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(The Wire)   Bad: You get caught plagiarizing. Embarrassing: From a high school student's blog post. Holy Fark: In an official bill you introduce as a state legislator   (thewire.com) divider line 59
    More: Fail, state legislators, Chicago, New York State Senate, Blackfish, state senators, Blogging, high schools  
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8741 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Feb 2014 at 4:06 PM (20 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-20 02:38:18 PM
Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?
 
2014-02-20 03:10:36 PM
"Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?"

~Rand Paul
 
2014-02-20 04:09:44 PM

shanrick: "Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?"

~Rand Paul


Thread over.
 
2014-02-20 04:10:23 PM
I was really hoping he'd be a democrat just to mix things up a little.

Nope.
 
2014-02-20 04:10:28 PM
Hmm, since it's a high school opinion, I'm going with democrat, republican positions tend to aim a bit lower.
 
2014-02-20 04:10:34 PM
Well... Apart from the fact Seaworld isn't opening on the great lakes anytime soon, isn't putting together legislation in line with whom you have plagiarized really more a compliment and acknowledging their contribution toward the legislation you use it in?
 
2014-02-20 04:11:08 PM

Rand Paul: shanrick: "Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?"

~Rand Paul

Thread over.

 
2014-02-20 04:11:13 PM

ikanreed: Hmm, since it's a high school opinion, I'm going with democrat, republican positions tend to aim a bit lower.


Hypothesis verified.
 
2014-02-20 04:11:49 PM
cdn.theatlantic.com


.......


static.fjcdn.com
 
2014-02-20 04:12:47 PM
do the ends justify the means?

 The guy is trying to safeguard whales and dolphins.

 If he really cared about the subject he should have sat down and wrote something himself.
 
2014-02-20 04:13:29 PM
I thought "Tax Cuts! The Answer to Everything" was the brainchild of a 12 year old?
 
2014-02-20 04:14:46 PM
FTFA: "As the Times-Union notes, Ball did introduce a typo on "place," perhaps a savvy attempt to fool people looking for evidence of plagiarism."

No. I doubt it. Ball, with the audacity of most any other politician, just didn't think he was going to get caught. Plus, of all words to misspell or improperly conjugate out of the plagiarized sentence, I highly doubt it would be "place".
 
2014-02-20 04:15:14 PM
With skills like that, you can one day be Vice President!
 
2014-02-20 04:15:17 PM
Thread over.

-Rand Paul
 
2014-02-20 04:15:57 PM

shanrick: "Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL SHIA LEBEOUF?"

~Rand Paul


~ Shia LeBeouf

FTFSL
 
2014-02-20 04:16:08 PM
I guess it's cheaper than selling your soul to lobbyists for them to write the bills for you, amiright?
 
2014-02-20 04:16:47 PM
Honestly how hard is it to bribe a 12 year old?  Your not even trying.
 
2014-02-20 04:16:48 PM
Who cares?  The point of a bill is to make a law, not to get an "A" in a class.  Who actually wrote the verbiage makes no difference whatsoever, as long as it's good policy.
 
2014-02-20 04:20:17 PM
FTFA: Rapier wasn't the only victim.

Was it legitimate?
 
2014-02-20 04:21:59 PM
Probably written up by a staffer, who is now in big trouble for getting caught - reading HuffPo and the LA Times.
 
2014-02-20 04:23:40 PM
I tried to read the article and got bored...

Just tell me,

Do I need to set my whale free or not?

/I suppose it'd be nice to use the bathtub again.
//But, he does seem to like the shower.
 
2014-02-20 04:24:12 PM

genner: Honestly how hard is it to bribe a 12 year old?  Your You're not even trying.


/what's a plagiarism thread without a grammar Nazi? ;)
 
2014-02-20 04:24:36 PM
img.fark.net

Problem?
 
2014-02-20 04:24:55 PM
This is going to really suck if it passes.  I'm going to have a hell of a hard time getting my dolphin out of my basement.  Actually, I don't think Jonathan Martin wants to go anywhere anyway.
 
2014-02-20 04:25:24 PM
Bad: You get caught plagiarizing. Embarrassing: From a high school student's blog post. Holy Fark: In an official bill you introduce as a state legislator

--Rand Paul
 
2014-02-20 04:28:08 PM

Weatherkiss: shanrick: "Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL SHIA LEBEOUF?"

~Rand Paul

~ Shia LeBeouf

FTFSL


--RAND PAUL

/FTFY
 
2014-02-20 04:28:25 PM
Didn't realize that whale slavery was that big of issue for NY state that they need legislation.
 
2014-02-20 04:28:49 PM
Serious Black [TotalFark]


Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?

media.al.com
What's wrong with a little plagiarism... and racism.. and ....
 
2014-02-20 04:29:22 PM

OnlyM3: Serious Black [TotalFark]


Are we sure the bill wasn't written by RAND PAUL?
[media.al.com image 850x600]
What's wrong with a little plagiarism... and racism.. and ....


Answer for your dumb climate change website, jerk.
 
