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(Kotaku)   13 year old boy rapes his 8 year old sister. Let's place the blame where it truly belongs, the Xbox he used to watch the porn that inspired him   (kotaku.com ) divider line 222
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13446 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Feb 2014 at 4:20 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-05 07:27:51 PM  

factoryconnection: miss diminutive: Well-adjusted, empathetic and reasonable 13 year olds don't rape their siblings just because they viewed some pornography. At 13 they know enough to understand how these actions are wrong and can impact another person.

I suspect there's more to the story here.

My wife used to work with underaged sex offenders.  Almost every single one was a victim of sexual abuse themselves, exposed to pornography and sex from a young age, often by relatives or close family friends.  Stories that were extremely difficult to listen to.

And then there was, every once in a while, the genuine sociopath with good parents that just had absolutely no empathy and no compunction in getting whatever he wanted.

So there is most likely a pedophile at the end of this story, too.



A long time ago when I was a teen I used to work in a store that - among many other things - sold these realistic looking sandstone dog statues. Most of them were small, meant to go on a knicknack shelf, but we had a life sized one in a sitting pose that we put in the entrance of the store to lure in the kind of people who would want a sandstone dog statue for some reason.

One day a pretty average looking suburban white guy comes in to look at something else with his like 2 or 3 year old boy, and while I'm selling the dad on the doodad he wanted to take a look at I notice that his little boy is behind him trying to give a handjob to the dog statue. Not just playing around with the statue, not just touching it.... seriously and undeniably trying to specifically give the statue of the dog a handjob.

The clear implication made me sick to my stomach on the spot, but I was dumb teenager and didn't really know what to do... The guy left and to this day it reminds me that abuse is probably a lot more common then we would all like to think and that all different kinds of farked up adults almost certainly got that way by having it taught to them when they were too young to know any better.
 
2014-02-05 07:29:41 PM  

sprawl15: cookiefleck: I'm not the one spouting off hypothetical BS and stating it as fact. You still haven't said how you came up with your assertion that law enforcement and mental health professionals will somehow cause more damage to this girl than getting raped by her brother.

well if it was a legitimate rape her body would have ways of shutting that down


You sir, are bad.

/new keyboard, aisle seat ticket, etc
 
2014-02-05 07:29:59 PM  

dopekitty74: Profedius: I find I want more information into how this act was discovered. I think rape in the idea that he held her down tore her underwear off is less likely than a case of sexual experimentation that resulted in him having actual sex with his sister. I am guessing at some point she had wanted the play to end most likely at the point of penetration and he did not stop. I guess sometime after the event she told a parent. I am still wondering how as a parent you go from finding out your son had sex with your daughter to calling the police to have him arrested. For the wellbeing of the family wouldn't the parents try to correct the issue quietly and quickly before bringing in law enforcement? This event has been dragged out for I am guessing months with all of society expressing how horrible this was and how she was victimized by her own brother. She is going to be damaged now for life when it could have been over and recovered from more quickly. I would have handled the situation differently which I think would have had less impact on the development of both children.

this is how it was handled in my family when my sixteen year old cousin forced me to give him oral sex when I was six.  He didn't come over anymore, my parents talked to me about how he was bad and it was ok for me to be upset about it.  At the time though, I really didn't think much of it except that it was gross.  I already had peeked at my brother's skin mags that were hidden in the bathroom (he's a lot older than me) and also at some point remember peeking thru the bathroom door when my dad was peeing because i was curious about how men peed.

That being said, there's a lot of people that would say that i'm "broken"  as a result of the abuse incidents, although I tend to disagree.  Yes, i'm promiscuous, but I enjoy myself and don't feel ashamed about it.  Yes, i'm kinky, but not crazily so.  I've always figured that one could go one of two ways after childhood sexual abuse, one could be frigid or one could be slutty... I prefer slutty, it's much more fun.


Did he ever do it to anybody else, after that?

Did your parents warn his parents, and those other kids he might be around?

Or did they keep it quiet, so not to cause ripples?

I am glad you are confident in yourself, and that you don't see yourself as broken. Victims aren't the broken ones; those who victimize are the farked up individuals.
 
