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(Talking Points Memo)   "The wealthy are far wealthier, politically powerful and find a more indulgent political class than at any time in almost a century. And yet at the same time they feel more isolated, abused and powerless than at any time over the same period"   (talkingpointsmemo.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, Kristallnacht, pendulum, brittles  
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1726 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Jan 2014 at 11:29 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-25 06:58:47 PM  
It is quite stunning. In the wake of the Great Depression, FDR - the president of the United States - openly used the word "banksters". Today, the bankers and ultra-wealthy have so much political power that sort of thing is unfathomable. And yet they feel unendlingly persecuted. It's bizarre.
 
2014-01-25 07:06:16 PM  

This is a good quote from a different article TPM wrote on this:

The case of Wall Street is in many ways the hardest nut to crack. President Obama took a huge political hit for massive amounts of public money that went to bailing out the major banks. By most measures, along with his predecessor, he more or less saved US and global capitalism. And yet, when you talk to people in finance, this is entirely forgotten. What you most often hear about are two or three statements from the President that are still potently remembered. Most often it's a late 2009 quote when he said "I did not run for office to be helping out a bunch of fat cat bankers on Wall Street. They're still puzzled why it is that people are mad at the banks. Well, let's see. You guys are drawing down 10, 20 million dollar bonuses after America went through the worst economic year in decades and you guys caused the problem." That's not something you'd expect folks in finance to like particularly. But it did come after about a year of the President getting grief from Wall Street while simultaneously taking the political hit for bailing the same folks out with tax payer dollars. I've heard similar things talking to folks in the business community in DC. And what strikes me again and again is how much it comes back to a handful of statements and anecdotes, things people remember the President saying over the last three plus years.

 
2014-01-25 07:18:16 PM  
i.imgur.com
 
2014-01-25 07:37:39 PM  
I've got a quick fix: A progressive income tax, and an end to the policy of giving preferential treatment to capital gains vs. hourly wages or salary. Mitt Romney can pay the same tax rate on the last dollar he earns as I pay on mine, and we'll all be BFF.
 
2014-01-25 07:58:12 PM  

DamnYankees: It is quite stunning. In the wake of the Great Depression, FDR - the president of the United States - openly used the word "banksters". Today, the bankers and ultra-wealthy have so much political power that sort of thing is unfathomable. And yet they feel unendlingly persecuted. It's bizarre.


Make a billion dollars a year?  "You are being greedy!  You need to share the wealth!"

Bring jobs to places that have never had manufacturing?  "You're exploiting cheap labor!"

Sleep with hundreds of women every year?  "Kidnapping the women of the village is a human rights catastrophe!"

Turn water into gasoline?  "You've destroyed the local environment with your fracking!"

Gee, I wonder why rich people feel "unendlingly persecuted".  Rofl.  Rich people give you McDonald's.  Then they give you Wal-Mart.  Then they put a McDonald's in a Wal-Mart.  And yet, you still complain.  Ahahahaha.
 
2014-01-25 08:55:43 PM  

MisterTweak: I've got a quick fix: A progressive income tax, and an end to the policy of giving preferential treatment to capital gains vs. hourly wages or salary. Mitt Romney can pay the same tax rate on the last dollar he earns as I pay on mine, and we'll all be BFF.


Commie scum.
 
2014-01-25 08:58:51 PM  

MisterTweak: I've got a quick fix: A progressive income tax, and an end to the policy of giving preferential treatment to capital gains vs. hourly wages or salary. Mitt Romney can pay the same tax rate on the last dollar he earns as I pay on mine, and we'll all be BFF.


You forgot to "end the inheritance bullshiat".

/no better way to foul up a system than to give free millions/billions to those who have earned zero
//inheritance = another relic of ancient past that we can't seem to shed because precious snowflakes made out of cum
 
2014-01-25 09:22:58 PM  
you guys are barking up the wrong tree with that no inheritance crap, what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate. Then it doesn't matter if someone inherits a shiat ton of money because they still have to pay the progressive rate on any money that they make off that inheritance. Then real merkins would pay much less than the current flat rate when you made a bit of a windfall.
 
2014-01-25 09:24:37 PM  

Headso: you guys are barking up the wrong tree with that no inheritance crap, what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate. Then it doesn't matter if someone inherits a shiat ton of money because they still have to pay the progressive rate on any money that they make off that inheritance. Then real merkins would pay much less than the current flat rate when you made a bit of a windfall.


