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(Huffington Post)   Maine Governor opposes desperately needed lifesaving drug because reasons   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 177
    More: Stupid, Governor of Maine, Paul LePage, Maine, harm reduction, overdose  
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10769 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Feb 2014 at 1:01 PM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-12 03:50:50 PM  

CJHardin: Carn: CJHardin: Carn: Here's a list of legal, prescription painkillers that are opioids, aka drugs that Naloxone might help you survive an accidental overdose:

codeine
fentanyl
hydrocodone
hydromorphone
meperidine
methadone
morphine
oxycodone
as well as combo drugs
Lorcet
Lortab
Norco
Vicodin
Percocet

But please keep derping it up with the "Yeah f*ck heroin shiatstains!"

Courtesy of Webmd

That Fentanyl is a beast.  I've seen a case where some teens got a hold of their dad's constant release transdermal patches and decided that they wouldn't get a good enough buzz using it as a patch so they cut them up and swallowed them.  In that case, a SINGLE patch is enough to kill someone.  Both died as a result, no Narcan was available to first responders and they were gone baby gone by the time the paramedics were able to reach them.

Thankfully the only one of these drugs I've ever needed a prescription for was vicodin when I had a root canal.  Oxycodone is the one I'm most afraid of on that list, but fentanyl definitely sounds potentially dangerous.

As you may already know, it is suspected that the heroin that Phillip Seymour Hoffman ODed on had Fentanyl as a cutting agent.  They use that a lot so they can step on the heroin more and it will still have the same or better kick to it.


shiat, no I hadn't heard about that.   http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/02/05/us-usa-hoffman-drugs-idUSBR E A1404S20140205
 
2014-02-12 04:04:23 PM  

mike_d85: OK, we're just plain not arguing the same point.


Right, because you moved your goalposts without even realizing it.  Your initial argument was based upon the belief that if you let drug users have access to naloxone, it will reduce the consequences of drug usage and as a result, drug use will actually go up.

mike_d85: Remember, I oppose putting this in the hands of regular users, NOT first responders. Giving it to "at risk users" is enabling an addict.


That's what I'm arguing against.  So this study happened:

Twenty-one percent of participants were female, 42% were white, 29% African American, and 18% Latino. Most were homeless or lived in temporary accommodation (73%). We found significant increases in knowledge about overdose, in particular about the use of naloxone. Twenty-two participants responded to 35 overdoses during the follow-up period. Twenty-six overdose victims recovered, four died, and the outcome of five cases was unknown. Response techniques included: staying with the victim (85%), administering naloxone (80%),

Drug users were taught many things about drug overdose, including the use of naloxone.  Tested later, the authors found in particular a significant increase in knowledge about naloxone.  Seems that caught on with drug users.  These drug users then went on and 22 of them responded to ODs themselves.  In 80% of those cases, the drug users used naloxone.

By your hypothesis, those drug users would be more likely to use again.  As you phrased it, that would "enable them."

mike_d85: Giving it to "at risk users" is enabling an addict.


Remember?  So were those drug users more likely to use again?

CONCLUSION:
Overdose prevention and response training programmes may be associated with improved overdose response behaviour, with few adverse consequences and some unforeseen benefits, such as reductions in personal drug use


No, they were not more likely.  If anything, they were less likely to use again.  Your hypothesis is thus rejected.
 
2014-02-12 04:33:40 PM  

CJHardin: I propose that we ban Epinephrine because that only encourages people to eat foods that they are allergic to.  I mean, without the consequences of death, people with peanut allergies are going to be chowing down PB&Js like there is no tomorrow!


Yeah, because everyone who was stung by a bee & allergic ordered THAT online before they left the house.


Excuse me, Miss?  Could I have a bee sting please?  Oh, no I wouldn't if I didn't have an EpiPen.

Smacking forehead..
 
2014-02-12 04:34:58 PM  

Fizics: It's a hard line to take but I can understand it. You need to take away the safety net if these people count on if they are ever going to have a hope of being something other than a drain on society. Are these addicts going to stop at one heroins if they think that a johnny take back is just a ambulance ride away? Hell no, they are going to do as many as they can and let the rest of society clean up this mess. I had a stepson who started with this garbage when he went to college and we didn't ask our neighbors to fix him, he has to pick up the pieces himself, not call for the taxpayers to help him!


