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(Heartland Connection)   Cult town in Southeast Iowa in danger of going full Waco   (heartlandconnection.com) divider line 254
    More: Scary, Waco, Jefferson County Sheriff's Office, Iowa Department of Transportation, Iowa Department of Natural Resources, unrest  
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16220 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Mar 2014 at 4:51 PM (41 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



254 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-03-11 10:11:02 PM  

Mock26: Not very good at this whole proof thing, are you?
Here, let me rephrase it for you:  Prove that this is what the federal agents on the scene did.  Providing a link to a training manual is not proof that said material was used in the assault.  Care to try again?


Field manual. But it didn't have anything in it about how to burning down houses.
/It did have stuff on useful KABOOMs.
 
2014-03-11 10:15:43 PM  

buzzcut73: I grew up about an hour from Fairfield, (kick, replies) and even lived there for a couple of years later on as an adult. Lots of woo up there, what with Maharishi International University and all...of all the things I would think might happen there, some sort of guru uprising would have been the last.

Granola shortage causing panic in the streets, maybe.


I went to school in Kirksville (about a hour from Fairfield in Missouri) and watched KTVO a lot while I was in college.

This is easily the most exciting thing that's happened to that region since Kirksville got hit with a tornado a few years back.
 
2014-03-11 10:29:10 PM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.


You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?
 
2014-03-11 10:32:01 PM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Waco was an excellent example of the "don't start no shiat, won't be no shiat" policy. Protip: When law enforcement comes with a search warrant, and you decide to get all shooty about it, you don't really have any cause to gripe when they burn your farking house to the ground. The U.S. Government has nothing to apologize for. Fark those whackjob Davidians, and fark their apologists.


What did the Davidians start?  You seem to have an odd concept of cause and effect.

Basically every argument against the Davidians and Koresh boil down to, he's weird, unchristian, or I dont like him.
 
2014-03-11 10:34:47 PM  

DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?


That's cute, but how is this:

img.fark.net

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.
 
2014-03-11 10:38:20 PM  

Mock26: If they really wanted to live then maybe they should not have broken the law.


If the Government wanted them to really live, it would seem like the best option would be to wait them out, or maybe capture Koresh a few months earlier, amiright?

I am sure that a good number of the folks trapped inside probably wanted to live and probably never broke the law.
 
2014-03-11 10:40:22 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: I can believe that someone in Washington would order the compound taken. I can believe that mistakes were made in the taking of that compound. But I just can't believe that the ATF on the ground would have gone for that.


I dont know, I watched/listened to law enforcement burn Christopher Dorner alive very purposefully.  "We're going to uh.. going to go ahead with the plan.  Set up the burners."


"Today, hot smoke/tear gas canisters accidentally burned down the house Dorner was hiding in..."

Its SOP for barricaded suspects who have the ability and willingness to kill law enforcement.  There have been many examples throughout US history of these tactics being employed, although I dont have the energy to go looking for them all right now.  It happened a lot in the 70s in particular with the various militant groups like the BLA etc running amok.
 
2014-03-11 10:42:30 PM  

Omahawg: so what's the weirdest town in Iowa then? The frog-hopping levitators of fairfield and vedic city? The hardcore capitalist religious communists of the amanas? the dutch reformed in pella who still won't let bars have lighted beer signs? the weird vibe of muscatine? The placid whitebread conformity of west des moines?

what's weird, in the end?


The conformists of WDM, for sure.  At least those other groups contribute in unique ways- Dutch letters, Amana beef...those suburbanites in WDM are creepy, aggressive, hive-minded drones; and drive like shiat.
 
2014-03-11 10:45:24 PM  

Need_MindBleach: Mock26: HeadLever: Mock26: Oh really?  It was Reno who made them break the law?

Law breakers deserve to be in prison.  The decisions that were made led them (and many innocent people) to the morgue instead.

Sometimes lawbreakers die.  That is just the way it works out sometimes.  If they really wanted to live then maybe they should not have broken the law.