I agree that no inheritance is stupid - the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt. Just make it like normal income - you can pass on whatever you like to whoever you like, but its income to them.
 
2014-01-25 09:29:16 PM  

DamnYankees: Headso: you guys are barking up the wrong tree with that no inheritance crap, what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate. Then it doesn't matter if someone inherits a shiat ton of money because they still have to pay the progressive rate on any money that they make off that inheritance. Then real merkins would pay much less than the current flat rate when you made a bit of a windfall.

I agree that no inheritance is stupid - the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt. Just make it like normal income - you can pass on whatever you like to whoever you like, but its income to them.


That seems fair enough.  I wouldn't even have a problem with no tax on the first $100,000 or so of liquid assets, or the first $500,000 of property, so that if you inherit the family house, you're not suddenly put into a position of having to pay a huge tax bill that you'd have to immediately sell it to pay.
 
2014-01-25 09:31:39 PM  

Headso: what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate


They just park their money in offshore accounts and not pay a dime in taxes. And then still whine that they're being taxed too much.
 
2014-01-25 09:31:50 PM  
So if they catch the guy red handed cracking all of those eggs into an enormous cauldron of boiling water will they charge him with poaching?

/Don't look at me like that.
//This thread was going to descend into a madhouse of bad egg related puns long before I posted that.
 
2014-01-25 09:35:43 PM  

DamnYankees: the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt.


It's the first 5.3 million that's exempt.  Everything after that is now 40%, I believe.  But there's no reason the first 5+ million should be exempt.
 
2014-01-25 09:36:11 PM  

Mugato: Headso: what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate

They just park their money in offshore accounts and not pay a dime in taxes. And then still whine that they're being taxed too much.


well, the good part about wealth being concentrated in the hands of like 80 people is you could assign a whole team of irs investigators to each person and it would still be worth it to the government.
 
2014-01-25 09:42:16 PM  
Gee, if only they had some resource at hand to use to spread goodwill, improve the lives of others, and inspire the respect and gratitude they crave.  Ah well.  I guess it's just not to be...
 
2014-01-25 09:44:01 PM  

quatchi: So if they catch the guy red handed cracking all of those eggs into an enormous cauldron of boiling water will they charge him with poaching?

/Don't look at me like that.
//This thread was going to descend into a madhouse of bad egg related puns long before I posted that.



Wrong thread?
 
2014-01-25 09:44:44 PM  
Wow, that was totally the wrong thread to post that last. All apologies.

On topic?

Rich people are upset because wealth inequality is slowly becoming a very real issue to a lot of people in a way it hasn't been previously. As the middle class continues to shrink, as manufacturing jobs diminish and McJobs crop up in their wake this trend will continue. It's not that the investment class isn't enjoying relatively low tax rates and ridiculous loopholes and more legal bribery of politicians in the wake of the CU decision, it's the fact that they know it can't continue this way forever. This is pre-emptive whining.

TL,DR? Rich people's problem's. LOL.
 
2014-01-25 09:46:42 PM  

DamnYankees: It is quite stunning. In the wake of the Great Depression, FDR - the president of the United States - openly used the word "banksters". Today, the bankers and ultra-wealthy have so much political power that sort of thing is unfathomable. And yet they feel unendlingly persecuted. It's bizarre.


The main difference between then and now is decades of data mining and targeted media has allowed the banksters to convince just enough dummies in the working class to vote for their candidates.
 
2014-01-25 09:47:20 PM  

SilentStrider: Wrong thread?


There's a thread about a guy who stole 22,000 dollars worth of eggs. It's very silly.

*hangs head in shame, puts on dunce cone and sits quietly in corner*
 
2014-01-25 09:48:24 PM  
img.photobucket.com
 
2014-01-25 09:48:53 PM  

Lsherm: DamnYankees: the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt.

It's the first 5.3 million that's exempt.  Everything after that is now 40%, I believe.  But there's no reason the first 5+ million should be exempt.


If it's cash sitting in a bank, maybe not, but some family farms and small businesses can easily hit that in total net worth even though the income streams they generate are rather modest or average by many standards.
 
2014-01-25 09:50:34 PM  

Lenny_da_Hog: DamnYankees: It is quite stunning. In the wake of the Great Depression, FDR - the president of the United States - openly used the word "banksters". Today, the bankers and ultra-wealthy have so much political power that sort of thing is unfathomable. And yet they feel unendlingly persecuted. It's bizarre.