Just so you know, heroin dosage is not measured in heroins. I believe the correct term is 'screaming heebie-jeebies'
 
2014-02-12 04:40:52 PM  

toraque: Fizics: It's a hard line to take but I can understand it. You need to take away the safety net if these people count on if they are ever going to have a hope of being something other than a drain on society. Are these addicts going to stop at one heroins if they think that a johnny take back is just a ambulance ride away? Hell no, they are going to do as many as they can and let the rest of society clean up this mess. I had a stepson who started with this garbage when he went to college and we didn't ask our neighbors to fix him, he has to pick up the pieces himself, not call for the taxpayers to help him!

Just so you know, heroin dosage is not measured in heroins. I believe the correct term is 'screaming heebie-jeebies'


I cc good to know.
 
2014-02-12 04:44:18 PM  
Paul LePrick!
 
2014-02-12 04:52:24 PM  

TopoGigo: My very good friend was left on a cold porch to die because her "friends" were afraid of getting arrested. This law-and-order tyrant can choke on Satan's many-headed cock.


Chris Christie had one of those in New Jersey right after he vetoed the "good samaratin" bill the first time.

We mentioned it here on Fark when it happened.
 
2014-02-12 05:05:30 PM  

Private_Citizen: That's like banning fire fighters because they would encourage people to play with fire.


While we're at it all fire extingushers ought to be removed from schools and other public buildings in Maine, because they foster a relaxed and casual attitude toward the danger of fire.
 
2014-02-12 06:04:52 PM  
Another Mainer, and one who used to work at Marden's- yes, he is just as big an asshat in person.  I am never surprised at the headlines, and I constantly regret being one of the 5000 people who voted for someone who had no chance instead of voting for Cutler, who at the time seemed like a decent alternative.

/after the first encounter, the managers refused to schedule me for days he'd be visiting
//mainly because they didn't want to fire me for doing what they wanted to do themselves
 
2014-02-12 06:11:11 PM  

Cdr.Murdock: CJHardin: I propose that we ban Epinephrine because that only encourages people to eat foods that they are allergic to.  I mean, without the consequences of death, people with peanut allergies are going to be chowing down PB&Js like there is no tomorrow!

Yeah, because everyone who was stung by a bee & allergic ordered THAT online before they left the house.


Excuse me, Miss?  Could I have a bee sting please?  Oh, no I wouldn't if I didn't have an EpiPen.

Smacking forehead..


OK, I've read your abortion of a post numerous times and I can't for the life of me understand your point.  I'm glad that you are smacking your forehead because it relieves me of the obligation of doing so for you.
 
2014-02-12 07:40:42 PM  

HindiDiscoMonster: CJHardin: As you may already know, it is suspected that the heroin that Phillip Seymour Hoffman ODed on had Fentanyl as a cutting agent. They use that a lot so they can step on the heroin more and it will still have the same or better kick to it.

if you are cutting heroin (cheap) with fentanyl (expensive) you are doing it VERY wrong.


My fault, I meant that after they cut the hell out of it with an inert substance they can bring it back up to perceived potency with a tiny amount of Fentanyl, not that they would use a lot of Fentanyl as the cutting agent.  From my understanding, a grain or two of the pure Fentanyl will kill you.
 
2014-02-12 09:22:41 PM  

FlashHarry: Chakro: There is no such thing as a "heroin overdose". That implies that it is safe to take heroin to a certain extent. People don't die from "heroin overdoses" they die from heroin. Stop being childish about the whole thing, grow up and accept it.

aaron sorkin, is that you?

actually, that's bullshiat. there is a safe level of heroin. it was developed by bayer in the late 1800s as a less-adictive (right!) substitute for morphine as a cough suppressant.

in fact, it is still prescribed today as a strong analgesic.

so, yeah, while heroin is extremely dangerous and highly addictive, it can be taken safely. and therefore, conversely, it can be over-dosed.


To be fair, I *think* that Sorkin (a recovering cocaine addict) intended to make the distinction between the drug itself and Hoffman's addiction to it.
 
2014-02-12 09:39:13 PM  

Carn: Here's a list of legal, prescription painkillers that are opioids, aka drugs that Naloxone might help you survive an accidental overdose:

codeine
fentanyl
hydrocodone
hydromorphone
meperidine
methadone
morphine
oxycodone
as well as combo drugs
Lorcet
Lortab
Norco
Vicodin
Percocet

But please keep derping it up with the "Yeah f*ck heroin shiatstains!"

