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(io9)   Chart explains different ways time travel works in science-fiction stories. This article was submitted tomorrow and has to be greenlit to avoid a time paradox with terrible consequences   (io9.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, time paradox, meson, charts, entailments, Sam Wilson  
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3577 clicks; posted to Geek » on 03 Feb 2014 at 9:26 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-02-03 08:43:05 PM  
Here's how it works in all science-fiction stories:

However they want it to, even if it is self-contradictory or just doesn't make any goddamned sense.
 
2014-02-03 08:51:23 PM  
The problem with time is that it's not a line so much as an infinite set of ball bearings the universe runs on.  Good luck re-setting a handful of them, let alone 10^80.
 
2014-02-03 09:06:43 PM  
This would have been the perfect time for someone to Boobies the thread.
 
2014-02-03 09:13:58 PM  
As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.
 
2014-02-03 09:17:06 PM  

b2theory: As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.


Well... only if they didn't have their shields up
 
2014-02-03 09:19:13 PM  
How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?
 
2014-02-03 09:23:19 PM  

fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?


It doesn't need to because the universe orbits around the Earth.
 
2014-02-03 09:24:01 PM  

fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?


Let alone the motion of the sun, or the entire universe for that matter.  The universe is also expanding.  How exactly do you unwind that expansion (which some have pointed out may be a source of entropy as well).
 
2014-02-03 09:24:42 PM  

BizarreMan: fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?

It doesn't need to because the universe orbits around the Earth.


SuperPope, is thatta you?
 
2014-02-03 09:31:28 PM  

fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?


Gravity and/or inertia?
 
2014-02-03 09:32:26 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: b2theory: As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.

Well... only if they didn't have their shields up


files.abovetopsecret.com
 
2014-02-03 09:43:35 PM  
You ever think the Gawker sites overanalyze pop-culture a bit too much?
 
2014-02-03 09:46:08 PM  
i.imgur.com

Temporal Investigations is always on time.
 
2014-02-03 09:48:33 PM  

b2theory: MaudlinMutantMollusk: b2theory: As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.

Well... only if they didn't have their shields up

[files.abovetopsecret.com image 398x505]


Even the Millennium Falcon had deflector shields

/what kinda namby pamby shield technology they got, anyway?
//far, far away is right... sheesh
 
2014-02-03 09:49:38 PM  

Gleeman: [i.imgur.com image 524x411]

Temporal Investigations is always on time.


Well... temporarily

/or maybe extemporaneously
//tempus fuggit
 
2014-02-03 09:56:02 PM  
Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.
 
2014-02-03 09:57:01 PM  

fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?


eyup
just like you dont have to RUN while riding on a train or plane.

Your time machine touches the earth briefly, continuously, while traveling back and forth in time, friction keeps it in place.

If you watch closely in one of the time machine movies, you will see things BLUR for a while as the machine speeds up. The machine was still there, just passing through briefly in time.

This also explains why the machines dont blow up by occupying the same ST coords. You cant walk into one while it is going by and it is only there for a such a brief moment of time. And if it were stopping, you wouldnt be able to be in the same place. You would have bumped into it when you tried to step into the place it would have had been.

Try to keep up please.
 
2014-02-03 10:00:05 PM  
Thread is a repeat from tomorrow.
 
2014-02-03 10:03:09 PM  

SomeAmerican: Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.


Satellites around the earth are in our past.
 
2014-02-03 10:05:31 PM  

Gordon Bennett: Thread is a repeat from tomorrow.


Boobies
 
2014-02-03 10:06:13 PM  
WTF do all these lines mean??!  Quantum String Revenge?

/tip: seattle wins the super bowl!
//tip: first play from scrimage is a safety!!
///pay it backward
////if I click 'Preview' what the hell will I see?
 
zez
2014-02-03 10:08:03 PM  
jackmoreland.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-02-03 10:16:58 PM  

SomeAmerican: Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.


Someone needs a lesson on relativity. If you could somehow travel instantaneously to a distant point in space, and aim a high power telescope back at Earth, you could see past events unfold in real-time. Is the Earth in the Observer's past, or is the Observer in Earth's future, or are they happening simultaneously?
 
2014-02-03 10:17:21 PM  

talkertopc: SomeAmerican: Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.

Satellites around the earth are in our past.


Because of time dilation?  Personally, I don't believe in it, at least as a distortion of time.

You could explain the effect easier by letting every bit of the universe update itself at a different rate.  Put a particle in an information rich environment (high gravity or high speed) and it updates less frequently.   Same way that different zones on a MMO server might tick at a different rate due to lag, but don't physically exist in different times.

