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(New York Daily News)   Tennessee pastor sets up website for disgruntled waitstaff to share stories about how Christians are terrible tippers who don't leave the proper 20% minimum   (nydailynews.com) divider line 342
    More: Hero, rude behavior, Easter Sunday  
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11864 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Mar 2014 at 8:18 PM (29 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-09 03:34:26 AM

another cultural observer: rustypouch: Tipping thread?

I'll just leave this here.

[img.fark.net image 576x835]

Upon being seated, I tell the waiter or girl version of a waiter (for a dinner expected to cost $35.00 for two): "Your tipping period begins now.  Your amount, at this time, is $20.00.  I want a water with lemon slice within 1 minute.  We both want wine now.  I want my salad in 5 minutes.  I want my dinner in twenty minutes.  I want the bill on my table with my salad.  I want my drink re-filled before I need it, and without asking.  If you put customers with children under the age of 8 around me, your tip is immediately cut in half.  Also, you are not to speak to me."


Gives them something to aspire to.  You know, motivation to do a good job and really earn it.


I absolutely cannot abide chatty servers. We can be civil, but it's none of the server's business "how I'm doing" and since when did adults (men AND women) become "guys" as in, "Can I get you guys a cocktail before dinner?" I know they mean well though, so it doesn't affect the tip. I'm pretty generous; I was a waiter for three years and loved it.

Honest mistakes? No problem.
Rudeness? That's a stiffin'.
 
2014-03-09 03:38:05 AM

TomD9938: another cultural observer: Upon being seated, I tell the waiter or girl version of a waiter (for a dinner expected to cost $35.00 for two): "Your tipping period begins now.  Your amount, at this time, is $20.00.  I want a water with lemon slice within 1 minute.  We both want wine now.  I want my salad in 5 minutes.  I want my dinner in twenty minutes.  I want the bill on my table with my salad.  I want my drink re-filled before I need it, and without asking.  If you put customers with children under the age of 8 around me, your tip is immediately cut in half.  Also, you are not to speak to me."


Gives them something to aspire to.  You know, motivation to do a good job and really earn it.


I'm fairly tall and will hold a ten dollar bill over a servers head and let them keep it if they've got the vertical to reach it within three tries.  It's good fun for my guests and (Im guessing) the staff as well.

If they did a good job they get 10% too, so the $10.00 is pure bonus.


If you're not trolling, this makes you a complete asshole.
 
2014-03-09 03:46:48 AM

superdude72: From the article:
Roberts said that his church members are planning to write out apologies to every single poster. They will also send a server a Food City gift card that can be used for groceries or gas.

A GIFT CARD?! The message received is, "Not all Christians are condescending assholes. And by the way, your lowly status in society means you can't be trusted with cash."


Oh, unclench, libtard. What are they supposed to do, send cash in the mail? The card is for groceries or gas. Do you know ANYONE who doesn't spend money on either of those things? The man is trying to do something actually Christian and you're busting his balls? Really? What a dick.
 
2014-03-09 04:08:38 AM

slotz: I absolutely cannot abide chatty servers. We can be civil, but it's none of the server's business "how I'm doing" and since when did adults (men AND women) become "guys" as in, "Can I get you guys a cocktail before dinner?" I know they mean well though, so it doesn't affect the tip. I'm pretty generous; I was a waiter for three years and loved it.

Honest mistakes? No problem.
Rudeness? That's a stiffin'.


So you like punitive reinforcement? Relax. They're just doing a job to make some money, not give the invisible hand a dutch rudder. It's called "going out to dinner" not "I'll go wherever you want". If they don't do their job well, go somewhere else. Rand PAUL!
 
2014-03-09 04:11:30 AM

Farker Soze: Sliding Carp: "I give God ten percent, why do you get 18," Missouri pastor   in lieu of a tip for a party of 10.

Oh, I don't know -- maybe because God won't spit in your biscuits and gravy?

I doubt she gives God 10%. More likely she gives to a shady middleman,  or to herself, being one of those middlemen and all. Me, I have an agreement directly with God; anything he needs, 10%, 20%, 100% or whatever, he can magic out of my bank account whenever he likes. So far he's been really cool and hasn't needed one penny.


when i feed hungry people at the shelter or outreach, i consider that giving to god.
 
2014-03-09 04:14:12 AM

Fista-Phobia: slotz: I absolutely cannot abide chatty servers. We can be civil, but it's none of the server's business "how I'm doing" and since when did adults (men AND women) become "guys" as in, "Can I get you guys a cocktail before dinner?" I know they mean well though, so it doesn't affect the tip. I'm pretty generous; I was a waiter for three years and loved it.