2014-02-05 07:31:51 PM  

mongbiohazard: factoryconnection: miss diminutive: Well-adjusted, empathetic and reasonable 13 year olds don't rape their siblings just because they viewed some pornography. At 13 they know enough to understand how these actions are wrong and can impact another person.

I suspect there's more to the story here.

My wife used to work with underaged sex offenders.  Almost every single one was a victim of sexual abuse themselves, exposed to pornography and sex from a young age, often by relatives or close family friends.  Stories that were extremely difficult to listen to.

And then there was, every once in a while, the genuine sociopath with good parents that just had absolutely no empathy and no compunction in getting whatever he wanted.

So there is most likely a pedophile at the end of this story, too.


A long time ago when I was a teen I used to work in a store that - among many other things - sold these realistic looking sandstone dog statues. Most of them were small, meant to go on a knicknack shelf, but we had a life sized one in a sitting pose that we put in the entrance of the store to lure in the kind of people who would want a sandstone dog statue for some reason.

One day a pretty average looking suburban white guy comes in to look at something else with his like 2 or 3 year old boy, and while I'm selling the dad on the doodad he wanted to take a look at I notice that his little boy is behind him trying to give a handjob to the dog statue. Not just playing around with the statue, not just touching it.... seriously and undeniably trying to specifically give the statue of the dog a handjob.

The clear implication made me sick to my stomach on the spot, but I was dumb teenager and didn't really know what to do... The guy left and to this day it reminds me that abuse is probably a lot more common then we would all like to think and that all different kinds of farked up adults almost certainly got that way by having it taught to them when they were too young to know any better.


Red rocket! Red rocket!!

*too lazy to go find the Southpark screenshot.
 
2014-02-05 07:33:47 PM  
Older brothers have been raping their younger sisters for millenia, I really don't think an xbox or porn had anything to do with it. Raging teen hormones, a learned lack of respect for females, and, how nice!, a victim you can easily bully and overpower are a well known formula for incestuous rape.
 
2014-02-05 07:34:00 PM  

FraggleStickCar: I didn't bother to read it ; )


That's okay, we treated your whiney post with the same regard :)
 
2014-02-05 07:35:05 PM  

dopekitty74: I prefer slutty, it's much more fun.


Ethically, yes.
 
2014-02-05 07:37:42 PM  
So we went from idiots blaming a Xbox for a 13 year old being a sociopath to claiming nobody's to blame because it probably wasn't legitimate rape. Stay classy, folks. And Abortionforall does have legitimate experience with brother/sister incest. Obviously his parents
 
2014-02-05 07:41:45 PM  
I could swear this isn't the first thread where everything would suddenly make sense (everything being said) if Abortionsforall was actually a rapist.
 
2014-02-05 07:41:51 PM  

Fallout Boy: BigNumber12: James10952001: Why is there no edit feature?

So that people can never go back and conceal the derp that they trotted out on some subject or other. We hold people accountable.

Or you know, have time limit on editing.


It was a joke. I don't actually make the rules here.
 
2014-02-05 07:43:19 PM  

AbortionsForAll: vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll: vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll: The funny thing is, the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did. It's probably a non-stop train of hand-wringing adults, telling her about how damaged she now is, etc.

You have experience on this topic? Data? Citations?

No?

Then fark you and the horse you rode in on.

What makes you so sure I don't have direct experience on the matter..?

Seems to me like you should take your assumptions, and use them to fark yourself.

Then lay out your argument as to why she is more damaged by the professional help.

No. No, I don't think I will. Just because I said something you don't like on an internet forum, it doesn't lay a burden on me demanding that I cite references & statistics. It might be different if references & statistics were what was being discussed or if I was perhaps writing for a professional publication but being as this is the comments section of fark.com, I don't really need to go through such trouble.

That said, I already did lay out my argument. Said argument being that the numerous adults which the victim is now interacting with are probably doing more long-term damage than the actual rapist, due to the fact that they are no-doubt relentlessly drilling into her the idea that she is damaged and that she should be extremely upset, etc. It's not a complicated concept requiring lengthy explanation.

As for any direct experience I might or might not have on the matter... Again, this is fark.com. I am under no obligation (legal or otherwise) to divulge my personal life and experiences. Of course, you're free to ask but I'm also free to decline.


Are you in NAMBLA? I'm asking seriously because they are the only people I've ever seen to put forth this EXACT argument.
 
