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(Yahoo)   Putin begins his liberation of villages neighboring the Crimea from non-Russian control   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 206
    More: Obvious, Crimean, Russians, Ukraine, Russian control, Russian forces, East-West, helicopter gunships, Long-distance track event  
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4533 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Mar 2014 at 6:01 PM (41 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-15 09:00:46 PM  
How about we immediately admit the Ukraine into NATO, (or at least sign a defense treaty that is binding) and put a tripwire force into the Ukraine (if they want us) then offer to extend the offer to Georgia in if they aren't pulling out of Crimea in a week.  After that, we (the U.S. and the European Union) pledge a billion a day in additional spending to help wean our European allies off Russian fuel dependency.  If they are still there in a month we promise to recognize any portions of Russia that declare independence.

In the meanwhile, start shipping blankets to Europe.  It could be a cold rest of the winter.
 
2014-03-15 09:01:19 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: shower_in_my_socks: Not a single right wing retard in any of these Obama-bashing threads has offered up a single solution that goes beyond sanctions without starting WWIII. I guess the talking points from Rush and Breitbart didn't get to the part where they tell you what to think about actual actions we should be taking. This shiat is getting old, so put up or STFU.

And, no, "training exercises" and a carrier group in the region aren't going to do shiat. Dubya didn't start WWIII over Georgia, and we aren't starting WWIII over Ukraine. It does not matter who is in the White House, that is the American position. You're either with us or against us, right?

Ukraine was picking its noise.  Georgia was mid scale military action into  Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same.   Keep saying it, though.  Dubya and Georgia  Dubya and Georgia   Maybe even a few retards will believe it.


Unless they hear it from the three Ms - Maddow, Matthews or Maher, to a liberal, it's not true.
 
2014-03-15 09:01:39 PM  

icemanwol: Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?

Consult with the new government of Ukraine and work out some sort of deal to ship 20,000 troops to Kiev for a "Training exercise" with the Ukrainian military.  It would send a pretty strong message to Putin to buzz off.


Personally I would do something like that, along with insisting an full UN involvement in the coming election.  I'm ok with Crimea breaking away from the Ukraine and/or joining the Soviet Russia, so long as it really is the will of the Crimean people.  My main worry is the the election will be a farce.
 
2014-03-15 09:01:59 PM  
Kill us Obama. Kill us all.
 
2014-03-15 09:04:05 PM  

HoratioGates: How about we immediately admit the Ukraine into NATO, (or at least sign a defense treaty that is binding) and put a tripwire force into the Ukraine (if they want us) then offer to extend the offer to Georgia in if they aren't pulling out of Crimea in a week.  After that, we (the U.S. and the European Union) pledge a billion a day in additional spending to help wean our European allies off Russian fuel dependency.  If they are still there in a month we promise to recognize any portions of Russia that declare independence.

In the meanwhile, start shipping blankets to Europe.  It could be a cold rest of the winter.



static.comicvine.com

\sees what you did there.
 
2014-03-15 09:07:08 PM  

ciberido: Personally I would do something like that


That's the equivalent of setting the can of kerosene next to the space heater.


along with insisting an full UN involvement in the coming election

That WAS insisted on, and summarily rejected by Russia.


I'm ok with Crimea breaking away from the Ukraine and/or joining the Soviet Russia, so long as it really is the will of the Crimean people.

It's a bit of a stretch, but would you be OK with California holding a referendum to join Mexico?
 
2014-03-15 09:14:41 PM  
Seriously people Obama is doing all he can to force Putin to back the hell out of the Ukraine while trying avoid touching off what could devolve into The Third World war.

now for the UN security Council there needs to be either some manner of over turning a veto or if one of the permanent members is having sanctions against them voted on that they must abstain  from the vote automatically so as to prevent an abuse of their veto powers.
 
2014-03-15 09:19:01 PM  
SithLord: Unless they hear it from the three Ms - Maddow, Matthews or Maher, to a liberal, it's not true. I interact with figments of my imagination because it's so much easier than dealing with real people.

FTFY
 
2014-03-15 09:24:10 PM  

Animatronik: It would be fair to say that Bush's handling was awkward and misguided at times. But he understood what Putin is and how you communicate with such a creature.


By looking at how Bush stood by while Putin did something similar in Georgia?
 
2014-03-15 09:24:26 PM  
Powerful strongman Obama will save us all!
 
2014-03-15 09:27:11 PM  

HoratioGates: In the meanwhile, start shipping blankets to Europe.  It could be a cold rest of the winter.