Honest mistakes? No problem.
Rudeness? That's a stiffin'.

So you like punitive reinforcement? Relax. They're just doing a job to make some money, not give the invisible hand a dutch rudder. It's called "going out to dinner" not "I'll go wherever you want". If they don't do their job well, go somewhere else. Rand PAUL!


You reward rudeness? You're drunk and you didn't read my post. Sleep it off and get back to me.
 
2014-03-09 04:20:24 AM

slotz: Fista-Phobia: slotz: I absolutely cannot abide chatty servers. We can be civil, but it's none of the server's business "how I'm doing" and since when did adults (men AND women) become "guys" as in, "Can I get you guys a cocktail before dinner?" I know they mean well though, so it doesn't affect the tip. I'm pretty generous; I was a waiter for three years and loved it.

Honest mistakes? No problem.
Rudeness? That's a stiffin'.

So you like punitive reinforcement? Relax. They're just doing a job to make some money, not give the invisible hand a dutch rudder. It's called "going out to dinner" not "I'll go wherever you want". If they don't do their job well, go somewhere else. Rand PAUL!

You reward rudeness? You're drunk and you didn't read my post. Sleep it off and get back to me.


Nope. I do surmise that if the wait staff is being rude to you, I suspect you work hard for comps. Point is, you most likely brought it on yourself OR you kick it at The Sizzler and DEMAND SATISFACTION!
 
2014-03-09 04:25:51 AM
I have waited tables before...... at a few places.

I had an Australian customer when I worked in a casino restaurant in Las Vegas. He tried to tell me that I should move to Australia where they would pay me a living wage between $15-$20.

He didn't believe me that because of tips, I made just under $50 an hour.

/this has not been my experience (financially) everywhere that I've waited tables however.
 
2014-03-09 04:29:12 AM

Sammichless: I had an Australian customer when I worked in a casino restaurant in Las Vegas. He tried to tell me that I should move to Australia where they would pay me a living wage between $15-$20.


booksbrainsandbeer.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-03-09 04:42:08 AM

Fista-Phobia: slotz: Fista-Phobia: slotz: I absolutely cannot abide chatty servers. We can be civil, but it's none of the server's business "how I'm doing" and since when did adults (men AND women) become "guys" as in, "Can I get you guys a cocktail before dinner?" I know they mean well though, so it doesn't affect the tip. I'm pretty generous; I was a waiter for three years and loved it.

Honest mistakes? No problem.
Rudeness? That's a stiffin'.

So you like punitive reinforcement? Relax. They're just doing a job to make some money, not give the invisible hand a dutch rudder. It's called "going out to dinner" not "I'll go wherever you want". If they don't do their job well, go somewhere else. Rand PAUL!

You reward rudeness? You're drunk and you didn't read my post. Sleep it off and get back to me.

Nope. I do surmise that if the wait staff is being rude to you, I suspect you work hard for comps. Point is, you most likely brought it on yourself OR you kick it at The Sizzler and DEMAND SATISFACTION!


Wrong again, amigo. Have you ever waited tables? I have, and loved it, as I said. I guess we just don't agree on what constitutes rudeness. I'm a very gracious customer because I know what it's like to wait tables. Everyone should have to do it for a year. It's a real education.
 
2014-03-09 06:00:03 AM

umad: When did the minimum become 20%?


Exactly?

I tip 20% on average, but if the service is terrible its 10-15%.
 
2014-03-09 06:34:42 AM

Sammichless: I have waited tables before...... at a few places.

I had an Australian customer when I worked in a casino restaurant in Las Vegas. He tried to tell me that I should move to Australia where they would pay me a living wage between $15-$20.

He didn't believe me that because of tips, I made just under $50 an hour.

/this has not been my experience (financially) everywhere that I've waited tables however.


You don't get good service anywhere in Australia, and it has nothing to do with tipping or the lack of it.

Australians are proud and aggressive, and see service work as a form of submission and thus beneath them.  The only thing an Australian wait staff is thinking off when they serve you is how to prove by acts of hostility and neglect that they are in now way below anyone despite their profession.

If you came to Australia and actually provided good service, you'd likely drown in tips because customers here are so unaccustomed to it.
 
2014-03-09 07:00:56 AM
If you think you're entitled to some overinflated tip scale simply because you chose to be a waiter/waitress, you really need to reflect on where your life went wrong.

Don't like relying on tips?  Get a different job.

/ worked at Chi-Chi's for 4 months and moved on. Maybe you should too.
 
2014-03-09 07:18:10 AM

rustypouch: The Southern Dandy: rustypouch: Tipping thread?

