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(Break)   These six robotic, self driving cars could soon become a reality, leaving drivers hands free for things like eating, makeup and texting. You know; things they would never do now while behind the wheel   (break.com) divider line 59
    More: Interesting, autopilots, electric cars, autonomous driving, vertical takeoff, self-driving, Nissan Leaf, couch, bus drivers  
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1332 clicks; posted to Geek » on 10 Mar 2014 at 3:10 PM (37 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-10 01:53:07 PM  
and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.
 
2014-03-10 02:01:54 PM  

Voiceofreason01: and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.


Driving in snow will also be lots of fun.  And good luck with the potholes.
 
2014-03-10 02:13:02 PM  
I can imagine some dude pulling out of his driveway going on a cross-country road trip, route already logged in, and having a coronary behind the wheel.

2 days later his corpse pulls up to a hotel in Vancouver.
 
2014-03-10 02:17:22 PM  

gopher321: I can imagine some dude pulling out of his driveway going on a cross-country road trip, route already logged in, and having a coronary behind the wheel.

2 days later his corpse pulls up to a hotel in Vancouver.


Nice !!


And we wont see these cars in the US anytime soon. I am betting on lawsuits and luddite laws to keep them out of the US market.
 
2014-03-10 02:23:40 PM  

namatad: And we wont see these cars in the US anytime soon. I am betting on lawsuits and luddite laws to keep them out of the US market.


You probably won't see them ever outside of a few niche markets. There are too many technical challenges that have yet to be worked out in addition to the legal and psychological hurdles. What you will start to see a lot more of is driver assist cars: cars with systems that detect other cars on the road and keep you from following too closely, automatically adjust the traction control and handling for different road conditions or that can stop themselves in the case of an emergency(systems that already exist on some luxury cars).
 
2014-03-10 02:47:25 PM  
Subby failed to mention fapping.  Glaring omission, subby.
 
2014-03-10 03:03:01 PM  

Voiceofreason01: and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.


I get what you're saying (and it's applicable to all vehicles on the road, really), but dude, seriously, that is the very definition of a strawman fallacy. I mean, it's just textbook.
 
2014-03-10 03:15:40 PM  

TwistedIvory: Voiceofreason01: and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.

I get what you're saying (and it's applicable to all vehicles on the road, really), but dude, seriously, that is the very definition of a strawman fallacy. I mean, it's just textbook.


sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars and an automated system is a lot less fault tolerant than a person, generally. And Second the psychology: Strawman or not "Ken" is out there and your only protection is that machine you've given up control to. Almost your whole flight on a commercial airline is controlled by the autopilot and there have been several crashes that have been caused because the pilot interfered with the automated systems but would you get on a plane without a human pilot? Probably not.
 
2014-03-10 03:16:59 PM  
media1.break.com
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.
 
2014-03-10 03:22:18 PM  
With Google's mapping inside spaces like buildings.  Your car can take you directly to the store department you want and then park itself later.  Sorta a cradle to grave solution for driving.
 
2014-03-10 03:23:29 PM  

gopher321: I can imagine some dude pulling out of his driveway going on a cross-country road trip, route already logged in, and having a coronary behind the wheel.

2 days later his corpse pulls up to a hotel in Vancouver.


I read a story when I was a kid... An awesome book of SciFi stories. I can't for the life of me find this story, but the premise was this:

Cars be came robotic, even to the point of being self-filling. Early on in the tech, a car malfunctioned, and continued to wander around for years, getting fuel on the owner's credit, but with 2 mummies in the car because they had never been able to stop it, and had eventually starved to death inside the car. It was all told kind of like a ghost story, with one service station employee telling another one(Remember, old SciFi assumed that we would still have attendants at service stations). At the end of the story, the 'Ghost Car' actually appeared, got its gas, and took off before the attendant could do anything.

It was a cool story, and I think about it EVERY time I read about 'robot' cars...
 
2014-03-10 03:25:21 PM  

serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.


Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.
 
