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(Syracuse Post-Standard)   Great Lakes ice coverage set to break the all-time record next week, exactly as predicted by global climate models   (syracuse.com) divider line 260
    More: Cool, Central New York, Great Lakes, Great Lakes ice, physical scientist, Lake Ontario, global climate models, lake effect  
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9584 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Feb 2014 at 3:21 PM (44 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



260 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2014-02-13 02:19:09 PM  
So we should move the polar bears to the Great Lakes?
 
2014-02-13 02:22:07 PM  
It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?
 
2014-02-13 02:22:38 PM  
Psssst - note to Canuckians: the US invasion starts next week.
 
2014-02-13 02:33:38 PM  
Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.
 
2014-02-13 03:05:19 PM  

Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.


I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.
 
2014-02-13 03:17:56 PM  
The big lake they call Gitchigoomee
 
2014-02-13 03:22:59 PM  
I predict this thread to contain many graphs and charts.
 
2014-02-13 03:24:44 PM  
Since when is Buffalo in Central New York?
 
2014-02-13 03:24:59 PM  

sigdiamond2000: It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?


IDK, less surface area to radiate heat?
 
2014-02-13 03:25:21 PM  

THE REASONABLE DEBATE ENDED AT THIS POST!!!!

 
2014-02-13 03:25:30 PM  

Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.


I see what you did there.
 
2014-02-13 03:26:06 PM  
thanks, Al Gore
 
2014-02-13 03:26:12 PM  
You mean the climate models that predict that weather will become increasingly extreme and unpredictable, like massive cold in the middle of the country while the Arctic is 45 degrees? Or maybe subby's definition of "global" is a circle of land 50 miles across.
 
2014-02-13 03:26:34 PM  
Hrm, the news people said we might have a cooler summer because of this.

And possibly not having Summerfest with 95 degree days.

i2.kym-cdn.com
 
2014-02-13 03:26:35 PM  
o.onionstatic.com
HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.
 
2014-02-13 03:27:09 PM  
looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.
 
2014-02-13 03:27:25 PM  
Meanwhile we have record highs and extended droughts in the Southwest.

But let's pretend these constant Noreasters are perfectly normal.
 
2014-02-13 03:27:32 PM  
Wasn't Alaska having a heat wave right about now as well? The winds shifted.  Plus it is way too hot still during summer.   Where the hell did they put that global thermostat thingy?  Need to make a few adjustments.
 
2014-02-13 03:28:08 PM  
All I know is, we don't have much snow here in WNY, while everyone else is getting buried.  Also, the ice buildup destroyed one of my favorite hiking trails along the Niagara River, but you can't have everything.
 
2014-02-13 03:28:25 PM  
The world would be so cool if Al Gore was President.
 
2014-02-13 03:28:26 PM  
...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.
 
2014-02-13 03:28:32 PM  
So did they really predict it? Or was this sarcasm?
 
2014-02-13 03:28:32 PM  

What_do_you_want_now: THE REASONABLE DEBATE ENDED AT THIS POST!!!!


I'm pretty sure it was over well before that point.
 
2014-02-13 03:28:42 PM  
Hurr Durr Global Warming Climate Change COOLING!

/Send more money to Al Gore!!!!!!
 
2014-02-13 03:29:43 PM  

Rapmaster2000: [o.onionstatic.com image 850x595]
HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


If we get rid of rap music what will you be the master of?
 
2014-02-13 03:30:03 PM  
Now days, when it's hot out and people are frying eggs on the sidewalk, it's "Global Warming", everybody panic and cut CO2 emissions!!!! Who can we blame for this?

When it's cold out and people are crashing their cars all over the south in ice storms, it's "Climate Change", what are we going to do? Who can we blame for this?

Back in the 1900's it was simply called, "A hot summer" or a "A cold winter". And that was that.
 
2014-02-13 03:30:34 PM  

unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.


Perhaps where you are.  Ski season is the Sierras was the worst in decades.
 
2014-02-13 03:31:10 PM  
czetie: Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.

I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.

keep flogging that horse! I don't think it's quite dead yet.
 
2014-02-13 03:31:14 PM  

rkiller1: ...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.


www.theindiepedant.com

Get yourself checked.
 
2014-02-13 03:31:41 PM  

Semper IvXx: So did they really predict it? Or was this sarcasm?


gifrific.com
 
2014-02-13 03:31:46 PM  
That's it. I'm done with Al Gore's party.

Is there a MILF party I can join?
 
2014-02-13 03:32:12 PM  

Pick: Now days, when it's hot out and people are frying eggs on the sidewalk, it's "Global Warming", everybody panic and cut CO2 emissions!!!! Who can we blame for this?

When it's cold out and people are crashing their cars all over the south in ice storms, it's "Climate Change", what are we going to do? Who can we blame for this?

Back in the 1900's it was simply called, "A hot summer" or a "A cold winter". And that was that.


Agrees

www.farmersalmanac.com
 
2014-02-13 03:32:16 PM  
Approves:

www.notinhalloffame.com
 
2014-02-13 03:32:19 PM  
I'm learning here that climate change proponents have absolutely no sense of humor.

I thought it was funny, subby
 
2014-02-13 03:32:53 PM  
If we had devices which could convert CO2 into gold dust, then conservatives would be screaming about there being too much CO2.
So we need to find a selfish motivation directly related to profit and hurting poor people to get them onboard.
 
2014-02-13 03:33:22 PM  
Most people can't remember a winter this cold, because they have not been alive that long......
 
2014-02-13 03:33:57 PM  
I farted this morning, and my butt got warm. Global warming my arse!
 
2014-02-13 03:34:20 PM  

Rapmaster2000: HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


I thought we are all for the removal of miniskirts...
 
2014-02-13 03:34:37 PM  
What percentage of climate change related headlines are absolute trollbait? And is it the same submitter each time or do we have copy cats?
 
2014-02-13 03:34:38 PM  

unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.


In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.
 
2014-02-13 03:34:50 PM  
I wonder if global warming refers to the entire globe or only a portion of one country?
 
2014-02-13 03:35:06 PM  

AngryDragon: I'm learning here that climate change proponents have absolutely no sense of humor.

I thought it was funny, subby


We've been hearing "it's cold in winter, therefore global warming is a hoax" for years.
 
2014-02-13 03:35:31 PM  

Slaxl: rkiller1: ...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.

[www.theindiepedant.com image 525x476]

Get yourself checked.


I will, thanks!  But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.
 
2014-02-13 03:35:48 PM  

rkiller1: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

Perhaps where you are.  Ski season is the Sierras was the worst in decades.


well I'm in Michigan.

a couple years ago we had a winter with almost no snow at all, the lack snowmobiler money really hurt the up-north folks...so I heard.

That same year we had 90 degree temps in March, which is completely unheard of. Farked up mah fruit trees, oh and the entire fruit industry in Michigan too.
 
2014-02-13 03:36:00 PM  
In North West Europe, by contrast, winter has been absent. Not there. Gone. We've had no winter. At all. Sorry!
 
2014-02-13 03:36:42 PM  
rev. dave: "...  global thermostat thingy?"

Al Gore's rectal thermometer?
 
2014-02-13 03:37:57 PM  

rev. dave: If we had devices which could convert CO2 into gold dust, then conservatives would be screaming about there being too much CO2.
So we need to find a selfish motivation directly related to profit and hurting poor people to get them onboard.


"Global warming is making living on the streets more comfortable. Pretty soon the homeless won't even need blankets at night. Being homeless will become so attractive that millions of people will drop out of the workforce rather than work minimum-wage, no-benefit jobs for you".

Any good?
 
2014-02-13 03:38:03 PM  

rkiller1: But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.


Is that legal?
 
2014-02-13 03:38:27 PM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.


I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.
 
2014-02-13 03:38:35 PM  
Oh look, idiots
 
2014-02-13 03:39:08 PM  

Pick: Most people can't remember a winter this cold, because they have not been alive that long......


You sound old.
 
2014-02-13 03:39:18 PM  

unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.


*checks accuweather*

Hmm...high 20's to mid 30's.

//Ill take it!
 
2014-02-13 03:39:21 PM  

Coming on a Bicycle: In North West Europe, by contrast, winter has been absent. Not there. Gone. We've had no winter. At all. Sorry!


Then count yourself lucky. Since Decemember it's been bitterly cold with some days hitting -40c in south central Ontario. We have about 1 to 1.5 meters of snow. I hated this winter.
 
2014-02-13 03:39:27 PM  
I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.
 
2014-02-13 03:39:47 PM  

spickus: rkiller1: But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.

Is that legal?


well don't try it at Sea World, but let's just say what happens in Alaska stays in Alaska
 
2014-02-13 03:40:18 PM  

threefeetoffun: Since when is Buffalo in Central New York?


Maybe by latitude.  I guess.
 
2014-02-13 03:40:22 PM  
I saw Dr. Michio Kaku on CBS This Morning. I realize he is an astrophysicist but the explanation he gave for it being so cold so far South is the north pole is heating up. This causes instability in the polar vortex causing it to spill South. Climate change will also cause large swings of heat and cold.
 
2014-02-13 03:41:04 PM  

bikerbob59: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

*checks accuweather*

Hmm...high 20's to mid 30's.

//Ill take it!


They're calling for 40s here in Mid-Michigan....I'm gonna break out the grill.
 
2014-02-13 03:41:24 PM  

Tyee: I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.


This!  I've been warning about imminent hyperinflation for 30 years!  When it finally happens, you'll all be sorry.
 
2014-02-13 03:41:31 PM  

rkiller1: Slaxl: rkiller1: ...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.

[www.theindiepedant.com image 525x476]

Get yourself checked.

I will, thanks!  But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.


NO!  IT WAS JUST ICE CREAM, DAMMIT!!
 
2014-02-13 03:41:47 PM  

Anayalator: I farted this morning, and my butt got warm. Global warming my arse!


I farted this morning and snow came out of my ass.
 
2014-02-13 03:43:14 PM  
Wait, there are lakes anywhere that don't freeze in winter? But... but how do people go ice fishing? What is this weird world people tell stories of??

/Minnesotan
//Drive out to my spot on the lake, set up the house and chill with some beers by the warm glow of the propane heater
 
2014-02-13 03:43:18 PM  

bikerbob59: Anayalator: I farted this morning, and my butt got warm. Global warming my arse!

I farted this morning and snow came out of my ass.


How refreshing for your spouse!
 
2014-02-13 03:43:56 PM  

czetie: rev. dave: If we had devices which could convert CO2 into gold dust, then conservatives would be screaming about there being too much CO2.
So we need to find a selfish motivation directly related to profit and hurting poor people to get them onboard.

"Global warming is making living on the streets more comfortable. Pretty soon the homeless won't even need blankets at night. Being homeless will become so attractive that millions of people will drop out of the workforce rather than work minimum-wage, no-benefit jobs for you".

Any good?