I'll just leave this here.

If you intend to give me inadequate service or spit in my food because I don't tip, then you have to tell me before I'm seated.  That way I can spend my money somewhere else.

You are aware that if you don't tip, you're costing the server money?

I don't think anyone would feel bad if the they don't have the pleasure of working for you.


 I'll need to copy this for all the other times I meant to post in a tipping thread. (That didn't involve cows).

I have worked in the service industry my entire life. I have no idea where some of you have worked; but at no time, anywhere, ever have I seen anyone "REALLY" do anything to a customers food/drink. Sure...it's a running joke joke. Really though? I would make sure that person didn't even finish the shift.

 If you don't tip, you most likely ARE costing your server $.  They usually have to tip out an arbitrary amount. Maybe 3% of their sales. Servers are generally paid minimum wage (sometimes less). The picture posted I'm going to use in the future. You take the job and the pay, under the assumption, that with great performance can reap great rewards. It does usually.

  We talked about this at work tonight a bit. You remember the customers who tip. The priority for serving him/her in your section is WAY at the top. Someone you've never seen before or don't recall? it's your job do the best you can and make them happy (It's still your friggen job no matter what). Someone you don't like or doesn't tip. The attitude is just "meh". Not good or bad.....and that's kinda the service they get. Just  "whatever".  That's kind of the reality at any place I've worked. It's not so much that today your server cares.....are you going back though. You WILL be remembered, and you will likely get the service you deserve. Quite frankly if you don't tip, or can't? Stay home, order a pizza.

  That may ruffle a feather or two. "The service you deserve."   Correct.  You deserve the absolute best possible! If you do not get it, then do not pay for it, and PLEASE let your server know why! This may be a shock, but constructive criticism works. I guarantee the next time your in it will be amazing. If the service was excellent? PAY for it. He/she will never forget and you can count on them trying even harder your next visit.

  We don't go out too often, but it is generally to one of the same 4-5 places. I tip a bit more than maybe I should. If I couldn't afford to, then I'd stay home. I will tell you. The service is never anything less than stunning.
/Granted, I don't eat at Denny's though
//unless it's breakfast on the road.
///McD's is a more likely road breakfast.
 
2014-03-09 07:27:30 AM

blipponaut: Can we just get rid of the tipping system? Pay people a liveable wage while simultaneously getting rid of obnoxious dining experiences where overly happy-to-see waitstaff try to upsell you extra cheese on your cheese sticks.


But how can we be more like the Europeans if we don't tip or drink bottled water ?
 
2014-03-09 07:39:58 AM

somemoron: And that. How about just giving people living wages. Not making millionaires or anything, just something better than 'supplement your income here with food stamps'. Frankly, it's enlightened self-interest. Better pay gets you better attitude, better attitude gets you better performance.


B-b-b-but think of those poor stockholders. You don't want them to get their dividends?
They work so hard all day, pushing those stacks of paper and wielding those extremely heavy pens to sign their names,  Such hard work,
 
2014-03-09 07:40:06 AM

another cultural observer: rustypouch: Tipping thread?

I'll just leave this here.

[img.fark.net image 576x835]

Upon being seated, I tell the waiter or girl version of a waiter (for a dinner expected to cost $35.00 for two): "Your tipping period begins now.  Your amount, at this time, is $20.00.  I want a water with lemon slice within 1 minute.  We both want wine now.  I want my salad in 5 minutes.  I want my dinner in twenty minutes.  I want the bill on my table with my salad.  I want my drink re-filled before I need it, and without asking.  If you put customers with children under the age of 8 around me, your tip is immediately cut in half.  Also, you are not to speak to me."


Gives them something to aspire to.  You know, motivation to do a good job and really earn it.


You're a pretty unbearable person, aren't you.
 
2014-03-09 08:01:01 AM
The 20% minimum is only there for very bad service. The going rate now is around 1/3, which rounds up to 35% or so for average service. Ideally pleasant waiters should get ~45% or just an even 50%.
 
2014-03-09 08:32:48 AM
I always tip at least 25 percent.

And the worse the service, the more I tip.

I feel a kinship with those who do a bad job.
 
2014-03-09 09:07:06 AM

Stuart Wolfe: Although my parents taught me a trick when I was a teenager: always keep a penny in your wallet for the rare occasion when your waiter is completely incompetent - because if they do a terrible job and you leave nothing, they can just assume that you forgot the tip, but placing a penny on the table is a neat way to tell them they were terrible.