Gets rid of a whole dimension, which is a massive simplification.

// The universe works like a World of Warcraft server, you heard it hear first
 
2014-02-03 10:18:42 PM  

Fubini: SomeAmerican: Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.

Someone needs a lesson on relativity. If you could somehow travel instantaneously to a distant point in space, and aim a high power telescope back at Earth, you could see past events unfold in real-time. Is the Earth in the Observer's past, or is the Observer in Earth's future, or are they happening simultaneously?


Neither obviously, you'd be observing the present.  Specifically, the present state of the photons at your telescope.
 
2014-02-03 10:24:16 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?

Let alone the motion of the sun, or the entire universe for that matter.  The universe is also expanding.  How exactly do you unwind that expansion (which some have pointed out may be a source of entropy as well).


The universe expanding. We know that the Earth is rotating and orbiting around the Sun. We also know that the entire solar system is moving within the galaxy.

Even if the universe was not expanding, I suspect the galaxy is also moving/rotating/spinning somehow due to even larger forces. Theoretically, the entire universe as we know it is shifting within the nothingness of the omniverse or space of nothing between universes.  Traveling in time would be certain death upon destination without factoring in all of these to a tee.
 
2014-02-03 10:28:04 PM  

SomeAmerican: Fubini: SomeAmerican: Interesting chart, but the likelihood that the past and future physically exist - and hence could be traveled to - is pretty low.  It would increase the complexity of the universe massively, and given that all physical laws just require the present, Occam's razor comes into play.

Someone needs a lesson on relativity. If you could somehow travel instantaneously to a distant point in space, and aim a high power telescope back at Earth, you could see past events unfold in real-time. Is the Earth in the Observer's past, or is the Observer in Earth's future, or are they happening simultaneously?

Neither obviously, you'd be observing the present.  Specifically, the present state of the photons at your telescope.


They are merely projecting matter from the past then.
 
2014-02-03 10:32:12 PM  

fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?


reminds me of some scifi short story I read years ago.  After much effort an FTL drive was invented, unfortunately it was so damn fast that to even turn it on for the shortest instant would zip you out of the visible universe that you would end up in a completely empty void with no hope of ever finding a way back.

csb
 
2014-02-03 10:36:05 PM  

mrlewish: fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?

reminds me of some scifi short story I read years ago.  After much effort an FTL drive was invented, unfortunately it was so damn fast that to even turn it on for the shortest instant would zip you out of the visible universe that you would end up in a completely empty void with no hope of ever finding a way back.

csb


That sounds familiar. Do you remember the name?
 
2014-02-03 10:37:42 PM  

SomeAmerican: Neither obviously, you'd be observing the present.  Specifically, the present state of the photons at your telescope.


Suppose you have two observers moving with respect to one another. There are several events that occur, call them A, B, and C.

The first observer sees these events in the order A-B-C. The second observer sees the events in the order C-B-A.

When the first observer sees the event A, the event C is in that observer's 'future'. When the second observer sees the event A, the event C is in that observer's 'past'.

There is no global notion of a "present" that all observers participate in equally.
 
2014-02-03 10:38:00 PM  
Who was it that explained that Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure was the most realistic portrayal of the perception of time travel? Specifically the whole bit about deciding to use the phone booth to go back in time and steal Ted's dad's keys and then leave them for themselves, and sure enough, there they were.
 
2014-02-03 10:44:31 PM  

namatad: fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?

eyup
just like you dont have to RUN while riding on a train or plane.

Your time machine touches the earth briefly, continuously, while traveling back and forth in time, friction keeps it in place.

If you watch closely in one of the time machine movies, you will see things BLUR for a while as the machine speeds up. The machine was still there, just passing through briefly in time.

This also explains why the machines dont blow up by occupying the same ST coords. You cant walk into one while it is going by and it is only there for a such a brief moment of time. And if it were stopping, you wouldnt be able to be in the same place. You would have bumped into it when you tried to step into the place it would have had been.

Try to keep up please.


Relativity and out of phase.
 
2014-02-03 10:44:37 PM  
i1126.photobucket.com
 
2014-02-03 10:50:23 PM  

ArcadianRefugee: Here's how it works in all science-fiction stories:

However they want it to, even if it is self-contradictory or just doesn't make any goddamned sense.


media.tumblr.com
 
2014-02-03 10:52:11 PM  
People, people. people, you have it all wrong. Time, as is not a strict linear progression of cause to effect.

