If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Marketwatch)   NYC restaurant owner institutes no-tipping policy. "The meal should be there for you to enjoy without doing the calculus"   (marketwatch.com) divider line 109
    More: Hero, Grant Achatz, Alice Waters, hospitality industry, meals  
•       •       •

2082 clicks; posted to Business » on 14 Mar 2014 at 5:59 AM (26 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



109 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-03-14 12:16:38 AM
In before

"Good, I don't tip anyway"
[mrpink.jpg]
that restaurant owner dude's words of wisdom
stories about how brave Farkers left restaurants due to poor service in the middle of meals

etc.......
 
2014-03-14 12:19:34 AM
I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.  If they don't accept tips they'd certainly have to pay them more, but does the steady flat rate come out ahead or behind of tips for a good waiter/waitress?
 
2014-03-14 12:20:57 AM
As long as the restaurant pays their employees a living wage, I have no problem with this.
 
2014-03-14 12:29:44 AM

TuteTibiImperes: I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.  If they don't accept tips they'd certainly have to pay them more, but does the steady flat rate come out ahead or behind of tips for a good waiter/waitress?


Behind, probably. But the restaurants make more money, stay in business longer, and everyone is happier.
 
2014-03-14 12:43:41 AM
Tipping is for suckers.

I eat at the same restaurant several times a week and I never leave a tip. The service is always fine and the waitstaff are always laughing and having a good time.

Also, can anyone tell me why my cheeseburger tastes like ball sweat?
 
2014-03-14 01:28:44 AM
Look, I suck at math, always have, but if you can't figure out 20% of a bill, you probably shouldn't be handling sharp objects.
 
2014-03-14 01:32:29 AM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Tipping is for suckers.



No joke. 9 times out of 10 they wake up and chase you around the pasture.
 
2014-03-14 01:40:29 AM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Tipping is for suckers.

I eat at the same restaurant several times a week and I never leave a tip. The service is always fine and the waitstaff are always laughing and having a good time.

Also, can anyone tell me why my cheeseburger tastes like ball sweat?


Why do you know what ball sweat tastes like?
 
2014-03-14 01:41:18 AM
If its average service its 20%. Good service 25. Great service 30%. Its not hard.
 
2014-03-14 01:49:58 AM
I always tip 20% at least, unless for some reason the service is horrible, or I'm in Europe.
 
2014-03-14 02:52:37 AM
A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out

Um, that's because the "customary tip" is still 15%, since that's what the IRS guidelines account for.

/18% most of the time
 
2014-03-14 03:02:25 AM

TuteTibiImperes: I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.  If they don't accept tips they'd certainly have to pay them more, but does the steady flat rate come out ahead or behind of tips for a good waiter/waitress?


I suspect they do just as well, plus the stress-free attitude of a guaranteed paycheck. Besides, at restaurants like Per Se, you can easily spend $300 per person without alcohol. When that bill arrives, even a self-proclaimed "good tipper" would realize that $120 is a lot for 3 hours of service (typical party of two). So you knock it down to $75, which is $25/hr, still a more than reasonable salary, even though it's now 12%.
 
2014-03-14 03:07:23 AM
I always tip exactly 100% for exactly two reasons.  First, it requires no calculus, I simply multiply the bill times two.  Second, it makes me win Fark threads where people brag about their tipping prowess because 100% is more than 30%.

/~20%
//don't hurt me
 
2014-03-14 03:16:46 AM

Solid State Vittles: I always tip exactly 100% for exactly two reasons.  First, it requires no calculus, I simply multiply the bill times two.  Second, it makes me win Fark threads where people brag about their tipping prowess because 100% is more than 30%.

/~20%
//don't hurt me


I actually have given tips exceeding 100 percent.  It's rare and usually when I have cash to spare and feeling really good for some reason or another.  Being a hot waitress helps but not guaranteed.  It'll be like a 8 or 9 dollar meal and I will hand them a 20 and tell them to keep a change.  My usual tip is between 20 and 30 percent though.
 
2014-03-14 06:19:43 AM

Gig103: A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out

Um, that's because the "customary tip" is still 15%, since that's what the IRS guidelines account for.

/18% most of the time


That is also what my company's travel policy says.
 
