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(Townhall)   Five virtues that liberals take to the extreme   (townhall.com ) divider line 119
    More: Amusing, liberals, Occupy protests  
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1861 clicks; posted to Politics » on 11 Feb 2014 at 8:26 AM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-11 12:58:36 PM  
Wow, the liberal derp in here is thick
 
2014-02-11 01:04:16 PM  

dantheman195: Wow, the liberal derp in here is thick


Looks like this guy sure showed all you liberals in here.
 
2014-02-11 01:04:16 PM  
I read a lot, and that article was the dumbest collection of words I've read in a long time. Then I got to the comments...
 
2014-02-11 01:20:59 PM  
And the only virtue true Americans take to extreme is their love of all American Apple Pie.

joshuatrent.com wonkette.com

You won't find any of them holding with the commie nonsense that Moochelle is trying to ram down their throats such as "as American as steamed vegetables".
 
2014-02-11 01:43:48 PM  
i1.ytimg.com
 
2014-02-11 01:59:52 PM  

Dinki: 5 things that conservatives appear to consider virtues

Greed
Selfishness
religious intolerance
self pity
ignorance


Actually, if you're talking about the derpy garden variety "conservative" of the sort that frequents that site, there is really only one virtue left, and that is fear.
 
2014-02-11 02:43:32 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: hubiestubert: 1) Tolerance
2) Compassion
3) Being nicer
4) Self esteem
5) Diversity

Yeah, these are destroying EVERYTHING...

Well, to some extent American liberals doing those things (trying to be helpful, fair and inclusive) has helped create create the modern American conservative movement.

/Every time I see a Conservative demanding that religion be treated as science in schools, all I can think is "Well, there's the "multculturalism run rampant we were warned about!"


Conservatives have been persecuting and killing people they don't like, denying and even criminalizing science, and abusing the public trust for personal gain while at the same time espousing empty promises about helping the less fortunate for most/all of recorded history.

Modern Conservatives are simply the continuation of not-so-modern Conservatives.
 
2014-02-11 02:45:01 PM  
One virtue that liberals can never be too extreme about: not giving a single fark about whatever Hawkins is currently blubbering about.
 
2014-02-11 02:57:47 PM  

dantheman195: Wow, the liberal derp in here is thick


wow. it's almost like you........are concerned.
 
2014-02-11 03:31:27 PM  

Emposter: Conservatives have been persecuting and killing people they don't like, denying and even criminalizing science, and abusing the public trust for personal gain while at the same time espousing empty promises about helping the less fortunate for most/all of recorded history.


You know all that could easily be applied to liberals as well, right?  Eugenics, communism, prohibition, the Vietnam War, the anti-GMO crowd, etc...

DarwiOdrade: One virtue that liberals can never be too extreme about: not giving a single fark about whatever Hawkins is currently blubbering about.


Yep.
 
2014-02-11 04:27:29 PM  

A Cave Geek: Oh, goodie, another 'liberal vs conservative' thread.

Look, philosophically, reality is somewhere in between the two extremes.  At the moment, it's closer to the liberal view of the world, but that's not to say that the conservative philosophy is completely without merit.  (Their current implementation of that philosophy is another matter)

Basic virtues That both parties agree are valid and good for society in general: (In varying degrees)
- Generosity
- Hard work
- Responsibility
- Creativity
- Courage
- Freedom
- Integrity
- Honor
- Honesty
- Respect
- Kindness

Now, where things get really messy is when you start rating those virtues. While the GOP values generosity, conservatives don't value generosity as highly as they value freedom or responsibility.  Liberals tend to value kindness and generosity more highly than blunt force 'honesty'.

From what I've seen of the GOP, their top virtues that are valued above all others are Freedom, Honor, and Hard work.  All other virtues are relegated to a 'if we have time for them'.  From what I've seen of the liberals, their top three are:  Kindness, generosity, and Creativity.  Most others appear to be an 'if we have time for them'.

Like I said earlier, however, I think the 'perfect balance' of these virtues is much closer to the liberal view than the conservative one.


