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(Washington Post)   The good thing about cutting off federal unemployment benefits is that economists can collect more data on the "Kramer Effect": How people with no clear means of income live   (washingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Misc, unemployment benefits, economists, Capitol Heights, NELP, Alan Krueger, William McKinley, incomes, Cosmo Kramer  
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6394 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Feb 2014 at 2:11 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-12 04:07:32 PM  

rogue49: Q: How does crime happen???


Get ready for a big increase...


It really doesn't work that way.  In 2010, when things were very bad, violent crime fell 12%.  You would expect crime to have skyrocketed in the Great Depression, but it didn't.
 
2014-02-12 04:08:41 PM  

cgraves67: The last time we were hiring we had a couple of applicants who asked to delay starting by a few weeks till their unemployment ran out. They wanted every last drop of free money.


Considering they pay into unemployment, it's hardly free money.
 
2014-02-12 04:09:45 PM  

tlars699: Thunderpipes:
Yay! Jobs! Now, question, these fictional acquaintances of yours, did they find a job so fast in pay comparable or better than their old job or did they get a job so low in pay that it won't even cover basic needs?

Bet it pays better than unemployment. Bet it keeps them active. Bet it doesn't cost taxpayers as much. Bet it makes them better people.

Unemployment pays 2/3 of your previous wages. At 20$/hour, that's a little over 13$/hour.
Minimum wage pays what, 8$/hour?

Keeps them active? How? By going onto a computer and putting in job applications online all day? Sounds like the opposite of active.

And how in the world would it make them better people? By learning to live with less, by starving, by having to give up on the American Dream?
How do you know that will work in that way? Is it because you have so few brain cells?


No it doesn't. You have no idea what you are talking about. I spent 4 months on unemployment and it paid $250/wk minus taxes. That is the maximum that anyone could be paid. The position I got downsized out of paid $48k, so unemployment paid me a bit over 1/4 of my working salary. Maybe it is 2/3 for people already making bupkis, but the discussion here was about skilled people that can perform much higher paying jobs that need time to find another one.
 
2014-02-12 04:11:20 PM  

keypusher: rogue49: Q: How does crime happen???


Get ready for a big increase...

It really doesn't work that way.  In 2010, when things were very bad, violent crime fell 12%.  You would expect crime to have skyrocketed in the Great Depression, but it didn't.


How does violent crime provide income?

Expect more fraud, theft, and trafficking.
 
2014-02-12 04:12:19 PM  

wildcardjack: [radicalunjobbing.files.wordpress.com image 452x433]


What if they've dropped out of school and are too dumb to read?
 
2014-02-12 04:13:01 PM  

tlars699: So, while looking for work, I couldn't take a position that would pay me less than that, because I would litterally be pissing away time that could be used to find a job that paid more than my benefits.

I don't know that that is true for everyone.  But, that was the situation for me.


You know you can't refuse work while on unemplyoment, legally speaking, right?


You just don't apply for the jobs that are below what you're looking for when you're in that boat.
 
2014-02-12 04:15:35 PM  
That tit should have been allowed to dry up a long time ago. THe unemployment rate would not still be as high as it is now. The area where I'm at it is only 4% or 4.3% and was only at 6% during the worst of the recession, so we were fortunate.
 
2014-02-12 04:15:46 PM  

K.B.O. Winston: YixilTesiphon: meat0918: A guy with an engineering degree shouldn't be working as a burger flipper.

What if nobody wants to employ him to be an engineer?

You guys talk about jobs as if they go to the highest educated bidder.  As someone with a degree that had to look for that kind of work for a while I'm here to tell you....  THEY DON'T WANT YOU.

I was told by a few people they liked my hustle and work ethic, they just couldn't justify hiring someone with a degree who could switch jobs down the road when they could instead hire a single parent struggling to make ends meet.  That second candidate could truly need that job for the rest of their life.

People who hire for burger flipping jobs hate turnover.  They avoid 'flight risks' whenever possible.


You're right! For some reason they think that 1. High turnover rates mean un-happy inefficient employees
2. That it costs more money for the company to train them, and then have to train another person in 3 months, that the 0.25$/hour raise the person will get in the 3 months time.

They may be right, but it seems a bit outdated mode of hiring for that type of job, IMO.

What I'm talking about is going out and getting the telemarketing job, or getting a job a bit outside your field with slightly less pay, while still applying to other jobs.

If nothing else, you may find something you enjoy to do, and can negotiate for higher pay by having two companies bid to get/keep you.

Still think they shouldn't cut off Unemployment completely. Maybe offer a different objective? Such as after 40 weeks of unemployment, a disbursement of moving costs? Then you can't claim it on your taxes, but you get the money when you need to use it.
 
2014-02-12 04:16:14 PM  

tlars699: durbnpoisn: DarkSoulNoHope: 2KanZam: I used to dismiss the idea that these extended unemployement benefits keep people from working by allowing them to live off the gov't.