2014-03-14 06:24:44 AM

Gig103: A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out

Um, that's because the "customary tip" is still 15%, since that's what the IRS guidelines account for.

/18% most of the time



That 75% don't do it is a clue that "customary" may not be an accurate description.

More than 75% of farkers spend less than the customary two hours trying to decode secret messages in TFA.
 
2014-03-14 06:27:03 AM
I realized that hot waitresses won't sleep with you if you give them 30% or more. That's taken me back down to reality. Also, I leave stupid small tips whenever I get cut off at a bar. Then I leave and smile and wave at them as I go. Douchebags.
 
2014-03-14 06:36:30 AM

DanZero: In before

"Good, I don't tip anyway"
[mrpink.jpg]
that restaurant owner dude's words of wisdom
stories about how brave Farkers left restaurants due to poor service in the middle of meals

etc.......


DAMN YOU!

24.media.tumblr.com
Just to be contrary.
 
2014-03-14 06:47:42 AM
I've never had a calculus class, know nothing about it.

But I can move a decimal point and multiply or divide by 2 in my head, so I guess I must be a genius.
 
2014-03-14 06:54:10 AM

SecretAgentWoman: As long as the restaurant pays their employees a living wage, I have no problem with this.


If someone doesn't like the wage then don't work there.
 
2014-03-14 06:54:57 AM
I always tip 0%.

/Because I live in Australia, where we pay waitstaff a decent wage...
//Do sometimes leave change if I can't be bothered dealing with coins.
 
2014-03-14 06:57:01 AM
When Scott Rosenberg did away with tipping some months back, he raised menu prices by 15% to cover costs

I am totally ok with this.
 
2014-03-14 07:06:25 AM
I'd imagine most restaurants wouldn't like the idea. First it means paying staff more during slow parts of the day. Second they'd be forced to put higher prices on the menu and may lead to customers ordering lower priced/less food. This would mean lower profits.
 
2014-03-14 07:14:30 AM
I subtract alcohol, salad and appetizers from my bill (they're not that heavy to carry) then add 12% to the bill. Also, I always share entrees with whomever I'm with.
 
2014-03-14 07:19:22 AM

DubyaHater: I subtract alcohol, salad and appetizers from my bill (they're not that heavy to carry) then add 12% to the bill. Also, I always share entrees with whomever I'm with.


We should hang out!!!
 
2014-03-14 07:29:08 AM

hervatski: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Tipping is for suckers.

I eat at the same restaurant several times a week and I never leave a tip. The service is always fine and the waitstaff are always laughing and having a good time.

Also, can anyone tell me why my cheeseburger tastes like ball sweat?

Why do you know what ball sweat tastes like?


Taint funny, McGee!
 
2014-03-14 07:40:39 AM
If these places are going towards paying their waitstaff more in lines with European models, that is just fine. Servers get paid equitably, and NOT the $2 and change that most places use for tipped positions, then drive on. It's a matter of budgeting for the labor, and I suspect that the bills are thus padded out to reflect that marked increase in labor cost. You'll pay more for the meal, but then again, the industry tends to charge what the market will bear. Yes, Virginia, high end joints will charge more than just their food cost+labor+operating costs to make a profit. If they're willing to take a smaller cut of profit by increasing their labor cost, that is spiffy for their staff. You will note from TFA that one of their model examples is out of business though--not uncommon in the industry, considering the restaurant failure rate--but I'd be interested in seeing what these folks are charging per item before making any judgments.

In the end: if they can make their mortgage, their operating costs, cover their labor and food costs, and their liquor and beverage costs, that's just fine. I can see the attraction to it, but likewise, I'm Old Skool enough to realize that the market is often divorced of knowledge about what it truly costs per plate--on the customer end that is--and if you want to try this, you'd best be someplace where plate costs are fair high so the patrons aren't aware of the increase that will be on their shoulders. You're going to pay for waitstaff no matter what. If the staff is paid well, then drive on. Given that a lot of their competitors don't feel this way, this is an interesting experiment. Lower and middle end joints...that's the bugger to the equation, because they are much more hostage to price points, especially where competition is concerned. Higher end? Less of an issue, but lower and middle end joints, I wouldn't expect to see anyone turning to this model any time soon. The competition is already brisk and furious, and will definitely influence such decisions. If you can shave pennies on the dollar per meal, you have to, otherwise you're cutting your own throat.
 
