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(The New Republic)   Finally, someone is speaking out against the cruel, cruel stereotyping our society has applied to Vikings   (newrepublic.com) divider line 82
    More: Unlikely, Vikings, Old Norse, Constantinople, byzantine emperors, political structure, British Museum  
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3792 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Mar 2014 at 1:33 PM (27 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-10 01:34:16 PM
so they weren't so horny?
 
2014-03-10 01:34:58 PM
Everybody knows the real reason why the Viking vanished is they killed the sheep and raped the women
 
2014-03-10 01:35:46 PM

Smeggy Smurf: Everybody knows the real reason why the Viking vanished is they killed the sheep and raped the women


Derp, killed the women and raped the sheep.

/need a snicker's bar
 
2014-03-10 01:35:54 PM
Hang people on trees, stab them with spears, feed their remains to crows: not fake.
 
2014-03-10 01:36:22 PM
Sure, the Norse had a rich, full culture and peaceful, idyllic lives when they weren't out visiting the neighbours...and if they'd bothered to share that with the rest of Western Europe, we wouldn't think of them as brutal, barbaric raiders.

When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.
 
2014-03-10 01:36:55 PM
They didn't come from the land of ice and snow?
 
2014-03-10 01:37:30 PM
So, they don't really like techno?
 
2014-03-10 01:38:01 PM

Smeggy Smurf: killed the women and raped the sheep.


farking sheeple
 
2014-03-10 01:38:21 PM

the cruel, cruel stereotyping our society has applied to Vikings


Unjustified charges of vandalism?
 
2014-03-10 01:38:56 PM

Ambitwistor: They didn't come from the land of ice and snow?


From the midnight sun where the hot springs flow?
 
2014-03-10 01:39:56 PM
wasn't Viking more of a lable than a people, always having negative connotations? Two armies fighting with each calling the other "Viking?"
 
2014-03-10 01:40:10 PM

Englebert Slaptyback: the cruel, cruel stereotyping our society has applied to Vikings


Unjustified charges of vandalism?


Those are the Vandals. TOTALLY different. The Vikings are the ones who can't win a Super Bowl.
 
2014-03-10 01:40:21 PM
It's not a stereotype, it's the truth.

Sex cruise.
 
2014-03-10 01:41:59 PM
www.nflpassers.com
 
2014-03-10 01:42:45 PM
Is this calling all Norse peoples "vikings"? Because that's taking one small group of people in a culture and ascribing their traits to everyone else, who didn't go a viking.

Personally I think they should be celebrated for their violence. They were successful, so stop trying to write out their violence. Historical violence is good fun. It stopped being fun in 1914. There's a 100 year point where historical violence just becomes violence. Maybe it's more, but not much more. Or perhaps it's just the mechanisation of warfare that makes it no longer good fun.
 
2014-03-10 01:43:16 PM
Vateffer coult choo mean?
static3.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2014-03-10 01:43:46 PM

wingnut396: So, they don't really like techno?


Making the comment, but not the picture?
bowiestie.files.wordpress.com
/oblig
 
2014-03-10 01:45:19 PM
i199.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-10 01:46:10 PM
api.ning.com

This is the Viking

Viking don't care, Viking don't give a shiat, Viking takes what it wants.
 
2014-03-10 01:47:38 PM
FTFA:

Above all, Vikings were not just viewed by the early-medieval British as enemies but as enemies of an especially dreadful kind: the epitome of barbarism and heathendom. All of historians' source material for their early impact on Britain was written by the victims, who emphasised the wanton lack of restraint with which the Vikings plundered Christian churches and killed their clergy and the cruelty with which they ravaged settlements and farms. They flouted every rule of conduct that the European Christendom of the time had developed, precariously, to limit human savagery.

So, aside from the wanton rape and murder, the church burning and the sudden descent on farms and monasteries with fire and sword, what have the Vikings ever done to us?
 
2014-03-10 01:47:46 PM

Arkanaut: Englebert Slaptyback: the cruel, cruel stereotyping our society has applied to Vikings


Unjustified charges of vandalism?

Those are the Vandals. TOTALLY different. The Vikings are the ones who can't win a Super Bowl.


The University of Idaho Vandals can't win anything.  Most HS teams could beat them
 
2014-03-10 01:48:01 PM

zulius: wingnut396: So, they don't really like techno?

Making the comment, but not the picture?
[bowiestie.files.wordpress.com image 350x449]
/oblig


Fark ate the gif I had linked...
 
2014-03-10 01:49:35 PM

Bondith: Sure, the Norse had a rich, full culture and peaceful, idyllic lives when they weren't out visiting the neighbours...and if they'd bothered to share that with the rest of Western Europe, we wouldn't think of them as brutal, barbaric raiders.

When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.


