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(NESN)   Dutch speedskating coach says US athletes' emphasis on playing football is to blame for US Men's dreadful Olympic performance, then drops the mic with, "you got zero medals. Zero, man"   (nesn.com) divider line 54
    More: Fail, Winter Olympics, speed skating, Dutch, United States, athlete of the year, Under Armour, Sports in the United States  
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1161 clicks; posted to Sports » on 21 Feb 2014 at 5:46 PM (25 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-21 03:17:20 PM
Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.
 
2014-02-21 03:56:22 PM

eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.


Would you like some cheese with that w(h)ine?
 
2014-02-21 04:08:16 PM
The coverage I saw of the speedskating events mostly centered around the American team blaming their shiatty performances on their new bodysuits (which struck me as a load of whiny horseshiat), and incredulity that countries like Poland could possibly beat Superior American Athletes™.

If the attitude of the athletes was at all similar to the attitude of the broadcasters, then a verbal beatdown from a Dutchman named Jill was probably in order.
 
2014-02-21 04:10:13 PM
The Dutch picked one thing and are very good at it.  Good for them.  BTW... don't they play hockey in the Netherlands?  I didn't see their olympic team in Sochi.
 
2014-02-21 04:14:03 PM

eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.


Speed skating is a spectator sport, and a very popular one in The Netherlands.  They get a lot of talent with the money sunk into it.

As a country, we've decided to sink our talent reserves into football.  And baseball.  And hockey.  And basketball.  And track & field.  And gymnastics.  And rowing.  And volleyball.  And we're not actually too bad at soccer, although the Dutch are considerably better.  So he's right... no need for us to get mad.
 
2014-02-21 04:50:01 PM
Anema was asked if he thought the United States' controversial Under Armour suits contributed to Team USA's lackluster showing this year. His response was a mouthful. "The suit was one of the reasons, but not because it was bad," Anema said. "It is because they believed it was bad. In skating, you have to believe in yourself like Americans always do. Americans always believe they're right, always believe that they're the best. That's not true."

If only there was a method of relieving Anema's butthurt.
 
2014-02-21 05:29:59 PM

gopher321: eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.

Would you like some cheese with that w(h)ine?



Not wine but endless talking about it at the next extended family dinner which require more wine, I am related to one of the winners and he will bring it up far too much and he does not even play rugby to make up for it.
 
2014-02-21 05:51:02 PM
"You kill each other in American football. It's so rough, and because you like it and you've got all the money into that sport, there's not a lot of money in the other sports," he said. "Just nobody in the world wants to compete in that sport with you."

The truth hurts.  He could just as well be talking about the overall lack of success of US soccer too.
 
2014-02-21 06:00:19 PM

bdub77: Anema was asked if he thought the United States' controversial Under Armour suits contributed to Team USA's lackluster showing this year. His response was a mouthful. "The suit was one of the reasons, but not because it was bad," Anema said. "It is because they believed it was bad. In skating, you have to believe in yourself like Americans always do. Americans always believe they're right, always believe that they're the best. That's not true."

If only there was a method of relieving Anema's butthurt.


One of the things that strikes me with this statement... if you want to be the best you first have to believe that you're the best. Then you have to try to be better than that every single day.

They took a gamble with the suits and they lost. A bigger issue for the US team is that it appears that they just can't skate at sea level. Training center is at a high altitude and you can stake a different style at altitude that is less effective at sea level. When you train everyday at altitude and skate that style, that style becomes ingrained into your muscle memory.
 
2014-02-21 06:06:45 PM

JSam21: They took a gamble with the suits and they lost. A bigger issue for the US team is that it appears that they just can't skate at sea level. Training center is at a high altitude and you can stake a different style at altitude that is less effective at sea level. When you train everyday at altitude and skate that style, that style becomes ingrained into your muscle memory.



As a Milwaukeean who works and lives within a couple of miles of the Pettit National Ice Center, I'm almost glad they tanked this year.  The speed skating team ignored the training success of Eric Heiden and Bonnie Blair, went off to SLC, ignored the more-appropriate training center, ice condition, and altitude of our humble city, and lost the gamble big time.  Maybe they'll learn and come back.
 
2014-02-21 06:08:55 PM

eurotrader: Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years.


Holy shiat -- "It's better because more money" is the most American response you could have possibly given. Bravo, Cletus.

