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(ABC)   Idaho hockey fans sue arena after someone discovers $7 cups hold the same amount of beer as $4 ones   (abcnews.go.com) divider line 126
    More: Followup, Idaho, CenturyLink, NBA Development League, stadiums  
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11544 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Mar 2014 at 7:45 AM (27 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-13 02:19:25 AM

KidKorporate: yukichigai: Plush_Cthulhu: Heh, CenturyLink Field here in Seattle (Seahawks) had the same issue a few years ago.

http://seattletimes.com/html/seahawks/2013877469_hawkbeer08.html

So they can show a pattern of deliberate misrepresentation even.  Lovely.  That'll make the lawsuit go a lot smoother.

Related: I'd like to see a law that requires vendors to use the actual capacity in ounces as the name of the size you purchase.  No "large" and "small", they can only call it "16oz" and "20oz".  Not just for sports arenas either; amusement parks, carnivals, concert venues, outdoor markets... plenty of areas that pull the same crap.

So, Starbucks will actually be OK with the Venti, then?


Well yeah, for two reasons.  One, they list the actual ounce size of their beverages in quite a few places that are easy to find.  They have to as a brick-and-mortar store; concessions stands don't.  Two, their entire business model isn't built around deception and having a captive audience.  Starbucks may be a business built around charging too much for mediocre coffee, but they don't then go the extra mile by trying to make you pay double the amount for 4 ounces more liquid.  Starbucks and brick-and-mortar restaurants aren't the ones ripping people off in this manner.

If it really became a sticking point though I'd be okay with a law that required the actual ounce measurement to be included in the name of the size for all businesses, e.g. "Venti 24oz", etc.  People would still order a Grande half-caff light soy almond mocha frappuchino with an extra shot, but the signage would say "Grande 16oz" now.
 
2014-03-13 02:20:06 AM

KidKorporate: So, Starbucks will actually be OK with the Venti, then?


All I know is that a tall is a small.
 
2014-03-13 02:20:21 AM

proteus_b: yukichigai: Related: I'd like to see a law that requires vendors to use the actual capacity in ounces as the name of the size you purchase.

Why should there be such a law? Should there be a law requiring them to offer small and large? Maybe medium as well? Should there be a law requiring them to make a drink of any size you request, at any price? Perhaps a law insuring that they have your favorite beer on tap? I'd like to see a law that requires people like you to be sterilized as soon as your lunacy is detected.


I just wanted to join the list of people laughing at you.
 
2014-03-13 02:22:13 AM

proteus_b: Should there be a law requiring them to make a drink of any size you request, at any price?


Heck yeah there should.
 
2014-03-13 02:22:18 AM

proteus_b: yukichigai: Related: I'd like to see a law that requires vendors to use the actual capacity in ounces as the name of the size you purchase.

Why should there be such a law? Should there be a law requiring them to offer small and large? Maybe medium as well? Should there be a law requiring them to make a drink of any size you request, at any price? Perhaps a law insuring that they have your favorite beer on tap? I'd like to see a law that requires people like you to be sterilized as soon as your lunacy is detected.


Yep, this is the dumbest thing I'll read on the internet this week.
 
2014-03-13 02:23:43 AM

yukichigai: Plush_Cthulhu: Heh, CenturyLink Field here in Seattle (Seahawks) had the same issue a few years ago.

http://seattletimes.com/html/seahawks/2013877469_hawkbeer08.html

So they can show a pattern of deliberate misrepresentation even.  Lovely.  That'll make the lawsuit go a lot smoother.

Related: I'd like to see a law that requires vendors to use the actual capacity in ounces as the name of the size you purchase.  No "large" and "small", they can only call it "16oz" and "20oz".  Not just for sports arenas either; amusement parks, carnivals, concert venues, outdoor markets... plenty of areas that pull the same crap.


CenturyLink Field
CenturyLink Arena

Seattle
Boise

Not the same place.
No pattern established.
 
2014-03-13 02:26:02 AM
arentol:
CenturyLink Field
CenturyLink Arena

Seattle
Boise

Not the same place.
No pattern established.