Ooh, onto something.  But there needs to be more freebies involved such as food appearing out of thin air and something to do with currency devaluation.
 
Bf+
2014-02-13 03:44:03 PM  

sigdiamond2000: It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?



Not a barista, but I'm guessing they were getting at the idea that less exposed coffee means it cools more slowly, but that completely disregards the amount of coffee mug surface area, which also contributes to cooling.  If the mug has a closing lid, then the shape of the mug would matter quite a bit.  I believe old coffee cans (and oil cans) used as little material while maximizing volume. If the mug doesn't have to be cylindrical to be a "mug", a spherical mug would keep the heat in the best, due to the minimal surface-area-to-volume ratio.
 
2014-02-13 03:44:35 PM  

Kraftwerk Orange: sigdiamond2000: It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?

IDK, less surface area to radiate heat?


That is the case, but the coffee cup analogy is just turrible.  Also, Lake Ontario has some different and faster internal currents that slow ice formation as well.
 
2014-02-13 03:44:48 PM  

rkiller1:  the chart and graph crew blow a seal.


No, it's just a little ice cream
 
2014-02-13 03:44:58 PM  

unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.


I had damn near two feet of snow from December to march.  It may have warmed up for a couple days in between, but it was quickly followed by at least enough snow to replace what melted.  It was a lot like when I was a kid in the 70's and 80's.
 
2014-02-13 03:44:59 PM  

Tyee: I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.


You mean like weather becoming extreme due to warming ocean currents and farked up atmospheric currents?
 
2014-02-13 03:45:16 PM  

bikerbob59: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

*checks accuweather*

Hmm...high 20's to mid 30's.

//Ill take it!


In Toledo, it's beautiful out! Just a little below freezing. You barely need a coat!
 
2014-02-13 03:45:45 PM  

Mell of a Hess: rev. dave: "...  global thermostat thingy?"

Al Gore's rectal thermometer?


So you can heat up and cool down Al Gore with it?
If it just measures then that won't help, plus we need zones.  I want Atlanta to get no hotter than 72F from April to October.
 
2014-02-13 03:45:56 PM  

unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.


Good thing weather never changes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age
 
2014-02-13 03:46:19 PM  
I thought it was supposed to warm up next week.
 
2014-02-13 03:46:34 PM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: rkiller1: Slaxl: rkiller1: ...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.

[www.theindiepedant.com image 525x476]

Get yourself checked.

I will, thanks!  But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.

NO!  IT WAS JUST ICE CREAM, DAMMIT!!


Damn you to hell.
 
2014-02-13 03:47:23 PM  
My father told me about driving across Lake Ontario from New York to Canada when he was a boy (the 1920's or 30's).  I can remember driving out on the bays of Lake Ontario regularly as a kid and teen in the 1970's. but by the time the 80's rolled around I can remember people getting stuck out there and the media warning folks not to use the bays anymore, once while walking across my friends and I encountered open water when things should have been long frozen.

One freak winter does not mean much, especially since the records go back only a short way, lets see a few years of this.  Even with this winter the snowfall totals are way down from what I remember as a kid.
 
2014-02-13 03:48:19 PM  

Mell of a Hess: rev. dave: "...  global thermostat thingy?"

Al Gore's rectal thermometer?


Great Band Name!!!
 
2014-02-13 03:48:31 PM  

AngryDragon: I'm learning here that climate change proponents have absolutely no sense of humor.

I thought it was funny, subby


Nah, it's because the other side has such morons behind it we can't tell if they're joking or not.
 
2014-02-13 03:49:05 PM  
California won't have enough water to get through the summer. Sao Paulo, Brazil is almost out of water. Maybe once millions of people who are used to having water don't have water anymore we'll start looking for solutions we should have been exploring for the past several decades. But who knows? We'll probably just say they're "poor" and therefore at fault for the conditions they find themselves in.
 
2014-02-13 03:49:26 PM  

Mell of a Hess: Dr Jack Badofsky: rkiller1: Slaxl: rkiller1: ...exactly as predicted by global climate models

Citation needed, or you be a troll, Subby.

[www.theindiepedant.com image 525x476]

Get yourself checked.

I will, thanks!  But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.

NO!  IT WAS JUST ICE CREAM, DAMMIT!!

Damn you to hell.


I live in Western NY, so, your wish has been granted.
 
2014-02-13 03:49:32 PM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.

I had damn near two feet of snow from December to march.  It may have warmed up for a couple days in between, but it was quickly followed by at least enough snow to replace what melted.  It was a lot like when I was a kid in the 70's and 80's.


sounds like what I remember. this year around here we had even more snow storms with very little if any melt in between, I've got 2 foot of snow for sure. It's been windy too so the drifts are massive. Not to mention we had a crazy ass-windstorm in November that ripped up 6 adult trees in my yard.

harsh man, harsh.
 
2014-02-13 03:49:40 PM  

interstellar_tedium: My father told me about driving across Lake Ontario from New York to Canada when he was a boy (the 1920's or 30's).  I can remember driving out on the bays of Lake Ontario regularly as a kid and teen in the 1970's. but by the time the 80's rolled around I can remember people getting stuck out there and the media warning folks not to use the bays anymore, once while walking across my friends and I encountered open water when things should have been long frozen.

One freak winter does not mean much, especially since the records go back only a short way, lets see a few years of this.  Even with this winter the snowfall totals are way down from what I remember as a kid.


Toledo is set to break their all time record. I think all we need is a couple more inches. And really, who couldn't use a couple more inches?
 
2014-02-13 03:50:06 PM  
Since our planet acts as a zero sum engine, I would fully expect winter to become worse as the planet heats up.
 
2014-02-13 03:50:24 PM  

MemeSlave: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

Good thing weather never changes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age


thanks fella
 
2014-02-13 03:51:33 PM  
 |  exactly as predicted by global climate models

Oh, I get it. That part is the joke.
 
2014-02-13 03:52:57 PM  

Mell of a Hess: rkiller1:  the chart and graph crew blow a seal.

No, it's just a little ice cream


Dr Jack Badofsky:

NO!  IT WAS JUST ICE CREAM, DAMMIT!!

unexplained bacon:

Is that legal?

well don't try it at Sea World, but let's just say what happens in Alaska stays in Alaska



And....you're all welcome.  I only set 'em up, so my work is done here.
 
2014-02-13 03:53:29 PM  

rev. dave: If we had devices which could convert CO2 into gold dust, then conservatives would be screaming about there being too much CO2.
So we need to find a selfish motivation directly related to profit and hurting poor people to get them onboard.


img.fark.net
 
2014-02-13 03:54:15 PM  
Pretty sure global climate models aren't used to make individual predictions for Great Lakes ice coverage year-to-year.  Yay scientific illiteracy, Subby!
 
2014-02-13 03:55:27 PM  

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: You mean the climate models that predict that weather will become increasingly extreme and unpredictable


Must be why we've been experiencing historic lows in tornadoes, hurricanes, and forest fires. Someone tell reality to start conforming to the models NOW, dammit!
 
2014-02-13 03:56:03 PM  

unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.


I lost count of the nights it hit -10F to -20F here, and I'm only in New York (Hudson Valley). Now there's ten inches of fresh snow on top of the eight inches that's left from last week's storm, and this is just a lull. We're looking to double that this evening when it starts back up.
 
2014-02-13 03:57:31 PM  

gretzkyscores: Someone tell reality to start conforming to the models NOW, dammit!


Or we could just tell you that a single year doesn't equate to a trend that you can compare to model projections.  You idiots chase every data point like you're scoring points in a game against someone, and completely ignore the trend.
 
2014-02-13 03:58:18 PM  

Rapmaster2000: [o.onionstatic.com image 850x595]
HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


The crying Statue of Liberty gets me every time.
 
2014-02-13 03:58:42 PM  
fark you deniers.
 
2014-02-13 03:59:23 PM  

unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.


I normally vacation near Little Lake in the winter, but Northern OH has been bad enough I said hell with it. I still let my friends use my camp because the snowmobile trails are so much better up there, but usually I just hang around camp and read/cook. Rather just do it at home this year.
 
2014-02-13 03:59:25 PM  
For comparison, here's a report on the lakes from about forty years ago:

Lake Huron rolls, Superior sings In the rooms of her ice-water mansion. Old Michigan steams like a young man's dreams; the islands and bays are for sportsmen. And farther below Lake Ontario takes in what Lake Erie can send her.
 
2014-02-13 03:59:28 PM  

belhade: unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.

I lost count of the nights it hit -10F to -20F here, and I'm only in New York (Hudson Valley). Now there's ten inches of fresh snow on top of the eight inches that's left from last week's storm, and this is just a lull. We're looking to double that this evening when it starts back up.


ouch...
yep, my outdoor thermometer has been below -10 when I checked it in the morning too many times to remember. The lowest actual was -22...though I didn't check every day. Wind chills in the -20 to -30 range were getting pretty common too. It's just now starting to let up here...like just today.
 
2014-02-13 04:00:30 PM  

LordJiro: You mean like weather becoming extreme due ? to warming ocean currents and farked up atmospheric currents?


How many time have you said that weather and climate are not the same thing?
How many times has weather been extreme, by your standards, in the last million years?
How come when you run your outcome models in reverse we don't end up with todays climate?

When you make predictions that come true more people will pay attention, quit wasting your breath predicting wrong, we're going to stop paying attention..
 
2014-02-13 04:00:35 PM  

belhade: there's ten inches of fresh snow on top of the eight inches that's left from last week's storm, and this is just a lull. We're looking to double that this evening when it starts back up.


Typical New Yorker, so selfish.  Now would you please share some of that snow with California?  I wanna go skiing next week, and the weather reports show mostly cloudy with rocky slopes.  (CSB I left my heart in Tuckahoe /CSB)
 
2014-02-13 04:00:47 PM  

Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.


well played.
 
2014-02-13 04:02:16 PM  
I guess the fact Oregon is far far below average rainfall, and January was so farking dry we had FOREST FIRES.

Hear that?

FOREST FIRES.

IN JANUARY, TYPICALLY ONE OF OUR RAINIEST MONTHS.
 
2014-02-13 04:02:30 PM  
It'll be nice to see 'Mr. 'D' in science' shoved back into obscurity with all the other climate pseudo-scientists soon...
 
2014-02-13 04:03:01 PM  

OregonVet: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

I normally vacation near Little Lake in the winter, but Northern OH has been bad enough I said hell with it. I still let my friends use my camp because the snowmobile trails are so much better up there, but usually I just hang around camp and read/cook. Rather just do it at home this year.


My friends and I skipped our "ice fishing" trip this year too. We haven't actually gone out to fish in a few years we've turned it into a long weekend of drinking and cards, but this year was just too nasty to make the trip. I did however make time to drink at home...almost as much fun.
 
2014-02-13 04:05:02 PM  
This winter we've been having in Ohio is actually the kind of winter I remember growing up in Michigan in the 70s and 80s.  Constant snow on the ground.  Though it's been nothing but cold for the past few months, colder than I remember those Michigan winters being.