This is a really strange sentiment in modern times. Do you have a problem with Vikings?

Do you think their only cultural impact was the violence, and was this a bad thing? The way you framed yourself as a victim of these long dead people is fascinating to me. Do you have a cultural memory of past abuses?

Personally I think vikings are rad as fark and way more interesting than their European contemporaries, but I admit I have problems with the lasting impact of Dark Age Christendom and the culture it created. Do you have similar problems with Vikings?
 
2014-03-10 01:50:33 PM
This thread needs more football humor.
 
2014-03-10 01:50:37 PM
So ... they don't like spam?
 
2014-03-10 01:52:41 PM

Smeggy Smurf: Arkanaut: Englebert Slaptyback: the cruel, cruel stereotyping our society has applied to Vikings


Unjustified charges of vandalism?

Those are the Vandals. TOTALLY different. The Vikings are the ones who can't win a Super Bowl.

The University of Idaho Vandals can't win anything.  Most HS teams could beat them


In their heyday, they conquered Rome's Africa Colony, held it for more than 100 years and sacked Rome. You can't judge a program just on recent results.
 
2014-03-10 01:52:41 PM
...another Viking thread.   So soon?
 
2014-03-10 01:53:00 PM
Carl supported the Viking mission:

public.media.smithsonianmag.com

Can you trust Neil now?
 
2014-03-10 01:56:44 PM

Slaxl: Personally I think they should be celebrated for their violence. They were successful, so stop trying to write out their violence. Historical violence is good fun. It stopped being fun in 1914. There's a 100 year point where historical violence just becomes violence. Maybe it's more, but not much more. Or perhaps it's just the mechanisation of warfare that makes it no longer good fun.


I agree that we shouldn't whitewash their violence, but I think it's important to understand other aspects of their society, at the very least to see what made them so successful at violence.
 
2014-03-10 01:57:29 PM
No subby, we still choke when it matters.

And scare off waitresses on boats with dildos when it doesn't.

/SKOL
 
2014-03-10 01:57:39 PM
oh and the stories they told

the blood eagle - where u axe the victim in the back so that the lungs pop out    looks like bloody wings

the raven that wanted to be human and landed at a farmstead
snip
the man of the house cut off its wings and gave it to his boy as a toy

others but long forgot
 
2014-03-10 01:58:28 PM

Bondith: Sure, the Norse had a rich, full culture and peaceful, idyllic lives when they weren't out visiting the neighbours...and if they'd bothered to share that with the rest of Western Europe, we wouldn't think of them as brutal, barbaric raiders.

When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.


Like the Romans?
 
2014-03-10 01:59:15 PM

Bondith: When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.


www.californiaindianeducation.org
 
2014-03-10 01:59:40 PM

nerftaig: Bondith: Sure, the Norse had a rich, full culture and peaceful, idyllic lives when they weren't out visiting the neighbours...and if they'd bothered to share that with the rest of Western Europe, we wouldn't think of them as brutal, barbaric raiders.

When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.

This is a really strange sentiment in modern times. Do you have a problem with Vikings?

Do you think their only cultural impact was the violence, and was this a bad thing?


Be definition, a viking's cultural impact was the violence. "Viking" being essentially a synonym for "pirate".
 
2014-03-10 02:00:19 PM

Smeggy Smurf: Smeggy Smurf: Everybody knows the real reason why the Viking vanished is they killed the sheep and raped the women

Derp, killed the women and raped the sheep.

/need a snicker's bar


And pruned the hedges of many small villagers?
 
2014-03-10 02:00:26 PM

kvinesknows: Bondith: When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.

[www.californiaindianeducation.org image 500x375]


Those guys drove the Vikings out...
 
2014-03-10 02:02:23 PM

This text is now purple: kvinesknows: Bondith: When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.

[www.californiaindianeducation.org image 500x375]

Those guys drove the Vikings out...


god damn Fighting Sioux ...
 
2014-03-10 02:04:08 PM
Did I mention in the last thread-- if you like Vikings, Bernard Cornwell has some really interesting books out involving the wars between the Vikings and those who became the English.  Cornwell is best known for his Sharpe series, which funny enough I found boring-- but his other stuff is really good.  He claims to have found Viking ancestry, which is likely enough for a Brit, I suppose; anyway, that was what started his research and writing in this area.

Good stuff.

*wanders off*
 
2014-03-10 02:04:50 PM

uber humper: wasn't Viking more of a lable than a people, always having negative connotations? Two armies fighting with each calling the other "Viking?"


Viking was a verb.  To go a-viking was to go pillaging in boats.

As said above, not all the Norse were Vikings.  Many were farmers and fishermen, many traded through Russia and Europe, many settled and intermarried in Britain etc.  And many were exactly the looting, raping, village-burning pirates that we think of.