Luckily it's been unseasonably warm over there this winter. Guess that's where all the Global Warming went.
 
2014-03-15 09:29:40 PM  

Felgraf: icemanwol: Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?

Consult with the new government of Ukraine and work out some sort of deal to ship 20,000 troops to Kiev for a "Training exercise" with the Ukrainian military.  It would send a pretty strong message to Putin to buzz off.

Why would it send such a message? Would we actually intend to use them?

Would *you* be willing to use them if Putin didn't "get the message"?

Shows of strength only work if you are actually willing to BACK THEM UP. Would you be willing to start WWIII?


Obama gave up missile defense in eastern Europe without getting anything from Putin in exchange.  Maybe he should reconsider that decision.
 
2014-03-15 09:33:38 PM  

Mrtraveler01: HoratioGates: In the meanwhile, start shipping blankets to Europe.  It could be a cold rest of the winter.

Luckily it's been unseasonably warm over there this winter. Guess that's where all the Global Warming went.


Last year, it suddenly started snowing on March 11th; we're not out of the woods yet.

But personally, I could get by, I'll happily wear a sweater or two, just to support the Ukrainians. I say let Putin close the taps, we'll see how fast he starts missing the cash.
 
2014-03-15 09:36:05 PM  

flexflint: Mrtraveler01: HoratioGates: In the meanwhile, start shipping blankets to Europe.  It could be a cold rest of the winter.

Luckily it's been unseasonably warm over there this winter. Guess that's where all the Global Warming went.

Last year, it suddenly started snowing on March 11th; we're not out of the woods yet.

But personally, I could get by, I'll happily wear a sweater or two, just to support the Ukrainians. I say let Putin close the taps, we'll see how fast he starts missing the cash.


I wonder how long it will be before Russia starts missing Ukrainian agricultural products.  The frozen tundra is a shiat place to grow tasty things like food.
 
2014-03-15 09:41:23 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Ukraine was picking its noise. Georgia was mid scale military action into Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same. Keep saying it, though. Dubya and Georgia Dubya and Georgia Maybe even a few retards will believe it.


Putin provoked the conflict with Georgia.  He tried to do the same with Ukraine, but they didn't bite which is why he's left with Crimea.
 
2014-03-15 09:44:08 PM  

bsharitt: I'm not saying go to war, but maybe park a carrier group in the Black Sea and have the Air Force bases in Turkey and German do a few extra exercises just to see if Putin thinks things over.


Who cares? Why do you care? They dont care. Jesus. So farking what.
 
2014-03-15 09:44:47 PM  

grimlock1972: Seriously people Obama is doing all he can to force Putin to back the hell out of the Ukraine while trying avoid touching off what could devolve into The Third World war.

now for the UN security Council there needs to be either some manner of over turning a veto or if one of the permanent members is having sanctions against them voted on that they must abstain  from the vote automatically so as to prevent an abuse of their veto powers.


I'd like to see them expand to 7, 9 or 11 members, replace the individual veto with a supermajority rule, and give each continent a representative.  Maybe EU, USA, Canada, Japan, Russia, China, India, Brazil, South Africa, Australia and someone else.  It will never happen, but at least it would make the Security Council somewhat useful.
 
2014-03-15 09:45:05 PM  
I figured out how Obama can handle this.

He can run for office in Russia!

1. Gets Obama out of the US
2. polarize the citizens.
3. Will weaken their military
4. Will destroy their healthcare system
5. Lose respect of foreign countries, they'll see Russia as a pushover
6. Will get Russia deeply in debt
7. Make the rich, richer. Keeping the kleptocracy alive

And that's just the top 7. There really is no downside


sanderspoli323.files.wordpress.com
Come on Guys, we got him elected here, we can do it in Russia, then on to Iran, then North Korea, then The Netherlands
 
2014-03-15 09:46:44 PM  

Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?


Farking nothing! Who cares??? Baltic people problems bro.
 
2014-03-15 09:49:40 PM  

Por que tan serioso: Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?

Farking nothing! Who cares??? Baltic people problems bro.


Euxine problems
 
2014-03-15 09:51:42 PM  

The Bestest: icemanwol: Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?

Consult with the new government of Ukraine and work out some sort of deal to ship 20,000 troops to Kiev for a "Training exercise" with the Ukrainian military.  It would send a pretty strong message to Putin to buzz off.

Alright.. let's say someone gets drunk/triggerhappy/clumsy and someone.. either side, gets shot. Now what?