Ought to check out this link (it's from 2000) :  http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/children-snow/

And a clip from it:  According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

A decade and a half later it sure isn't rare, but at times it has been getting exciting!

/not really a malkin fan
 
2014-02-13 04:05:41 PM  

unexplained bacon: belhade: unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.

I lost count of the nights it hit -10F to -20F here, and I'm only in New York (Hudson Valley). Now there's ten inches of fresh snow on top of the eight inches that's left from last week's storm, and this is just a lull. We're looking to double that this evening when it starts back up.

ouch...
yep, my outdoor thermometer has been below -10 when I checked it in the morning too many times to remember. The lowest actual was -22...though I didn't check every day. Wind chills in the -20 to -30 range were getting pretty common too. It's just now starting to let up here...like just today.


I'm guessing that during those cold nights, you probably didn't have much cloud cover, either?  The last week or so here, it's been clear skies at night.  Beautiful.  But, with nothing to hold the heat down, away it goes.  On the plus side, it is nice to have sunny days though.  It helps people stuck inside to see some sunlight.  Especially the bipolar people.  Is is a bad time of year for them.
 
2014-02-13 04:06:06 PM  

Miss Alexandra: This winter we've been having in Ohio is actually the kind of winter I remember growing up in Michigan in the 70s and 80s.  Constant snow on the ground.  Though it's been nothing but cold for the past few months, colder than I remember those Michigan winters being.

Ought to check out this link (it's from 2000) :  http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/children-snow/

And a clip from it:  According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

A decade and a half later it sure isn't rare, but at times it has been getting exciting!

/not really a malkin fan


That quote is also about England, not the US.
 
2014-02-13 04:06:33 PM  

WTF Indeed: I predict this thread to contain many graphs and charts.


i.imgur.com

Dr. Thinkwik's climate altering tugboat is clearly to blame for this.
 
2014-02-13 04:07:27 PM  

meat0918: Miss Alexandra: This winter we've been having in Ohio is actually the kind of winter I remember growing up in Michigan in the 70s and 80s.  Constant snow on the ground.  Though it's been nothing but cold for the past few months, colder than I remember those Michigan winters being.

Ought to check out this link (it's from 2000) :  http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/children-snow/

And a clip from it:  According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

A decade and a half later it sure isn't rare, but at times it has been getting exciting!

/not really a malkin fan

That quote is also about England, not the US.


How much snow has England gotten since 2000?
 
2014-02-13 04:08:16 PM  
At least we're ready in the south for this weather.


scontent-b-atl.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2014-02-13 04:10:11 PM  

unexplained bacon: bikerbob59: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

*checks accuweather*

Hmm...high 20's to mid 30's.

//Ill take it!

They're calling for 40s here in Mid-Michigan....I'm gonna break out the grill.


Pfft! Amateurs...

In Wisconsin we grill when it's -40.
 
2014-02-13 04:10:20 PM  

Miss Alexandra: How much snow has England gotten since 2000?


Example: 2010/11 December 2010 will go down as an infamous winter month in the UK (perhaps it should be added to our famous winters run down?). Temperatures were around 5c below average which made it the coldest December in over 100 years, and there was significant and widespread snowfall to go with the cold. A good deal of the country had snow on the ground right up to and beyond Christmas.

http://www.netweather.tv/index.cgi?action=winter-history;sess%3D
 
2014-02-13 04:12:26 PM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: belhade: unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.

I lost count of the nights it hit -10F to -20F here, and I'm only in New York (Hudson Valley). Now there's ten inches of fresh snow on top of the eight inches that's left from last week's storm, and this is just a lull. We're looking to double that this evening when it starts back up.

ouch...
yep, my outdoor thermometer has been below -10 when I checked it in the morning too many times to remember. The lowest actual was -22...though I didn't check every day. Wind chills in the -20 to -30 range were getting pretty common too. It's just now starting to let up here...like just today.

I'm guessing that during those cold nights, you probably didn't have much cloud cover, either?  The last week or so here, it's been clear skies at night.  Beautiful.  But, with nothing to hold the heat down, away it goes.  On the plus side, it is nice to have sunny days though.  It helps people stuck inside to see some sunlight.  Especially the bipolar people.  Is is a bad time of year for them.


yep, the "warm" nights we were getting too much snow.
 
2014-02-13 04:13:45 PM  
Miss Alexandra:

From Miss Alexandra's profile:

http://www.genesis-creation-proof.com/geocentricity.html

Yes, she is promoting Geo-centrism.
You are now free to ignore her.
 
2014-02-13 04:15:01 PM  

Miss Alexandra: meat0918: Miss Alexandra: This winter we've been having in Ohio is actually the kind of winter I remember growing up in Michigan in the 70s and 80s.  Constant snow on the ground.  Though it's been nothing but cold for the past few months, colder than I remember those Michigan winters being.

Ought to check out this link (it's from 2000) :  http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/children-snow/

And a clip from it:  According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

A decade and a half later it sure isn't rare, but at times it has been getting exciting!

/not really a malkin fan

That quote is also about England, not the US.

How much snow has England gotten since 2000?


There has only been a widespread covering of snow on the ground four times in the last 51 years - but that could all finally change in winter 2013, with a traditional Yuletide scene a real possibilty as families wake up on Christmas morning.
Met Office spokeswoman Laura Young said the whole country has a chance of seeing snow on Christmas Day.
 http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/449815/Snow-warning-Winter-2013-wi ll- see-a-White-Christmas-across-UK-says-shock-weather-forecast
 
2014-02-13 04:15:44 PM  

Witty_Retort: Miss Alexandra:

From Miss Alexandra's profile:

http://www.genesis-creation-proof.com/geocentricity.html

Yes, she is promoting Geo-centrism.
You are now free to ignore her.


Oh!!!

My wife warned me about her.
 
2014-02-13 04:16:30 PM  

inglixthemad: unexplained bacon: bikerbob59: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

*checks accuweather*

Hmm...high 20's to mid 30's.

//Ill take it!

They're calling for 40s here in Mid-Michigan....I'm gonna break out the grill.

Pfft! Amateurs...

In Wisconsin we grill when it's -40.


lol...now hold on, I've done my share of arctic grilling. At least a couple of times a winter I usually can't take it anymore and make it happen. This year between the blown over trees and the asshole snow drifts my grill just seemed more out of reach than usual.

/I've actually used a leaf blower to keep the coals going in sub zero temps just to get a damn charred steak.
//worked like a charm
///drinking may have been involved
 
2014-02-13 04:18:20 PM  
 
2014-02-13 04:18:30 PM  

blatz514: Hrm, the news people said we might have a cooler summer because of this.

And possibly not having Summerfest with 95 degree days.

[i2.kym-cdn.com image 379x214]


Oh come on, there's nothing better than getting us beer guzzling, cheese eating, awesome people from Wisconsin together to jump around and sweat in 95 degree sunbaked heat. The smell is awesome! :D
 
2014-02-13 04:20:50 PM  
I'm a white guy with quite a few black friends.  Ergo, there is no more racism in the world.
 
2014-02-13 04:21:27 PM  

enik: It'll be nice to see 'Mr. 'D' in science' shoved back into obscurity with all the other climate pseudo-scientists soon...


I bet D stands for dumbass
 
2014-02-13 04:22:35 PM  
I don't know if the slight global warming we've noticed is man-made or not.  But what's interesting is the ferocity in which the Alarmists defend their position no matter what.

It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

And there's lots of hypocrisy flying around to boot.

/Flame on.  I put on my asbestos underwear
 
2014-02-13 04:23:14 PM  

LordJiro: Tyee: I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.

You mean like weather becoming extreme due to warming ocean currents and farked up atmospheric currents?


Or less extreme because everything is warmer so there is less difference in temperatures?
 
2014-02-13 04:26:30 PM  

meat0918: Miss Alexandra: meat0918: Miss Alexandra: This winter we've been having in Ohio is actually the kind of winter I remember growing up in Michigan in the 70s and 80s.  Constant snow on the ground.  Though it's been nothing but cold for the past few months, colder than I remember those Michigan winters being.

Ought to check out this link (it's from 2000) :  http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/children-snow/

And a clip from it:  According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia, within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".

A decade and a half later it sure isn't rare, but at times it has been getting exciting!

/not really a malkin fan

That quote is also about England, not the US.

How much snow has England gotten since 2000?

There has only been a widespread covering of snow on the ground four times in the last 51 years - but that could all finally change in winter 2013, with a traditional Yuletide scene a real possibilty as families wake up on Christmas morning.
Met Office spokeswoman Laura Young said the whole country has a chance of seeing snow on Christmas Day.
 http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/449815/Snow-warning-Winter-2013-wi ll- see-a-White-Christmas-across-UK-says-shock-weather-forecast


It should be noted that that didn't happen. There has been some snow, but while we've had snow in the past couple of years at this time of year, instead we're now seeing wild winds and torrential rains. It's also been much warmer than usual.

When I was a kid snow was rare, through my teenage years and early adultivity it was exceedingly rare, and now it had just started to become regular again but this year it failed to show. My dad loves to tell me about the great London smog, and the devastating snow in the 60s... It just goes to show how basing opinions of weather on one persons anecdotal experience isn't a good idea.
 
2014-02-13 04:26:35 PM  

Witty_Retort: Yes, she is promoting Geo-centrism.


upload.wikimedia.org
 
2014-02-13 04:26:45 PM  

WelldeadLink: LordJiro: Tyee: I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.

You mean like weather becoming extreme due to warming ocean currents and farked up atmospheric currents?

Or less extreme because everything is warmer so there is less difference in temperatures?


More extreme, with a higher overall average.
 
2014-02-13 04:28:11 PM  

BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.


Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Thanks.
 
2014-02-13 04:30:47 PM  

Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?


Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/
 
2014-02-13 04:36:54 PM  
I'm fine with the lakes freezing.  Cuts down on lake effect snow.  We've had about 130" this year.  It can stop anytime.
 
2014-02-13 04:38:17 PM  
WelldeadLink: LordJiro: Tyee: I predict that one day the alarmist will make a prediction that actually happens but nobody will be paying attention because they have yet to be correct and are looked at as the little boy who cries wolf.

You mean like weather becoming extreme due to warming ocean currents and farked up atmospheric currents?

Or less extreme because everything is warmer so there is less difference in temperatures?

You really shouldn't try to do the one-size-fits-all thing. The one explanation is for a decline in Atlantic basin hurricanes.

I think the Philippines would come to your house and smother you in your sleep if you tried to be flip about the intensity of hurricanes everywhere declining.
 
2014-02-13 04:43:58 PM  

BigGrnEggGriller: I don't know if the slight global warming we've noticed is man-made or not.  But what's interesting is the ferocity in which the Alarmists defend their position no matter what.

It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

And there's lots of hypocrisy flying around to boot.

