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(ESPN)   Browns part ways with a Lombardi. This is not a repeat from every year since 1967   (espn.go.com) divider line 81
    More: Interesting, Browns, Ray Farmer, Mike Pettine, Joe Banner, Rob Chudzinski, general managers, Adam Schefter, Bill Haslam  
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946 clicks; posted to Sports » on 11 Feb 2014 at 11:22 AM (24 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-11 11:25:37 AM
I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.
 
2014-02-11 11:26:40 AM
Guessing he'll pop up up on bill Simmons podcast again.
 
2014-02-11 11:27:08 AM

justtray: I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.


but banner/lombardi already were the definition of suck, it can only go up from here!

/right?
 
2014-02-11 11:28:04 AM
Sounds like Moe just canned Curly and Larry. I wonder how many eye-pokes happened during that meeting.

Good riddance.
 
2014-02-11 11:36:20 AM
So trading away the teams top pick from the year before when you are only a few months into your new job isn't seen as career developing?

I agreed with the decision to trade Trent Richardson. RB's don't need to be drafted in the top half of the 1st round.
 
2014-02-11 11:37:18 AM
This is great news for Cleveland fans, but it begs the question:

Why didn't they do this before the coaching search?  Or maybe this is because of the coaching search?
 
2014-02-11 11:37:51 AM
Browns fans wanted them fired from day 1, for reasons I don't understand. They drafted reasonably, with a focus on defense. They seemed to make the trades and signings they needed, and didn't make bad ones. The only thing I can fault them for is firing the coach after 1 season, but the owner would have to sign off on a decision like that, so presumably that wasn't the reason for firing them.

Seems more like an owner grasping at straws trying to pump up the value of his team before the feds force him to liquidate his assets.
 
2014-02-11 11:39:18 AM
Everyone knows the path to success starts with redoing your entire front office and coaching staff on a yearly basis. Bonus success for changing QBs multiple times a season.

The Browns are going to the Super Bowl after this reorganization. For sure.
 
2014-02-11 11:43:33 AM

Lost Thought 00: Browns fans wanted them fired from day 1, for reasons I don't understand. They drafted reasonably, with a focus on defense. They seemed to make the trades and signings they needed, and didn't make bad ones. The only thing I can fault them for is firing the coach after 1 season, but the owner would have to sign off on a decision like that, so presumably that wasn't the reason for firing them.

Seems more like an owner grasping at straws trying to pump up the value of his team before the feds force him to liquidate his assets.


I think its because they've had almost every QB that sucked play for them except for St. Timothy of Gainesville.
 
2014-02-11 11:44:17 AM

rickythepenguin: Guessing he'll pop up up on bill Simmons podcast again.


O/U he'll return would be...before the draft.  Perhaps around the Combines.
 
2014-02-11 11:46:29 AM

bluorangefyre: Lost Thought 00: Browns fans wanted them fired from day 1, for reasons I don't understand. They drafted reasonably, with a focus on defense. They seemed to make the trades and signings they needed, and didn't make bad ones. The only thing I can fault them for is firing the coach after 1 season, but the owner would have to sign off on a decision like that, so presumably that wasn't the reason for firing them.

Seems more like an owner grasping at straws trying to pump up the value of his team before the feds force him to liquidate his assets.

I think its because they've had almost every QB that sucked play for them except for St. Timothy of Gainesville.


They had nothing to do with Weeden,and brought in Hoyer and Campbell to replace him.
 
2014-02-11 11:46:57 AM

AdamK: justtray: I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.

but banner/lombardi already were the definition of suck, it can only go up from here!

/right?


Lets check the boards!

Lost Thought 00: Browns fans wanted them fired from day 1, for reasons I don't understand. They drafted reasonably, with a focus on defense. They seemed to make the trades and signings they needed, and didn't make bad ones. The only thing I can fault them for is firing the coach after 1 season, but the owner would have to sign off on a decision like that, so presumably that wasn't the reason for firing them.

Seems more like an owner grasping at straws trying to pump up the value of his team before the feds force him to liquidate his assets.


Semper IvXx: Everyone knows the path to success starts with redoing your entire front office and coaching staff on a yearly basis. Bonus success for changing QBs multiple times a season.

The Browns are going to the Super Bowl after this reorganization. For sure.


Signs point to "No."
 
2014-02-11 11:49:21 AM
So to prevent one of their top level guys from leaving for a job higher up the food chain at a different team, they fire the other guys that currently have that job in Cleveland and promote the guy they want to keep.  That's something.
 