2014-02-05 07:47:29 PM  
images.wikia.com
 
2014-02-05 07:50:33 PM  

AbortionsForAll: The funny thing is, the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did. It's probably a non-stop train of hand-wringing adults, telling her about how damaged she now is, etc.


THIS   I know they say you should be counselled and etc, but all I wanted to do was forget it ever happened, not talk about it more.
 
2014-02-05 07:51:04 PM  

WTP 2: just castrate him. and i mean now.


And what will that do? You don't need a hard-on to sexually assault someone.
 
2014-02-05 07:53:09 PM  
QueenMamaBee
LowbrowDeluxe: Was she hot? I mean if we're going to figure out who or what to blame we have to check all the angles.

She was wearing a skirt.


So focus should be on checking out the lower angles?
 
2014-02-05 07:53:54 PM  

pute kisses like a man: James10952001: I watched porn with my friends whenever we could get it when I was that age. Never had any desire to tape anyone, especially a sibling, ewww.

Anyone else remember when you could use a matchbook to wedge the knob on those analog cable boxes between channels and get playboy to come in?

I just trained my eyes to see through the rainbow colored distortion lines. Like the matrix. Exactly like the matrix.

/ still can't see the farking sailboat in those mall posters.


it's a schooner!
 
2014-02-05 08:02:46 PM  

vicioushobbit: Did he ever do it to anybody else, after that?


not to MY knowledge

Did your parents warn his parents, and those other kids he might be around?

His parents were told, but did not want to believe their son was capable of such a horrendous act.  I told my friend who lived next door to him so that she would stay away from him (a couple of years after my incident that was)

Or did they keep it quiet, so not to cause ripples?

I am glad you are confident in yourself, and that you don't see yourself as broken. Victims aren't the broken ones; those who victimize are the farked up individuals.


thanks :)
 
m00
2014-02-05 08:08:56 PM  

dopekitty74: this is how it was handled in my family when my sixteen year old cousin forced me to give him oral sex when I was six. He didn't come over anymore, my parents talked to me about how he was bad and it was ok for me to be upset about it. At the time though, I really didn't think much of it except that it was gross. I already had peeked at my brother's skin mags that were hidden in the bathroom (he's a lot older than me) and also at some point remember peeking thru the bathroom door when my dad was peeing because i was curious about how men peed.

That being said, there's a lot of people that would say that i'm "broken" as a result of the abuse incidents, although I tend to disagree. Yes, i'm promiscuous, but I enjoy myself and don't feel ashamed about it. Yes, i'm kinky, but not crazily so. I've always figured that one could go one of two ways after childhood sexual abuse, one could be frigid or one could be slutty... I prefer slutty, it's much more fun.


I don't think you're broken (I think it's shameful to consider a human being as "broken" -- except in maybe the most extreme cases) but clearly it impacted your life and sexuality, and probably not in a positive manner.
 
2014-02-05 08:33:27 PM  

dopekitty74: vicioushobbit: Did he ever do it to anybody else, after that?

not to MY knowledge

Did your parents warn his parents, and those other kids he might be around?

His parents were told, but did not want to believe their son was capable of such a horrendous act.  I told my friend who lived next door to him so that she would stay away from him (a couple of years after my incident that was)

Or did they keep it quiet, so not to cause ripples?

I am glad you are confident in yourself, and that you don't see yourself as broken. Victims aren't the broken ones; those who victimize are the farked up individuals.

thanks :)


It is unfortunate his parents refused to believe. That's unfortunately fairly normal.

When I talked to my parents about my abuse when I was an adult, my mom flat out refused to believe what happened. My father responded with "it might have been me."

That aside, it's a shame that your parents didn't press charges. There is a HIGH likelihood that he will/has reoffend/ed.
 
2014-02-05 08:36:03 PM  
factoryconnection: ...  So there is most likely a pedophile at the end of this story, too.

hehe... end.
 
2014-02-05 08:37:30 PM  
Something like this happened in my town in the mid 80s. Except it was an 11 year old boy and he raped his 8 year old sister about 5 different times and a handful of younger boys. The parents found out eventually but nothing was done to the boy, At least until he shot out 20 windows at an elementary school and became someone else's problem. He recently spent 10 years in jail for armed robbery.
 
