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(The American Spectator)   Conservatives are upset that 12 Years a Slave didn't represent a 'kind master or a contented slave'... because you know... most slaves were happy   (spectator.org) divider line 469
    More: Asinine, Years a Slave, stop and frisk, Chiwetel Ejiofor, Steve McQueen, New York Police Department  
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10659 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Mar 2014 at 5:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



469 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-03-10 05:44:59 PM  

MrSteve007: While there certainly were terrible slave owners (and the simple fact that slavery in itself is terrible), there were many cases where freed slaves stayed with the previous "owners" by choice, as paid servants.

But lets not let that get in the way of a good internet argument!


Yes, let's talk about sharecropping, shall we?
 
2014-03-10 05:45:05 PM  

FlashHarry: i think the GOP should finance a conservative film about slavery called "Lawdy, Massuh Sho Bin Good t'Us."


Wasn't that "Song of the South?"
 
2014-03-10 05:45:12 PM  
Mr T is growing weary with this shiat.

img.fark.net
 
2014-03-10 05:45:24 PM  
I'm sure a few were just like there were blacks who owned slaves, but that does nothing to validate the abhorrent practice of slavery.
 
2014-03-10 05:45:33 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: I highly encourage the conservative grift movement to bankroll a film showing all the feel good times that slavery produced during that period.


and as it might be tough to find african-american actors to star in such a film, it might be necessary to have white actors made up to look like african slaves... "blackface," if you will.
 
2014-03-10 05:45:54 PM  
I would like to hear more of this man's opinions.

I think he should start an honest dialog about rape.
 
2014-03-10 05:45:58 PM  

Prey4reign: SecretAgentWoman: I just want to cockpunch the author for the phrase "We, forsooth!"

What a pretentious ass.

I can just picture him putting down his brandy snifter he had just sipped his Hennesey from, straightening out his smoking jacket and puffing on his meerschaum pipe before his typed that out on his keyboard.


... Oblivious to the many typos.

/what a pos. Ass cancer is required.
 
2014-03-10 05:46:03 PM  
timujin:

I wonder if this person has ever uttered those famous conservative words, "Taxation is slavery"?

static01.mediaite.com

"You think it is immoral for the Government to reach into your pocket and rip it from its warm home and claim it for its own property. Money that used to enjoy unfettered freedom is now conscripted to do whatever its new owner tells it to.
Now, I know this is going to be a leap, but you know that sadness and rage you feel about your money?  Well, that's the way some of us feel about people."
 
2014-03-10 05:46:24 PM  

det0321: Some slave owners were downright playful with the property.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delphine_LaLaurie


I wonder if that person was the inspiration for Katy Bates' character in AHS The Coven?
 
2014-03-10 05:46:54 PM  

FlashHarry: HotWingConspiracy: I highly encourage the conservative grift movement to bankroll a film showing all the feel good times that slavery produced during that period.

and as it might be tough to find african-american actors to star in such a film, it might be necessary to have white actors made up to look like african slaves... "blackface," if you will.


The sad thing is I wouldn't even be a little surprised if someone actually did this.
 
2014-03-10 05:46:56 PM  

wambu: just like there were blacks who owned slaves


i... don't even want to google that. care to back up that assertion?
 
2014-03-10 05:47:09 PM  

SecretAgentWoman: I just want to cockpunch the author for the phrase "We, forsooth!"

What a pretentious ass.


And another cockpunch for using "unwrung withers".
 
2014-03-10 05:47:23 PM  

LeroyBourne: det0321: Some slave owners were downright playful with the property.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delphine_LaLaurie

I wonder if that person was the inspiration for Katy Bates' character in AHS The Coven?


Um...
 
2014-03-10 05:47:26 PM  

MrSteve007: While there certainly were terrible slave owners (and the simple fact that slavery in itself is terrible), there were many cases where freed slaves stayed with the previous "owners" by choice, as paid servants.

But lets not let that get in the way of a good internet argument!


I pray you're trolling.

Either way, you are a vile specimen.
 
2014-03-10 05:47:52 PM  
George Washington had 300 slaves.
 
2014-03-10 05:47:55 PM  
Did the author even watch the movie? There were several "contented" slaves depicted. I use that term in quotes to mean slaves who were resigned to their position and making the most out of it. Some of them were depicted as leading lives in comfort, with servants of their own and more luxury than a large number of free people had at the time.  In some cases, the price paid for this life was to be the master's mistress.