2014-02-11 11:55:08 AM
Also, you have to question a guy's judgement who thinks being GM of the Browns is a better job than being GM of the Dolphins.  Especially since "judgement about what makes a football team successful" is sort of an important part of being a GM.
 
2014-02-11 11:59:07 AM

Lost Thought 00: Seems more like an owner grasping at straws trying to pump up the value of his team before the feds force him to liquidate his assets


The Feds won't want to take them over though, they can't be "too big to fail" when they've already been failing for decades.
 
2014-02-11 12:04:08 PM
www.londonbigbands.ca
 
2014-02-11 12:04:16 PM

bluorangefyre: I think its because they've had almost every QB that sucked play for them except for St. Timothy of Gainesville.


And thank God for that.  Timmysprinkles joining the Browns would create a vortex of suck big enough to swallow the entire Great Lakes region.
 
2014-02-11 12:04:43 PM
This long running cruel joke by the gods/cosmos/whatever on Cleveland fans has to end at some point.

Right?
 
2014-02-11 12:04:51 PM

llortcM_yllort: Also, you have to question a guy's judgement who thinks being GM of the Browns is a better job than being GM of the Dolphins.  Especially since "judgement about what makes a football team successful" is sort of an important part of being a GM.


I'm not sure which position is better. The rumor in Miami was that the GM had less power than the Head Coach, and a VP that reported directly to Owner. Cleveland has the #4 pick, 3 picks in the top 35, and 5 picks in the top 83. They also have a very talented defense, and some offensive skill talent (Top 5 TE, top 3 WR). They are currently $45M under the cap. That's not a bad space for a GM to walk into.
 
2014-02-11 12:07:32 PM

JohnHall: llortcM_yllort: Also, you have to question a guy's judgement who thinks being GM of the Browns is a better job than being GM of the Dolphins.  Especially since "judgement about what makes a football team successful" is sort of an important part of being a GM.

I'm not sure which position is better. The rumor in Miami was that the GM had less power than the Head Coach, and a VP that reported directly to Owner. Cleveland has the #4 pick, 3 picks in the top 35, and 5 picks in the top 83. They also have a very talented defense, and some offensive skill talent (Top 5 TE, top 3 WR). They are currently $45M under the cap. That's not a bad space for a GM to walk into.


The reason they're under the cap, though, is that they don't want to spend the money.  It's like talking about how much cap room Tampa Bay or Cincinnati has.  Your point about the Miami GM having less power is a good one, and is something I didn't think of or know about.
 
2014-02-11 12:07:58 PM
Banner was a business guy sticking his fingers in to the "football" side of the team.  HE was the "toxic" problem people kept referring to during the latest coaching search.  The new GM is already with the team (as was highly thought of - AND - was the only front office guy at the senior bowl game)  it's pretty clear he was the front end of the scouting/talent  aspect of the team.  I have NO idea what Lombardi was doing for the team, even while he was here - he certainly won't be missed.

This is probably good for the Browns almost any way you slice it.
 
2014-02-11 12:12:38 PM
So, basically, Jimmy Haslam just said he made a horrible mistake in his front office selections right from the start.  No wonder he had to bilk truck drivers to keep Pilot Flying J afloat.

/Sell the team, Jimmy. Make the fail complete.
 
2014-02-11 12:13:49 PM

Fizpez: Banner was a business guy sticking his fingers in to the "football" side of the team. HE was the "toxic" problem people kept referring to during the latest coaching search.


An an Eagles fan, I am shocked - shocked, I tells ya - that Joe Banner might have been a problem.
 
2014-02-11 12:15:00 PM

IlGreven: So, basically, Jimmy Haslam just said he made a horrible mistake in his front office selections right from the start.  No wonder he had to bilk truck drivers to keep Pilot Flying J afloat.

/Sell the team, Jimmy. Make the fail complete.


There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.
 
2014-02-11 12:15:19 PM
So let's get this straight. They hired a coach last year before hiring the GM. Which is fine, if you go the Hoodie/Carroll route (coach is essentially in charge) and the coach gets to hire one of his guys.* The Browns didn't go that way, of course. They hired a coach and then hired a GM who may or may not have meshed and then let the same GM fire said coach.

Mike Lombardi might suck as a GM, but man, he got less than a year on the job right? The Browns suck because they have zero ability to stick with a plan.

* Didn't the Browns go down that route a while back with Mangini?
 
2014-02-11 12:21:00 PM

Semper IvXx: The Browns are going to the Super Bowl after this reorganization. For sure.


I send the Browns to the Super Bowl every day of my life.

/*flush*
 
2014-02-11 12:21:25 PM

AdamK: justtray: I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.

but banner/lombardi already were the definition of suck, it can only go up from here!