2014-02-05 08:39:04 PM  

vicioushobbit: dopekitty74: vicioushobbit: Did he ever do it to anybody else, after that?

not to MY knowledge

Did your parents warn his parents, and those other kids he might be around?

His parents were told, but did not want to believe their son was capable of such a horrendous act.  I told my friend who lived next door to him so that she would stay away from him (a couple of years after my incident that was)

Or did they keep it quiet, so not to cause ripples?

I am glad you are confident in yourself, and that you don't see yourself as broken. Victims aren't the broken ones; those who victimize are the farked up individuals.

thanks :)

It is unfortunate his parents refused to believe. That's unfortunately fairly normal.

When I talked to my parents about my abuse when I was an adult, my mom flat out refused to believe what happened. My father responded with "it might have been me."

That aside, it's a shame that your parents didn't press charges. There is a HIGH likelihood that he will/has reoffend/ed.


If he did, it's been quite some time since.  Karma got the f**ker.  He's in a nursing home with severe MS and the only person who visits him anymore is his mother.
 
2014-02-05 08:43:32 PM  

dopekitty74: vicioushobbit: dopekitty74: vicioushobbit: Did he ever do it to anybody else, after that?

not to MY knowledge

Did your parents warn his parents, and those other kids he might be around?

His parents were told, but did not want to believe their son was capable of such a horrendous act.  I told my friend who lived next door to him so that she would stay away from him (a couple of years after my incident that was)

Or did they keep it quiet, so not to cause ripples?

I am glad you are confident in yourself, and that you don't see yourself as broken. Victims aren't the broken ones; those who victimize are the farked up individuals.

thanks :)

It is unfortunate his parents refused to believe. That's unfortunately fairly normal.

When I talked to my parents about my abuse when I was an adult, my mom flat out refused to believe what happened. My father responded with "it might have been me."

That aside, it's a shame that your parents didn't press charges. There is a HIGH likelihood that he will/has reoffend/ed.

If he did, it's been quite some time since.  Karma got the f**ker.  He's in a nursing home with severe MS and the only person who visits him anymore is his mother.


At least he can't hurt anybody else.

Thanks for the peace of mind.
 
2014-02-05 08:48:22 PM  

SecretAgentWoman: I would bet there are tens of thousands of 13 year old boys that have watched porn and didn't rape anyone, let alone their sister.


Yes, but the goal is to have zero 13 year old boys raping their sisters. So sorry, no porn for you. We should ban videogame systems too, just to be sure. Especially the ones that have the thing that goes up.

Who am I kidding. Farkers will never give up their electronic penis exctensions even if it means children will be raped.

/'Merica
 
2014-02-05 08:52:18 PM  

dopekitty74: AbortionsForAll: The funny thing is, the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did. It's probably a non-stop train of hand-wringing adults, telling her about how damaged she now is, etc.

THIS   I know they say you should be counselled and etc, but all I wanted to do was forget it ever happened, not talk about it more.


Uh oh! Better be careful agreeing with me like that! Apparently that kind of thinking either makes you a pedophile or a troll.
 
2014-02-05 08:55:38 PM  

The Voice of Doom: QueenMamaBee
LowbrowDeluxe: Was she hot? I mean if we're going to figure out who or what to blame we have to check all the angles.

She was wearing a skirt.

So focus should be on checking out the lower angles?


That's usually how things work. Blame everything except the person doing the raping.
 
2014-02-05 08:59:27 PM  
The actual article (not Kotaku's copy/paste, thanks Drew Curtis's Gawker.com) stated that it happened in Blackburn, one of those areas with extreme amounts of immigrants.
This article is racist.
 
2014-02-05 09:09:47 PM  
My father had 8mm porn tapes. Once I discovered them (age 12?) I was in hog heaven but was still a virgin until I was 17. If it wasn't for alcohol and drugs I would still be one. At age 53.
 
2014-02-05 09:11:09 PM  
Eh. 13? I was watching porn at 8. I didn't ever have that "hey let's go try it out" feeling on any of my female friends. My Dad never actually explained the birds and the bees either. He knew I had watched his videos. I took my learning from that and kept it to myself. Dad dodged that "talking to" bullet.
 
