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(Patheos)   Rapes on Christian college campus result in expulsion of students. Fark: The victims, not the attackers   (patheos.com ) divider line
    More: Florida, Pensacola Christian College, Bob Jones University, god, honor code, Patrick Henry College, sex crimes  
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11843 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Mar 2014 at 3:39 AM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-11 11:50:38 PM  
Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.
 
2014-03-12 12:06:03 AM  
You're supposed to marry the man who rapes you.

It's right there in the Bible.
 
2014-03-12 12:14:21 AM  
Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.
 
2014-03-12 12:53:36 AM  

AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.


as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.
 
2014-03-12 01:24:22 AM  
FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.
 
2014-03-12 01:24:59 AM  
They just earned their accreditation in 2013. I think we can forcibly take that from them.

You know what? On second thought...

www.zerosun.com
 
2014-03-12 02:44:21 AM  

fusillade762: Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.


Ewww!
 
2014-03-12 03:42:29 AM  
(Deuteronomy 22:23-24 NAB)

    If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife.


Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)

    If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.
 
2014-03-12 03:46:27 AM  
I don't know what is worse: the details of the article, or the fact that I am not surprised. Every day I log onto Fark, and every day I read at least a dozen stories about religious organizations, be they churches, universities, charities, or political action groups, that disgust me so much that I almost feel physically ill.
 
2014-03-12 03:48:44 AM  
cretinbob:

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)      If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

And then of course according to Deuteronomy 22:13-21 she must be stoned to death on her wedding day for not being a virgin.
 
2014-03-12 03:49:11 AM  
It's really creepy that the rapist is now a pastor. Just lovely.
 
2014-03-12 03:49:48 AM  

doglover: You're supposed to marry the man who rapes you.

It's right there in the Bible.


Not so fast, Sparky. You also owe her dad 50 shekels.

/lest you think God is soft on rapists
 
2014-03-12 03:51:00 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


I think there's certainly more to the story...but it doesn't matter in the context of what the article asserts. She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape, even if there may be a question *who* did it), taken to a hospital, etc and upon returning to school the next day was expelled for being a fornicator.

Immediately after being brutally raped, bones broken, she was expelled for being a fornicator.
 
2014-03-12 03:53:52 AM  

timharrod: doglover: You're supposed to marry the man who rapes you.

It's right there in the Bible.

Not so fast, Sparky. You also owe her dad 50 shekels.

/lest you think God is soft on rapists


To be fair, have you priced shekels lately? One shekel

$125,000 is a lot of money.
 
2014-03-12 03:55:34 AM  
This article was very insightful, brought out a great deal of information that was fair and impartial to both sides of the story and is likely right on the mark with its opinions.

or maybe not...
 
2014-03-12 03:57:02 AM  
Look, if you havn't figured out that "Pastor" is code for child abusing rape factory, then you don't actually ever read the news or well, participate in America.

These pastor factories are just churning out thousands of people just like this guy. They're just raping all over the place.
 
2014-03-12 03:58:23 AM  

liltingbanshee: It's really creepy that the rapist is now a pastor. Just lovely.


Closet gay trying to prove something about his own sexuality to himself. Creepy, but par for the fundy course.
 
2014-03-12 04:04:21 AM  

Lady Indica: I think there's certainly more to the story...but it doesn't matter in the context of what the article asserts. She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape, even if there may be a question *who* did it), taken to a hospital, etc and upon returning to school the next day was expelled for being a fornicator.

Immediately after being brutally raped, bones broken, she was expelled for being a fornicator.


And then there's the guy. How do you go from wanting to be an actor to getting gang-raped prison-style by your roommates?
You could write a book with what's missing from the article.
 
2014-03-12 04:06:13 AM  
I doubt any of these schools will ever produce a Nobel laureate.
 
2014-03-12 04:06:45 AM  
For Christ sake, these are people of age.  If they think it's bad they should join Pope Francis's church of the little boy butt fuggers.  Hell. babeeee!   Everybody loves Pope Francis.  Believe meeee!  He's not going to start excommunicating all those gay pedophile priests like Benedict did.  Actually, Francis is going to reinstate them.  We love you Francis!  In the biblical sense of course.
 
2014-03-12 04:07:55 AM  
What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?
 
2014-03-12 04:16:04 AM  
The young lady in question went and enrolled in a Fundy "university" (deserves double quotes actually). She had a "boyfriend" whom she misread so badly she couldn't sense he was an Xtian sex maniac. She got no justice from the ha ha police or the ha ha ha "university" - rather the opposite.

So what kind of Christian will she choose to be? Turn the other [butt] cheek? Or go for some payback? If the gentleman in question is an ordained pastor, why goodness gracious he is certainly in what you would refer to as a "high-profile" [exposed] position, wouldn't you agree? Can't just skedaddle off and say oh that was then but this is now, I've seen the Light and let's let bygones be bygones...

There is a galaxy of payback awaiting the young lady, if she simply takes the initiative. On the other hand she may be waiting for the Old Feller to blink and come around and do the job for her. But he's old, really old, and you can't depend on him the way you could in the gud olden daze.

I'd not be surprised to see a followup piece from some eager beaver journalist within the near future. Rapist like that can't just slip away and start over. Unless of course he's Glenn Beck.
 
2014-03-12 04:18:08 AM  
Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.
 
2014-03-12 04:18:21 AM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-12 04:20:49 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


Yeah, it's always the other guy.
 
2014-03-12 04:21:45 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


i235.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-12 04:22:09 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


Maybe I'm getting jaded from having been on Fark too long but my spidey senses were a-tingling along the same lines. The whole article reads like something posted to outrage you but with nary a detail that can be used to verify any of this actually happened. If this in fact actually happened that family would (or should) have reported this to the local media and it would have become national news overnight.
 
2014-03-12 04:23:35 AM  
Jesus Christ.
 
2014-03-12 04:28:23 AM  

Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.


It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.
 
2014-03-12 04:30:48 AM  
Try not to be so naive guys
 
2014-03-12 04:33:03 AM  

i242.photobucket.com

 
2014-03-12 04:35:25 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


There was a time I'd agree with you. A time when I, too, would say "Ah, this must be one of those FAKE Christian groups, not REAL Christians like mine." But then I found out my group of Christians were protecting child molestors.
The truth is, like it or not, this is real Christianity. The truth is, you're not a real Christian. In fact, you're a decent, compassionate human being. And that's a good thing.
 
2014-03-12 04:35:44 AM  
FTA:  "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend "

Yeah, sounds legit.
 
2014-03-12 04:44:54 AM  

liltingbanshee: It's really creepy that the rapist is now a pastor. Just lovely.


No kidding, a pastor that rapes grown women instead of young boys? Very creepy indeed.
 
2014-03-12 04:45:06 AM  

nmrsnr: Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


Yeah, I was wondering about this myself.  Since there were witnesses to her kidnapped state (the guy who found her) and injuries, such as the doctors who treated her (who have to report all suspicions of a crime), how did the pastor guy not go to prison for 15 years?  If the accused perpetrator was tried and found innocent then I have no problem with the school not taking action against him.

So apparently she either identified the wrong guy, or no incident actually occurred?  Unless we conclude that local hospitals, law enforcement, courts, and construction workers are all in on the conspiracy. Lacking further details, Occam's razor may have some advice on which conclusion to favor.
 
2014-03-12 04:47:41 AM  
This article is a half-assed ripoff of a much more in depth story on Patrick Henry College from a few weeks ago.

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/11 6623/sexual-assault-patrick-henr y -college-gods-harvard

/ no hotlinky from phone
 
2014-03-12 04:48:28 AM  

MagicMissile: deportation as well as permanent exile.


What makes you think you can foist your misfits on another country?
 
2014-03-12 04:50:13 AM  

kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?


Math is just made up crap. You take some very simple rules, extrapolate a bit, and you get math. A perfect system. In the real real universe, no system is perfect, so math doesn't accurately model it. So we go back to the math, make up more stuff, try again, etc. etc. etc. Eventually we get a math that ACTUALLY WORKS to a useful degree of accuracy. Physics is chock full of it. But if you study physics for more than 10 minutes, you realize that there's still a non-trivial margin of error. That's because math is made up while matter is not. So you run the numbers a lot and make sure your math is as close as possible to the real thing. Even then, sometimes we have to re-kajigger the math to make it work again.


Religion is kind of the same thing. Take the "Word of God"TM (It's really not. It's the words of many men about the word of god, plus about 50 translations on top, and that's why you study it every week for a lifetime.) Apply, and repeat. When something's not working, back to the altar and meditate upon it and schism that shiat till it's working again. Ideally that's what happens. Ideally

But the evolution of the mental into the physical is the primary obstacle humans face in life. Almost every problem we face is just another flavor of this sour grape. So right now you have people practicing a wrong Christianity at this school. I say we should help them with compassion in our hearts and in no way spare the rod. Put them back on the cross as it were. Especially the rapists. We can literally have them following in Jesus' footsteps. Big nails are only like $3 each.
 
2014-03-12 04:55:29 AM  

MagicMissile: It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


So your plan is to pretend that Christians who do horrible things are actually atheists who infiltrate religious venues to hide and find victims? Then you have the audacity to insinuate that anyone who disagrees with your position is naive. 

You have demonstrated that you are not a good person. You not only can't accept the reality that not all "Christians" are decent people, but you tried to demonize people who had nothing to do with this situation. You know those "bad Christians" you and others are talking about? You're one of them. Shame on the people who taught you to think that way.
 
2014-03-12 04:56:04 AM  

Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.


You sound like a hateful hate-filled C U Next Tuesday of a human being. Are you for real?

ps: Were they real rapes or Duke lacrosse rapey?
 
2014-03-12 05:00:33 AM  

doglover: You're supposed to marry the man who rapes you.

It's right there in the Bible.


You're close, but it's even worse. Strictly interpreted, the penalty for rape is either death or marriage (under the flimsy legal rationale that you can't rape a spouse, therefore no crime, therefore no problem). Talk about your tough choices.
 
2014-03-12 05:01:46 AM  

fusillade762: Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.


It really depends on the type of candy bar. Some chocolate bars come pre-scored and can be shared without being the use of the mouth. Mr. Goodbar,Hershey Bars, and certain sizes of Nestle Crunch are some examples. Reese Nutrageous and Skor bars are a whole different ballgame. A single serve type candybar can be offered pre-bite or split with a pocket knife and be socially acceptable.

Using somebody elses toothbrush is sketchy. When I was younger and faced with the only option of using somebody else's toothbrush there was liquor or boiling water involved.
 
2014-03-12 05:01:48 AM  

Captain James T. Smirk: I don't know what is worse: the details of the article, or the fact that I am not surprised. Every day I log onto Fark, and every day I read at least a dozen stories about religious organizations, be they churches, universities, charities, or political action groups, that disgust me so much that I almost feel physically ill.


Maybe that could reflect a bias on Fark with what gets green lighted here?

/just an alternative thought
 
2014-03-12 05:02:09 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: nmrsnr: Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.

Yeah, I was wondering about this myself.  Since there were witnesses to her kidnapped state (the guy who found her) and injuries, such as the doctors who treated her (who have to report all suspicions of a crime), how did the pastor guy not go to prison for 15 years?  If the accused perpetrator was tried and found innocent then I have no problem with the school not taking action against him.

So apparently she either identified the wrong guy, or no incident actually occurred?  Unless we conclude that local hospitals, law enforcement, courts, and construction workers are all in on the conspiracy. Lacking further details, Occam's razor may have some advice on which conclusion to favor.


I can totally believe either a) the local cops are so shiatty they didn't take rape kit samples or b) the local cops are so shiatty any sample they did take was conveniently misplaced.

Don't forget, Pensacola is in the very derpicenter of Florida.
 
2014-03-12 05:03:12 AM  

wurdjunky: This article is a half-assed ripoff of a much more in depth story on Patrick Henry College from a few weeks ago.


Well, to be fair, this wasn't an article, it was a guest blog on "Slacktivist."

A google for Pensacola Christian College shows no news articles about rape, or any sort of crime or problems at all, in the first 4 pages of hits.
 
2014-03-12 05:04:44 AM  

JohnnyC: So your plan is to pretend that Christians who do horrible things are actually atheists who infiltrate religious venues to hide and find victims? Then you have the audacity to insinuate that anyone who disagrees with your position is naive.


Not to derail your righteous rage, but I didn't read the post you're responding to in that light. More in the light that it is the sickness and twistedness inside the people that is making them act in a sick and twisted fashion. Not that it's some sort of fifth column organized effort to discredit a religion. But that some people are bad, and some of those bad people pretend to be things they aren't - Christians, educators, mentors, family friends, etc - and then use the trust gained by their position to take advantage of others. Hey, maybe I'm wrong and the OP really did mean that it was an organized infiltratory effort by atheists, but I'll just present the above as an alternative to that.
 
2014-03-12 05:06:35 AM  

The hopeless imp: MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.

There was a time I'd agree with you. A time when I, too, would say "Ah, this must be one of those FAKE Christian groups, not REAL Christians like mine." But then I found out my group of Christians were protecting child molestors.
The truth is, like it or not, this is real Christianity. The truth is, you're not a real Christian. In fact, you're a decent, compassionate human being. And that's a good thing.


You have a waaay different definition if 'decent' and 'compassionate' than I do.
 
2014-03-12 05:29:51 AM  

untaken_name: JohnnyC: So your plan is to pretend that Christians who do horrible things are actually atheists who infiltrate religious venues to hide and find victims? Then you have the audacity to insinuate that anyone who disagrees with your position is naive.

Not to derail your righteous rage, but I didn't read the post you're responding to in that light. More in the light that it is the sickness and twistedness inside the people that is making them act in a sick and twisted fashion. Not that it's some sort of fifth column organized effort to discredit a religion. But that some people are bad, and some of those bad people pretend to be things they aren't - Christians, educators, mentors, family friends, etc - and then use the trust gained by their position to take advantage of others. Hey, maybe I'm wrong and the OP really did mean that it was an organized infiltratory effort by atheists, but I'll just present the above as an alternative to that.


Perhaps if he hadn't said:

MagicMissile: Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims.


... I might be inclined to agree. But he did.

If a police officer does something horrible to someone else, do we suddenly say that he/she was never actually a police officer at all and was an anarchist hiding in the police force to look for victims? No... we say, "that police officer did something horrible". That person might get kicked off the police force for their actions, but he/she was still a member of the police.
 
2014-03-12 05:34:45 AM  

Farxist Marxist: MagicMissile: deportation as well as permanent exile.

What makes you think you can foist your misfits on another country?


America and Australia?
 
2014-03-12 05:35:34 AM  
I think the problem here is they turned to a bunch of crazy people instead of the police when reporting these rather serious crimes.  Actually the bigger problem is they decided to attend a school based on crazy.
 
2014-03-12 05:37:02 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: wurdjunky: This article is a half-assed ripoff of a much more in depth story on Patrick Henry College from a few weeks ago.

Well, to be fair, this wasn't an article, it was a guest blog on "Slacktivist."

A google for Pensacola Christian College shows no news articles about rape, or any sort of crime or problems at all, in the first 4 pages of hits.


Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges
 
2014-03-12 05:42:22 AM  

doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap. You take some very simple rules, extrapolate a bit, and you get math. A perfect system. In the real real universe, no system is perfect, so math doesn't accurately model it. So we go back to the math, make up more stuff, try again, etc. etc. etc. Eventually we get a math that ACTUALLY WORKS to a useful degree of accuracy. Physics is chock full of it. But if you study physics for more than 10 minutes, you realize that there's still a non-trivial margin of error. That's because math is made up while matter is not. So you run the numbers a lot and make sure your math is as close as possible to the real thing. Even then, sometimes we have to re-kajigger the math to make it work again.


Religion is kind of the same thing. Take the "Word of God"TM (It's really not. It's the words of many men about the word of god, plus about 50 translations on top, and that's why you study it every week for a lifetime.) Apply, and repeat. When something's not working, back to the altar and meditate upon it and schism that shiat till it's working again. Ideally that's what happens. Ideally

But the evolution of the mental into the physical is the primary obstacle humans face in life. Almost every problem we face is just another flavor of this sour grape. So right now you have people practicing a wrong Christianity at this school. I say we should help them with compassion in our hearts and in no way spare the rod. Put them back on the cross as it were. Especially the rapists. We can literally have them following in Jesus' footsteps. Big nails are only like $3 each.


