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(Salon)   The whiniest members of the 1%   (salon.com ) divider line
    More: Amusing, plutocracy, selfishness, American Justice  
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13164 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Feb 2014 at 10:55 AM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-08 11:33:07 PM  
"Yeah. You know, it occurs to me that the best way you hurt rich people is by turning them into poor people."
- Billy Ray


/profound
//now

AlwaysRightBoy: knows about "My" money... it still not yours for the taking


Maybe not... but "your" money is only worth anything because we as a society (and by implication the government) agreed that it was, like gold or anything else. Food has intrinsic worth because without it you die. Same with water, and clothing in colder climates, as well as shelter. But unless I agree that those brightly colored pieces of paper and shiny metal you hand me are equal in value to what you want from me, "your money" means jack sh*t. It does indeed belong to all of us, because without all of us it has no value.
The value it has to you is irrelevant, but the value it has to me is what's important when you want something I have.
 
2014-02-08 11:37:50 PM  
Searching: "zero sum"
0 results

You goyim don't even know how all this supposed hoarded wealth, that didn't exist 100 years, came into existence.  You can't hoard what only exists once you create it.

Go flucking study economic theory some more.  It has done you shiat good up to now.  I'm hoping it will keep your idle hands busy in the future.
 
2014-02-08 11:42:44 PM  
If wealth is such a burden then give away your money and be happy.
 
2014-02-08 11:43:09 PM  

rewind2846: "Yeah. You know, it occurs to me that the best way you hurt rich people is by turning them into poor people."
- Billy Ray


/profound
//now

AlwaysRightBoy: knows about "My" money... it still not yours for the taking

Maybe not... but "your" money is only worth anything because we as a society (and by implication the government) agreed that it was, like gold or anything else. Food has intrinsic worth because without it you die. Same with water, and clothing in colder climates, as well as shelter. But unless I agree that those brightly colored pieces of paper and shiny metal you hand me are equal in value to what you want from me, "your money" means jack sh*t. It does indeed belong to all of us, because without all of us it has no value.
The value it has to you is irrelevant, but the value it has to me is what's important when you want something I have.


You can have the rest of mine so I can start taking the rest of yours.
 
2014-02-08 11:46:07 PM  

super_grass: Teens are dumb and whiny as fark, even kids of rich people.

Now feast your eyes in spoiled stupidity:

][www.boredpanda.com image 605x780]

[www.boredpanda.com image 605x553]
[www.boredpanda.com image 605x749]


They're stupid, too.  Apple doesn't even make white Macbooks any more.  That brat is angry she didn't get something they stopped making 3 years ago.
 
2014-02-08 11:55:35 PM  
faculty.tcc.fl.edu

floridahistory.org

sites.psu.edu

static.guim.co.uk
 
2014-02-09 12:31:54 AM  

trappedspirit: Searching: "zero sum"
0 results

You goyim don't even know how all this supposed hoarded wealth, that didn't exist 100 years, came into existence.  You can't hoard what only exists once you create it.

Go flucking study economic theory some more.  It has done you shiat good up to now.  I'm hoping it will keep your idle hands busy in the future.


This is an economic myth, akin to humans having unlimited wants and needs, and the reason why economics is the most dismal science of all. Economic theory is a contrivance and corrosive to basic morality.

Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum.
 
2014-02-09 01:00:22 AM  

MayoSlather: Economic theory is a contrivance and corrosive to basic morality.


As should any "science" be that offers validity to nothing more than a pack of play by play wankers who never picked up a ball, sitting in the lodge, and telling the crowd what they just saw every 3 minutes.  And then publishing the game sats as a "theory"  Useless as titties on a fish, the lot of them.  Business plans can be mapped to cover centuries.  The transactions take about 3 sec flat, happen with a handshake and then the mountains move.  Nobody who has made a nickel in this shark tank is working off the Econ 303 play book or needs it.
 
2014-02-09 01:08:22 AM  
Don't give the people who bring the money in the door a decent wage, give them stirring songs and emotionally engaging videos and attaboys and folded flags and medals and some hyped notion of he dignity of beating your brains out for 50 years to get bent over the sink when they're too tired to keep buying you 300,000.00 cars.

thomsonconsultingservicesllc.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-02-09 01:43:37 AM  
So let us lift a glass to those who toiled on another man's field.  Who sowed where they could barely reap.  Who took a scythe to 1,000 acres for the privilege of gleaning the scraps.  Who plowed and sweat and laughed and loved and brought loved and hopeful babies into a world that gave them no ladder or comeuppance, only a smile from an honest father or a loving mother who fed and clothed them the best they could.