Please re-read this quote from the skating coach and take it to heart: "Americans always believe they're right, always believe that they're the best. That's not true."
 
2014-02-21 06:12:01 PM
ImOKWithThis.jpg
 
2014-02-21 06:24:30 PM
The guy is right, but look at the medal standings.  The US leads in overall total and is trails for most golds by a few.  The Dutch should be happy we waste time on non-Olympic sports. Can you imagine if we took our real athletes and had them all participate in Olympic sports? The other nations would barely medal in a single event if we taught Bo Jackson, Deion Sanders, and Devin Hester how to skate.
 
2014-02-21 06:29:37 PM

Master P but not that one: The guy is right, but look at the medal standings.  The US leads in overall total and is trails for most golds by a few.  The Dutch should be happy we waste time on non-Olympic sports. Can you imagine if we took our real athletes and had them all participate in Olympic sports? The other nations would barely medal in a single event if we taught Bo Jackson, Deion Sanders, and Devin Hester how to skate.


^^^^THIS^^^^

They would probably cancel the Olympics if all our best athletes ignored professional sports and concentrated on obscure ones.
 
2014-02-21 06:34:50 PM
"Americans always believe they're right, always believe that they're the best. That's not true."

img.fark.net
 
2014-02-21 06:35:48 PM
How will the US ever recover from this shameful display?
 
2014-02-21 06:38:12 PM
Rank    Country    Gold    Silver    Bronze    Total
1    Norway    10    4    8    22
2    Russian Fed.    9    10    7    26
3    Canada    9    10    5    24
4     United States    9    7    11     27
5    Germany    8    4    4    16
6     Netherlands    6    7    9     22
7    Switzerland    6    3    2    11
8    Belarus    5    0    1    6
9    France    4    4    7    15
10    Poland    4    0    0    4


Scoreboard.
 
2014-02-21 06:43:14 PM
Is it time to play the "If it weren't for us, you'd all be speaking German" card yet? Or was his family one of the many Nazi collaborators?

Oh shiat, did I just nearly Godwin a thread?
 
2014-02-21 06:44:42 PM
The Chinese will probably kick our ass at ping pong too next olympics. If thats the penalty we pay to have football Im willing to pay it.
 
2014-02-21 06:49:27 PM

PowerSlacker: Scoreboard.


Yeah, but there are fewer people in the Netherlands than there are in Florida, and they have less than half of our GDP, so they're doing way better with their resources than we are. Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.
 
2014-02-21 06:57:39 PM

PowerSlacker: Rank    Country    Gold    Silver    Bronze    Total
1    Norway    10    4    8    22
2    Russian Fed.    9    10    7    26
3    Canada    9    10    5    24
4     United States    9    7    11     27
5    Germany    8    4    4    16
6     Netherlands    6    7    9     22
7    Switzerland    6    3    2    11
8    Belarus    5    0    1    6
9    France    4    4    7    15
10    Poland    4    0    0    4


Scoreboard.


16 Million people vs 330 Million?
 
2014-02-21 06:58:02 PM
Netherlands won medals in 1 sport, whereas USA has medals in 9.  22 medals in speed skating, da hell...
 
2014-02-21 07:00:12 PM
Scrotastic Method:
 Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.

By your metric, China should be atop the medal standings.
 
2014-02-21 07:03:45 PM

BunkyBrewman: The Dutch picked one thing and are very good at it.  Good for them.  BTW... don't they play hockey in the Netherlands?  I didn't see their olympic team in Sochi.


The Dutch have earned 22 medals this Olympics--ALL IN SPEED SKATING. Good for them, but that's not terribly diverse.

/But hey, for a country of 16 million, that's not half bad.
 
2014-02-21 07:04:41 PM

Scrotastic Method: PowerSlacker: Scoreboard.

Yeah, but there are fewer people in the Netherlands than there are in Florida, and they have less than half of our GDP, so they're doing way better with their resources than we are. Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.


If they gave 1 medal for speed skating like they do for ice hockey, the medal count would look a lot different.

And India would have 4x our medal count instead of 0.
 
2014-02-21 07:06:53 PM

IAmYourBrainOnDrugs: Scrotastic Method:
 Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.

By your metric, China should be atop the medal standings.


And India 2nd
 
2014-02-21 07:12:05 PM

Scrotastic Method: PowerSlacker: Scoreboard.