I had a friend work with one of his math professors on a proof that explained--to people with thick glasses, suspenders, and pocket protector as, anyway--that 2 plus 2 does not equal a precise 4, but something extremely close.

THIS is why I didn't major in math, but in something where people haven't stopped arguing for thousands of year: history!
 
2014-03-12 05:48:04 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: wurdjunky: This article is a half-assed ripoff of a much more in depth story on Patrick Henry College from a few weeks ago.

Well, to be fair, this wasn't an article, it was a guest blog on "Slacktivist."

A google for Pensacola Christian College shows no news articles about rape, or any sort of crime or problems at all, in the first 4 pages of hits.


That would suggest that it didn't happen *at all*; it's just a smear.
 
2014-03-12 05:55:10 AM  

JohnnyC: Perhaps if he hadn't said:

MagicMissile: Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims.

... I might be inclined to agree. But he did.

If a police officer does something horrible to someone else, do we suddenly say that he/she was never actually a police officer at all and was an anarchist hiding in the police force to look for victims? No... we say, "that police officer did something horrible". That person might get kicked off the police force for their actions, but he/she was still a member of the police.


Well, they certainly aren't following the tenets of that religion, which is typically how we define "religious", so I can see the other side, too. It's not like they are professional Christians, either. It's more like if there was a club dedicated to non-violence, and one of the members of that club liked to get into fights. He might be a member of that club, but he certainly isn't representative of the club's goals, now is he? Additionally, there's no certifying authority for religious people, but there is one for police. You don't have to apply to anything, or complete any specific course of action, in order to call yourself a member of whatever religion you want. However, there are laws against calling yourself a policeman if you have not met certain standards. I'm not sure those are comparable positions. However, again, we would not say that an anarchist who pretends to be a law enforcer in order to find victims doesn't typify police officers, but you seem to be saying that the people who pretend to be religious in order to find victims typifies religious people, and that doesn't square with my personal experience. For the record, I'm not religious, and in fact I am opposed to organized religion on principle, but that doesn't mean that I mistake the issues I have with religion with issues I have with the religious. They're not the same thing.
 
2014-03-12 05:56:51 AM  

untaken_name: However, again, we would not say that an anarchist who pretends to be a law enforcer in order to find victims doesn't DOES typify police officers


I even previewed and I missed that one.
 
2014-03-12 05:57:02 AM  
I'm skeptical. I'm not saying this doesn't happen at colleges, I'm just saying these examples seem a little far-fetched.
 
2014-03-12 06:03:58 AM  

Fury Pilot: Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges



Vice.com.  Interesting.  Google might be taking you to specific, um, special interest, sites based on your search history.  I just repeated the search and see nothing but general admissions information and such in either "News" or "Web" tabs.  Anyway.... this post again says nothing about a police report or a crime.  It is a third hand account that an accusation was made, no one was expelled (or at least the article doesn't say so), and none of it is verified by the college or anyone else.
 
2014-03-12 06:12:49 AM  
MagicMissile:

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.

uh...nope.  this is being done by a rather significant faction of modern Christianity.  you might not want them on your side (and I get it if you're disgusted with 'em, no argument from me on that score!) but you got 'em.  these days that's what Christianity has become - a place where rapists and scumbags can hide, grow, and hurt people.  this is what's become of that religion in the US.  either you face that reality, accept that Christianity has some serious soul searching and house cleaning to do and then fix it...or the problem will continue to corrupt, distort and destroy Christianity from within.
 
2014-03-12 06:15:17 AM  

rzrwiresunrise: I'm skeptical. I'm not saying this doesn't happen at colleges, I'm just saying these examples seem a little far-fetched.


no, its been something of a theme lately.  stories of rapes and rape culture have been hinted at for years about these places.  its only just recently that details have started to leak out.  I can only assume that someone forgot to pay their yearly bribe money to keep things quiet and that's why we're getting the nasty details.
 
2014-03-12 06:15:24 AM  

cretinbob: If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.


A just and wise punishment.
 
2014-03-12 06:19:59 AM  

maram500: -that 2 plus 2 does not equal a precise 4, but something extremely close.


I'm gettin' a math boner.

I may hate on the sciences here in favor of philosophy, but really who doesn't hate their ex? I was one semester away from a minor in physics and chemistry. I just didn't have the heart to keep going to school after getting a degree.
 
2014-03-12 06:27:53 AM  

Weaver95: rzrwiresunrise: I'm skeptical. I'm not saying this doesn't happen at colleges, I'm just saying these examples seem a little far-fetched.

no, its been something of a theme lately.  stories of rapes and rape culture have been hinted at for years about these places.  its only just recently that details have started to leak out.  I can only assume that someone forgot to pay their yearly bribe money to keep things quiet and that's why we're getting the nasty details.


Yeah, and the cousin of a friend that lived next door to my accountant told me the house down the street is haunted. Like I said, I'm not saying these things don't happen, but TFA gives little in the way of corroboration. The Vice.com article was much more convincing (thanks, FuryPilot).

Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."
 
2014-03-12 06:40:25 AM  
I knew a girl at university who made up a rape claim so she could miss her exams, get her entire semester thrown out all so she could avoid a single F on her transcript.
 
2014-03-12 06:42:45 AM  

Lordserb: This article was very insightful, brought out a great deal of information that was fair and impartial to both sides of the story and is likely right on the mark with its opinions.

or maybe not...


*favorited!*
 
2014-03-12 06:46:03 AM  

MagicMissile: Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


You are obviously not a true Scotsman.
 
2014-03-12 06:56:28 AM  
While the article carries an aura of truthiness...

I also believe I detect the aroma of...

Sniff, sniff...

An axe being ground against a bullshiat wheel.
 
2014-03-12 06:56:32 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


This is Florida. Not far from where I am is a place where the bodies of dead boys are being dug up and examined from deaths that took place over something like 60 years at a boys school. Just hearing about the stories makes you think of the boy's school that Jack got caught up in in the Talisman. Only this place was for really-real, and people so did not know about what was going on, even though their kids were dying, for so long that they'e just now exhuming and examining these bodies.

Give it time. The police will get around to investigating ... after the place is shut down and no longer donating to someone.
 
2014-03-12 06:57:44 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


You know how I know you've never been to Pensacola?
 
2014-03-12 07:00:18 AM  

rzrwiresunrise: Weaver95: rzrwiresunrise: I'm skeptical. I'm not saying this doesn't happen at colleges, I'm just saying these examples seem a little far-fetched.

no, its been something of a theme lately.  stories of rapes and rape culture have been hinted at for years about these places.  its only just recently that details have started to leak out.  I can only assume that someone forgot to pay their yearly bribe money to keep things quiet and that's why we're getting the nasty details.

Yeah, and the cousin of a friend that lived next door to my accountant told me the house down the street is haunted. Like I said, I'm not saying these things don't happen, but TFA gives little in the way of corroboration. The Vice.com article was much more convincing (thanks, FuryPilot).

Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."


I don't know he way she describes that it doesn't sound like she was very clear in alleging rape at all. It sounds more like the counselor could easily take that for her confessing to letting her boyfriend talk her into doing things. Unless I missed something there she needs to kick her self in the ass for not reporting it or doing anything about it before she starts blaming the school.
 
2014-03-12 07:01:47 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: Fury Pilot: Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges


Vice.com.  Interesting.  Google might be taking you to specific, um, special interest, sites based on your search history.  I just repeated the search and see nothing but general admissions information and such in either "News" or "Web" tabs.  Anyway.... this post again says nothing about a police report or a crime.  It is a third hand account that an accusation was made, no one was expelled (or at least the article doesn't say so), and none of it is verified by the college or anyone else.


Oh FFS, vice.com is the online site of Vice magazine, a magazine on news, culture and art.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_(magazine)
 
2014-03-12 07:03:24 AM  
Goddamit! NO POPCORN?!?!

/Seriously, good thread for popcorn...
 
2014-03-12 07:06:58 AM  

timharrod: Not so fast, Sparky. You also owe her dad 50 shekels.

/lest you think God is soft on rapists


Just so we're all clear on the penalty, that's about $250 in silver.
 
2014-03-12 07:14:54 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


Why, I'd wager not a single true Scotsman attends that school!
 
2014-03-12 07:22:20 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: Fury Pilot: Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges


Vice.com.  Interesting.  Google might be taking you to specific, um, special interest, sites based on your search history.  I just repeated the search and see nothing but general admissions information and such in either "News" or "Web" tabs.  Anyway.... this post again says nothing about a police report or a crime.  It is a third hand account that an accusation was made, no one was expelled (or at least the article doesn't say so), and none of it is verified by the college or anyone else.


Also,
i1024.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-12 07:22:50 AM  

fusillade762: Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.



"Look at that. A half eaten chocolate bar. It's hardly been touched. Do you want some?"
s10.postimg.org

/Obscure?
 
2014-03-12 07:31:46 AM  
The article is way too light an verifiable facts for me.

and by that I mean, none at all.
 
2014-03-12 07:32:34 AM  

Lord Farkwad: fusillade762: Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.


"Look at that. A half eaten chocolate bar. It's hardly been touched. Do you want some?"
[s10.postimg.org image 640x480]

/Obscure?


Bunky? How many times I gotta tell ya? The litter box, the litter box!
 
2014-03-12 07:34:39 AM  

log_jammin: The article is way too light an verifiable facts for me.

and by that I mean, none at all.


log_jammin: The article is way too light an verifiable facts for me.

and by that I mean, none at all.


Well, let's give the author SOME credit. There actually is a Pensacola Christian College.
 
2014-03-12 07:37:59 AM  

log_jammin: Lord Farkwad: fusillade762: Can we send these people to a country where they'll fit in better? Like Saudi Arabia?


a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars

You can send all those used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars my way. I'll take them.


"Look at that. A half eaten chocolate bar. It's hardly been touched. Do you want some?"
[s10.postimg.org image 640x480]

/Obscure?

Bunky? How many times I gotta tell ya? The litter box, the litter box!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FA4azb7tFg
 
2014-03-12 07:45:26 AM  
"a culture that teaches women who have sex are like used toothbrushes and half-eaten candybars"

imageshack.com
 
2014-03-12 07:46:50 AM  

untaken_name: Well, let's give the author SOME credit. There actually is a Pensacola Christian College.


I'm not taking away any credit from the author at all. I'm not saying they are liars or they are wrong. I'm just saying they didn't really give me anyway to easily verify any of the things they said.
 
2014-03-12 08:08:39 AM  

neongoats: Look, if you havn't figured out that "Pastor" is code for child abusing rape factory, then you don't actually ever read the news or well, participate in America.

These pastor factories are just churning out thousands of people just like this guy. They're just raping all over the place.


Rape rape here
rape rape there
rape rape everywhere

/rape is not funny, but this is fark
 
2014-03-12 08:08:59 AM  
I'm going to do a little clarification, just to throw my admittedly tiny $.02 against the intellectual heavyweights in this thread who are assuming this chick is lying because reasons.

Pensacola is an insular, fascinating old city-state on a beautiful stretch of coast. It's possible to live a very pleasant life here. It's also possible to run afoul of a streak of some of the worst social and psychological sickness I've ever encountered anywhere.

I was born here 35 years ago, and have livedin tons of places since. I've never seen anything quite like it. 99% of the people in this town are pleasant enough, if a bit placid. That 1% commits crimes that will give you nightmares to read about, let alone go through.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gunn_%28doctor%29

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/man-charged-in-fla-abortion-clinic-fire/ (2012)

http://www.inweekly.net/article.asp?artID=4718
"Panhandle top place in Florida for human trafficking "
"Saving young girls-- The biggest challenge he faces in Pensacola? 'Overcoming the opinion that they are criminals, not victims,' Dennis says."


Some reviews about PCC

http://www.studentsreview.com/FL/PCC_comments.html?page=1&type=&d_sc ho ol=Pensacola%20Christian%20College
"I dated someone that was a masked lier-pure evil.  He was manipulative and abusive but I had no one to go to or talk to becuase I would be thought guilty for something.  I was eventually raped by this person but I could not go to the deans or anyone becuase I would have been kicked out.  That is not Christian.  TO not help a fellow Christian in need is against Christ's teaching. "
"Attending Pensacola Christian College was bar none the most soul.damaging, faith robbing, and spiritually deterimental experience in my entire existence. I have been thus far mute on this issue and am taki.g.the opportunity to express myself.. All the information on control tactics, unfair gender practices, racial discrimation, outlandish, over the top gestapo agent behaviors is all true."
"As for being a Christian institution, I feel strongly that PCC is more cult-like than Christian. I say this because the administration was determined to control students and even faculty and staff instead of allowing God to work in your life and draw you closer to Him. Just like the Pharisees, it was easy to lose sight of God for all the blasted rules, and I know several former PCC students who lost faith in God as a result. I have not lost faith in God (I am a deeply committed Christian and active member of my church, which is Southern Baptist), but I must say that God used this year of my life to teach me what following God does not look like, as well as the dangers of legalism."


I have a soft spot in my heart for my hometown, but there's also no doubt in my mind the what this girl claims, actually happened. Pensacola has a streak of rapes, gay-bashing, religious threats, police brutality, even awful stories of mutilation and twisted child abuse that I won't link to here. My best friend was raped here, and I was assaulted.

It saddens me that such a beautiful and pleasurable part of the country, with such an amazing history and friendly folks, can have this dark of a mean streak running through it. I live here now, and sometimes you can almost feel the unhappy miasma in certain parts of town, and I don't mean the ghetto. I mean the goddamn schools and churches.

I talk with my friends all the time about this, and they sense it too. I'm glad to have one more year here, but I won't be back.
 
2014-03-12 08:11:48 AM  
a) they should not be accredited schools
b) I hope it happens to that guys daughter
 
2014-03-12 08:13:56 AM  
Some have even gone so far as to claim the administrations at colleges like PCC have the right to be "suspicious" of victims because "rules at that school make it nearly impossible [for a victim] to even get into a situation like this."

 Idiocracy at it's finest.  What if we treated homicide the same way?  Assault and battery is illegal, our laws make it nearly impossible for someone to be into a situation to be assaulted, so if you shoot the attacker in self defense, it's obviously murder because you were asking for it.... or something.

There's a single mention of one of the two main characters' rapes being reported to the police (the only other time police is mentioned is students not wanting to explain what happened to them even to the police).  Alight, can we stop having campus police get anywhere near handling rapes - unless of course like someone's screaming and they can actively stop it in progress - and require a department whose budget isn't tied to the PR success of the university to handle this shiat; and can we start charging university officials with obstruction for tossing out victims and protecting potential defendants?  I mean, if these bastards want to claim to be Christians, FFS WWJD... he wouldn't hide behind lawyers and school officials, he'd face the trial like a man and point out that hearsay is hearsay, conjecture conjecture, and that the facts are the facts.  Oh and he actually did stop a crowd from stoning a dirty toothbrush to death... also, he wouldn't rape people.
 
2014-03-12 08:19:07 AM  
Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season. After filing reports with campus security, both were asked to leave by administration officials due to "ongoing possibility of mental issues" and campus security refused to do anything with the reports even after repeated follow-ups by their families about the status of the investigations. After a month, the families tried going to the police, not realizing that the city police were not already notified, but the school refused to acknowledge that they had any knowledge of the allegations and the local police were hesitant to investigate a "school matter." In both cases, the victims families decided that pursuing the players, who were well known to the sports media at the time, would make the problem worse for their kids because of the publicity and simply moved the girls to another school.

These things happen at universities, no matter how closely they may or may not identify with a religious institution. There have been a lot of evidence that things are changing, but schools at those levels are driven by money, and sometimes they go out of their way to hide anything that may mess with their reputations.
 
2014-03-12 08:31:49 AM  
I work in higher ed.   I was annoyed at the mandatory Title IX training I and everyone else on campus had to go through, as well as all the explicit rules about handling sexual abuse involving students that allow no leeway or grey areas in handling issues other than full bore "everything must be reported to everyone no matter what".

Then I see crap like this and I realize that a good fraction of the population is too stupid and/or evil to handle it any other way.
 
2014-03-12 08:36:36 AM  

Weaver95: cozy little rape boxes


Nirvana cover band name?

MagicMissile: It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it.


There sure do seem to be an awful lot of those around... To the point where they seem to be outnumbering the "real" Christians... It's really sad, because as much as I dislike religion, I have to admit that a world in which everyone followed the actual teachings of Jesus would be a pretty farking great one...
 