I would say you missed a couple major liberal values: equality and fairness (although fairness could arguably be interchanged with a few of these I suppose).  Most of what liberals stand for and fight for is equality whether it be for race, gender, sexual orientation, wealth, etc.

You're right in the sense that we have a different set of values, but it also extends to having a different set of definitions for those words (as someone else mentioned) as well as a different set of goals and fundamental beliefs.  Our neural frameworks are just different.

It really boils down to liberals want to change the world to make it what they perceive to be a better place.  Generally this means that everyone is equal, not discriminated against, and gets along (at least in an ideal world).  In the liberal utopia, everyone gets to do their own thing and we all work together to prevent people from harming each other (whether it be physically or emotionally).  Sometimes that means regulations against corporations who want to harm people, sometimes that just means rules against bullies.  They want freedom and liberty in the form of everyone being free as long as they are playing nice with each other.

Conservatives also want to make the world to be what they perceive to be a better place, but in their view, a better place means everyone follows the rules of a true authority (it's important that they perceive the authority to be legitimate though and that can only be someone who's just like them or traditionally the type who has been a leader previously).  They don't want people to be equal, they like hierarchies where people have to earn their right to work their way up the ranks, and unfortunately for some, that simply isn't possible due to their unfortunate luck to not be born into the dominant group whatever it may be.  They want everyone to respect the hierarchy and know their place and to never question it thus creating structure and tradition.  They take comfort in knowing that people aren't doing things they don't agree with, and if they are, the authority has the right to persecute and punish that individual.  Ironically they don't like laws or rules that allow others to make decisions that they don't agree with or that forces them to respect others.  They see this as an infringement of their freedom.  They want freedom and liberty in the form of everyone being free to hurt, discriminate against, persecute, and force their will on those lower in the hierarchy than them.  It's no coincidence that conservatives have tended to belong to traditionally privileged groups (rich, dominant race, straight, male, dominant religion).  They want to maintain their dominance and privilege while ensuring that others cannot have what they have as they like to feel superior.
 
2014-02-11 04:39:41 PM  

dantheman195: Wow, the liberal derp in here is thick


Indeed? Please explain to us how "being nice" is bad.
 
2014-02-11 04:59:17 PM  

FLMountainMan: Emposter: Conservatives have been persecuting and killing people they don't like, denying and even criminalizing science, and abusing the public trust for personal gain while at the same time espousing empty promises about helping the less fortunate for most/all of recorded history.

You know all that could easily be applied to liberals as well, right?  Eugenics, communism, prohibition, the Vietnam War, the anti-GMO crowd, etc...


No, yes, historically bipartisan with no continuity into modern period, wtf are you drunk, fringe loonies and an issue that didn't even exist historically.

Pathetic.  Even your false equivalencies are wrong.
 
2014-02-11 06:09:18 PM  
Right. Because if I want to know how Liberals think, I'm going to go to a right-wing nutjob website.
 
2014-02-11 06:31:25 PM  
Okay, this is one of those situations where the article itself makes some good points while the author's past comments have created some biases that prevent you from seeing his points.  Let me try and reframe it in a slightly less "derpy" way.

1. Tolerance: Yes, we should have tolerance for other people's beliefs.  However, where do you draw the line between tolerance for a belief and tolerance for something that our society judges is profoundly wrong, such as say human sacrifice for a religion?  Or tolerance for the belief that killing other people in the name of your God just because other people don't believe in your God? (Yes, that is a partial shot at Islam, but I will freely acknowledge that Christianity has it's own share of blood on it's hands as well).  The point is that at some point you have to draw a line between toleration and the overall good of a continuing society.