A bunch of poors 5000 miles away from anything I give a shiat about settle it like men and life as we know it goes on exactly like before.
 
2014-03-15 09:51:54 PM  

Por que tan serioso: Sinbox: jnapier: If you he doesnt stop we are going to have our community organizer send a strongly worded letter

So, you're in Obama's shoes right now. What would YOU do?

Farking nothing! Who cares??? Baltic people problems bro.


Much funnier if you said "Caucus problems". Just leave it to the caucasians
 
2014-03-15 09:53:05 PM  

Mrtraveler01: Animatronik: It would be fair to say that Bush's handling was awkward and misguided at times. But he understood what Putin is and how you communicate with such a creature.

By looking at how Bush stood by while Putin did something similar in Georgia?


It is similar in that it is Putin.  Everything else is different.      Georgia and Dubya.. Georgia and Dubya..  Georgia and Dubya.

Keep smoking the dope.
 
2014-03-15 09:55:03 PM  

shower_in_my_socks: Peter von Nostrand: Libya is the perfect example of him getting involved and watching them lost their shiat. They have no opinion on anything until he acts


To this day, I still don't know if the GOP was for or against US military action in Libya.

And considering that CPAC backed the isolationist, anti-neocon Rand Paul, I suspect that they don't know either.


To this day the old lady trys to jam random household objects up my crack while yelling "Gaddafi!!!!" In sum, I dont know how I feel about it either.
 
2014-03-15 09:55:29 PM  

Mentat: Nutsac_Jim: Ukraine was picking its noise. Georgia was mid scale military action into Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same. Keep saying it, though. Dubya and Georgia Dubya and Georgia Maybe even a few retards will believe it.

Putin provoked the conflict with Georgia.  He tried to do the same with Ukraine, but they didn't bite which is why he's left with Crimea.


Enlighten us into how Putin tricked Georgia into invading Tskhinvali.
 
2014-03-15 09:58:19 PM  
static5.therichestimages.com

I've got this.
 
2014-03-15 09:58:38 PM  

BravadoGT: Obama gave up missile defense in eastern Europe without getting anything from Putin in exchange. Maybe he should reconsider that decision.


Yes, and in doing so he sent the message to them that we no longer view them as a credible counterweight to our global power, which has driven them absolutely crazy.

Seriously, you're underestimating what a head-case post-Soviet Russia is.
 
2014-03-15 10:02:29 PM  

Bonzo_1116: BigNumber12: So, where this is going is that, as more and more countries pursue nuclear weapons, we'll try to talk them out of doing so, and they'll justifiably tell us to fark right off.

What a world I'm bringing kids into.

Nukes are completely out of the bag, man.  The technology is nearly 70 years old, maybe older than your Granny.



They're both dead - thanks for the reminder, though!

And yet, if you actually look at the world, nukes aren't completely out of the bag. 9 nuclear powers out of a total of 206 nations?! You're full of it. There are plenty of countries who would prefer not to go through the expense of building and maintaining a nuke collection. What Ukraine tells them is that they can never count on the West to actually back up promises of Defense if the aggressor is Russia or China. Quite a few countries in the neighborhood are going to reexamine their external reliance in light of Ukraine. Saudi Arabia is already heading that direction. Look for more if Russia and China get more and more enthusiastic about disrespecting the sovereignty of their neighbors.
 
2014-03-15 10:04:03 PM  

studebaker hoch: [static5.therichestimages.com image 728x383]

I've got this.


It is fashion week in the Ukraine http://news.yahoo.com/ukraine-fashion-week-shows-unbroken-spirit-war- l ooms-004839117.html;_ylt=AwrBJR6Q.CRT3FAA90rQtDMD

l1.yimg.com
 
2014-03-15 10:05:47 PM  

udhq: BravadoGT: Obama gave up missile defense in eastern Europe without getting anything from Putin in exchange. Maybe he should reconsider that decision.

Yes, and in doing so he sent the message to them that we no longer view them as a credible counterweight to our global power, which has driven them absolutely crazy.

Seriously, you're underestimating what a head-case post-Soviet Russia is.


This would be happening if McCain had been elected in 2008, or Romney in 2012.  This has nothing to do with America, or Putin showing up Obama.  It has to do with Putin realizing that he's losing Russia's former allies in Eastern Europe, that they all want to bolt to the West if they can, and he wants to try to scare them into staying.  Nothing any President could have said would have stopped him from doing this, because he knows what we do: no one is gonna start WW III over this.

