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(NYPost)   Everything we know about Kitty Genovese is wrong   (nypost.com) divider line 27
    More: Interesting, Kitty Genovese, Kew Gardens  
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11715 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Feb 2014 at 6:39 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2014-02-16 07:00:50 PM  
15 votes:
Personally, I believe the police pushed the story of uncaring neighbors to cover up their own incompetence for failing to respond.
2014-02-16 06:05:25 PM  
8 votes:
FTA: "...the real thoughtlessness came from a police commissioner who lazily passed a falsehood to a journalist, and a media that fell so deeply in love with a story that it couldn't be bothered to determine whether it was true."

I see that journalism hasn't changed at all in 50 years.
2014-02-16 06:27:03 PM  
6 votes:

DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.


Not in NYC if you're not connected.
2014-02-16 07:32:32 PM  
4 votes:
The only wrong thing about the Kitty Genovese story is that anyone still believes the long-debunked mythos that "38 people stood and watched the whole thing and did nothing." Most people--certainly anyone in criminology and sociology--knows that the "38 people" story is conflated from the fact that 38 total people saw or heard something on that night, that some or all of them SAID they could have done "something" or "could have done more"; that at least one person yelled out the window to Genovese's attacker but did not confront him; that at least one person called the police but it was unclear who; and that the entire story was spun by subsequent journalists and social do-gooders as a heinous example of how disconnected and apathetic urban society had become. But the truth has always been out there.

But if you rely on pop culture for your history instead of, you know, actual history books, then what you'll get is the "38 people watched Kitty Genovese die and did nothing," instead of the facts, and serve you right.
2014-02-16 07:14:41 PM  
3 votes:

OgreMagi: Personally, I believe the police pushed the story of uncaring neighbors to cover up their own incompetence for failing to respond.


That's exactly what happened. A little digging by the New York press would have uncovered that.

But this story is just another example of how the initial reports, no matter how wrong, become the accepted facts. The "uncaring neighbors" story has been debunked numerous times. But most people who have heard Kitty Genovese are convinced its true.
2014-02-16 06:49:17 PM  
3 votes:
So, it was wrong, but not wrong enough to change the essential message of the original story.

Gotcha.
2014-02-16 06:45:02 PM  
3 votes:
there was NO WAY to summarize that story?
FFS

NO WAY to layout the list of OLD version vs NEW version?
FFS, what a waste of brain cells

and now they have to change everything that they taught us in psych 101 ??

HAHAH
2014-02-16 06:31:16 PM  
3 votes:
♫ Oh, look outside the window
There's a woman being grabbed
They've dragged her to the bushes
And now she's being stabbed

Maybe we should call the cops
And try to stop the pain
But Monopoly is so much fun
I'd hate to blow the game

And I'm sure
It wouldn't interest anybody
Outside of a small circle of friends ♫

/and this, children, is how pop culture perpetuates urban myth
2014-02-16 06:11:35 PM  
3 votes:
Was she raped and killed?

Then I at least know something correct about her.
2014-02-16 06:02:51 PM  
3 votes:
This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.
2014-02-17 06:48:43 AM  
2 votes:

Jument: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Yes, because letting one incident change your life is sane.


My one incident was the Cheshire Massacre. It happened not too far from Sandy Hook, and is far more relevant to individual gun rights, but not as sexy to the media and certain politicians as a school full of dead kids.
2014-02-16 07:51:25 PM  
2 votes:
profileimages.torn.com

Does not approve
2014-02-16 07:09:26 PM  
2 votes:

DrPainMD: TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Not in NYC if you're not connected.

I don't live in NY, but you assume that I would let the law interfere with my ownership of guns. You would be wrong.


Responsible Gun Owner© right here, people.
2014-02-16 06:42:05 PM  
2 votes:

DrPainMD: FTA: "...the real thoughtlessness came from a police commissioner who lazily passed a falsehood to a journalist, and a media that fell so deeply in love with a story that it couldn't be bothered to determine whether it was true."

I see that journalism hasn't changed at all in 50 years.


Some other things haven't changed since then, either.


The story made the Genovese murder front-page news around the world. People began wondering aloud how society had fallen so far, and letters to the editors at various newspapers blamed everything from television to the "women's-lib movement."
2014-02-17 05:15:29 AM  
1 votes:

Manic Depressive Mouse: Gyrfalcon:

But if you rely on pop culture for your history instead of, you know, actual history books, then what you'll get is the "38 people watched Kitty Genovese die and did nothing," instead of the facts, and serve you right.

What about psychology books? 'cause I'm pretty sure the "38 people watched and did nothing, ergo Bystander Effect" was what was taught in ours.

\can't remember the name of the book, sorry. As I said, pretty sure, not 100% positive.