You know what's an even better way to let them know? Simply write "no tip, terrible service" on your bill. But the best way, they way that will really have the most and best impact, is to speak with the hostess (or Maitre' D, or manager) on your way out and tell them that your service was terrible, and give the tip to them with the instructions that it be given to the kitchen staff (assuming the food was good. If the food and service were both terrible, don't bother).

That way, the shiatty server gets what he deserves - both on the way of a tip as well as the necessity of explaining it to his boss - and the people running the place know that you're not one of those jerkoffs who stiffs the staff. It also allows for the unlikely  possibility that the server might have a damned good reason for whatever actually happened that you don't know, and will still be able get some portion of that tip (if appropriate) when he is forced to explain it all to the boss.
 
2014-03-09 09:17:47 AM

Albinoman: bboy: Fluid: Servers are allowed to bypass minimum wage requirements? Strange. May I ask how a rule like that came to be?

Assuming you're not in the U.S... "Minimum Wage" for waitstaff in the U.S. is like $2.30 an hour or so, forcing them to rely on tips to earn a living wage.  I do not know the history of that law.

That's just simply untrue. The law is that if your tips+wage does not add up to the normal minimum wage then your employer must make up the difference.


Not sure if trolling, but I'll bite anyway in case 1. You're serious or 2. Someone else out there might be convinced of this. Yes, it's the law. It's also nearly impossible for an employee as replaceable as a server in the U.S. to call an employer out on it. The power imbalance in that scenario is massive. Actually complying with the law means more effort and more expenditure on the restaurant's part, so guess what happens if they know they're not likely going to be held to account?

The entire tipping system needs to die. I know this is unlikely in the foreseeable future, but I'm on board. Pay servers a living wage and give people one actual, final-total bill for their meal out. The entire rest of the world can do it, why not North America?
 
2014-03-09 09:18:30 AM
For the Xtians who pull the 10% to God thing, you don't give 18% or 20% of your INCOME as tips, dumbass.  You're giving a percent of your actual bill.  The percentage of your income that goes to tips per year is probably miniscule.  If you're spending your ENTIRE INCOME on dining out and therefore 18-20% on tips then you might have to re-think all of your budgeting.

Stop being a cheap, entitled jerk and pay for your service.


/not a server and don't work for tips, but have employed many of them and seen/heard it all
 
2014-03-09 09:35:25 AM

super_grass: The 20% minimum is only there for very bad service. The going rate now is around 1/3, which rounds up to 35% or so for average service. Ideally pleasant waiters should get ~45% or just an even 50%.


You are high.
 
2014-03-09 09:44:43 AM
oh great, another tipping thread

obligatory post about living wage

obligatory post about snot in your soup

obligatory post about some off-topic csb

obligatory post about reforming the system

obligatory post about ha-ha i don't tip ever

obligatory post about ha-ha i tip every table in the house

goto 10
 
2014-03-09 09:47:07 AM

Farker Soze: Sliding Carp: "I give God ten percent, why do you get 18," Missouri pastor   in lieu of a tip for a party of 10.

Oh, I don't know -- maybe because God won't spit in your biscuits and gravy?

I doubt she gives God 10%. More likely she gives to a shady middleman,  or to herself, being one of those middlemen and all. Me, I have an agreement directly with God; anything he needs, 10%, 20%, 100% or whatever, he can magic out of my bank account whenever he likes. So far he's been really cool and hasn't needed one penny.


She only gives God 10% because she asked for eternal salvation and he brought her mediocre wine and stale bread.
 
2014-03-09 09:55:37 AM

Sliding Carp: "I give God ten percent, why do you get 18," Missouri pastor   in lieu of a tip for a party of 10.

Oh, I don't know -- maybe because God won't spit in your biscuits and gravy?


It's 10% like God gets, and the other 8% is for having to put up with people who don't now the difference between righteous and and self-righteous.
 
2014-03-09 09:59:32 AM

zepillin: Eponymous: Not many true wait staff on here....just a bunch of christian haters and this is how I can tell.....if I had a table of church women and a table of black women, 9 times out of 10 the church women would leave a better tip all things being equal.  It still may be a shiat tip....but the church women would at least leave something.

the black women ARE church women


That's racist.
 
2014-03-09 10:01:53 AM

Popular Opinion: Farker Soze: Sliding Carp: "I give God ten percent, why do you get 18," Missouri pastor   in lieu of a tip for a party of 10.

Oh, I don't know -- maybe because God won't spit in your biscuits and gravy?

I doubt she gives God 10%. More likely she gives to a shady middleman,  or to herself, being one of those middlemen and all. Me, I have an agreement directly with God; anything he needs, 10%, 20%, 100% or whatever, he can magic out of my bank account whenever he likes. So far he's been really cool and hasn't needed one penny.

when i feed hungry people at the shelter or outreach, i consider that giving to god.


