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(Local10 WPLG)   Rushing to emergency room is no excuse for red light running, according to city that put red light camera at hospital entrance   (local10.com) divider line 70
    More: Florida, Tamarac, red light cameras, emergency rooms, Jacob Alcahe, 72nd Street, medical emergency, two-lane road, intersections  
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4620 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Mar 2014 at 1:09 PM (28 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-04 01:11:49 PM
It is about safety
 
2014-03-04 01:11:56 PM
spi3uk.itvnet.lv
 
2014-03-04 01:12:14 PM
It's a trap.
 
2014-03-04 01:12:36 PM
1.  Sue the city for interfering with a medical emergency.
2.  ???
3.  Profit
 
2014-03-04 01:12:41 PM

pendy575: It is about safety

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
 
2014-03-04 01:14:11 PM
When my mother ran every red light in town rushing me to the ER so I wouldn't bleed out (nicked an artery), she got pulled over, cop took one look, and we got a police escort.

/oh for the pre-camera days
//oh for the pre jackboot days
 
2014-03-04 01:14:44 PM
What a country!
 
2014-03-04 01:15:13 PM
Maybe the city should ticket any of its emergency vehicles that run through that light. And then pay off their fines by moving money from one department budget to another, kind of like a bureaucratic perpetual motion machine.
 
2014-03-04 01:15:14 PM
How many of those tickets were for cop cars who ran red lights without their lights and sirens on?

I'm going to say somewhere around the realm of 0.
 
2014-03-04 01:19:11 PM
That has to be the most epic troll EVER!!  There is no middle finger big enough to adequately display one tenth of the disdain that city has for its populace.
 
2014-03-04 01:21:15 PM
However, city officials couldn't tell Local 10 how many of those violators were turning left into the hospital.

Couldn't,  or wouldn't?   Huge difference.


Cops, on or off duty don't pay red light tickets.  They go to court during their working hours and they automatically get dismissed.  Any judge who doesn't play along is out.  It's one of the many perks of being a cop.  So if they get a red light ticket while taking their kid to Little League,  you and I pay for them to spend half a day getting it dismissed.
 
2014-03-04 01:23:30 PM
Hah! I grew up a stone's throw away from that hospital. There is no way that area justifies a red-light camera, except for the fact that the entire area is probably 80% retired fogies and therefore an easy cashgrab because most of them don't even realize that they are driving.
 
2014-03-04 01:29:55 PM
In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.
 
2014-03-04 01:33:33 PM

pendy575: It is about safety


It is if you're running a red light.

I have nice flashy lights and sirens and I DONT do that.
 
2014-03-04 01:34:59 PM

NutWrench: Maybe the city should ticket any of its emergency vehicles that run through that light. And then pay off their fines by moving money from one department budget to another, kind of like a bureaucratic perpetual motion machine.


I know you're trying to be snarky, but if their operators are blowing through red lights, lights and sirens or not, damn right they should.

And the city makes the apparatus operators pay for tickets if they're municipal employees.
 
2014-03-04 01:36:46 PM
Fix the intersection.

Make entering the left turn pocket trip the signal faster.

Make it blink yellow after midnight.

Install a roundabout.


Make it a 4 way stop.
 
2014-03-04 01:37:17 PM

Ivo Shandor: In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.


This is partially incorrect. It should be made on a case-by-case basis by an actual officer, not a camera. There are too many variables to say without a doubt that calling an ambulance would be the better decision to driving there yourself.

It depends on the following:

The distance to drive from where you live, and the distance the nearest ambulance would be.

The medical condition itself. If it's a stroke or heart attack, you could be dead waiting for an ambulance when the hospital is less than 3 minutes away in your car. It has to be life-threatening.

And, of course, whether or not the paramedics in the area are incompetent assholes.
 
2014-03-04 01:41:45 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-04 01:45:09 PM

Ivo Shandor: In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.


I hear they got them there 2-seater motion machines where one person drive and the other person don't - they just sit der bleedin da death at red lights!

Driver done gotta clean all that up!
 
2014-03-04 01:45:21 PM

Weatherkiss: The medical condition itself. If it's a stroke or heart attack, you could be dead waiting for an ambulance when the hospital is less than 3 minutes away in your car. It has to be life-threatening.


Actually, this is not true. We even have scientific evidence proving that is not the case - response times under 15 minutes do not matter for things outside of Cardiac Arrest or a certain subset of medical or surgical emergencies. In addition, there are also studies that show that Door to Balloon in STEMI (a time critical type of heart attack) and Door to Needle/Intervention (Stroke) times are much less with EMS activation and field triage to an appropriate facility versus driving someone yourself. And the fact you CANNOT perform any interventions in your vehicle should something happen.

EMS is NOT a taxi ride. We do actually do stuff, contrary to popular belief.