2014-02-05 09:14:11 PM  

Lee451: My father had 8mm porn tapes. Once I discovered them (age 12?) I was in hog heaven but was still a virgin until I was 17. If it wasn't for alcohol and drugs I would still be one. At age 53.


There are several ways your statement could be taken... Did the found porn tapes feature YOU at the age of 12 or did they show your father when HE was 12? ...Or did they feature hogs? Dead hogs..? I demand specific details on who or what was shown in the alleged "porn tapes"!
 
gja
2014-02-05 09:25:13 PM  

pute kisses like a man: / still can't see the farking sailboat in those mall posters.


Try crystal met, or bath salts. You won't believe the shiat you'll see on those.
 
2014-02-05 09:35:33 PM  
Ban Xboxes. they cause rape
Same way guns cause murders
 
2014-02-05 09:42:19 PM  

AbortionsForAll: dopekitty74: AbortionsForAll: The funny thing is, the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did. It's probably a non-stop train of hand-wringing adults, telling her about how damaged she now is, etc.

THIS   I know they say you should be counselled and etc, but all I wanted to do was forget it ever happened, not talk about it more.

Uh oh! Better be careful agreeing with me like that! Apparently that kind of thinking either makes you a pedophile or a troll.


Not necessarily; DK clarified their personal opinion based on personal experience.  That they happened to agree with you is besides the point. 

You still haven't expressed WHY you posted the above statement, which still reads trollish.  While DK may have not wanted to talk about it anymore, that does NOT mean that the girl in TFA didn't want help, didn't want to talk about what happened, and won't benefit from therapy.

See? it's possible for me to disagree with a person's opinion as long as they clarify that that's what the fark it is.

How's that horse you rode in on doing?
 
2014-02-05 09:45:39 PM  

vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll: dopekitty74: AbortionsForAll: The funny thing is, the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did. It's probably a non-stop train of hand-wringing adults, telling her about how damaged she now is, etc.

THIS   I know they say you should be counselled and etc, but all I wanted to do was forget it ever happened, not talk about it more.

Uh oh! Better be careful agreeing with me like that! Apparently that kind of thinking either makes you a pedophile or a troll.

Not necessarily; DK clarified their personal opinion based on personal experience.  That they happened to agree with you is besides the point. 

You still haven't expressed WHY you posted the above statement, which still reads trollish.  While DK may have not wanted to talk about it anymore, that does NOT mean that the girl in TFA didn't want help, didn't want to talk about what happened, and won't benefit from therapy.

See? it's possible for me to disagree with a person's opinion as long as they clarify that that's what the fark it is.

How's that horse you rode in on doing?


You do realize that your entire argument against me consists of you putting words into my mouth and essentially inventing an entire set of circumstances which only exist within the confines of your imagination..?
 
2014-02-05 09:57:15 PM  
AbortionsForAll:
You do realize that your entire argument against me consists of you putting words into my mouth and essentially inventing an entire set of circumstances which only exist within the confines of your imagination..?

No.  I do, however, realize, that you cannot see how the below statement of yours:

...the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did.

is trollish.  You are literally claiming that the therapy she receives and the investigation is MORE TRAUMATIC than being raped by her older brother, a kid she very likely trusted and respected, if not idolized (like many kids do their big siblings).

That breach of trust, that violation of a child's innocence, that abuse of their body...LESS damaging than somebody asking questions about it?

Yet you claim it's worth, and provide no substantiation to WHY you believe it is worse.  You flat out refuse to provide substantiation.  You, sir/ma'am, whether you see it or not, are in fact a farking troll.

And I'm done with you.  Welcome to one of the very few people on my ignore list.
 
2014-02-05 10:07:51 PM  

vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll:
You do realize that your entire argument against me consists of you putting words into my mouth and essentially inventing an entire set of circumstances which only exist within the confines of your imagination..?

No.  I do, however, realize, that you cannot see how the below statement of yours:

...the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did.

is trollish.  You are literally claiming that the therapy she receives and the investigation is MORE TRAUMATIC than being raped by her older brother, a kid she very likely trusted and respected, if not idolized (like many kids do their big siblings).

That breach of trust, that violation of a child's innocence, that abuse of their body...LESS damaging than somebody asking questions about it?

Yet you claim it's worth, and provide no substantiation to WHY you believe it is worse.  You flat out refuse to provide substantiation.  You, sir/ma'am, whether you see it or not, are in fact a farking troll.