Every time you forgive someone, you're giving to God.

Every time you give love and not hate, you're giving to God.

:)
 
2014-03-09 10:04:09 AM

Slagnasty: Fluid: rustypouch: Tipping thread?

I'll just leave this here.

[img.fark.net image 576x835]

Servers are allowed to bypass minimum wage requirements? Strange. May I ask how a rule like that came to be?

They figured the servers would be able to make up the difference in tips. In a good restaurant with customers who aren't walking pieces of garbage this is true. When you throw either a shiatty restaurant or farkhead customers into the mix the numbers don't add up anymore.


"They figured..." should read as "The Restaurant Association's caveat for supporting the first "minimum wage" law was that they would be exempted from it for wait staff. That's why tipping amounts increase over the years, because the amount of money wait staff gets paid hasnt budged in like 30 years and we have this thing called inflation.

It boils down to restaurant lobbies saying they cant afford it, but in a lot of places tipping is mandatory (because $2.30 is cruel), so patrons really can afford it, restaurant owners are just cheap bastards, and the indentured-servant business model is most appealing to them.

Tipping should be outlawed and wait staff should be paid a living wage.
 
2014-03-09 10:04:34 AM

Day_Old_Dutchie: somemoron: And that. How about just giving people living wages. Not making millionaires or anything, just something better than 'supplement your income here with food stamps'. Frankly, it's enlightened self-interest. Better pay gets you better attitude, better attitude gets you better performance.

B-b-b-but think of those poor stockholders. You don't want them to get their dividends?
They work so hard all day, pushing those stacks of paper and wielding those extremely heavy pens to sign their names,  Such hard work,


You sound poor.
 
2014-03-09 10:12:53 AM
fark obligation tips.  I'll leave a tip if I'm really impressed with someone's service, but I'm not going to do it out of pity for their third world wages or some sense of duty to seem like a good member of society.  The bottom line is that I don't care about anyone I don't know unless they provide me with some reason to, whether through association or action.  The difference between me and you is that I admit it freely and don't feel ashamed or embarrassed into lying about it to others.

If you want a tip, earn it by being exemplary.  You don't earn it by just being there, regardless of whether the social consensus says you do.  A tip is a bonus from me to you, and considering how hard it is to earn a bonus in any other industry I'm not inclined to feel anyone deserves one for handing me a menu and carrying a plate to my table (which is honestly all most servers do).  Servers aren't even necessary at all unless you're in an upscale place and need recommendations on the daily special or which wine to drink with your meal.  Evidence lies in the existence of places like Kaitenzushi (conveyor belt sushi) restaurants here in Japan, where you browse the available items and order them using a touch screen at your table and then wait for your order to come out to your table.  No interaction with staff, except to be greeted as you enter and thanked as you leave.  It's efficient, cost-effective and leaves no possibility for poor service or entitled rage at customers from the staff.

Other restaurants here use the touch screens as well and I have to say it's incredibly effective, especially since you can send an order to the kitchen without flagging down or waiting for a server.  Yet other restaurants have a button at the table allowing you to summon a server with a single press, something I know even the most heavily-tipped servers in North America would be completely unable to tolerate. 

For those restaurants here that do use the traditional server system the service is always amazing, and that's without tips of any kind.  Servers here don't get paid much - certainly no more than a fry cook at McDonalds would.  Consider the cost of living here compared with most small cities or towns in the US/Canada and they probably have less spending power than any downtrodden server who complains about low tippers back home.  Good service is a requirement of the job, not something I have to bribe you for.  If your job pays too little and you want me to feel sorry for you, I can't.  Get a new job.  If you're not qualified, go back to school.  If you can't afford it or refuse to, just accept your lot in life and try to make the best of it that you can through your own actions.  Whining about others isn't going to get you squat.
 
2014-03-09 10:26:43 AM
I'm quite surprised that none of the self-righteous pro-tipping crowd (servers or ex-servers mostly it seemed) responded to my post regarding the income disparity between those who make the food (actually provide a service) and the leeches who profit undeservedly off their labour.

Perhaps it's indefensible.
 
2014-03-09 10:41:50 AM
It's almost as if many of you on this thread don't comprehend the difference between eating at a fast food place and having an actual dining experience at a fine food establishment.
 
2014-03-09 10:48:40 AM
Christians are such Jews.
 