2014-03-10 03:27:41 PM  

Prey4reign: Subby failed to mention fapping.  Glaring omission, subby.


Or the female accidentally switching the auto-pilot off with her high heel while she's squirming on the male's lap...
 
2014-03-10 03:27:45 PM  

Voiceofreason01: sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars


Not here they're not... The "Safety Inspection" thing in Utah seems like a scam and can be a pain in the ass at times, but do you know how few beaters I see on the roads here? In AZ, it was probably 10-15%, here, if a car is 20 years old, it actually runs pretty well, isn't falling apart, has decent tires, etc... It wouldn't be a bad policy to have elsewhere, actually.
 
2014-03-10 03:29:24 PM  
but will it have farmers market detection systems for the old people?
 
2014-03-10 03:31:34 PM  

Mikey1969: gopher321: I can imagine some dude pulling out of his driveway going on a cross-country road trip, route already logged in, and having a coronary behind the wheel.

2 days later his corpse pulls up to a hotel in Vancouver.

I read a story when I was a kid... An awesome book of SciFi stories. I can't for the life of me find this story, but the premise was this:

Cars be came robotic, even to the point of being self-filling. Early on in the tech, a car malfunctioned, and continued to wander around for years, getting fuel on the owner's credit, but with 2 mummies in the car because they had never been able to stop it, and had eventually starved to death inside the car. It was all told kind of like a ghost story, with one service station employee telling another one(Remember, old SciFi assumed that we would still have attendants at service stations). At the end of the story, the 'Ghost Car' actually appeared, got its gas, and took off before the attendant could do anything.

It was a cool story, and I think about it EVERY time I read about 'robot' cars...


I want to say it was a Heinlein story
 
2014-03-10 03:33:59 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: Voiceofreason01: and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.

Driving in snow will also be lots of fun.  And good luck with the potholes.


Thank god we don't have idiots, potholes, or snow now.
 
2014-03-10 03:34:49 PM  

Mikey1969: Voiceofreason01: sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars

Not here they're not... The "Safety Inspection" thing in Utah seems like a scam and can be a pain in the ass at times, but do you know how few beaters I see on the roads here? In AZ, it was probably 10-15%, here, if a car is 20 years old, it actually runs pretty well, isn't falling apart, has decent tires, etc... It wouldn't be a bad policy to have elsewhere, actually.


A lot can go wrong in a year and safety inspections are expensive and tend to price lower income people off the road(there is a reason most States either don't do them are set the bar incredible low). I can see robot buses as public transportation or in military convoys and there are ports that use automation for cargo handling but just like the idea that "everybody is going to have a flying car" automatic drive personal automobiles are not really practical.
 
2014-03-10 03:35:28 PM  

Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.


If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.
 
2014-03-10 03:48:17 PM  

loonatic112358: Mikey1969: gopher321: I can imagine some dude pulling out of his driveway going on a cross-country road trip, route already logged in, and having a coronary behind the wheel.

2 days later his corpse pulls up to a hotel in Vancouver.

I read a story when I was a kid... An awesome book of SciFi stories. I can't for the life of me find this story, but the premise was this:

Cars be came robotic, even to the point of being self-filling. Early on in the tech, a car malfunctioned, and continued to wander around for years, getting fuel on the owner's credit, but with 2 mummies in the car because they had never been able to stop it, and had eventually starved to death inside the car. It was all told kind of like a ghost story, with one service station employee telling another one(Remember, old SciFi assumed that we would still have attendants at service stations). At the end of the story, the 'Ghost Car' actually appeared, got its gas, and took off before the attendant could do anything.

It was a cool story, and I think about it EVERY time I read about 'robot' cars...

I want to say it was a Heinlein story


Could have been... The book had some good choices in it. The other biggest one I remember was one of the chapters of The Martian Chronicles as a stand alone short story. I think there was also a Harlan Ellison story in there. Pretty good for a 5th grade school library.

