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(Mental Floss)   Hey ladies, ever wonder what your chances would have been like in Salem back in 1692 if you'd been accused of being a witch? Let's just put it this way...we hope you weigh more than a duck   (mentalfloss.com ) divider line
    More: Scary, Hey Ladies, female friends  
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11135 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Mar 2014 at 11:56 AM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-02 01:06:12 PM  
Twins of Evil is a good witch hunting movie to watch when you are bored.
 
2014-03-02 01:09:37 PM  

megarian: I like how they say the daughter "went prematurely insane."


That has a nice Lovecraftian ring to it, "prematurely insane". It suggests that insanity is inevitable but not limited to the middle-aged and elderly.

 ... and then there is his brother,  Absalom Judas Aldwife III, who went prematurely insane and thus can not be counted as a victim of the Eldritch Family Curse ... he was one of the lucky ones.
 
2014-03-02 01:10:24 PM  

iheartscotch: Pretty much anybody who got accused was toast. I'm not familiar with any cases where the accused was found innocent. A few people never confessed their witchery; they just got tortured to death. One guy was even crushed in a questioning technique called "pressing". They put stones on your chest till you talked. If memory serves; the whole thing was set into motion by a group of young girls.


Giles Corey, who pretty much showed he had stones bigger than anything they laid on him by saying, "more weight"
 
2014-03-02 01:14:01 PM  

OtherLittleGuy: cirby: Of course, about one out of six of the accused (and of the executed) was male, and the whole thing was kicked off by a feud between women who were related to each other, but...

..and ended when people of property and power were starting to get accused, and it was beyond all fun and games.

/and it was in modern-day Danvers, aka "Salem Village"


One of the precious bits of information I learned while doing my family tree was that the witch accusations in Boston, MA, ended when one very rich Bostonian was accused and he responded like a gentleman bourgeois by suing his accuser for libel asking 1000 Pounds in damages.

Reason prevails. Or at least the Lord God Mammon. He is, like Jehovah, a God of Gods.

I like to shout JEHOVAH! Just because I can!
 
2014-03-02 01:21:21 PM  

OtherLittleGuy: and ended when people of property and power were starting to get accused, and it was beyond all fun and games


Thin the final straw was when they accused the Governor's wife.
 
2014-03-02 01:24:42 PM  
ts1.mm.bing.net
 
2014-03-02 01:28:00 PM  
short of not executing people for these things, we really haven't progressed much since then.
 
2014-03-02 01:28:35 PM  

iheartscotch: Pretty much anybody who got accused was toast. I'm not familiar with any cases where the accused was found innocent. A few people never confessed their witchery; they just got tortured to death. One guy was even crushed in a questioning technique called "pressing". They put stones on your chest till you talked. If memory serves; the whole thing was set into motion by a group of young girls.


Remember this, folks, next time anyone tells you torture is a good way of getting information.  Ask them if they believe in witches...we got a LOT of "evidence" of witches using torture.
 
2014-03-02 01:30:03 PM  

brantgoose: OtherLittleGuy: cirby: Of course, about one out of six of the accused (and of the executed) was male, and the whole thing was kicked off by a feud between women who were related to each other, but...

..and ended when people of property and power were starting to get accused, and it was beyond all fun and games.

/and it was in modern-day Danvers, aka "Salem Village"

One of the precious bits of information I learned while doing my family tree was that the witch accusations in Boston, MA, ended when one very rich Bostonian was accused and he responded like a gentleman bourgeois by suing his accuser for libel asking 1000 Pounds in damages.

Reason prevails. Or at least the Lord God Mammon. He is, like Jehovah, a God of Gods.

I like to shout JEHOVAH! Just because I can!


BLASPHAMY! You're only making it worse for yourself!


/ no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle; even, and I want to make this absolutely clear, even if they do say Jehovah
 
2014-03-02 01:32:30 PM  
Does anyone have any evidence to suggest they weren't guilty of witchcraft?
 
2014-03-02 01:34:43 PM  
Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.
 
2014-03-02 01:35:51 PM  
I'm a direct descendant of a woman burned in the Salem Witch Trials, but I don't have any magic powers (unless being a really good slacker counts)
 
2014-03-02 01:38:52 PM  
STILL more rational and merciful than the average modern Teabaggers.
 