2014-02-20 04:47:24 PM
Ball's bill lifts that entire paragraph, including that last point: "dolphins and whales are actually faced with several health problems that shorten their life span and cause insanity when they are place in captivity." As the Times-Union notes, Ball did introduce a typo on "place," perhaps a savvy attempt to fool people looking for evidence of plagiarism.

Meanwhile at Google.com:
Showing results for How can I foil  plagiarism
Search instead for How can I foil plagarism

/yep, super savvy dude
 
2014-02-20 04:50:32 PM

lumiere: FTFA: "As the Times-Union notes, Ball did introduce a typo on "place," perhaps a savvy attempt to fool people looking for evidence of plagiarism."

No. I doubt it. Ball, with the audacity of most any other politician, just didn't think he was going to get caught. Plus, of all words to misspell or improperly conjugate out of the plagiarized sentence, I highly doubt it would be "place".


Are you Poe's lawing me dude?
 
2014-02-20 05:03:11 PM
considering how serious a penalty the highschooler would get if he did the same to the legislator I think it would be fair that he be censured.
 
2014-02-20 05:09:21 PM
Maybe Sen. BIll was just hoping they'd pass the law so he could find out what was in it?
 
2014-02-20 05:13:36 PM

jshine: Who cares?  The point of a bill is to make a law, not to get an "A" in a class.  Who actually wrote the verbiage makes no difference whatsoever, as long as it's good policy.



This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The 'high school blogger' didn't come up with the original thought. He found that information someplace else. So why isn't the kid a plagiarist
 too? So what if he arranged the words differently.
 
2014-02-20 05:13:41 PM
Legislative fact finding at work.
 
2014-02-20 05:15:07 PM

bratface: jshine: Who cares?  The point of a bill is to make a law, not to get an "A" in a class.  Who actually wrote the verbiage makes no difference whatsoever, as long as it's good policy.


This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The 'high school blogger' didn't come up with the original thought. He found that information someplace else. So why isn't the kid a plagiarist too? So what if he arranged the words differently.


Uh, 'cause that makes it not plagiarism any more?
 
2014-02-20 05:17:14 PM
Professor semiotix here, professional (and arguably dickish) scourge of plagiarists. Plagiarism is bad, m'kay? So is copyright violation. But this ain't that.

The function of a legislative bill isn't to make its author look smart, or get him royalties, or fulfill a scholarly assignment. It's not a place where an original author could meaningfully benefit from an acknowledgement. So while this is lazy, and pretty embarrassing considering the original source, it's the wrong word.

Plagiarism requires a victim.[citation needed] Either authors denied credit in a forum where they might actually get some, or someone being lied to about where information came from. (When a sophomore copies from Wikipedia, she's lying by omission, since the presumption is always that work not otherwise cited is by the author.)

Having typed all this, I guess I don't really have a larger point, because I agree this guy should be made fun of for ripping off a high school essay. But I'm an academic, and I'm counting this as service to the broader scholarly community. You're welcome.
 
2014-02-20 05:17:52 PM
Pfft, that's nothing. In my country you get national senators plagiarizing bills from wikipedia and yahoo! Answers ffs!

/cries in beer
 
2014-02-20 05:19:52 PM

semiotix: Professor semiotix here, professional (and arguably dickish) scourge of plagiarists. Plagiarism is bad, m'kay? So is copyright violation. But this ain't that.

The function of a legislative bill isn't to make its author look smart, or get him royalties, or fulfill a scholarly assignment. It's not a place where an original author could meaningfully benefit from an acknowledgement. So while this is lazy, and pretty embarrassing considering the original source, it's the wrong word.

Plagiarism requires a victim.[citation needed] Either authors denied credit in a forum where they might actually get some, or someone being lied to about where information came from. (When a sophomore copies from Wikipedia, she's lying by omission, since the presumption is always that work not otherwise cited is by the author.)

Having typed all this, I guess I don't really have a larger point, because I agree this guy should be made fun of for ripping off a high school essay. But I'm an academic, and I'm counting this as service to the broader scholarly community. You're welcome.


In what conceivable way is this NOT copyright violation?
 
2014-02-20 05:33:18 PM
Ball's bill lifts that entire paragraph, including that last point: "dolphins and whales are actually faced with several health problems that shorten their life span and cause insanity when they are place in captivity." As the  Times-Union notes, Ball did introduce a typo on "place," perhaps a savvy attempt to fool people looking for evidence of plagiarism.

This guy must be a republican or something.  This sounds wholly inconsequential but will probably need a subcommittee investigation because dolphins.
 
2014-02-20 05:34:11 PM
Better that than ALEC, imo.


LarryDan43: I thought "Tax Cuts! The Answer to Everything" was the brainchild of a 12 year old?


www.citizensinchargefoundation.org
 
2014-02-20 05:36:26 PM

Far Cough: In what conceivable way is this NOT copyright violation?


For one thing, because   de minimis copying is always permitted. A single paragraph, which is what they're talking about here, is virtually never going to be found infringing.