Voiceofreason01: A lot can go wrong in a year and safety inspections are expensive and tend to price lower income people off the road(there is a reason most States either don't do them are set the bar incredible low). I can see robot buses as public transportation or in military convoys and there are ports that use automation for cargo handling but just like the idea that "everybody is going to have a flying car" automatic drive personal automobiles are not really practical.


That's why there are minimums for stuff like brakes and tire treadwear. As for "expensive", no they aren't.

Oh, and there are plenty of people on low incomes driving around here. It's not like all we're seeing are Porsche Cayennes and Bentleys on the road here.
 
2014-03-10 03:51:32 PM  

Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.


Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.
 
2014-03-10 03:52:33 PM  

Voiceofreason01: Mikey1969: Voiceofreason01: sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars

Not here they're not... The "Safety Inspection" thing in Utah seems like a scam and can be a pain in the ass at times, but do you know how few beaters I see on the roads here? In AZ, it was probably 10-15%, here, if a car is 20 years old, it actually runs pretty well, isn't falling apart, has decent tires, etc... It wouldn't be a bad policy to have elsewhere, actually.

A lot can go wrong in a year and safety inspections are expensive and tend to price lower income people off the road(there is a reason most States either don't do them are set the bar incredible low). I can see robot buses as public transportation or in military convoys and there are ports that use automation for cargo handling but just like the idea that "everybody is going to have a flying car" automatic drive personal automobiles are not really practical.


Or likely. By the time we reach full autonomy, it's more likely that there will be a stable of cars nearby that you can call on demand. It's far less wasteful and less expensive than every person owning a car which spends most of its time sitting around.

By that same token, those fleet vehicles would get regular service.
 
2014-03-10 04:03:28 PM  

LasersHurt: Voiceofreason01: Mikey1969: Voiceofreason01: sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars

Not here they're not... The "Safety Inspection" thing in Utah seems like a scam and can be a pain in the ass at times, but do you know how few beaters I see on the roads here? In AZ, it was probably 10-15%, here, if a car is 20 years old, it actually runs pretty well, isn't falling apart, has decent tires, etc... It wouldn't be a bad policy to have elsewhere, actually.

A lot can go wrong in a year and safety inspections are expensive and tend to price lower income people off the road(there is a reason most States either don't do them are set the bar incredible low). I can see robot buses as public transportation or in military convoys and there are ports that use automation for cargo handling but just like the idea that "everybody is going to have a flying car" automatic drive personal automobiles are not really practical.

Or likely. By the time we reach full autonomy, it's more likely that there will be a stable of cars nearby that you can call on demand. It's far less wasteful and less expensive than every person owning a car which spends most of its time sitting around.

By that same token, those fleet vehicles would get regular service.


Until you deal with the "vomit soaked interior free-rider problem" Americans are going to be unhealthily obsessed with ownership.

There are 2 mutually exclusive groups here: the picky assholes who don't want to deal with any problems caused by anyone else, and the kinda people who will take a dump in the car because "it's not their problem" on the way home from the bar.

And people in the middle don't really want to put up with both the demands of the former, or the serious shiat caused by the latter.  (And I wouldn't doubt that a huge percentage of group A are also in group B)
 
2014-03-10 04:21:17 PM  

ikanreed: LasersHurt: Voiceofreason01: Mikey1969: Voiceofreason01: sure but it illustrates two important points: one is the maintenance issue, a lot of people are on the road now with barely functional cars

Not here they're not... The "Safety Inspection" thing in Utah seems like a scam and can be a pain in the ass at times, but do you know how few beaters I see on the roads here? In AZ, it was probably 10-15%, here, if a car is 20 years old, it actually runs pretty well, isn't falling apart, has decent tires, etc... It wouldn't be a bad policy to have elsewhere, actually.

A lot can go wrong in a year and safety inspections are expensive and tend to price lower income people off the road(there is a reason most States either don't do them are set the bar incredible low). I can see robot buses as public transportation or in military convoys and there are ports that use automation for cargo handling but just like the idea that "everybody is going to have a flying car" automatic drive personal automobiles are not really practical.