And those children they had in there with them? They deserved to burn to death too? Let's face it, the government is at least partially to blame for the deaths of those children. They had the cult completely surrounded. They could have just waited and starved them out, but no, they launched an assault and intentionally or intentionally lit the whole farking place on fire.


Where exactly did I state that anyone deserved to die?  As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.
 
2014-03-11 10:48:21 PM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Mock26: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: demaL-demaL-yeH: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: They (law enforcement) burned up children on purpose. I know. I taught tactics like this in the military. I saw it as it was happening. It was intentional. They waited for the windiest day they could, they punched holes into the building to build a chimney effect, and they pumped flaming tear gas into the building, to make sure they burned every person up. The U.S. were the criminals there.

Bullshiat.

I know that you're a veteran (you mentioned it in a previous thread) so you know that of course, I never trained for this specific situation. But as I was a fully qualified combat engineer in an armored infantry division, and taught demolitions for thirteen years, this was an easily trained for operation that could be successfully practiced and prepared for in a matter of days. This is just an urban warfare problem, with a simple solution if the orders were given to end the operation.

Mock26:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

Start with this: FM 5-34 Combat Engineer Field Manual, paying particular attention to chapters 1, 4, 5, 6, 8, and 10. When you've absorbed that, then I'll give you further reading.

Not very good at this whole proof thing, are you?

Here, let me rephrase it for you:  Prove that this is what the federal agents on the scene did.  Providing a link to a training manual is not proof that said material was used in the assault.  Care to try again?

You provided an image. That told me nothing. I had to guess at what you were questioning. You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.


You claimed that the children were burned on purpose.  I put up an image that said "Citation needed."  Nowhere in any of that article you linked to does it state to burn children on purpose nowhere.  And nowhere does it actually prove that the federal agents did any of what you claimed to do.  Sorry you are such a farking retard and do not know what constitutes proof.  And if you want to be asked a question respectfully, well, maybe you should not be such a moran.
 
2014-03-11 10:50:34 PM  
I've been there. Creepy place. Every home faces the same direction and has pretty much the same layout. In fact just about every building faces the same way. Weird.

The people are, um, creepy too. Not like, "Join our cult, we're really cool," creepy, just off. Good food though.
 
2014-03-11 10:52:20 PM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.


You made very specific claims, none of which were supported by that field manual text.  None.  Nowhere in that manual does it state that they intentionally burned children, or that they did in fact wait for the windiest day, or that they made holes in such and such location to create a chimney effect.  What is in a field manual does not prove intent in the field.  Even the stupidest of fark lawyers could have that field manual thrown out as evidence.
 
2014-03-11 10:52:20 PM  

farkingismybusiness: I had a dark sense of humor before I even knew long division.


And people say community colleges aren't helping
 
2014-03-11 10:55:20 PM  

Fubegra: A quick Google Maps search indicates that "Maharishi Vedic City, IA 52556" is a thing. In Iowa? WTF?


Why is there a major Hare Krishna settlement in West Virginia? My guess: cheap land.

Bathia_Mapes: Fubegra: Bathia_Mapes: Sounds more akin to Rajneeshpuram than Waco, but the whole Rajneeshpuram thing didn't end well for anyone.

That's kind of what I was thinking too. That was an epic fustercluck if there ever was one.

A quick Google Maps search indicates that "Maharishi Vedic City, IA 52556" is a thing. In Iowa? WTF?

I know, right?

And Rajneeshpuram was indeed an epic clusterfark, right down to infecting several restaurant salad bars in The Dalles with salmonella in the hopes of preventing people from voting in an upcoming election.


Don't forget about the plot to murder the U.S. Attorney...
 
2014-03-11 10:59:52 PM  

Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.


"Harm's way" here was a two way street.  Without the government pushing the issue, there is no harm to the 'hostage'.
 
2014-03-11 11:00:22 PM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.


Mock26: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.

You made very specific claims, none of which were supported by that field manual text.  None.  Nowhere in that manual does it state that they intentionally burned children, or that they did in fact wait for the windiest day, or that they made holes in such and such location to create a chimney effect.  What is in a field manual does not prove intent in the field.  Even the stupidest of fark lawyers could have that field manual thrown out as evidence.