Let us praise the true wealth creators, briefly, as they are mostly modest men and women.


Call up the band and play a reel and a polka and a happy dance for the makers of the world we stand upon.


Let us shake their hands and pull them to our bosoms to praise their furrowed brows and sore backs and tell them the love they put forth has not gone unnoticed at our dinner table or in our humble homes.  Let us tell them of our respect and admiration for the roads they cleared and the wheat  they harvested and the money they moved so that others might stand in the shadow of their dignity and toil, before they, as we all must, look to the sky, starless and bible black, and fall back into the arms of mother night.   Let's drink to the salt of the earth.
 
2014-02-09 02:23:51 AM  
Doug Hopkins was a brilliant songwriter who blew his brains out after he got kicked out of his own band, named after a skin condition that results from alcoholism.

Ah, the irony.

This is the best song on their debut album, IMNSFHO.

If you want to know what it's like to be working class, whip smart and out of ideas, give it a listen.
 
2014-02-09 03:26:24 AM  

Astorix: ThighsofGlory: bunner: I wonder if people with more money than Croesus ever stare out their windows and ponder if this sad little tap dance we all get to do is all there is and if, by the grace their vomit inducing avarice, they really have "won".  And whether that brief, hollow feeling when nobody is kissing their ass is what winning feels like.  I mean, sure, they just shake it off and go buy more useless, overpriced trash and then wave it around like it's the holy grail, but I can't help but wonder if they ever have the little attacks of existential angst that are the hallmark of living poor.

Nope. Not a one.

Then explain Tom Perkins.


No.
 
2014-02-09 11:43:26 AM  

MayoSlather: trappedspirit: Searching: "zero sum"
0 results

You goyim don't even know how all this supposed hoarded wealth, that didn't exist 100 years, came into existence.  You can't hoard what only exists once you create it.

Go flucking study economic theory some more.  It has done you shiat good up to now.  I'm hoping it will keep your idle hands busy in the future.

This is an economic myth, akin to humans having unlimited wants and needs, and the reason why economics is the most dismal science of all. Economic theory is a contrivance and corrosive to basic morality.

Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum.



*whoosh*
 
2014-02-09 12:01:35 PM  

trappedspirit: MayoSlather: trappedspirit: Searching: "zero sum"
0 results

You goyim don't even know how all this supposed hoarded wealth, that didn't exist 100 years, came into existence.  You can't hoard what only exists once you create it.

Go flucking study economic theory some more.  It has done you shiat good up to now.  I'm hoping it will keep your idle hands busy in the future.

This is an economic myth, akin to humans having unlimited wants and needs, and the reason why economics is the most dismal science of all. Economic theory is a contrivance and corrosive to basic morality.

Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum.


*whoosh*


Brilliant rebuttal. The response to criticism of "non zero sum" thinking always has such cogent displays of logic, and are never based out of bias from wealth apologists.

And in your mind you're above this, anyone that disagrees with you, you'll claim they just don't get it, or they aren't framing it the proper context. Unfortunately non zero sum ideas never hold up in any model, and is easily disprovable.

The thing about hard sciences is they offer a model of prediction. You can run thought experiments and calculations with observable data and anyone given the right variables can predict outcomes. Unfortunately for economics, this is an impossibility. It rarely plays out as predicted. Other than the most rudimentary elements of supply and demand does any prediction consistently hold up.
 
2014-02-09 12:10:34 PM  

Shades: Keep blaming others for your problems, though,


Point out where I did that, smartass, or keep your ignorant assumptions to yourself.

/in fact, just keep your ignorant assumptions to yourself, please and thanks
 
2014-02-09 12:16:18 PM  

traylor: I'm not sure how killing the rich would solve your problems.


It's not just the killing of the rich, it's the fact that when they're no longer around to hoard money, all that money goes back into the economy. Ta-daaa!
 
2014-02-09 12:18:50 PM  

AlwaysRightBoy: classwar


I don't think you quite grasp who is waging war with whom.
 
2014-02-09 12:21:34 PM  

AlwaysRightBoy: You and I know... this will not happen.


Bull-farking-shiat, it won't.
 
2014-02-09 12:26:16 PM  

AlwaysRightBoy: So 35 years of sacrifice and labor at my job is for nothing?


It is if you're some mean old bastard barking on the internet.
 
2014-02-09 12:41:06 PM  

MayoSlather: Brilliant rebuttal. The response to criticism of "non zero sum" thinking always has such cogent displays of logic, and are never based out of bias from wealth apologists.

And in your mind you're above this, anyone that disagrees with you, you'll claim they just don't get it, or they aren't framing it the proper context. Unfortunately non zero sum ideas never hold up in any model, and is easily disprovable.