Maybe the Republicans will eventually figure out other countries act in what they view as their own self-interest (though is such a stupid play on Putin's part in so many ways), and it's not all about 'Murica.
 
2014-03-15 10:07:36 PM  

BigNumber12: Bonzo_1116: BigNumber12: So, where this is going is that, as more and more countries pursue nuclear weapons, we'll try to talk them out of doing so, and they'll justifiably tell us to fark right off.

What a world I'm bringing kids into.

Nukes are completely out of the bag, man.  The technology is nearly 70 years old, maybe older than your Granny.


They're both dead - thanks for the reminder, though!

And yet, if you actually look at the world, nukes aren't completely out of the bag. 9 nuclear powers out of a total of 206 nations?! You're full of it. There are plenty of countries who would prefer not to go through the expense of building and maintaining a nuke collection. What Ukraine tells them is that they can never count on the West to actually back up promises of Defense if the aggressor is Russia or China. Quite a few countries in the neighborhood are going to reexamine their external reliance in light of Ukraine. Saudi Arabia is already heading that direction. Look for more if Russia and China get more and more enthusiastic about disrespecting the sovereignty of their neighbors.


That is exactly right.

That gushing sound is the power vacuum

Not to be confused with the sucking sound which is Obama
 
2014-03-15 10:08:43 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Mentat: Nutsac_Jim: Ukraine was picking its noise. Georgia was mid scale military action into Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same. Keep saying it, though. Dubya and Georgia Dubya and Georgia Maybe even a few retards will believe it.

Putin provoked the conflict with Georgia.  He tried to do the same with Ukraine, but they didn't bite which is why he's left with Crimea.

Enlighten us into how Putin tricked Georgia into invading Tskhinvali.


You're saying Georgia invaded Russia unprovoked?
 
2014-03-15 10:09:15 PM  

The Bestest: Any threat of a new actor coming into nuclear weapons is generally met with the heaviest of sanctions and cyberattacks.


And that's all we'll have at our disposal, even against "non-enemies" like Ukraine - people we'd prefer to be friends with - now that our promises are in danger of looking hollow.

Arrangements like Budapest are the "smart diplomacy" that people like to trot out as the solution to the world's international problems. It is very much in our best interest to show nations that are friendly to us that our word actually means something - the outcome of the Ukraine situation will be a very visible signal to similar countries about what alliance with the U.S. is actually worth.
 
2014-03-15 10:10:00 PM  
l.yimg.com
 
2014-03-15 10:13:42 PM  

BigNumber12: Bonzo_1116: BigNumber12: So, where this is going is that, as more and more countries pursue nuclear weapons, we'll try to talk them out of doing so, and they'll justifiably tell us to fark right off.

What a world I'm bringing kids into.

Nukes are completely out of the bag, man.  The technology is nearly 70 years old, maybe older than your Granny.


They're both dead - thanks for the reminder, though!

And yet, if you actually look at the world, nukes aren't completely out of the bag. 9 nuclear powers out of a total of 206 nations?! You're full of it. There are plenty of countries who would prefer not to go through the expense of building and maintaining a nuke collection. What Ukraine tells them is that they can never count on the West to actually back up promises of Defense if the aggressor is Russia or China. Quite a few countries in the neighborhood are going to reexamine their external reliance in light of Ukraine. Saudi Arabia is already heading that direction. Look for more if Russia and China get more and more enthusiastic about disrespecting the sovereignty of their neighbors.


Since with nukes it's more about the expense, and the fact that plenty more countries out there have nuke reactors for power, I'd say it is out of the bag.  Hellish power available to the highest bidder.

Pakistan is dirt poor and they have nukes, simply because they were willing to pay up and put their scientists and engineers to work on it and buy them the shiat they needed.  The info to make the damn things is available and understandable to third year undergrads in physics.

Delivery systems are a way harder tech challenge at this point, and with the rise of UAVs even that might be workable for those on a budget.
 
2014-03-15 10:15:09 PM  

uber humper: Not to be confused with the sucking sound which is Obama


Don't do that. This is bigger than Obama. This is on our entire government, no matter which party is at the helm, and on our public to actually care about. We really need our National Word to actually mean something. Things will be much easier for the U.S. if the Ukraines of the world can simply say "we don't need Nukes because the West stands behind us," rather than needing to hack or threaten down every new country that decides to go nuclear because they don't feel they have any other option.
 
2014-03-15 10:22:37 PM  

flexflint: Nutsac_Jim: Mentat: Nutsac_Jim: Ukraine was picking its noise. Georgia was mid scale military action into Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same. Keep saying it, though. Dubya and Georgia Dubya and Georgia Maybe even a few retards will believe it.

