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(Guardian)   We don't know who is getting sanctioned over Crimea or for how much, but we can all agree that it's Obama's fault, no matter what   (theguardian.com) divider line 236
    More: Obvious, Crimean, punishments, High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy, Dmitry Rogozin, Russian oligarchs, unanimity, Russians, persona non grata  
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1050 clicks; posted to Politics » on 17 Mar 2014 at 6:08 PM (18 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-17 04:42:56 PM
Wealthy corrupt Russian oligarchs own property all over Europe and New York and stash their money there and travel there.

Take away their dirty money and their ability to travel.
 
2014-03-17 04:55:00 PM
This is all for show. Why? Because pretty much everyone that is honest knows one thing- that Crimea has much stronger ties to Russia than to Ukraine, and has had since they were annexed by Russia in 1783. So it only makes sense for Russia to absorb them now.
 
2014-03-17 05:45:49 PM
We don't know who is getting sanctioned over Crimea

Subby should read his own article.

The seven Russians targeted by US sanctions

Vladislav Surkov, a Putin aide

Sergey Glazyev, a Putin adviser

Leonid Slutsky, a state Duma deputy

Andrei Klishas, member of the Federation Council (the upper house of the Federal Assembly of Russia)

Valentina Matviyenko, head of the Federation Council

Dmitry Rogozin, deputy prime minister

Yelena Mizulina, a state Duma deputy
 
2014-03-17 06:07:21 PM
Well of course, everything is Obama's fault.  He's MAKING Putin invade Crimea.  Putin didn't want to, Obama forced him to do it.  It is ALL Obama's fault.
 
2014-03-17 06:14:05 PM

fusillade762: Leonid Slutsky, a state Duma deputy


Please tell me I'm not the only one who chuckled at that.
 
2014-03-17 06:14:47 PM
I'm sure the NCAA will find a way to punish the Pac-12 for this somehow.
 
2014-03-17 06:16:13 PM
I'm sure if Obama hadn't let those Americans die in Benghazi they would have been able to talk Putin out of invading Crimea.

/Wondering if this will become or has already become a talking point.
 
2014-03-17 06:21:46 PM
It's Putin who will be getting the butt plug for this nonsense.
He was the dog who had too much rope, ultimately.

/He's going down like Saddam Hussein.
 
2014-03-17 06:25:43 PM
Well, he's been president through the whole thing and for the 5 years prior.  Why wouldn't an ineffective response be his fault?
 
2014-03-17 06:26:03 PM

PowerSlacker: I'm sure the NCAA will find a way to punish the Pac-12 for this somehow.


Clearly what needs to happen is that assets of the PAC-12 need to be seized and used to double the number of hooker and cocaine yacht parties being thrown for athletes at Miami, FSU, Alabama, etc
 
2014-03-17 06:26:54 PM

Dinki: This is all for show. Why? Because pretty much everyone that is honest knows one thing- that Crimea has much stronger ties to Russia than to Ukraine, and has had since they were annexed by Russia in 1783. So it only makes sense for Russia to absorb them now.


Why yes, it makes perfect sense to endorse Stalin's ethnic cleansing of Crimea by saying "well now most of them are Russian so Russia should get it", good thinking there!
 
2014-03-17 06:36:30 PM

Wooly Bully: Dinki: This is all for show. Why? Because pretty much everyone that is honest knows one thing- that Crimea has much stronger ties to Russia than to Ukraine, and has had since they were annexed by Russia in 1783. So it only makes sense for Russia to absorb them now.

Why yes, it makes perfect sense to endorse Stalin's ethnic cleansing of Crimea by saying "well now most of them are Russian so Russia should get it", good thinking there!


Annexing a place and ethnically cleansing it is kinda their thing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaliningrad_Oblast

They pretty much killed and replaced 90% of the population of former Prussia.
 
2014-03-17 06:42:08 PM

Dinki: This is all for show. Why? Because pretty much everyone that is honest knows one thing- that Crimea has much stronger ties to Russia than to Ukraine, and has had since they were annexed by Russia in 1783. So it only makes sense for Russia to absorb them now.


How about no?
 
2014-03-17 06:44:18 PM

Dinki: This is all for show. Why? Because pretty much everyone that is honest knows one thing- that Crimea has much stronger ties to Russia than to Ukraine, and has had since they were annexed by Russia in 1783. So it only makes sense for Russia to absorb them now.


But I was told that referendum was a sham. A mockery. A travesty of democracy.

A shamevstockery!!!
 
2014-03-17 06:45:08 PM
Traveshamockery?