And I'm done with you.  Welcome to one of the very few people on my ignore list.


Thank you. Yes. Add me to your ignore list. If the end result is that you never reply to anything I say ever again, then I consider that a win.

Your are operating under the assumption that the 8 year old victim has an adult-level understanding of the incident (in reality, as a small child, she probably has very little understanding of what actually happened to her - fortunately for her). Her likely level of understanding of the situation being what it is, I would wager that the long line of weepy adults repeatedly telling the girl how she has been victimized and damaged is probably more traumatic for her (not to mention the sheerly massive level of attention said adults are now paying to her private areas).

I don't see what's so hard to understand about this concept. Hell, an actual molestation victim in this thread understood what I was saying without any difficulties at all (and agreed with me). Seems to me, you just desperately wanted to argue with someone and/or accuse someone of being a troll for your own amusement or at least to gain the room's attention.
 
2014-02-05 10:12:44 PM  

vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll:
You do realize that your entire argument against me consists of you putting words into my mouth and essentially inventing an entire set of circumstances which only exist within the confines of your imagination..?

No.  I do, however, realize, that you cannot see how the below statement of yours:

...the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did.

is trollish.  You are literally claiming that the therapy she receives and the investigation is MORE TRAUMATIC than being raped by her older brother, a kid she very likely trusted and respected, if not idolized (like many kids do their big siblings).

That breach of trust, that violation of a child's innocence, that abuse of their body...LESS damaging than somebody asking questions about it?

Yet you claim it's worth, and provide no substantiation to WHY you believe it is worse.  You flat out refuse to provide substantiation.  You, sir/ma'am, whether you see it or not, are in fact a farking troll.

And I'm done with you.  Welcome to one of the very few people on my ignore list.


It's not just trollish. It's almost directly out of the NAMBLA playbook, and something that you'll see in many pedophilia interviews when they're rationalizing their abuse (in clinical case studies). I'm not accusing the poster of being in NAMBLA (I did ask if they were though), but it's deeply disturbing.

Chemotherapy also is very uncomfortable, painful and makes people very sick...but it is often necessary to treat cancer. The same is true in these situations. Having victims repeat their experiences over and over and over again can be unbelievably painful and awful, but it's been proven to reduce PTSD, and is tremendously beneficial to abuse survivors, as well as survivors of many traumatic experiences. The natural inclination is to avoid, we avoid painful stimulus; and this avoidance is what makes triggers and PTSD so much worse.

Unfortunately predators latch on to this painful process and disingenuously attempt to shift the harm from their evil, vile and disgusting acts...onto the professionals dealing with the aftermath. They literally claim that the child was HAPPY when they were being molested with them, and were only sad and scared once society got involved. It's sick rationalizing and a refusal of responsibility. No, they want to claim they LOVE the kiddies...they're not hurting them. Riiiight.

There's a very small percentage of people who do not respond well to this type of repetition in therapy. Just as there's a small number of people who don't respond to all sorts of medical treatments. There's alternatives for them though (cbt is highly successful), and once again the responsibility lies with the predators, not the victims and certainly not our social structures.
 
2014-02-05 10:15:47 PM  
Did he come up with this story, before or after he talked to his lawyer?
 
2014-02-05 10:15:56 PM  

Lady Indica: vicioushobbit: AbortionsForAll:
You do realize that your entire argument against me consists of you putting words into my mouth and essentially inventing an entire set of circumstances which only exist within the confines of your imagination..?

No.  I do, however, realize, that you cannot see how the below statement of yours:

...the various social workers & law-enforcement personnel who are caring for the little girl/victim are almost certainly doing vastly more damage than the brother/rapist actually did.

is trollish.  You are literally claiming that the therapy she receives and the investigation is MORE TRAUMATIC than being raped by her older brother, a kid she very likely trusted and respected, if not idolized (like many kids do their big siblings).

That breach of trust, that violation of a child's innocence, that abuse of their body...LESS damaging than somebody asking questions about it?

Yet you claim it's worth, and provide no substantiation to WHY you believe it is worse.  You flat out refuse to provide substantiation.  You, sir/ma'am, whether you see it or not, are in fact a farking troll.