/Flame on.  I put on my asbestos underwear


Your predictable use of projection + commie-scaring isn't really worthy of flaming.  You guys should update your technique to at least the post-USSR era.
 
2014-02-13 04:44:08 PM  

threefeetoffun: Since when is Buffalo in Central New York?


Since Global Warming, man!
 
2014-02-13 04:45:21 PM  
"exactly as predicted by global climate models "

Pretty much. Here's an article from 2003 explaining how a shift in the gulf stream could cause colder temperatures in northern regions, particularly in North America and Northern Europe. 


http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2003/nov/13/comment.research
 
2014-02-13 04:46:11 PM  

rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/


Why thank you, good sir.

/OhSnap.jpg
 
2014-02-13 04:47:01 PM  

VendorXeno: "exactly as predicted by global climate models "

Pretty much. Here's an article from 2003 explaining how a shift in the gulf stream could cause colder temperatures in northern regions, particularly in North America and Northern Europe. 


http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2003/nov/13/comment.research


Why it's almost as if scientists try to test out alternate theories.
 
2014-02-13 04:47:44 PM  
it's 52 in Denver, gonna get to 60 this weekend!

Though Denver is pretty all over the place weather wise in the winter.
 
2014-02-13 04:47:53 PM  

czetie: Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.

I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.


Gee. He is so ignorant you do not have an cogent argument to refute him. How... "intelligent."
 
2014-02-13 04:49:49 PM  

BigGrnEggGriller: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

Why thank you, good sir.



I only use my expert Google-fu for the betterment of mankind.
Peace.
 
2014-02-13 04:51:18 PM  
Lets cut to the chase.

Does this mean that Sarah Palin is finally president?
 
2014-02-13 04:51:30 PM  

BigGrnEggGriller: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

Why thank you, good sir.


I'm trying to get up to speed here. Improving mankind's lot is a bad thing?
 
2014-02-13 04:52:23 PM  

spickus: rkiller1: But every time in these threads I say "predictive climate models are imperfect" the chart and graph crew blow a seal.

Is that legal?


Have you ever heard about the seal calling the cops?
 
2014-02-13 04:53:20 PM  

gretzkyscores: The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: You mean the climate models that predict that weather will become increasingly extreme and unpredictable

Must be why we've been experiencing historic lows in tornadoes, hurricanes, and forest fires. Someone tell reality to start conforming to the models NOW, dammit!


Because the US is the entire planet...
 
2014-02-13 04:54:38 PM  

Pangea: Lets cut to the chase.

Does this mean that Sarah Palin is finally president?


She can see the Olympics from her house.
 
2014-02-13 04:55:40 PM  

yakmans_dad: BigGrnEggGriller: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

Why thank you, good sir.

I'm trying to get up to speed here. Improving mankind's lot is a bad thing?


No, is that what you are saying?  If so, you may find some folks in the this thread who disagree with you.
 
2014-02-13 04:57:47 PM  

Witty_Retort: Pangea: Lets cut to the chase.

Does this mean that Sarah Palin is finally president?

She can see the Olympics from her house.


Even though we've completely worn out the let's-beat-up-Palin-again cliche, that made me laugh.
 
2014-02-13 04:57:54 PM  

rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/


I'm going to be more honest than anyone on Fark has ever been, so be cool.
I'm too drunk to read that right now. Can't you just like, summarise it with names and dates of proofs n stuff?
 
2014-02-13 04:58:07 PM  

oldfarthenry: Psssst - note to Canuckians: the US invasion starts next week.


No worries. That ice ain't gonna hold trucks, let alone tanks. And Lake Ontario is still mostly open water and Lake Effect snow. We have the great Generals, Janvier and Février, on loan from Russia.
 
2014-02-13 04:58:08 PM  

yakmans_dad: BigGrnEggGriller: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

Why thank you, good sir.

I'm trying to get up to speed here. Improving mankind's lot is a bad thing?


If it hurts the bottom line of the sacred job creators, yes.
 
2014-02-13 05:00:56 PM  

Slaxl: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

I'm going to be more honest than anyone on Fark has ever been, so be cool.
I'm too drunk to read that right now. Can't you just like, summarise it with names and dates of proofs n stuff?


Like you, I too am currently imbibing, so no.
 
2014-02-13 05:03:55 PM  
The AGW crowd reminds me of playing cards when I was in jail. As soon as you caught on to the scam the others were perpetrating, they changed the rules so they can continue scamming. When you make up the rules as you go along you insure winning

/I got some carbon credits I will gladly sell the deluded farkers who still believe
 
2014-02-13 05:05:44 PM  

rkiller1: yakmans_dad: BigGrnEggGriller: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

Why thank you, good sir.

I'm trying to get up to speed here. Improving mankind's lot is a bad thing?

No, is that what you are saying?  If so, you may find some folks in the this thread who disagree with you.

Well, that was a question I was asking. I'd hope that everyone disagreed with it. The exchange I was responding to had a kind of tone I didn't recognize so I wanted a clarification.

 
2014-02-13 05:06:01 PM  

rkiller1: Slaxl: rkiller1: Slaxl: BigGrnEggGriller: It's almost like they are desperately wishing it to be true, so that they can press for a global re-distribution of wealth to "combat" it.

Firstly, since you're clearly in tune with what the people are saying, can you explain to me why people are saying that wealth redistribution will combat global warming? What do they think it will accomplish? Secondly can you provide examples of them saying exactly that?

Even though you didn't ask me:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/8916664/carbon-tax-billions-to-help-p oo r-nations/

I'm going to be more honest than anyone on Fark has ever been, so be cool.
I'm too drunk to read that right now. Can't you just like, summarise it with names and dates of proofs n stuff?

Like you, I too am currently imbibing, so no.


We're too honest for our own good.
 
2014-02-13 05:07:24 PM  

Adalius: blatz514: Hrm, the news people said we might have a cooler summer because of this.

And possibly not having Summerfest with 95 degree days.

[i2.kym-cdn.com image 379x214]

Oh come on, there's nothing better than getting us beer guzzling, cheese eating, awesome people from Wisconsin together to jump around and sweat in 95 degree sunbaked heat. The smell is awesome! :D


NSCSB:

We saw Maiden a couple summers ago.  4th of July, farking hot as hell.  Anyhoo, shows over, still balls hot out at midnight.  Need to take a leak before the multiple block walk back to the car.  Hit the pisser and here comes in a dude, without shoes on.  Sweaty floor littered with piss.  hork

/NSCSB
//Do not go to Summerfest on July 4th
 
2014-02-13 05:10:18 PM  

blatz514: We saw Maiden a couple summers ago. 4th of July, farking hot as hell. Anyhoo, shows over, still balls hot out at midnight. Need to take a leak before the multiple block walk back to the car. Hit the pisser and here comes in a dude, without shoes on. Sweaty floor littered with piss. hork


I didn't know Hippies still roamed the Earth.
 
2014-02-13 05:13:30 PM  

rkiller1: blatz514: We saw Maiden a couple summers ago. 4th of July, farking hot as hell. Anyhoo, shows over, still balls hot out at midnight. Need to take a leak before the multiple block walk back to the car. Hit the pisser and here comes in a dude, without shoes on. Sweaty floor littered with piss. hork

I didn't know Hippies still roamed the Earth.


Not sure he was a hippy or just absolutely smashed.

/going with smashed.
//or a smashed hippy
 
2014-02-13 05:16:24 PM  

blatz514: rkiller1: blatz514: We saw Maiden a couple summers ago. 4th of July, farking hot as hell. Anyhoo, shows over, still balls hot out at midnight. Need to take a leak before the multiple block walk back to the car. Hit the pisser and here comes in a dude, without shoes on. Sweaty floor littered with piss. hork

I didn't know Hippies still roamed the Earth.

Not sure he was a hippy or just absolutely smashed.

/going with smashed.
//or a smashed hippy


Though I assumed the shoeless dude was Hippy-like, you told the story exactly like a long-haired guy I knew in the summer of '69.
 
2014-02-13 05:18:41 PM  
Lordy, if we keep warming up, we're all gonna freeze to death.

Also:
Lake Huron rolls, Superior sings
in the rooms of her ice-water mansion.
Old Michigan steams like a young man's dreams;
the islands and bays are for sportsmen.
And farther below Lake Ontario
takes in what Lake Erie can send her,
And the iron boats go as the mariners all know
with the Gales of November remembered.

/ Creepin' 'round your back door
// heh
 
2014-02-13 05:18:59 PM  
Remember how some scientists worry about global warming shutting down the Gulf Stream as cold water from melting ice covers the Atlantic and shuts down the thermo-saline circulation, sending parts of North Western Europe and the UK into the ice box? (As happened less than 11,000 years ago.) Well, imagine that the polar jet stream stays locked into place over Canada as well as the UK, drawing Arctic cold down to freeze some of us, while others suffer from unseasonal warmth and dryness.

This sort of thing is what causes glaciers to advance and ice caps to form in unwonted places.

There was still ice caps in Central Quebec 9,000 years ago.

The Great Lakes were freezing like this less than 300 years ago due to the "Little Ice Age", which lasted into the mid-1800s. A couple of times in the early 20th century, Niagara Falls froze. People were able to walk out to islands in the Great Lakes.

In other words, a regional new normal does not refute climate change--it just means that global warming comes with local or regional cooling as an optional extra. Some of which will be unpredicted change and thus dangerous. Nobody says the models are perfect, only that they are improving as more and more data is collected and different details of weather and local climate are modeled more accurately and added to the climate models.

I've been looking at the maps showing the climate in Eastern Canada over the last century. In my childhood, the whole area was much cooler than it was after the early 1980s. Normal was a lot colder all the way back through the lives of my parents, grandparents, and great- and great-great grandparents.

Most of the rest of North America began warming generations earlier than the Maritimes, New England, and Quebec. Perhaps it was largely due to the kind of warming that created the Great Dustbowl and the recent trans-American drought (which spared only the Pacific Northwest, which was wetter and cooler and thus attracted the attention of climate change denialists although it meant the climate was changing every where else and only a couple of states were bucking the trend). I expect that the North West will become a refuge against global warming again. It has done so several times when the world warmer much more than today and caused mass extinctions.

But if the present dip in the Jetstream with its Arctic cold through the middle of the Continent were to stick around, it would certainly have no cooling effect on the oceans. Only the UK would share in our cold, while Russia and Pakistan would warm again as they did during the year of the great fires and droughts and floods, and the tundra would go on thawing out and leaking Gigatonnes of CO2 and methane.

This could be the new normal. Ice free Siberia and glacier-covered Central Canada, although generally, the part of Canada that would generate a new ice age is warming at four times the rate as the rest of Canada, which is warming at twice the rate as the world as a whole (as is Australia). The map looked like that for thousands of years, though. The results for life in North America and Europe were not pretty. Don't gloat over what you don't understand. It may be worse than expected by the climate scientists and that is far more likely than it being better than expected. All of the shift in certainty is going the wrong way for the old normal and denialists.
 