Yeah, but there are fewer people in the Netherlands than there are in Florida, and they have less than half of our GDP, so they're doing way better with their resources than we are. Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.


As said up thread, so many athletes go for pro sports. We'd crush it if everyone took eight years off just to do Olympics.
 
2014-02-21 07:15:14 PM

kmfjd: PowerSlacker: Rank    Country    Gold    Silver    Bronze    Total
1    Norway    10    4    8    22
2    Russian Fed.    9    10    7    26
3    Canada    9    10    5    24
4     United States    9    7    11     27
5    Germany    8    4    4    16
6     Netherlands    6    7    9     22
7    Switzerland    6    3    2    11
8    Belarus    5    0    1    6
9    France    4    4    7    15
10    Poland    4    0    0    4


Scoreboard.

16 Million people vs 330 Million?


Medals are not based on a per capita measure.  So yes, Scoreboard.
 
2014-02-21 07:42:13 PM
all props to the dutch speed skaters you did well, I just hope the US learns from this and does not make the same mistakes.
 
2014-02-21 07:43:26 PM

whither_apophis: Scrotastic Method: PowerSlacker: Scoreboard.

Yeah, but there are fewer people in the Netherlands than there are in Florida, and they have less than half of our GDP, so they're doing way better with their resources than we are. Considering our population and money we should be in 1st or 2nd place every year, er, um, I guess I mean, every Olympiad.

As said up thread, so many athletes go for pro sports. We'd crush it if everyone took eight years off just to do Olympics.


And yet we still crush. No other country shows in both summer and winter like usa. Someday we need to dump a bunch of money into the soccer world cup team and watch the world cry. Guess that would be mostly acting lessons...
 
2014-02-21 08:13:36 PM
BunkyBrewman
The Dutch picked one thing and are very good at it. Good for them. BTW... don't they play hockey in the Netherlands?


Good enough to win gold and silver.

www2.pictures.zimbio.com

www1.pictures.zimbio.com
 
2014-02-21 08:19:35 PM

eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.


Apollo Ono?
 
2014-02-21 08:29:12 PM
So he is basically saying, outside of the only real winter sport the US spends any actual money on supporting as a sport other than a hobby(Hockey), we could do much better.  Yet we still crush in medal counts across various sports.  The only thing the Netherlands actually devote any capital to they won medals in.  Well,.... Congratulations?

I guess I couldn't imaging American Football(hand egg) being introduced into the Olympics and subsequently watching the US pretty much laugh at the rest of the world, a US coach deriding another country for their dreadful performances due to enjoying other athletic pursuits.

I guess there are no medals for class, so this guy is safe.
 
2014-02-21 09:17:18 PM

Cuyose: So he is basically saying, outside of the only real winter sport the US spends any actual money on supporting as a sport other than a hobby(Hockey), we could do much better.  Yet we still crush in medal counts across various sports.  The only thing the Netherlands actually devote any capital to they won medals in.  Well,.... Congratulations?

I guess I couldn't imaging American Football(hand egg) being introduced into the Olympics and subsequently watching the US pretty much laugh at the rest of the world, a US coach deriding another country for their dreadful performances due to enjoying other athletic pursuits.

I guess there are no medals for class, so this guy is safe.


Imagine if Chuck Daly said something like this in 92, lol.
 
2014-02-21 10:15:03 PM
I guess since the Olympics is the collection of sports not popular enough to have leagues that anyone gives a sh*t about, and the Winter Olympics is the collection of sports that aren't good enough to make it into the real Olympics, and speed skating isn't even within the top 10 of most popular Winter Olympics sports...we should be focusing on THAT worthless sport. Silly us.

/yeah, there are a couple of sports in the Olympics that have international leagues of note - basketball and hockey. For both sports, the Olympics are basically a side mission and don't matter nearly as much as league trophies
 
2014-02-21 10:15:08 PM

eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.


There was a Dutch speed skater named Ard Schenk yrs ago who competed in the Worlds Greatest Athlete competition back in the 70s....that is maybe the only Dutch skater to do anything outside of skating

Most of the Dutch skaters end up doing regular jobs when skating is over
 
2014-02-21 10:24:02 PM
I wonder how much of Holland's GNP is spent on speed skating?
 