You are the guy who said

"Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum. "

Right?  Then you go off on scientific principles.   Well thing is, Scientific 'zero sum' principles, like conservation of energy and conservation of momentum are supposed to apply at all times.  not just after T=0.

Your example:  "A company makes 100 bucks ".  That's before the T=0 where the  profit is distributed.  So is it still a conservation principle at T<0?  But 100 bucks were 'made'! Sure you'll say the customers paid for it, so it's still zero sum.  But how?  They wrote a check?  The bank has cash sitting in a vault to cover that check?  In this day of fractional reserves, probably not.  So where is that money coming from.  Probably the future value of a mortgage or something similar.  Which is a guess, not something real.

Congratulations, your zero-sum is not zero sum.
 
2014-02-09 01:15:30 PM  

Vlad_the_Inaner: MayoSlather: Brilliant rebuttal. The response to criticism of "non zero sum" thinking always has such cogent displays of logic, and are never based out of bias from wealth apologists.

And in your mind you're above this, anyone that disagrees with you, you'll claim they just don't get it, or they aren't framing it the proper context. Unfortunately non zero sum ideas never hold up in any model, and is easily disprovable.

You are the guy who said

"Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum. "

Right?  Then you go off on scientific principles.   Well thing is, Scientific 'zero sum' principles, like conservation of energy and conservation of momentum are supposed to apply at all times.  not just after T=0.

Your example:  "A company makes 100 bucks ".  That's before the T=0 where the  profit is distributed.  So is it still a conservation principle at T<0?  But 100 bucks were 'made'! Sure you'll say the customers paid for it, so it's still zero sum.  But how?  They wrote a check?  The bank has cash sitting in a vault to cover that check?  In this day of fractional reserves, probably not.  So where is that money coming from.  Probably the future value of a mortgage or something similar.  Which is a guess, not something real.

Congratulations, your zero-sum is not zero sum.


In my example, which admittedly was not the basis out which non zero sum thinking arises, but it is the applied principle. That few having more directly translates into others having less. There's no way around this. It is zero sum.

Furthermore, non zero sum thinking requires the infinite. Infinite is impossible in an economy, both in supply and demand. Make any excuse you want out of fractional reserves in banks, but none of that applies to real resources available, which are in fact finite, and in real world resources one person having more will translate to another having less.

Try as you might, economics does not trump physics.

All non zero sum thinking occurs at this mythical level of production that doesn't exist in the real world. And again, real science has real world applications and freely admits we live in a fully connected system. Non zero sum game thinking exists within a vacuum and a world without leverage. In this magical world one person can acquire infinite amounts of wealth and this has no effect on another persons ability to produce wealth. It's simply not true.

Congratulations your logic sucks, and you're still wrong.
 
2014-02-09 02:06:37 PM  

MayoSlather: Furthermore, non zero sum thinking requires the infinite. Infinite is impossible in an economy, both in supply and demand. Make any excuse you want out of fractional reserves in banks, but none of that applies to real resources available, which are in fact finite, and in real world resources one person having more will translate to another having less.


Well, there's your problem.  You think money, or 'bucks' as you put it are REAL resources, instead of a fungible token unit.

Your world model is based on an assumption that all things are owned by someone somewhere.  That's not the case.    There are plenty of things that are not owned (aka wealth) until they are claimed.  If a golden meteor falls from space and lands on your property, you can claim it.  But you didn't get it from any other person.  It's a non-zero sum acquisition.  Set up a solar panel and acquire some solar power, then sell it to the powergrid.  That power did not come from diminishing another person's wealth, but you 'made' money.  Same thing with agriculture.  The solar power to grow the food did not diminish anyone else.  Your labor to till the soil didn't either. The CO2 and other gases come 'free' with the atmosphere.  They do not belong to any one person. Assuming no need for irrigation, the water fell free from the sky.  Your produce is wealth that you can trade.  It came from no other person to make it a zero-sum game.

Sorry to break it to you, but the entire world is but an infinitesimal part of the universe, and so in a practical sense there is what's effectively infinite stuff out there.  Not to say it's all easy to acquire, but to claim it doesn't exist or is already owned by another person is just plain stupid.
 
2014-02-09 02:10:46 PM  

Vlad_the_Inaner: a fungible token unit.


www.csmonitor.com


SKREEEEE
 
2014-02-09 02:44:53 PM  

thamike: AlwaysRightBoy: So 35 years of sacrifice and labor at my job is for nothing?

It is if you're some mean old bastard barking on the internet.