2014-03-09 10:57:03 AM

30yrs2l8: The expectation for 20% tips is out of control. Taking the family out to a normal dinner at a sit down place runs $50 to $60. The waitress, even if very nice and helpful will spend all of 10 minutes with us thru the whole visit. How is 10 minutes worth $10 to $12? That is a pay rate of around $60 an hour. I have a really decent job and don't make half of that. People have completely lost sight of the fact that any job has a certain value to it and not more no matter how much you think you are entitled to.


Your expectation is unrealistic.  If the servers were paid even minimum wage, then the price of your meal, plus what you might have paid via tip, would be higher.  And servers are some of the hardest working people in this society.

Anyone who uses the term 'entitled' to sneer at people who work their asses off is a Grade A Asshole.
 
2014-03-09 11:00:44 AM

mudmin: mrlewish: Many of you are absolution asses on tipping. My guess is that you vote republican.

I'm a libertarian, but most studies I've read say that Republicans are more generous across the board than Democrats.

Democrats are more generous with other people's tax money.

Thanks Obama.

/I'll just leave that right there and go to bed.


Those are studies that include tithing at church.  Once you factor that out, no, Republicans are skinflints.
 
2014-03-09 11:05:51 AM

Huggermugger: 30yrs2l8: The expectation for 20% tips is out of control. Taking the family out to a normal dinner at a sit down place runs $50 to $60. The waitress, even if very nice and helpful will spend all of 10 minutes with us thru the whole visit. How is 10 minutes worth $10 to $12? That is a pay rate of around $60 an hour. I have a really decent job and don't make half of that. People have completely lost sight of the fact that any job has a certain value to it and not more no matter how much you think you are entitled to.

Your expectation is unrealistic.  If the servers were paid even minimum wage, then the price of your meal, plus what you might have paid via tip, would be higher.  And servers are some of the hardest working people in this society.

Anyone who uses the term 'entitled' to sneer at people who work their asses off is a Grade A Asshole.


Servers are some of the hardest workers in society? Citation?

I know that where I work, the back of house routinely works 11 hours a day and walks with less than servers who work 5.

Back of house has to carry heavy things, burns/cuts themselves routinely, get on their knees to sweep under the pass, smell/taste possibly offensive food and utilize schooling and finesse to provide a beautiful and tasty dish that servers drop (often unprofessionally) on tables.

In fact, the only thing servers complain about more than not being treated like rock star gods via tipping is customers in general. Usually as they count fat, tax free stacks.

That said, kitchen workers aren't even some of the hardest working people in society. You're either willfully ignorant or in the dark.
 
2014-03-09 11:10:27 AM
Tipped employees must make minimum wage with tips, AFAIK, and if they do not the employer is required to make up the difference.
 
2014-03-09 11:20:57 AM
Another tipping thread. Well, here's the reply I left in said column when someone else commented that we shouldn't shame the poor, they may leave only a dollar because they may not have enough to make it to their next pay day.

"If you can't afford to tip properly, you should not be going out to eat in the first place. Eating at home is much more economically sound. And don't tell me it's about "being social". You can be just as social at somebody's house and again, it costs a lot less.

I'm not a waiter, but I lived with a low income job for many years and I never ate out if I couldn't afford the meal plus tip, even when invited by others.  I also made sure I had enough to give a bigger tip if the service was of excellent quality. And if not - I didn't go out to eat."

End of story. In the United States, the standard tip should be included in the price of what you pay for the food. Extra on top of that is a bonus at your discretion. When you stiff a tip, you are depriving a fellow human being of their basic livelihood. I'm not a Christian, but their is nothing Christian about treating another human being like that. It's selfish and inhumane.

When the laws or conventions change to match that of other countries, we can talk about different conventions at that time. Period.
 
2014-03-09 11:23:21 AM

jrg1199: I'm not a Christian, but their is nothing Christian about treating another human being like that.


You may now proceed to mock me for "there" vs. "their".
 
2014-03-09 11:33:43 AM
Once again, he hero tag means squat here.

Ps; if you rely on tips to survive, your doing life wrong.
 
2014-03-09 11:40:29 AM
When i worked pizza delivery, we used to get a largish order from a local church every month or so. Between 6 & 8 pies, not bad. But they were wayyyy out in the sticks & they always wanted to you bring it down to their basement/gymnasium, which was a long walk w/ 8 pies. & theyd always try to guilt you into helping set up their folding tables.

And then they'd never tip.

So you'd use your gas to come all the way out there & spend the time you couldve been making paying deliveries for these asshole xtians pizza party.

Eventually we'd have to get drivers to draw straws whenever cheapskate church came up on the screen.
 