You try to drive someone in cardiac arrest or respiratory arrest yourself, they're dead. Point blank. You've killed them and any chance they had versus doing pre-arrival CPR and waiting for EMS to manage them.

Weatherkiss: The distance to drive from where you live, and the distance the nearest ambulance would be.


The closest hospital to you might not have the services you or your family member need. Can you tell the capabilities of every hosptial in your city? Where is the most appropriate place to go for a Stroke? For Chest Pain? Which hospital has pediatric surgical or in patient capabilities?
 
2014-03-04 01:50:28 PM

hardinparamedic: pendy575: It is about safety

It is if you're running a red light.

I have nice flashy lights and sirens and I DONT do that.


If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish. In fact for each red that you have to red, I will buy you a plush pony of your choice. And if you get me to the hospital 15% under goal, I will write you your own personal erotic MLP fanfic. You ever want to know what else Twilight Sparkle can do with that horn? Save my life and you'll find out.
 
2014-03-04 01:52:38 PM

Ivo Shandor: In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.


This...

My brother got T-boned on Christmas day by a mother who blew through a red light while rushing her child to the hospital.  (The child was having an asthma attack.  Fortunately, the impact and air bags going off in his face didn't make it worse and the child survived after an ambulance came and got him and took him to the hospital.)
 
2014-03-04 01:58:39 PM

MythDragon: If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish


I have two friends who are dead because they tried to run a red light with the woo woo bus. We recently went through a debacle here where a police officer killed a family of three blowing through a red light.

50% of ALL Emergency Vehicle accidents, not just abulances, occur at intersections that are improperly navigated through. And they kill non-rescuers just as much as rescuers.

I'll get you to the hospital safe and alive, Sir. Everyone goes home.
 
2014-03-04 02:09:40 PM

hardinparamedic: MythDragon: If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish

I have two friends who are dead because they tried to run a red light with the woo woo bus. We recently went through a debacle here where a police officer killed a family of three blowing through a red light.

50% of ALL Emergency Vehicle accidents, not just abulances, occur at intersections that are improperly navigated through. And they kill non-rescuers just as much as rescuers.

I'll get you to the hospital safe and alive, Sir. Everyone goes home.


Can I at least play with the truck horn that goes "BRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAA"?
 
2014-03-04 02:10:19 PM
Ban camera enforcement once and for all.
 
2014-03-04 02:12:50 PM
KidKorporate: What a country!

Ah, saw your profile.  Reedie douchebag?
 
2014-03-04 02:12:55 PM

RoyBatty: [i.imgur.com image 850x488]


Is that the intersection. If the straightaway was green and nobody was oncoming damn sure I would run that redlight. Left turn redlights that don't blink during a green straight are just plain stupid.
 
2014-03-04 02:21:48 PM

MythDragon: Can I at least play with the truck horn that goes "BRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAA"?


I could probably get you a ride in a ladder truck in my hometown. :)
It's got the old hydraulic powered federal Q siren and brass bells on it.
 
2014-03-04 02:28:44 PM
FTA:
Jacob Alcahe was worried he was having a heart attack, so he rushed himself to University Hospital in Tamarac.

I 'm guessing that if you think it's a good idea to the hospital beacuse you think you are having a heart attack you are probably not having a heart attack.
 
2014-03-04 02:29:23 PM
A buddy of mine in Israel just posted this morning that he paid a 35 NIS fine (about $5-10) for speeding on his way to the hospital while his wife was in labor. Apparently, they knocked it down to 7 NIS including admin fees ($2), after he appealed.

// according to him, he just said "emergency" rather than "my wife was turtle-heading in the backseat"
 
2014-03-04 02:30:51 PM
hardinparamedic - EMS is NOT a taxi ride.

Not kidding. I could ride from Nashville to Knoxville in a taxi cheaper than I could ride in the ambulance the three miles it takes to get me to the emergency room.

/several paramedics in my family...
//they all agree with you, but of course their jobs depend on this...
///STILL don't have the $500 for a three mile ride, regardless of the situation...
 
2014-03-04 02:38:30 PM

payattention: hardinparamedic - EMS is NOT a taxi ride.

Not kidding. I could ride from Nashville to Knoxville in a taxi cheaper than I could ride in the ambulance the three miles it takes to get me to the emergency room.

/several paramedics in my family...
//they all agree with you, but of course their jobs depend on this...
///STILL don't have the $500 for a three mile ride, regardless of the situation...


Tennessee has a law because of this that as long as someone pays at least a dollar a month on a medical bill, it's considered paid up for that month - they are not supposed to be able to come after you on deliquent collections. And many of the services will work with you, because they need that money. In addition, as a rule, insurance will cover between 60 to 80% of EMS charges.

If anyone EVER asks you for money up front after calling 911, they're violating State and in some cases Federal law.