Mockashamesty?
 
2014-03-17 07:00:10 PM

UncomfortableSilence: I'm sure if Obama hadn't let those Americans die in Benghazi they would have been able to talk Putin out of invading Crimea.

/Wondering if this will become or has already become a talking point.


What is Putin doing with that Malaysian plane that he parked in Ben Gazzardy?
 
2014-03-17 07:07:22 PM
Putin doesn't care about sanctions.  He probably welcomes them, because each step we take toward a new cold war helps solidify his power and gives him a new excuse to crack down on political opposition.  He lives and breathes for this stuff.  He's going to take Crimea, there's nothing anybody will do to stop him, and everyone on every side knows it.  All this sanctions stuff is for hometown consumption.
 
2014-03-17 07:17:32 PM

AngryDragon: Well, he's been president through the whole thing and for the 5 years prior.  Why wouldn't an ineffective response be his fault?


Clearly, you have the properly weighted response already thought up. Please, enlighten us, theoretical President AngryDragon...
 
2014-03-17 07:19:28 PM

CPennypacker: How about no?


You're right- let's go to war over a superpower flexing its muscle in its back yard. That will work out just fine.
 
2014-03-17 07:20:50 PM

UncomfortableSilence: I'm sure if Obama hadn't let those Americans die in Benghazi they would have been able to talk Putin out of invading Crimea.

/Wondering if this will become or has already become a talking point.


Too late.

I saw variations of this talking point when the crisis first started.
 
2014-03-17 07:33:45 PM

Mrtraveler01: UncomfortableSilence: I'm sure if Obama hadn't let those Americans die in Benghazi they would have been able to talk Putin out of invading Crimea.

/Wondering if this will become or has already become a talking point.

Too late.

I saw variations of this talking point when the crisis first started.


I had hopes that this wasn't the case.  Ah, who am I kidding?
 
2014-03-17 07:42:36 PM
I don't understand.  If Obama has a magical time machine that he used to crash the economy, why doesn't he use it to go back in time and give child Putin a hug so that he grows up to be good?
 
2014-03-17 07:46:42 PM

Mentat: I don't understand.  If Obama has a magical time machine that he used to crash the economy, why doesn't he use it to go back in time and give child Putin a hug so that he grows up to be good?



oh man, that's time machine etiquette 101:

article 2 section B.

your time machine can not be used for the purposes of good.
 
2014-03-17 07:51:49 PM
Guy walks in and asks the bartender
"Isn't that Obama and Biden sitting over there?" The bartender says, "Yep, that's them." So the guy walks over and says, "Wow, this is a real honor. What are you guys doing in here?"
Obama says, "We're trying to prevent WWIII. And the guy says, "Really? How are you going to do that."
Obama says, "Well, we're going to impose sanctions on six of Putin's policy advisors and one bicycle repairman."
The guy exclaimed, "A bicycle repairman!!! Why impose sanctions on a bicycle repairman?"
Obama turns to Biden , punches him on the shoulder and says, "See, dummy! I told you no one would worry about the six policy advisors!"
 
2014-03-17 08:01:36 PM

vernonFL: Wealthy corrupt Russian oligarchs own property all over Europe and New York and stash their money there and travel there.

Take away their dirty money and their ability to travel.


Isn't that what happened last year during the Cyprus Financial Crisis when the government seized all bank account?
 
2014-03-17 08:04:04 PM

Isitoveryet: Mentat: I don't understand.  If Obama has a magical time machine that he used to crash the economy, why doesn't he use it to go back in time and give child Putin a hug so that he grows up to be good?


oh man, that's time machine etiquette 101:

article 2 section B.

your time machine can not be used for the purposes of good.


But Obama is evil and breaking rules is evil, so I could totally see him using his time machine for good.  Because he's evil.
 
2014-03-17 08:05:44 PM

Dinki: CPennypacker: How about no?

You're right- let's go to war over a superpower flexing its muscle in its back yard. That will work out just fine.


You: It makes sense for Russia to absorb Crimea
Someone else: No it doesn't
You: You're a warmonger

You should look up the term "false dichotomy" some time.
 
2014-03-17 08:08:46 PM

Mentat: Isitoveryet: Mentat: I don't understand.  If Obama has a magical time machine that he used to crash the economy, why doesn't he use it to go back in time and give child Putin a hug so that he grows up to be good?


oh man, that's time machine etiquette 101:

article 2 section B.

your time machine can not be used for the purposes of good.

But Obama is evil and breaking rules is evil, so I could totally see him using his time machine for good.  Because he's evil.


good point.