Courtesy of Webmd


I was prescribed Norco after my appendectomy a couple years ago. I'd been on a morphine drip in the hospital, and that shiat was a very close second in terms of pain relief. I'll readily admit that I was bummed when the little bottle (maybe 16 pills?) was empty and my surgeon laughed in my face when I asked for a refill.

I can definitely understand someone getting addicted to an opioid.
 
2014-02-12 09:41:36 PM  
I thought junkies hate it when paramedics give them Narcan? Prevent them from getting value for money from their high or something?
 
2014-02-12 10:11:07 PM  
Kind of makes you wonder what these nuts will say when there is a HIV vaccine.
 
2014-02-12 10:38:18 PM  

DrBenway: What do your stupid facts matter when I have BELIEFS? And I believe the fastest way to solve our state's heroin problem is to encourage junkies to die as quickly as possible without interference from the state. Buncha do-gooder buttinskis need to mind their own beeswax.

But seriously... how did Maine end up with this pecan log as governor, anyway? I thought Maine was sane, but there I go, being all wrong again.


Paraphrasing Otter from Animal House---"Hey! We fu*ked up".
 
2014-02-12 10:49:37 PM  

justanothersumguy: Mainer here... LePage won the election after an Independent candidate split the Democratic vote, we have been making Fark regularly since then... and more good news farkers, with the election coming up... it is all set to happen again.

/Hate the bastard.


I think Cutler might get it this time. Not so sure about Michaud.
 
2014-02-12 10:52:54 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: The people of Maine voted and got the governor they deserve.


Just so you know, we didn't all vote for him. Stop putting me in the idiot bin.
 
2014-02-12 11:13:03 PM  
Why did they waste the space by placing the (R) after his name? Anyone could have guessed that based on the headline alone.
 
2014-02-13 12:15:25 AM  
Another jerkbag politician with teabags for brains.
 
2014-02-13 12:16:01 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: FlashHarry: i hope this asshole has a granddaughter OD on heroin.

I hope his whole family ODs on heroin.  What a complete shiat stain of a human being.  People suck, but not usually this hard.


that seems a little harsh
 
2014-02-13 12:20:36 AM  

DrBenway: What do your stupid facts matter when I have BELIEFS? And I believe the fastest way to solve our state's heroin problem is to encourage junkies to die as quickly as possible without interference from the state. Buncha do-gooder buttinskis need to mind their own beeswax.

But seriously... how did Maine end up with this pecan log as governor, anyway? I thought Maine was sane, but there I go, being all wrong again.


I'm pretty sure the specific belief that wide availability of an efficacious treatment for OD's will result in some addicts increasing use of heroin is correct. See risk behavior trends since effective HIV treatment became available. Many people who have already evidenced poor risk aversion (for whatever reason in whatever situation) will decrease that risk aversion further commensurately with an increased sense of invulnerability.

NOT arguing he's less than a complete POS. Just that he's probably right about that one statement.
 
2014-02-13 12:25:04 AM  
FTFA: LePage, however, has taken a "drug warrior" approach to his state's heroin problem. In three years as governor, he has sought to cut funds for substance abuse treatment, limited the amount of time Mainers can spend on heroin replacement therapies like suboxone, and requested money to add 14 agents to the state Drug Enforcement Agency.

He should be impeached for being recklessly stupid.
 
2014-02-13 12:36:50 AM  

Begoggle: "LePage's fellow Republican, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, once opposed both increased naloxone access and Good Samaritan protections. "

Christie is showing his RINO nature more and more every day.
Please run for president, I want to see the Republicans throw you under the bus.


What do you have against buses?  You're gonna need one of these:

i.telegraph.co.uk

/I'd pay a LOT of money to get to drive one of those things.
 
2014-02-13 12:37:48 AM  

great_tigers: Really, if you OD on heroin is there anything to live for anyways?


Yes.
 
2014-02-13 07:44:57 AM  

Chakro: That's all very nice but it's not the same thing we are talking about and you know it. Bullshiat like this doesn't help the situation no matter how intelligent and superior it may make you feel.


many people die from alcohol overdoses each year. there is, however, a safe level of alcohol. just as there is a safe level of heroin. it is possible to take a safe dose, get high and live to see another day. millions of people do every day.

i'm not advocating it; i'm just stating fact.
 
2014-02-13 11:32:52 AM  
It seems that the Republicans' laser-like focus on jobs is currently limited to undertakers and funeral directors.
 
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