2014-03-02 01:40:36 PM  

Aulus: National Geographic Channel recently had a program on this.  It seems to have largely been the work of one man, the preacher in Salem, who was not all that well liked.  He drummed up the bit about witches on the loose to increase his standing in the community.


popreflection.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-03-02 01:41:14 PM  

Mega Steve: I'm a direct descendant of a woman burned in the Salem Witch Trials, but I don't have any magic powers (unless being a really good slacker counts)


No one was burned at Salem.
 
2014-03-02 01:44:42 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.


The Burning Times
 
2014-03-02 01:45:32 PM  
brantgoose:

It suffices to look at the death date to know there are witches:

Mary Town Eastery, hanged 22 Sept 1692, Gallow's Hill;
Rebecca Towne Nurse, 19 July 1692
Rev. George Burroughs, hanged 19 August 1692 (yes, a clergyman! hanged as a witch), 1692


Hanging was actually the more merciful thing they did to those accused of witchcraft. One method of execution was "Pressing", where the victim was restrained to the ground and stone after stone was piled on top of them one at a time until they were eventually squished to death.

And sicko stuff like this is why we have laws against "cruel and unusual punishment" and a separation between church and state in our Bill of Rights. Next time you hear some crap-for-brains talking about weakening that separation between C&S, take into account that they want to bring back all these sadistic horrors as well, because JAY-ZUSS!
 
2014-03-02 01:46:20 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.


Yes, Europe was much worse. There were various inquisitions and witch hunts. There was even a book for witch hunters, the Malleus Maleficarum, it takes second place to the bible as the most blood soaked book in history. There were, at least, 10's of thousands of accused witches burned, impaled, drowned, ect over the centuries. Most sources disagree about the actual number.

/ one of the most famous European "witch" to burn was Joan De Arc
 
2014-03-02 01:48:41 PM  
12 out of 16!


www.mahurangi.org.nz
 
2014-03-02 01:50:35 PM  
Speaking of Europe, my European History textbook from back in high school heavily implied that one of the supposed signs a woman was a witch was the ability to have multiple orgasms without a refractory period.
 
2014-03-02 01:51:11 PM  

PunGent: iheartscotch: Pretty much anybody who got accused was toast. I'm not familiar with any cases where the accused was found innocent. A few people never confessed their witchery; they just got tortured to death. One guy was even crushed in a questioning technique called "pressing". They put stones on your chest till you talked. If memory serves; the whole thing was set into motion by a group of young girls.

Remember this, folks, next time anyone tells you torture is a good way of getting information.  Ask them if they believe in witches...we got a LOT of "evidence" of witches using torture.


Indeed.

The implication of torture is MUCH more effective.

/ some sensory deprivation, a horror movie scream track and a good imagination are much more effective.
 
2014-03-02 01:52:09 PM  

iheartscotch: Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.

Yes, Europe was much worse. There were various inquisitions and witch hunts. There was even a book for witch hunters, the Malleus Maleficarum, it takes second place to the bible as the most blood soaked book in history. There were, at least, 10's of thousands of accused witches burned, impaled, drowned, ect over the centuries. Most sources disagree about the actual number.

/ one of the most famous European "witch" to burn was Joan De Arc


The thing is, look at the timeline. As Europe was starting to wake up and see what madness things like witch trials were and were starting to swindle down, witch trials on the US side were actually picking up.

Also if I'm not mistaken, one of the US's top universities was founded by a descendent of one of the most vicious witch hunters in the colonies, although that descendent was so ashamed at what his ancestor did that he changed his family name.
 
2014-03-02 01:53:54 PM  

Aulus: National Geographic Channel recently had a program on this.  It seems to have largely been the work of one man, the preacher in Salem, who was not all that well liked.  He drummed up the bit about witches on the loose to increase his standing in the community.


So a 17th century Fox News predecessor?
 
2014-03-02 02:06:03 PM  

Weatherkiss: 12 out of 16!


[www.mahurangi.org.nz image 500x372]


She has nice tatas!

We have a Witchduck Road and a Salem Road. No, they do not intersect - that would be too creepy
(especially if there was a lake there)

Just like there is a Popeye's chicken at the corner of Martin Luther King Blvd and Malcolm X Blvd in DC.

img.fark.net

You would think it would be more busy.  Surprised the Google Maps car was not jacked.
 
2014-03-02 02:09:15 PM  
Modern-day "witch hunts" aka moral panics

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria

And

of course, good ol' tail-gunner Joe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_McCarthy

Human beings can be such bastards.
 
2014-03-02 02:11:59 PM  

TV's Vinnie: iheartscotch: Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.