But I have a few (lazy) acquaintences whom have been laid off for some time now and "couldn't find a job anywhere"...well as soon as their benefits were cut recently, *POOF* they suddenly both came up with jobs!

Huh, whodathunkit? (seriously, I had no idea some people really were THAT lazy)

Yay! Jobs! Now, question, these fictional acquaintances of yours, did they find a job so fast in pay comparable or better than their old job or did they get a job so low in pay that it won't even cover basic needs?

Pretty much, this.

I have spent my share of time being between contracts, and having to collect unemployment benefits.  My benefits were paying the max, which translates in real-world money to about $15/hr.  So, while looking for work, I couldn't take a position that would pay me less than that, because I would litterally be pissing away time that could be used to find a job that paid more than my benefits.

I don't know that that is true for everyone.  But, that was the situation for me.

You know you can't refuse work while on unemplyoment, legally speaking, right?

I'm assuming you mean you can't waste your time looking for lower paying jobs...

But I have to point this out: what gets you a job the fastest? Getting ANY other job, and making a good reference for yourself.


I never once said that I refused work.  I would look at the payscale before even trying for the job.  That is not to say that I wasn't looking.
And, yeah, here in NJ we have to prove we are looking for work too.  They rarely ask you to actually provide a list.  But I tracked every single person I talked to, and what the result was.  I broke no rules whatsoever.
 
2014-02-12 04:17:16 PM  

netgamer7k: Since we're in the business here in America of tossing rights and gaining rights, how about a right to income? That way everyone's got money, and that money being spent generates demand! And demand = jobs!


Because that income comes from other people from whom it was just stolen?  Yeah, makework, but that's still unnecessary labor that costs money we don't have.

If you want to say "Hey, let's do that because it's a good idea," we can chat.  Depending on implementation, I'm not against it.  In fact, given that the natural idea of   But there's no such thing as a right to income.  Because that implies central planning.  And that's both evil and incapable of working properly.

/Right generally implies that having it has 0 cost to other people.  Or it's a right of people against the government.
 
2014-02-12 04:20:27 PM  

madgonad: tlars699: Thunderpipes:
Yay! Jobs! Now, question, these fictional acquaintances of yours, did they find a job so fast in pay comparable or better than their old job or did they get a job so low in pay that it won't even cover basic needs?

Bet it pays better than unemployment. Bet it keeps them active. Bet it doesn't cost taxpayers as much. Bet it makes them better people.

Unemployment pays 2/3 of your previous wages. At 20$/hour, that's a little over 13$/hour.
Minimum wage pays what, 8$/hour?

Keeps them active? How? By going onto a computer and putting in job applications online all day? Sounds like the opposite of active.

And how in the world would it make them better people? By learning to live with less, by starving, by having to give up on the American Dream?
How do you know that will work in that way? Is it because you have so few brain cells?

No it doesn't. You have no idea what you are talking about. I spent 4 months on unemployment and it paid $250/wk minus taxes. That is the maximum that anyone could be paid. The position I got downsized out of paid $48k, so unemployment paid me a bit over 1/4 of my working salary. Maybe it is 2/3 for people already making bupkis, but the discussion here was about skilled people that can perform much higher paying jobs that need time to find another one.


Do you live in WI?
Maybe my knowledge doesn't apply to you. OR MAYBE it is up to 2/3 of what you were previously making OR 250$, whichever is lower.
I thought the discussion was about how good or bad it will be for the people who have their unemployment benefits cut, regardless of position, but related to how long they are on unemployment.

Also, if you only are making 250/wk on unemployment, methinks you can get better pay than that if you just let your ego deflate a little bit.
 
2014-02-12 04:20:51 PM  
Most cities/towns have one or tow McDonald's. I am guessing they, on average have 40-50 employees. So where do the other 1000 laid off people in town work?
 
2014-02-12 04:25:10 PM  
Thunderpipes - So, you cannot look for a job while you have one?

Every single person I know who was fired for crappy/unusual/stupid reasons were actually canned because they were caught looking for other jobs. So, absolutely no way would I hunt for a job while already employed in this economy.

Thunderpipes - Stay classy, libs

Stay deluded, cons
/'cons'.... what an apropos nickname...

tlars699 - If you otherwise keep occupied, you clearly are amibitious/go-getting/positive someone who shows they are perfectly willing to be treated like a sub-human serf and willing to kiss any insecure employer's ass as long as they toss a few coins in their general direction.

FTFY

/who would want to be like that, I wonder...
 
2014-02-12 04:25:34 PM  

Pick: Most cities/towns have one or tow McDonald's. I am guessing they, on average have 40-50 employees. So where do the other 1000 laid off people in town work?


Burger King?
 
2014-02-12 04:26:09 PM  

Pangea: tlars699: So, while looking for work, I couldn't take a position that would pay me less than that, because I would litterally be pissing away time that could be used to find a job that paid more than my benefits.