2014-03-12 08:41:06 AM  

Captain James T. Smirk: I don't know what is worse: the details of the article, or the fact that I am not surprised. Every day I log onto Fark, and every day I read at least a dozen stories about religious organizations, be they churches, universities, charities, or political action groups, that disgust me so much that I almost feel physically ill.


A few bad apples etc, etc...
 
2014-03-12 08:45:11 AM  

sallys: a) they should not be accredited schools
b) I hope it happens to that guys daughter



I deduct that you are wishing rape on a (hypothetical) girl that has nothing to do with the action of her father?!?!  Newsflash you are a sick person...
 
2014-03-12 08:46:13 AM  
Not to go all ITG, but if my daughter shows up all beat to hell, claiming rape, and I can't get help from the school or law enforcement, I believe I'd go on a farking rampage.
 
2014-03-12 08:47:38 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


Not that it makes a lick of difference to the subhuman scum who run places like that, and which I would refuse to call schools, but colleges & universities rules about criminal charges usually read more like a requirement to wait until the criminal trial is dismissed or completed, THEN the college judicial system has a go at the student.  Whether or not they are acquitted or the charges dismissed has no bearing at my school.  You can be found guilty of a crime but "not in violation" of whatever college rule you broke, and vice-versa.  After all, the rules are not exactly the same as the local municipality's and state's criminal code, so you may easily have broken one but not the other.

I agree that it's awfully suspicious that there's no evidence of criminal trouble for the first assailant from the story.  Leaves us with nothing but conjecture.  Did he have powerful friends or family to squash the charges?  Did the "institution" help?  Is there more to her story we didn't hear, or is it the standard "shamed into recanting" BS?

The only reason I'm not in prison today is I haven't had the chance to meet or learn the address of any man I know to have behaved in this way, because I sincerely doubt I'd be able to restrain myself from murder if I had to look at them in person.
 
2014-03-12 08:48:24 AM  
Stories like this are why I no longer have any hope for humanity.
 
2014-03-12 08:56:11 AM  

doglover: timharrod: doglover: You're supposed to marry the man who rapes you.

It's right there in the Bible.

Not so fast, Sparky. You also owe her dad 50 shekels.

/lest you think God is soft on rapists

To be fair, have you priced shekels lately? One shekel

$125,000 is a lot of money.



As a side note: 50 shekels was on average 14 years of income for a healthy man.  Inflation and what not has brought that down a bit.  But it's interesting to think that it's where our modern child support laws were derived from.   There was also symbolism in the number, because it was the standard amount you could sell yourself into indentured servitude for.  (Slavery back then was a much different thing than slavery in american history)

Also note in the passage it states that the man may never divorce the woman he raped.  It was however common practice for the woman to divorce the man and buy a servant to help raise the kids.
 
2014-03-12 08:57:17 AM  
There is someone that priest should meet
img1.wikia.nocookie.net

"You can scream now"
 
2014-03-12 09:07:13 AM  
i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-12 09:09:54 AM  
The 'date rape' phenomena is not something new. Only recently have cracks finally appeared in the  cover ups that has been in place for by colleges.  The routine suppression intimidation of victims from making accusatiosn and causing bad publicity has been the standard behavior of almost every college that has ever existed.
 
2014-03-12 09:15:40 AM  
Does Pensacola have a DA?  Who is not a xian?
 
2014-03-12 09:23:53 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


YEAH!

I bet they're even truly Scottish either!
 
2014-03-12 09:24:02 AM  

MagicMissile: Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


8/10 for the first, but this one is less convincing. 3/10.

But surely, no true Scotsman would do something like defending an organization that punishes rape victims.
 
2014-03-12 09:25:02 AM  

incrdbil: The 'date rape' phenomena is not something new. Only recently have cracks finally appeared in the  cover ups that has been in place for by colleges.  The routine suppression intimidation of victims from making accusatiosn and causing bad publicity has been the standard behavior of almost every college that has ever existed.


Except this isn't about date rape.  This is an allegation by a woman that a man abducted her, tied her up, beat her causing serious injuries and raped her.  He happened to also be her "friend".  In the other allegation, a man claimed he was gang raped by his roommates.
 
2014-03-12 09:25:48 AM  
Well, that's not fair. Who are we gonna rape then?
 
2014-03-12 09:36:10 AM  
PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor.

I'm kinda glad, in a way. With scumbags allowed to be a part of church, at least we know where the scumbags are.
 
2014-03-12 09:37:31 AM  
At this point I view religious people - at least those that are religious to the extent that they would seek out a private religious school with strict "moral" codes like the ones referenced in TFA - like smokers. There was a time you could claim ignorance, but, at this point, the risks of hanging out with nutty religious crackpots and subjecting yourself to their rules and contracts should be pretty obvious. If you choose to accept those risks then the consequences are entirely on your own head. No suing the tobacco companies when you get lung cancer any more, no complaining about religious colleges when you get kicked out for being a rape victim.

If they weren't treated fairly by law enforcement or the courts in relation to the criminal end of it, that's another matter not brought up in the article, but, as for their expulsions?

Too f'ing bad. Maybe try hanging out with people who have a slightly more intelligent view of human sexuality than this guy:

lgsquirrel.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-03-12 09:38:28 AM  

CivicMindedFive: incrdbil: The 'date rape' phenomena is not something new. Only recently have cracks finally appeared in the  cover ups that has been in place for by colleges.  The routine suppression intimidation of victims from making accusatiosn and causing bad publicity has been the standard behavior of almost every college that has ever existed.

Except this isn't about date rape.  This is an allegation by a woman that a man abducted her, tied her up, beat her causing serious injuries and raped her.  He happened to also be her "friend".  In the other allegation, a man claimed he was gang raped by his roommates.


"Date rape" is a term often used to describe assaults by those the victim knew, that were not family--as opposed to attacks by a stranger.

"Acquaintance rape" is a synonym. So yes, this is a "date" rape, though he didn't present her flowers before breaking the law.
 
2014-03-12 09:47:27 AM  
I can't possibly be the only one seeing similarities between this school and the village from Hot Fuzz.  The aspect of the 'moral code' being used to suppress victims and prop up the university is only for The Greater Good of the school.

/I think I'm gonna be sick
 
2014-03-12 09:48:36 AM  

skozlaw: At this point I view religious people - at least those that are religious to the extent that they would seek out a private religious school with strict "moral" codes like the ones referenced in TFA - like smokers. There was a time you could claim ignorance, but, at this point, the risks of hanging out with nutty religious crackpots and subjecting yourself to their rules and contracts should be pretty obvious. If you choose to accept those risks then the consequences are entirely on your own head. No suing the tobacco companies when you get lung cancer any more, no complaining about religious colleges when you get kicked out for being a rape victim.

If they weren't treated fairly by law enforcement or the courts in relation to the criminal end of it, that's another matter not brought up in the article, but, as for their expulsions?

Too f'ing bad. Maybe try hanging out with people who have a slightly more intelligent view of human sexuality than this guy:

[lgsquirrel.files.wordpress.com image 400x295]


You make a decent point, but many area kids head to this school because it's basically a choice between PCC, Liberty "University", or excommunication from their families.

Not kidding. That's what happened to my mother, the daughter of one of the founding pastors at a local church. She chose to skip college and marry instead, and became the black sheep of the family.

Local Christian kids don't all choose this place because they like rules and raping people, though some obviously do. Even many students from hardcore conservative Baptist families, used to authoritarian environments, get shocked and embittered by what they find at PCC. It's like a fascist cult compound masquerading as a "nice school, and safe for little Suzy". Hardcore conservative parents insist on it, or no $$ for school...and these kids had been kept in such anti-government ignorance that they don't even know about student loans, or what "not accredited" really means for their futures.

That this little punkass went on to be a pastor isn't surprising at all. A certain amount of sadism appears to be required in that field.

As for the Farker that asked about a non-Christian Pensacola DA: I've never heard of one. If anybody knows otherwise, that knowledge would be useful and appreciated.
 
2014-03-12 09:50:11 AM  

CivicMindedFive: incrdbil: The 'date rape' phenomena is not something new. Only recently have cracks finally appeared in the  cover ups that has been in place for by colleges.  The routine suppression intimidation of victims from making accusatiosn and causing bad publicity has been the standard behavior of almost every college that has ever existed.

Except this isn't about date rape.  This is an allegation by a woman that a man abducted her, tied her up, beat her causing serious injuries and raped her.  He happened to also be her "friend".  In the other allegation, a man claimed he was gang raped by his roommates.


Sorry if I was not clear enough. Colleges/schools cover up any form of crime, or instituionalized behavior (hazing, alcohol abuse) that might make them look bad, even at the victims expense. At best, they may pay lip serviice to being concerned and taking action, but their first concern, over student safety, is protecting their publicity.  Rape, of any kind, is no exception.
 
2014-03-12 09:50:55 AM  

Epic Fap Session: Not to go all ITG, but if my daughter shows up all beat to hell, claiming rape, and I can't get help from the school or law enforcement, I believe I'd go on a farking rampage.


Yeah, this.  I can't imagine a single instance of seeing someone I love beaten to the point of broken bones and raped that doesn't end with my fists, feet and any other weapons that I could get my hands on being used.  I'm not saying I'd be very good at this, only that I find it hard to imagine restraining myself.
 
2014-03-12 09:52:41 AM  

Lordserb: This article was very insightful, brought out a great deal of information that was fair and impartial to both sides of the story and is likely right on the mark with its opinions.

or maybe not...


Oh, by all means, tell us the rapists' sides of the story.
 
2014-03-12 09:55:18 AM  
What was she wearing?

/rolls eyes - thank yew cheesus!
 
2014-03-12 09:57:39 AM  

noblewolf: [i242.photobucket.com image 640x507]


The "left" fork of the initial splits on that is wrong.  The orthodox churches didn't fragment very much, where the Roman Catholic+protestant line did.
 
2014-03-12 09:58:29 AM  

MagicMissile: Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


Read the Bible, doofus.  The whole thing, not just the nice parts.  Fact is, based on his actions, your god is an asshole, and so are his followers, since they use his dickish behavior to justify their own.
 
2014-03-12 09:58:36 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.



R i g h t....  Next you'll be telling us that not all Muslims are bloodthirsty terrorists!
 
2014-03-12 10:02:26 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


Nice thing about Christianity it tells a lot of people different things up to and including genocide.

If you are a Christian today the faith you believe in is one that has been twisted and warped out of any recognition to what was worshiped when the cult first started.
 The radical changes in doctrine is a testament to the inheritance of corruption from each generation of Christian leaders.  The idea of the hippy loving Jesus is a pretty recent example of how doctrine changes over time according to the need for the religion to control a new generation.
 
2014-03-12 10:04:04 AM  

Tr0mBoNe: I knew a girl at university who made up a rape claim so she could miss her exams, get her entire semester thrown out all so she could avoid a single F on her transcript.


Did she break her own arm to make her claim seem more convincing?

\not sure what your point is
 
2014-03-12 10:05:06 AM  
Question from the new SAT: So you're walking down the street one day, and on one side there's a church, and on the other there's a mosque.  How wide the street need to be before you can make it to the end of the block without being raped or blown up by a suicide bomber?

Assume the Earth is a perfect sphere.  Disregard friction due to atmospheric drag.  All meteorological conditions at STP (standard temperature and pressure).  Relativistic effects due to proximity of high-density concentration of derp in Central Florida may be ignored.  Show all work.
 
2014-03-12 10:05:26 AM  

supageil: CivicMindedFive: incrdbil: The 'date rape' phenomena is not something new. Only recently have cracks finally appeared in the  cover ups that has been in place for by colleges.  The routine suppression intimidation of victims from making accusatiosn and causing bad publicity has been the standard behavior of almost every college that has ever existed.

Except this isn't about date rape.  This is an allegation by a woman that a man abducted her, tied her up, beat her causing serious injuries and raped her.  He happened to also be her "friend".  In the other allegation, a man claimed he was gang raped by his roommates.

"Date rape" is a term often used to describe assaults by those the victim knew, that were not family--as opposed to attacks by a stranger.

"Acquaintance rape" is a synonym. So yes, this is a "date" rape, though he didn't present her flowers before breaking the law.


I prefer "casual rape"... I'm not really at a place in my life for anything serious...
 
2014-03-12 10:06:52 AM  
*sigh* You people act like this is just a Christian college or university thing. Rapes on most colleges or universities usually end with the victim being removed from campus. Most are "encouraged" to do so "voluntarily", but some are just out right harassed into it. I'm surprised that this college just comes out and boots the victim, but don' act like this is exclusive to Christian colleges.
 
2014-03-12 10:08:36 AM  
I am Jack's utter lack of surprise.
 
2014-03-12 10:14:08 AM  

MagicMissile: Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


When violence is as inherent to a belief system, as it is in Christianity when does it stop being a few lone ass holes and becomes millions of believers acting according to their belief system?

Just because the small sect you belong to has rejected violence does not mean, the faith as a whole is rotten to the core. It has been for about 1800 years now. I don't expect you to know the day to day negatives about your faith but surely you are not naive as to not know about the near constant genocide your faith has been part of? Violence spanning every part of the globe. Every Christian country has some example of extreme wholesale violence committed by the Christian population in the name of God.
 
2014-03-12 10:15:02 AM  

MagicMissile: Try not to be so naive guys


Ok, this is obviously a troll.  To say what this person said, then get the exact responses that pretty much anyone could have predicted (no true Scotsman), and follow up by accusing everyone else of naivete is too ironic to be real.
 
2014-03-12 10:15:20 AM  

Kali-Yuga: cretinbob:

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)      If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

And then of course according to Deuteronomy 22:13-21 she must be stoned to death on her wedding day for not being a virgin.


So you're saying the "can-never-divorce-her" thing isn't really a big deal?  The Bible, always thinking ahead.
 
2014-03-12 10:20:39 AM  

sallys: a) they should not be accredited schools
b) I hope it happens to that guys daughter


You do realize, don't you, this with this comment you have lowered yourself to the level of the school administrators who expelled the rape victims.  You consider the hypothetical daughter in question worthless and disposable, useful only as a vessel for punishing the father.

You are a horrible person.
 
2014-03-12 10:21:06 AM  

AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.


It's only going to get worse in the short term. Now predators know they can literally get away with rape. All they have to do is praise Jesus nice and loud when they aren't raping anyone. Before these schools were just places where predators happened to get away with it. Now, unless the schools crack down and start changing, they're going to attract predators who are enticed by a school that will throw the VICTIMS out.
 
2014-03-12 10:22:44 AM  

Brick-House: Well, that's not fair. Who are we gonna rape then?


There's always a new class of incoming freshmen...
 
2014-03-12 10:23:03 AM  
After article/comments: Now teaching all my kids: If you're raped, go to the hospital. Alert the attending that you have been raped. Demand a rape kit, and a rape sensitive officer be brought to you to get your statement and any photos necessary. Call me after they go to get officer and let me know where you are. I'll get there asap. Do not sign anything unless I am there, or you have a lawyer there to help review.

DO NOT go to campus security, or school officers. Go Directly to Hospital. Collect Mom.

O_O

Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.
 
2014-03-12 10:24:47 AM  

shamanwest: MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.

This is Florida. Not far from where I am is a place where the bodies of dead boys are being dug up and examined from deaths that took place over something like 60 years at a boys school. Just hearing about the stories makes you think of the boy's school that Jack got caught up in in the Talisman. Only this place was for really-real, and people so did not know about what was going on, even though their kids were dying, for so long that they'e just now exhuming and examining these bodies.

Give it time. The police will get around to investigating ... after the place is shut down and no longer donating to someone.


I should also mention children in religiously fundamental homes almost never report sexual abuse. If they do it is normally to a trusted friend or an elder.  The elder then will pretty universally sweep it under the rug or blames the victim. These communities are not a fun place to grow up in. It takes a long time just to learn to be a normal person when you escape out of them.
 
2014-03-12 10:28:49 AM  
Story would be better had it included some more actual facts
 
2014-03-12 10:30:26 AM  

tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.


If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.
 
2014-03-12 10:31:07 AM  

Rozotorical: shamanwest: MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.

This is Florida. Not far from where I am is a place where the bodies of dead boys are being dug up and examined from deaths that took place over something like 60 years at a boys school. Just hearing about the stories makes you think of the boy's school that Jack got caught up in in the Talisman. Only this place was for really-real, and people so did not know about what was going on, even though their kids were dying, for so long that they'e just now exhuming and examining these bodies.