Really? That's no way to address yourself in the mirror. Especially  the first thing in the morning
 
2014-02-09 03:07:00 PM  

AlwaysRightBoy: thamike: AlwaysRightBoy: So 35 years of sacrifice and labor at my job is for nothing?

It is if you're some mean old bastard barking on the internet.

Really? That's no way to address yourself in the mirror. Especially  the first thing in the morning


A mean old bastard acting like a 5th grader on the internet.
 
2014-02-09 03:15:52 PM  

Vlad_the_Inaner: MayoSlather: Furthermore, non zero sum thinking requires the infinite. Infinite is impossible in an economy, both in supply and demand. Make any excuse you want out of fractional reserves in banks, but none of that applies to real resources available, which are in fact finite, and in real world resources one person having more will translate to another having less.

Well, there's your problem.  You think money, or 'bucks' as you put it are REAL resources, instead of a fungible token unit.

Your world model is based on an assumption that all things are owned by someone somewhere.  That's not the case.    There are plenty of things that are not owned (aka wealth) until they are claimed.  If a golden meteor falls from space and lands on your property, you can claim it.  But you didn't get it from any other person.  It's a non-zero sum acquisition.  Set up a solar panel and acquire some solar power, then sell it to the powergrid.  That power did not come from diminishing another person's wealth, but you 'made' money.  Same thing with agriculture.  The solar power to grow the food did not diminish anyone else.  Your labor to till the soil didn't either. The CO2 and other gases come 'free' with the atmosphere.  They do not belong to any one person. Assuming no need for irrigation, the water fell free from the sky.  Your produce is wealth that you can trade.  It came from no other person to make it a zero-sum game.

Sorry to break it to you, but the entire world is but an infinitesimal part of the universe, and so in a practical sense there is what's effectively infinite stuff out there.  Not to say it's all easy to acquire, but to claim it doesn't exist or is already owned by another person is just plain stupid.


Again, you're still operating within a mythical non connected reality and one that exists without taking leverage into account. And even in your example there is still a very finite money supply which is largely held by a few people, while others have very little, that's the entire premise behind why wealth inequality is a problem. Ignoring this is to ignore a very simple observable reality.

We are on earth, we have real limits to resources and as long as we're going to agree that things like hyperinflation are possible then in fact it is zero sum. If a non zero sum game was true we could agree to just give everyone a million dollars and let them produce off this capital. And in truth we could hand out money to some degree given our current levels of productivity, however it still has its limits.

Even when dealing with solar power as you point out, you can only produce so many solar panels, someone will have more while another has less. There is finite space available to set them up, finite time to build them, only a finite amount of power they can produce. Not only that but there power must be used as it's created, there is only so much power demand at a given time and hence so much money that can be produced once that power demand is met and that must be split in some very real fashion where one person gets more and another gets less.

Also, if your argument needs golden meteors to fall from the sky to be relevant...give up.
 
2014-02-09 03:30:52 PM  

MayoSlather: Also, if your argument needs golden meteors to fall from the sky to be relevant...give up.


So since it didn't, and used solar power and agriculture as other examples, you give up?

Oh wait, you think money is as real a resource as land, energy, food, water and shelter.

But I'm disconnected...

Tell you what.  Lets plop you alone on a desert island with a million bucks, but no power, food, water, or shelter and see how you do.   Then you can show me how REAL money is as a resource.

/Hell, I acquired many trillion dollars to give away as presents last year, so I know how real dollars are.

ecx.images-amazon.com
 
2014-02-09 05:19:50 PM  

AlwaysRightBoy: LavenderWolf: AlwaysRightBoy: Noted: other people's money belongs to the people who don't make that money.

You don't own money.

Ever.

It's not yours.

The people, in the form of government, own all money everywhere. You don't own it. You don't get to say "I earned it, I get to keep it!"

You didn't earn it in a vacuum. You earned it because society made it possible for you to earn it.

There is no such thing as "My" money or "Your" money. Just money. You use it for a while, I use it for a while, but it belongs to the government. They do have the power and every right to say "We're taxing this money to pay for society's needs." And you don't get to say what those needs are, except by exercising your right to vote. The civilized world has decided that it's not right for a few ultra-wealthy people to control all of the money. The civilized world has decided that the poor need protection from the rich, as the rich have proven time and time again that they will grind the poor into the dirt to earn fraction of a percentage more per quarter than they did last quarter. The civilized world has decided that the wealthy only got that way on the backs of the poor, and it's the responsibility of the wealthy to pay for those that paved the road for their success.

So 35 years of sacrifice and labor at my job is for nothing? Should I have  just gone on the government dole in the first place? I'll try that next time around and see how it works.


knows about "My" money... it still not yours for the taking


The point has sailed over your head.