Apparently, you didn't say "pretty please."
 
2014-03-11 11:00:36 PM  

HeadLever: Mock26: If they really wanted to live then maybe they should not have broken the law.

If the Government wanted them to really live, it would seem like the best option would be to wait them out, or maybe capture Koresh a few months earlier, amiright?

I am sure that a good number of the folks trapped inside probably wanted to live and probably never broke the law.


Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.

As for capturing him earlier, that is true, but that is not what happened.  As for standoffs, so any time a criminal holes up somewhere we should just waste potentially millions of dollars of money by surrounding him and wait for him to eventually give up?  Yeah, now there is a great plan.  And somehow I bet that if that had gone on for another 51 days, costing roughly another 7 million dollars, that people would have been up in arms over that.  Stand offs only work for so long.  Eventually you just have to go in and take down the criminals, and sometimes innocent people get caught in the crossfire.  In this situation I will not weep for those innocents, because they have only themselves (or their parents) to blame for being there.  They should have walked out of there instead of praying for the government to go away.

Also, in regards to taking Koresh earlier, he did not travel outside of the compound with the fully automatic firearms.  He had to be taken in the compound where the guns were.  That is why they did not take him earlier.
 
2014-03-11 11:03:19 PM  

HeadLever: Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.

"Harm's way" here was a two way street.  Without the government pushing the issue, there is no harm to the 'hostage'.


They were still breaking the law.  One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.
 
2014-03-11 11:04:26 PM  

DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.

Mock26: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.

You made very specific claims, none of which were supported by that field manual text.  None.  Nowhere in that manual does it state that they intentionally burned children, or that they did in fact wait for the windiest day, or that they made holes in such and such location to create a chimney effect.  What is in a field manual does not prove intent in the field.  Even the stupidest of fark lawyers could have that field manual thrown out as evidence.

Apparently, you didn't say "pretty please."


Maybe her tiara is a bit too tight.
 
2014-03-11 11:09:16 PM  

Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.


Do you really think that they had the choice to simply walk out the door here?  From coercion/brainwashing of Koresh to the installation of the notion that the government was going to kill them all, that is the last thing that was going to happen and the government knew that full well.

To suggest otherwise is being naive of the realities of this situation.

One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.

Only after collateral damage is minimized.  They knew where Koresh was and they knew that he was not going anywhere soon.  'Catching the bad guy' was inevitable.  The only other question was how many were going to be killed in the process.  The goal should have always been zero.
 
2014-03-11 11:11:12 PM  

Mock26: HeadLever: Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.

"Harm's way" here was a two way street.  Without the government pushing the issue, there is no harm to the 'hostage'.

They were still breaking the law.  One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.


Yeah, who cares how many people you kill? That's my kind of justice!
 
2014-03-11 11:22:49 PM  

Mock26: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.

You made very specific claims, none of which were supported by that field manual text.  None.  Nowhere in that manual does it state that they intentionally burned children, or that they did in fact wait for the windiest day, or that they made holes in such and such location to create a chimney effect.  What is in a field manual does not prove intent in the field.  Even the stupidest of fark lawyers could have that field manual thrown out as evidence.


And you didn't specifiy what information you wanted verified. You might as well go outside and yell at the sky, "WHY!?!" And when I answered what I thought you might mean, you got biatchy. The only things I will provide "citations" for is my experience and expertise and the knowledge that what I stated is the truth as I see it. If that isn't good enough for you, well, tough titty.
 
2014-03-11 11:23:26 PM  

HeadLever: Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.

Do you really think that they had the choice to simply walk out the door here?  From coercion/brainwashing of Koresh to the installation of the notion that the government was going to kill them all, that is the last thing that was going to happen and the government knew that full well.

To suggest otherwise is being naive of the realities of this situation.

One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.

Only after collateral damage is minimized.  They knew where Koresh was and they knew that he was not going anywhere soon.  'Catching the bad guy' was inevitable.  The only other question was how many were going to be killed in the process.  The goal should have always been zero.