There's a reason why the most famous prayer of the age was: "from the fury of the Northmen, good Lord, deliver us."
 
2014-03-10 02:07:00 PM

uber humper: wasn't Viking more of a lable than a people, always having negative connotations? Two armies fighting with each calling the other "Viking?"


Viking was an activity not a people.

Viking was the activity of raiding and pillaging... so yes, more a label than a people.

Its like many years from now amateur historians may think the US was invade by a tribe of people called the hipsters in the 21st century.

They will think the hipsters were a tribe native to California and conquered people over America.
 
2014-03-10 02:07:38 PM
nerftaig:

 The way you framed yourself as a victim of these long dead people is fascinating to me. Do you have a cultural memory of past abuses?

I will pay you one million Bison dollars if you use this line in a debate with an Afro-American studies scholar/student.
 
2014-03-10 02:08:39 PM
The Norse are a very particular culture, because all that wanton sacking, rape and murder, comes from the fact that they lived in a very harsh land.

Harsh lands breed harsh people, sometimes.

However, the Norse did trade as much as they pillaged. From the Greeks, to the Kievian Rus, the different peoples under the Umayyad Caliphate, and the Byzantines often traded with then; in the case of the Byzantines, they employed Norse/Kievian Rus/Saxons as mercenaries, to the point that that the Emperor had his own group of Norse warriors as his private guard, the Varangian Guard (Reading about them makes me wonder why has there been no movie about the Varangian Guard). They were known as both fearsome warriors and as drunken louts (nicknamed "The Emperor's Winebags" by the rest of the Byzantine troops).

The Norse were also great sailors (just ask the Thule people that kicked them out, twice), and famed explorers.
 
2014-03-10 02:10:59 PM
What's everyone's Viking problem?
 
2014-03-10 02:11:34 PM
This text is now purple:

Be definition, a viking's cultural impact was the violence. "Viking" being essentially a synonym for "pirate".

By definition, that is a nonsense statement. It is not self evident that a bunch of norsemen who farked shiat up didnt leave any cultural impact behind and vanished liked ghosts into history, only leaving bodies in their wake. That is just untrue.

I assume you mean that the vikings were a destructing force, and their cultural impact came only through what they destroyed. This is overly simplistic. By definition.
 
2014-03-10 02:11:43 PM
www.history.com
lh6.googleusercontent.com

Vikings had really bad hairdos?
 
2014-03-10 02:16:04 PM

nerftaig: Bondith: Sure, the Norse had a rich, full culture and peaceful, idyllic lives when they weren't out visiting the neighbours...and if they'd bothered to share that with the rest of Western Europe, we wouldn't think of them as brutal, barbaric raiders.

When the only contact someone has with you is you massacring civilians, stealing all their stuff and then burning down the church, they tend to get a fairly negative impression.

This is a really strange sentiment in modern times. Do you have a problem with Vikings?


I have a problem with piracy, but the point I was trying to make is that while people today complain that the viking raiders were misunderstood, they didn't really make an effort to help everyone else understand them.  I...may have gotten a little more invested in it than a typical academic would have.

Do you think their only cultural impact was the violence, and was this a bad thing? The way you framed yourself as a victim of these long dead people is fascinating to me. Do you have a cultural memory of past abuses?

I've got an Irish surname, so...yes (kinda - never underestimate the Irish capacity to hold onto a grudge).  Granted, Danish raiders became Danish settlers that founded Ireland's first true cities, but then we kicked their ass*

Personally I think vikings are rad as fark...

"rad"?  How old are you?  I said that when I was 9, and that was more years ago than I care to admit.

* - and by "kicked their ass" I mean "they got involved in Ireland's never-ending hundred-sided civil war and picked the wrong side"
 
2014-03-10 02:16:49 PM
How soft your fields so green, can whisper tales of gore,
Of how we calmed the tides of war.
 
2014-03-10 02:20:53 PM

ikanreed: Hang people on trees, stab them with spears, feed their remains to crows: not fake.


So you've got a problem with religious/cultural traditions practiced in such a manner as to support the local ecology?
 
2014-03-10 02:23:09 PM

Fano: Smeggy Smurf: Smeggy Smurf: Everybody knows the real reason why the Viking vanished is they killed the sheep and raped the women

Derp, killed the women and raped the sheep.

/need a snicker's bar

And pruned the hedges of many small villagers?


like these guys! They are funny guys!
 
2014-03-10 02:24:02 PM
Bondith:
* - and by "kicked their ass" I mean "they got involved in Ireland's never-ending hundred-sided civil war and picked the wrong side"

There was an actual right side?
I thought it was basically the same thing as Scotland went through- neverending small-scale warfare practiced by the Scots against their hereditary enemies, the Scots.
 
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