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(Hurriyet Daily News)   Britain hopes its new 12-sided, £1 coin will "deter counterfeiters." Because counterfeiters usually spend their time trying to perfectly replicate the lowest-value form of a given currency then churning it out in quantities that would fill a rail car   (hurriyetdailynews.com) divider line 42
    More: Asinine, Britain, Britain hopes, enhancers, UK Treasury, coins  
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1533 clicks; posted to Business » on 19 Mar 2014 at 11:23 AM (23 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



42 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-03-19 10:16:00 AM
Is that the 1-pound or 1-penny coin?  The article doesn't make clear.
 
2014-03-19 10:41:00 AM
Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

thumbs.dreamstime.com
 
2014-03-19 11:20:31 AM
You want to tell if a coin is counterfeit or not?  Just pull off the foil wrapper and look at the chocolate inside.  If it has white chalkiness around the edges, it's either old or a low-quality knockoff.
 
2014-03-19 11:21:58 AM

Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]


That would make coin mechanism designers go insane
 
2014-03-19 11:40:56 AM

dkendr: Is that the 1-pound or 1-penny coin?  The article doesn't make clear.


It is a one pound penny coin.
 
2014-03-19 11:54:20 AM

Britain hopes its new 12-sided, £1 coin will "deter counterfeiters." Because counterfeiters usually spend their time trying to perfectly replicate the lowest-value form of a given currency then churning it out in quantities that would fill a rail car


They will if they're smart. Who checks $5 and $10 notes for counterfeits? Okay, so those are "low" value, not "the lowest", but a railcarload could be quite handy.

Decent money with very low odds of being caught seems like a reasonable plan.
 
2014-03-19 12:00:07 PM

Englebert Slaptyback: Britain hopes its new 12-sided, £1 coin will "deter counterfeiters." Because counterfeiters usually spend their time trying to perfectly replicate the lowest-value form of a given currency then churning it out in quantities that would fill a rail car


They will if they're smart. Who checks $5 and $10 notes for counterfeits? Okay, so those are "low" value, not "the lowest", but a railcarload could be quite handy.

Decent money with very low odds of being caught seems like a reasonable plan.


In November 2013 there was an estimated 45M of counterfeit coins in circulation.

3%

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/mar/19/five-things-you -w anted-to-know-about-pound-coins-but-were-too-afraid-to-ask
 
2014-03-19 12:04:21 PM
Subby apparently skimmed past this bit:

"About three percent of all 1 quid coins, about 45 million, are currently forgeries and in some parts of Britain this rises to six percent, according to the Royal Mint. "
 
2014-03-19 12:27:00 PM
So 45m in fake pound coins. Just say "they're legal now" and mark down 45 million in production savings at the mint.
 
2014-03-19 12:27:46 PM
The main problem is the weight. Most people can't carry 50 pounds around for long.
 
2014-03-19 12:27:48 PM
FTFA: As with all British coins, the 'heads' side will feature the image of Queen Elizabeth II and there will be a public competition to decide the 'tails' side

I'm sure FARK may have an entry or two to submit...
 
2014-03-19 12:32:13 PM
Who the fark counterfeits that many coins???
 
2014-03-19 01:14:04 PM

Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]


Me too.
 
2014-03-19 01:14:37 PM
When I become Emperor of the world all currency will be in the form of D&D dice.

Also, everyone will be issued a robotic futanari catgirl as a personal servant. Everybody.
 
2014-03-19 01:40:41 PM

Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]


I was thinking the same thing
 
2014-03-19 01:50:27 PM
So they looked at the 11-sided Canadian coin and said fark it we're going to 12 sides.
 
2014-03-19 01:55:47 PM
www.creativereview.co.uk

Cool british coins are cool
 
2014-03-19 01:56:21 PM

Tyrone Slothrop: Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]

Me too.


The only thing you can buy with it is a great axe.
 
2014-03-19 02:19:02 PM

Englebert Slaptyback: They will if they're smart. Who checks $5 and $10 notes for counterfeits? Okay, so those are "low" value, not "the lowest", but a railcarload could be quite handy.

Decent money with very low odds of being caught seems like a reasonable plan.


IIRC the most popular note to forge in the US (possibly in the world) has long been the $20, precisely because it's big enough to be worth forging but small enough to escape close scrutiny. I should check that online, but this is Fark, so what the heck.

The other attraction of forging one pound coins is that it is (or at least used to be) easier to make one that will fool a vending machine than a person. More than once I've put a note into a machine and gotten slugs as part of the change.
 
2014-03-19 02:27:50 PM

czetie: IIRC the most popular note to forge in the US (possibly in the world) has long been the $20, precisely because it's big enough to be worth forging but small enough to escape close scrutiny. I should check that online, but this is Fark, so what the heck.


Everyone checks with those pens when you use a $20 or higher but nobody checks a $5 or $10.  I've always thought people were stupid for forging $20s when you can print 2 $10s and probably get away with it.  Take the tens buy something cheap and get change.  Basically laundry your won money but it would take a long time to make a lot of money I guess.

