If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Bay News 9)   Good news everyone. Scientists extracted DNA of Justinian Plague that killed half of humanity 1500 years ago   (baynews9.com) divider line 55
    More: Scary, DNA, Justinian plague, Justinian, Black Death, The Lancet Infectious Diseases, Yersinia pestis, half, Hendrik Poinar  
•       •       •

3003 clicks; posted to Geek » on 28 Jan 2014 at 11:19 AM (25 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



55 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-01-28 11:20:38 AM
I used to know Justinian Plague, or J-Pla as we called him. Real asshole, that dude.
 
2014-01-28 11:22:07 AM

show me: I used to know Justinian Plague, or J-Pla as we called him. Real asshole, that dude.


You must of met him on a very bad day, he's always been cool around me.
 
2014-01-28 11:22:45 AM

show me: I used to know Justinian Plague,


Didn't he get busted for racing drunk and stoned not so long ago?
 
2014-01-28 11:23:03 AM
Bieber!
 
2014-01-28 11:24:57 AM
We only brought it back to let it know how far we've come and have some comeuppance
 
2014-01-28 11:25:43 AM
Maybe we'll just develop immunity after a few more die-offs.

Maybe we should clone some Neanderthals. Apparently, they were pretty robust when it came to the plague and other nasty stuff.
 
2014-01-28 11:26:11 AM
Yay!
 
2014-01-28 11:29:15 AM
img.fark.net
img.fark.net
 
2014-01-28 11:30:16 AM
I'm sure this will end well.


Shut down everything??
 
2014-01-28 11:31:11 AM
Who needs the plague when we've got the flu?

Dramatic rise in flu deaths reported by California health officials

That would put this year's number of flu fatalities so far at 146. At this time last year, nine deaths had been confirmed, and only 106 were confirmed by the end of the season.

www.trbimg.com

And if that don't thrill you, hang on until the new model comes out.

H7N9 bird flu death toll 19 but epidemic deemed 'unlikely'

gdb.voanews.com

The H7N9 bird flu virus has killed 19 people in China this year, with the total number of human infections now 96, according to the Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention.
That compares with 144 confirmed cases, including 46 deaths, in the whole of 2013.


They are still working out the birds ah I meant bugs.
 
2014-01-28 11:37:31 AM

Odoriferous Queef: show me: I used to know Justinian Plague,

Didn't he get busted for racing drunk and stoned not so long ago?


Yeah, but they dropped the charges when he threatened to infect them. Or sing, I can't remember which.
 
2014-01-28 11:49:30 AM
 Odoriferous Queef: show me: I used to know Justinian Plague,

Didn't he get busted for racing drunk and stoned not so long ago?

Yeah, but they dropped the charges when he threatened to infect them. Or sing, I can't remember which.


Yeah, but does this plague have a hot milfy mom?
 
2014-01-28 12:02:17 PM

show me: I used to know Justinian Plague, or J-Pla as we called him. Real asshole, that dude.


Don't hate the plaguer, hate the game.
 
2014-01-28 12:09:19 PM
Hypothetical scenario for spread of Y. pestis based on the data, from the paper:

i57.tinypic.com

Thanks, Asia, for the first two. Sorry about the third.
 
2014-01-28 12:12:30 PM

Arkanaut: show me: I used to know Justinian Plague, or J-Pla as we called him. Real asshole, that dude.

Don't hate the plaguer, hate the game.


What a plaguer may look like:
www.vintagecardprices.com
 
2014-01-28 12:25:08 PM
SOON.
 
2014-01-28 12:28:16 PM
Where is the army of the 12 monkeys?
/ where's my finglonger?
 
2014-01-28 12:28:24 PM
"Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.
 
2014-01-28 12:33:26 PM
All I have to say is if there are places on the Earth where people haven't lived in large numbers for eons, there's probably a good reason why. Maybe the firstest were the lastest because they unleashed some too-efficient killer upon themselves.
 