Yes, Europe was much worse. There were various inquisitions and witch hunts. There was even a book for witch hunters, the Malleus Maleficarum, it takes second place to the bible as the most blood soaked book in history. There were, at least, 10's of thousands of accused witches burned, impaled, drowned, ect over the centuries. Most sources disagree about the actual number.

/ one of the most famous European "witch" to burn was Joan De Arc

The thing is, look at the timeline. As Europe was starting to wake up and see what madness things like witch trials were and were starting to swindle down, witch trials on the US side were actually picking up.

Also if I'm not mistaken, one of the US's top universities was founded by a descendent of one of the most vicious witch hunters in the colonies, although that descendent was so ashamed at what his ancestor did that he changed his family name.


I've been looking at it and there were witch trials and executions pre-Christianity. And there are still witch hunts; they're just called something else. Also, there is some conjecture about actual modern witch hunts, for actual witches, in sub-Saharan Africa.

/ also, the Inquisition is still around; now they investigate heresy and such

// I don't know about the college thing; but, it wouldn't surprise me
 
2014-03-02 02:14:31 PM  
K3rmy: We have a Witchduck Road and a Salem Road

You can keep that noise. I'm going over to Pleasure House.
 
2014-03-02 02:23:51 PM  
Satan sounds like a cool dude whereas Jesus is just a paranoid dickhole.
 
2014-03-02 02:26:30 PM  
static.fjcdn.com
 
2014-03-02 02:31:02 PM  

dopekitty74: I'm a goner...


You and me both sister.
 
2014-03-02 02:35:06 PM  
Jon Stewart had a guest on about a month ago who went through all the court records from all the witch trials and it turns out 98% of them were simply fined, with some being forced to move from the community. Sure, lots of people were accused, but there was never a "water test" or anything, and the only recorded execution was a hanging. They kept very detailed notes about the trials because it was a real court, it's just that the story of what happened to witches is a lot juicer than reality.
 
2014-03-02 02:38:59 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: Needlessly Complicated: Benevolent Misanthrope: 1. Be a woman.

Aaaaaaand, we're done. Women are the Debbil and deserve anything that happens to them. That hasn't changed much in the US. You have no idea how refreshing it is to live in a place where that particular part of the "women are lesser" idea never took root.

What place is that? I would like to go to there, please.

Canada.  Northern Alberta, specifically.  Sexism certainly exists - but it doesn't have that religio-moral component to it.  And if a woman can perform at the same level as a man, no one gives a crap that she's a woman.


That is a little more prevalent in the states than you make it sound by saying "that hasn't changed much" from the times of the Salem witch burnings.  Just a tad disingenuous.
 
2014-03-02 02:43:29 PM  

omeganuepsilon: Benevolent Misanthrope: Needlessly Complicated: Benevolent Misanthrope: 1. Be a woman.

Aaaaaaand, we're done. Women are the Debbil and deserve anything that happens to them. That hasn't changed much in the US. You have no idea how refreshing it is to live in a place where that particular part of the "women are lesser" idea never took root.

What place is that? I would like to go to there, please.

Canada.  Northern Alberta, specifically.  Sexism certainly exists - but it doesn't have that religio-moral component to it.  And if a woman can perform at the same level as a man, no one gives a crap that she's a woman.

That is a little more prevalent in the states than you make it sound by saying "that hasn't changed much" from the times of the Salem witch burnings.  Just a tad disingenuous.


It's not nice to come into the middle of a conversation and pretend you know what's being discussed, based on the last few words.  Now, hush.  Grown-ups are talking.
 
2014-03-02 02:50:09 PM  
And for the last time NOBODY was burned in the Salem Witch Trials. Or executions. They were hanged with one exception who was pressed to death- burning may have been quicker. Unless your ancestor accidentally broke a lamp while trying to read out court records, if you say your ancestor was burned at the stake in Salem you're just another kook who thinks 10 million people were somehow killed in the European Witch Trials and 99.9 per cent of the records magically disappeared, and you believe talking to your pet cat, rat, or hamster makes you a psychic.
 
2014-03-02 02:54:24 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.


Yes, Witch trials weren't even common in the Colonies, it was just this weird last gasp from like 100 years before. BTW protestant countries burned a lot more witches than the Inquisition.
 
2014-03-02 02:55:24 PM  

Day_Old_Dutchie: Modern-day "witch hunts" aka moral panics

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day-care_sex-abuse_hysteria

And

of course, good ol' tail-gunner Joe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_McCarthy

Human beings can be such bastards.