Of course not, but it is equally stupid to suggest that the government just throw away yet more money by surrounding the place and just sitting on their arses for even longer than the 51 days they were already there just on the hope that "maybe today they will give up peacefully and everyone will walk out the door."  Yeah, the branch davidians were dead-set (pun intended) and going down with guns blazing.  They got what they wanted.  So blame those in charge of the branch davidian group for brainwashing others and for keeping them there as some sort of shield of hope to stop the government from assaulting the place.  Yeah, some innocents died, but big farking deal.  shiat happens.
 
2014-03-11 11:25:47 PM  

Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.


So you wouldnt oppose the state coming to take your kids away from you?

Mock26: They were still breaking the law. One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.


Here is where you could educate me- what law were they convicted of breaking?

Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.


I'm sure if a trial had ensued and Koresh were found guilty, his followers would have left.  But the Feds played judge and jury on that land rather than in a courtroom.

There was no need to hurry, no timetable to consider for law enforcement.  Simply put, waiting was the best option.
 
2014-03-11 11:28:29 PM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Mock26: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: DrBenway: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can fark off, and learn how to ask a question respectfully, asshole.

You want to take a moment to fix your make-up and straighten your tiara, sweetie?

That's cute, but how is this:

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

a request for specific information? I repeat, fark that guy. Sweetie.

You made very specific claims, none of which were supported by that field manual text.  None.  Nowhere in that manual does it state that they intentionally burned children, or that they did in fact wait for the windiest day, or that they made holes in such and such location to create a chimney effect.  What is in a field manual does not prove intent in the field.  Even the stupidest of fark lawyers could have that field manual thrown out as evidence.

And you didn't specifiy what information you wanted verified. You might as well go outside and yell at the sky, "WHY!?!" And when I answered what I thought you might mean, you got biatchy. The only things I will provide "citations" for is my experience and expertise and the knowledge that what I stated is the truth as I see it. If that isn't good enough for you, well, tough titty.


Sigh.  You claimed that the federal agents did something very specific.  When someone says, "Citation needed" then even someone with only a passing relationship to the educational system would know that it means to prove the specific claims that you made.  Posting a link to some field manual does not constitute proof that supports your claim that those federal agents did specifically what you said they did.  And I did not get biatchy.  I got condescending, because you were too farking stupid to provide proof to back up your blatant lies.
 
2014-03-11 11:30:18 PM  

Witness99: Oh FANTASTIC, there's not enough shiat hitting the fan and now I gotta worry about loose Pandits. And not just any Pandits, angry Pandits. Pandits, Pandits everywhere!

/TFA wrote "Pandit" 31 times


I thought it was weird that the author never referred to them as men, people, or anything other than Pandits. What audience benefited from dehumanizing then?
 
2014-03-11 11:36:04 PM  

Mock26: Sigh. You claimed that the federal agents did something very specific. When someone says, "Citation needed" then even someone with only a passing relationship to the educational system would know that it means to prove the specific claims that you made. Posting a link to some field manual does not constitute proof that supports your claim that those federal agents did specifically what you said they did. And I did not get biatchy. I got condescending, because you were too farking stupid to provide proof to back up your blatant lies.


Now it is your turn.

Frederick: Here is where you could educate me- what law were they convicted of breaking?

 
2014-03-11 11:44:26 PM  

HeadLever: Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.

Do you really think that they had the choice to simply walk out the door here?  From coercion/brainwashing of Koresh to the installation of the notion that the government was going to kill them all, that is the last thing that was going to happen and the government knew that full well.

To suggest otherwise is being naive of the realities of this situation.

One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.

Only after collateral damage is minimized.  They knew where Koresh was and they knew that he was not going anywhere soon.  'Catching the bad guy' was inevitable.  The only other question was how many were going to be killed in the process.  The goal should have always been zero.