2014-01-28 12:37:05 PM
I know that theres probably some smart, really good reason why they would go about getting that. But I cant help but wonder if any of those scientists suddenly stopped in the middle of doing science stuff and thought to themselves

"I think I saw this in a movie once and it didnt turn out so great"
 
2014-01-28 12:42:03 PM
It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.
 
2014-01-28 12:53:36 PM

That Guy Jeff: "Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.


So your saying that there were no rats, pigeons (aka "rock doves"), or cockroaches till humans came along and built cities?
 
2014-01-28 12:55:42 PM

Alebak: I know that theres probably some smart, really good reason why they would go about getting that. But I cant help but wonder if any of those scientists suddenly stopped in the middle of doing science stuff and thought to themselves

"I think I saw this in a movie once and it didnt turn out so great"


I think they're mostly in it for the money. I've heard that "geneticists" and "climate change scientists" rake in huge amounts in grant money, so they'll do anything to keep the cash flowing.

Actually, they only sequenced old DNA. It's sort of useful to know exactly how it spread, although modern epidemiology usually doesn't involve plague ships and invading armies as vectors.
 
2014-01-28 01:07:10 PM
Dammit, show me, I had a Justin Bieber joke almost ready to go.

I'm pretty sure you made this Justinian Plague guy up out of whole cloth.
 
2014-01-28 01:12:17 PM
Get ready for Justinian Plague 2:  Mortality Boogaloo
 
2014-01-28 01:15:13 PM

give me doughnuts: That Guy Jeff: "Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.

So your saying that there were no rats, pigeons (aka "rock doves"), or cockroaches till humans came along and built cities?


Nope. I am saying, however, that any infringing happened in antiquity and their habitat has been greatly expanded by our involvement. There no such thing as infringing on their habitat anymore.
 
2014-01-28 01:25:56 PM
It's only a matter of time anyway. Paging Captain Trips to the white courtesy phone...
 
2014-01-28 01:26:04 PM

That Guy Jeff: give me doughnuts: That Guy Jeff: "Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.

So your saying that there were no rats, pigeons (aka "rock doves"), or cockroaches till humans came along and built cities?

Nope. I am saying, however, that any infringing happened in antiquity and their habitat has been greatly expanded by our involvement. There no such thing as infringing on their habitat anymore.


Truth.
 
2014-01-28 01:27:26 PM
On a serious note, some skeptics don't believe that Yersina pestis was responsible for the Great Plague.

If the various great plagues are caused by mutations that flashed into history and then died out, this both strengthens and weakens their objections, because it may very well be true that the Great Plague is a different strain from more recent plague outbreaks and the strains that can be found in reservoirs such as armadillos in Texas and the South West, while the failure to identify any other organism in the remains of the plague dead makes variability in the Y. pestis strains a plausible explanation.

The Great Plague of London was the combination of several sub-plagues but this is not surprising because the Plague behaves very differently depending on how you contract it. You can get it through your skin, in your lungs, or from a rat bite, for example. Contemporary descriptions describe a class plague (with buboes on the body), a respiratory disease that might be another disease altogether but could be the air-borne lung infecting version of the plague, and possibly a third disease.

Some people survived the plague from natural immunity, which interestingly enough means their descendants are less susceptible to HIV-AIDS because of a similar infection mechanism. Up to 10% of some Europeans have this mutation, especially in Eastern Europe and Russia.

I do not doubt that Yersina pestis is the cause of the plague but this new evidence helps to explain why the matter needed to be treated with some skepticism despite the long-standing identification of the organism and the great outbreaks of the plague.

Plague often breaks out in years when war, famine, earthquake, or other natural disasters including booming rat populations, disturb the rats or sends them out looking for food supplies in places they usually avoid, such as close proximity to humans. The blooming and fruiting of some bamboos in India and China causes the rat population to boom periodically because they only bear fruit at long intervals (such as 23 year cycles for one species). Many of the plagues have coincided with this bamboo boom-bust cycle, and the great pandemics are probably the result of rat booms and busts in India or China carried along sea and land trade routes.

I like to keep up on the plague news. It's just one of my many charming quirks. Some people like Hitler and World War II documentaries, and some people prefer to keep abreast of the other three horsemen of the Apocalypse.