And I'm done with you.  Welcome to one of the very few people on my ignore list.

It's not just trollish. It's almost directly out of the NAMBLA playbook, and something that you'll see in many pedophilia interviews when they're rationalizing their abuse (in clinical case studies). I'm not accusing the poster of being in NAMBLA (I did ask if they were though), but it's deeply disturbing.

Chemotherapy also is very uncomfortable, painful and makes people very sick...but it is often necessary to treat cancer. The same is true in these situations. Having victims repeat their experiences over and over and over again can be unbelievably painful and awful, but it's been proven to reduce PTSD, and is tremendously beneficial to abuse survivors, as well as survivors of many traumatic experiences. The natural inclination is to avoid, we avoid painful stimulus; and this avoidanc ...


You went ahead and attributed and entire line of thought to me, which in fact came straight from you. At no point did I rationalize the older brother's actions or down-play the incident in any way. The only places such things took place are in your own mind and your own posts.
 
2014-02-05 10:20:29 PM  
How much you wanna bet vicioushobbit didn't actually put me on ignore, and is, at this moment, absolutely *dying* to continue accusing me of trolling, etc...? Careful VH! If you give into your urges and reply to me, everyone will know that you're all talk! bwaaa hahaha!
 
2014-02-05 10:39:29 PM  

namegoeshere: I'm feeling a bit sick at the moment thinking of all the children treated in exactly this way. YEAY on the parents, whatever their mistakes may have been in the past, for reporting this. That was absolutely the correct, and ONLY response.


I actually disagree that this is the ONLY response. I think it's entirely possible to be supportive to the daughter without sending the son to jail in some cases. I don't know if I knew the entire details around this incident and the people involved if I would feel that this particular case would be one that I wouldn't send right to the cops, but I am willing to entertain that there are outcomes that could potentially be better for everyone, including the victim, than immediately involving the legal system.

Evidently these parents thought this was the right thing to do, so I'm not going to second guess them at all. But I do think it's possible for people acting in good faith to provide better outcomes than our "one size fits all" justice system. To be very clear - I am not advocating for ignoring the situation, quite the opposite, I am advocating for dealing with it, but acknowledging that a parents duty to their children isn't necessarily satisfied by letting essentially someone else (in this case the criminal justice system) sort it out for you.

It's likely the courts would do exactly what most families would do either way. The offender is going to be removed from the house and put into some sort of care system, both children will be put into counselling and there will be some sort of supervision on family visits. The only practical difference here is that the decisions around these terms is not in control of the family any more, but the courts.

The only potential upside of the above scenario is that maybe the government will pay for the services provided to the offender. But, assuming that you're on the hook for feeding him/clothing him and getting him mental health care, you're not really better off, in fact, you're probably worse off since there is no guarantee that you can meet the terms put forth by the government, at least financially.

Obviously I'm making an assumption here that the parents are not motivated by retribution in so much that they want to correct the situation and also that the situation can even be corrected. I'm more than willing to admit that sometimes the best thing to do absolutely IS to let the cops handle it. I just am not willing to flatly state that this is always the best solution.
 
m00
2014-02-05 10:51:04 PM  

Lady Indica: having victims repeat their experiences over and over and over again can be unbelievably painful and awful, but it's been proven to reduce PTSD, and is tremendously beneficial to abuse survivors, as well as survivors of many traumatic experiences.


Wait, wait, wait. I thought the reason that judges threw the book at child porn downloaders was that it forced the victim to "relive their experiences over and over" just knowing the content was out there.
 
2014-02-05 10:57:38 PM  

m00: Lady Indica: having victims repeat their experiences over and over and over again can be unbelievably painful and awful, but it's been proven to reduce PTSD, and is tremendously beneficial to abuse survivors, as well as survivors of many traumatic experiences.

Wait, wait, wait. I thought the reason that judges threw the book at child porn downloaders was that it forced the victim to "relive their experiences over and over" just knowing the content was out there.


Talking to a counselor =/= knowing that somebody is still jacking off to the shiat that traumatized you.

/the more you know...
 