If the same company owns both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.
 
2014-03-13 02:26:36 AM

yukichigai: If the same company owns both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.


Companies don't own arenas, they just lease the names.
 
2014-03-13 02:28:45 AM

Confabulat: yukichigai: If the same company owns both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.

Companies don't own arenas, they just lease the names.


Well good thing I said "if" then. :P
 
2014-03-13 02:32:54 AM

C18H27NO3: proteus_b: Should there be a law requiring them to make a drink of any size you request, at any price?

Heck yeah there should.


That's called customer service; it's the difference between a coffee shop I visit once and complain about and a coffee shop I visit regularly and tell my friends to go to.

orangehat: On a side note every stadium in America should have a shelf above the urinals so you can set your beer down while you pee...it severely minimizes the possibility of someone accidentally dropping one into the urinal they're using and that's a positive for them and the people on either side of them.


Why stop at stadiums? I say every public bathroom in Seattle should have this so I can set down my Venti-quad shot-caramel-mocha-soy-latte when I have to make room for MOAR COFFEE!!!

/really I'm a 'shots over ice' kinda guy, but it sounded better that way
//DON'T JUDGE ME!
 
2014-03-13 02:41:48 AM

flamark: KidKorporate: So, Starbucks will actually be OK with the Venti, then?

All I know is that a tall is a small.


You can get a short, it's like a Dixie cup
 
2014-03-13 02:42:21 AM
Hmm...

16oz beer / $3 = ¢18.75 per oz.
24oz beer / $7 = ¢29.16 per oz.

Doesn't seem like the new cups really address the issue very well. You should get a discount for the greater amount, not a penalty. To make the numbers figure straight you'd need to charge $4.50 for the 24oz beer. Alternatively you could offer a 38oz beer for $7 which would be a slight discount.

I do have to say that $3 for a 16 oz beer at a sports arena sounds pretty cheap. I'd expect to pay $6 or more.
 
2014-03-13 02:45:32 AM
 
2014-03-13 02:46:43 AM
Brainsick:

Why stop at stadiums? I say every public bathroom in Seattle should have this so I can set down my Venti-quad shot-caramel-mocha-soy-latte when I have to make room for MOAR COFFEE!!!

That's a good idea too...I mentioned stadiums because it's the only place I've ever seen one and the next time I went to a different stadium I put it on the comment card as something they should do.  They should also do this in bars or pretty much any place where people would bring a drink into a bathroom.  They should probably have something similar in women's bathrooms but I don't use them so for all I know they have something like that already.
A lot of times the stalls at stadiums have the toilet paper thing that holds two rolls and is flat on the top so that's usually not an issue but sometimes it's easier to get a beer or two and wait for the line to die down than it is to wait in line and then get beers...
I've spent a lot of time thinking about this over the years but as a person who has attended roughly 30 to 100+ sporting events and concerts every year for the last decade or more it's something that I've noticed.  The thing is that it really wouldn't cost all that much and would be a huge improvement to every stadium.
 
2014-03-13 02:54:50 AM

Bob Falfa: How long had this been going on? It should have taken fans about 1 beer to notice this.


Can't figure it out on one beer.  You need at least two.  You gotta look at it this way.  First you order the small beer and drink it and then later you order a large beer and drink that.  That's when you first notice that the small and large maybe had the same about of beer but you aren't sure.  So you decide to order another large and small beer to test that theory.  You drink those but you aren't sure yet so you decide to increase your control group.  You down a couple more large and small beers to test it out and then you rip off your shirt and yell at the opposing teams goalie that their a biatch and you could take them in a one on one.  Repeat process each game and soon you realize why it took so long.
 
2014-03-13 02:55:23 AM
"CenturyLink officials announced a short time later that the company would purchase new cups for the large beers that would hold 24 ounces instead of the previous 20 ounces for a bigger difference in size."
-=-

So four more ounces for 3.00? Screw that, give me two 4.00 cups. That means I get 16 ounces for just a buck more.
 