Putin provoked the conflict with Georgia.  He tried to do the same with Ukraine, but they didn't bite which is why he's left with Crimea.

Enlighten us into how Putin tricked Georgia into invading Tskhinvali.

You're saying Georgia invaded Russia unprovoked?


Is  Tskhinvali  Russia?
 
2014-03-15 10:23:36 PM  

Bonzo_1116: Since with nukes it's more about the expense, and the fact that plenty more countries out there have nuke reactors for power, I'd say it is out of the bag. Hellish power available to the highest bidder.

Pakistan is dirt poor and they have nukes, simply because they were willing to pay up and put their scientists and engineers to work on it and buy them the shiat they needed. The info to make the damn things is available and understandable to third year undergrads in physics.

Delivery systems are a way harder tech challenge at this point, and with the rise of UAVs even that might be workable for those on a budget.


We're converging on a sort of agreement. Nuclear weapons can absolutely be procured, arrangements entered into - though going nuclear on the cheap usually entails procuring pre-constructed weapons that will then age away and be maintained and guarded with far less attention than such weapons deserve. Not a good situation for anyone, particularly if the public sees government money being funneled into the military to the great detrement of public welfare. Total revolution in a third-world nuclear power would be a nightmare scenario.

But my point continues to be - the list of Declared (& Suspected) Nuclear Powers remains very small, despite that availability, due in large part to the expectation that the West, and the U.S. in particular, does not tend to tolerate one Nation's invading another. If that assurance becomes increasingly suspect, we will see more Saudi Arabias who decide to go their own way and become tin-pot nuclear powers. That happening is not in our best interest.
 
2014-03-15 10:23:45 PM  

udhq: BravadoGT: Obama gave up missile defense in eastern Europe without getting anything from Putin in exchange. Maybe he should reconsider that decision.

Yes, and in doing so he sent the message to them that we no longer view them as a credible counterweight to our global power, which has driven them absolutely crazy.

Seriously, you're underestimating what a head-case post-Soviet Russia is.


My wife is post-Soviet Russian.  I have a pretty good idea.
 
2014-03-15 10:23:52 PM  

BigNumber12: uber humper: Not to be confused with the sucking sound which is Obama

Don't do that. This is bigger than Obama. This is on our entire government, no matter which party is at the helm, and on our public to actually care about. We really need our National Word to actually mean something. Things will be much easier for the U.S. if the Ukraines of the world can simply say "we don't need Nukes because the West stands behind us," rather than needing to hack or threaten down every new country that decides to go nuclear because they don't feel they have any other option.


If there were a stronger man (or woman) as commander and chief, it could be different. Romney? Probably, not.  Regan or Maggie? Putin would probably would back down. Those guys would lay down the law, make unequivocal statements that they would stand behind. Putin's game is built around people folding, not people standing up. This is not how you deal with bullies. They will just be harder to deal with the future.  You have to be direct, crystal clear, and follow though. Not mud -- opaque and pliable.

Weakness is dangerous. It will lead to an overreaction. LEADERS ARE NEEDED. PLEASE APPLY!
 
2014-03-15 10:24:08 PM  

The Bestest: ciberido: Personally I would do something like that

That's the equivalent of setting the can of kerosene next to the space heater.


along with insisting an full UN involvement in the coming election

That WAS insisted on, and summarily rejected by Russia.


Then it's an invasion, pure and simple, and military force should be used to stop Russia.  The ONLY excuse Russia has is "This is what the Crimean people want," and unless they can PROVE that with fair and free elections, there's no justification whatsoever.


The Bestest: ciberidoI'm ok with Crimea breaking away from the Ukraine and/or joining the Soviet Russia, so long as it really is the will of the Crimean people.

It's a bit of a stretch, but would you be OK with California holding a referendum to join Mexico?


Yes, at least in principle.  I wouldn't be thrilled about it, but if that was what they really, really wanted, I wouldn't send in tanks to stop it.
 
2014-03-15 10:28:17 PM  

BravadoGT: My wife is post-Soviet Russian. I have a pretty good idea.


Congrats/Condolences.
 
2014-03-15 10:29:43 PM  
BigNumber12:

But my point continues to be - the list of Declared (& Suspected) Nuclear Powers remains very small, despite that availability, due in large part to the expectation that the West, and the U.S. in particular, does not tend to tolerate one Nation's invading another. If that assurance becomes increasingly suspect, we will see more Saudi Arabias who decide to go their own way and become tin-pot nuclear powers. That happening is not in our best interest.