Or you could buy something that costs like $100 with 10s at Walmart and return it and get clean money.
 
2014-03-19 02:36:24 PM

TNel: czetie: IIRC the most popular note to forge in the US (possibly in the world) has long been the $20, precisely because it's big enough to be worth forging but small enough to escape close scrutiny. I should check that online, but this is Fark, so what the heck.

Everyone checks with those pens when you use a $20 or higher but nobody checks a $5 or $10.  I've always thought people were stupid for forging $20s when you can print 2 $10s and probably get away with it.  Take the tens buy something cheap and get change.  Basically laundry your won money but it would take a long time to make a lot of money I guess.

Or you could buy something that costs like $100 with 10s at Walmart and return it and get clean money.


Back in the day, one popular way to launder a big chunk of money was to buy a paper airline ticket -- a one-way, first-class, fully-refundable ticket was a great way to turn a pile of dirty money into a slip of paper with a face value of several thousand dollars, which you could then get refunded in the form of a clean check issued by the airline. You could even get the ticket issued in somebody else's name and mail it to them if you needed to pay somebody with dirty money.

I vaguely remember somebody getting arrested (maybe back in the 1970s?) with a briefcase full of tickets with some ridiculous value (imagine a briefcase full of $5000 bills to get some idea), but no details.

/Some of you may need to ask your parents what a "paper ticket" was
 
2014-03-19 03:04:10 PM

swaxhog: So they looked at the 11-sided Canadian coin and said fark it we're going to 12 sides.


And even number of sides is a bad idea.  With an odd number, you can curve the sides slightly and make a "constant width" shape, like some of the UK's current coins, that works as well as a round coin in machines that sort coins by size.  If you have an even number of sides, though, the width "across flats" has to be different that the width "across corners".
 
2014-03-19 03:15:36 PM

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Who the fark counterfeits that many coins???


North Korea?

I read somewhere that they are the biggest counterfeiters of American dollars.  Stands to reason they would do it for other currencies.
 
2014-03-19 03:16:11 PM

flondrix: swaxhog: So they looked at the 11-sided Canadian coin and said fark it we're going to 12 sides.

And even number of sides is a bad idea.  With an odd number, you can curve the sides slightly and make a "constant width" shape, like some of the UK's current coins, that works as well as a round coin in machines that sort coins by size.  If you have an even number of sides, though, the width "across flats" has to be different that the width "across corners".


That is supposed to be a feature to make it hard to copy. So glad I don't have to design the coin recognisation system for one of those things.
 
2014-03-19 03:18:46 PM

TNel: czetie: IIRC the most popular note to forge in the US (possibly in the world) has long been the $20, precisely because it's big enough to be worth forging but small enough to escape close scrutiny. I should check that online, but this is Fark, so what the heck.

Everyone checks with those pens when you use a $20 or higher but nobody checks a $5 or $10.  I've always thought people were stupid for forging $20s when you can print 2 $10s and probably get away with it.  Take the tens buy something cheap and get change.  Basically laundry your won money but it would take a long time to make a lot of money I guess.

Or you could buy something that costs like $100 with 10s at Walmart and return it and get clean money.


Yes, going back to a store where you just passed 10 fake banknotes would be really clever.

Sounds like something you'd come up with.
 
2014-03-19 03:19:53 PM
In other news, England used to have a threepenny bit, that was 1/80 of a pound. Because, why not go full retard.
 
2014-03-19 03:34:18 PM

Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]


me too, was going to comment, that was the going damage for something... but, uh, it's a d12.  what is it for?
 
2014-03-19 03:47:44 PM
(From another article)

A man responsible for making 14million fake £1 coins is starting a five-year jail sentence.

Marcus Glindon, 37, ran the counterfeiting scam from a workshop on an industrial estate after losing his job as an engineer.

Officers who searched his workshop in Enfield, North London, discovered enough machinery for the large-scale manufacture of fake coins. There were also copies of the dyes used to imprint legitimate £1 coins.

Detectives arrested Glindon, from nearby Edmonton, and he admitted he had been producing the fake money for seven years.

The father of two said that he had worked alone for most of that time, under the orders of two men he knew only as "Tom" and "John".

They would deliver materials to his workshop, which he would use to produce both completed and blank coins.

Over the seven-year period Glindon produced a total of 14million coins, of which 2.5million were stamped and ready to spend. The coins have not been recovered.

Glindon estimated that at one stage he was making 12,000 pound coins a day. The finished items would be passed to his accomplices, who paid him around £2,000 in cash each week.


So even if the organisers were selling the coins at 50% discount, they would still be on a good earner
 
2014-03-19 03:51:32 PM

spawn73: Yes, going back to a store where you just passed 10 fake banknotes would be really clever.

Sounds like something you'd come up with.


Yeah like they are going to remember someone that bought something out of the thousands.  Is there only one walmart in your location?  Do you think that with cash they write down serial numbers?

Jesus you are dense they balance the receipt with drawer then combine all of the money for the deposit.  It would be near impossible to tell once that happens.  Then do you think that once money goes into the drawer you think it stays there till the end of day?  Some of those tens will make it out of the drawer and into the wild.