2014-03-13 02:56:53 AM
It always amazes me how places like that, which already charge ripoff prices, just can't seem to resist going further to screw people and have to veer off in to illegal territory. I can understand (though not support) when something is being offered cut-rate and they are struggling to make money trying to find a way to get more. However stadium food and drink is stupidly profitable. Those $4 beers probably cost them on the order of $0.30-$0.50 between cup and alcohol at the prices they pay (you get good deals when you are that large). So they are making several hundred percent profit. No problem, fans are happy to pay it. But then, rather than making a large which you give someone more and thus make more money on, they have to go and screw people over.

Frankly I'd like to see places that do this nailed with massive fines. Say, take the cost difference between the small and the large and triple it. Then they pay that for each one sold. Maybe that'd teach them to knock it off.

I don't mind businesses charging whatever they like, if you as a consumer don't like it, don't buy it. However deceptive practices are bullshiat, and usually illegal to boot.
 
2014-03-13 03:01:21 AM
The monsters!!!
 
2014-03-13 03:06:33 AM

Popular Opinion: beer is overpriced at sporting events?
omg.


Admission to sporting events is overpriced at sporting events as well.

Fark em! I'll stay home and fall asleep watching em from the comfort of my own couch.
 
2014-03-13 03:22:04 AM
Been caught stealin'.  So, business in America is now just, optimally, whatever con you can get away with?
 
2014-03-13 03:27:27 AM
16:4 as 28:7

Kick their asses.
 
2014-03-13 03:35:26 AM

yukichigai: arentol:
CenturyLink Field
CenturyLink Arena

Seattle
Boise

Not the same place.
No pattern established.

If the same Concessions company owns the Concessions contracts  at both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.


Fixed that for you.

Usually Concessions are run by a company that is contracted by the arena, with the exception of selling team merchandise thats usually run by the team but not always.
 
2014-03-13 03:49:25 AM

sycraft: It always amazes me how places like that, which already charge ripoff prices, just can't seem to resist going further to screw people and have to veer off in to illegal territory. I can understand (though not support) when something is being offered cut-rate and they are struggling to make money trying to find a way to get more. However stadium food and drink is stupidly profitable. Those $4 beers probably cost them on the order of $0.30-$0.50 between cup and alcohol at the prices they pay (you get good deals when you are that large). So they are making several hundred percent profit. No problem, fans are happy to pay it. But then, rather than making a large which you give someone more and thus make more money on, they have to go and screw people over.

Frankly I'd like to see places that do this nailed with massive fines. Say, take the cost difference between the small and the large and triple it. Then they pay that for each one sold. Maybe that'd teach them to knock it off.

I don't mind businesses charging whatever they like, if you as a consumer don't like it, don't buy it. However deceptive practices are bullshiat, and usually illegal to boot.


Let's just estimate the alleged illegal profits. For every dollar of that estimate, they have to give away one $4 beer for $1.
 
2014-03-13 03:50:18 AM
Reductio ad absurdum isn't a logical fallacy, although of course it can be used improperly as I expect most things can.
 
2014-03-13 04:21:27 AM

mnemonic device: Reductio ad absurdum isn't a logical fallacy, although of course it can be used improperly as I expect most things can.


well, you could go with slippery slope or appeal to ridicule, but he actually did, in his own special way, try to illustrate logical consequences of his argument/view on the matter. When he does that, rao becomes a logical fallacy
 
2014-03-13 04:28:49 AM
This past thanksgiving, I bought a load of cans of Bruce's Yams because I was making several loads of sweet potato casserole. I found that two different sizes of cans contained the same amount of sweet potatoes.. I was pretty pissed but not sure what to do about it. One can listed the weight of only the sweet potatoes inside and the other listed the weight of both the sweet potato and the syrup they're packed in. I want to say one can was 16 oz. and the other was 24 oz. and both cans contained 12 oz of yams.
 
2014-03-13 06:10:33 AM

bunner: Been caught stealin'.  So, business in America is now just, optimally, whatever con you can get away with?


Now?  That's how it's always been.


Anyway, if I were king, there'd be random, unannounced audits and I'd revoke the liquor licenses of establishments found to be short-pouring customers.
 