Give it time. The police will get around to investigating ... after the place is shut down and no longer donating to someone.

I should also mention children in religiously fundamental homes almost never report sexual abuse. If they do it is normally to a trusted friend or an elder.  The elder then will pretty universally sweep it under the rug or blames the victim. These communities are not a fun place to grow up in. It takes a long time just to learn to be a normal person when you escape out of them.


That's also an answer to "why didn't her parents do more????"
 
2014-03-12 10:31:14 AM  

Big Ramifications: You sound like a hateful hate-filled C U Next Tuesday of a human being. Are you for real?


Weaver95 is most certainly for real.  And what part was hateful?  He is speaking the truth.
 
2014-03-12 10:31:46 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


This.

People are going to take the word of some blog versus the criminal justice system? This "story" smells of fake all over.
 
2014-03-12 10:33:51 AM  

stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.


Killing people even in the worse way imaginable has no affect with your standing with God son. We are all just as guilty, it's sin nature don't you know. Now so long as we repent and super love Jesus we all get into heaven with the gold and the whores.
 
2014-03-12 10:34:43 AM  

Lady Indica: nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.

I think there's certainly more to the story...but it doesn't matter in the context of what the article asserts. She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape, even if there may be a question *who* did it), taken to a hospital, etc and upon returning to school the next day was expelled for being a fornicator.

Immediately after being brutally raped, bones broken, she was expelled for being a fornicator.


What proof is there she was raped? As far as the school knows, she got stuck tied up after a BDSM session. If she didn't press criminal charges (and if the state declined to prosecute for the ones she doesn't have to press) then it is more likely that she made it up after being found tied up and naked.
 
2014-03-12 10:37:36 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


You're trying to reason with hate filled liberals. Heck, if the story here is true, it is probably liberals pretending to be Christians to advance their cause.
 
2014-03-12 10:38:08 AM  

Bullseyed: What proof is there she was raped?


Somehow you missed the part where she was EXPELLED FOR BRINGING UP RAPE CHARGES.

Let me say that one more time in case you missed it.

She was expelled for bringing up rape charges.
 
2014-03-12 10:38:47 AM  

supageil: Rozotorical: shamanwest: MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.

This is Florida. Not far from where I am is a place where the bodies of dead boys are being dug up and examined from deaths that took place over something like 60 years at a boys school. Just hearing about the stories makes you think of the boy's school that Jack got caught up in in the Talisman. Only this place was for really-real, and people so did not know about what was going on, even though their kids were dying, for so long that they'e just now exhuming and examining these bodies.

Give it time. The police will get around to investigating ... after the place is shut down and no longer donating to someone.

I should also mention children in religiously fundamental homes almost never report sexual abuse. If they do it is normally to a trusted friend or an elder.  The elder then will pretty universally sweep it under the rug or blames the victim. These communities are not a fun place to grow up in. It takes a long time just to learn to be a normal person when you escape out of them.

That's also an answ ...


There is a reflection of the children's actions socially to the adults.  A lot of pressure to have perfect Jesus loving children. Religion can be a funny thing, when you wrap your entire lifestyle and belief system around it the idea of being rejected even slightly by your peers is a powerful motivator to do extremely shiatty things to people you care about.
 
2014-03-12 10:39:31 AM  

doosh: nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.

Maybe I'm getting jaded from having been on Fark too long but my spidey senses were a-tingling along the same lines. The whole article reads like something posted to outrage you but with nary a detail that can be used to verify any of this actually happened. If this in fact actually happened that family would (or should) have reported this to the local media and it would have become national news overnight.


If her family sent her to a place like that, they probably approve of the schools handling of the situation. But yea, there's a lot missing here.
 
2014-03-12 10:42:00 AM  

stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.


I'm going with the duck theory:

If he walks like a Christian into his weekly christian service, talks like a christian espousing Jesus, including how Jesus used violence against the temple's oppressors (hint: They were Jews!),
and acts like a Christian in public in doing these things, and gathering the poor Aryan youths and giving them purpose and drive, encouraging the other Christians to get higher education to become doctors and lawyers, because "teaching to fish", etc.

...Then he was a Christian. You can be a BAD Christian, and still believe in Christ.

 King Herod was technically a Christian, for crying out loud- He actually believed that Jesus was the King of the Jews, and hence ordered all male babies to be found, registered, and eventually slain.
 
2014-03-12 10:42:38 AM  

Rozotorical: supageil: Rozotorical: shamanwest: MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.

This is Florida. Not far from where I am is a place where the bodies of dead boys are being dug up and examined from deaths that took place over something like 60 years at a boys school. Just hearing about the stories makes you think of the boy's school that Jack got caught up in in the Talisman. Only this place was for really-real, and people so did not know about what was going on, even though their kids were dying, for so long that they'e just now exhuming and examining these bodies.

Give it time. The police will get around to investigating ... after the place is shut down and no longer donating to someone.

I should also mention children in religiously fundamental homes almost never report sexual abuse. If they do it is normally to a trusted friend or an elder.  The elder then will pretty universally sweep it under the rug or blames the victim. These communities are not a fun place to grow up in. It takes a long time just to learn to be a normal person when you escape out of them.

That's al ...


huh, there is a lot wrong with that last post.

Basically the church can be a powerful motivator in keeping Parents of abuse quit. In a lot of ways similar to what it does to the abuse victim.

For an extreme example. What is still currently happening in Bolivia

http://www.vice.com/en_ca/read/the-ghost-rapes-of-bolivia-000300-v20 n8
 
2014-03-12 10:42:51 AM  

harleyquinnical: I can't possibly be the only one seeing similarities between this school and the village from Hot Fuzz.  The aspect of the 'moral code' being used to suppress victims and prop up the university is only for The Greater Good of the school.

/I think I'm gonna be sick


I suspect that villages like the one in Hot Fuzz may be more common than we'd like to think.
 
2014-03-12 10:45:40 AM  

Rozotorical: stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.

Killing people even in the worse way imaginable has no affect with your standing with God son. We are all just as guilty, it's sin nature don't you know. Now so long as we repent and super love Jesus we all get into heaven with the gold and the whores.


He killed himself... no pass for him...
 
2014-03-12 10:45:43 AM  

JohnnyC: So your plan is to pretend that Christians who do horrible things are actually atheists who infiltrate religious venues to hide and find victims?


That's why words have definitions. For example, you're not Catholic if you have voted for a pro-choice politician. You can go to church all you want. You can pray, donate money, whatever. You aren't Catholic.  That's why gay marriage is no big deal. It isn't real marriage.

If Catholics, Jews, Muslims, or even "fundamentalist christians" are right, whatever the rules are will define who was or was not a true member, regardless of what they called themselves. Say the Catholic version is correct. When Hitler died, he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven.
 
2014-03-12 10:48:14 AM  

Bullseyed: he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven


You are assuming that someone who has violated the first commandment their entire lives will get into heaven.  That's a bit of a stretch.
 
2014-03-12 10:48:15 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: Bullseyed: What proof is there she was raped?

Somehow you missed the part where she was EXPELLED FOR BRINGING UP RAPE CHARGES.

Let me say that one more time in case you missed it.

She was expelled for bringing up rape charges.


Except she didn't bring up rape charges. If she did, cite the police records, the national media story, etc. If she did, the entire hospital where she got her rape kit done is going to jail too for not reporting it.

Some blog on the internet making things up doesn't make it true.
 
2014-03-12 10:50:50 AM  

stonicus: Rozotorical: stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.

Killing people even in the worse way imaginable has no affect with your standing with God son. We are all just as guilty, it's sin nature don't you know. Now so long as we repent and super love Jesus we all get into heaven with the gold and the whores.

He killed himself... no pass for him...


Nah son, you don't know Hitler killed himself. There were no surviving witnesses. Hitler being a good fearing man. More then likely had his sister girlfriend shoot him before offing herself.  So don't worry you uncle Hitler will be in a mansion in heaven drinking from the same fountain Jesus and your pappy.

Now that Gandhi sick-o, that little fark is burning in hell each and every second for the rest of motherfarking time.
 
2014-03-12 10:51:34 AM  

Bullseyed: Except she didn't bring up rape charges. If she did, cite the police records, the national media story, etc. If she did, the entire hospital where she got her rape kit done is going to jail too for not reporting it.

Some blog on the internet making things up doesn't make it true.


If it was an isolated incident I would discount it.  These "incidents" are like a rash across the country, as you can see:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/08/18/missouri.school.rape.claim/
http://www.redandblack.com/news/student-accused-of-rape-expelled-cla im s-uga-denied-due-process/article_5383b38e-39c4-11e2-8540-001a4bcf6878. html
http://www.wsoctv.com/news/news/local/unc-student-accused-harassing- ex -boyfriend-after-f/nWb3S/
http://jezebel.com/5986693/college-rape-survivor-faces-potential-exp ul sion-for-intimidating-her-rapist

And those incidents are from SECULAR schools.
 
2014-03-12 10:52:10 AM  

Bullseyed: Except she didn't bring up rape charges


So she was expelled for no reason then.
 
2014-03-12 10:52:44 AM  
I see that Fark's Conservative dumbass racial apologist has entered the thread.
 
2014-03-12 10:54:47 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: Bullseyed: he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven

You are assuming that someone who has violated the first commandment their entire lives will get into heaven.  That's a bit of a stretch.


Why would they not get into Heaven? The bible states that with Jesus's blood your sins are washed clean.

We all get into heaven if we love the Jesus.
 
2014-03-12 10:55:56 AM  

pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.


Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.
 
2014-03-12 10:57:49 AM  

Bullseyed: if the story here is true, it is probably liberals pretending to be Christians to advance their cause.


If anyone needs more proof that conservatives are out of their farking trees, look up an inch or so.
 
Ant
2014-03-12 10:57:50 AM  

MagicMissile: What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it.


No true Scotsman would do that!
 
2014-03-12 10:59:22 AM  

Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


Some stories of rape are made up by the accuser. Many stories of rape are ignored by the authorities. Pretty much every major city in the country have a basement full of fridges full of years old untested rape kits.

You don't get to say anyone who says they were raped are lying, any more then I get to say you have an IQ higher them the temperature outside.

//the reason being they are both abusive lies, Bull Seyed
 
2014-03-12 10:59:25 AM  

Fury Pilot: Also,


Wow, um, I didn't mean to offend you so badly.  Lol.  I think google was ordering our search hits differently.  That's all.  I still think that.  I rarely look at arts websites online.   And what you linked is still a blog about no crime being reported.
 
2014-03-12 10:59:34 AM  

Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


You might want to consider using your super-powered cognition for good instead of just playing on the internet all day.
 
2014-03-12 10:59:52 AM  

Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


Haha, it's funny, because someone got raped, and you're pretending they're the bad ones.  "Those women and their bodily autonomy, amiright?"  You  literally know nothing about the case, but you're ready to blame the victims.

Oh, by the way, did you know, OJ's ex-wife committed suicide to blame it on him?
 
2014-03-12 11:01:28 AM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


The B.S. meter is STRONG in this article.  I was all set to get outraged and then noted that she went to the hospital with a broken arm and obvious injuries resulting from assault and what?  The hospital also did nothing?  B.S.

/fake story is fake.
 
2014-03-12 11:01:28 AM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


Please stop using the "No True Scotsman" defense. I am an atheist, and so are most of my family and friends. Morality is not taught exclusively through religion, it is easy to figure out right from wrong, even for us heathens. Humans can be evil, and saying that only TRUE christians are good people make your argument insulting to those of us who lead exemplary lives without having an imaginary friend to scare them into righteousness. Also, eat a dick.
 
2014-03-12 11:02:31 AM  

ikanreed: Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.

Haha, it's funny, because someone got raped, and you're pretending they're the bad ones.  "Those women and their bodily autonomy, amiright?"  You  literally know nothing about the case, but you're ready to blame the victims.

Oh, by the way, did you know, OJ's ex-wife committed suicide to blame it on him?


i.huffpost.com
- ooooo I knew it! That biatch always had it out for me!
 
2014-03-12 11:05:00 AM  

cervier: sallys: a) they should not be accredited schools
b) I hope it happens to that guys daughter


I deduct that you are wishing rape on a (hypothetical) girl that has nothing to do with the action of her father?!?!  Newsflash you are a sick person...



Numbers 14:18 -- The LORD is longsuffering, and of great mercy, forgiving iniquity and transgression, and by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.
 
2014-03-12 11:06:37 AM  

Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


Just out of interest, if a women close to you (girlfriend, wife, sister, daughter) came to you and said she'd been raped, is there anything she could say that would convince you it was true... or would you just assume she was a slut?
 
2014-03-12 11:08:29 AM  
Christianity, the so-called "religion of peace" strikes again.
 
2014-03-12 11:08:56 AM  

MinkeyMan: Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.

Just out of interest, if a women close to you (girlfriend, wife, sister, daughter) came to you and said she'd been raped, is there anything she could say that would convince you it was true... or would you just assume she was a slut?


Dude, I have a feeling that even if they had been wearing a burka that he'd bring up something about needing an escort.
 
2014-03-12 11:09:32 AM  

Begoggle: Christianity, the so-called "religion of peace" strikes again.


Aren't they all religions of peace, really?
 
Ant
2014-03-12 11:09:38 AM  

untaken_name: Well, they certainly aren't following the tenets of that religion, which is typically how we define "religious", so I can see the other side, too.


Which tenets? Some Christians think that all that is required is to accept Jesus' sacrifice. Some think that good works are required. Some think that God has already chosen who will be saved, so there is no way to get yourself into Heaven through acts.

Like it or not, these are Christians. They might not be your brand of Christians, but they are Christians nonetheless.
 
Ant
2014-03-12 11:11:32 AM  

rzrwiresunrise: Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."


Why?
 
2014-03-12 11:14:36 AM  

tlars699: MinkeyMan: Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.

Just out of interest, if a women close to you (girlfriend, wife, sister, daughter) came to you and said she'd been raped, is there anything she could say that would convince you it was true... or would you just assume she was a slut?

Dude, I have a feeling that even if they had been wearing a burka that he'd bring up something about needing an escort.


His first question would be, "Why were you out of the house?"
 
2014-03-12 11:16:14 AM  

stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.


Yeah, uh, no. Murderers, rapists, and thieves can be Christian. Stop making excuses. If you identify as Christian, go to church, praise Jeebus and then rape hitchhikers, you are a christian rapist. Also, eat a dick.
 
2014-03-12 11:17:51 AM  

Rozotorical: Marcus Aurelius: Bullseyed: he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven

You are assuming that someone who has violated the first commandment their entire lives will get into heaven.  That's a bit of a stretch.

Why would they not get into Heaven? The bible states that with Jesus's blood your sins are washed clean.

We all get into heaven if we love the Jesus.


The first commandment clearly states that you are to have no other gods before God.  If you claim you have to go through Jesus to get to God, you're putting another God before the first One.  And don't tell me about the trinity.  That's the math Christians do to make themselves feel better about violating the first commandment.

On the plus side, all the descriptions of Heaven I've heard sound dreadful.  So going to hell won't be all that bad.  Especially since our bodies won't be there.
 
2014-03-12 11:19:13 AM  
Woo, got me a motherfarker on ignore.
 
2014-03-12 11:23:12 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: Rozotorical: Marcus Aurelius: Bullseyed: he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven

You are assuming that someone who has violated the first commandment their entire lives will get into heaven.  That's a bit of a stretch.

Why would they not get into Heaven? The bible states that with Jesus's blood your sins are washed clean.

We all get into heaven if we love the Jesus.

The first commandment clearly states that you are to have no other gods before God.  If you claim you have to go through Jesus to get to God, you're putting another God before the first One.  And don't tell me about the trinity.  That's the math Christians do to make themselves feel better about violating the first commandment.

On the plus side, all the descriptions of Heaven I've heard sound dreadful.  So going to hell won't be all that bad.  Especially since our bodies won't be there.


I always thought that commandment meant God had to be your First and that was why he couldn't just make Jesus out of dirt or bones and shiat.

He had to fark a virgin to make a new God. That is why you have to love that new God, then he will let you come into is cold cold city of metal.
 