I don't know that that is true for everyone.  But, that was the situation for me.


You know you can't refuse work while on unemplyoment, legally speaking, right?

You just don't apply for the jobs that are below what you're looking for when you're in that boat.


durbnpoisn: tlars699: durbnpoisn: DarkSoulNoHope: 2KanZam: I used to dismiss the idea that these extended unemployement benefits keep people from working by allowing them to live off the gov't.

But I have a few (lazy) acquaintences whom have been laid off for some time now and "couldn't find a job anywhere"...well as soon as their benefits were cut recently, *POOF* they suddenly both came up with jobs!

Huh, whodathunkit? (seriously, I had no idea some people really were THAT lazy)

Yay! Jobs! Now, question, these fictional acquaintances of yours, did they find a job so fast in pay comparable or better than their old job or did they get a job so low in pay that it won't even cover basic needs?

Pretty much, this.

I have spent my share of time being between contracts, and having to collect unemployment benefits.  My benefits were paying the max, which translates in real-world money to about $15/hr.  So, while looking for work, I couldn't take a position that would pay me less than that, because I would litterally be pissing away time that could be used to find a job that paid more than my benefits.

I don't know that that is true for everyone.  But, that was the situation for me.

You know you can't refuse work while on unemplyoment, legally speaking, right?

I'm assuming you mean you can't waste your time looking for lower paying jobs...

But I have to point this out: what gets you a job the fastest? Getting ANY other job, and making a good reference for yourself.

I never once said that I refused work.  I would look at the payscale before even trying for the job.  That is not to say that I wasn't looking.
And, yeah, here in NJ we have to prove we are looking for work too.  They rarely ask you to actually provide a list.  But I tracked every single person I talked to, and what the result was.  I broke no rules whatsoever.


I figured as much, and put that in my previous post as my operating assumption.


And they don't really audit too often in WI either. I kept track as well when I was on it, and then I went back to school to finish my degree.

When can you no longer get unemployment? When you graduate from college, even having to get fired from a job as a tutor, because you're no longer technically a student.

I also could have implied "refused work" from "couldn't take a ___ position", because I'm a tricksy hobbit. But since I don't work for the gov't, it doesn't really matter to me. :)
 
2014-02-12 04:31:04 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: If you don't have the government enabling you to sit on the couch you'll do what your grandparents did and move to where the work is.  I hear the Dakotas and Texas are hiring.


The lady in the article was hoping for a job that pays $10.00/hour.  No one should have to move to another state to get a measly $10.00/hour job.
 
2014-02-12 04:33:24 PM  

payattention: Thunderpipes - So, you cannot look for a job while you have one?

Every single person I know who was fired for crappy/unusual/stupid reasons were actually canned because they were caught looking for other jobs. So, absolutely no way would I hunt for a job while already employed in this economy.

tlars699 fixed statement response:
/who would want has to be like that, I wonder...


Want? Nobody really.
Has to be? Someone who has to support two small children?

And the previous statement is against the law, I think. Harrassment/retaliation? IANAL, so if you are, please help me out.
I mean if you can prove the trumped up reasons are in fact trumped up?

Also, if you're looking for an alternate job you 1. Don't list references from anyone in your current employment situation. You keep in contact with outside references, and use those.
2. Don't tell anyone about looking for alternate employment, aside from your spousal unit who doesn't work for the company.
3. DON"T LOOK FOR OTHER JOBS ONLINE WHILE AT YOUR CURRENT JOB.

Oy vei.
 
2014-02-12 04:34:20 PM  

tlars699: You know there are other jobs aside from Burger flipper. And why make telemarketing/customer service out to be so negative? It usually pays more than min wage, and if you've got good people skills/positive attitude it can really pay off in the reference dept.
Also, working as a telemarketer/customer service can get you benefits to last you in the meantime, while still working on finding a higher level job.


See my earlier post, I do know that the benefits and money help. I lived it. If you think that my time in cubical land had anything to do with getting my current job though, you are mistaken.  I don't put irrelevant work on my resume so my current employer had no idea what I was doing until they asked in an interview and I told them.  They then asked another question because they didn't care about non-engineering work. Since they were hiring me as an engineer.

Also most low wage employers don't trust their regional HR reps enough to let them give references and have a no references policy. So that part about getting references in your OP was incorrect as well.
 
2014-02-12 04:35:52 PM  
img.fark.net

The disintegration of collecting as a cultural practice is comparable with the realization of the literary canon. The assertion of commodified objects may be parsed as the marketing of (dis)simulation.

/I created this message with a random word generator.
//Can I be Buckminster Fuller now?
 
2014-02-12 04:38:48 PM  

Crass and Jaded Mother Farker: All2morrowsparTs: Smeggy Smurf: If you don't have the government enabling you to sit on the couch you'll do what your grandparents did and move to where the work is.  I hear the Dakotas and Texas are hiring.