This. I can't believe that I'm trying to argue with someone who thinks that law enforcement should actually be used as an extralegal execution squad. Citizens do deserve their day in court. And being a representative of the United States law enforcement means specifically that you have to obey the law. If there is a way to peacefully resolve things that has to be done.

Of course, firefights happen and that's why cops have guns.
 
2014-03-11 11:46:27 PM  

fst_creeper: Fubegra: Zooming in on Vedic City in with satellite view shows all sorts of weirdness. In the northwest corner of the town, there's an area that looks an awful lot like military barracks (or a concentration camp).

Reminds me of something far worse than a barracks area.


Student housing?
 
2014-03-11 11:46:51 PM  

trappedspirit: farkingismybusiness: I had a dark sense of humor before I even knew long division.

And people say community colleges aren't helping


I never went to community college. I learned long division in prison.
 
2014-03-11 11:48:17 PM  

Frederick: Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.

So you wouldnt oppose the state coming to take your kids away from you?

Mock26: They were still breaking the law. One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.

Here is where you could educate me- what law were they convicted of breaking?

Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.

I'm sure if a trial had ensued and Koresh were found guilty, his followers would have left.  But the Feds played judge and jury on that land rather than in a courtroom.

There was no need to hurry, no timetable to consider for law enforcement.  Simply put, waiting was the best option.


No, they did not play judge and jury.  They used force to apprehend criminals, something that they are legally authorized to do.  Just because things went south for the branchies does not mean that the federal agents just threw the constitution out the window and held a drum head trial in the field and executed the branchies.  They used necessary force to apprehend criminals who were holed up in a fortified position.  Again, they are authorized to do so.  If the branchies wanted to be tried in a court of law then they should have given up peacefully instead of deciding on armed resistance as the best course of action.  But the moment they did take up arms then an armed response from the government was now on the table.  And just because the government decided on an armed response does not mean that the feds played judge and jury in the field.  Or would you rather that the feds had stormed the compound waving a bunch of billy clubs and had them gunned down by the branchies?  The branchies have only themselves to blame.  They had every opportunity to give up, for 50 days.

Convicted of?  None at the time of the raid, but one does not need to be convicted in order to be arrested.  But since you asked, they had possession of illegal firearms.

As for waiting, that wastes money.  Nor is it the best option, as it gives the criminals time to plan and possibly carry out those plans.
 
2014-03-11 11:49:42 PM  
uh huh
 
2014-03-11 11:51:33 PM  

mr_fulano: vudukungfu: Dafarqs a pandit?

I was wondering too, and the Google machine led me to the Wiki fount of all knowledge:

"A  pandit or  pundit (paṇḍita) is a scholar and a teacher, particularly one skilled in the Sanskrit language, who has mastered the four is derived from it but has been used to broadly refer to any of the following:
In the original usage of the word, "Pandit", synonymous to "Purohits", refers to a
The designation may also appear as the abbreviation "Pt." or "Pnt."

Robed guru type Hindu guy - aren't they supposed to be all peace-loving and shiat?


actually, no they aren't
 
2014-03-11 11:52:00 PM  

Frederick: Mock26: As for those children, I put the blame on the branch davidians for putting them in harm's way.

So you wouldnt oppose the state coming to take your kids away from you?



If I had kids I would not put them in a position of being taken away because I was in possession of illegal firearms and I would certainly not fortify my house and use my kids as some sort of shield to try and keep the police from storming the place.  Of course, I am not some bat-schitt crazy, paranoid religious nut conspiracy theorist, so I do not see that happening to my and my non-existent children.
 
2014-03-11 11:52:20 PM  
They're paid to meditae for world peace?
Deport them.
It ain't working.
 
2014-03-11 11:55:45 PM  
krishna.org

This is what a pundit looks like.
 
2014-03-11 11:58:07 PM  

Fano: HeadLever: Mock26: Then those folks should have left or stopped associating with those who were breaking the law.

Do you really think that they had the choice to simply walk out the door here?  From coercion/brainwashing of Koresh to the installation of the notion that the government was going to kill them all, that is the last thing that was going to happen and the government knew that full well.