The indiviudal providers don't care about the money - they don't even deal with the billing side of that.
 
2014-03-04 02:51:36 PM
Because, you know, SAFETY.

/read it for the articles . . .
 
2014-03-04 02:57:02 PM

Ivo Shandor: In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.


I never agree with red light cameras, anywhere, or the excessive fines but I agree just because someone thinks they are in an emergency situation doesn't absolve them of guilt.

Basically, if you are going to run a light and risk endangering others you better have a better excuse than a panic attack after the fact.
 
2014-03-04 02:58:08 PM

hardinparamedic: MythDragon: If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish

I have two friends who are dead because they tried to run a red light with the woo woo bus. We recently went through a debacle here where a police officer killed a family of three blowing through a red light.

50% of ALL Emergency Vehicle accidents, not just abulances, occur at intersections that are improperly navigated through. And they kill non-rescuers just as much as rescuers.

I'll get you to the hospital safe and alive, Sir. Everyone goes home.


"woo woo bus". For some reason I find that hilarious.
 
2014-03-04 03:06:53 PM
it's not
 
2014-03-04 03:08:00 PM
...and they don't even have sirens on top of the ambulance.

chewiesconcerts.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-03-04 03:09:57 PM

Ivo Shandor: In this case I agree with the city. If you want to run a red light, do it inside an ambulance. If you're that sick you shouldn't be driving in the first place. Don't risk turning one medical emergency into two by hitting someone else.


We don't run red lights
 
2014-03-04 03:10:28 PM

hardinparamedic: Weatherkiss: The medical condition itself. If it's a stroke or heart attack, you could be dead waiting for an ambulance when the hospital is less than 3 minutes away in your car. It has to be life-threatening.

Actually, this is not true. We even have scientific evidence proving that is not the case - response times under 15 minutes do not matter for things outside of Cardiac Arrest or a certain subset of medical or surgical emergencies. In addition, there are also studies that show that Door to Balloon in STEMI (a time critical type of heart attack) and Door to Needle/Intervention (Stroke) times are much less with EMS activation and field triage to an appropriate facility versus driving someone yourself. And the fact you CANNOT perform any interventions in your vehicle should something happen.

EMS is NOT a taxi ride. We do actually do stuff, contrary to popular belief.

You try to drive someone in cardiac arrest or respiratory arrest yourself, they're dead. Point blank. You've killed them and any chance they had versus doing pre-arrival CPR and waiting for EMS to manage them.

Weatherkiss: The distance to drive from where you live, and the distance the nearest ambulance would be.

The closest hospital to you might not have the services you or your family member need. Can you tell the capabilities of every hosptial in your city? Where is the most appropriate place to go for a Stroke? For Chest Pain? Which hospital has pediatric surgical or in patient capabilities?


All variables which tell me that dismissing/condoning the idea of running red lights during an emergency in your personal car/truck/whatever should be made on a case-by-case basis. I think it should be a guideline, sure. But there are always going to be situations that will require the rules to be bent or outright broken.
 
2014-03-04 03:14:24 PM
This isn't even running a real red light. This is one of those idiotic red left turn arrows where they think it's necessary to make traffic going the opposite direction stop to let you turn left, even if you can plainly see no one coming for as far as you can see, or you can see the traffic stopped at the next light. If it were an actual safety issue there would not be discretionary left turns anywhere. This type of traffic light setup shouldn't exist unless the intersection is at the crest of a hill where you can't tell if there is oncoming traffic.
 
2014-03-04 03:22:24 PM

hardinparamedic: MythDragon: If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish

I have two friends who are dead because they tried to run a red light with the woo woo bus. We recently went through a debacle here where a police officer killed a family of three blowing through a red light.

50% of ALL Emergency Vehicle accidents, not just abulances, occur at intersections that are improperly navigated through. And they kill non-rescuers just as much as rescuers.

I'll get you to the hospital safe and alive, Sir. Everyone goes home.


Maybe we need to differentiate between blowing through a red light at top speed even though the lights and siren are on, and going through a red light after noting that traffic in all directions is giving the proper respect to the Emergency vehicle.
 
2014-03-04 03:43:01 PM

Weatherkiss: All variables which tell me that dismissing/condoning the idea of running red lights during an emergency in your personal car/truck/whatever should be made on a case-by-case basis. I think it should be a guideline, sure. But there are always going to be situations that will require the rules to be bent or outright broken.


If your emergency is so dire that you feel it's appropriate to endanger countless other people on the road by doing this in order to make a difference in the life or death of your loved one, you shouldn't be driving them to begin with.

To put this another way, if you are so emotionally freaked out that you feel what is going on constitutes recklessly driving down the road, putting your own life and the lives of everyone you pass in danger with - at least- a two ton missile going 35 to 65 miles an hour at minimum, then maybe - JUST MAYBE - you should call 911.