2014-03-09 11:55:54 AM

inclemency: Huggermugger: 30yrs2l8: The expectation for 20% tips is out of control. Taking the family out to a normal dinner at a sit down place runs $50 to $60. The waitress, even if very nice and helpful will spend all of 10 minutes with us thru the whole visit. How is 10 minutes worth $10 to $12? That is a pay rate of around $60 an hour. I have a really decent job and don't make half of that. People have completely lost sight of the fact that any job has a certain value to it and not more no matter how much you think you are entitled to.

Your expectation is unrealistic.  If the servers were paid even minimum wage, then the price of your meal, plus what you might have paid via tip, would be higher.  And servers are some of the hardest working people in this society.

Anyone who uses the term 'entitled' to sneer at people who work their asses off is a Grade A Asshole.

Servers are some of the hardest workers in society? Citation?

I know that where I work, the back of house routinely works 11 hours a day and walks with less than servers who work 5.

Back of house has to carry heavy things, burns/cuts themselves routinely, get on their knees to sweep under the pass, smell/taste possibly offensive food and utilize schooling and finesse to provide a beautiful and tasty dish that servers drop (often unprofessionally) on tables.

In fact, the only thing servers complain about more than not being treated like rock star gods via tipping is customers in general. Usually as they count fat, tax free stacks.

That said, kitchen workers aren't even some of the hardest working people in society. You're either willfully ignorant or in the dark.


You're an asshole.  I'm sure you don't tip.

There's a lot of abuse that servers endure that the people in the back don't, mostly from customers but also from management and the folks in the back.  First of all, having to cater to customers emotionally, their demands, and also their frequent sexual harassment.  They're the focal point for everyone's anger: if a back person screws up an order, the server gets the abuse from the customer.  Servers are also very frequently sexually harassed by management, or else management hasn't got their back when they're sexually abused by customers.  Finally, servers are entirely disposable commodities, they have no job security whatsoever, whereas the people in the back have the veneer of being 'food professionals', but servers are regarded by the people in the back and management with contempt.
 
2014-03-09 12:01:18 PM

Huggermugger: 30yrs2l8: The expectation for 20% tips is out of control. Taking the family out to a normal dinner at a sit down place runs $50 to $60. The waitress, even if very nice and helpful will spend all of 10 minutes with us thru the whole visit. How is 10 minutes worth $10 to $12? That is a pay rate of around $60 an hour. I have a really decent job and don't make half of that. People have completely lost sight of the fact that any job has a certain value to it and not more no matter how much you think you are entitled to.

Your expectation is unrealistic.  If the servers were paid even minimum wage, then the price of your meal, plus what you might have paid via tip, would be higher.  And servers are some of the hardest working people in this society.

Anyone who uses the term 'entitled' to sneer at people who work their asses off is a Grade A Asshole.


This is hillarious.  Servers are some of the hardest working people in this society? Let me get this straight:
Taking orders, getting drinks and refills, bringing food to the table, asking if everything is alright and then bringing the check is considered hard?
Ohh wow.  This is what's wrong with society.  You have no concept of what is considered a hard job.  Physically there are many other jobs that don't receive tips and yet expected to be high quality.  Go work as a construction worker, fast food counter, a cook etc to find out what's hard.  Then there's mentally hard.  Go be a software engineer, air traffic controller, a pilot.
You're not in charge of lives, you're in charge of doing things a middle schooler can do.  I can't wait until you're all replaced with robots.
 
2014-03-09 12:05:43 PM

Hypergreatthing: if you don't want low wages, don't accept a position that pays you below min wage.


You are an idiot.  When they take the position, tips are an assumed portion of their compensation.  Tipping is the traditional and standard practice in this country.
 
2014-03-09 12:06:29 PM

chewd: When i worked pizza delivery, we used to get a largish order from a local church every month or so. Between 6 & 8 pies, not bad. But they were wayyyy out in the sticks & they always wanted to you bring it down to their basement/gymnasium, which was a long walk w/ 8 pies. & theyd always try to guilt you into helping set up their folding tables.

And then they'd never tip.

So you'd use your gas to come all the way out there & spend the time you couldve been making paying deliveries for these asshole xtians pizza party.

Eventually we'd have to get drivers to draw straws whenever cheapskate church came up on the screen.


You should have told them they were now outside of your delivery area, and you would be otherwise glad to do them a solid under other circumstances, but that they never tip.

And on the tables, I would do it the first time, but after realizing they don't tip, I would put the word out. The reply should be, I have to go out and deliver more pies to people that actually leave a tip.
 
2014-03-09 12:08:29 PM
"Asshole Xtian Pizza Party", LOL, band name.