The main difference between then and now is decades of data mining and targeted media has allowed the banksters to convince just enough dummies in the working class to vote for their candidates.


yeah and that whole narrative about them being persecuted is just all part of that convincing, it's just part of an ongoing pr campaign.
 
2014-01-25 09:55:58 PM  

quatchi: SilentStrider: Wrong thread?

There's a thread about a guy who stole 22,000 dollars worth of eggs. It's very silly.

*hangs head in shame, puts on dunce cone and sits quietly in corner*



It still oddly works here.
 
2014-01-25 09:56:33 PM  

Headso: Lenny_da_Hog: DamnYankees: It is quite stunning. In the wake of the Great Depression, FDR - the president of the United States - openly used the word "banksters". Today, the bankers and ultra-wealthy have so much political power that sort of thing is unfathomable. And yet they feel unendlingly persecuted. It's bizarre.

The main difference between then and now is decades of data mining and targeted media has allowed the banksters to convince just enough dummies in the working class to vote for their candidates.

yeah and that whole narrative about them being persecuted is just all part of that convincing, it's just part of an ongoing pr campaign.


Small part of it. The big part is that they figured out that if they tell you they're against abortion, and for prayer and jacked-up pick-up trucks, they can kick their followers in the financial balls over and over again and they won't even notice.
 
2014-01-25 09:56:44 PM  

Nabb1: Lsherm: DamnYankees: the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt.

It's the first 5.3 million that's exempt.  Everything after that is now 40%, I believe.  But there's no reason the first 5+ million should be exempt.

If it's cash sitting in a bank, maybe not, but some family farms and small businesses can easily hit that in total net worth even though the income streams they generate are rather modest or average by many standards.


Yes, this is a big issue for the 7 people this applies to.
 
2014-01-25 09:58:51 PM  

SilentStrider: quatchi: SilentStrider: Wrong thread?

There's a thread about a guy who stole 22,000 dollars worth of eggs. It's very silly.

*hangs head in shame, puts on dunce cone and sits quietly in corner*


It still oddly works here.


Especially with hollandaise. That's especially rich.
 
2014-01-25 10:00:20 PM  
It's lonely up there in that ivory tower...
 
2014-01-25 10:09:06 PM  

DamnYankees: Nabb1: Lsherm: DamnYankees: the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt.

It's the first 5.3 million that's exempt.  Everything after that is now 40%, I believe.  But there's no reason the first 5+ million should be exempt.

If it's cash sitting in a bank, maybe not, but some family farms and small businesses can easily hit that in total net worth even though the income streams they generate are rather modest or average by many standards.

Yes, this is a big issue for the 7 people this applies to.


I think I went to high school with all of them.

/My high school was halfway out in the sticks. Future Farmers of America was the largest student club, I believe.
 
2014-01-25 10:36:16 PM  
I am playing a tiny violin.

a tiny Stradivarius.
 
2014-01-25 11:38:22 PM  
My Wal-Mart uses to have a McDonald's. Now it has a subway

Thanks Obama
 
2014-01-25 11:40:05 PM  
In other words, butthurt associated with Affluenza.
 
2014-01-25 11:40:08 PM  

Lenny_da_Hog: SilentStrider: quatchi: SilentStrider: Wrong thread?

There's a thread about a guy who stole 22,000 dollars worth of eggs. It's very silly.

*hangs head in shame, puts on dunce cone and sits quietly in corner*


It still oddly works here.

Especially with hollandaise. That's especially rich.


Oh sure..come into this thread and get all saucy..
 
2014-01-25 11:41:21 PM  

SuperTramp: I am playing a tiny violin.

a tiny Stradivarius.


Typical 1%er talk. Us working folks had to settle for a Yamaha.
 
2014-01-25 11:43:57 PM  
that imaginary obama fellow sure is an asshole. the real one has his issues, but the imaginary one is superhitler.
 
2014-01-25 11:54:42 PM  

Because People in power are Stupid: [img.photobucket.com image 350x262]


img.fark.net


I like this one better:

www.clker.com
 
2014-01-25 11:58:54 PM  

DamnYankees: Headso: you guys are barking up the wrong tree with that no inheritance crap, what needs to happen would be capital gains taxed at a progressive rate. Then it doesn't matter if someone inherits a shiat ton of money because they still have to pay the progressive rate on any money that they make off that inheritance. Then real merkins would pay much less than the current flat rate when you made a bit of a windfall.