/right?


Vinnie Cerrato still considers them rank amateurs at sucktitude.
 
2014-02-11 12:21:38 PM

llortcM_yllort: The reason they're under the cap, though, is that they don't want to spend the money.


...I'd say it's less to do with willingness to spend the money, but ability to attract top tier FA talent.  Hell, the only reason they'd keep Alex Mack is if they put the franchise tag on him, and that would likely mean TJ Ward is gone. They can't keep 'em, they can't attract 'em. Hence, plenty of cap room with no one to spend it on.
 
2014-02-11 12:22:07 PM

kukukupo: This is great news for Cleveland fans, but it begs the question:

Why didn't they do this before the coaching search?  Or maybe this is because of the coaching search?


Yeah, all of the sudden Mike Pettine becomes "the other guy's guy" before he even puts on a whistle. Have fun with that Mikey.

/Bills fan
//Not hating on him for leaving
///I just thought we'd have him for two seasons, not one
////Four consecutive slashies
 
2014-02-11 12:23:34 PM

ladodger34: * Didn't the Browns go down that route a while back with Mangini?


Yes...and then a year later they hired Holmgren.  Which was the beginning of the end for Randy Lerner as owner.
 
2014-02-11 12:24:08 PM
Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.
 
2014-02-11 12:29:08 PM

LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.


That's what it's beginning to sound like.  Don't think Lombardi turns to shiat in one season (esp. after trading for an extra first round pick); think there was something a lot more to this mess.
 
2014-02-11 12:33:17 PM
Lombardi drafted Weeden and said Josh Gordon would never make it in the NFL.

What are you people smoking to imply he knew what he was doing.  Today is a great day for Browns fans.
 
2014-02-11 12:34:52 PM

Uakronkid: There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.


That rumor makes no sense.   Why would the NFL do that?

LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.


The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?
 
2014-02-11 12:36:25 PM

T.rex: Lombardi drafted Weeden and said Josh Gordon would never make it in the NFL.

What are you people smoking to imply he knew what he was doing.  Today is a great day for Browns fans.


Weeden was drafted by Holmgrem.  So was Gordon mind you, but place the blame where the blame lies.
 
2014-02-11 12:37:56 PM

Uakronkid: IlGreven: So, basically, Jimmy Haslam just said he made a horrible mistake in his front office selections right from the start.  No wonder he had to bilk truck drivers to keep Pilot Flying J afloat.

/Sell the team, Jimmy. Make the fail complete.

There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.


Seriously, have the Browns even made a good move in the last decade? They haven't made the playoffs since '02. That's like Clippers bad (and they aren't even bad anymore).

Lombardi might have been a bad hire, but 13 months on the job?
 
2014-02-11 12:41:49 PM

llortcM_yllort: Uakronkid: There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.

That rumor makes no sense.   Why would the NFL do that?

LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.

The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?


The problem with the Oakland thing is you don't know how much power the guy actually had. It's sort of like the Brian Cashman dilemna. We just don't know how much power he actually has and it makes it hard to evaluate him.
 
2014-02-11 12:43:15 PM

llortcM_yllort: LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.


The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?


And he basically ran the Browns out of Cleveland the first time. Not even Captain Hoodie could make that look good (and he was able to get the Browns to the playoffs)...
 
2014-02-11 12:44:43 PM
Can anyone explain what Lombardi did that was bad?  It seemed like the defining move of his time in Cleveland was the Trent Richardson trade, which has pretty clearly worked out extremely well for the Browns.
 
2014-02-11 12:47:33 PM

justtray: I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.


Actually this is good news for Browns' fans. Lombardi wasn't exactly burning up the draft with superior choices, and he's one of the architects to pushing for Chudzinski for head coach last year. Seeing him and Banner leaving is a good thing.
 
2014-02-11 12:48:04 PM

ladodger34: llortcM_yllort: Uakronkid: There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.

That rumor makes no sense.   Why would the NFL do that?

LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.

The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?

The problem with the Oakland thing is you don't know how much power the guy actually had. It's sort of like the Brian Cashman dilemna. We just don't know how much power he actually has and it makes it hard to evaluate him.


He should have been given more time on the job, but he was GM for Oakland for years and hasn't had a job in the NFL for five years afterwards until the Browns grabbed him.  People who are good at their jobs don't go jobless for five years in the NFL.  Hell, people who are even remotely competent don't go five years without a job in the NFL.  It appears that the NFL made a decision after his time in Oakland about whether he was responsible or not.

Also, you know who else hasn't made the playoffs since 2002?  Lombardi's own Raiders.
 