I'm sure this has been covered, but although the server is the face of the experience, there are a lot of moving parts that need to come together to create good service.  So next time you stiff the server for bad service, a server who may be working her ass off to do the best she can under the circumstances of that day, remember that it's a TEAM effort.  The only time I would stiff a server would be for rudeness or obvious neglect of their duties.  But most of the times I've received bad service, it was likely a culmination of this:

-- Management may not have properly staffed the shift, or others servers didn't show up for their shift
-- Management messed up the supplier orders, or the suppliers didn't come through (sorry, we're out of that)
-- The hostess might not seat the sections properly, overloading a server
-- Cooks make mistakes too and that can hold up an order
-- Other servers sometimes steal your food from the line (sometimes accidentally, sometimes on purpose)
-- Others may not be pulling their weight - silverware didn't get rolled, condiments didn't get refilled, etc
-- Other team members (bussers, etc) say they're going to go refill Table 9's water or clear plates, then they don't
 
2014-03-09 12:11:23 PM

MycroftHolmes: Hypergreatthing: if you don't want low wages, don't accept a position that pays you below min wage.

You are an idiot.  When they take the position, tips are an assumed portion of their compensation.  Tipping is the traditional and standard practice in this country.


When you agree to the terms of a job, that's a contract between you and you're employer.  Why do you assume the public will make up the difference for wages? That's what's wrong.  You don't see it as a problem between you and your place of work, you see it as unwritten expectations.  If it's standard and traditional, please feel free to add tip directly to the bill.  If you want to gamble and leave it up to the person to decide an amount, don't complain when you gamble and lose.  It's that simple.
 
2014-03-09 12:15:03 PM

Hypergreatthing: Huggermugger: 30yrs2l8: The expectation for 20% tips is out of control. Taking the family out to a normal dinner at a sit down place runs $50 to $60. The waitress, even if very nice and helpful will spend all of 10 minutes with us thru the whole visit. How is 10 minutes worth $10 to $12? That is a pay rate of around $60 an hour. I have a really decent job and don't make half of that. People have completely lost sight of the fact that any job has a certain value to it and not more no matter how much you think you are entitled to.

Your expectation is unrealistic.  If the servers were paid even minimum wage, then the price of your meal, plus what you might have paid via tip, would be higher.  And servers are some of the hardest working people in this society.

Anyone who uses the term 'entitled' to sneer at people who work their asses off is a Grade A Asshole.

This is hillarious.  Servers are some of the hardest working people in this society? Let me get this straight:
Taking orders, getting drinks and refills, bringing food to the table, asking if everything is alright and then bringing the check is considered hard?
Ohh wow.  This is what's wrong with society.  You have no concept of what is considered a hard job.  Physically there are many other jobs that don't receive tips and yet expected to be high quality.  Go work as a construction worker, fast food counter, a cook etc to find out what's hard.  Then there's mentally hard.  Go be a software engineer, air traffic controller, a pilot.
You're not in charge of lives, you're in charge of doing things a middle schooler can do.  I can't wait until you're all replaced with robots.


I have been a network engineer, a manager and a director of an IT department, and have managed 15+ people and million+ budgets at different points.  With the exception of the occasional network outage, I would rate my job as less acutely difficult than what a server has to deal with on a standard shift.  Yes, my work had more cumulative stress, and yes, I required more experience and training.  But being a server is hard work.

Think about it this way.  Try to throw a dinner party for 6 people, keeping each one happy with their specific likes and dislikes.  Now multiply that by 4 or 5 times.  Add on top of that trying to manage the back of the house to make sure everything is timed and prepared per specification...well you get the picture (or rather any reasonable persone would get the picture, you seem like an oblivious idiot).

It is not always the most skilled work (though sometimes, it can be), but anyone who says it isn't hard work is an entitled, oblivious, self centered idiot.
 
2014-03-09 12:17:08 PM

Hypergreatthing: MycroftHolmes: Hypergreatthing: if you don't want low wages, don't accept a position that pays you below min wage.

You are an idiot.  When they take the position, tips are an assumed portion of their compensation.  Tipping is the traditional and standard practice in this country.

When you agree to the terms of a job, that's a contract between you and you're employer.  Why do you assume the public will make up the difference for wages? That's what's wrong.  You don't see it as a problem between you and your place of work, you see it as unwritten expectations.  If it's standard and traditional, please feel free to add tip directly to the bill.  If you want to gamble and leave it up to the person to decide an amount, don't complain when you gamble and lose.  It's that simple.


The iRS disagrees with you.  The department of Labor disagrees with you (which is why subminimum wages are allowed).  It is part of American business practice.  You do not get to unilaterally change that.
 
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