Or likely. By the time we reach full autonomy, it's more likely that there will be a stable of cars nearby that you can call on demand. It's far less wasteful and less expensive than every person owning a car which spends most of its time sitting around.

By that same token, those fleet vehicles would get regular service.

Until you deal with the "vomit soaked interior free-rider problem" Americans are going to be unhealthily obsessed with ownership.

There are 2 mutually exclusive groups here: the picky assholes who don't want to deal with any problems caused by anyone else, and the kinda people who will take a dump in the car because "it's not their problem" on the way home from the bar.

And people in the middle don't really want to put up with both the demands of the former, or the serious shiat caused by the latter.  (And I wouldn't doubt that a huge percentage of group A are also in group B)


The former can still have their own, and the latter is wildly overblown. People, as a whole, aren't just shiatting willy-nilly in things.
 
2014-03-10 04:22:55 PM  

LasersHurt: The former can still have their own, and the latter is wildly overblown. People, as a whole, aren't just shiatting willy-nilly in things.


I don't disagree, but it only takes one shiat-ladden robo-taxi to ruin your day.
 
2014-03-10 04:23:04 PM  
The maintenance issues... Well, they are self driving. No reason for you to sit in the waiting room of the dealership while they perform routine maintenance. And since I predict the first generation will all be leased ala EV1 I bet there will be a maintenance contract on them that excludes the leasee from doing anything other than fill the gas tank and tires as directed by the computer.
 
2014-03-10 04:24:23 PM  

ikanreed: LasersHurt: The former can still have their own, and the latter is wildly overblown. People, as a whole, aren't just shiatting willy-nilly in things.

I don't disagree, but it only takes one shiat-ladden robo-taxi to ruin your day.


I bet you can call another and send that one back to the depot. At least I would assume so, this is all hypothetical. Inconvenient, sure, but not something I suspect would happen often.
 
2014-03-10 04:42:10 PM  
Then you can just try walking on your hands! Then you could use your feet for high fives, and ...eatin' sandwiches... and, you know, the important stuff.
 
2014-03-10 04:49:39 PM  

MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.


I'm thinking joystick is next.

img.fark.net
Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even notice the joysticks gone too.
 
2014-03-10 05:17:50 PM  
way south:

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Is that a collective on the left? Looks more like a helicopter...
 
2014-03-10 05:24:40 PM  
Google is testing their self driving car here in the Tampa bay area.

My understanding is that at this point, the technical issues have been solved.  It's the social and legal issues that are nightmares.

Socially, there is the issue of adoption.  People feel safer if they or someone they know are driving than if a computer is.  Sadly, the opposite appears to be true.  We would all be far safer & face less congestion if the computers were driving.  Nothing in our evolutionary background prepared us to hurl down highways at insane speeds while encased in a ton of metal.

Legally, there is the question of who is at fault if the car crashes.  If Google and other companies are open to class action law suits from anyone involved in a wreck, then its not worth it to them to roll out the technology, as there are a LOT of car wrecks, and we'd all pile on the gravy train.

Right at the boundary are cultural habits.  For example, in the US, we assume that many traffic regulations are there to increase local revenue through fines instead of for our protection; we ignore the regulations when we can get away with it.  But companies like Google have to design their vehicles to obey the law as written.  So Google's car doesn't speed, but other drivers get mad at it for being so slow.

Long story short, the problem isn't the technology, the problem is us.
 
2014-03-10 05:26:41 PM  
Texting out pics of their dick with a little sombrero on it.
 
2014-03-10 05:27:44 PM  
I saw a texting/e-mailing executive-lookin-type moron take his passenger side mirror off today.  He was weaving around so bad that I backed off more than my usual distance because I as sure he was going to hit somebody or something and if he hit somebody I was going to wait for the cops and write out a statement for them.

On the same note, a few weeks ago I saw a woman texting (or dialing) pull out in front of a texting (or dialing) dude and he damned near rear ended her.  I would have loved to have filled out a statement and attended any court sessions.
 