2014-03-14 07:51:13 AM
A motivated waiter will upsell checks and turn tables faster. Why? More tips.

An unmotivated waiter like I was would ask busboys to let my dirty tables sit.
 
2014-03-14 08:04:51 AM
getlol.info
 
2014-03-14 08:07:44 AM
Calculus?  Tip with respect to time?  Interdasting......
 
2014-03-14 08:09:09 AM

PreMortem: I've never had a calculus class, know nothing about it.

But I can move a decimal point and multiply or divide by 2 in my head, so I guess I must be a genius.


Is that the same as taking 10 percent and doubling it?

/sin x dx
 
2014-03-14 08:28:48 AM
This would make it harder to ensure appropriate staffing for restaurants that have big ups and downs. Restaurants commonly overstaff their front of the house, in case a night turns out to be busy. They can then sent people home, paying them nothing more than a couple hours of minimum wage, if it doesn't happen.

It would also do a lot of equalize server pay. Restaurants commonly reward their best people by giving them the busiest, most lucrative shifts, while the third-stringers are stuck cleaning salt shakers on the slow nights. This means their income is very different. But if they were paying wages it would be difficult to pay some waiters $15 per hour and others $35, which is how it ends up shaking out now. Good or bad, depends on how you look at it.
 
2014-03-14 08:35:25 AM

hervatski: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Tipping is for suckers.

I eat at the same restaurant several times a week and I never leave a tip. The service is always fine and the waitstaff are always laughing and having a good time.

Also, can anyone tell me why my cheeseburger tastes like ball sweat?

Why do you know what ball sweat tastes like?


Please, don't answer that question.

thx
 
2014-03-14 08:35:33 AM
If you're doing "calculus" in the process of tipping, you're doing it wrong.
 
2014-03-14 08:36:10 AM

doglover: TuteTibiImperes: I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.  If they don't accept tips they'd certainly have to pay them more, but does the steady flat rate come out ahead or behind of tips for a good waiter/waitress?

Behind, probably. But the restaurants make more money, stay in business longer, and everyone is happier.


Not sure about that, because it depends on the price per plate and assumes people always tip well. I'll wager it's closer to a wash (near equal) than anything else.
 
2014-03-14 08:47:49 AM
This article was previously linked here on Fark:

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/culturebox/2013/08/tipless_restau ra nts_the_linkery_s_owner_explains_why_abolishing_tipping.html

Perhaps it would not be good for those making the most tips but he certainly appears to make his case well that, in the majority of cases, it would be prudent for a variety of reasons
 
2014-03-14 08:50:25 AM
And while you are at it, could grocery stores list prices with taxes included ? That's one of the things that highly frustrated when I lived in the USA, the fact that I could never know in advance what I'd pay.

Can anybody tell me why prices are never listed taxes included, in the USA?
 
2014-03-14 08:51:35 AM

Gig103: A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out

Um, that's because the "customary tip" is still 15%, since that's what the IRS guidelines account for.

/18% most of the time


The sushi place in the article raised prices to cover the cost difference of the no tipping policy. I call shenanigans. First off, in Europe where there is a no tip culture, prices are not 15% higher overall. If you compare similar establishments there might (and this will vary per dish a bit) a 15% difference. They also include taxes in the dish price many (if not most) places.

I ate everywhere from small brassieres, doner (similar to gyros) carts, to high end establishments. What they get you on in Europe is the drinks. Soda (in particular) is more expensive and sold in an 8-16 oz glass. Beer isn't bad, and coffee (other than specialty places) is cheap. Then again, all the soda I saw in Europe had sugar in it, not HFCS. Sugar costs more than HFCS so they've got to cover that.

Plus you see that meat prices, amongst the other things on your plate, are a bit more as well. Most wait staff I met spoke 2-4 languages and had degrees from hospitality schools to top it off.