You have read the Grapes of Wrath right?

Also they will do what your Grandparents did, steal, loot, riot and /or hang aristocrats

I thought my grandfather was a mechanic.



My grandfather was a mechanic, too.  His wife (my grandmother) was a stay-at-home mom.

You know, maybe losing unemployment benefits wouldn't be so painful if all those stay-at-home moms out there would get jobs?
 
2014-02-12 04:39:42 PM  
Well if you deny people a visible means of support, it seems inevitable that they will turn to an invisible means of support, invisible usually meaning not-legal.

Guess what, if your government suddenly found itself with no need to pay out any sort of social support, you'd still get exactly zero paid back to you from your taxes. Once the government has an idea of the taxation you will bear, it will keep taking it from you, it might just channel it in a different direction.

So considering you get nothing back from reducing support to those in unfortunate circumstances, and that society might be a little less pleasant for you when those in unfortunate circumstances turn to nefarious methods to just stay alive, due to lack of support, why on earth are people so caught up in trying to make the people at the bottom of the social scale suffer even more?
 
2014-02-12 04:39:59 PM  

Egoy3k: tlars699: You know there are other jobs aside from Burger flipper. And why make telemarketing/customer service out to be so negative? It usually pays more than min wage, and if you've got good people skills/positive attitude it can really pay off in the reference dept.
Also, working as a telemarketer/customer service can get you benefits to last you in the meantime, while still working on finding a higher level job.

See my earlier post, I do know that the benefits and money help. I lived it. If you think that my time in cubical land had anything to do with getting my current job though, you are mistaken.  I don't put irrelevant work on my resume so my current employer had no idea what I was doing until they asked in an interview and I told them. They then asked another question because they didn't care about non-engineering work. Since they were hiring me as an engineer.

Also most low wage employers don't trust their regional HR reps enough to let them give references and have a no references policy. So that part about getting references in your OP was incorrect as well.


This(bolded) is neat; but in comparison to any other engineer who hadn't been otherwise employed in the meantime, do you think that maybe you would be the more desirable candidate?

As for the latter part, that may be how it worked for your company, but others that I have worked for seem to be just fine with it. I suppose it depends on what company, and who is in charge of the HR dept. You also don't have to get a reference from the HR dept. You could get a reference from another employee of the company.

Also, I posted in an alternate post that while employed at one company(A), and you're looking for outside work(B), to do your best to ensure that Company A does not cross paths with Company B until Company B offers a sure thing.

Then the negotiations begin. >XD
 
2014-02-12 04:40:25 PM  

Egoy3k: Also most low wage employers don't trust their regional HR reps enough to let them give references and have a no references policy. So that part about getting references in your OP was incorrect as well.


Honestly, the entire concept of 'references' is dead virtually anywhere that has a formal HR department.  I don't care if it was part-time at Sonic or a salaried software engineer at Oracle, for 99% of businesses the policy is to answer a reference call with "Joe Smith was an employee from July 2008 to January 2014. Thank you for calling. click"
 
2014-02-12 04:42:06 PM  

FizixJunkee: Crass and Jaded Mother Farker: All2morrowsparTs: Smeggy Smurf: If you don't have the government enabling you to sit on the couch you'll do what your grandparents did and move to where the work is.  I hear the Dakotas and Texas are hiring.

You have read the Grapes of Wrath right?

Also they will do what your Grandparents did, steal, loot, riot and /or hang aristocrats

I thought my grandfather was a mechanic.


My grandfather was a mechanic, too.  His wife (my grandmother) was a stay-at-home mom.

You know, maybe losing unemployment benefits wouldn't be so painful if all those stay-at-home moms out there would get jobs?


They already did. Hence women bringing home more and more bacon as the years go by. It also helps that more and more girls have college degrees. :)
 
2014-02-12 04:43:30 PM  

Thunderpipes: meat0918: YixilTesiphon: meat0918: I thought they had shown the jobs they take are below their skill level jobs that they only take because they are desperate?

Is the argument that it's better in aggregate to have people idle than to take productive, if inferior, jobs?

It's better to have people take jobs according to their skill level, and failing that, keep them from hitting complete bottom so we don't destabilize society through rising crime and hopelessness.

If you have high skilled people in low skilled jobs, those low skilled people have no jobs.  A guy with an engineering degree shouldn't be working as a burger flipper.

Also, raise the minimum wage if you're expecting people that made $30 hour before losing their jobs to take a minimum wage one to make ends meet, assuming that McDonald's would hire him in the first place.

So, you cannot look for a job while you have one? You do realize, employers don't like people who spend long times on unemployment?

Stay classy, libs. But heh, now you can focus on your painting, according to Pelosi.


Which is why I would never hire an engineer to sweep floors, pack boxes, or make burgers.
 