It's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly timey Wimey... stuf.
 
2014-02-03 10:53:02 PM  
I like the Doctor Who portrayal of time travel.

You pretty much take time travel theory and drop an infinite number of police boxes on it.

/New series, the old series actually had some level of continuity.
//I love em both.
 
2014-02-03 10:56:30 PM  

Nemo's Brother: Marcus Aurelius: fusillade762: How come no one ever seems to take the motion of the Earth into account?

Let alone the motion of the sun, or the entire universe for that matter.  The universe is also expanding.  How exactly do you unwind that expansion (which some have pointed out may be a source of entropy as well).

The universe expanding. We know that the Earth is rotating and orbiting around the Sun. We also know that the entire solar system is moving within the galaxy.

Even if the universe was not expanding, I suspect the galaxy is also moving/rotating/spinning somehow due to even larger forces. Theoretically, the entire universe as we know it is shifting within the nothingness of the omniverse or space of nothing between universes.  Traveling in time would be certain death upon destination without factoring in all of these to a tee.


Not to mention at the speed of light, the universe collapses to a point and time halts.  That alone would be extremely painful.
 
2014-02-03 10:59:55 PM  

SquiggsIN: fusillade762: This would have been the perfect time for someone to Boobies the thread.

The Vulcan Science Directorate has determined that time travel is impossible.
[img.fark.net image 800x633]
There are pictures that a slightly more NSFW but, i figured this was the safe thing.


He shure does have a purdy mouth.
 
2014-02-03 11:06:15 PM  
Terry Pratchett has the most believable time travel.

There's various ways to do it, but all your paradoxes get undone by little asian men in saffron robes. And god help you if ya piss off the sweeper. He knows Deja-Fu.
 
2014-02-03 11:11:07 PM  

b2theory: MaudlinMutantMollusk: b2theory: As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.

Well... only if they didn't have their shields up

[files.abovetopsecret.com image 398x505]


That's cute. Kind of like modern US marines going back in time and laughing at Bronze Age warriors.

/ST: 200+ years in the future
//SW: A long time ago....
 
2014-02-03 11:26:35 PM  

b2theory: MaudlinMutantMollusk: b2theory: As long as we're all in agreement that the Enterprise could simply beam their torpedoes to the bridge of a star destroyer at will.

Well... only if they didn't have their shields up

[files.abovetopsecret.com image 398x505]


They beamed a torpedo onto another ship exactly once in the 5 tv series and 12 movies. They never thought of doing that before or since, even when the other ship's shields were down.

And do those look like actual lasers that the Star Wars ships fire?
 
2014-02-03 11:44:43 PM  

Joe USer: /New series, the old series actually had some level of continuity.
//I love em both.


The classic series that destroyed Atlantis three different ways?
 
2014-02-03 11:57:47 PM  
I thought time was a big ball of wibbly wobbly timey wimey.... stuff.
img.fark.net
 
2014-02-04 12:46:34 AM  
I have nothing overly constructive to add to this debate.

Except, NNEERRRRDDDSSSSSSSS!

/Doctor Who is awesome, Back To The Future is wtf in an awesome plot hole sort of way, Star Trek just does its own thing.
 
2014-02-04 01:24:54 AM  
msg-ctrl.com
Honestly, though, Terminator's the only major time-travel franchise that really pisses me off.  Sent back in time by your son to impregnate his Mom, my ass.
 
2014-02-04 04:03:52 AM  

GoodDoctorB:  ass.


I think John was planning that Kyle would stick somewhere else other than her pooper.
 
2014-02-04 07:14:55 AM  

Vaneshi: GoodDoctorB:  ass.

I think John was planning that Kyle would stick somewhere else other than her pooper.


[whynotboth?.jpg]
 
2014-02-04 07:36:59 AM  
calitreview.com

Best time travel premise ever
 
2014-02-04 08:29:57 AM  

GoodDoctorB: Honestly, though, Terminator's the only major time-travel franchise that really pisses me off.  Sent back in time by your son to impregnate his Mom, my ass.


What's wrong with that? Obviously in the original timeline, John Connor was someone else. Then Kyle got to the other would be father first. That's why Kyle's John is kind of a pussy. He was never meant to be the badass leader the original was. Makes sense.
 
2014-02-04 09:23:36 AM  
If you are your own grandfather, you are passing along to yourself an infinite set of genetic mutations. Eventually, the you that goes back in time would be a different species entirely, unable to breed with your grandmother, and the time loop would cease to propagate.
 
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