For another, Congress--and I'm assuming this applies to the states as well--is explicitly permitted to incorporate copyrighted works, either explicitly or by reference. Federal laws themselves can't be copyrighted--again, I assume that applies to states, but IANAL/YMMV/LOLOMGWTF--and repeating a copyrighted work verbatim brings it by force into the public domain. Usually this is more for technical standards (and usually Congress is careful NOT to directly incorporate those standards, so that the private authors can continue to charge for them), but I don't see why it wouldn't apply to blog posts too.

I guess we can argue about whether the shiattiness of this rises to the level of plagiarism, but the high schooler wouldn't have a chance in hell of prevailing in a copyright suit.
 
2014-02-20 05:39:23 PM
img.fark.net
 
2014-02-20 05:49:08 PM

semiotix: Far Cough: In what conceivable way is this NOT copyright violation?

For one thing, because   de minimis copying is always permitted. A single paragraph, which is what they're talking about here, is virtually never going to be found infringing.

For another, Congress--and I'm assuming this applies to the states as well--is explicitly permitted to incorporate copyrighted works, either explicitly or by reference. Federal laws themselves can't be copyrighted--again, I assume that applies to states, but IANAL/YMMV/LOLOMGWTF--and repeating a copyrighted work verbatim brings it by force into the public domain. Usually this is more for technical standards (and usually Congress is careful NOT to directly incorporate those standards, so that the private authors can continue to charge for them), but I don't see why it wouldn't apply to blog posts too.

I guess we can argue about whether the shiattiness of this rises to the level of plagiarism, but the high schooler wouldn't have a chance in hell of prevailing in a copyright suit.


That, plus the big chunk he copied from the LA Times, again presumably without credit or permission. If multiple smaller segments are copied from individual copyright holders such that much of a work is unoriginal, have those writers no recourse as a group?
 
2014-02-20 06:24:19 PM
And where were the giant corporations that usually write these bills so legislators don't have to? Where were they?

I blame corporate America. They've let thee Republicans down.

I assume it was a Republican. I didn't bother to look.

A Democrat would not steal his homework from a student blog. Fastest way to a C-.
 
2014-02-20 06:33:51 PM

fusillade762: Better that than ALEC, imo.


LarryDan43: I thought "Tax Cuts! The Answer to Everything" was the brainchild of a 12 year old?

[www.citizensinchargefoundation.org image 298x448]


You would think he would have a VERY punchable face, but really it's just... forgettable.  Just some slightly chubby guy who has the kids this weekend... not a psychopathic juvenile with little understanding of macroeconomics or human compassion.
 
2014-02-20 06:51:29 PM

Far Cough: That, plus the big chunk he copied from the LA Times, again presumably without credit or permission. If multiple smaller segments are copied from individual copyright holders such that much of a work is unoriginal, have those writers no recourse as a group?


If I steal one sentence from every bestselling book ever written (or any such thing), the courts will rule that what I created is a new thing. Not only legit, but my mashup of sentences will itself be eminently protected. They can't all band together because by the spirit (and letter) of the law, I haven't hurt any of them.

I didn't realize there was a bigger chunk from someone else. Depending on how big a chunk, if he'd ripped it off for his own privately published book about whales (say), they could conceivably prevail, although citation isn't relevant there. But remember, blatant and massive and theoretically actionable copyright infringement occurs all the time, including a thousand times a day right here on Fark. It's usually just not a big deal.

As for this specific case, I'm guessing sovereign immunity comes into play when something is being "infringed" for a legislative act. All copyright claims happen in federal court, so whether all legislatures could get away with it, or just Congress... *shrug*.
 
2014-02-20 08:01:27 PM

semiotix: Professor semiotix here, professional (and arguably dickish) scourge of plagiarists. Plagiarism is bad, m'kay? So is copyright violation. But this ain't that.

The function of a legislative bill isn't to make its author look smart, or get him royalties, or fulfill a scholarly assignment. It's not a place where an original author could meaningfully benefit from an acknowledgement. So while this is lazy, and pretty embarrassing considering the original source, it's the wrong word.

Plagiarism requires a victim.[citation needed] Either authors denied credit in a forum where they might actually get some, or someone being lied to about where information came from. (When a sophomore copies from Wikipedia, she's lying by omission, since the presumption is always that work not otherwise cited is by the author.)

Having typed all this, I guess I don't really have a larger point, because I agree this guy should be made fun of for ripping off a high school essay. But I'm an academic, and I'm counting this as service to the broader scholarly community. You're welcome.


So where did you copy this from?
 
2014-02-20 08:04:57 PM
What he should have done was not just quote bit cite the kid, even mention that it was specifically a high school student's blog post that was so inspiring. Kid would have gotten proper credit, state senator would have looked like a sweetheart.
 
2014-02-20 08:09:54 PM
Greg Ball is a Moran! When he was running for office he had his mom making calls to round up votes, why should you vote for him? because he was in the Air Force. That was the only  reason, no sh*t.

The Moran already fired some staffer over this.
 
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