2014-03-12 11:24:57 AM  

Fury Pilot: Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges


That Vice article is based on an interview with Samantha Field. Samantha Field is the writer of the article linked on the post we are commenting on. She attended PCC, accused her boyfriend of raping her twice and then somehow was not kicked out of PCC and even graduated in 2010. So according to her claims that she provides no references, links, police reports the two people in her blog post were kicked out of school next day for being raped, yet Samantha Field was not.


She seems to have a vendetta against the school because of inaction on their part when she reported she was raped. Maybe she was, maybe she wasn't, but I seriously doubt the the two rapes she wrote about are legit. Police here in Pensacola are probably likely to blame the girl if it is her boyfriend she is accusing and there are no injuries, but a broken arm and black eye are likely to get the accused a few bumps and bruises when they arrest him. Since that apparently didn't happen and he managed to graduate on time, I have trouble believing this girl's story.
 
2014-03-12 11:29:28 AM  
i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-12 11:35:35 AM  

rzrwiresunrise: Weaver95: rzrwiresunrise: I'm skeptical. I'm not saying this doesn't happen at colleges, I'm just saying these examples seem a little far-fetched.

no, its been something of a theme lately.  stories of rapes and rape culture have been hinted at for years about these places.  its only just recently that details have started to leak out.  I can only assume that someone forgot to pay their yearly bribe money to keep things quiet and that's why we're getting the nasty details.

Yeah, and the cousin of a friend that lived next door to my accountant told me the house down the street is haunted. Like I said, I'm not saying these things don't happen, but TFA gives little in the way of corroboration. The Vice.com article was much more convincing (thanks, FuryPilot).

Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."


So, sorry miss, you weren't raped because the reporter who wrote the article I read sucked at his job? Seems like a damn good argument to me.
 
2014-03-12 11:40:32 AM  

Lady Indica: She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape


Oh, really?  How does that guarantee a rape occurred, Sherlock?
 
2014-03-12 11:48:33 AM  

skozlaw: At this point I view religious people - at least those that are religious to the extent that they would seek out a private religious school with strict "moral" codes like the ones referenced in TFA - like smokers. There was a time you could claim ignorance, but, at this point, the risks of hanging out with nutty religious crackpots and subjecting yourself to their rules and contracts should be pretty obvious. If you choose to accept those risks then the consequences are entirely on your own head. No suing the tobacco companies when you get lung cancer any more, no complaining about religious colleges when you get kicked out for being a rape victim.

If they weren't treated fairly by law enforcement or the courts in relation to the criminal end of it, that's another matter not brought up in the article, but, as for their expulsions?

Too f'ing bad. Maybe try hanging out with people who have a slightly more intelligent view of human sexuality than this guy:

[lgsquirrel.files.wordpress.com image 400x295]


So in a nutshell, blame the victim...
 
2014-03-12 11:50:05 AM  

nmrsnr: Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial.


Campus police tend to be in line with the school administration.
 
2014-03-12 11:52:39 AM  
Here's the worst part:

The school feels they are addressing the problem in the best way possible, either from a religious standpoint, or a pragmatic PR standpoint.

I am getting more and more disgusted at just how often people are treat as means or obstacles to an end.

Shamelessly lifted from Pratchett...


"...There is a very interesting debate raging at the moment on the nature of sin, for example."
"And what do they think? Against it, are they?"
"It is not as simple as that. It's not a black and white issue. There are so many shades of gray."
"Nope."
"Pardon?"
There's no grays, only white that's got grubby. I'm surprised you don't know that. And sin, young man, is when you treat people as things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
"It's a lot more complicated than that--"
"No it ain't. When people say things are a lot more complicated than that, they means they're getting worried that they won't like the truth. People as things, that's where it starts."
"Oh, I'm sure there are worse crimes-"
"But they Starts with thinking about people as things..."

Or for the more high-brow among you:

"Act in such a way that you treat humanity, whether in your own person or in the person of any other, never merely as a means to an end, but always at the same time as an end." - Kant
 
2014-03-12 11:55:23 AM  

Kali-Yuga: cretinbob:

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)      If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

And then of course according to Deuteronomy 22:13-21 she must be stoned to death on her wedding day for not being a virgin.


No.
1. Don't make stuff up.
2. There have to be witnesses - plural - for the stoning to apply. He gets the lash if he has no proof - and witnesses.
 
2014-03-12 12:02:04 PM  

Clever Neologism: "Act in such a way that you treat humanity, whether in your own person or in the person of any other, never merely as a means to an end, but always at the same time as an end." - Kant


Sure, the basic idea is nice, but once you start looking at the conclusions Kant draws in his categorical imperatives you go "really?"
 
2014-03-12 12:02:12 PM  

trappedspirit: Lady Indica: She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape

Oh, really?  How does that guarantee a rape occurred, Sherlock?


Broken arm, bruised and battered, found tied and taped up by the kampus kops. She did it to herself, einstien[SIC]?
 
2014-03-12 12:10:19 PM  

supageil: nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.

You know how I know you've never been to Pensacola?


I went to BJU for a year so I have some knowledge about the environments these fudie institutions breed.  If Pensacola is anything like Greenville, SC, many of the local cops went to the school in question.  So the rape kits were conveniently "misplaced".   The cops in Greenville used to call in students breaking student rules to the Dean all the time (rules mind you, not laws).  The students would then get in trouble.

I wish I could say that this story sounds "fishy" or that the schools weren't this corrupt, but it simply isn't the case.

/The More You Know.
 
2014-03-12 12:11:51 PM  

Kali-Yuga: she must be stoned... on her wedding day


i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-12 12:12:27 PM  

doosh: nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.

Maybe I'm getting jaded from having been on Fark too long but my spidey senses were a-tingling along the same lines. The whole article reads like something posted to outrage you but with nary a detail that can be used to verify any of this actually happened. If this in fact actually happened that family would (or should) have reported this to the local media and it would have become national news overnight.


Yeah, they should have reported it, but just because they didn't doesn't mean it didn't happen. Religious people bury the truth and cover up for their abusers all the time.

CSB: Back when I was a freshman in college I was dating a Pentecostal girl who was a senior in high school. Her and her friends were all in this youth group at their church. One of the girls in the group was overweight and depressed so the very creepy youth pastor began meeting with her one on one to "counsel" her, an after a couple of sessions of him making improper suggestions, he just flat out raped her. After a few weeks she finally told her family and friends what happened and they confronted the youth pastor with the church elders. He admitted to forcing himself on her, but blamed her (and Satan) for tempting him. The church elders agreed with him. To keep attending the curch (and to prevent being ostracized by their friends in the church), she and her family had to go in front of the congregation the next Sunday and apologize to her rapist and his wife for tempting him and for the hardship she'd brought upon his family and the church. She attempted suicide a few months later and then developed a bad drug problem. An the cherry on top is about a year later they fired the guy after he was caught taking money from the youth group "missionary" fund. They couldn't tolerate such a violation of the church. So to recap: Raping a minor you are in a position of authority over, a-ok, but stealing a few hundred dollars from the ski trip to Aspen "missionary" fund, completely unacceptable.
 
2014-03-12 12:15:07 PM  

Kali-Yuga: cretinbob:

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)      If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father.  Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

And then of course according to Deuteronomy 22:13-21 she must be stoned to death on her wedding day for not being a virgin.


Getting somebody THAT stoned takes a lot of weed!
 
2014-03-12 12:18:42 PM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend. A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report. In the next 24 hours, she went to the hospital, reported her attack to the police, and stayed the night with her parents. However, when she arrived back on campus with a black eye and a broken arm, her family was confronted by the dean of women and told that Beth was being expelled "because she is a fornicator."

PCC took no action against Beth's boyfriend. He graduated with honors and is now a pastor."

Okay, there has to be something missing from this story. I know that most women don't report rape, but here it says she filed a report. Even if she failed to go through with pressing charges, kidnapping and false imprisonment (and potentially attempted murder for leaving her there bound) are all crimes for which the victim doesn't have to press charges, the state can. So even if the school didn't take action, the guy should have been arrested and had a trial. The article makes no mention of this one way or the other. If he had a trial and was acquitted, then the college shouldn't have taken any action against him, because in the eyes of the law he is innocent. If he was never brought to trial despite the evidence, there is more screwed up here than a Christian college's honor code.


Considering the high-profile rape cases that have been in the news lately, police departments seems to have a very "meh" attitude to rape reports, even in very "obvious" cases such as this.  It's farking shocking and a damn shame.

Stubenville - a good chunk of the town and a CNN report focused on how the rapists football careers where ruined. How about the victims lives?

Maryville - despite video evidence, the case never gets to trial (one of the accused has a US senator relative) and one of the victims houses is burned down.

New Zealand Roast Busters - There was a teen rape gang that lured underaged girls (like 13 years old) and piled them with alcohol and drugs, raped them, and laughed about it on Facebook. They where reported to the police multiple times who claimed they couldn't do anything, despite the fact that having sex with someone under 16 is considered Statutory Rape under NZ law.

Detroit - Thousands of rape kits went un-tested due to "lack of funds" for years. A campaign finally secured funding and even though they only tested a few hundred they discovered 15 serial rapists, one of whom became a sexual serial killer and was arrested after killing 5 women. If they had tested the rape kits then they could have caught him before they started killing.

Moreover, I wouldn't be surprised if the family declined to prosecute to "avoid the stress of a trial" AKA "let's pretend this didn't happen and quietly go away".

People with this neo-con evangelical beliefs probably believe that it's always the her fault anyway for "tempting him" because men can't control themselves at all so women have to wear burkas to protect themselves.
 
2014-03-12 12:19:15 PM  

MagicMissile: Weaver95: AirForceVet: Sounds like a great reason not to send your kids to THAT school.

Cue "You're gonna get raped" meme.

as bad as this is, were it only confined to the elite few christians all locked in the same campus and raping one another in between classes, that would be bad enough.  ok, horrific enough really.  But the crazy christian elite who run these schools train to bring their toxic culture out of their cozy little rape boxes and inflict those ideals on the rest of the country.  that's the end goal - a 'christian nation'.  in the interim, they'll settle for taking over local and state governments and putting their twisted ideology into practice.  these people scare me.  not just because they see women as disposable sex objects but because they honestly believe that they can do no wrong.  they see themselves as the chosen of their lord god almighty - by definition they CANNOT be in the wrong.  that sort of world view is very very dangerous.

It's not Christians doing these things ... It's sick and evil ..people..... If you can call them that..... Using Christianity as a smoke screen to commit their crimes . Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims. Laws need to be put in place to better detect and track these types of people, and like I mentioned it should become a felony with very strict penalties for abusing religious names and venues in this manner including incarceration and deportation as well as permanent exile.


I hear they're not even true Scotsmen!
 
2014-03-12 12:25:14 PM  
aedude01:
You know how I know you've never been to Pensacola?

I went to BJU for a year so I have some knowledge about the environments these fudie institutions breed.  If Pensacola is anything like Greenville, SC, many of the local cops went to the school in question.  So the rape kits were conveniently "misplaced".   The cops in Greenville used to call in students breaking student rules to the Dean all the time (rules mind you, not l ...


THIS^ doesn't just happen at christian schools either. Secular/State run schools in smaller towns have this problem, too. Luckily, the townies don't like the college in my town so much, so if a newspaper catches hold of a story like this, those rape kits are found in short order.
 
2014-03-12 12:29:20 PM  

bdub77: They just earned their accreditation in 2013. I think we can forcibly take that from them.

You know what? On second thought...

[www.zerosun.com image 490x290]


I agree.

/We have to make sure they still work.
 
2014-03-12 12:32:02 PM  

Ant: rzrwiresunrise: Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."

Why?


Cuz there's no such thing. It's this amorphous term thrown around to make it seem like there's some grand conspiracy to rape women, and the only distinctive feature one has to have to be a member of this "culture" is a penis. It's an insinuated accusation. There's no secret handshake, no peculiar argot, no hidden sign or wink that allows rapists to identify each other and exchange traditions and form a "culture" around rape. "Patriarchy" is almost as bad, but that at least has some foundation to it. If one wants to talk about female powerlessness in a male-dominated society, one in which rape is swept under the rug, please, have a rational discussion. Throw around the "rape culture" epithet, and all that's accomplished is man-shaming.

And cue the projection/something-to-hide/MRA responses in 3... 2... 1...
 
2014-03-12 12:36:33 PM  

rzrwiresunrise: Ant: rzrwiresunrise: Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."

Why?

Cuz there's no such thing. It's this amorphous term thrown around to make it seem like there's some grand conspiracy to rape women, and the only distinctive feature one has to have to be a member of this "culture" is a penis. It's an insinuated accusation. There's no secret handshake, no peculiar argot, no hidden sign or wink that allows rapists to identify each other and exchange traditions and form a "culture" around rape. "Patriarchy" is almost as bad, but that at least has some foundation to it. If one wants to talk about female powerlessness in a male-dominated society, one in which rape is swept under the rug, please, have a rational discussion. Throw around the "rape culture" epithet, and all that's accomplished is man-shaming.

And cue the projection/something-to-hide/MRA responses in 3... 2... 1...


Um?
You're overgeneralizing the meaning of the term. No- it is inherent in our culture that any female should be on the constant lookout for her well-being against being raped, or she is considered complicit in being attacked.
It's a more specific term for "blaming the victim" that is pervasive in our society; "rape culture" identifies that this blaming the victim for being a victim, is more apparent in the cases involving rape victims, and how they are unable to report it without being judged for their actions simultaneously.
 
2014-03-12 12:39:13 PM  

formerfloozy: stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.

Yeah, uh, no. Murderers, rapists, and thieves can be Christian. Stop making excuses. If you identify as Christian, go to church, praise Jeebus and then rape hitchhikers, you are a christian rapist. Also, eat a dick.


Well, I'm not a Christian, so I guess I shouldn't speak for them...
 
2014-03-12 12:42:02 PM  

MagicMissile: Ok ... If all this is true then just know that this isn't a Christian anything .... Christianity teaches that everything described in this story from the brutal assaults, rapes, expelling the victims , calling them " dirty vessels " and so on are all very evil things to do . Christianity teaches love, compassion, forgiveness, and that we are all imperfect but that God has love for all of us. We need only admit that we are sinners and reject our sins as much as we can , and accept Jesus Christ as our savior.

What is described in this story, if it's true... It is an evil organization that is falsely calling itself Christian and getting away with it. There should be an investigation , arrests made and people jailed over this . That college should be shut down as well . It should be a felony to falsely claim you represent a religion for personal gain and or to hijack a religion by using its name and then committing your crimes.


They are evangelical neo-cons, their whole movement is to return America to either the 1950s or 1850s, depending on their particular movement.

Actually reading the bible is not a part of their "religion", being a cheerleader for Christ and pretending to be June Cleaver is all they need to do to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

I left the regular neo-con movement when I actually read the Bible and studied it, applied logic to a bunch of their tenants such as "We shall ban abortions AND birth control! Then block all funding for unplanned pregnancies! It's what Jesus would want!".
 
2014-03-12 12:42:33 PM  

stonicus: formerfloozy: stonicus: tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.

If you're a murderer, you're not a christian.  Hitler may have said he was, but he wasn't.
I can say I am a super hero if I want to, it doesn't make it true.

Yeah, uh, no. Murderers, rapists, and thieves can be Christian. Stop making excuses. If you identify as Christian, go to church, praise Jeebus and then rape hitchhikers, you are a christian rapist. Also, eat a dick.

Well, I'm not a Christian, so I guess I shouldn't speak for them...

img.fark.net
 
2014-03-12 12:43:34 PM  
THIS WHOLE THREAD:
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-12 12:44:24 PM  

Farxist Marxist: MagicMissile: deportation as well as permanent exile.

What makes you think you can foist your misfits on another country?


No.. its just that Religions have what we Christians call "Missionaries", people sent abroad to spread the religion.

Well.. there are rapists, child molesters and other evil people that will slip through the cracks and join religions because it gives them a place to hide and a place to find victims, it also gives them the ability to travel under protection...

So in the even that some of these people committing these crimes are on a Mission or something similar, they could be deported back to their original country and exiled from ever returning to the country they committed their crimes in.

It is a very real thing that people use Christianity as a place to hide and commit their crimes, or that people will join and do stuff like this just to give the religion a black eye.
 
2014-03-12 12:46:24 PM  

tlars699: rzrwiresunrise: Ant: rzrwiresunrise: Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."

Why?