2014-02-11 12:50:08 PM

Uakronkid: IlGreven: So, basically, Jimmy Haslam just said he made a horrible mistake in his front office selections right from the start.  No wonder he had to bilk truck drivers to keep Pilot Flying J afloat.

/Sell the team, Jimmy. Make the fail complete.

There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.


I didn't mean to sound rude, but I would like to hear the reasoning behind that rumor.  It sounds farfetched, though.
 
2014-02-11 12:55:03 PM

IlGreven: llortcM_yllort: LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.


The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?

And he basically ran the Browns out of Cleveland the first time. Not even Captain Hoodie could make that look good (and he was able to get the Browns to the playoffs)...


The Browns moved because Modell was a dummy and didn't realize that he had a sweetheart deal from the city that allowed him to make profits from the Indians until they moved to the Jake and after they moved, his revenue stream dried up.
 
2014-02-11 12:55:26 PM

Bendal: justtray: I knew the Browns would continue to find a way to suck. Awesome. Now go and mess up the draft, there's teams behind you that need those good picks.

Actually this is good news for Browns' fans. Lombardi wasn't exactly burning up the draft with superior choices, and he's one of the architects to pushing for Chudzinski for head coach last year. Seeing him and Banner leaving is a good thing.


How do you figure? Chud was hired before he was
 
2014-02-11 12:57:30 PM
Same old Browns.
 
2014-02-11 12:58:39 PM
images.fanatics.com
 
2014-02-11 12:59:36 PM

llortcM_yllort: T.rex: Lombardi drafted Weeden and said Josh Gordon would never make it in the NFL.

What are you people smoking to imply he knew what he was doing.  Today is a great day for Browns fans.

Weeden was drafted by Holmgrem.  So was Gordon mind you, but place the blame where the blame lies.


So you go and say this, but in an earlier post you say the following:

llortcM_yllort: LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.

The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?


Y-you do realized who owned the Raiders right?
 
2014-02-11 01:00:38 PM

Ranger Joe: Sounds like Moe just canned Curly and Larry. I wonder how many eye-pokes happened during that meeting.

Good riddance.



Wow, try to have an original thought vs plagiarizing the comments from the article.
 
2014-02-11 01:07:21 PM

llortcM_yllort: JohnHall: llortcM_yllort: Also, you have to question a guy's judgement who thinks being GM of the Browns is a better job than being GM of the Dolphins.  Especially since "judgement about what makes a football team successful" is sort of an important part of being a GM.

I'm not sure which position is better. The rumor in Miami was that the GM had less power than the Head Coach, and a VP that reported directly to Owner. Cleveland has the #4 pick, 3 picks in the top 35, and 5 picks in the top 83. They also have a very talented defense, and some offensive skill talent (Top 5 TE, top 3 WR). They are currently $45M under the cap. That's not a bad space for a GM to walk into.

The reason they're under the cap, though, is that they don't want to spend the money.  It's like talking about how much cap room Tampa Bay or Cincinnati has.  Your point about the Miami GM having less power is a good one, and is something I didn't think of or know about.


Egads which means they may overpay a FA to avoid the salary cap floor.
 
2014-02-11 01:19:00 PM

llortcM_yllort: ladodger34: llortcM_yllort: Uakronkid: There are rumors out there that the NFL picked his initial front office for him.

/Getting rid of Lombardi is the best move by Browns in at least a decade.

That rumor makes no sense.   Why would the NFL do that?

LarryDan43: Lombardi always came across as someone who knew what he was doing. I figured him as the only hope for that franchise. That organization is a mess.

The guy who ran Oakland into the ground?

The problem with the Oakland thing is you don't know how much power the guy actually had. It's sort of like the Brian Cashman dilemna. We just don't know how much power he actually has and it makes it hard to evaluate him.

He should have been given more time on the job, but he was GM for Oakland for years and hasn't had a job in the NFL for five years afterwards until the Browns grabbed him.  People who are good at their jobs don't go jobless for five years in the NFL.  Hell, people who are even remotely competent don't go five years without a job in the NFL.  It appears that the NFL made a decision after his time in Oakland about whether he was responsible or not.

Also, you know who else hasn't made the playoffs since 2002?  Lombardi's own Raiders.


At least the Raiders last playoff appearance was a Super Bowl and 2 AFC championship games. Lombadi was hired the same year as Gruden and they were pretty damned successful. But the dude hasn't worked for the Raiders since '05.

We have two teams that haven't made the playoffs since '02 who have had multiple people in charge of player personal. At some point in time, it falls on the ownership.

//Lombardi might suck and didn't deserve his job, but at some point you have start looking at the guy who decided to hire him.
 
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