2014-03-10 05:34:03 PM  
My wife would make me play Scrabble, so no.
 
2014-03-10 05:52:20 PM  

Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.


Every time we have one of these threads we get people saying "it's not going to happen"

In fact, most completely misunderstand how quickly the tech is evolving.

Seven years ago, futurists were confidently predicting that truck driving was an example of a blue collar job that would never be threatened by computers.

Now, you have self-drive cars on the German autobahns  Link

You won't get a vote on this. Insurers will at first preferentially favor cars with black boxes, then the fully controlled ones.

Legislators will realize that they can pack far more cars onto motorways if all self-drive (and so reduce need for new roads), so they will set laws and permits to encourage this
 
2014-03-10 05:58:09 PM  

Voiceofreason01: and one of those cars is going to be bought by a man named Ken. Now those cars are going to need quite a bit of maintenance, being delicate and complex machines which isn't going to stop Ken from thinking that he can do that delicate repair work himself. So there you are, sitting back, enjoy a nice cup of coffee and the newspaper(or FARK) on your way to work in your self-drive car and in the back of your mind you'll know that somewhere on the highway around you is Ken, in his car with it's bald tires and slipshod, amateur repairs.


Power-on tests would determine that "auto-drive" cannot function safely, and disable it until Ken drives his lazy ass to a mechanic and get it fixed right.
 
2014-03-10 05:59:49 PM  

mjjt: Legislators will realize that they can pack far more cars onto motorways if all self-drive (and so reduce need for new roads), so they will set laws and permits to encourage this


Actually, if they had an automated system, and wired all of the freeways, it would be interesting. Expensive, but interesting. Just got done reading Job: A Comedy of Justice by Heinlein, and in one of his timelines, that's basically what the US had. They were highways that didn't allow pedestrians, and had computer controlled systems, so the cars didn't really 'auto-drive' as much as they were fed into the system at speed and when there was a spot. You could still take control whenever you wanted, but it's one of the ideas that has been tossed around for awhile now, more of an automated roadway with drone cars than independent robots. It would cost a mint, but it would really be the best way to do this hands-off driving.
 
2014-03-10 06:52:00 PM  

mjjt: Seven years ago, futurists were confidently predicting that truck driving was an example of a blue collar job that would never be threatened by computers.


I think trucks will be the first wide-spread use of self-driving technology. Truck drivers are expensive enough that replacing them makes sense, especially with something that can drive 24 hours a day only stopping for fuel.
 
2014-03-10 06:56:30 PM  

way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even notice the joysticks gone too.


No way in hell. Ever try a driving game with a joystick?
Simply put: wrong tool.
 
2014-03-10 06:58:59 PM  
The biggest problem with automated cars is that they obey the posted speed limits.
 
2014-03-10 07:03:09 PM  

Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even notice the joysticks gone too.

No way in hell. Ever try a driving game with a joystick?
Simply put: wrong tool.


Standard video game controller would work well enough.
 
2014-03-10 07:12:14 PM  

serial_crusher: Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even notice the joysticks gone too.

No way in hell. Ever try a driving game with a joystick?
Simply put: wrong tool.

Standard video game controller would work well enough.


Nope. Not enough analog travel.
Look at how twitchy remote control cars are. Now imagine that @80 mph.
Look at the replay in any racing game, you'll see your wheels twitching from straight to all the way turned as you tap tap tap.
Tested this with Dirt 2 on pc. My Saitek Flight Yoke beats joystick or game pad hands down.

Yes I use a flight yoke, already have one for FSX with pedals and all and don't see a point in buying an expensive wheel.
 
2014-03-10 07:34:47 PM  

Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even ...




Viper racing with a Microsoft force feedback stick.
It was actually not that bad, but this isn't the point. People won't be driving much at all when autopilot takes off. Parking and navigating off-road on occasion, but rarely highway.