2014-02-13 05:23:23 PM  
This will affect the shipping season.
 
2014-02-13 05:26:05 PM  

Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.


stevengoddard.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-02-13 05:26:08 PM  

that one guy from that one place: Approves:

[www.notinhalloffame.com image 392x637]


www.miataturbo.net

They should do a duet...
 
2014-02-13 05:26:46 PM  
So let me get this straight. Artic ice shelves retreat for a few years and that is proof of global warming. The Great Lakes freeze more than they ever have, but that can't be used as an argument against it. I think I got it. Weather patterns in some parts of the world are more important than others.
 
2014-02-13 05:29:57 PM  

Lee451: The AGW crowd reminds me of playing cards when I was in jail. As soon as you caught on to the scam the others were perpetrating, they changed the rules so they can continue scamming. When you make up the rules as you go along you insure winning

/I got some carbon credits I will gladly sell the deluded farkers who still believe


I often get my science from the incarcerated, so this is a helpful post.
 
2014-02-13 05:30:39 PM  

Jakesta: I think I got it.


That's the problem.  You guys really think you do.
 
2014-02-13 05:38:15 PM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: I think I got it.

That's the problem.  You guys really think you do.


And that is the problem.  That you think the problem is his THOUGHTS, while others think it's CARBON, and others think it's AGW, and still others think it melting snow or animal migration or glaciers calving or that we can though debate or wealth redistribution or taxes or Al Gore movies or another government study predict or change the outcome.
 
2014-02-13 05:39:01 PM  

czetie: I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.


2013 hottest year on record.  willful ignorance indeed.
 
2014-02-13 05:45:47 PM  

czetie: Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.

I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.


Of course, Descartes' own doubt was hyperbolic and methodological.
 
2014-02-13 05:46:35 PM  
 
2014-02-13 05:49:10 PM  

rkiller1: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: I think I got it.

That's the problem.  You guys really think you do.

And that is the problem.  That you think the problem is his THOUGHTS, while others think it's CARBON, and others think it's AGW, and still others think it melting snow or animal migration or glaciers calving or that we can though debate or wealth redistribution or taxes or Al Gore movies or another government study predict or change the outcome.


Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time. It hasn't. The current change we are going through will not destroy the planet. It may mean tough times for certain plants and animals, not the least of which are humans. But the planet will be alright in the near future as well as long after we've moved to Mars
 
2014-02-13 05:50:01 PM  

de_Selby: Of course, Descartes' own doubt was hyperbolic and methodological.


ajrogersphilosophy.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-02-13 05:50:11 PM  
So when they say we need to reduce our "carbon footprint", do they really mean "carbon dioxide" footprint?
 
2014-02-13 05:53:44 PM  

Descartes: de_Selby: Of course, Descartes' own doubt was hyperbolic and methodological.

[ajrogersphilosophy.files.wordpress.com image 319x158]


Um, yes. And then after doubting everything, he realizes he can't doubt everything. And that he needs God for scientific knowledge of anything but himself. Is that the direction you are heading?
 
2014-02-13 05:54:45 PM  

John0x: You just got Bill Nye'd


Debate between Bill and Dill
 
2014-02-13 05:54:54 PM  

Jakesta: Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time.


It most certainly does not.  This is what I mean when I say that the problem is that you guys think you know what you're talking about.  You're wrong from the very beginning, and you build your case from there.
 
2014-02-13 05:55:28 PM  
I keep hearing that a "consensus" of scientists agree about AGCC (Anthropocentric Global Climate Change). However every scientist that I have asked has responded by equating AGCC or AGW to other pseudo scientific pursuits such as astrologists, chupacabra chasers, ghost hunters, nessie watchers, and bigfoot research.

I have only ever heard about this "consensus" of AGCC scientists from journalists, politicians, and "Believers".

They wouldn't lie about something so important just to push some collectivist agenda, would they?
 
2014-02-13 05:56:40 PM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time.

It most certainly does not.  This is what I mean when I say that the problem is that you guys think you know what you're talking about.  You're wrong from the very beginning, and you build your case from there.


So what exactly is the "problem"?
Enlighten me please.
 
2014-02-13 06:01:48 PM  

Jakesta: rkiller1: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: I think I got it.

That's the problem.  You guys really think you do.

And that is the problem.  That you think the problem is his THOUGHTS, while others think it's CARBON, and others think it's AGW, and still others think it melting snow or animal migration or glaciers calving or that we can though debate or wealth redistribution or taxes or Al Gore movies or another government study predict or change the outcome.

Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time. It hasn't. The current change we are going through will not destroy the planet. It may mean tough times for certain plants and animals, not the least of which are humans. But the planet will be alright in the near future as well as long after we've moved to Mars


"The planet will be fine. The people are farked" - GC
 
2014-02-13 06:01:51 PM  

Jakesta: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time.

It most certainly does not.  This is what I mean when I say that the problem is that you guys think you know what you're talking about.  You're wrong from the very beginning, and you build your case from there.

So what exactly is the "problem"?
Enlighten me please.


Maybe I should clarify. Climate change probably is real, and we are probably causing a lot of it. But so what? The planet will be fine. Even if all the polar ice caps melt and temps rise 10° (which has happened before, about 50 million years ago) the earth will recover. It may take 150,000 years or so but that's a blink of an eye in terms of planetary history.
 
2014-02-13 06:03:30 PM  

Jakesta: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time.

It most certainly does not.  This is what I mean when I say that the problem is that you guys think you know what you're talking about.  You're wrong from the very beginning, and you build your case from there.

So what exactly is the "problem"?
Enlighten me please.


The Dunning-Kruger Effect
 
2014-02-13 06:03:52 PM  

Pick: Back in the 1900's it was simply called, "A hot summer" or a "A cold winter". And that was that.


That is still what it is.  If we have a hot summer, it's a hot summer. It's a single data point for a single location for a single time period.

Do some people with little understanding of science say things like "it's hot today, thus global warming is happening"?  Of course!   Those aren't valid arguments for or against AGW or Global Climate Change.

Climate Change and Global Warming are both happening.  The average temperature of the earth is increasing steadily as a partial result of greenhouse gas emissions.   The overall warming of the Earth doesn't mean that all parts of the Earth will simultaneously increase in temperature at the same time.  Some of that additional energy will shift wind patterns around which might lead to locally colder temperatures in some areas of the Earth.

The fact that morons and idiots "believe" in a theory doesn't mean the theory itself is valid or not valid.  There are far more idiots and morons that "don't believe" in AGW for some of the most ridiculous reasons possible.

/The good thing is that science doesn't care if you "believe" in it or not.
 
2014-02-13 06:13:43 PM  

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: Jakesta: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Jakesta: Weather or not (see what I did there?) climate change is man made is a silly argument. It implies that the climate ofthe earth has been stable at any point in time.

It most certainly does not.  This is what I mean when I say that the problem is that you guys think you know what you're talking about.  You're wrong from the very beginning, and you build your case from there.

So what exactly is the "problem"?
Enlighten me please.

The Dunning-Kruger Effect


This made me laugh. Well done
 
2014-02-13 06:15:01 PM  

politech: I have only ever heard about this "consensus" of AGCC scientists from journalists, politicians, and "Believers".

They wouldn't lie about something so important just to push some collectivist agenda, would they?


97% of climate scientists agree [1][2][3].

1) W. R. L. Anderegg, "Expert Credibility in Climate Change,"  Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences Vol. 107 No. 27, 12107-12109 (21 June 2010); DOI: 10.1073/pnas.1003187107.

2) P. T. Doran & M. K. Zimmerman, "Examining the Scientific Consensus on Climate Change,"  Eos Transactions American Geophysical Union Vol. 90 Issue 3 (2009), 22; DOI: 10.1029/2009EO030002.

3)  N. Oreskes, "Beyond the Ivory Tower: The Scientific Consensus on Climate Change,"Science Vol. 306 no. 5702, p. 1686 (3 December 2004); DOI: 10.1126/science.1103618.
 
2014-02-13 06:34:46 PM  

Jakesta: Maybe I should clarify. Climate change probably is real, and we are probably causing a lot of it. But so what? The planet will be fine.


But your great grandkids, maybe not so much.
 
2014-02-13 06:38:19 PM  
Surprised this picture did not surface in discussion yet:
s.imwx.com
It was a sunny and balmy 28 degrees today near Lake Huron - it actually felt better outside.

/Don't get excited yet - Spring is still over a month away.
 
2014-02-13 06:38:40 PM  

sigdiamond2000: It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?


Smaller surface area = less heat loss, duhhhh.
 
2014-02-13 06:39:14 PM  

Rapmaster2000: [o.onionstatic.com image 850x595]
HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


Can I put in a request for the backless halter tops of the late 1990s/early 2000s to come back a bit sooner on the nostalgia train?
 
2014-02-13 06:46:14 PM  

unexplained bacon: OregonVet: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

I normally vacation near Little Lake in the winter, but Northern OH has been bad enough I said hell with it. I still let my friends use my camp because the snowmobile trails are so much better up there, but usually I just hang around camp and read/cook. Rather just do it at home this year.

My friends and I skipped our "ice fishing" trip this year too. We haven't actually gone out to fish in a few years we've turned it into a long weekend of drinking and cards, but this year was just too nasty to make the trip. I did however make time to drink at home...almost as much fun.


It's the drinking that matters.
 
2014-02-13 06:46:23 PM  

whatshisname: Jakesta: Maybe I should clarify. Climate change probably is real, and we are probably causing a lot of it. But so what? The planet will be fine.

But your great grandkids, maybe not so much.


Why? Because the coastline will be in a different spot? Humans are very adaptable. They'll be ok too.
 
2014-02-13 06:46:29 PM  

simkatu: politech: I have only ever heard about this "consensus" of AGCC scientists from journalists, politicians, and "Believers".

They wouldn't lie about something so important just to push some collectivist agenda, would they?

97% of climate scientists agree [1][2][3].

1) W. R. L. Anderegg, "Expert Credibility in Climate Change,"  Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences Vol. 107 No. 27, 12107-12109 (21 June 2010); DOI: 10.1073/pnas.1003187107.

2) P. T. Doran & M. K. Zimmerman, "Examining the Scientific Consensus on Climate Change,"  Eos Transactions American Geophysical Union Vol. 90 Issue 3 (2009), 22; DOI: 10.1029/2009EO030002.

3)  N. Oreskes, "Beyond the Ivory Tower: The Scientific Consensus on Climate Change,"Science Vol. 306 no. 5702, p. 1686 (3 December 2004); DOI: 10.1126/science.1103618.



I see you have the  journos, politicians and the believers covered in your links. I also see a bunch of very important looking text formatting. But you're not a scientist are you? Your just another believer taking it all on faith (or you are lying). Why should I believe you, or them?