Amazing how people don't change, just the labels that are attached.
 
2014-03-02 02:57:19 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: omeganuepsilon: Benevolent Misanthrope: Needlessly Complicated: Benevolent Misanthrope: 1. Be a woman.

Aaaaaaand, we're done. Women are the Debbil and deserve anything that happens to them. That hasn't changed much in the US. You have no idea how refreshing it is to live in a place where that particular part of the "women are lesser" idea never took root.

What place is that? I would like to go to there, please.

Canada.  Northern Alberta, specifically.  Sexism certainly exists - but it doesn't have that religio-moral component to it.  And if a woman can perform at the same level as a man, no one gives a crap that she's a woman.

That is a little more prevalent in the states than you make it sound by saying "that hasn't changed much" from the times of the Salem witch burnings.  Just a tad disingenuous.

It's not nice to come into the middle of a conversation and pretend you know what's being discussed, based on the last few words.  Now, hush.  Grown-ups are talking.


That's how pretty much all of the internet works.  Nobody has the time to read ALL of the comments and track all of the conversations and try to understand people's entire position.  They read a few comments, either near the top or near the bottom, see something they agree with/disagree with and hit reply.
 
2014-03-02 03:00:10 PM  

cynicalbastard: And for the last time NOBODY was burned in the Salem Witch Trials. Or executions. They were hanged with one exception who was pressed to death- burning may have been quicker. Unless your ancestor accidentally broke a lamp while trying to read out court records, if you say your ancestor was burned at the stake in Salem you're just another kook who thinks 10 million people were somehow killed in the European Witch Trials and 99.9 per cent of the records magically disappeared, and you believe talking to your pet cat, rat, or hamster makes you a psychic.


I agree with most of that; but, no one is really sure how many women got executed for witchcraft in Europe over the centuries. There are records of witch trials that predate Christianity. If the actual figure isn't in the millions of women; it's in the hundreds of thousands. Hell, the Spanish Inquisition got at least a hundred thousand by itself.
 
2014-03-02 03:02:04 PM  
www.rubberduckface.com
 
2014-03-02 03:05:10 PM  

Private_Citizen: Oblio13: "Having taken the suspected Witch, shee is placed in the middle of a room upon a stool, or Table, crosse legg'd, or in some other uneasie posture, to which if she submits not, she is then bound with cords, there is she watcht & kept without meat or sleep for the space of 24 hours. For (they say) within that time they shall see her Impe come and suck; a little hole is likewise made in the door for the Impe to come in at: and lest it might come in some lesse discernible shape, they that watch are taught to be ever & anon sweeping the room, and if they see any spiders or flyes, to kill them. And if they cannot kill them, then they may be sure they are her Impes."

- John Gaule, describing a test used by Witchfinders, 1646

Stress positions, sleep deprivation, and constant watching and harassment? Sounds like the test we now use to see if a Brown person is a terrorist.


Chill out, man
 
2014-03-02 03:08:10 PM  
FTA: 12. YOU HAVE EXHIBITED "STUBBORN," "STRANGE," OR "FORWARD BEHAVIOR"

Well, I'm boned.
 
2014-03-02 03:11:38 PM  
static4.wikia.nocookie.net

I declareth this log to be a witch! And if you disagree with me'eth, you're a witch! - eth
 
2014-03-02 03:30:27 PM  

Private_Citizen: Oblio13: "Having taken the suspected Witch, shee is placed in the middle of a room upon a stool, or Table, crosse legg'd, or in some other uneasie posture, to which if she submits not, she is then bound with cords, there is she watcht & kept without meat or sleep for the space of 24 hours. For (they say) within that time they shall see her Impe come and suck; a little hole is likewise made in the door for the Impe to come in at: and lest it might come in some lesse discernible shape, they that watch are taught to be ever & anon sweeping the room, and if they see any spiders or flyes, to kill them. And if they cannot kill them, then they may be sure they are her Impes."

- John Gaule, describing a test used by Witchfinders, 1646

Stress positions, sleep deprivation, and constant watching and harassment? Sounds like the test we now use to see if a Brown person is a terrorist.


upload.wikimedia.org

She's a witch! Burn her!
 
2014-03-02 03:31:34 PM  

iheartscotch: Pretty much anybody who got accused was toast. I'm not familiar with any cases where the accused was found innocent. A few people never confessed their witchery; they just got tortured to death. One guy was even crushed in a questioning technique called "pressing". They put stones on your chest till you talked. If memory serves; the whole thing was set into motion by a group of young girls.