To that end you can have any kind of input device.
Since many cars have a spot for a stick, and it's familiar to users, I think it's a ready made solution.
 
2014-03-10 07:37:26 PM  
Computers are may not be 100% reliable, but they are more reliable than people.
 
2014-03-10 08:06:06 PM  
34,080 deaths in 2012 due to motor vehicle accidents.

Dunno what the total cost to insurance companies was in 2012, but if reducing fatalities isn't going to convince us to stop driving like impatient idiots, then the insurance companies will probably price manually-operated cars out of reach of most everyone.
 
2014-03-10 08:08:24 PM  

way south: Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, people might not even ...



Viper racing with a Microsoft force feedback stick.
It was actually not that bad, but this isn't the point. People won't be driving much at all when autopilot takes off. Parking and navigating off-road on occasion, but rarely highway.

To that end you can have any kind of input device.
Since many cars have a spot for a stick, and it's familiar to users, I think it's a ready made solution.


Think about the physics of a tight turn where you are almost pulling 1g. Unless you are in a 5 point racing harness you are holding onto your steering wheel for support. Try that with a joystick.
 
2014-03-10 08:31:18 PM  
No matter what.. What I do know is that no matter what happens there will be a reason for it to cost more to drive.
 
2014-03-10 09:17:43 PM  

Luse: way south: Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, peopl ...


img.fark.net

I doubt it will be a problem. 
Besides, you still aren't driving. So if  your google car is pulling a 1g turn on the morning commute, you should probably call the dealership.

The peripheral is just a remnant for the few moments that the car can't handle a situation by itself.
 
2014-03-10 09:47:31 PM  
In the event of an imminent collision, the car will probably turn control over to the distracted driver... to crash.

//Liability will be a problem
//Law Suuuuiiits
 
2014-03-10 10:25:55 PM  

way south: Luse: way south: Luse: way south: MindStalker: Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: serial_crusher: [media1.break.com image 650x366]
sitting in a driver's seat with your hands on your knees while the steering wheel ghostly rotates itself?  Has anybody thought this through?  Putting me in that position forces me to pay attention to what's happening on the road and defeats the benefits of having an autonomous car.  And you just know the average person is going to hit the manual override too readily, then cause an accident themselves.

Well, it's only a design concept with limited usage at this point. Besides, what's supposed to happen to the steering wheel? TFA states that the Mercedes tech is currently only approved for low speed driving. They kinda need the wheel the rest of the time. I'm sure as the tech gets expanded to include a truly autonomous car, the steering wheel would retract or something.

If you have drive by wire, which is where everything is going, and the steering wheel runs a hall effect sensor instead of a mechanical linkage, there is no reason to need the wheel to turn during autonomous mode.

Wheel will probably be there in some form for a long time, it may even fold up out of the way when you don't need it. For certain roads like dirt roads you'll probably need to drive yourself, but even then it will be assisted. Think of it like riding a horse, you suggest to the horse where you want to go, but you generally can't tell a horse to walk off a cliff.

I'm thinking joystick is next.


Small, out of the way, and  it frees up alot of space for an input device you'll rarely use.

The big hurdle now is keeping this tech from being lawsuited out of existence.  So expect it will come first as an autopilot with a little check box that says you're responsible for everything the program does.
Then, as the systems get better and people realize human drivers suck, its the insurance companies will probably lead the charge in removing the steering wheel.

After a few years, ...


How convenient then that you left out my entire response, the one that includes the words "unless you are wearing a 5 point harness". That pilot is fastened to that airframe and you damned well know it.
 Are you dishonest or just stupid?


Sample scenario: Your typical granny or soccer mom holding an iphone to one side of her face while clutching a joystick in the other. She makes a sharp right turn to avoid the bicycle she didn't see because of her stupid iPhone. Her whole body gets jerked left as a reaction, that means the hand that's holding the joystick as well. Joystick goes left, so does the car, right into the bicycle she tried to avoid.
Keep in mind, there are people that kill church and Sunday market goers because they can't figure out which is the brake pedal.
 
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