Are these people truly 'content'? I would say that the movie leaves that to the audience to decide. Would we choose to place ourselves in that position in exchange for a life of luxury? Would we place our children there? Hell no. Slavery is slavery, regardless of the perks, and the costs are lifelong pseudo-consentual rape.

Point being, the movie seemed to me to be an honest depiction. No sugar coating, and no demonization. Even Michael Fassbender's character wasn't truly evil - he was in love with one of his slaves, insanely jealous, and brow beaten by a spiteful wife (who could see his love for the girl).  He is not depicted as a nice man, but nor is he demonized as purely evil.


The most incredible thing I found about Solomon Northup's story is how evenly it is told. No godwinning here.
 
2014-03-10 05:48:11 PM  

Isitoveryet: typical dirty Liberal tricks, projecting their ideas of what it really meant to be a slave on actual slaves.

every Southern slave owner who was kind enough to house, feed & lend a gentle educational correction to black slaves was a saint and should be exonerated (I know, big word for you sheep) from the absolutely false depiction of what owning humans as chattel really was.

you are more of a slave as a tax payer today than any bought and paid for slave who did so on his/her own accord after some mild convincing, during America's great period of unprecedented growth that was a testament to and of the hard work that Americans used to do that made this country what it is today.


img.fark.net
 
2014-03-10 05:48:24 PM  

lockers: Is this what conservatives have been reduced to?


The whole concept of conservatism, of which there was once an actual progressive strain, has been hijacked and distorted by zealous demagogues. Or so it seems to me.

The writer seemed unaware that 12 Years a Slave was essentially an autobiography. With that kind of logic, female slaves would've been happy to be raped by their masters because it made a nice little break from picking cotton or digging ditches.

" I have no comments to make upon the subject of Slavery. Those who read this book may form their own opinions of the "peculiar institution". What it may be in other States, I do not profess to know; what it is in the region of Red River, is truly and faithfully delineated in these pages. This is no fiction, no exaggeration. If I have failed in anything, it has been in presenting to the reader too prominently the bright side of the picture."-Solomon Northup

Well, zippety-farking-doo-dah.
 
2014-03-10 05:48:42 PM  
img.fark.net
Of course!  But MAYbe...
 
2014-03-10 05:48:58 PM  

Maud Dib: buckeyebrain: [misfit120.files.wordpress.com image 640x480]
Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, Zip-a-dee-ay.  My oh my, what a wonderful day!

[www.morethings.com image 320x240]


I was waiting for this.
 
2014-03-10 05:49:05 PM  
Movies are two dimensional portrayals of real life.  Why should this one be any different?
 
2014-03-10 05:49:13 PM  

scottydoesntknow: When my mom was in her early teens, she got into an argument with my great-grandmother over this. My mom just found out that her great-grandfather owned plantations with slaves (he was a colonel for the confederate army).

Mom: Wait, so great-grandpa owned slaves?!
GG: Yes, but they all loved him!
Mom: Of course they did! They were forced to! I'd say I loved anyone if it meant I wouldn't be beaten or sold!
GG: THEY! LOVED! HIM! I WILL NOT HAVE YOU SAY OTHERWISE! *she starts shaking at this point*
Mom's mom: Shush. Don't agitate your grandma!

Apparently one of the ways of justifying having racist slave owners in your family tree is by saying all the slaves loved their masters and were treated so nice.


Yup.  That's still a common image in the South in a lot of places, that slaves were happy, well fed, well treated, and loved their masters dearly and there was nothing wrong with the system. . .till those liberal Damn Yankees came and ruined everything by violating State's Rights with their evil Big Government.

/Sadly, that is NOT hyperbole, I've heard such attitudes articulated more than once.
 
2014-03-10 05:49:17 PM  
Maybe the writer can have this discussion with the (admittedly-fictional) Django Freeman and his wife. I am sure they would have a rational and peaceful conversation on the subject.
 
2014-03-10 05:50:26 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: These people think Song of the South is a documentary. This isn't surprising.


Just like to point out that that movie took place during reconstruction. Uncle Remus wasn't a slave.
 
2014-03-10 05:50:47 PM  

Clash City Farker: George Washington had 300 slaves.


And he was the Father of Our Country. So slavery, as an institution, can't be all bad.
 