2014-03-13 06:23:21 AM
I'm not going to mention the brand, but I am sure it applies to most brands. A small keg of beer costs about 35 cents LESS per 12 oz. serving, "here", compared to buying it in bottles.
 
2014-03-13 06:42:02 AM
What about the ticket prices? $75 for a small ticket and $ 125 for a large?
 
2014-03-13 06:43:24 AM
I used to know a pub in Seattle that did something like this. A 12 oz. bottle of any beverage would fill one of their (so-called by them) "pint" glasses to the brim. They apparently bought special glasses that were the same size and style as everyone else's pints but with thicker glass.
 
2014-03-13 06:53:48 AM
orangehat: That's a good idea too...I mentioned stadiums because it's the only place I've ever seen one and the next time I went to a different stadium I put it on the comment card as something they should do.  They should also do this in bars or pretty much any place where people would bring a drink into a bathroom.  They should probably have something similar in women's bathrooms but I don't use them so for all I know they have something like that already.

No offense, but what kind of idiot doesn't buy his beer on the way from the loo instead of on the way to it?

And if you say you already had it, then you're doing it wrong.  The idea is to finish it off and get another like the good consumer that you are.

Now, why again would the stadium want to make it easy for your cheapass self to nurse that one small beer?

/All that said, I'm completely supportive of a shelf to put your stuff down; though, whenever I run across one, I always suspect/know it's not been cleaned in eons and I don't want all those germs on my stuff.
 
2014-03-13 07:00:45 AM
This is why we in the UK have the weights and measures act. You can only sell beer in 1/3, 1/2 or full pints. You can only sell spirits in multiples of 25ml. You must not serve short measures.


Booze. It's serious business.
 
2014-03-13 07:13:58 AM

Confabulat: yukichigai: If the same company owns both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.

Companies don't own arenas, they just lease the names.


In most cases you are right.  A notable exception is Nationwide Arena in Columbus.  Definitely owned by Nationwide.
 
2014-03-13 07:31:32 AM
Me and Warren Z say Hit Somebody!
 
2014-03-13 07:41:55 AM
I see the price of a small beer going to $7.
 
2014-03-13 07:46:00 AM

yukichigai: If it really became a sticking point though I'd be okay with a law that required the actual ounce measurement to be included in the name of the size for all businesses, e.g. "Venti 24oz", etc. People would still order a Grande half-caff light soy almond mocha frappuchino with an extra shot, but the signage would say "Grande 16oz" now.



You mean like when Subway was caught selling footlongs that where really 10 inches, and their response, was "Footlong is just a name and not a measurement. In fact we don't see how anyone could take it to mean that they are supposed to get 12 inches of sandwhich, just because we named it the footlong"
 
2014-03-13 07:51:53 AM

Pick: I'm not going to mention the brand, but I am sure it applies to most brands. A small keg of beer costs about 35 cents LESS per 12 oz. serving, "here", compared to buying it in bottles.


Isn't that the point of buying a keg?
 
2014-03-13 07:54:58 AM

saturn badger: You would still get more beer for $8 for two smalls than $7 for the big one and you have two hands. Figure it out.


One beer per transaction.
 
2014-03-13 08:09:53 AM

saturn badger: You would still get more beer for $8 for two smalls than $7 for the big one and you have two hands. Figure it out.


Reminds me of when McD's sold 10 nuggets for ~$4 but you could buy 3 orders of 4 nuggets for $3
 
2014-03-13 08:12:28 AM

ElPollotonto: saturn badger: You would still get more beer for $8 for two smalls than $7 for the big one and you have two hands. Figure it out.

Reminds me of when McD's sold 10 nuggets for ~$4 but you could buy 3 orders of 4 nuggets for $3


Which one do you think has been sitting under the heat lamp the longest?
 
2014-03-13 08:27:12 AM

StoPPeRmobile: ElPollotonto: saturn badger: You would still get more beer for $8 for two smalls than $7 for the big one and you have two hands. Figure it out.

Reminds me of when McD's sold 10 nuggets for ~$4 but you could buy 3 orders of 4 nuggets for $3

Which one do you think has been sitting under the heat lamp the longest?