Cuz there's no such thing. It's this amorphous term thrown around to make it seem like there's some grand conspiracy to rape women, and the only distinctive feature one has to have to be a member of this "culture" is a penis. It's an insinuated accusation. There's no secret handshake, no peculiar argot, no hidden sign or wink that allows rapists to identify each other and exchange traditions and form a "culture" around rape. "Patriarchy" is almost as bad, but that at least has some foundation to it. If one wants to talk about female powerlessness in a male-dominated society, one in which rape is swept under the rug, please, have a rational discussion. Throw around the "rape culture" epithet, and all that's accomplished is man-shaming.

And cue the projection/something-to-hide/MRA responses in 3... 2... 1...

Um?
You're overgeneralizing the meaning of the term. No- it is inherent in our culture that any female should be on the constant lookout for her well-being against being raped, or she is considered complicit in being attacked.
It's a more specific term for "blaming the victim" that is pervasive in our society; "rape culture" identifies that this blaming the victim for being a victim, is more apparent in the cases involving rape victims, and how they are unable to report it without being judged for their actions simultaneously.


I'd like to refer you to your post:

tlars699: THIS WHOLE THREAD:
[img.fark.net image 137x90]

 
2014-03-12 12:47:55 PM  

tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian...


Goebbels wrote that Hitler hated Christianity, and Goebbels actually hung out with the groupies, so I'm giving him the credibility on this one.
 
2014-03-12 12:48:04 PM  

JohnnyC: untaken_name: JohnnyC: So your plan is to pretend that Christians who do horrible things are actually atheists who infiltrate religious venues to hide and find victims? Then you have the audacity to insinuate that anyone who disagrees with your position is naive.

Not to derail your righteous rage, but I didn't read the post you're responding to in that light. More in the light that it is the sickness and twistedness inside the people that is making them act in a sick and twisted fashion. Not that it's some sort of fifth column organized effort to discredit a religion. But that some people are bad, and some of those bad people pretend to be things they aren't - Christians, educators, mentors, family friends, etc - and then use the trust gained by their position to take advantage of others. Hey, maybe I'm wrong and the OP really did mean that it was an organized infiltratory effort by atheists, but I'll just present the above as an alternative to that.

Perhaps if he hadn't said:

MagicMissile: Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims.

... I might be inclined to agree. But he did.

If a police officer does something horrible to someone else, do we suddenly say that he/she was never actually a police officer at all and was an anarchist hiding in the police force to look for victims? No... we say, "that police officer did something horrible". That person might get kicked off the police force for their actions, but he/she was still a member of the police.


By stating that some people might be "non-religious" comitting these crimes within other religions... I am simply stating that there are posers pretending to be Christians or Islamics or Buddhists or what have you.. stop taking everything so personally. I didn't come out and say "Those dirty atheists did it"

I am trying to shed some light that people will  use the names of Religions on Colleges for instance to get funding, to attract a certain type of person, for protections under the 1st Amendment.. for extra protections from the Police... and there are people that will join or create these organizations because it provides cover so they can commit their crimes as well.

Stop getting so worked up and defensive over everything I say.. and stop acting like everyone is out to persecute you.
 
2014-03-12 12:48:40 PM  
Spent one semester at a "Christian" college -- there were three of these incidents. I transferred to a real university.
 
Ant
2014-03-12 12:57:29 PM  

rzrwiresunrise: Cuz there's no such thing.


There is though. Call it something else if you like. It's kind of an offshoot of just world theory: If something bad happened to you, you probably deserved it in some way. Why is it so common to ask questions like "what was she wearing?" or "was she drinking?" or "why was she alone with that guy?"
 
2014-03-12 12:59:22 PM  
If a group of pedophiles started a school for boys age 3-12 and named it "Athiest school for Boys" and then received funding from atheists, political and police protections , and then started child molesting and so on... does that mean that every Atheist is a child molester and a pedophile?

Or does it meant that a group of sick people started that thing up for money and victims? I am sorry but people are sick and evil and these twisted farkers will do anything to get their rocks off.


Some of you are going to go out and bash Christianity for half of your day and then spend the other half preaching about human rights and freedoms, gay rights, and claim you are against prejudice and stereotyping and so on.


All I am saying is that the Christian religion teaches that everything this school did is evil and wrong.... if you are an axe murderer that attends church every day.... I am sorry but you are not a Christian Axe Murderer... you are still just an axe murder that goes to Church every day.
 
Ant
2014-03-12 01:13:29 PM  

MagicMissile: If a group of pedophiles started a school for boys age 3-12 and named it "Athiest school for Boys" and then received funding from atheists, political and police protections , and then started child molesting and so on... does that mean that every Atheist is a child molester and a pedophile?

Or does it meant that a group of sick people started that thing up for money and victims? I am sorry but people are sick and evil and these twisted farkers will do anything to get their rocks off.


Some of you are going to go out and bash Christianity for half of your day and then spend the other half preaching about human rights and freedoms, gay rights, and claim you are against prejudice and stereotyping and so on.


All I am saying is that the Christian religion teaches that everything this school did is evil and wrong.... if you are an axe murderer that attends church every day.... I am sorry but you are not a Christian Axe Murderer... you are still just an axe murder that goes to Church every day.


Nobody is saying "All Christians are XYZ". We're saying that, like it or not, these are Christians. If a group of atheist pedos started a school for young boys, we'd still acknowledge that they were atheists. They'd just be atheists who happen to also be pedophile jerks.

/atheist
//knows that assholes can be atheists too
///I'm looking at you, Ayn Rand
 
2014-03-12 01:23:27 PM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: Fury Pilot: Found at least one on the first page :  http://www.vice.com/read/sexual-abuse-has-become-a-huge-problem-for-a m ericas-bible-colleges


Vice.com.  Interesting.  Google might be taking you to specific, um, special interest, sites based on your search history.  I just repeated the search and see nothing but general admissions information and such in either "News" or "Web" tabs.  Anyway.... this post again says nothing about a police report or a crime.  It is a third hand account that an accusation was made, no one was expelled (or at least the article doesn't say so), and none of it is verified by the college or anyone else.


For what it's worth, Vice has done some of the best investigative journalism over the last year in the Ukraine, Russia, and the ME. Frankly, when they want to cover a topic, they do a better job than CNN,  CBS, ABC, MSNBC, FNC, etc..

That said, they'll follow up a hard hitting story about violence and neo-nazi groups on the rise in Russia with a story like :  http://www.vice.com/read/sugarless-gummy-bears-are-not-safe-for-human s
 
2014-03-12 01:25:01 PM  

Bullseyed: Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


How many times have you raped someone and do think you'll rape again?
 
2014-03-12 01:26:21 PM  

tlars699: Not to Godwin the "They're not really Xtians!!" group or anything, but Hitler was a Christian, and used Christianity as a front for all of his evil malicious deeds. That's part of the reason all of the Christians in Germany were so willing to follow him.


There is enough to criticize Christians about without having to make shiat up.
 
2014-03-12 01:27:10 PM  

Latinwolf: I see that Fark's Conservative dumbass racial apologist has entered the thread.


There's only one?
 
2014-03-12 01:35:41 PM  
I am a Christian. I don't tolerate Christians who commit crimes against women, or use drugs, or cheat on their taxes.... fill in the blank.

What I don't see is a bunch of Christians coming into this thread and defending the rapist or the school. I think if you took a poll most Christians would say "let the rapist rot in prison." That's how I feel, if that were my daughter I would be on the warpath, and I am outraged at this behavior even though this woman is not my daughter.

Weirdly every time a muslim commits an atrocity I do see CAIR release statements defending the perpetrator. Whenever a black athelete commits a crime Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton defend the perpetrator. Whenever a quaterback commits a crime, members of the NFL go on Sports Center and defend the perpetrator. Why? It is human nature to want our institutions to not be corrupt, to want to believe the best in the organizations that we spend our time and capitol on.

I am a member of the military, that freely admits it has a "rape culture" and has spent close to $$1Billion dollars on education programs meant to combat it. I refuse to defend our leadership that has failed in this regard. The military has a rape culture because it has failed to hold rapists accountable.

If Pensacola Chistian fails to hold its students and faculty accountable, they are the worst kind of Christians. Jesus said it would be better if a "mill-stone were hung around their necks and they were thrown into the ocean," then they face the wrath of the last days. All of this is an "if" because we can't substantiate it one way or the other. The blog references nothing and points us back to nothing to base an assertion on. That doesn't mean that this doesn't happen every day in Churches across America. Also happens in schools, in the military and in the corporate culture.

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J
 
2014-03-12 01:38:55 PM  
Who would have guessed a tight assed sudo religious school would be more interested in protecting its image than its students.
 
2014-03-12 01:39:43 PM  

scotchlandia: I am a Christian. I don't tolerate Christians who commit crimes against women, or use drugs, or cheat on their taxes.... fill in the blank.

What I don't see is a bunch of Christians coming into this thread and defending the rapist or the school. I think if you took a poll most Christians would say "let the rapist rot in prison." That's how I feel, if that were my daughter I would be on the warpath, and I am outraged at this behavior even though this woman is not my daughter.

Weirdly every time a muslim commits an atrocity I do see CAIR release statements defending the perpetrator. Whenever a black athelete commits a crime Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton defend the perpetrator. Whenever a quaterback commits a crime, members of the NFL go on Sports Center and defend the perpetrator. Why? It is human nature to want our institutions to not be corrupt, to want to believe the best in the organizations that we spend our time and capitol on.

I am a member of the military, that freely admits it has a "rape culture" and has spent close to $$1Billion dollars on education programs meant to combat it. I refuse to defend our leadership that has failed in this regard. The military has a rape culture because it has failed to hold rapists accountable.

If Pensacola Chistian fails to hold its students and faculty accountable, they are the worst kind of Christians. Jesus said it would be better if a "mill-stone were hung around their necks and they were thrown into the ocean," then they face the wrath of the last days. All of this is an "if" because we can't substantiate it one way or the other. The blog references nothing and points us back to nothing to base an assertion on. That doesn't mean that this doesn't happen every day in Churches across America. Also happens in schools, in the military and in the corporate culture.

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J


Translation: "I'm a bigot, and I personally ignore all the plentiful evidence of people defending this, chastising Muslims, and I really can't even imagine that my religion played an active roll in this happening, even though plentiful elements of my religion actively endorse rapists over the raped"

You are one of the people defending this.
 
2014-03-12 01:48:23 PM  

cervier: So in a nutshell, blame the victim...


Try thinking with something larger than a nutshell and perhaps you'll better comprehend the topic.
 
2014-03-12 01:55:00 PM  

The hopeless imp: Lady Indica: I think there's certainly more to the story...but it doesn't matter in the context of what the article asserts. She was rescued by campus police (so really no question here about the rape, even if there may be a question *who* did it), taken to a hospital, etc and upon returning to school the next day was expelled for being a fornicator.

Immediately after being brutally raped, bones broken, she was expelled for being a fornicator.

And then there's the guy. How do you go from wanting to be an actor to getting gang-raped prison-style by your roommates?


Pretty easily, I imagine, if you get the right dorm.
 
2014-03-12 02:05:08 PM  

Ant: MagicMissile: If a group of pedophiles started a school for boys age 3-12 and named it "Athiest school for Boys" and then received funding from atheists, political and police protections , and then started child molesting and so on... does that mean that every Atheist is a child molester and a pedophile?

Or does it meant that a group of sick people started that thing up for money and victims? I am sorry but people are sick and evil and these twisted farkers will do anything to get their rocks off.


Some of you are going to go out and bash Christianity for half of your day and then spend the other half preaching about human rights and freedoms, gay rights, and claim you are against prejudice and stereotyping and so on.


All I am saying is that the Christian religion teaches that everything this school did is evil and wrong.... if you are an axe murderer that attends church every day.... I am sorry but you are not a Christian Axe Murderer... you are still just an axe murder that goes to Church every day.

Nobody is saying "All Christians are XYZ". We're saying that, like it or not, these are Christians. If a group of atheist pedos started a school for young boys, we'd still acknowledge that they were atheists. They'd just be atheists who happen to also be pedophile jerks.

/atheist
//knows that assholes can be atheists too
///I'm looking at you, Ayn Rand


I'll bet that the guy you're replying to would have no problem referring to that pedo as an "atheist pedo" instead of just calling him a pedo who associates with atheists.
 
2014-03-12 02:08:12 PM  

ikanreed: scotchlandia: I

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J

Translation: "I'm a bigot, and I personally ignore ...


Give me one quote where a Christian is defending the rapist.
 
2014-03-12 02:10:16 PM  

skozlaw: cervier: So in a nutshell, blame the victim...

Try thinking with something larger than a nutshell and perhaps you'll better comprehend the topic.



She got expelled from a college BECAUSE she was raped and, according to you, it's somewhat HER fault...  Christian college or not it's REALLY stupid to blame her for being expelled as a result of this pesky rape incident...
 
2014-03-12 02:20:12 PM  

nmrsnr: A campus security guard discovered her, still restrained with the cord and tape, and took her to the campus clinic to file a report.


1) If it was a campus security guard, the school might have had words with him about what not to say to the real police.

2) If she filed a report and the campus clinic, it probably never reached any real police outside the campus.

3) And finally, even if she did go to the real police...they don't always do so good a job prosecuting rape cases either, especially ones that happen on a campus.
 
2014-03-12 02:23:25 PM  

aedude01: I went to BJU for a year...


Every time I see the initials for that university, and then realize what university it is, I am reminded of the definition of disappointment.
 
2014-03-12 02:28:19 PM  

hestheone: FTA:  "One night in May, however, she was grabbed, dragged into a construction area, beaten, restrained with bungee cord and duct tape, and then raped. As he was leaving her there, she recognized him as her boyfriend "

Yeah, sounds legit.


I imagine that, for this account to make sense, the attacker must have worn a mask or done something to disguise his identity, which later failed somehow.  For example, perhaps he wore a mask which he took off as he was leaving because he thought she was unconscious.  Or possibly he had been silent until, as he was leaving, he spoke, and she recognized his voice.

But as others have said, yes, there are some pertinent facts missing.
 
2014-03-12 02:34:18 PM  

doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap.


No, it isn't.  Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.
 
2014-03-12 02:56:42 PM  

Bullseyed: Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.


scotchlandia: ikanreed: scotchlandia: I

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J

Translation: "I'm a bigot, and I personally ignore ...

Give me one quote where a Christian is defending the rapist.


Lookey there.
 
2014-03-12 02:57:31 PM  

blindio: aedude01: I went to BJU for a year...

Every time I see the initials for that university, and then realize what university it is, I am reminded of the definition of disappointment.


I have an amazing t-shirt from that school that is the source of some amazing ironic grins among my friends.
 
2014-03-12 03:01:37 PM  

ikanreed: Bullseyed: Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.

scotchlandia: ikanreed: scotchlandia: I

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J

Translation: "I'm a bigot, and I personally ignore ...

Give me one quote where a Christian is defending the rapist.

Lookey there.


In fairness, he may be an MRA, not a Christian.
 
2014-03-12 03:04:09 PM  

ciberido: doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap.

No, it isn't.  Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.


Idiots really believe everything is subjective, even math itself. A friend of mine at Fairfield was taking a class called "Philosophy of Mathematics"... when she described the class, I damn near raged hard enough to have an aneurysm pop.
 
2014-03-12 03:12:52 PM  

grumpfuff: In fairness, he may be an MRA, not a Christian.


I know, but what may be should be enough to shut up an idiot with their false sense of certainty about how pure and unharmful Christians are.  They don't know either, and they still made their post.
 
2014-03-12 03:26:40 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: In fairness, he may be an MRA, not a Christian.

I know, but what may be should be enough to shut up an idiot with their false sense of certainty about how pure and unharmful Christians are.  They don't know either, and they still made their post.


I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.
 
2014-03-12 03:36:37 PM  

stuffy: Who would have guessed a tight assed sudo religious school would be more interested in protecting its image than its students.


There's nothing "pseudo" about the religious part.  Quite a lot of Bible- and Qur'an-thumpers actually believe that Dirty Jezebels deserve to be raped.

"Tight-assed religious pseudo-school" works just fine.
 
2014-03-12 03:40:59 PM  

ciberido: doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap.

No, it isn't.  Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.


As a mathematically educated person, I would take a middle ground between those two positions. It isn't (entirely) made up crap, but neither is math some immutable property of the universe. First of all there is no singular "math", humans have invented many math systems, some of which look at things in different ways. For example in Galois field math, basic operations such as addition and subtraction are defined differently than you are used to - simply because it is useful to do so in some situations.