2014-02-12 04:44:35 PM  

rvesco: [img.fark.net image 452x433]

The disintegration of collecting as a cultural practice is comparable with the realization of the literary canon. The assertion of commodified objects may be parsed as the marketing of (dis)simulation.

/I created this message with a random word generator.
//Can I be Buckminster Fuller now?


The Buckminster Fuller quote made sense, (whether you agree with it or not is a different matter) even I understood it, and I'm an idiot, so how stupid are you that you cannot differentiate it from random words?
 
2014-02-12 04:47:08 PM  
Haha, I am barely employed. I enjoy a very nice lifestyle. I travel. I take more college classes (working on a second degree).

I have never in my life taken welfare. I've never taken unemployment. People wonder how I work so little. The answer is: I live within my means. I am self employed but have taken jobs here and there to add to my income before. I've been doing this for my whole life. It blows people's f*cking minds.

I drive a cash car and when it breaks I fix it myself. I make my own stuff (I am very artistic). I live in a tiny apartment but I'm hardly ever home, I like the outdoors.

I don't have kids; that's a huge money saver. I try not to get involved with anything that has "monthly payments". I got my first credit card at 30. The only debt I have is a small student loan I took out for my first year of college, and I regret that.

I have a friend who is gifting me some furniture this week and I am reupholstering it. My brother is a lot like I am, he is a waiter who works 25 hours and stays home with his baby while his wife works her 30 hours. He also has reupholstered used furniture so I probably will ask him to help me.

Most people think they need that new car or a bigger house, so they work 60 hours, many of them at jobs they hate.

I call myself "willfully poor". I consider myself much more fortunate than say the "unwillfully poor" who are uneducated, have trouble finding employment, have children they cannot care for, have poor so ISL skills or low mental ability or have some other factor that prevents them from living comfortably well.

My father did not understand me for a long time. He worked as an engineer, and he worked long hours. My parents always said they'd travel when they retired but now they're too tired, too out of shape. I watched them and decide that if I wanted to travel I'd figure out a way to do it for free or to do it for a living.. And I have.

Recently my parents came to visit and my dad looked around my house. I'm used to him complaining about my lack of modern comforts (I got my first TV last year.. I never really liked watching TV.. i preferred to use the computer for leisure). This time when he visited he said "you know.. I think you have it all figured out."

That's all it is.. Figure out what you want, and how much you're willing to give up to get it.
 
2014-02-12 04:47:35 PM  

Lawnchair: Egoy3k: Also most low wage employers don't trust their regional HR reps enough to let them give references and have a no references policy. So that part about getting references in your OP was incorrect as well.

Honestly, the entire concept of 'references' is dead virtually anywhere that has a formal HR department.  I don't care if it was part-time at Sonic or a salaried software engineer at Oracle, for 99% of businesses the policy is to answer a reference call with "Joe Smith was an employee from July 2008 to January 2014. Thank you for calling. click"


This is not a reference.
This is a prior employment verification/check call, to see if the latest job you listed has the correct info. (Thinking behind it: If you didn't lie here, we can assume your resume has some truth to it)

A reference is the people you worked with while there. Such as your previous manager, or co-workers you may have had, to see what you're like as an employee.New employers call these people at home, so the references are not under pressure from work to give a short review, and to see what you are like as a person.
 
2014-02-12 04:52:05 PM  

navanax: YixilTesiphon: meat0918: A guy with an engineering degree shouldn't be working as a burger flipper.

What if nobody wants to employ him to be an engineer?

Why would they when we now have the fad of 'employing' college-educated interns to do for free jobs that paid pretty well 10 years ago?

And why would anyone hire the engineer at a lower wage anyway, considering they should realistically expect him to vanish as soon as he finds a job that pays him in accordance with his skills?



Or when we can import one from China or India for 50% of the cost of an American?
 
2014-02-12 04:53:34 PM  

tlars699: A reference is the people you worked with while there. Such as your previous manager, or co-workers you may have had, to see what you're like as an employee.New employers call these people at home, so the references are not under pressure from work to give a short review, and to see what you are like as a person.


And, again, the formal policy from my employer to my direct supervisor (and to me regarding co-workers) is, "If you get a call like this at work or at home, refer them to the HR number. Anything else has the risk of a libel suit.".   I think my supervisor would bend that (and hopefully many would), but that's very much the policy.
 
2014-02-12 04:54:06 PM  
An additional 6 percent apply for disability insurance

SSD automatically rejects 90% who apply. When they reapply, they need a Disability Lawyer, who will work for a portion of their back benefits, which started accumulating upon their first application. The longer the case takes to win, the greater their 'fee'.

When they win, their fee comes right out of the first check, before it gets to the client. SSD usually instructs the new recipient to NOT bank to save any of that remaining money, not invest any of it.