I used to always ask that they be fried fresh.  I had to wait at the door, and they were probably just dropped in the oil again, but they were always lava hot.  Probably full of spit too, but they were lava hot.
 
2014-03-13 08:28:07 AM

vinniethepoo: I used to know a pub in Seattle that did something like this. A 12 oz. bottle of any beverage would fill one of their (so-called by them) "pint" glasses to the brim. They apparently bought special glasses that were the same size and style as everyone else's pints but with thicker glass.


Nearly every bar in America does this with 14 oz glasses.
 
2014-03-13 08:28:17 AM
I've seen this in bars and resturants  around town.  Most notabley it's  in Mexican resturants.  My wife had ordered a jumbo margaritta. It seemed HUGE. However the waitress left an empty normal size margarita glass on our table.  I decided to have some and poured the jumbo margarita into the empty, normal sized glass. To our surprise, the entire jumbo magarita  barely filled the normal sized glass. I tossed in some ice and it was clear the only difference in the two sizes was the amount of ice.

We also noticed this at another upscale mexican resturant that features premium margaritas which, if you want you can order a pitcher of margarittas. I noticed the margarita glasses that came with the pitcher were smaller than the standard glasses.  Once again, we took a normal sized margarita glass and poured from the pitcher and discovered the pitcher actually held 2.5 normal sized margaritas, but cost the price of 3.5 margarittas. If you used the smaller glasses you would pour just over 4 glasses thinking you got a slight break.
 
2014-03-13 09:00:59 AM
Paging Piaget. Piaget to thread 8177658.
 
2014-03-13 09:05:50 AM

Confabulat: yukichigai: If the same company owns both arenas and both are engaging in the same type of fraud, that's definitely a pattern.

Companies don't own arenas, they just lease the names.


True, but the reason they do this is to advertise. I'm not sure Century Link is getting a good return by having their name associated with thieving beer thieves.
 
2014-03-13 09:13:24 AM
I don't get angry about this kind of thing anymore. But, it's a very big reason why I don't attend events anymore, and rarely even go out for dinner. For me, feeling ripped off trumps anything positive about the experience.
 
2014-03-13 09:20:30 AM

proteus_b: yukichigai: Related: I'd like to see a law that requires vendors to use the actual capacity in ounces as the name of the size you purchase.

Why should there be such a law? Should there be a law requiring them to offer small and large? Maybe medium as well? Should there be a law requiring them to make a drink of any size you request, at any price? Perhaps a law insuring that they have your favorite beer on tap? I'd like to see a law that requires people like you to be sterilized as soon as your lunacy is detected.


You should be sterilized immediately.
 
2014-03-13 10:03:32 AM

Danger Mouse: I've seen this in bars and resturants  around town.  Most notabley it's  in Mexican resturants.  My wife had ordered a jumbo margaritta. It seemed HUGE. However the waitress left an empty normal size margarita glass on our table.  I decided to have some and poured the jumbo margarita into the empty, normal sized glass. To our surprise, the entire jumbo magarita  barely filled the normal sized glass. I tossed in some ice and it was clear the only difference in the two sizes was the amount of ice.

We also noticed this at another upscale mexican resturant that features premium margaritas which, if you want you can order a pitcher of margarittas. I noticed the margarita glasses that came with the pitcher were smaller than the standard glasses.  Once again, we took a normal sized margarita glass and poured from the pitcher and discovered the pitcher actually held 2.5 normal sized margaritas, but cost the price of 3.5 margarittas. If you used the smaller glasses you would pour just over 4 glasses thinking you got a slight break.


You fail at drinking margaritas if you could do this math.
 
2014-03-13 10:10:28 AM
I've seen this several times in many restaurants...

Hamburger: $2.50
Cheeseburger: $3.00

bottom of menu: add cheese to any order: $0.25.

Can I sue?
 
2014-03-13 11:31:38 AM

Bob_Laublaw: I was just at a bar that featured a 16 OZ Pint and a 20 OZ Pint. That must be fun to see when you're OCD.


...and don't know that both are correct, depending on which side of the Atlantic Ocean you're on.
 
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