I could probably have been a doctor but I figure I wouldn't have been a good one because I don't have anything remotely like a good bedside manner. I'm very good at seeing the downside to things, not so good at pursuing the upside. It's a bit of a bad habit, but I believe you should let stupider or naturally active and diligent people do the hard work. I'll just be over there with a book if you need me.

The best cure for hypochondria is a fatal disease, by the way. Once you know what you are almost certainly going to die of, you don't worry about every ling fad that comes along.
 
2014-01-28 01:30:24 PM
The seasons don't fear the Reaper
Nor do the wind the sun and the rain
We can be like they are
 
2014-01-28 01:31:27 PM

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: The seasons don't fear the Reaper
Nor do the wind the sun and the rain
We can be like they are



40,000 men and women everyday.
 
2014-01-28 01:46:33 PM
So the end has come. I always suspected I'd have a hand in it.
 
2014-01-28 01:49:32 PM
Not impressed:
upload.wikimedia.org
 
2014-01-28 01:55:39 PM
Has Madagascar shut everything down?
 
2014-01-28 02:06:25 PM

TheShavingofOccam123: It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.


By some estimates, the Mongols killed 1 out of every 10 people on the planet at the time.
 
2014-01-28 02:27:26 PM
Puts on cowboy boots with run-down heels, starts walking.
 
2014-01-28 02:40:07 PM

Lord Dimwit: TheShavingofOccam123: It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.

By some estimates, the Mongols killed 1 out of every 10 people on the planet at the time.


Mind you, they also conquered a much larger area.

/But yeah, the Muslim world fell because of that guy who said that A did not cause B, but that God used A as an excuse to cause B, and then the Mongols murdered everyone in Baghdad.
//Seriously, when the guys fighting the Crusades are so worried about the Mongols that they let the Muslims march onto their land to go fight them, you know that they're bad news.
 
2014-01-28 02:44:11 PM
Shame. I had my hopes on grey goo.
 
2014-01-28 03:02:26 PM

meyerkev: Lord Dimwit: TheShavingofOccam123: It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.

By some estimates, the Mongols killed 1 out of every 10 people on the planet at the time.

Mind you, they also conquered a much larger area.


But only ~110 million people compared to 70-90 million for the Romans.

/But yeah, the Muslim world fell because of that guy who said that A did not cause B, but that God used A as an excuse to cause B, and then the Mongols murdered everyone in Baghdad.

When did the Muslim world "fall" exactly?
 
2014-01-28 03:22:53 PM

FLMountainMan: meyerkev: Lord Dimwit: TheShavingofOccam123: It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.

By some estimates, the Mongols killed 1 out of every 10 people on the planet at the time.

Mind you, they also conquered a much larger area.

But only ~110 million people compared to 70-90 million for the Romans.

/But yeah, the Muslim world fell because of that guy who said that A did not cause B, but that God used A as an excuse to cause B, and then the Mongols murdered everyone in Baghdad.

When did the Muslim world "fall" exactly?


1918, though meyerkev is referring to the publication of The Incoherence of the Philosophers by Al-Ghazali which is credited with ending the secularization of Islamic philosophy and closing the ijtihad (the legal interpretation of Islamic law).
 
2014-01-28 03:31:06 PM

FLMountainMan: When did the Muslim world "fall" exactly?


Fall was a bad word.

"Stop growing"?   Passed the torch to the Renaissance people?   Turned inwards?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Ghazali

It turns out that putting people from Spain and people from India (and every point in between) in the same room is a fantastic way to spread ideas.   Which is why the Islamic Golden Age is a thing.

It then ALSO turns out that if one of your "great thinkers" sends you from "Let's do cool stuff and then tell each other about it, and use everyone's cool ideas to make even cooler ideas" to "Let's stop caring about science and become fatalists because it's all on God*", you stop producing new ideas and growing as a culture.