Yeah, this guy's price difference is legit *rolleyes*
 
2014-03-14 08:52:25 AM
Oh.... and:

media.tumblr.com
 
2014-03-14 08:53:44 AM

God Is My Co-Pirate: Look, I suck at math, always have, but if you can't figure out 20% of a bill, you probably shouldn't be handling sharp objects.


For reals....you're not evaluating differential equations with complex variables. It's a percentage. You're moving a decimal point, and multiplying by 2. Or you're firing up an app on that smartphone you can't leave alone for even a minute....

/grumpy Friday
 
2014-03-14 09:14:08 AM

TuteTibiImperes: I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.  If they don't accept tips they'd certainly have to pay them more, but does the steady flat rate come out ahead or behind of tips for a good waiter/waitress?


Simple economics tells us the harmonic rate would be higher than what bad servers make and lower than what good servers make. However, this means they will be unable to attract good servicefolk. They'll have to repeated fire people and hire new ones. At some point the hiring costs will be such that they will just offer higher wages to get better talent. And the price of meals will rise, limiting the customer base to people who will expect better service.... and the cycle repeats.

Realistically the no tip model should only work for high end dining, and that's probably the audience most on board with tipping.
 
2014-03-14 09:15:08 AM

God Is My Co-Pirate: Look, I suck at math, always have, but if you can't figure out 20% of a bill, you probably shouldn't be handling sharp objects.


This. Came here to say that if people consider tip math to be "calculus" then that is a sad commentary on the state of education in our country.
 
2014-03-14 09:17:42 AM

padraig: And while you are at it, could grocery stores list prices with taxes included ? That's one of the things that highly frustrated when I lived in the USA, the fact that I could never know in advance what I'd pay.

Can anybody tell me why prices are never listed taxes included, in the USA?


The eeeeevil of soshulizms.  We're the folks that came up with 9/10s of a cent on gas because if gas is $3.50 a gallon on place and $3.499 another, I know where *I'm* going to save 2 cents!  It's free to drive to the other side of town, right?
 
2014-03-14 09:23:34 AM
"A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out"

That's because the customary amount for a tip is 15%, always has been, always will be.
 
2014-03-14 09:29:01 AM

TuteTibiImperes: I wonder how the income works out for the waitstaff at tipped based vs non-tipping restaurants.


I'm curious about the taxes. When I was waiting tables, I was charged 8% of sales in taxes. Is this still the standard?
 
2014-03-14 09:32:57 AM

inglixthemad: I ate everywhere from small brassieres


It's "brasseries", not "brassieres". However, you are suggesting that food was served to you in women's undergarments.
 
2014-03-14 09:37:14 AM

Gig103: I suspect they do just as well, plus the stress-free attitude of a guaranteed paycheck. Besides, at restaurants like Per Se, you can easily spend $300 per person without alcohol. When that bill arrives, even a self-proclaimed "good tipper" would realize that $120 is a lot for 3 hours of service (typical party of two). So you knock it down to $75, which is $25/hr, still a more than reasonable salary, even though it's now 12%.


At Per Se (or most fine dining in NYC), that $75 or whatever is split between the head waiter, all the assistant waiters, the bartenders, the hostess and the bus boys..   So it's not all going into your pocket.

They make decent money there, but not superb or anything.   You are still tipping a lot there too, its just included in the price.
 
2014-03-14 09:38:33 AM

hubiestubert: If these places are going towards paying their waitstaff more in lines with European models, that is just fine.


Just fine if you like atrocious service....

/When living in Germany I always wanted to work a restaraunt job for a week or two so I could be a farking prick to my customers and not worry about not getting a tip or being fired.  Would have been theraputic after the years of waiting/bartending in college.
 
2014-03-14 10:02:31 AM
Eddie Adams from Torrance:

I eat at the same restaurant several times a week ........

Also, can anyone tell me why my cheeseburger tastes like ball sweat?


It tastes like ball sweat "several times a week".

/can't answer that one
 
2014-03-14 10:12:21 AM

ReapTheChaos: "A solid majority of Americans - 75% - say they tip less than the customary 20% when dining out"

That's because the customary amount for a tip is 15%, always has been, always will be.


I had a discussion with a bartender friend of mine where he argued that 20% is now customary because of inflation. He's not a close friend.
 
Displayed 50 of 109 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report