Giles Corey (sp?) The last time they asked him to confess before he died from being crushed to death he replied MORE STONES.


Confessing would save you from being tortured to death but the church would collect your entire estate if you confessed and your entire family would be outcasts. So there was good reason not to confess.

Then just as now follow the money.
 
2014-03-02 03:38:13 PM  

iheartscotch: Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.

Yes, Europe was much worse. There were various inquisitions and witch hunts. There was even a book for witch hunters, the Malleus Maleficarum, it takes second place to the bible as the most blood soaked book in history. There were, at least, 10's of thousands of accused witches burned, impaled, drowned, ect over the centuries. Most sources disagree about the actual number.

/ one of the most famous European "witch" to burn was Joan De Arc


The Bible and the Malleus have NOTHING on the Communist Manifesto and Mao's little red book for being the bloodiest.
 
2014-03-02 04:13:59 PM  

Oldiron_79: iheartscotch: Fark_Guy_Rob: Slightly less trolly question - but weren't these trials and prosecutions far more common in the EU?  It seems like history remembers the Salem witch trials, but I thought they were commonplace for a few hundred years prior.

Yes, Europe was much worse. There were various inquisitions and witch hunts. There was even a book for witch hunters, the Malleus Maleficarum, it takes second place to the bible as the most blood soaked book in history. There were, at least, 10's of thousands of accused witches burned, impaled, drowned, ect over the centuries. Most sources disagree about the actual number.

/ one of the most famous European "witch" to burn was Joan De Arc

The Bible and the Malleus have NOTHING on the Communist Manifesto and Mao's little red book for being the bloodiest.


There is an argument to be made for the Communist Manifesto and Mao's Little Red Book.

But, the Bible and Malleus have been around a lot longer. How many people died in the various wars, inquisitions, crusades? How many nations did the Israelites fight in the bible? How many cannanites were put to the sword when the Israelites took the promised land? How many suicide bombers? How many terrorists? How many died in the 7 day war? How many in the Holocaust? A lot of misery and death has been caused, either directly or indirectly, by the words of Jesus, his apostles and the prophets.

/ I'd say that the Bible is number one on the blood soaked list; Malleus might be anywhere from two to five; I'd say that the Communist Manifesto is defiantly in the top 10, if not the top 5. And the same of Mao's Little Red Book
 
2014-03-02 04:22:08 PM  
mentalfloss.com

I don't want to alarm anyone but that girl in the middle is actually a witch. Look at her eyes!
 
2014-03-02 04:24:21 PM  
Be interesting to compare the rates of "accused witches in Colonial America not dying" versus "accused felons in 21st century America not doing jail time."

I'm willing to bet you had a better chance beating the witch rap than you do of beating the DA. Which considering the DA's evidence will be based on perjury and pseudoscience, is not that great.
 
2014-03-02 04:41:15 PM  

Slaxl: [mentalfloss.com image 620x424]

I don't want to alarm anyone but that girl in the middle is actually a witch. Look at her eyes!


That's not the word I'd use for it.
 
2014-03-02 04:41:34 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: omeganuepsilon: Benevolent Misanthrope: Needlessly Complicated: Benevolent Misanthrope: 1. Be a woman.

Aaaaaaand, we're done. Women are the Debbil and deserve anything that happens to them. That hasn't changed much in the US. You have no idea how refreshing it is to live in a place where that particular part of the "women are lesser" idea never took root.

What place is that? I would like to go to there, please.

Canada.  Northern Alberta, specifically.  Sexism certainly exists - but it doesn't have that religio-moral component to it.  And if a woman can perform at the same level as a man, no one gives a crap that she's a woman.

That is a little more prevalent in the states than you make it sound by saying "that hasn't changed much" from the times of the Salem witch burnings.  Just a tad disingenuous.

It's not nice to come into the middle of a conversation and pretend you know what's being discussed, based on the last few words.  Now, hush.  Grown-ups are talking.


1. The thread is here for all to see and to be read in sequence.
2.  The "conversation", as quoted, is in it's entirety.  It is neither long nor complicated.
3. Your initial post, about how not much has changed(the point of contention), was at the very beginning of the thread.

So you got called out as being a dick, and now you're being condescending about how I didn't get it?  My you're full of yourself.

Welcome to fark, I suppose.
 
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