That's pop culture. It was the idea that 38 people saw or heard something and didn't INTERVENE that caused researchers to examine what led to the conclusions that are now called the Bystander Effect; but that's not the same thing. You're condensing the entire event plus decades of research into one pop-culture phrase, and that's what people get wrong.

To unsummarize: Researchers were interested in why 38 (or more) people could have heard or seen something and not actively intervened in the event; since by at least one man's admission, he saw part of the attack and yelled down at Mosely, but did not do anything more, and one woman said she "opened her curtains" but when she saw nothing (since Genovese had crawled into the shadows by then) she went back to bed. They wondered why so many people could have witnessed something and not "done something" because everyone was sure THEY would have "done something"; and this led to a series of experiments in which a subject would be placed in a room with one or two other people (researchers) and a mock victim in the next room. The victim would pretend to fall or have a seizure, and the subject's response was monitored.

Subsequent tests found that the greater the number of people in the room with the subject, the less likely any one person was to actively intervene; this was called the "Bystander Effect"; and was then used retroactively to explain why so many people at the Genovese murder could have heard or seen "something" and not actively intervened. It did NOT flow directly from the Genovese murder into the creation of the "Bystander Effect" as people seem to believe.
2014-02-16 11:40:00 PM  
1 votes:

ChuckyV: [profileimages.torn.com image 600x799]

Does not approve


Hurm.
img.fark.net
2014-02-16 09:53:17 PM  
1 votes:

wildcardjack: FrancoFile: Everything?

So she was actually a South African Indian, with a wooden leg, working as a translator for a publishing house, and married to an Irish truck driver?  Wow.

[www.albinoblacksheep.com image 850x478]

Everything you know is wrong


Everything you know is wrong!
2014-02-16 08:51:27 PM  
1 votes:
Yesterday afternoon at the highway exit ramp, I was waiting to turn left.  A woman got out of the car next to me in the right-turn lane, crying, and started walking down the road.  The driver of the car (I assume boyfriend/husband), turned right, rolled the window down, and pulled up next to her.  She kept walking, then crossed 4 lanes of traffic to get away from the car, then started walking back the other way.  He drove down, pulled a u-turn, and came back to her again.

Not sure where I'm going with this, but I considered calling the cops and then decided against it.  No signs of violence or other coercion, and by the time they responded who knows where the two of them would be.

/NSCSB
2014-02-16 08:33:16 PM  
1 votes:

DrPainMD: TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Not in NYC if you're not connected.

I don't live in NY, but you assume that I would let the law interfere with my ownership of guns. You would be wrong.


Not sure what the gun is good for then. If you use it, you're in jail. If you flash it at someone, you're in jail. If someone reports you, you're in jail. If it falls out of your pocket, you're in jail. If a cop catches you with it, you're full of bullets and dead or in jail after your hospital stay.  Seriously, you don't fark with the NYPD when it comes to guns. They have a reputation to maintain.
2014-02-16 08:21:16 PM  
1 votes:
when The New York Times erroneously reported that 38 of her neighbors had seen the attack and watched it unfold without calling for help.
The Times piece was followed by a story in Life magazine


www.washingtonpost.com

STFU
2014-02-16 07:38:38 PM  
1 votes:

OgreMagi: Personally, I believe the police pushed the story of uncaring neighbors to cover up their own incompetence for failing to respond.


QFT.
2014-02-16 07:32:33 PM  
1 votes:
tl;dr
2014-02-16 07:15:54 PM  
1 votes:

TheHighlandHowler: TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Not in NYC if you're not connected.

I don't live in NY, but you assume that I would let the law interfere with my ownership of guns. You would be wrong.

I have no problem at all with your ownership.  NY State, however, mandates a year in jail for this transgression (supposedly).

Sorry, "City of NY."


This is where a woman was acquitted of killing her police officer husband where it was proved that he was a long time abuser but then given 5 years for possessing and using (one of her husband's) guns.
2014-02-16 07:04:59 PM  
1 votes:

DrPainMD: TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Not in NYC if you're not connected.

I don't live in NY, but you assume that I would let the law interfere with my ownership of guns. You would be wrong.


I have no problem at all with your ownership.  NY State, however, mandates a year in jail for this transgression (supposedly).
2014-02-16 06:57:42 PM  
1 votes:
As disturbing as the Genovese murder was, I'm more bothered by the death of Wang Yue.
2014-02-16 06:57:08 PM  
1 votes:

TheHighlandHowler: DrPainMD: This is why I paid for firearms training and a CC permit for my wife.

Not in NYC if you're not connected.


I don't live in NY, but you assume that I would let the law interfere with my ownership of guns. You would be wrong.
2014-02-16 04:58:41 PM  
1 votes:
Great.  Now Harlan's got something else to be pissed off about.
 
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