Maths are systems of formal logic. Which means they are models by which we represent and work on concepts. Godel proved that our math systems (formal logic systems) cannot be both complete and internally consistent. We get to choose one, (or neither).

It may also be telling about the general consensus on this subject, that most (all) mathematicians refer to Newton as having "developed" calculus, not "discovered" it. And likewise for for all other fields of math. Galois developed new fields of math, he didn't "discover" them as if they were a pre-existing entity. We (humans) define the rules as we find useful to model certain concepts.
 
2014-03-12 03:41:45 PM  

grumpfuff: I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.


This was the very attitude that annoying me. "The bad people, they're not Christians, not real ones like I know, so we can ignore this".  I wasn't annoyed at Christians, I was annoyed at stupid deflections.
 
2014-03-12 03:44:50 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.

This was the very attitude that annoying me. "The bad people, they're not Christians, not real ones like I know, so we can ignore this".  I wasn't annoyed at Christians, I was annoyed at stupid deflections.


Forgive me for not lumping everyone together, and acknowledging that, like with any label, there are good ones and bad ones.

Though I admittedly did phrase is poorly, as I consider "Paulist" as a subset of "Christian"
 
2014-03-12 03:47:20 PM  

scotchlandia: I am a Christian. I don't tolerate Christians who commit crimes against women, or use drugs, or cheat on their taxes.... fill in the blank.

What I don't see is a bunch of Christians coming into this thread and defending the rapist or the school. I think if you took a poll most Christians would say "let the rapist rot in prison." That's how I feel, if that were my daughter I would be on the warpath, and I am outraged at this behavior even though this woman is not my daughter.

Weirdly every time a muslim commits an atrocity I do see CAIR release statements defending the perpetrator. Whenever a black athelete commits a crime Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton defend the perpetrator. Whenever a quaterback commits a crime, members of the NFL go on Sports Center and defend the perpetrator. Why? It is human nature to want our institutions to not be corrupt, to want to believe the best in the organizations that we spend our time and capitol on.

I am a member of the military, that freely admits it has a "rape culture" and has spent close to $$1Billion dollars on education programs meant to combat it. I refuse to defend our leadership that has failed in this regard. The military has a rape culture because it has failed to hold rapists accountable.

If Pensacola Chistian fails to hold its students and faculty accountable, they are the worst kind of Christians. Jesus said it would be better if a "mill-stone were hung around their necks and they were thrown into the ocean," then they face the wrath of the last days. All of this is an "if" because we can't substantiate it one way or the other. The blog references nothing and points us back to nothing to base an assertion on. That doesn't mean that this doesn't happen every day in Churches across America. Also happens in schools, in the military and in the corporate culture.

The real question is when are organizations (of any type) going to stop tolerating this?

-J


No, Christians defend Christian corruption extremely diligently.

Also Islam is basically a slightly nicer version of Christianity.
 
2014-03-12 03:47:57 PM  

grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.

This was the very attitude that annoying me. "The bad people, they're not Christians, not real ones like I know, so we can ignore this".  I wasn't annoyed at Christians, I was annoyed at stupid deflections.

Forgive me for not lumping everyone together, and acknowledging that, like with any label, there are good ones and bad ones.

Though I admittedly did phrase is poorly, as I consider "Paulist" as a subset of "Christian"


That's exactly what you did do though.  You made this assertion that there was this clear divide into groups of good people and bad people, based on some arbitrary religious difference.  The only fundamental relationship Christianity has with rape is the rules outlined in the bible, and they aren't good ones.
 
2014-03-12 03:51:08 PM  

grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.

This was the very attitude that annoying me. "The bad people, they're not Christians, not real ones like I know, so we can ignore this".  I wasn't annoyed at Christians, I was annoyed at stupid deflections.

Forgive me for not lumping everyone together, and acknowledging that, like with any label, there are good ones and bad ones.

Though I admittedly did phrase is poorly, as I consider "Paulist" as a subset of "Christian"

What's your religion?
I was walking across a bridge one day, and I saw a man standing on the edge, about to jump off. I immediately ran over and said "Stop! Don't do it!"

"Why shouldn't I?" he said.

I said, "Well, there's so much to live for!"

"Like what?"

"Well ... are you religious or atheist?"

"Religious."

"Me too! Are you Christian or Jewish?"

"Christian."

"Me too! Are you Catholic or Protestant?"

"Protestant."

"Me too! Are you Episcopalian or Baptist?"

"Baptist."

"Wow! Me too! Are you Baptist Church of God or Baptist Church of the Lord?"

"Baptist Church of God."

"Me too! Are you Original Baptist Church of God, or are you Reformed Baptist Church of God?"

"Reformed Baptist Church of God."

"Me too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1915?"

"Reformed Baptist Church of God, reformation of 1915!"

To which I said, "Die, heretic scum!" and pushed him off.
 
2014-03-12 03:52:14 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: I don't have the innate hostility towards Christians that you seem to. But then again, I'm in libby lib NJ, so most of the ones I know are Christians, not Paulists.

This was the very attitude that annoying me. "The bad people, they're not Christians, not real ones like I know, so we can ignore this".  I wasn't annoyed at Christians, I was annoyed at stupid deflections.

Forgive me for not lumping everyone together, and acknowledging that, like with any label, there are good ones and bad ones.

Though I admittedly did phrase is poorly, as I consider "Paulist" as a subset of "Christian"

That's exactly what you did do though.  You made this assertion that there was this clear divide into groups of good people and bad people, based on some arbitrary religious difference.  The only fundamental relationship Christianity has with rape is the rules outlined in the bible, and they aren't good ones.


So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?
 
2014-03-12 03:53:56 PM  

Rozotorical: No, Christians defend Christian corruption extremely diligently.

Also Islam is basically a slightly nicer version of Christianity.


Eh... in words, maybe?  The Koran is pretty flowery in a new testamenty kinda way.  In pragmatic reality, the same fundamental hang-ups(you know, non-questioning of answers, strict gender roles, people doing horrible things thinking themselves moral and good) cause even worse problems in the real world.
 
2014-03-12 03:58:26 PM  

ikanreed: Rozotorical: No, Christians defend Christian corruption extremely diligently.

Also Islam is basically a slightly nicer version of Christianity.

Eh... in words, maybe?  The Koran is pretty flowery in a new testamenty kinda way.  In pragmatic reality, the same fundamental hang-ups(you know, non-questioning of answers, strict gender roles, people doing horrible things thinking themselves moral and good) cause even worse problems in the real world.


Oh mai, I didn't mean to say it was a moral way to live your life.  Just a slightly nicer creed then Christianity.
 
2014-03-12 03:58:30 PM  

grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?


No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.
 
2014-03-12 04:03:27 PM  

MagicMissile: If a group of pedophiles started a school for boys age 3-12 and named it "Athiest school for Boys" and then received funding from atheists, political and police protections , and then started child molesting and so on... does that mean that every Atheist is a child molester and a pedophile?

Or does it meant that a group of sick people started that thing up for money and victims? I am sorry but people are sick and evil and these twisted farkers will do anything to get their rocks off.


Some of you are going to go out and bash Christianity for half of your day and then spend the other half preaching about human rights and freedoms, gay rights, and claim you are against prejudice and stereotyping and so on.


All I am saying is that the Christian religion teaches that everything this school did is evil and wrong.... if you are an axe murderer that attends church every day.... I am sorry but you are not a Christian Axe Murderer... you are still just an axe murder that goes to Church every day.

They are a Christian axe murderer because they self-identify most importantly as a Christian to begin with. They are a Christian axe murderer when they use their faith to defend their actions or persecute their victims. Christianity is a hot mess.

These fundies can't even get it right. Jesus and his teachings supercede the Old Testament, essentially making the the OT as history book as it relates to the Israelites plights. They love to hit the Gospels when they talk about love and forgiveness as Jesus taught.

But as soon as you need some fire and brimstone, weeping and gnashing of teeth and judgments against the other; they trot out the OT or the ridiculous letters written in the NT to the new churches by the surviving apostles after Christ died.

 
2014-03-12 04:06:52 PM  

MagicMissile: Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims.


Everyone sins, including Christians. Just because a Christian sins it doesn't mean he's a "fake" Christian. If he believes in Jesus and asks forgiveness, no amount of heinous crimes against humanity can take his personal relationship with Jesus away. There are monsters in your midst. Claiming they don't 'count' as a part of your group is a cop-out. I suggest you take action in stopping their behaviour because they just keep making your religion look worse and worse.
 
2014-03-12 04:07:47 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?

No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.


There are plenty of Christians I don't approve of, Paulists are only one sub set. Prosperity Gospel types are another one, for example. "Christians" isn't a designation for the ones I like, it's a designation for people who believe in the divinity of Jesus. Like I said, I phrased that part poorly.

And it is hard for me to judge them all based on the Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth, just like it is hard for me to judge them all based on churches because different sects have different churches and hierarchies. Yes, the OT has some nasty things to say about rape, but not all Christians think the OT is right(and I mean the ones who toss out the whole OT, not just pick and chose the parts they like).

The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.
 
2014-03-12 04:15:31 PM  

grumpfuff: believe in the divinity of Jesus



grumpfuff: Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth,


It's too late not to turn this into a religious debate, but tell me what I'm missing here:

"We believe a man called Jesus is literally god, because the bible says so, but the bible isn't literally true."  Isn't that an intuitively nutso position?  I mean once you dismiss the bible as absolute truth, there's nothing substantiating Jesus as God at all.  I mean, "I personally believe one of the most unsubstantiated claims of the bible, while thinking other parts of it silly".


I get that there are people who put no thought into it, but I'm trying to not presume that's what's going on with these people.  Why would this seem like a logical improvement on the position?
 
2014-03-12 04:18:16 PM  

grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?

No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.

There are plenty of Christians I don't approve of, Paulists are only one sub set. Prosperity Gospel types are another one, for example. "Christians" isn't a designation for the ones I like, it's a designation for people who believe in the divinity of Jesus. Like I said, I phrased that part poorly.

And it is hard for me to judge them all based on the Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth, just like it is hard for me to judge them all based on churches because different sects have different churches and hierarchies. Yes, the OT has some nasty things to say about rape, but not all Christians think the OT is right(and I mean the ones who toss out the whole OT, not just pick and chose the parts they like).

The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.


The irony... it burns!
 
2014-03-12 04:18:54 PM  

ikanreed: Why would this seem like a logical improvement on the position?


If someone is a decent human being who doesn't try to force their beliefs on other people, I really don't see why it matters if they believe in a magic sky fairy.
 
2014-03-12 04:19:22 PM  

firefly212: ciberido: doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap.

No, it isn't.  Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.

Idiots really believe everything is subjective, even math itself. A friend of mine at Fairfield was taking a class called "Philosophy of Mathematics"... when she described the class, I damn near raged hard enough to have an aneurysm pop.


See my previous -p-o-s-t. Things like that should not drive you into a rage. And not everything is black and white definable in absolute terms. Not formal logic, and not even reality itself, as we are discovering more and more. Get over the idea that you know everything, or even that everything is knowable. It's looking more and more like not everything is knowable (at least not all at once in one time and space, for example, by a human). Both our limited systems of formal logic and physics agree on that. (Relax a bit, and go apologize to your friend.)

You should also get over the idea that anyone who expresses an idea you don't like is an idiot.
 
2014-03-12 04:22:14 PM  

stonicus: grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?

No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.

There are plenty of Christians I don't approve of, Paulists are only one sub set. Prosperity Gospel types are another one, for example. "Christians" isn't a designation for the ones I like, it's a designation for people who believe in the divinity of Jesus. Like I said, I phrased that part poorly.

And it is hard for me to judge them all based on the Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth, just like it is hard for me to judge them all based on churches because different sects have different churches and hierarchies. Yes, the OT has some nasty things to say about rape, but not all Christians think the OT is right(and I mean the ones who toss out the whole OT, not just pick and chose the parts they like).

The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.

The irony... it burns!


You may be shocked to learn this, but context matters.

Judging them for not holding to beliefs they claim to hold =/= judging them for the content of their book
 
2014-03-12 04:24:19 PM  

grumpfuff: stonicus: grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?

No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.

There are plenty of Christians I don't approve of, Paulists are only one sub set. Prosperity Gospel types are another one, for example. "Christians" isn't a designation for the ones I like, it's a designation for people who believe in the divinity of Jesus. Like I said, I phrased that part poorly.

And it is hard for me to judge them all based on the Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth, just like it is hard for me to judge them all based on churches because different sects have different churches and hierarchies. Yes, the OT has some nasty things to say about rape, but not all Christians think the OT is right(and I mean the ones who toss out the whole OT, not just pick and chose the parts they like).

The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.

The irony... it burns!

You may be shocked to learn this, but context matters.

Judging them for not holding to beliefs they claim to hold =/= judging them for the content of their book


But judging = judging... isn't that like a bad thing to do?  It's hard to tell... the rules are so ambiguous and wishy-washy...
 
2014-03-12 04:25:10 PM  

grumpfuff: If someone is a decent human being who doesn't try to force their beliefs on other people, I really don't see why it matters if they believe in a magic sky fairy.


It doesn't.  That's not the case I'm making at all.  I can judge the book as a negative thing, and be concerned about institutions surrounding it, without judging individuals.
 
2014-03-12 04:27:19 PM  

stonicus: grumpfuff: stonicus: grumpfuff: ikanreed: grumpfuff: So by acknowledging that not all Christians are pro-rape, and not all of them give two shiats what the OT says, I'm lumping them all together?

No, you're lumping two imagined types of people into groups all together, either "Christians" who are Christians you approve of, and "Paulists" who are Christians you don't.  I don't pretend there's such a thing as a Christian group that has any meaning as to judging people, all I can do is criticize the defining elements of Christianity(Monotheism, the bible and its content, and churches) as having an effect(that I perceive as negative, especially with regard to rape) on attitudes.  Those effects aren't consequentialist in nature, but they do exist.

There are plenty of Christians I don't approve of, Paulists are only one sub set. Prosperity Gospel types are another one, for example. "Christians" isn't a designation for the ones I like, it's a designation for people who believe in the divinity of Jesus. Like I said, I phrased that part poorly.

And it is hard for me to judge them all based on the Bible when not all of them hold it for the literal truth, just like it is hard for me to judge them all based on churches because different sects have different churches and hierarchies. Yes, the OT has some nasty things to say about rape, but not all Christians think the OT is right(and I mean the ones who toss out the whole OT, not just pick and chose the parts they like).

The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.

The irony... it burns!

You may be shocked to learn this, but context matters.

Judging them for not holding to beliefs they claim to hold =/= judging them for the content of their book

But judging = judging... isn't that like a bad thing to do?  It's hard to tell... the rules are so ambiguous and wishy-washy...


Being as I'm not a Christian, why should I care what Christianity has to say about judging?
 
2014-03-12 04:30:23 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: If someone is a decent human being who doesn't try to force their beliefs on other people, I really don't see why it matters if they believe in a magic sky fairy.

It doesn't.  That's not the case I'm making at all.  I can judge the book as a negative thing, and be concerned about institutions surrounding it, without judging individuals.


Some groups try to distance themselves as far as possible from the nasty elements of the Bible, sometimes even saying they are wrong.

I fail to see how you can hold all of Christians to the same standard with the Bible, when not all Christians view the Bible the same way. If they all said "The Bible is absolutely the literal word of God!" sure you could hold that stance. But they don't.

 In my eyes, you're doing the same thing as the "Dawkins' book is the Atheist Bible and therefore all atheists are pricks!" that religious trolls do.
 
2014-03-12 04:31:22 PM  

grumpfuff: Being as I'm not a Christian, why should I care what Christianity has ...


It appears I was... *clears throat*  wrong on the internet...  *DOH*

Carry on then... =)
 
2014-03-12 04:37:12 PM  

stonicus: grumpfuff: Being as I'm not a Christian, why should I care what Christianity has ...

It appears I was... *clears throat*  wrong on the internet...  *DOH*

Carry on then... =)


It's alright.  I once got called a theocrat for saying Dawkins is a whiny, arrogant, piece of shiat who fails to grasp Philosophy 101, so this was hardly a big deal.
 
2014-03-12 04:43:07 PM  

grumpfuff: I fail to see how you can hold all of Christians to the same standard with the Bible


Because that's literally the only source of anything even remotely relevant to the idea that Jesus was a person who said things.  This is important.  "I believe in the divinity of this person I literally know nothing about other than that"?