It can take up to two years from the end of unemployment benefits and the first SSD application to get Disability. Social Security will put you on Social Security Income, usually about 1/4 of what you made monthly when you last worked and give you Medicare and Medicaid as you fight for SSD.

You also cannot have any savings above $1000 in any bank, nor any stocks or bonds. You are expected to exhaust any alternative resources prior to being considered for Social Security Disability.

Once you get it, Medicaid stops forever. More than likely if you make over $500 a month, your food stamps will stop. You will get Medicare. Your check will be based on roughly 50% of your last salary. You'll need to sign up for Medicare part D.

Chances are, by the time you get disability, you'll have been kicked out of your home, gone bankrupt and applying for housing assistance can take up to a year.

BTW. You actually have to have a disability to get Disability. You'll be sent to various physicians to verify this -- at the Governments' expense. Chances are, you'll have to verify your disability yearly.

BTW. Remember struggling Social Security? Millionaires and Billionaires get it whether they need it or not. It's the law. Even if they use the checks to tip their waiter at their club and have the best health insurance available. Congress will not cut anyone off who paid into it, even if they will never need it.

It's been estimated that one billion a year can be saved for the fund by cutting off the 1% highest earners.
 
2014-02-12 05:00:25 PM  

PunkTiger: I've been out of work for 4 years. Two of those years, I couldn't really search for work seriously because I was on dialysis (I had been since 2005 -- don't fark up your kidneys, folks, that crap ain't fun). The third year (2012), I was recovering from a kidney transplant. Last year (and into this year), I've been actively searching for employment and finding very little available. After I stopped receiving unemployment benefits (I took myself off of them because I couldn't, in good faith, keep looking for work -- being on dialysis and all that), I've been living partly on disability benefits (that will end February 2015), a severance payment from my old job, and my life savings.

I'm 50 years old and facing an uphill battle in the job market. I'm not looking for handouts, I'm looking for a job that pays above minimum wage so I can get back on my feet again.

All that being said, I have a hard time believing that the federal government actually gives a leaping G-d damn for people who are still unemployed after their benefits have run out.


Whiner.When i was on dialysis I paved roads from noon till 4AM and coached Little League and Pop Warner on weekends. I also volunteered a a UPS warehouse from 5AM to 10AM because I was making too much money paving roads and felt that I had to give back to the business community. I'd tell you about climbing Mt Washington with two broken legs and intubated oxygen but you probably are already ashamed after reading about my stick-to-it-ivness and gumption so i won't
 
2014-02-12 05:04:38 PM  

2KanZam: But of course, as people upthread are insinuating, I am making all this up for some reason.


Having read through, I buy it. I won't lie, when I lost my job as a secretary - right when the recession hit - I didn't find another until the benefits were about to run out - because I moved (with my husband) to an area where the number of jobs total, much less those I was qualified for, was drastically lower. I did get some interviews, but not many, and no offers.

I ended up having to deliver car parts part time for a year, and it SUCKED. I don't mind retail, but I have back problems and the job exacerbated that plus a bunch of other joint issues. I only started my own business because I inherited some money to do it with; it hasn't gone all that well (again this area sucks), but I've kept afloat.

End of benefits means you have to take the first job you can find that will hire you, instead of holding out for something you actually want to do... so it'll be interesting to see how this new trend of quitting I've been hearing about will go.
 
2014-02-12 05:07:30 PM  

Rik01: You also cannot have any savings above $1000 in any bank, nor any stocks or bonds. You are expected to exhaust any alternative resources prior to being considered for Social Security Disability.


You're confusing SSI (Supplemental Security Income... the rarer welfare system) with SSDI (disability insurance, part of your Social Security payroll tax).  The latter is many things, but it is not means-tested.  You can have any amount of money in the bank and get SSDI.
 
2014-02-12 05:10:26 PM  
This thread, y,all.

I graduated last June and have been looking for full time work since. I work two jobs for shiat wages, and am only part-time and on-call. Christ on a seatless bicycle, on-call sucks. Anyway, I already had ten years of experience in my field when I went to school. So I'm applying for many jobs, including ones that list my exact degree and a few years of experience as the minimum requirements. The response? Bupkis. Maybe the occasional auto-generated "your application is in another, smaller pool of applicants and we'll inform you if you're selected for an interview" email, but after that? More bupkis. Blarg.
 
2014-02-12 05:11:48 PM  

Lawnchair: tlars699: A reference is the people you worked with while there. Such as your previous manager, or co-workers you may have had, to see what you're like as an employee.New employers call these people at home, so the references are not under pressure from work to give a short review, and to see what you are like as a person.

And, again, the formal policy from my employer to my direct supervisor (and to me regarding co-workers) is, "If you get a call like this at work or at home, refer them to the HR number. Anything else has the risk of a libel suit.".   I think my supervisor would bend that (and hopefully many would), but that's very much the policy.



It's not libel if you tell the truth, and can prove what was said was true.
Also, they don't tell you which reference gave you a bad review that prevented your hiring, so these policies are stupid.
 