To suggest otherwise is being naive of the realities of this situation.

One of the key points of law enforcement is going out and catching the bad guys, not just standing around and watching them.

Only after collateral damage is minimized.  They knew where Koresh was and they knew that he was not going anywhere soon.  'Catching the bad guy' was inevitable.  The only other question was how many were going to be killed in the process.  The goal should have always been zero.

This. I can't believe that I'm trying to argue with someone who thinks that law enforcement should actually be used as an extralegal execution squad. Citizens do deserve their day in court. And being a representative of the United States law enforcement means specifically that you have to obey the law. If there is a way to peacefully resolve things that has to be done.

Of course, firefights happen and that's why cops have guns.


Nowhere have I said that the branchies deserved to die or that they should not have had their day in court.  But, sch!tt happens, and this just happens to be one situation where the sch!tt was a really big one.  I am just saying that I do not blame the government.  I do not think that all the leaders were sitting around and on day 51 they all said, "Hey, do you know what would look great on TV?  If we went in guns blazing and murdered a bunch of innocent women and children!  Yeah, that would be freaking AWESOME!"  Anyone who believes that or that they decided to skip the courts and the entire judicial system and deliberately killed them is the king of idiots.  The federal agents made a decision to end the siege and apprehend the criminals.  Those criminals chose to fight.  And they died.  Sometimes that happens.  And this is one of those situations.  The branchies have only themselves to blame.  They broke the law.  They decided on armed resistance.  They could have avoided all of this by giving up on Day 1.  Blame them for deciding they were above the law.  Do not blame the federal agents for doing their job.
 
2014-03-12 12:37:14 AM  

Mock26: Nowhere have I said that the branchies deserved to die or that they should not have had their day in court. But, sch!tt happens, and this just happens to be one situation where the sch!tt was a really big one. I am just saying that I do not blame the government. I do not think that all the leaders were sitting around and on day 51 they all said, "Hey, do you know what would look great on TV? If we went in guns blazing and murdered a bunch of innocent women and children! Yeah, that would be freaking AWESOME!" Anyone who believes that or that they decided to skip the courts and the entire judicial system and deliberately killed them is the king of idiots. The federal agents made a decision to end the siege and apprehend the criminals. Those criminals chose to fight. And they died. Sometimes that happens. And this is one of those situations. The branchies have only themselves to blame. They broke the law. They decided on armed resistance. They could have avoided all of this by giving up on Day 1. Blame them for deciding they were above the law. Do not blame the federal agents for doing their job.


img.fark.net

/now do you get it?
 
2014-03-12 02:56:49 AM  
Fark you! Enough with postings that try to force you to download their mobile ap!!!! Shame! Shame!! Double Fark!!!
 
2014-03-12 03:33:07 AM  

Need_MindBleach: Mock26: HeadLever: Mock26: Oh really?  It was Reno who made them break the law?

Law breakers deserve to be in prison.  The decisions that were made led them (and many innocent people) to the morgue instead.

Sometimes lawbreakers die.  That is just the way it works out sometimes.  If they really wanted to live then maybe they should not have broken the law.

And those children they had in there with them? They deserved to burn to death too? Let's face it, the government is at least partially to blame for the deaths of those children. They had the cult completely surrounded. They could have just waited and starved them out, but no, they launched an assault and intentionally or intentionally lit the whole farking place on fire.


A prolonged standoff would probably have had an ending that looked like the Jonestown massacre.
 
2014-03-12 05:16:13 AM  
"Pandits are young men brought over from India, and they are housed in a fenced campus.
They are paid $200 a month to chant and meditate, $150 of which is sent back to their families in India."

"Pandits have made headlines frequently for disappearing after their two years are up.
They receive visas as part of the program.
It is likely they disappear because they do not want to return to India but cannot stay on campus."