I bet he didn't even bother to read the damn literature that came with the machine. There should be a certification course, at least.
 
2014-03-17 08:18:19 PM

Wooly Bully: ou: It makes sense for Russia to absorb Crimea
Someone else: No it doesn't
You: You're a warmonger

You should look up the term "false dichotomy" some time.


Ok, so what do all you people that are saying Obama isn't doing enough propose? Difficulty- your proposal can't be something that will lead to a new hot or cold war.
 
2014-03-17 08:21:31 PM

AngryDragon: Well, he's been president through the whole thing and for the 5 years prior.  Why wouldn't an ineffective response be his fault?


Seems like it ought to be. Whenever something like a less-terrible-than-before jobs report comes along, he certainly gives himself the credit. You fought for this job, so for good or ill when something happens on your watch, it's yours, Mr. President.
 
2014-03-17 08:21:39 PM

Dinki: Wooly Bully: ou: It makes sense for Russia to absorb Crimea
Someone else: No it doesn't
You: You're a warmonger

You should look up the term "false dichotomy" some time.

Ok, so what do all you people that are saying Obama isn't doing enough propose? Difficulty- your proposal can't be something that will lead to a new hot or cold war.


How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.
 
2014-03-17 08:23:59 PM

Dinki: Wooly Bully: ou: It makes sense for Russia to absorb Crimea
Someone else: No it doesn't
You: You're a warmonger

You should look up the term "false dichotomy" some time.

Ok, so what do all you people that are saying Obama isn't doing enough propose? Difficulty- your proposal can't be something that will lead to a new hot or cold war.


Too late. We've just been handed the former, so it's only the latter that's up for discussion.
 
2014-03-17 08:25:33 PM
HOW CAN the USA or anybody accept the overthrowing of the Ukraine government as "OK", but have a big problem with the Crimean nonsense?

Even better, how can the USA biatch about illegally occupying a foreign country?
Bush took care of America's reputation long ago.
 
2014-03-17 08:36:40 PM

davynelson: HOW CAN the USA or anybody accept the overthrowing of the Ukraine government as "OK", but have a big problem with the Crimean nonsense?

Even better, how can the USA biatch about illegally occupying a foreign country?
Bush took care of America's reputation long ago.


Do you even know what happened in Ukraine?
 
2014-03-17 08:36:51 PM

CPennypacker: How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.


So you know the history of Crimea and Ukraine, right? And you know that Crimea wasn't a part of Ukraine until 1954 when it was given to Ukraine by... who exactly? Oh yeah, the Russians. And you know that the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, right? So your outrage about about Russia reclaiming their territory, while understandable, is impotent.
 
2014-03-17 08:38:34 PM

jjorsett: Too late. We've just been handed the former, so it's only the latter that's up for discussion.


We haven't been handed anything. This has always been a relatively minor regional issue, which unless the warmongers get their way, will be resolved in a couple of months.
 
2014-03-17 08:38:44 PM

Dinki: CPennypacker: How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.

So you know the history of Crimea and Ukraine, right? And you know that Crimea wasn't a part of Ukraine until 1954 when it was given to Ukraine by... who exactly? Oh yeah, the Russians. And you know that the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, right? So your outrage about about Russia reclaiming their territory, while understandable, is impotent.


Crimea is part of Ukraine now. I'm sorry if you're having trouble understanding that.
 
2014-03-17 08:38:45 PM

CPennypacker: Dinki: Wooly Bully: ou: It makes sense for Russia to absorb Crimea
Someone else: No it doesn't
You: You're a warmonger

You should look up the term "false dichotomy" some time.

Ok, so what do all you people that are saying Obama isn't doing enough propose? Difficulty- your proposal can't be something that will lead to a new hot or cold war.

How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.


To him, how Obama his perceived is way more important than what actually happens.
 
2014-03-17 08:40:24 PM

davynelson: HOW CAN the USA or anybody accept the overthrowing of the Ukraine government as "OK", but have a big problem with the Crimean nonsense?

Even better, how can the USA biatch about illegally occupying a foreign country?
Bush took care of America's reputation long ago.


So clearly, Putin gets a free war. You know, to make up for missing out earlier.

We can never, ever, say anything about another war, ever. Everybody gets freebies until we're even stevens.
 
2014-03-17 08:40:47 PM

CPennypacker: Crimea is part of Ukraine now. I'm sorry if you're having trouble understanding that.


Actually, it pretty much appears that it isn't. You might want to get used to that.
 
2014-03-17 08:40:51 PM

Dinki: CPennypacker: How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.