2014-03-10 05:51:05 PM  

miss diminutive: If ever in slavery's the Holocaust's 250-year 5 year history in North America Germany there were a kind master Camp Commandant or a contented slave Jew , as in the nature of things there must have been, here and there, we may be sure that Mr McQueen Spielberg does not want us to hear about it.

Why didn't that liberal hack Spielberg not show us the other side of the Holocaust? Too busy with his own agenda, I'd wager. Eh, Mr Bowman?


People born into 4th generation slavery might very well have been content with their situation. They never knew anything else than slavery after all.

So I don't think your Jew example works.

---

I am not really sure I understand what people are getting so riled up about. Obviously people in the South believed in slavery as the natural state, as you can see in their arguments for it from the time. And it stands to reason that slaves could hold the same belief, and be content in their life. As could a slave owner be a nice person, and treat his slaves well.
 
2014-03-10 05:51:26 PM  

meat0918: Big Daddy approves this message

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 675x404]


Is that Colonel Angus?
 
2014-03-10 05:51:29 PM  

semiotix: There's something to be said for the idea that not every moment of every enslaved African-American's life was utter misery and degradation. This doesn't detract from the horror of slavery, it reflects the fact that people are good at finding meaning and happiness in objectively horrible situations. It shows the strength and resourcefulness of slaves that they were able to have any happy times at all. Or to take a totally different example, Anne Frank's story is such a gut-punch because her life ended even as she was making a semblance of a normal adolescent life for herself in that attic.

But yeah, as a rule, fark anyone who talks about slavery being a happy thing in general. Fark them indecorously in their ear.


This.  You can also make the valid points that lots of slaves were originally sold by their fellow Africans...and that those slaves' descendants are doing better, on average, than the descendants of the people who sold them, Africa being mostly a shiathole these days.

But step beyond that at your peril.
 
2014-03-10 05:51:46 PM  

miss diminutive: If ever in slavery's the Holocaust's 250-year 5 year history in North America Germany there were a kind master Camp Commandant or a contented slave Jew , as in the nature of things there must have been, here and there, we may be sure that Mr McQueen Spielberg does not want us to hear about it.

Why didn't that liberal hack Spielberg not show us the other side of the Holocaust? Too busy with his own agenda, I'd wager. Eh, Mr Bowman?


He did, unless you missed the part where Schindler was a Nazi and the Jrws celebrated him. Your comparison fails.

Seems to me this giys beef is with Historians claiming the film showed the only reality about slavery when that claim is factually incorrect. He plainly stayes that chattel slavery at large was cruel.

My problem with his argument is that even though there were some kindasyers and contented slaves, they were such a minority that it seems inappropriate to biatch about an ant-slavery movie not addressing it.

/heck Jefferson Davis was one iirc. Treated his slaves very well and worked along side them.
 
2014-03-10 05:52:08 PM  
Clash City Farker
George Washington had 300 slaves.


And in his will I think they were to be given freedom upon the death of his wife. For some reason she gave them freedom before her death.

Did you know that Jefferson had slaves too.
 
2014-03-10 05:52:15 PM  

scottydoesntknow: MrSteve007: While there certainly were terrible slave owners (and the simple fact that slavery in itself is terrible), there were many cases where freed slaves stayed with the previous "owners" by choice, as paid servants.

But lets not let that get in the way of a good internet argument!

Never mind the fact that they had no education, transferable skills (beyond farm work), support system, or communities that would welcome them. Ya know, things most people would need when being thrust into a new world.

Just because they couldn't handle life outside of the plantation does not make life inside the plantation enjoyable. It's just familiar. Better the devil you know...


While I would need to look up all of the details of the history, my family's history in North America dates back to the Mayflower (and one branch of the family is American Indian, so much longer than that). I had ancestors who were both northerners and southerners - including plantation owners. By all accounts of what we can find, the plantation owners were pretty good to their slaves: they were literate, were allowed to earn their freedom, and were paid fairly. Most kept on at the plantation as freemen. I certainly agree with you that the cards were stacked against non-whites in the South (especially with the specter of being sold back into slavery).

Of course, it wasn't too long before my other ancestors from the North came down, kicked some ass, and made things right.

Plus Hollywood doesn't like stories from that era that lack gratuitous whippings and beatings - so modern society largely loses reference to peoples' decisions based on their time and social mores.
 
2014-03-10 05:52:18 PM  

Kome: I love the condescension this clown has for the history profession. "Oh, sure, this historian says it's representative of the period, and that professional academic who studies this stuff agrees, and all the rest of the profession accepted it as a reasonably representative depiction of slavery in the US south, but f*ck them. I'm some piece of sh*t racist movie critic and it's painfully obvious that I know better than those snooty ivory-tower elites who value facts and evidence over my inherent biases and prejudices."