I agree that no inheritance is stupid - the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt. Just make it like normal income - you can pass on whatever you like to whoever you like, but its income to them.


Why?

DEATH TAX DEATH TAX DEATH TAX! OMG TAXING DEATH.
 
2014-01-26 12:03:10 AM  
Oh their widdle feelings is being hurts? Boo hoo.

Things keep going where they're going and they'll want to invest in guillotine manufacturing.
 
2014-01-26 12:03:43 AM  
"And yet at the same time they palpably feel more isolated, abused and powerless than at any time over the same period and sense some genuine peril to the whole mix of privileges, power and wealth they hold."

[goodgrumpycat.jpg]
 
2014-01-26 12:04:42 AM  
I'll take this asshole's cries of persecution seriously when someone hacks off his prized dancing horse's head and mounts it on a pike jammed through the engine block of his Maybach. Until then, learn to enjoy the billions you have, farknuts. You've got enough money to do pretty much whatever you want, and you choose to spend your time writing paranoid bullshiat for the WSJ instead of taking trips to popular honeymoon spots and offering up indecent proposals to every newleywed you can find.
 
2014-01-26 12:04:47 AM  
I sort of understand how fascism takes root when the elite just kind of deserve to be stabbed to death in the street.

Were I a regular guy in pre-war Germany, I'd say yeah, just kill that guy and take his money.
 
2014-01-26 12:06:40 AM  
Lessons taught but never learned
All around us anger burns
Guide the future by the past
Long ago the mould was cast

For they marched up to Bastille Day
La guillotine claimed her bloody prize
Hear the echoes of the centuries
Power isn't all that money buys
 
2014-01-26 12:07:52 AM  

Nabb1: Lsherm: DamnYankees: the issue is why we make inheritance tax exempt.

It's the first 5.3 million that's exempt.  Everything after that is now 40%, I believe.  But there's no reason the first 5+ million should be exempt.

If it's cash sitting in a bank, maybe not, but some family farms and small businesses can easily hit that in total net worth even though the income streams they generate are rather modest or average by many standards.


I could see an exception being made for family businesses that stay in the family.  Most businesses once they reach a certain size end up being corporations anyway, so they're not treated the same was as a privately owned operation, but I don't see a problem with a family farm, restaurant, dry cleaner, winery, etc, being passed down tax free.

If, however, whoever inherits the business then sells it, they should certainly be held liable for taxes on any income derived from that sale.
 
2014-01-26 12:10:15 AM  

LectertheChef: I'll take this asshole's cries of persecution seriously when someone hacks off his prized dancing horse's head and mounts it on a pike jammed through the engine block of his Maybach.


THIS^^^ You have enough money to buy and sell entire cities, if not islands and chunks of small nations.
Don't whine, don't b*tch, STFU and enjoy it. You're just pissing people off with your blubbering.
 
2014-01-26 12:11:10 AM  
They feel isolated and powerless because they were dead certain that they had finally made the last payment and taken possession to the title of the US government in 2001, and they have been outraged ever since sometime around 2006 they got the first hints that they did not, in fact, have total ownership, and then 2009 came along, and that's when the weeping and the gnashing of teeth and the howls of "but we paid for it" began.

And then of course there was 2013, when they agreed to double down, and found yet again that they were left holding the bag.

In short,

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
 
2014-01-26 12:14:09 AM  
If the Publicans are the "party of personal responsibility", perhaps they can tell us who is going to be personally responsible for dumping poison into the Elk River.
 
2014-01-26 12:18:38 AM  

Nabb1: /My high school was halfway out in the sticks. Future Farmers of America was the largest student club, I believe.


I went to that school too. a whole 10 of us in my entire grade.

Those "family farms" are multimillion dollar corporations.
 
2014-01-26 12:21:55 AM  
C'mon you guys, stop being mean to rich people or it'll NEVER trickle down.
 
2014-01-26 12:22:58 AM  
That's because most of them should be strung up from trees
 
2014-01-26 12:23:09 AM  
Those poor, fragile, delicate souls.
 
2014-01-26 12:23:36 AM  

log_jammin: Nabb1: /My high school was halfway out in the sticks. Future Farmers of America was the largest student club, I believe.

I went to that school too. a whole 10 of us in my entire grade.

Those "family farms" are multimillion dollar corporations.


If anyone's curious, here's a quite thorough explanation by a non-partisan think tank about why the "won't someone think of the farmers!" argument is bullshiat handwaving.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3223
 
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