What is your agenda? What are your proposed solutions? Do your prefered solutions to the "problem" involve some sort of collectivist or authoritarian solutions? I'll bet they do!
 
2014-02-13 07:06:54 PM  
Well, the last two winters it's been so warm, lake erie didn't even THINK about freezing.

Since I moved to Cleveland two years ago... I really wanted to see the lake freeze over, since I've never gotten to see that in person... who knew the whole damn thing would freeze over :)
 
2014-02-13 07:07:10 PM  

czetie: Descartes: Silly Subby, this is only weather.  When it's hotter than normal it's called climate.

I'm disappointed to have to share a species with people as willfully ignorant as you.


Caught one in the first throw!
 
2014-02-13 07:11:32 PM  

Stile4aly: AngryDragon: I'm learning here that climate change proponents have absolutely no sense of humor.

I thought it was funny, subby

We've been hearing "it's cold in winter, therefore global warming is a hoax" for years.


It's still funny and you're still predictably humorless.
 
2014-02-13 07:26:58 PM  

Jakesta: whatshisname: Jakesta: Maybe I should clarify. Climate change probably is real, and we are probably causing a lot of it. But so what? The planet will be fine.

But your great grandkids, maybe not so much.

Why? Because the coastline will be in a different spot? Humans are very adaptable. They'll be ok too.


Our food cycle, air cycle, and water cycle is not closed and while Most other animals and plants are not capable of breeding year round. They depend on seasonal temperature and weather patterns and/or food availability. Plants die when it gets hot or cold at the wrong times during their growing cycles.

We are hugely dependent on non-artificial natural processes and many of them rely on predictable seasonal variations in temperature and weather.
 
2014-02-13 07:41:42 PM  

Rapmaster2000: [o.onionstatic.com image 850x595]
HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


What a surprise ... a denier advocating book burning.

I understand how stupid people can be anti-science. I find it strange how proud they are of it.
 
2014-02-13 07:47:02 PM  
Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.
 
2014-02-13 07:56:43 PM  
imgs.xkcd.com
 
2014-02-13 07:56:44 PM  

rwdavis: Jakesta: whatshisname: Jakesta: Maybe I should clarify. Climate change probably is real, and we are probably causing a lot of it. But so what? The planet will be fine.

But your great grandkids, maybe not so much.

Why? Because the coastline will be in a different spot? Humans are very adaptable. They'll be ok too.

Our food cycle, air cycle, and water cycle is not closed and while Most other animals and plants are not capable of breeding year round. They depend on seasonal temperature and weather patterns and/or food availability. Plants die when it gets hot or cold at the wrong times during their growing cycles.

We are hugely dependent on non-artificial natural processes and many of them rely on predictable seasonal variations in temperature and weather.


If and when that happens, humans will adapt as they have for thousands of years. Why is it that people seem to think that if the environment changes the human species isn't going to survive it? We will as a species. Does it mean that we won't have some hard times? Of course not. And what we are doing today may very well be a cause of that. But the doom and gloom nonsense needs to stop if anyone ever actually wants to change something
 
2014-02-13 07:59:11 PM  

Hassan Ben Sobr: Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.


You're joking, right?
 
2014-02-13 08:01:06 PM  

Jakesta: Hassan Ben Sobr: Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.

You're joking, right?


He must be one of those guys that thinks size doesn't matter
 
2014-02-13 08:03:11 PM  

DesertDemonWY: Jakesta: Hassan Ben Sobr: Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.

You're joking, right?

He must be one of those guys that thinks size doesn't matter


3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2014-02-13 08:05:37 PM  

Hassan Ben Sobr: Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.


I believe it percentage of total area, not the average of the 5 percentages.  Ontario has less surface, thus the 32% is not going to be weighted evenly.  At least I think that's what is happening - I don't give a crap enough to check.  Just like I don't give a crap about global warming / climate change because even if the most alarmist projection comes true, there's no way we could address the problem without throwing the world into a total, global, economic meltdown.  I'd prefer to die by freezing to death than to be captured by the roving rape gangs and kept for food.
 
2014-02-13 08:13:47 PM  
elvindeath: there's no way we could address the problem without throwing the world into a total, global, economic meltdown.

What a shock, a confident Internet Expert knows far more than all the folks who study this for a living.

Meanwhile, the US has cut it's total (not per capita - raw total tons) carbon emissions every year since 2007. No, it's not all due to the recession - the growth of natural gas availability from frackig is awesome. And apparently the auto industry can deliver efficient cars without resulting in roving rape gangs.

Reducing carbon emissions to a sustainable level (sustainable, which is far higher than zero) is completely doable without catastrophic costs. Costs that every study I've seen are far lower than the cost of re-building the past couple centuries of infrastructure, from watersheds to farm land, built up to support our populations.
 
2014-02-13 08:24:47 PM  

Surpheon: elvindeath: there's no way we could address the problem without throwing the world into a total, global, economic meltdown.

What a shock, a confident Internet Expert knows far more than all the folks who study this for a living.

Meanwhile, the US has cut it's total (not per capita - raw total tons) carbon emissions every year since 2007. No, it's not all due to the recession - the growth of natural gas availability from frackig is awesome. And apparently the auto industry can deliver efficient cars without resulting in roving rape gangs.

Reducing carbon emissions to a sustainable level (sustainable, which is far higher than zero) is completely doable without catastrophic costs. Costs that every study I've seen are far lower than the cost of re-building the past couple centuries of infrastructure, from watersheds to farm land, built up to support our populations.


Yet China and India's have skyrocketed.  Hate to tell you this but America is working on it.  Good luck getting the BRICs to comply though.  Those are the ones who will bury us.

Oh, and that's all due to outsourcing, offshoring, and NAFTA.  Ironic that Bill Clinton signed it, huh?
 
2014-02-13 08:28:54 PM  

Jakesta: If and when that happens, humans will adapt as they have for thousands of years. Why is it that people seem to think that if the environment changes the human species isn't going to survive it? We will as a species. Does it mean that we won't have some hard times? Of course not. And what we are doing today may very well be a cause of that. But the doom and gloom nonsense needs to stop if anyone ever actually wants to change something


People advocating for action to be taken are not stopping action from being taken.

The deniers spreading anti-science and their "do nothing" campaign is stopping action from being taken. Don't project it on us.

Not that I care. I live in Southern Ontario ... well suited to handle the up coming changes. I make enough money that I should be able to handle all the price increases. And I don't have kids.
 
2014-02-13 08:34:09 PM  

AngryDragon: Yet China and India's have skyrocketed.  Hate to tell you this but America is working on it.  Good luck getting the BRICs to comply though.  Those are the ones who will bury us.


About that "we don't have to do anything because other people pollute" taking point:

You need new material:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-06-18/china-launches-its-first-carbo n- trading-scheme/4763770

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/19/business/energy-environment/china- in troduces-local-program-for-reducing-emissions.html?_r=0

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/china-agrees -t o-impose-carbon-targets-by-2016-8626101.html

Refresh the blog page ... maybe some new talking points are up. Remember, you don't have to understand them. Just repeat them over and over.
 
2014-02-13 08:38:08 PM  
Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.
 
2014-02-13 08:42:19 PM  

Farking Canuck: AngryDragon: Yet China and India's have skyrocketed.  Hate to tell you this but America is working on it.  Good luck getting the BRICs to comply though.  Those are the ones who will bury us.

About that "we don't have to do anything because other people pollute" taking point:

You need new material:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-06-18/china-launches-its-first-carbo n- trading-scheme/4763770

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/19/business/energy-environment/china- in troduces-local-program-for-reducing-emissions.html?_r=0

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/china-agrees -t o-impose-carbon-targets-by-2016-8626101.html

Refresh the blog page ... maybe some new talking points are up. Remember, you don't have to understand them. Just repeat them over and over.


Carbon trading is bullshiat.

I was responding to the comment earlier that the US has cut emissions every year since 2007.  Meanwhile Shanghai's air is so thick you can cut it with a knife.  I wasn't mirroring talking points, I was stating the obvious.
 
2014-02-13 08:42:59 PM  

Jakesta: Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.


Can you link to some scientists predicting the end of the world? Because if you are listening to what reporters say about science then I think I've found your problem - they always get it wrong,

FYI - Applaudable isn't a word. Laudable is though.
 
2014-02-13 08:45:02 PM  

Jakesta: Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.


Protip: Trying to win over people by equating them to people who don't believe the Holocaust happened doesn't help your cause
 
2014-02-13 08:47:00 PM  

yakmans_dad: I wonder if global warming refers to the entire globe or only a portion of one country?


Last week's California drought thread answers that question.
 
2014-02-13 08:49:01 PM  

AngryDragon: I wasn't mirroring talking points, I was stating the obvious.


What is obvious is the whole "L-l-l-look at China! Our doing anything can never help so do nothing!!!" is a cornerstone of the denier agenda. Congratz if you came up with it independently of a industry funded blog.

AngryDragon: Carbon trading is bullshiat.


The point is that China is taking action. We will see how effective it is ... but at least they acknowledge the science and evidence and they are trying.
 
2014-02-13 08:54:06 PM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay:

gretzkyscores: Someone tell reality to start conforming to the models NOW, dammit!

Or we could just tell you that a single year doesn't equate to a trend that you can compare to model projections.  You idiots chase every data point like you're scoring points in a game against someone, and completely ignore the trend.

1.bp.blogspot.com

 
2014-02-13 09:10:08 PM  

John0x: http://www.smithsonianmag.com/videos/category/3play_1/climate-change- 1 01-with-bill-nye-the-science/

You just got Bill Nye'd


Heh. The guy who had Ham for breakfast last week.
 
2014-02-13 09:11:35 PM  

Farking Canuck: Jakesta: Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.

Can you link to some scientists predicting the end of the world? Because if you are listening to what reporters say about science then I think I've found your problem - they always get it wrong,

FYI - Applaudable isn't a word. Laudable is though.


Really? Damn. Seems like it should be a word. Oh well.

It's not scientists. It's media and politics that distort the message. But go ahead and keep fighting the wrong fight.
 
2014-02-13 09:13:40 PM  

elvindeath: Ontario has less surface, thus the 32% is not going to be weighted evenly.


Ontario is a very deep lake, with the tendency to "turn over". It rarely freezes to a significant degree.

Erie, however, is like the pond on your uncle's farm.
 
2014-02-13 09:19:19 PM  

Farking Canuck: AngryDragon: I wasn't mirroring talking points, I was stating the obvious.

What is obvious is the whole "L-l-l-look at China! Our doing anything can never help so do nothing!!!" is a cornerstone of the denier agenda. Congratz if you came up with it independently of a industry funded blog.

AngryDragon: Carbon trading is bullshiat.

The point is that China is taking action. We will see how effective it is ... but at least they acknowledge the science and evidence and they are trying.


Think so? Even Climate Central thinks what China is doing hardly amounts to a lump of coal

www.climatecentral.org
 
2014-02-13 09:21:55 PM  

Kraftwerk Orange: sigdiamond2000: It's like putting coffee in tall, narrow mug instead of a short, wide one. The taller cup keeps the coffee warmer.