2014-02-05 11:04:35 PM  
One may argue it is also coming from the culture at large which has normalized the abject commodification of women to the point where an unwitting 13 year old boy believes he has free reign over their smaller defenceless sister whom he chose to commit this act on knowing full well that she could not fight back. Which is to wonder if the boy had had pent up emotions/mental issues which were eventually reignited by the viewing of pornographic material? Or have we arrived at a culture where devious behavior is now becoming normalized amongst young men...?

http://scallywagandvagabond.com/2014/02/13-year-old-boy-raped-eight- ye ar-old-sister-watching-porn-xbox/
 
2014-02-05 11:20:51 PM  

miss diminutive: Well-adjusted, empathetic and reasonable 13 year olds don't rape their siblings just because they viewed some pornography. At 13 they know enough to understand how these actions are wrong and can impact another person.

I suspect there's more to the story here.


Yep.
 
m00
2014-02-05 11:38:49 PM  

vicioushobbit: Talking to a counselor =/= knowing that somebody is still jacking off to the shiat that traumatized you.

/the more you know...


Look I don't disagree with the conclusion -- that clearly talking to counselors does less harm than the original incident. But you can't use a statement that makes no sense because it has an obvious counter-example (within the context of the very discussion!) to get there.

It's like saying... Creationism is nonsense. I have irrefutable proof for the currently accepted scientific model -- Lord Xenu told me so.
 
2014-02-05 11:49:44 PM  

m00: vicioushobbit: Talking to a counselor =/= knowing that somebody is still jacking off to the shiat that traumatized you.

/the more you know...

Look I don't disagree with the conclusion -- that clearly talking to counselors does less harm than the original incident. But you can't use a statement that makes no sense because it has an obvious counter-example (within the context of the very discussion!) to get there.

It's like saying... Creationism is nonsense. I have irrefutable proof for the currently accepted scientific model -- Lord Xenu told me so.


I disagree that the statement was used incorrectly.  Just because you randomly came up with that "obvious" counter example (you are the first one in the thread to point it out, mind you) doesn't mean that the original statement lacked merit.

In my opinion, it was a fairly sad deviation from the topic, especially considering you admittedly agree that there is a difference in the application of the repeated reliving of the scenario.

/TL;DR, To use a word from earlier in the thread, sir, you are being fairly pedantic here.  And possibly shallow.
//yes.  Shallow AND pedantic.
 
2014-02-06 12:09:36 AM  
My best friend works in an ER. Last year, a 14 year old boy was brought in b/c he raped his little sister, one of the dogs, and attempted to rape his mother, but a neighbor intervened. His mom and the neighbor somehow got him into the car and were driving to the hospital, but he jumped out of the car on the freeway and was hit by another car.

My best friend isn't sure what happened to him once he was admitted and the mental health professionals got involved.
 
m00
2014-02-06 12:36:25 AM  

vicioushobbit: m00: vicioushobbit: Talking to a counselor =/= knowing that somebody is still jacking off to the shiat that traumatized you.

/the more you know...

Look I don't disagree with the conclusion -- that clearly talking to counselors does less harm than the original incident. But you can't use a statement that makes no sense because it has an obvious counter-example (within the context of the very discussion!) to get there.

It's like saying... Creationism is nonsense. I have irrefutable proof for the currently accepted scientific model -- Lord Xenu told me so.

I disagree that the statement was used incorrectly.  Just because you randomly came up with that "obvious" counter example (you are the first one in the thread to point it out, mind you) doesn't mean that the original statement lacked merit.

In my opinion, it was a fairly sad deviation from the topic, especially considering you admittedly agree that there is a difference in the application of the repeated reliving of the scenario.

/TL;DR, To use a word from earlier in the thread, sir, you are being fairly pedantic here.  And possibly shallow.
//yes.  Shallow AND pedantic.


Okay, let me try this another way... here is the assertion I took issue with:

...having victims repeat their experiences over and over and over again can be unbelievably painful and awful, but it's been proven to reduce PTSD, and is tremendously beneficial to abuse survivors, as well as survivors of many traumatic experiences.

This does not seem like it could possibly be a true statement. When, in the course of a debate, one comes across a statement that defies logic, it is common to respond with [citation needed]. Hey, maybe I'm wrong. But according to the quote, it's been proven.

When a poster makes a claim saying X has been proven, is it off-limits to ask for the proof?
 
2014-02-06 12:51:56 AM  
If there only had been a Hot Teacher that could have saved this boy.
 
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