What a cock.


 Watch those same people swell with pride when they find one historian or scientist who seems to support their [insert lost cause]. "See? He's a professor!Whaddya make of THAT, libs!? Who's the smart one now?"

 /most common current example is citing Newt Gingrich's academic career, while everyone else is just an ivory tower elite
 
2014-03-10 05:52:40 PM  

FlashHarry: Lawdy, Massuh Sho Bin Good t'Us

s.mcstatic.com

 
2014-03-10 05:52:59 PM  
Conservatives REALLY hate it when Reality keeps showing it's left-wing bias.
 
2014-03-10 05:53:36 PM  

InterruptingQuirk: Will Solomon's own words condemn me for sharing them?

[img.fark.net image 575x899]


There probably were slave owners who were "kind", except, you know, about the part about owning other people. Still can't excuse it.
 
2014-03-10 05:53:38 PM  

lockers: Is this what conservatives have been reduced to?


Oh, this rabbit hole goes far, far deeper, my friend.
 
2014-03-10 05:53:46 PM  

Clash City Farker: George Washington had 300 slaves.


But Michele Bachmann told me that "the Founding Fathers who wrote the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence worked tirelessly to end slavery. " video
 
2014-03-10 05:54:09 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: meat0918: Big Daddy approves this message

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 675x404]

Is that Colonel Angus?


1.bp.blogspot.com

This is Colonel Angus, and he goes by Ennol now.
 
2014-03-10 05:54:20 PM  

Mr. Coffee Nerves: "And in 'Roots' why didn't they ever show Toby thanking the benevolent men for taking away that mouthful of a moniker and giving him a name so easily found on gift-shop keychains and novelty license plates?"


AND helping him save money on shoes.
 
2014-03-10 05:54:23 PM  

Clash City Farker: George Washington had 300 slaves.


And 30 goddamn dicks.
 
2014-03-10 05:55:07 PM  

FlashHarry: oh, yeah, how's that outreach coming, republicans?


It was never really "outreach" as it was "striking distance".
 
2014-03-10 05:55:37 PM  
Probably already been mentioned, and I can't really argue it, as I haven't seen the movie yet, but I thought Smaug Holmes was supposed to be a decent master, as far as someone who owns people can be...
 
2014-03-10 05:56:12 PM  

skrame: InterruptingQuirk: Will Solomon's own words condemn me for sharing them?

[img.fark.net image 575x899]

Wow; not a single response.



No one's interested in his opinion.
 
2014-03-10 05:56:14 PM  
Yeah, and how about how hard Democrats kept fighting to keep blacks down?  F*cking liberals.
 
2014-03-10 05:56:20 PM  

FlashHarry: wambu: just like there were blacks who owned slaves

i... don't even want to google that. care to back up that assertion?


That's sadly correct, even ignoring the vast slave markets in Africa; most slaves were initially bought from fellow blacks after being captured in tribal raids.  Also, some parts of the South (and other parts of the world) had fairly intricate social caste systems, based on "how black" you were; quadroon, octaroon, etc.

For instance, some 1/4 blacks would think it quite proper to own 1/2 blacks, since they were obviously "better" than their property.
 
2014-03-10 05:56:28 PM  
If you watched that movie and your reaction was one of outrage at the persecution ... of slavers, you might be a racist.
 
2014-03-10 05:57:02 PM  
Back in 2009, I got into an argument here on Fark with a Farkette named TheDumbBlonde, who defended the conditions of slavery, before finally admitting that she came from "a long line of slaveowners" in Virginia and Barbados.

The denialism of Southerners about the horrors of slavery continues today.
 
2014-03-10 05:57:05 PM  

MrSteve007: While there certainly were terrible slave owners (and the simple fact that slavery in itself is terrible), there were many cases where freed slaves stayed with the previous "owners" by choice, as paid servants.

But lets not let that get in the way of a good internet argument!


wait... so you're saying that owning of human beings as property isn't all that bad?
 
2014-03-10 05:58:20 PM  
i60.tinypic.com

farm4.staticflickr.com
 
2014-03-10 05:58:47 PM  
This type of tripe definitely falls into the category of "stop talking about rape if you want to win elections".  Farking dumbasses.
 
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