You should not be in that position to begin with in a modern, first world society which is not operating under a disaster situation. Emergency Medical Services exist for a reason. They're paid very well to set there on their butt and wait for you to call. And IF, just IF the situation is so dire that you can remotely justify endangering the lives and livelyhood of those around you by Dukes of Hazzarding it to the nearest hospital, they represent the best chance for your loved one to go home from the hospital without any kind of disability or deficit.
 
2014-03-04 03:43:50 PM

BizarreMan: hardinparamedic: MythDragon: If I ever need an ambulance, you sir, have my permission to run as many Goddamn reds as you wish

I have two friends who are dead because they tried to run a red light with the woo woo bus. We recently went through a debacle here where a police officer killed a family of three blowing through a red light.

50% of ALL Emergency Vehicle accidents, not just abulances, occur at intersections that are improperly navigated through. And they kill non-rescuers just as much as rescuers.

I'll get you to the hospital safe and alive, Sir. Everyone goes home.

Maybe we need to differentiate between blowing through a red light at top speed even though the lights and siren are on, and going through a red light after noting that traffic in all directions is giving the proper respect to the Emergency vehicle.


That's what I was thinking. I'd hope the whaambulance wouldn't just go "got my lights on, you farmers better not be in my way when I plow through"
But stopping or going real slow and making sure the intersection is clear (if you can't see you don't go) seems reasonable. If some guy is stroking out (hehe) in the back, I don't see a point in sitting at a light that's got no traffic coming either way.
 
2014-03-04 03:47:53 PM

MythDragon: I'd hope the whaambulance wouldn't just go "got my lights on, you farmers better not be in my way when I plow through"


Sadly, MD, that's what a lot of people still think, including people who operate emergency vehicles. It's why we have things like CEVO III, Emergency Vehicle Operations Course, and Certified Pumper/Apparatus Operator.

It's also the reason Tennessee has the Vanessa K. Free law.
 
2014-03-04 03:54:32 PM

RoyBatty: Fix the intersection.

Make entering the left turn pocket trip the signal faster.

Make it blink yellow after midnight.

Install a roundabout.

Make it a 4 way stop.


Make the left turn yellow/blink red in the situation above, where if it were clear, you could make a left.  That's what Michigan does. Also make sure the left turn gets green before letting cross traffic flow.   This is tricky on a 3 lane in one direction road like this, so I can imagine why they don't.
Maybe honk horn/flash bright lights for green would be possible, but people don't adapt well to new things well.

I generally agree that an ambulance if the best way into a hospital, I've seen badly bleeding people sit in the ER, were if you are brought in by an ambulance you don't get sent out to the waiting room to wait your turn.  On top of that, they can perform services on site and en-route.

If there were some instance where a passenger or I were shot while sitting in my car down the road from the ambulance, I would drive myself, speed/run the light (if I thought it was clear), and pay the ticket.
 
2014-03-04 03:54:42 PM

MythDragon: That's what I was thinking. I'd hope the whaambulance wouldn't just go "got my lights on, you farmers better not be in my way when I plow through"
But stopping or going real slow and making sure the intersection is clear (if you can't see you don't go) seems reasonable. If some guy is stroking out (hehe) in the back, I don't see a point in sitting at a light that's got no traffic coming either way


The only people who I have seen go through red lights carelessly are law enforcement.  Every ambulance, and fire truck I've seen takes it slow and careful at intersections.
 
2014-03-04 04:08:46 PM
Ed says ... you know what to do ..

31.media.tumblr.com
 
2014-03-04 04:11:42 PM

BizarreMan: MythDragon: That's what I was thinking. I'd hope the whaambulance wouldn't just go "got my lights on, you farmers better not be in my way when I plow through"
But stopping or going real slow and making sure the intersection is clear (if you can't see you don't go) seems reasonable. If some guy is stroking out (hehe) in the back, I don't see a point in sitting at a light that's got no traffic coming either way

The only people who I have seen go through red lights carelessly are law enforcement.  Every ambulance, and fire truck I've seen takes it slow and careful at intersections.


Does this or does this not include the cops who turn on the whoopie lights as they approach a red light and then turn it off as soon as they get to the other side?

Because those cops are dicks who deserve to be beheaded in front of their families.
 
2014-03-04 04:17:44 PM

King Something: Does this or does this not include the cops who turn on the whoopie lights as they approach a red light and then turn it off as soon as they get to the other side?

Because those cops are dicks who deserve to be beheaded in front of their families.


Most definitely includes those dicks.
 
2014-03-04 04:39:02 PM
Time to attach some IR strobes to the hazard light relay.


If there's a major emergency, flip on the hazards, lay into the horn and scoot. At the very least people move over because they think you are road-raging.
 
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