You can't actually take the bible out of Christianity, because that's nonsense.  I mean... what?  What point are you trying to make?
 
2014-03-12 04:46:47 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: I fail to see how you can hold all of Christians to the same standard with the Bible

Because that's literally the only source of anything even remotely relevant to the idea that Jesus was a person who said things.  This is important.  "I believe in the divinity of this person I literally know nothing about other than that"?

You can't actually take the bible out of Christianity, because that's nonsense.  I mean... what?  What point are you trying to make?


That all Christians do not view the Bible in the same way?

I'm going to take a guess that you are an atheist. Do you agree with every single thing all the atheists have said? Since Stalin was an atheist, should I assume you support genocide? No, of course not. That's retarded.
 
2014-03-12 05:01:15 PM  

grumpfuff: That all Christians do not view the Bible in the same way?


I'm trying to understand here.  What "approach" or "view" or whatever, gets you to the point where "X human is GOD" is literally true, but "god said victims should marry their rapists" isn't.  They both have the same character.  I mean, separating the new testament into magically true and the old into not works, but why would that be reasonable.  It's not a new/old covenant thing, since that presumes both books are totally legit.  I don't follow the reasoning at all.
 
2014-03-12 05:04:20 PM  

grumpfuff: The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.

O

.o
Yeah, I know ,,.

/Just don't try to explain the Mystery: It gives me a headache and heartburn, and it just doesn't work.
//Which is my reaction to most of Jewish mysticism, by the way.
 
2014-03-12 05:12:10 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: That all Christians do not view the Bible in the same way?

I'm trying to understand here.  What "approach" or "view" or whatever, gets you to the point where "X human is GOD" is literally true, but "god said victims should marry their rapists" isn't.  They both have the same character.  I mean, separating the new testament into magically true and the old into not works, but why would that be reasonable.  It's not a new/old covenant thing, since that presumes both books are totally legit.  I don't follow the reasoning at all.


I never said it makes logical sense or is reasonable or anything, I just said that's the way they view it. Did you know people also think Obama is an empty suit dictator atheist Muslim?

demaL-demaL-yeH: grumpfuff: The "defining elements" of Christianity are a) Monotheism and b) Jesus. Everything else varies from group to group.

O.o
Yeah, I know ,,.

/Just don't try to explain the Mystery: It gives me a headache and heartburn, and it just doesn't work.
//Which is my reaction to most of Jewish mysticism, by the way.


See above. :)
 
2014-03-12 05:23:37 PM  

cervier: She got expelled from a college BECAUSE she was raped


No, she was expelled because she was a "fornicator". She had sex with somebody who wasn't her husband which she agreed not to do which is a violation of the code she agreed to. Fornication technically (and, more importantly, as it's typically applied by religious lunatics) includes getting raped.

You're viewing this through the wrong lens. All the people involved are fundamentalist Christians who agreed to a fundamentalist code of ethics. What you and I think of that code is immaterial. She agreed, as a fundie, to be obligated to a fundie code that would be enforced by fundies. Same with the guy.

They violated an agreement they made. It doesn't matter that the agreement was obviously ridiculous, they still agreed to it. Don't sign stupid things. It's certainly unfortunate that this is how they had to learn that valuable life lesson, but it's still true.
 
2014-03-12 06:08:42 PM  
JohnnyC:Perhaps if he hadn't said:

MagicMissile: Unfortunately there are a lot of non religious evil twisted farkers out there that see Christianity and other religious venues as a place to hide and find victims.

... I might be inclined to agree. But he did.

If a police officer does something horrible to someone else, do we suddenly say that he/she was never actually a police officer at all and was an anarchist hiding in the police force to look for victims? No... we say, "that police officer did something horrible". That person might get kicked off the police force for their actions, but he/she was still a member of the police.


I tend to agree, and yet in an earlier thread (the one about Ky churches withholding funds over LBGTQ issues) I was challenged to declare that homophobic "Christians" really weren't Christians at all.

I really don't want to defend what  MagicMissile is saying.  I personally don't want to get into the whole "he's not a REAL Christian" thing --- especially since I get that accusation thrown at me from the conservative/evangelical/homophobic churches for being too liberal.  Let's just agree that, at least for purposes of discussion, anyone who calls themself a Christian IS a Christian, no matter how poor of a job they do at it.
 
2014-03-12 06:16:57 PM  

Clash City Farker: cretinbob: If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

A just and wise punishment.


Some aliens believe that (VERY NSFW).
 
2014-03-12 06:22:10 PM  
From the wiki:
Hitler viewed the church as an important politically conservative influence on society, and he adopted a strategic relationship with it "that suited his immediate political purposes". In public, Hitler often praised Christian heritage and German Christian culture, though professing a belief in an "Aryan" Jesus-one who fought against the Jews.Any pro-Christian public rhetoric was at variance with his personal beliefs, which described Christianity as "absurdity" and nonsense founded on lies.

Okay- my previous assessment was based on his speeches and how he would constantly say that they had to fight the Jews' oppression of the Aryan race for Jesus.
He did also make public appearances at churches from time to time to continue this charade.
But this is very interesting. :\
 
2014-03-12 06:55:03 PM  

skozlaw: Too f'ing bad. Maybe try hanging out with people who have a slightly more intelligent view of human sexuality than this guy:

img.fark.net


But she looks so happy!
 
2014-03-12 06:56:39 PM  

ciberido: skozlaw: Too f'ing bad. Maybe try hanging out with people who have a slightly more intelligent view of human sexuality than this guy:

[img.fark.net image 400x295]

But she looks so happy!


You're right, she looks like she wants to take a walk. No need for a cart at all; no sir. Move along.
 
2014-03-12 07:01:16 PM  

tlars699: From the wiki:
Hitler viewed the church as an important politically conservative influence on society, and he adopted a strategic relationship with it "that suited his immediate political purposes". In public, Hitler often praised Christian heritage and German Christian culture, though professing a belief in an "Aryan" Jesus-one who fought against the Jews.Any pro-Christian public rhetoric was at variance with his personal beliefs, which described Christianity as "absurdity" and nonsense founded on lies.

Okay- my previous assessment was based on his speeches and how he would constantly say that they had to fight the Jews' oppression of the Aryan race for Jesus.
He did also make public appearances at churches from time to time to continue this charade.
But this is very interesting. :\


See? :)

Hitler's personal religious belief is a matter that is debated by historians, and probably always will be.
 
2014-03-12 07:02:19 PM  

Rozotorical: Marcus Aurelius: Rozotorical: Marcus Aurelius: Bullseyed: he couldn't just say "oh yeah I was Catholic and went to Church" and get in to heaven

You are assuming that someone who has violated the first commandment their entire lives will get into heaven.  That's a bit of a stretch.

Why would they not get into Heaven? The bible states that with Jesus's blood your sins are washed clean.

We all get into heaven if we love the Jesus.

The first commandment clearly states that you are to have no other gods before God.  If you claim you have to go through Jesus to get to God, you're putting another God before the first One.  And don't tell me about the trinity.  That's the math Christians do to make themselves feel better about violating the first commandment.

On the plus side, all the descriptions of Heaven I've heard sound dreadful.  So going to hell won't be all that bad.  Especially since our bodies won't be there.

I always thought that commandment meant God had to be your First and that was why he couldn't just make Jesus out of dirt or bones and shiat.

He had to fark a virgin to make a new God. That is why you have to love that new God, then he will let you come into is cold cold city of metal.


^ This is EXACTLY what God was talking about.

/favorites Rozotorical in the good color
 
2014-03-12 07:17:57 PM  

grumpfuff: tlars699: From the wiki:
Hitler viewed the church as an important politically conservative influence on society, and he adopted a strategic relationship with it "that suited his immediate political purposes". In public, Hitler often praised Christian heritage and German Christian culture, though professing a belief in an "Aryan" Jesus-one who fought against the Jews.Any pro-Christian public rhetoric was at variance with his personal beliefs, which described Christianity as "absurdity" and nonsense founded on lies.

Okay- my previous assessment was based on his speeches and how he would constantly say that they had to fight the Jews' oppression of the Aryan race for Jesus.
He did also make public appearances at churches from time to time to continue this charade.
But this is very interesting. :\

See? :)

Hitler's personal religious belief is a matter that is debated by historians, and probably always will be.


Like all rules, he believed that religion was useful.  That much is indisputable.
 
2014-03-12 07:27:01 PM  

Egoy3k: Bullseyed: pkellmey: Uncool story - My sister went to Duke and knew 2 of the girls who were raped by important players on the basketball team during a winning season.

Which means they went to a party, got black out drunk and decided to have sex with the guys and changed their mind a day or two later when the guys told everyone in the school.

You might want to consider using your super-powered cognition for good instead of just playing on the internet all day.


He likes to do this kind of things in threads.  It's not the first time.
 
2014-03-12 07:27:09 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: grumpfuff: tlars699: From the wiki:
Hitler viewed the church as an important politically conservative influence on society, and he adopted a strategic relationship with it "that suited his immediate political purposes". In public, Hitler often praised Christian heritage and German Christian culture, though professing a belief in an "Aryan" Jesus-one who fought against the Jews.Any pro-Christian public rhetoric was at variance with his personal beliefs, which described Christianity as "absurdity" and nonsense founded on lies.

Okay- my previous assessment was based on his speeches and how he would constantly say that they had to fight the Jews' oppression of the Aryan race for Jesus.
He did also make public appearances at churches from time to time to continue this charade.
But this is very interesting. :\

See? :)

Hitler's personal religious belief is a matter that is debated by historians, and probably always will be.

Like all rules, he believed that religion was useful.  That much is indisputable.


So what this says is that for anyone making generalizations about anyone else in a particular group, there will be a clear example proving them wrong?

Ie. Hitler was not a Christian, as he did not attend church and wanted to use the church for his own gains, thus disproving the idea that there can't be any christian poser using the organization for their own purpose.

There would also be the example of a professed christian who does believe in Jeebus committing atrocities such as the pastor/school listed in this article.

So you have to treat each human on a case by case basis.
Huh.
 
2014-03-12 07:44:19 PM  

rzrwiresunrise: Ant: rzrwiresunrise: Oh, and fark that term "rape culture."

Why?

Cuz there's no such thing. It's this amorphous term thrown around to make it seem like there's some grand conspiracy to rape women,


No.
 
2014-03-12 07:47:17 PM  

tlars699: Hitler was not a Christian, as he did not attend church and wanted to use the church for his own gains, thus disproving the idea that there can't be any christian poser using the organization for their own purpose.


I agree in principle that some people may be lying when they say they are Christian but the above doesn't really tell me he definitively wasn't Christian. I think it all boils down to faith. Not going to church or manipulating church doesn't really say anything about his faith or lack thereof.

But even when someone is a total phony and lying through their teeth about their faith in order to commit evil, the ball is still in the 'real' Christians' court because they set up an infastructure wherein these things can happen and have allowed terrible things to happen on their watch.
 
2014-03-12 08:03:27 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Like all rules, he believed that religion was useful.  That much is indisputable.


I wouldn't debate that, but the people who run around saying "Hitler was a Christian/atheist/rightist/leftist/alien from alpha centauri" are usually more interested in saying "See! Hitler agreed with my opponent!"
 
2014-03-12 08:14:16 PM  

grumpfuff: I never said it makes logical sense or is reasonable or anything, I just said that's the way they view it. Did you know people also think Obama is an empty suit dictator atheist Muslim?


And those are attitudes we can be freely critical of because they make no sense.
 
2014-03-12 08:16:23 PM  

ikanreed: grumpfuff: I never said it makes logical sense or is reasonable or anything, I just said that's the way they view it. Did you know people also think Obama is an empty suit dictator atheist Muslim?

And those are attitudes we can be freely critical of because they make no sense.


Then be critical of that attitude. Don't claim they believe things they don't.
 
2014-03-12 08:24:31 PM  
Considering the pro Pope who has done nothing articles and the other positive articles like the nuns who told the Vatican to Fark off over healthcare and others i would say that is  a defective and biased thought.

Here are the articles on Fark about Pope Francis - which of those portray his religion in a positive light?

http://www.fark.com/hlsearch?qq=francis&is_using_js=1&o=0&limlt=0&li mw p=-1&limtt=0&comment=&url=&email=&name=&website=

The "has done nothing" line might also suggest a little bias to some..
 
2014-03-12 08:40:08 PM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: ciberido: doglover: kortex: What do you expect for sending your kids to a school based around made up crap?

Math is just made up crap.

No, it isn't.  Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.

As a mathematically educated person, I would take a middle ground between those two positions. It isn't (entirely) made up crap, but neither is math some immutable property of the universe. First of all there is no singular "math", humans have invented many math systems, some of which look at things in different ways. For example in Galois field math, basic operations such as addition and subtraction are defined differently than you are used to - simply because it is useful to do so in some situations.

Maths are systems of formal logic. Which means they are models by which we represent and work on concepts. Godel proved that our math systems (formal logic systems) cannot be both complete and internally consistent. We get to choose one, (or neither).

It may also be telling about the general consensus on this subject, that most (all) mathematicians refer to Newton as having "developed" calculus, not "discovered" it. And likewise for for all other fields of math. Galois developed new fields of math, he didn't "discover" them as if they were a pre-existing entity. We (humans) define the rules as we find useful to model certain concepts.


It might be telling, if it were true.  But I'm a mathematically educated person myself, and it hasn't been my experience that 'most (all) mathematicians refer to Newton as having "developed" calculus, not "discovered" it.'  What gets developed, and is human intervention, is notation and ways of communicating and representing mathematics.

In fact, I disagree with pretty much everything you said, apart from the bit on Gödel's incompleteness theorems, which is true but not especially relevant.

And I'm pretty sure you don't know what kind of field operations I am used to, unless you sat in the same classes I did in grad school.
 
2014-03-12 09:14:07 PM  
So who are we hating on in this thread--Christian colleges, or women who falsely report rape?  I need to know where to direct my selective outrage.
 
2014-03-12 10:51:19 PM  
So no police involved ? But you report it to your school instead ? Education system is failing here .
 
2014-03-12 10:56:32 PM  
Fark rapists.
Fark the people who cover it up.
Fark those who shiat all over the victims.

And fark this thread.
 
2014-03-13 12:02:49 AM  

The hopeless imp: How do you go from wanting to be an actor


They're implying he's gay?

To what end, I really don't know.  The only people that could "matter" to is the school (gay is effeminate and therefore if you get raped you deserve it or wanted it, real men are masculine and can't be raped).
 
2014-03-13 07:47:20 AM  

ciberido: No, it isn't. Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.


This series of comments really makes me want to watch Pi again...

"11:15. Restate my assumptions: One: Mathematics is the language of nature. Two: Everything around us can be represented and understood through numbers. Three: If you graph the numbers of any system, patterns emerge. Therefore, there are patterns everywhere in nature. Evidence: The cycling of disease epidemics; the wax and wane of caribou populations; sun spot cycles; the rise and fall of the Nile."
 
2014-03-13 11:01:34 AM  

RobSeace: ciberido: No, it isn't. Like distant galaxies, mathematics existed long before humans discovered it.

This series of comments really makes me want to watch Pi again...


I saw it once.  Um.  I guess I'm glad I did.  Maybe.
 
2014-03-13 12:20:13 PM  

grumpfuff: Man On Pink Corner: Like all rules, he believed that religion was useful.  That much is indisputable.

I wouldn't debate that, but the people who run around saying "Hitler was a Christian/atheist/rightist/leftist/alien from alpha centauri" are usually more interested in saying "See! Hitler agreed with my opponent!"


Yeah, the only thing  you can for sure about boogeymen like Hitler and Stalin is that they were psychotic assholes.
 
2014-03-13 12:54:04 PM  

ciberido: I saw it once. Um. I guess I'm glad I did. Maybe.


Heh. It's a very weird one, for sure... But, that was its main appeal for me: a crazy mathematician trying to predict the stockmarket stumbles across the secret name of God and has to literally drill the info out of his head to survive? That's just so bizarre, I have to see it!
 
2014-03-13 03:01:11 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Yeah, the only thing you can for sure about boogeymen like Hitler and Stalin is that they were psychotic assholes.


It doesn't help that this isn't true.  Undeniable egomania on Stalin's part.  But psychotic means a specific thing.
 
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