And so while the Islamic world was a major threat to the Christian world from ~700 to 1500 or so (Crusades were a reaction to Byzantine collapse), by 1600, they could be stopped by a coalition of Southern Europe (Malta and Lepanto), by 1700, they were no longer a threat (Last siege of Vienna), by 1800, the only way to prevent a Western invasion was via another Western nation (Napoleon in Egypt), and by 1920, every single "Islamist" state had fallen with the collapse of the Ottoman Empire and the Middle East was the plaything of Europe.

And today, every single Arab nation is either temporarily rich due to oil or a complete shiathole (or both). Partly, even mostly, the West's fault (Sykes-Picot, Churchill's little lines, everything to do with Iran ever since Alexander conquered it), but.

Suppose you are going to be reincarnated as a person of Middle Eastern descent (I would have said "Arab", but then we would get into the whole 'most Middle Easterners are not Arabs' debate). Once again, you can choose your country. Where do you go?
Once again, Britain, US, or somewhere of that ilk sound like your best choices.
Okay, once again we're ruling that out. You've got to go somewhere in the Middle East.
Your best choice is one of those tiny emirates where everyone is a relative of the emir and gets lots of oil money and is super-rich: I would go with Qatar. Let's rule them out too.
Your next-best choice is Israel.
Yes, Israel. Note that I am not saying the Occupied Palestinian Territories; that would be just as bad a choice as you expect. I'm saying Israel, where 20% of the population is Arab, and about 16% Muslim.
Israeli Arabs earn on average about $6750 per year. Compare this to conditions in Israel's Arab neighbors. In Egypt, average earnings are $6200; in Jordan, $5900; in Syria, only $5000.
Aside from the economics, there are other advantages. If you happen to be Muslim, you will have a heck of a lot easier time practicing your religion freely in Israel than in some Middle Eastern country where you follow the wrong sect of Islam. You'll be allowed to vote for your government, something you can't do in monarchical Jordan or war-torn Syria, and which Egypt is currently having, er, severe issues around. You can even criticize the government as much as you want (empirically quite a lot), a right Syrian and Egyptian Arabs are currently dying for. Finally, you get the benefit of living in a clean, safe, developed country with good health care and free education for all.
I'm not saying that Israeli Arabs aren't discriminated against or have it as good as Israeli Jews. I'm just saying they have it better than Arabs in most other countries.


*Look, I'm really not explaining this well because I can't think that way.  Think Pat Robertson and some of his 9/11 comments.  Acc. to Pat Robertson, had we lived good Jesusy lives, God would have intervened and prevented 9/11 because all the bad things that happen are a result of sin.   So it's "Your car burst into flame because God is punishing you for [Insert thing here]" and not "Your car burst into flame because you didn't change the oil for 57K miles" (Literal example by uncle who spent 12 years in the seminary), except for everything.   Which means that you don't get calculus or gravity or the Industrial Revolution or Engineering or Computer Science or all the things that came from that.  And so the Islamic World "fell" from grace, just like China fell between ~1500 and The Opium Wars.
 
2014-01-28 03:46:59 PM

give me doughnuts: That Guy Jeff: give me doughnuts: That Guy Jeff: "Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.

So your saying that there were no rats, pigeons (aka "rock doves"), or cockroaches till humans came along and built cities?

Nope. I am saying, however, that any infringing happened in antiquity and their habitat has been greatly expanded by our involvement. There no such thing as infringing on their habitat anymore.

Truth.


my opinion o the matter is that it is more acurate to say WE ARE the habitat when it comes to such creatures. Humans are filthy creatures. and creatures like roaches and mice clean up our mess on a micro level, other creatures feed on them, be it fleas on the mice, or the cats eating the mice.
etc etc etc
 
2014-01-28 03:54:56 PM
Ashes Ashes, we all fall down.
 
2014-01-28 03:56:04 PM

That Guy Jeff: "Humans are infringing on rodents' territory, "

Wat. Like... there are pristine forests inhabited by plague rats and the humans are cutting down all the trees and THAT'S why the rats are coming into human civilization? Bullsh*t. That line works for tigers and monkeys and such. It doesn't work for rats, pigeons, and cockroaches.