2014-02-21 10:26:02 PM
In a way he's right...a lot of American athletes opt to play football because of the opportunities it proves.  One of those athletes realized that there was a need for better gear for under the pads than cotton T-shirts which let him to create Under Armour.  Which became the company that made the suits that we didn't medal in.
 
2014-02-21 10:30:41 PM

factoryconnection: eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.

Speed skating is a spectator sport, and a very popular one in The Netherlands.  They get a lot of talent with the money sunk into it.

As a country, we've decided to sink our talent reserves into football.  And baseball.  And hockey.  And basketball.  And track & field.  And gymnastics.  And rowing.  And volleyball.  And we're not actually too bad at soccer, although the Dutch are considerably better.  So he's right... no need for us to get mad.


Yeah not nearly as much as you think, its on par with like minor league baseball, some make a lot but most barely get by.
 
2014-02-21 10:32:27 PM

RINO: eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.

Apollo Ono?


Yeah where is he, that's the only skater I could name and even I had trouble remembering his name.
 
2014-02-21 10:48:04 PM

Solid State Vittles: "You kill each other in American football. It's so rough, and because you like it and you've got all the money into that sport, there's not a lot of money in the other sports," he said. "Just nobody in the world wants to compete in that sport with you."

The truth hurts.  He could just as well be talking about the overall lack of success of US soccer too.


No, because the whole damn world wants to compete in soccer with us.

American football is, at the risk of sounding obvious, the American version of what Gaelic football is in Ireland. Big sport within its nation, kids from that country dream of playing for their local football team (of whichever version), the teams the nation puts out are by far the best in the world... but nobody outside their country gives a rat's ass about the sport, comprehends it, or cares to comprehend it. The NFL is nothing more than an American-scaled local equivalent of Gaelic football.

Let me put it this way. The United States has a national team in American football. But it has some limits imposed in exchange for even being allowed to play (the first two editions of American football's World Cup, the US was barred from competing because of the obvious domination and injury risk). The team must be composed of players out of the NFL or even CFL (though it appears a couple fringe NFL'ers did get on the 2011 squad- Johnny Dingle, DeWayne Lewis and Richie Brockel). They have to be out of college. They have to be no more than one year out of college. The team has to take from all divisions of college football: FBS, FCS, D2, D3, and NAIA.

All other nations are permitted to field an all-hands-on-deck team.

Given all those restrictions... the United States still whips everyone they play by a wide enough margin of victory that you're half-scared to have the two teams on the field together. The 2011 gold medal match was a 50-7 destruction of Canada, led by quarterback Cody Hawkins, formerly of Colorado, then, after the tournament, of the Stockholm Mean Machines.
 
2014-02-21 11:16:40 PM

Gosling: Solid State Vittles: "You kill each other in American football. It's so rough, and because you like it and you've got all the money into that sport, there's not a lot of money in the other sports," he said. "Just nobody in the world wants to compete in that sport with you."

The truth hurts.  He could just as well be talking about the overall lack of success of US soccer too.

No, because the whole damn world wants to compete in soccer with us.

American football is, at the risk of sounding obvious, the American version of what Gaelic football is in Ireland. Big sport within its nation, kids from that country dream of playing for their local football team (of whichever version), the teams the nation puts out are by far the best in the world... but nobody outside their country gives a rat's ass about the sport, comprehends it, or cares to comprehend it. The NFL is nothing more than an American-scaled local equivalent of Gaelic football.

Let me put it this way. The United States has a national team in American football. But it has some limits imposed in exchange for even being allowed to play (the first two editions of American football's World Cup, the US was barred from competing because of the obvious domination and injury risk). The team must be composed of players out of the NFL or even CFL (though it appears a couple fringe NFL'ers did get on the 2011 squad- Johnny Dingle, DeWayne Lewis and Richie Brockel). They have to be out of college. They have to be no more than one year out of college. The team has to take from all divisions of college football: FBS, FCS, D2, D3, and NAIA.

All other nations are permitted to field an all-hands-on-deck team.

Given all those restrictions... the United States still whips everyone they play by a wide enough margin of victory that you're half-scared to have the two teams on the field together. The 2011 gold medal match was a 50-7 destruction of Canada, led by quarterback Cody Hawkins, formerly of Colorado, then, after the tournament, of the Stockholm Mean Machines.