Can any of Fark's baristas speak specifically to this reckless, incredible claim?

IDK, less surface area to radiate heat?


My bff jill?
 
2014-02-13 09:29:41 PM  

Jakesta: So let me get this straight. Artic ice shelves retreat for a few years and that is proof of global warming. The Great Lakes freeze more than they ever have, but that can't be used as an argument against it. I think I got it. Weather patterns in some parts of the world are more important than others.


Correct. Just like ice core samples from Russia illustrate the entire global climate for thousands of years.
 
2014-02-13 09:46:44 PM  

Hassan Ben Sobr: Here are the latest totals for each lake, by percentage of surface area covered with ice. The entire Great Lakes average is 87 percent, the most since 1994.
Erie: 96
Superior: 95
Huron: 95
Michigan: 80
Ontario: 32


I get 79.6%, not 87%.


And the year before 1994, we in the northeast had another, even more severe rash of cold weather/snow compared to this year.  It was called the Blizzard of 1993, where it snowed from western NY alllllllll the way down to southern Georgia.  And not just a few inches, it was a couple feet, easy.  I drove to FL to visit friends in it.  From Beckley, VA on down into Georgia, it was single-lane, with the inside lane used for stuck cars and trucks.  People were crammed into the hotel in Beckley to the point we were offered to stay in the weight room for free.  Nope, we kept on driving, and pulled off for a bit down the road and slept.  We were almost through GA before the roads cleared up.  I will never forger all of the cars and tractor-trailers stuck in the road.  It was insane.

Anyway, back in NY, it was temps in the -30 range for a few days.  The power steering fluid in my Bronco II froze over and was leaking out onto the ground.  I didn't know that could happen.
 
2014-02-13 10:20:14 PM  

threefeetoffun: Since when is Buffalo in Central New York?


Turn your map 90-degrees.
 
2014-02-13 10:23:21 PM  

The Third Man: All I know is, we don't have much snow here in WNY, while everyone else is getting buried.  Also, the ice buildup destroyed one of my favorite hiking trails along the Niagara River, but you can't have everything.


Which trail?
 
2014-02-13 10:23:45 PM  

Betep: The world would be so cool if Al Gore was President.


Just got here, but I'll bet someone else seed what you did there.
 
2014-02-13 11:13:33 PM  

Surpheon:

What a shock, a confident Internet Expert knows far more than all the folks who study this for a living.
Yeah, he may well know better.   The so-called "experts" have booted every prediction they've made so far.  Not only that, they've booted them in the same direction, and by approximately the same factor, and in over 25 years haven't managed to correct their error.  And, in fact, if the gentleman you are insulting here is being honest, he is ahead of much of the climatology community.  Pretty much the entire "leadership" of the climatology community is selling their "consensus" to politicians, who are buying results favorable to draconian new measures with a 20-fold increase in research money as a Quid-Pro-Quo.

www.climatedialogue.org

 
2014-02-13 11:17:25 PM  

Farking Canuck: And I don't have kids.

We have THAT going for us, which is nice.
 
2014-02-13 11:58:23 PM  

Jakesta: It's media and politics that distort the message.


Which is exactly why I suggested you not get your science from the media.

Let's be clear here. There are two completely different subjectsin play: the science of AGW and the politics of what to do about it. The deniers like to conflate the two because their position is 100% political and they cannot honestly argue the science.

I don't fight the politics fight as I know all politicians are dumber than science reporters and will never get anything right. But I will argue against the weapons-grade stupidity that is the denier "all climate scientists in the world are dirty liars scamming for juicy grants and the oil exec are the good guys who will steer us safely into the future" propaganda.

The fact is this: The overwhelming majority of publishing climate scientists working in the field believe that AGW is correct and is a serious threat to our way of life. Full stop.

All the arm-chair, brain-dead, green-text, internet "scientists" with their unsupported arguments and blatantly dishonest, repeatedly debunked graphs cannot change this and cannot challenge this. Their politics does not trump science.
 
2014-02-14 12:11:15 AM  
GROSS: What's your reaction when you see people debating whether climate change actually exists and whether it's man - whether it has been created by, you know, human activity?

KOLBERT: Well, I guess my reaction is, you know, frustration on the one hand and sadness on the other because it's just evidently clear what's going on. The physics of it - the geophysics of it are abundantly clear. They were already understood, you know, back in the 1850s and in the 1890s you already had the scientist - he was in fact a Nobel Prize winning scientist named Svante Arrhenius made predictions about what was going to happen if we kept, you know, adding CO2 to the atmosphere.

Now, he was off on his predictions in a lot of ways, in fact, because we've added CO2 - in part because we've added CO2 to the atmosphere so much faster than he could even have imagined. So the fact that we're sort of debating what the effects of adding CO2 to the atmosphere are, you know, 150 years after people understood the effects of adding CO2 to the atmosphere is sort of sad.

And what we should be debating, to the extent that we should be debating anything, is what we should do about it. We shouldn't be debating whether this is having an impact because as you see the Arctic ice cap melt away which is, you know, exactly what was predicted by climate models, even if they were somewhat too conservative, you shouldn't really be debating anymore whether climate change is having an effect.


In The World's 'Sixth Extinction,' Are Humans The Asteroid?
 
2014-02-14 12:40:09 AM  

Rapmaster2000: HA HA HA.  I for one am glad this fad is almost over.  Up next, blue jeans, rap music, and miniskirts.


I typed the first few words of a rage post before I noticed it was you. Nice job.
 
2014-02-14 12:43:58 AM  

blatz514: Pick: Now days, when it's hot out and people are frying eggs on the sidewalk, it's "Global Warming", everybody panic and cut CO2 emissions!!!! Who can we blame for this?

When it's cold out and people are crashing their cars all over the south in ice storms, it's "Climate Change", what are we going to do? Who can we blame for this?

Back in the 1900's it was simply called, "A hot summer" or a "A cold winter". And that was that.

Agrees


Interestingly,

"In 2008, the [Old Farmers'] Almanac stated that the earth had entered a global cooling period that would probably last decades. The journal based its prediction on sunspot cycles. Said contributing meteorologist Joseph D'Aleo, "Studying these and other factor suggests that cold, not warm, climate may be our future.""
 
2014-02-14 12:48:37 AM  

unexplained bacon: Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

I'm trying to recall, but I think that year brought a lot of snow for us too, but we had thaws in between the storms. Not so much this year. The cold has been straight up brutal too, temps below -10 at night were practically common. It's 36 right now and I swear it feels like shorts weather. The wind doesn't even hurt my face.


I hear you, I think my body has adapted to the cold. I don't feel comfortable even inside anymore in less than 3 layers and if the wind chill is a positive number, it's not even remarkable. 10℉ is okay, now. Indiana is now permanently a barren, frozen tundra and I've come to terms with that.

It will be a shock to the rest of the nation next September when no semi trucks full of corn start spewing out of our borders, though.
 
2014-02-14 12:50:27 AM  
 
2014-02-14 12:50:58 AM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.


What is "mandingsnow"?
 
2014-02-14 01:01:07 AM  

ZzeusS: rev. dave: If we had devices which could convert CO2 into gold dust, then conservatives would be screaming about there being too much CO2.
So we need to find a selfish motivation directly related to profit and hurting poor people to get them onboard.


Slaves can mine gold, but they don't breathe carbon dioxide.
 
2014-02-14 01:03:12 AM  

MBooda: For comparison, here's a report on the lakes from about forty years ago:

Lake Huron rolls, Superior sings In the rooms of her ice-water mansion. Old Michigan steams like a young man's dreams; the islands and bays are for sportsmen. And farther below Lake Ontario takes in what Lake Erie can send her.


You sure that wasn't from around 45 years ago? Like, right before LSD was made illegal?
 
2014-02-14 01:06:41 AM  

clovercat: At least we're ready in the south for this weather.


People keep posting this pic as a joke, but I bet you that thing is the shiZnit bombdiggity at plowing, and it fits in the back of a pickup. The dude who owns that probably makes bank plowing people's driveways for 40 bucks a pop every snowfall.
 
2014-02-14 01:11:29 AM  

FLMountainMan: I'm a white guy with quite a few black friends.  Ergo, there is no more racism in the world.


Your username does not jive with your claims.
 
2014-02-14 01:13:20 AM  

Witty_Retort: Pangea: Lets cut to the chase.

Does this mean that Sarah Palin is finally president?

She can see the Olympics from her house.


I chuckled
 
2014-02-14 01:15:06 AM  

Lee451: The AGW crowd reminds me of playing cards when I was in jail. As soon as you caught on to the scam the others were perpetrating, they changed the rules so they can continue scamming. When you make up the rules as you go along you insure winning

/I got some carbon credits I will gladly sell the deluded farkers who still believe


I'll buy them if you accept Coinye West
 
2014-02-14 01:16:28 AM  

Witty_Retort: Pangea: Lets cut to the chase.

Does this mean that Sarah Palin is finally president?

She can see the Olympics from her house.


img.fark.net
 
2014-02-14 01:27:43 AM  

GeneralJim: Surpheon: What a shock, a confident Internet Expert knows far more than all the folks who study this for a living.Yeah, he may well know better.   The so-called "experts" have booted every prediction they've made so far.  Not only that, they've booted them in the same direction, and by approximately the same factor, and in over 25 years haven't managed to correct their error.  And, in fact, if the gentleman you are insulting here is being honest, he is ahead of much of the climatology community.  Pretty much the entire "leadership" of the climatology community is selling their "consensus" to politicians, who are buying results favorable to draconian new measures with a 20-fold increase in research money as a Quid-Pro-Quo.


There's the green text I've been expecting for 200+ posts!
 
2014-02-14 01:57:41 AM  

Farking Canuck: Jakesta: Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.

Can you link to some scientists predicting the end of the world? Because if you are listening to what reporters say about science then I think I've found your problem - they always get it wrong,

FYI - Applaudable isn't a word. Laudable is though.


Ahem: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/applaudable
 
2014-02-14 02:38:51 AM  

KyDave: Farking Canuck: Jakesta: Advocating for action is one thing. It's even applaudable. But the end of the world, we're all going to die stuff needs to stop if you want to make more progress. You won't win over deniers that way.

Can you link to some scientists predicting the end of the world? Because if you are listening to what reporters say about science then I think I've found your problem - they always get it wrong,

FYI - Applaudable isn't a word. Laudable is though.

Ahem: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/applaudable


And approbations, accolades and golf claps to you, sir.
 
2014-02-14 02:44:31 AM  
Witty_Retort: 

She can see the Olympics from her house.

This is Sarah Palin
img.fark.net


This is not.
img.fark.net


This one said she can see Russia from her house.

img.fark.net


This one did not.
img.fark.net
 
2014-02-14 03:05:05 AM  

dbrunker: Witty_Retort: 

She can see the Olympics from her house.