 I read very few of the comments above, because really?
Isn't $200/mth far less than the minimum wage for chanting? My guess would have been at least $400.
If $50/wk is the going rate, that may not be my thing.....but I think 3/4 to the Fam is a bit steep.
"I" get to live on $50/mth? Cost of living is WAY higher here!! Sure, I don't need to goto a theater to watch a movie, but I need to pay the cable to .torrent and Candy Crush. Seriously. Boss. Send the Parents and in-laws $50 (that's PLENTY!)
Is that a Visa? kthxbye!
 
2014-03-12 05:29:11 AM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Waco didn't go Waco because of Waco. Waco went Waco because of Reno.


I didn't know you had opinions...  I thought you just posted pictures....
 
2014-03-12 08:35:10 AM  

Mock26: Of course not, but it is equally stupid to suggest that the government just throw away yet more money by surrounding the place and just sitting on their arses for even longer than the 51 days


Sure, they could have pulled the tanks, armored carriers, and thousands of armed government agents back away from the compound and simply placed the area under surveillance with about a 1/10th the personnel.  Just apprehend all that comes out for food and eventually you will have them all.  Pretty easy if you ask me and low cost as well.

Yeah, some innocents died, but big farking deal.  shiat happens.

I'd bet you feel the same exact way when it is your kids that are killed.  Your disregard for human life is telling
 
2014-03-12 08:40:15 AM  
So by liberty, freedom, and limited government you mean stockpiling weapons and pumping out Tater Jrs for a creepy guy who claims he's Jesus? Or do you mean being the creepy guy who claims he's Jesus?


Yes. Exactly. Weird, strange, whatever. Those are all examples of freedom.
 
2014-03-12 08:41:06 AM  

Fano: Pop Quiz hotshot: You're the directOr of the ATF. You need to.....


C) Come up with some guaranteed public spectacle to deflect attention away from the racial discrimination and sexual harassment charges in process against your organization.
 
2014-03-12 09:06:17 AM  

Krieghund: A prolonged standoff would probably have had an ending that looked like the Jonestown massacre.


In that case, at least you would not be party to the actual killings.  That case would mean any death would be completely on them.
 
2014-03-12 09:10:22 AM  

Mock26: They could have avoided all of this by giving up on Day 1.  Blame them for deciding they were above the law.  Do not blame the federal agents for doing their job.


They could have avoided this by apprehending Koresh months earlier, but they didn't.  And we are not blaming the agents, they were only doing what they were told.  No matter how you deflect, those that were making the decisions on the government side are culpable for what happened.

Criminals are not going to be playing by the rules.  However, that is no excuse for the government not to be the 'grownup' in these circumstances.
 
2014-03-12 09:58:10 AM  

farkingismybusiness: How many of David Koresh's followers can fit in a convertible?

Two in the front, two in the back, and 72 in the ash tray.

/loved that joke as a third grader.


Hahaha! When I was a kid that was a Space Shuttle joke... only it was a Volkswagen Beetle. Along with "How did they know Christa Mcauliffs eyes were blue? One blew this way, and one blew that way."
 
2014-03-12 11:39:58 AM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Mock26: Nowhere have I said that the branchies deserved to die or that they should not have had their day in court. But, sch!tt happens, and this just happens to be one situation where the sch!tt was a really big one. I am just saying that I do not blame the government. I do not think that all the leaders were sitting around and on day 51 they all said, "Hey, do you know what would look great on TV? If we went in guns blazing and murdered a bunch of innocent women and children! Yeah, that would be freaking AWESOME!" Anyone who believes that or that they decided to skip the courts and the entire judicial system and deliberately killed them is the king of idiots. The federal agents made a decision to end the siege and apprehend the criminals. Those criminals chose to fight. And they died. Sometimes that happens. And this is one of those situations. The branchies have only themselves to blame. They broke the law. They decided on armed resistance. They could have avoided all of this by giving up on Day 1. Blame them for deciding they were above the law. Do not blame the federal agents for doing their job.

[img.fark.net image 500x271]

/now do you get it?


or as Ron burgundy would say, "when in Rome?"
 
2014-03-12 11:49:07 AM  
I don't get it. What does a airplane have to do with a bunch of indian guys babbling in a commune?

upload.wikimedia.org
 
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