So you know the history of Crimea and Ukraine, right? And you know that Crimea wasn't a part of Ukraine until 1954 when it was given to Ukraine by... who exactly? Oh yeah, the Russians. And you know that the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, right? So your outrage about about Russia reclaiming their territory, while understandable, is impotent.


Someone's gone all-in on Putin's version of things, I see.
 
2014-03-17 08:42:05 PM

Dinki: CPennypacker: How does me thinking Russia can go fark itself have anything to do with Obama? I'm Ukrainian asshole.

So you know the history of Crimea and Ukraine, right? And you know that Crimea wasn't a part of Ukraine until 1954 when it was given to Ukraine by... who exactly? Oh yeah, the Russians. And you know that the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians, right? So your outrage about about Russia reclaiming their territory, while understandable, is impotent.


Do you know why the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians?
 
2014-03-17 08:42:49 PM

Nabb1: Someone's gone all-in on Putin's version of things, I see.


Um, no, I'm simply looking at the history of the region. Unless you have some other data showing that the majority of Crimeans  want to stay in the Ukraine. Do you?
 
2014-03-17 08:42:53 PM

Dinki: CPennypacker: Crimea is part of Ukraine now. I'm sorry if you're having trouble understanding that.

Actually, it pretty much appears that it isn't. You might want to get used to that.


Maybe we should give back all the land we got from Mexico in the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo? After all, it was theirs until 1848. That means they can claim it back whenever they want right? Or is it only if a bunch of Mexicans move there and then vote to give the land back?
 
2014-03-17 08:45:48 PM

CPennypacker: Dinki: CPennypacker: Crimea is part of Ukraine now. I'm sorry if you're having trouble understanding that.

Actually, it pretty much appears that it isn't. You might want to get used to that.

Maybe we should give back all the land we got from Mexico in the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo? After all, it was theirs until 1848. That means they can claim it back whenever they want right? Or is it only if a bunch of Mexicans move there and then vote to give the land back?


farm3.static.flickr.com
 
2014-03-17 08:47:56 PM
The Grey Cardinal was on President Obama's sanction list. This is what he had to say:

"Another Russian on the sanctions list, Vladislav Surkov, also seemed unconcerned.
Surkov,  a top Putin ideologue often called the Kremlin's grey cardinal, reportedly told a Russian newspaper, "It's a big honor for me. I don't have accounts abroad. The only things that interest me in the U.S. are Tupac Shakur, Allen Ginsberg, and Jackson Pollock. I don't need a visa to access their work. I lose nothing."

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA ... I guess Obama's community outreach efforts never extended into any Russian or Polish neighborhoods in Chicago. What a stony looking rube.
 
2014-03-17 08:48:54 PM

Dinki: Ok, so what do all you people that are saying Obama isn't doing enough propose? Difficulty- your proposal can't be something that will lead to a new hot or cold war.


I'm not one of those people so I wouldn't presume to speak for them. I don't have any reason to blame Obama for not doing enough.

davynelson: HOW CAN the USA or anybody accept the overthrowing of the Ukraine government as "OK", but have a big problem with the Crimean nonsense?

Even better, how can the USA biatch about illegally occupying a foreign country?
Bush took care of America's reputation long ago.


There's a big difference between a revolution, which is what happened in Ukraine, and a foreign invasion and seizure of another country's territory. If you don't get that, look into what a revolution is.

I f*ckin' hated Bush and I'll be damned if someone tells me I can't condemn Putin because of him. Anyway, we finally got rid of him, but there's no indication the Russians can get rid of Putin. And as incredibly wrong as Iraq was, it wasn't the same as annexing a foreign country's territory.
 
2014-03-17 08:49:11 PM

MJMaloney187: The only things that interest me in the U.S. are Tupac Shakur, Allen Ginsberg, and Jackson Pollock.


nttatwwt
 
2014-03-17 08:50:14 PM

Dinki: Nabb1: Someone's gone all-in on Putin's version of things, I see.

Um, no, I'm simply looking at the history of the region. Unless you have some other data showing that the majority of Crimeans  want to stay in the Ukraine. Do you?


Your understanding of the history of that region is appallingly thin and judging by your responses so far, I am not inclined to educate you since you seem to have picked up bits and pieces of information from political blogs over the past two weeks.
 
2014-03-17 08:50:45 PM

dave2198: Do you know why the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russians?


And? The Tartar purge was reprehensible, but Stalin did lots of reprehensible acts. The simple fact is that now the majority of Crimeans are ethnic Russian.
 
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