The sticking point is what precisely our disapproval consists of.  US Marines in Donetsk itching for a fight with Ivan?  Or is it the IMF freezing all banking transactions with Russian players?

And frankly, the US has been pretty loose on its interpretation on what sins rate an invasion in the last fifteen years.
 
2014-03-15 10:30:17 PM  

The Bestest: ciberido: Personally I would do something like that

That's the equivalent of setting the can of kerosene next to the space heater.


Maybe.  Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.  Maybe there's all kinds of relevant information I don't have.  Maybe I'd plunge the world into World War III, and maybe it's a good thing I'm not in change.

Honestly, at the moment I'm not even trying to be practical or realistic.  It's more like I'm telling you what I would do if I were Superman or had an army of indestructible robots.  I make no claim that my ideas would really be what would work best in the real world.
 
2014-03-15 10:34:37 PM  

ciberido: The Bestest: ciberido: Personally I would do something like that

That's the equivalent of setting the can of kerosene next to the space heater.

Maybe.  Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.  Maybe there's all kinds of relevant information I don't have.  Maybe I'd plunge the world into World War III, and maybe it's a good thing I'm not in change.

Honestly, at the moment I'm not even trying to be practical or realistic.  It's more like I'm telling you what I would do if I were Superman or had an army of indestructible robots.  I make no claim that my ideas would really be what would work best in the real world.


You handle it the way the Cold War was handled for 50 years.  You give the other guy two options: one that he can live with and the other he cannot. Let him make the decision.
 
2014-03-15 10:36:10 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Mentat: Nutsac_Jim: Ukraine was picking its noise. Georgia was mid scale military action into Ossetian and they deserved a beating.

You are right, they are exactly the same. Keep saying it, though. Dubya and Georgia Dubya and Georgia Maybe even a few retards will believe it.

Putin provoked the conflict with Georgia.  He tried to do the same with Ukraine, but they didn't bite which is why he's left with Crimea.

Enlighten us into how Putin tricked Georgia into invading Tskhinvali.


You identify populations within your target population that are ripe for exploitation.  Maybe it's a Russophone group.  You give them Russian passports, remind them how the central government doesn't appreciate them.  Maybe it's a separatist group that you arm and fund.  When the central government pushes back, Russia rushes in to protect the separatist population.  It's what Russia did in Moldova, Abkhazia and Georgia and it's what they're doing in Ukraine.
 
2014-03-15 10:38:00 PM  
 
2014-03-15 10:40:09 PM  

uber humper: If there were a stronger man (or woman) as commander and chief, it could be different. Romney? Probably, not. Regan or Maggie? Putin would probably would back down. Those guys would lay down the law, make unequivocal statements that they would stand behind. Putin's game is built around people folding, not people standing up. This is not how you deal with bullies. They will just be harder to deal with the future. You have to be direct, crystal clear, and follow though. Not mud -- opaque and pliable.

Weakness is dangerous. It will lead to an overreaction. LEADERS ARE NEEDED. PLEASE APPLY!


Damn right.  That's why we haven't heard a peep out of those Grenadan bastards.
 
2014-03-15 10:44:41 PM  

Mentat: uber humper: If there were a stronger man (or woman) as commander and chief, it could be different. Romney? Probably, not. Regan or Maggie? Putin would probably would back down. Those guys would lay down the law, make unequivocal statements that they would stand behind. Putin's game is built around people folding, not people standing up. This is not how you deal with bullies. They will just be harder to deal with the future. You have to be direct, crystal clear, and follow though. Not mud -- opaque and pliable.

Weakness is dangerous. It will lead to an overreaction. LEADERS ARE NEEDED. PLEASE APPLY!

Damn right.  That's why we haven't heard a peep out of those Grenadan bastards.


Haha

It's also why the world didn't end sometime during the cold war.

I said weakness is dangerous. So it being unclear. Misunderstandings kill people.
 
2014-03-15 10:45:39 PM  

ciberido: Maybe. Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. Maybe there's all kinds of relevant information I don't have. Maybe I'd plunge the world into World War III, and maybe it's a good thing I'm not in change.


A world war in starting in Crimea right now would be an existential threat to exactly 2 groups of people:  those actually in Crimea, and Russians.  To everybody else, it would be more like Iraq2 than WW2.

In fact, I don't think you could even call it "World War 3", because Russia may not have a single ally in the conflict.
 
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