Also, you're pretty stupid if you think "35 years of sacrifice and labour" qualifies you for taxes on the ultra-wealthy. You are not ultra-wealthy.
 
2014-02-09 05:25:22 PM  

MayoSlather: trappedspirit: Searching: "zero sum"
0 results

You goyim don't even know how all this supposed hoarded wealth, that didn't exist 100 years, came into existence.  You can't hoard what only exists once you create it.

Go flucking study economic theory some more.  It has done you shiat good up to now.  I'm hoping it will keep your idle hands busy in the future.

This is an economic myth, akin to humans having unlimited wants and needs, and the reason why economics is the most dismal science of all. Economic theory is a contrivance and corrosive to basic morality.

Of course it's a zero sum game. We don't live in a magical world where infinite money, time, demand, and resources exist. A company makes 100 bucks the CEO takes 99 and gives his employees a dollar to split, that's pretty f'ing zero sum. Or there are 2 restaurants that get all the business, a third restaurant opens and takes half the business away from the other two; again pretty f'ing zero sum.




This is why "The Secret" doesn't work. We can't all be billionaires, we can't all have a BMW.

However, having said that, there is no way we should tolerate 85 families owning as much wealth as 3.5 billion people. It's suicidal in it's unsustainability.

It's like these rich jerks WANT to be guillotined.
 
2014-02-09 05:42:10 PM  

ThighsofGlory: Astorix: ThighsofGlory: bunner: I wonder if people with more money than Croesus ever stare out their windows and ponder if this sad little tap dance we all get to do is all there is and if, by the grace their vomit inducing avarice, they really have "won".  And whether that brief, hollow feeling when nobody is kissing their ass is what winning feels like.  I mean, sure, they just shake it off and go buy more useless, overpriced trash and then wave it around like it's the holy grail, but I can't help but wonder if they ever have the little attacks of existential angst that are the hallmark of living poor.

Nope. Not a one.

Then explain Tom Perkins.

No.


Then I'll explain it for you: "if you throw a stone into a pack of dogs, the one that gets hit barks."

Tom Perkins spent the last couple of weeks whining that the resentment of the 1% is about to turn into Kristallnacht. Why? Because he and his fellow complainers are afraid. They are very afraid that they are outnumbered and out gunned. Which they are: 85 people against 7 billion are not good odds.

What is missing is the mobilization to send them to the guillotine. There are too many people still brainwashed into thinking that they will get some crumbs odd their huge tables. It's called the "Powerball" mentality. They still hold out that little hope.

But it won't work out for Tom Perkins in the long term. Because he, Waltons, Kochs, Chip Wilson, AOL guy Armstrong, Zuckerberg, they put their Spaceball maids on suck mode. And they don't stop sucking until they have completely sucked all the resources, money and means for life out of everybody else.

When people no longer are able to eat, they mobilize frighteningly fast.

This is why the 1% get guillotined. This is why Rome gets sacked. This is why the Russian Czarist gets dragged out and shot.
 
2014-02-09 06:03:54 PM  

Astorix: ThighsofGlory: Astorix: ThighsofGlory: bunner: I wonder if people with more money than Croesus ever stare out their windows and ponder if this sad little tap dance we all get to do is all there is and if, by the grace their vomit inducing avarice, they really have "won".  And whether that brief, hollow feeling when nobody is kissing their ass is what winning feels like.  I mean, sure, they just shake it off and go buy more useless, overpriced trash and then wave it around like it's the holy grail, but I can't help but wonder if they ever have the little attacks of existential angst that are the hallmark of living poor.

Nope. Not a one.

Then explain Tom Perkins.

No.

Then I'll explain it for you: "if you throw a stone into a pack of dogs, the one that gets hit barks."

Tom Perkins spent the last couple of weeks whining that the resentment of the 1% is about to turn into Kristallnacht. Why? Because he and his fellow complainers are afraid. They are very afraid that they are outnumbered and out gunned. Which they are: 85 people against 7 billion are not good odds.

What is missing is the mobilization to send them to the guillotine. There are too many people still brainwashed into thinking that they will get some crumbs odd their huge tables. It's called the "Powerball" mentality. They still hold out that little hope.

But it won't work out for Tom Perkins in the long term. Because he, Waltons, Kochs, Chip Wilson, AOL guy Armstrong, Zuckerberg, they put their Spaceball maids on suck mode. And they don't stop sucking until they have completely sucked all the resources, money and means for life out of everybody else.

When people no longer are able to eat, they mobilize frighteningly fast.

This is why the 1% get guillotined. This is why Rome gets sacked. This is why the Russian Czarist gets dragged out and shot.


Can't wait.
 
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