2014-02-12 05:12:50 PM  

Rik01: An additional 6 percent apply for disability insurance

SSD automatically rejects 90% who apply. When they reapply, they need a Disability Lawyer, who will work for a portion of their back benefits, which started accumulating upon their first application. The longer the case takes to win, the greater their 'fee'.

When they win, their fee comes right out of the first check, before it gets to the client. SSD usually instructs the new recipient to NOT bank to save any of that remaining money, not invest any of it.

It can take up to two years from the end of unemployment benefits and the first SSD application to get Disability. Social Security will put you on Social Security Income, usually about 1/4 of what you made monthly when you last worked and give you Medicare and Medicaid as you fight for SSD.

You also cannot have any savings above $1000 in any bank, nor any stocks or bonds. You are expected to exhaust any alternative resources prior to being considered for Social Security Disability.

Once you get it, Medicaid stops forever. More than likely if you make over $500 a month, your food stamps will stop. You will get Medicare. Your check will be based on roughly 50% of your last salary. You'll need to sign up for Medicare part D.

Chances are, by the time you get disability, you'll have been kicked out of your home, gone bankrupt and applying for housing assistance can take up to a year.

BTW. You actually have to have a disability to get Disability. You'll be sent to various physicians to verify this -- at the Governments' expense. Chances are, you'll have to verify your disability yearly.

BTW. Remember struggling Social Security? Millionaires and Billionaires get it whether they need it or not. It's the law. Even if they use the checks to tip their waiter at their club and have the best health insurance available. Congress will not cut anyone off who paid into it, even if they will never need it.

It's been estimated that one billion a year can be saved for the fund by cutting off the 1% highest earners.


So much misinformation about ssa in that post. SSI and Dib insurance are two different things for one. Not to mention your misunderstanding of the disability application process. Next time get it straight before you post.
 
2014-02-12 05:12:59 PM  

Pangea: Of course it's not the job you wish for. I was out of work for 13 weeks in 2002 after losing my job making $72,000 a year and unable to find a job that was "up to my standards."

Do you know what I did when benefits ran out? I took a job paying $49,000 a year that I would have called "beneath me" a few weeks earlier.


Holy smokes?! BENEATH YOU?!

I'd do some pretty unspeakable things to get to $49k/yr, so remember your "beneath me" is someone else's "couple of rungs up".

BTW, not a burger flipper. I'm an IT Manager, and I took this job because the person who had it before me got fired.
 
2014-02-12 05:16:02 PM  

keypusher: rogue49: Q: How does crime happen???


Get ready for a big increase...

It really doesn't work that way.  In 2010, when things were very bad, violent crime fell 12%.  You would expect crime to have skyrocketed in the Great Depression, but it didn't.


Prohibition was also repealed after Roosevelt was elected.
 
2014-02-12 05:18:32 PM  
tlars699 - Want? Nobody really. Has to be? Someone who has to support two small children?

I knew you were going to say this. I will point out again.... I said 'want'... not 'had to'...

And the previous statement is against the law, I think. Harrassment/retaliation? IANAL, so if you are, please help me out.I mean if you can prove the trumped up reasons are in fact trumped up?

I am aware it is against the law, which is why I said that these people were in fact fired for silly/petty/ no reason... after all, it is a RTW state and they can fire you for NO reason and not have to explain it to anyone. Unless you can prove malice, which is almost impossible for anyone without the resources of amajor corporation. Which, if you have beenkeeping up on current economic affairs, is about 1% of the US population.

Also, if you're looking for an alternate job you
1. Don't list references from anyone in your current employment situation. You keep in contact with outside references, and use those
.

If your career path is in a career that is rather specific and small.. like, say being a post-cardiological examiner as an example (I am not one) how are you going to keep it quiet? Such businesses have seminars, they have people who work throughout the profession... how are you going to get another job in such a field when they all know each other, not just in your area, but nation-wide?

2. Don't tell anyone about looking for alternate employment, aside from your spousal unit who doesn't work for the company.

As stated above, it is not a question of talking about it... in some situations it is impossible for your search NOT to get out...

3. DON"T LOOK FOR OTHER JOBS ONLINE WHILE AT YOUR CURRENT JOB.

They were not.In one of the instances I mentioned, they had told no one. But, the HR person of Company B knew the HR person in company A and mentioned getting a resume from my friend because his name came up in normal conversation. Illegal? Maybe... but again, see above reference to ability to carry a sustained legal battle.

Oy vei.

Indeed. You did not strike me as someone who would make such sweeping generalizations as you have done in your last post. There is also something called 'bad luck', which is something that, if never experienced, can easily be ignored. However, it is very real and can destroy a person in every way in a very short space of time, regardless of 'intelligent decisions' and an economically sound lifestyle.
 