Forget it you would rather try and make personal attacks than to use your brain.
 
2014-03-19 04:01:55 PM
long ago in a land far across the Pacific Ocean when the dollar was worth more than didly-squat I discovered that one of their coins that cost about 3 cents US was the exact same size as a US Quarter.  Naturally I got a lot of them and then used them to do something of NO VALUE.  yes, I played video games.

the smart kids invested in currency that tripled in value, I just wore out my thumbs.
 
2014-03-19 05:08:14 PM

spawn73: In other news, England used to have a threepenny bit, that was 1/80 of a pound. Because, why not go full retard.


That's rich, coming from (probably) a resident of a country that still uses 12 inches to a foot, 3 feet to a yard, 5 and one half yards to a rod, four rods to a chain, ten chains to a furlong, and eight furlongs to a mile.  A "pound" consisting of 240 silver "pennies" was a unit of account going all the way back to Anglo Saxon England.  Back before arabic numerals, there was no incentive to divide things into fractions that can be expressed as nice terminating decimals.  But 240 is a convenient number for dividing something up--it can be broken into tenths, quarters, sixths, etc.  One of the more popular divisions of the pound was a shilling, consisting of 12 pence.  A threepenny bit would have been a quarter of that.  Back when a pound sterling really was a pound sterling, a shilling would have been worth about 15 bucks in today's American money, so I can see why you would want to divide it up.
 
2014-03-19 05:41:22 PM

Englebert Slaptyback: Britain hopes its new 12-sided, £1 coin will "deter counterfeiters." Because counterfeiters usually spend their time trying to perfectly replicate the lowest-value form of a given currency then churning it out in quantities that would fill a rail car


They will if they're smart. Who checks $5 and $10 notes for counterfeits? Okay, so those are "low" value, not "the lowest", but a railcarload could be quite handy.

Decent money with very low odds of being caught seems like a reasonable plan.


image.tmdb.org
 
2014-03-19 05:57:00 PM
www.coinclub.com.au
 
2014-03-19 06:35:13 PM

flondrix: Back when a pound sterling really was a pound sterling, a shilling would have been worth about 15 bucks in today's American money, so I can see why you would want to divide it up.


All they way up to a farthing, which was 1/4 of a penny.
 
2014-03-19 09:29:43 PM
Won't they play funny in coin operated machines?

I remember hearing about a man who bought an EDM machine to make coin dies and a silver mix that was intended for cutlery, then proceeding to make casino tokens in the $5-$20+ range. Just imagine the balls required to walk up with a cup full of counterfeit casino coins and redeeming them for cash.
 
2014-03-19 09:42:54 PM

wildcardjack: Won't they play funny in coin operated machines?

I remember hearing about a man who bought an EDM machine to make coin dies and a silver mix that was intended for cutlery, then proceeding to make casino tokens in the $5-$20+ range. Just imagine the balls required to walk up with a cup full of counterfeit casino coins and redeeming them for cash.



There's quite a few instances of people making counterfeit poker chips and cashing them out.
 
2014-03-19 10:31:46 PM
I watched a programme about fake £1 coins, how many there were and how to spot them. So I emptied my change jar and out of maybe twenty coins I think three were fake. It is a big problem, though I don't think my experience is the actual percentage.

Faking a coin is a lot easier than faking a banknote.
 
2014-03-19 10:49:46 PM

Shostie: Aw. I saw 12-sided and was hoping for something more like this:

[thumbs.dreamstime.com image 400x343]


That's just how farkers roll.
 
Xai
2014-03-20 06:42:36 AM
Given that a £1 coin is worth more than 6 times as much as the highest value US coin in common usage, it's more worth counterfitting than you might otherwise think.
 
2014-03-20 07:56:58 AM

Xai: Given that a £1 coin is worth more than 6 times as much as the highest value US coin in common usage, it's more worth counterfitting than you might otherwise think.


I'm glad you put in common usage but I've used a lot of dollar coins and perfer them over bills.  Dollar coins go into vending machines worlds easier than dollar bills.  I swear to god I have to feed the machine at my job atleast 20 times before it accepts even a brand new crisp dollar.

Problem is the US is so ingrained with that damn $1 bill that people collected the stupid $1 coins.
 
2014-03-20 10:02:41 AM

TNel: Xai: Given that a £1 coin is worth more than 6 times as much as the highest value US coin in common usage, it's more worth counterfitting than you might otherwise think.

I'm glad you put in common usage but I've used a lot of dollar coins and perfer them over bills.  Dollar coins go into vending machines worlds easier than dollar bills.  I swear to god I have to feed the machine at my job atleast 20 times before it accepts even a brand new crisp dollar.

Problem is the US is so ingrained with that damn $1 bill that people collected the stupid $1 coins.


A bunch of £5 coins were released a few years ago. I got a couple but spent them. They were nice coins, and huge.
 
2014-03-20 03:44:25 PM
How much is that in old money?
 
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