2. Compassion: What happens when the money runs out?  I also disagree with the entire idea that we are a compassionless society.  There are lots of people who give money, goods, or there own personal time to many deserving causes.  I would argue that we are much more compassionate towards helping people in need than people think.  Also, compassion isn't just found in a government program.  What about a private charity organization?  The catholic church is one of the most giving organizations in the world yet does it rely on government handouts?  The goal of a government program should be to 1) help those who are incapable of helping themselves due to a physical or mental handicap (I work with emotionally disturbed kids, so I know a lot about mental handicaps); 2) to help those who need temporary relief due to unfortunate circumstances such as death or unexpected unemployment; 3) to help those who are capable of giving to our society to be able get back to work so they can continue to contribute rather than drain society.  Conservatives support this idea, but we can not afford to let the grasshoppers be grasshoppers in perpetuity.  Eventually, the cost in terms of resources will outpace the available resources and thus, you have societal collapse.  Compassion, yes.  But compassion that is designed to encourage contributing to society, not that rewards being a constant drain on society.  One of the hardest lessons to learn as a special education teacher, or any teacher for that matter, is that no matter how hard you try you can't save every kid.  Doctors understand it: it's called triage.  Nobody likes it, but we have to do it.  This means we need to encourage everyone who is physically and mentally capable of working to work.

3. Being nice: Sometimes you have to stop being nice and start being mean.  If you're too nice, people walk all over you.  If you're willing to demonstrate that you are at least willing to stand up for yourself, then the really mean people out there will basically bully you into doing whatever they want.  The best example is Chamberlain and Hitler.  If Chamberlain showed even a little backbone, it could have averted a whole lot of problems.

4. Self-Esteem: There's a difference in telling a girl that no, you're not fat so please stop starving yourself and telling a 21 year old who can't read, write, or do simple math despite 16 years of year-round services and multiple hospitalizations in mental hospitals and jail terms for armed robbery because he thinks that he's "thug life".  One you put into a program designed to support for the rest of their natural life because everyone realizes that unless they are placed in such a program, they might not do something worse than just rob someone.  The other you help by saying "no, you're not fat and society is wrong to call you fat." (plus a lot of personal therapy).  It's time to stop being overly therapeutic and start being a little realistic with our education system.  If a kid is simply incapable of learning, then we need to adjust their educational program accordingly so they don't get kicked in the teeth when they enter the real world.  Incidentally, I blame NCLB for a majority of those problems.    There's a fine line between helping and being unrealistic to the point where we are creating more problems than we're solving.

5. Diversity: It's okay to be different, but not to the point where it shatters society.  Please, go out and celebrate your differences.  However, we do this now to the point where instead of a melting pot.  When I teach my students about the difference between a solution and mixture in chemistry, I use the analogies of soda and a salad.  Can you pick out the individual ingredients in a salad?  Yes, that's a mixture.  Can you pick out the individual ingredients in a soda?  No, that's a solution.  What makes our society so good is that regardless of what your ethnicity, gender, etc., that we all have some basic common beliefs.  The whole melting pot concept is that our society has taken the best of a lot of different cultures and combined them into a unique American culture that allowed our society to function.  Taken to it's extreme, our society becomes very divided because those common beliefs are no longer so common.  Then our society becomes dysfunctional and eventually collapses along ethnic or whatever lines you pick.  This can be done without becoming unthinking and unfeeling clones that the both sides often accuse each other of attempting to do.
 
2014-02-11 10:36:42 PM  
I have to stop reading PotatoHall. I think I lost another 400 IQ points on that one.
 
2014-02-11 10:56:33 PM  
"Diversity is a strength? Tell that to Afghanistan or Iraq. Both nations are so diverse they want to murder each other.  "

This may be the worst set of three consecutive sentences I've ever read.
 
2014-02-11 11:24:57 PM  
sign up temporarily disabled to prevent gifted liberal trolling
 
2014-02-12 04:53:19 PM  
NOBODY expects the Liberal Inquisition! Our chief weapon is tolerance...tolerance and compassion...compassion and tolerance.... Our two weapons are tolerance and compassion ...and being nice.... Our *three* weapons are tolerance, compassion, and being nice...and an almost fanatical devotion to self-esteem.... Our *four*...no... *Amongst* our weapons.... Amongst our weaponry...are such elements as tolerance, compassion.... I'll come in again.
 
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