2014-02-12 05:18:33 PM  

Rik01: BTW. You actually have to have a disability to get Disability. You'll be sent to various physicians to verify this -- at the Governments' expense. Chances are, you'll have to verify your disability yearly.


You sound white.

Very White.

Really, really white - (read the linked article at the top of this article first).

/If we actually gave out that much money to black people and called it welfare, white people would riot.  And white people own all the guns, because blacks mostly live in the cities where they've on the average banned guns.  So we don't.  We call it disability, spend way too much money on Medicaid labeling them bipolar/schizo/whatever, and move on $80 Billion and an entire generation of black people who could be contributing to the actual non-welfare economy poorer.
 
2014-02-12 05:21:04 PM  

Lawnchair: tlars699: A reference is the people you worked with while there. Such as your previous manager, or co-workers you may have had, to see what you're like as an employee.New employers call these people at home, so the references are not under pressure from work to give a short review, and to see what you are like as a person.

And, again, the formal policy from my employer to my direct supervisor (and to me regarding co-workers) is, "If you get a call like this at work or at home, refer them to the HR number. Anything else has the risk of a libel suit.".   I think my supervisor would bend that (and hopefully many would), but that's very much the policy.


I always say

"you'll be lucky to get this guy to work for you" or

"I am pleased to say that this candidate is a former colleague of mine" or

"I most enthusiastically recommend this candidate with no qualifications whatsoever"
 
2014-02-12 05:22:49 PM  
My dad's words of wisdom to me at age 6 (he died when I was 7) were:
"Son, never pawn the pistols, and don't lose the ski mask....hit it!"
 
2014-02-12 05:27:10 PM  

YixilTesiphon: meat0918: A guy with an engineering degree shouldn't be working as a burger flipper.

What if nobody wants to employ him to be an engineer?


I know plenty of people with engineering degrees I wouldn't trust to flip burgers

/anecdotes are fun!
 
2014-02-12 05:27:37 PM  
zeroman987 - So much misinformation about ssa in that post. SSI and Dib insurance are two different things for one. Not to mention your misunderstanding of the disability application process. Next time get it straight before you post.

Excuse me? I am living this right now and everything Rik01 has said (up to the 'after you get it' line, because I have not gotten shiat) is exactly what I am going through. (except the SS income thing... I have been given nothing... not one cent. I don't know about if they are different or whatever, but it is not something I have even been given a glimpse of.)
 
2014-02-12 05:31:57 PM  

MyRandomName: North Carolina has already stopped long term unemployment... let's see how that is working... oh! Higher employment levels.


Bullshiat.  Unemployment rate went down, but that was because people seeking employment dropped.   Blue line shows jobs, on same slow trend upward.  Red line shows labor force.

research.stlouisfed.org

Now, what would cause people to quit looking for work?   Maybe the requirement that they do so?  You don't say!


/Don't try arguing data with a Datanerd.
 
2014-02-12 05:36:10 PM  

keypusher: wildcardjack: [radicalunjobbing.files.wordpress.com image 452x433]

What if they've dropped out of school and are too dumb to read?


It's an idea that's been put forth. Bucky was wound up a bit tight. He actually thought everyone could be superior to the downtrodden someday. What a fool, right?

LiquidTester: YixilTesiphon: meat0918: A guy with an engineering degree shouldn't be working as a burger flipper.

What if nobody wants to employ him to be an engineer?

I know plenty of people with engineering degrees I wouldn't trust to flip burgers

/anecdotes are fun!


Yeah, I have a BS in mechanical engineering and I wouldn't be fit to work in the average burger joint. The griddles are built to 39" and I'm 6'5", I'd have to bend over to flip burgers. That's not a long term option.
 
2014-02-12 05:36:23 PM  

FizixJunkee: Crass and Jaded Mother Farker: All2morrowsparTs: Smeggy Smurf: If you don't have the government enabling you to sit on the couch you'll do what your grandparents did and move to where the work is.  I hear the Dakotas and Texas are hiring.

You have read the Grapes of Wrath right?

Also they will do what your Grandparents did, steal, loot, riot and /or hang aristocrats

I thought my grandfather was a mechanic.


My grandfather was a mechanic, too.  His wife (my grandmother) was a stay-at-home mom.

You know, maybe losing unemployment benefits wouldn't be so painful if all those stay-at-home moms out there would get jobs?


Maybe wages would be higher if all those working moms would stay at home instead of taking jobs away from husbands and dads?
 
2014-02-12 05:36:29 PM  
No one has ever explained why you .. yes you .. are entitled to other people's money ..
 
2014-02-12 05:38:24 PM  
And, most importantly, if you naysayers are so sure I am sitting here because I want to be a lazy little mooching shiat, then please do me a favor and tell your LEOs and politicians to please, please stop interfering with my attempt to check out. Thank You. I mean, if you won't help me live, at least stop keeping me alive. Is that too much to ask?
 
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