Yeah, we've been kind of creating their habitats for them for quite a while now, at least the ones that have adapted to humans.  What you are forgetting is that there are rats and mice and other rodents (as well as pigeons and cockroaches and such) that do live in the forests and the meadows and deserts and what not, out in nature, apart from us.  They're the ones more likely to be exposed to weird viruses and bacteria and what not.  When you work in areas near them, there's a chance you'll be exposed to a wild rodent with it, and if you settle in areas near them then they can infect our nice human adapted city rats which as you know are capable of spreading like, well, the plague.

Stile4aly: FLMountainMan: meyerkev: Lord Dimwit: TheShavingofOccam123:

When did the Muslim world "fall" exactly?

1918, though meyerkev is referring to the publication of The Incoherence of the Philosophers by Al-Ghazali which is credited with ending the secularization of Islamic philosophy and closing the ijtihad (the legal interpretation of Islamic law).


Just to make sure, The Armistice of Mudros?
 
2014-01-28 04:05:18 PM

brantgoose: The best cure for hypochondria is a fatal disease, by the way. Once you know what you are almost certainly going to die of, you don't worry about every ling fad that comes along.


That reminds me of my cousin. He was constantly saying his whole life "I'm sick! I'm sick! I feel terrible!" but couldn't describe what was wrong (just "I don't know I feel like I must have something") and doctors said he was fine.

I couple years ago he was diagnosed with cancer and he didn't tell the family until the day before he died in the hospital, and didn't even complain about anything. All he said is "the doctor says I'm not in great shape," with no further explanation. When my dad got called to the hospital by the staff he didn't even know what the heck was going on or that he was on his death bed.

I'm a hypochondriac, so I figure I'm the same way. I'll just tell everyone I'm fine and suddenly die.
 
2014-01-28 04:10:32 PM

meyerkev: And so while the Islamic world was a major threat to the Christian world from ~700 to 1500 or so (Crusades were a reaction to Byzantine collapse), by 1600, they could be stopped by a coalition of Southern Europe (Malta and Lepanto), by 1700, they were no longer a threat (Last siege of Vienna), by 1800, the only way to prevent a Western invasion was via another Western nation (Napoleon in Egypt), and by 1920, every single "Islamist" state had fallen with the collapse of the Ottoman Empire and the Middle East was the plaything of Europe.


That's a very good breakdown of it.  However, that focuses on Muslim states in the Middle East and not Islam itself.  Non-Muslim populations in the Middle East (aside from Israel of course) have fallen precipitously since 1700.  Jews virtually exterminated or driven out, and Druze, Christians, and Bahai are following suit.  Meanwhile, Islam has expanded significantly in Europe and the Americas.

The Muslim World has expanded and will likely continue to do so.  Hell, I bet there's even an argument that it is tailor-made for the increasing income inequality in the West.
 
2014-01-28 04:25:27 PM

TheShavingofOccam123: It is interesting that the Mongols probably brought the plague to Europe by rebuilding global trade routes. Possibly the same trade routes that brought the Justinian plague around the world several centuries earlier. Of course, the Mongols also managed to kill millions with methods other than the plague.

/I'm not sure why everyone thinks the Mongols were so much worse than the Romans. When they beseiged a city, they often killed every living thing in the city they captured. Including dogs.


I think it was what the two empires did with the land they conquered. The Romans built roads, baths, aqueducts, etc. and settled down. The Mongols built skull mountains and rode on.
 
2014-01-28 05:24:30 PM
Cool

img.fark.net
 
2014-01-28 05:30:35 PM
Two people mentioned the Biebster before me but think about it.  Infect him.  Let him tour.  Millions of unneeded flesh bags no longer consuming our resources.

(course that is as likely as having an automatic cock punch / c*nt punt machine whenever a Nielsen viewer changes the channel to watch anything Kardassian)
 
2014-01-28 06:06:38 PM
Dammit, my proposal for a topic on this plague was shot down due to lack of recent breaks in the study.... this article came out one month too late...

I'm currently working on two projects on the ancient world though, so I'm happy.

/This is definitely relevant to my interests.
 
Displayed 50 of 55 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report