Yeah I read that a few years ago and was shocked at the restrictions they placed on the American team and even more shocked they almost lost to the japs the first time championship game. If you've ever been to Japan I'm shocked they didn't just run over them every play.
 
2014-02-21 11:58:06 PM

Kuta: BunkyBrewman: The Dutch picked one thing and are very good at it.  Good for them.  BTW... don't they play hockey in the Netherlands?  I didn't see their olympic team in Sochi.

The Dutch have earned 22 medals this Olympics--ALL IN SPEED SKATING. Good for them, but that's not terribly diverse.

/But hey, for a country of 16 million, that's not half bad.


Incorrect, 21 in speed skating 1 in short track :)
 
2014-02-21 11:59:57 PM

chuggernaught: kmfjd: PowerSlacker: Rank    Country    Gold    Silver    Bronze    Total
1    Norway    10    4    8    22
2    Russian Fed.    9    10    7    26
3    Canada    9    10    5    24
4     United States    9    7    11     27
5    Germany    8    4    4    16
6     Netherlands    6    7    9     22
7    Switzerland    6    3    2    11
8    Belarus    5    0    1    6
9    France    4    4    7    15
10    Poland    4    0    0    4


Scoreboard.

16 Million people vs 330 Million?

Medals are not based on a per capita measure.  So yes, Scoreboard.


No worries, i think Norway and Netherlands have done pretty well considering....
 
2014-02-22 12:37:31 AM

Master P but not that one: The guy is right, but look at the medal standings.  The US leads in overall total and is trails for most golds by a few.  The Dutch should be happy we waste time on non-Olympic sports. Can you imagine if we took our real athletes and had them all participate in Olympic sports? The other nations would barely medal in a single event if we taught Bo Jackson, Deion Sanders, and Devin Hester how to skate.


Correct the medal standings for population though...
 
2014-02-22 12:42:56 AM
It really isn't football.

First, it is a non-starter on the female side (aside from the "money spent on men helps women because better rinks...").

For the guys, those speedskaters look nothing like a football player.  In the 5000 (which they swept) Kramer is 6'2", 185, silver was 6', 175, and bronze (gold in 10k) was 6'3" 165.  Those aren't football player numbers.  Maybe some WRs.  So football is not taking our precious speedskating talent.

I'd say, if we want to win, we should recruit ex-track athletes.  Find the tall middle distance runners.  They'll have the body type and the VO2 to compete.  Just have to teach them form.  It will take some time, but it can work.  That's how we do bobsled (ex-sprinters as pushers)
 
2014-02-22 02:19:41 AM
...so, a 'down year' for the US still results in a crap ton of medals in a wide variety of sports that the US devotes very little money towards...and we should be upset about one sport where we underperformed so much that we should nix our most popular sport in order to siphon those athletes into sports that not nearly as lucrative for an event that comes around every four years and gives out medals?

Uhh...sure, very logical thinking there, skip. Now try suggesting that Latin American countries like Mexico do the same with their soccer players and see what kind of response you get.
 
2014-02-22 02:38:01 AM

fickenchucker: Master P but not that one: The guy is right, but look at the medal standings.  The US leads in overall total and is trails for most golds by a few.  The Dutch should be happy we waste time on non-Olympic sports. Can you imagine if we took our real athletes and had them all participate in Olympic sports? The other nations would barely medal in a single event if we taught Bo Jackson, Deion Sanders, and Devin Hester how to skate.

^^^^THIS^^^^

They would probably cancel the Olympics if all our best athletes ignored professional sports and concentrated on obscure ones.


And that's why baseball and softball are no longer Olympic sports. Same reason why golf is back in 2016. More European players are having success on the PGA tour.
 
2014-02-22 02:48:30 AM

steamingpile: RINO: eurotrader: Can anyone name one speed skater let alone one that has made a good living competing?  Competing in a sport that has no spectators  others than friends and family along with no chance to make a living competing in the sport makes it a hobby sport. Americans and most of the world prefer their children to compete in real sports that offer the chance of buying the big house and cars and not just a few people watching every four years. I am will to bet none of NL's speed skating winners could even play for Ajax.

Apollo Ono?

Yeah where is he, that's the only skater I could name and even I had trouble remembering his name.


Dan Jansen and Bonnie Blair.
 
2014-02-22 02:56:21 AM

Solid State Vittles: The truth hurts.


No, not really
 
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