This is Sarah Palin
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


This is not.
[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one said she can see Russia from her house.

[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one did not.
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


You mad bro?
 
2014-02-14 04:52:02 AM  
I agree, we can't be sure that any of this global warming, climate change, blah blah blah can be proven. Ipso facto, let's pollute more! Do conservatives actually CONSERVE anything anymore?
 
2014-02-14 04:55:03 AM  

dbrunker: Witty_Retort:

She can see the Olympics from her house.

This is Sarah Palin
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


This is not.
[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one said she can see Russia from her house.

[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one did not.
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


Keep on polishing that turd.

http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/2010/04/did-sa ra h-palin-really-say-you-can-see-russia-from-alaska.html
 
2014-02-14 06:08:23 AM  
Lakes are so frozen, wolves will be crossing to get the huge deer herds in the US.
 
2014-02-14 07:22:51 AM  

dbrunker: Witty_Retort: 

She can see the Olympics from her house.

This is Sarah Palin
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


This is not.
[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one said she can see Russia from her house.

[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one did not.
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


True.  But....

Gharlie Gibson: "What insight into Russian actions particularly in the last couple of weeks, does the proximity of this state give you?"
Palin responded: "They're our next door neighbors. And you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska."

Not much better.
 
2014-02-14 08:22:18 AM  

AngryDragon: I'm learning here that climate change proponents have absolutely no sense of humor.

I thought it was funny, subby


Laughter is still allowed, but only mocking laughter directed at ideological opponents. By making all other forms of humor too "insensitive" to tolerate, two goals are accomplished: First, to suppress all undirected humor that stands any chance of causing damage to the Inner Party's reputation for infallibility and the unchallenged authority that derives from it, and second, to provide an outlet that can be channeled by the Inner Party into a powerful ideological weapon, for use in the engineered never-ending war that we call "Peace."

/picture a boot stamping on a human face, forever
 
2014-02-14 10:18:46 AM  

Repo Man: Global Warming: What We Knew in 82


So, we really can't plead ignorance.
 
2014-02-14 10:27:10 AM  

Farking Canuck: What is obvious is the whole "L-l-l-look at China! Our doing anything can never help so do nothing!!!" is a cornerstone of the denier agenda. Congratz if you came up with it independently of a industry funded blog


So the fact that our emissions are dropping means that we're doing nothing.

Farking Canuck: The point is that China is taking action. We will see how effective it is ... but at least they acknowledge the science and evidence and they are trying


But China is "trying" so that means what again?

Agenda.  I think you have one.
 
2014-02-14 10:32:53 AM  

jgilb: Since our planet acts as a zero sum engine, I would fully expect winter to become worse as the planet heats up.


so, as the planet gets warmer, it will get equally colder.  so the warmth will be counterbalanced.  so the net effect will be no change.  got it.  so the problem is what then?
 
2014-02-14 10:35:33 AM  

dbrunker: Witty_Retort: 

She can see the Olympics from her house.

This is Sarah Palin
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


This is not.
[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one said she can see Russia from her house.

[img.fark.net image 640x427]


This one did not.
[img.fark.net image 512x326]


Keep ringing those bells. She still won't sleep with you.
 
2014-02-14 10:46:40 AM  

gretzkyscores: Must be why we've been experiencing historic lows


what part of "unpredictable" is incompatible with "historic lows" ?
 
2014-02-14 11:13:11 AM  

AngryDragon: Farking Canuck: What is obvious is the whole "L-l-l-look at China! Our doing anything can never help so do nothing!!!" is a cornerstone of the denier agenda. Congratz if you came up with it independently of a industry funded blog

So the fact that our emissions are dropping means that we're doing nothing.


Not at all. Much progress has been made in spite of the denier mantra of "do nothing". But the denier campaign to spread misinformation and to convince everyone to take a "sit back and wait" position has negatively impact progress towards cleaner power.


AngryDragon: Farking Canuck: The point is that China is taking action. We will see how effective it is ... but at least they acknowledge the science and evidence and they are trying

But China is "trying" so that means what again?


It means that they've recognized that there is a problem and they are moving forward with the very difficult task of trying to bring power to their massive population in a cost-effective manner while simultaneously trying to reduce pollution. A daunting task that they are only starting out at. It will be decades before we see any positive movement from them. But they are trying. Deniers say that because they are not making huge leaps forward today we should do nothing.

AngryDragon: Agenda.  I think you have one.


I most certainly have an agenda:

Item 1: Reduce Pollution: Cleaner air, less negative impact on AGW, long term health benefits for the population, reduced long term health costs

Item 2: Reduce Dependence on Middle East Oil: Stop funneling money to people who want to kill us.

Item 3: Attack Anti-Science: Science has been the force that pulled us out of the dark ages. These politically motivated attacks on science and scientists ("They're all lying for grant money") are pathetic, obvious and despicable. They need to be countered at every opportunity.


Deniers are not on board with this agenda. They invent ridiculous talking points like:

- "They want to destroy the economy" - Who the fark wants to destroy their own economy? This is epic stupidity.

- "They want to redistribute wealth" - While there is certainly an anti-1% movement out there it is not related to the science of AGW. They conflate these two to sew confusion and to misdirect away from the science.

- "The UN is going to take over our government" - They are claiming that the organization that they eternally mock for being impotent and only able to send out "strongly worded letters" is now going to take over the world. Real Dr. Evil stuff here folks.

These idiot statements represent the intense stupidity of the denier movement.

Personally I prefer cleaner air, less money to terrorists and support for science. But you keep going with the idiotic lies if that suits you better.
 
2014-02-14 11:20:55 AM  

Farking Canuck: Personally I prefer cleaner air, less money to terrorists and support for science. But you keep going with the idiotic lies if that suits you better


No.

You have an agenda because despite the fact that I agree with your position, with the exception of the assertion that you believe we're doing nothing, you insist on labeling me as a denier and calling me idiotic.  You are so blinded by your evangelism that you can't see when someone mostly concurs if they dispute even one of your "facts"

I'm going to build a coal powered steam car just to spite you now..
 
2014-02-14 11:27:03 AM  

AngryDragon: Farking Canuck: Personally I prefer cleaner air, less money to terrorists and support for science. But you keep going with the idiotic lies if that suits you better

No.

You have an agenda because despite the fact that I agree with your position, with the exception of the assertion that you believe we're doing nothing, you insist on labeling me as a denier and calling me idiotic.  You are so blinded by your evangelism that you can't see when someone mostly concurs if they dispute even one of your "facts"

I'm going to build a coal powered steam car just to spite you now..



a) I did not say I believe we're doing nothing. I said "Much progress has been made in spite of the denier mantra of "do nothing". Please do not misrepresent me.

b) I did not call you idiotic ... I attacked the denier movement and the denier talking points as idiotic. Please do not misrepresent me.

c) I attacked the denier talking points that you were presenting. If you do not agree with these talking points then stop presenting them. If you do agree with them ... well, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck ...

Good luck with the car ... you will need some science to achieve your goal.
 
2014-02-14 11:34:18 AM  

GeneralJim: LouDobbsAwaaaay: gretzkyscores: Someone tell reality to start conforming to the models NOW, dammit!

Or we could just tell you that a single year doesn't equate to a trend that you can compare to model projections.  You idiots chase every data point like you're scoring points in a game against someone, and completely ignore the trend.
[1.bp.blogspot.com image 850x402]


people.virginia.edu

Heh. GeneralJim is inadvertently providing an example of exactly the sort of cherry-picking that LouDobbsAwaaaay is arguing against. Instead of chasing a single data point in a temporal sense, GeneralJim has done so in a spatial sense.  A single temperature record from Greenland does not somehow disprove global trends.

That out of the way, a more robust holocene record from Marcott et al. 2013,  taking 73 records instead of just one, looks more like this:

img.fark.net
 
2014-02-14 11:45:04 AM  

fredmcmurray: I agree, we can't be sure that any of this global warming, climate change, blah blah blah can be proven. Ipso facto, let's pollute more! Do conservatives actually CONSERVE anything anymore?


Ignorance, failed economic policies, failed drug policies, discrimination, and intolerance, for starters.

Yeah, they still conserve quite a bit, sadly.
 
2014-02-14 12:07:15 PM  

GeneralJim: Surpheon: What a shock, a confident Internet Expert knows far more than all the folks who study this for a living.Yeah, he may well know better.   The so-called "experts" have booted every prediction they've made so far.  Not only that, they've booted them in the same direction, and by approximately the same factor, and in over 25 years haven't managed to correct their error.  And, in fact, if the gentleman you are insulting here is being honest, he is ahead of much of the climatology community.  Pretty much the entire "leadership" of the climatology community is selling their "consensus" to politicians, who are buying results favorable to draconian new measures with a 20-fold increase in research money as a Quid-Pro-Quo.
[www.climatedialogue.org image 607x342]



Comparing a temperature record to the  averages from model runsis misleading.

It's the exact same faulty reasoning that mandated this response:
img.fark.net

No matter how it's presented, shorter term changes may not accurately reflect longer-term ones. It's a simple concept that I hope others can grasp, even if GeneralJim (and subby) cannot.
 
2014-02-14 05:25:30 PM  

oldfarthenry: Psssst - note to Canuckians: the US invasion starts next week.


First we'll throw Bieber at you, and then Drake. Don't make us go full Dion.
 
2014-02-14 07:11:04 PM  

ransack.: Dr Jack Badofsky: unexplained bacon: looks like we're getting a heat wave next week, not sure if that's factored in DRTFA

damn it's been a hard winter, I can't recall one so cold and so snowy with so few breaks.

In the Buffalo area, that would be the winter of 2010/2011.  Started December 3rd, and didn't warm up until at least mid-march.  We just didn't have the temps so close to zero (or below like a couple nights ago).  That was some major mandingsnow.

What is "mandingsnow"?


That is my own term for the major screwing WNY got from the large amount of snowfall we got.  It was big and hung....around for awhile.  It also farked the area good when it came to people who had longer commutes.  It happened in 1992 and 1993 as well.  The blizzard of '77 was the largest amount of mandingsnow I've ever seen, even though it wasn't new snow (that was snow sitting on top of frozen Lake Erie that the wind picked up off the ice and dropped on us).
 
2014-02-14 09:56:11 PM  
Isnt it about time we just let go and embrace the global warming and stop worrying about it?

There is little no nothing individuals can do about it beyond personal responsibility.  And each of our separate carbon footprints is practically meaningless compared to industry.
 
2014-02-14 11:57:06 PM  

SlothB77: jgilb: Since our planet acts as a zero sum engine, I would fully expect winter to become worse as the planet heats up.

so, as the planet gets warmer, it will get equally colder.  so the warmth will be counterbalanced.  so the net effect will be no change.  got it.  so the problem is what then?


The problem is that someone is actually moranic enough to think that the planet acts as a zero sum engine.
 
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