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(Edmonton Sun)   Bill Gates got checkmated by world Chess champion Magnus Carlsen in just nine, count 'em, nine moves. Adding insult to injury, Gates kept calling the knight "the horsey guy"   (edmontonsun.com) divider line 25
    More: Spiffy  
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5298 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jan 2014 at 5:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2014-01-24 05:24:20 PM  
4 votes:
Bill is lucky, Magnus is good. When it comes to chess, luck has nothing to do with it.
2014-01-24 04:19:17 PM  
3 votes:
I doubt most non-master-class folks would last any longer.
2014-01-24 06:50:51 PM  
2 votes:
People that are really good at chess study it.

They practice tactics over and over and over.  Patterns tend to repeat, and by doing a ton of tactics, they can often, as soon as they glance at a position, recognize a weakness and start looking for how to exploit it, because they've seen similar patterns many times before.  Chess is essentially a game of tactics, so in order to be good at chess, you have to be good at tactics.

As they get pretty good, they start studying openings.  For common openings, they know the main lines and the common mistakes, they don't even have to think about it.  If  you're playing them and you don't know those lines, you're going to make a mistake.  Depending on the mistake, they may already know a way to take advantage of it, or they may just have to start thinking about what to play instead of auto-playing the "book" line.  Either way, that puts them at an advantage.

It's a lot like anything else.  To be the best you can be, you have to work at it, you have to study, and  you have to practice.  If you want to be the best NFL QB, you have to work out, practice passing, and study the playbook.  If you want to be really good at programming computers, you have to study and put a lot of time in on the keyboard.  If you want to be a great guitar player, you have to practice for thousands of hours and study other guitar players for thousands more.  It's easy to be an overnight success, as long as you spend 10 years preparing for it.
2014-01-24 04:31:15 PM  
2 votes:
And yet in that 71 second round, Bill Gates made approximately $17,750*

*No one seems to know an exact number, but most said between $200-300/second so I averaged at $250
2014-01-24 09:15:09 PM  
1 votes:
Probably used a Vista box to help him...

/Still a very rich man
//Using a Win 7 box
2014-01-24 08:16:37 PM  
1 votes:

spawn73: Now how long do you need to think about the fact that a computer couldn't beat a human till 1997, given that computers are kinda known for being good at memorizing things.


Space limitations.  Serious ones.

Basically, (to the best of my knowledge.  I do not program AI's for a living), a chess AI works like this:

1) Define a heuristic that determines *best* chess position.  Define another heuristic that starts from a given position and determines how LIKELY a given opponent move is.
2) Start from a position.  At every point, make every single move, calculate how *good* the resulting positions is, push forwards from there.
3) At a certain point, run up against physical hardware limits.  Use heuristic to prune tree of all unlikely (because it's bad for them) or bad moves.  Keep moving forwards from there.
4) Stop after simulating N moves.  Pick best move

So let's say we stop at 5 moves.  We know that doing this move is, on average, given our best guess at how likely our opponent is to make certain moves for the next 5 moves, the *best* move.  If it's all going to go horribly wrong at 6 moves, we're farked.

And the heuristics tend to be "Given this list of every previous game ever, what did people do in this position and what happened to them?"

So therefore, your 2 knobs are going to be:

* How good is my heuristic?  How effective is my pruning and how accurate are my predictions?
* Sub-question: How wide/deep is my heuristic?  Since I have limited space, I can either prune like mad and simulate the whole game or I can throw a very wide net that simulates 3 moves out.  (OR: W*H = Constant)
* How much compute power can I throw at the problem?  (Ie: How large can I make constant?)

So the more computing power and the more memory you have, the *deeper* and *broader* you can look, and the *better* your looks are because they're based on more history which helps tune your heuristic.  Combine that with much, much better algorithms (partly because we get better at writing them over time and partly because they can use the new compute power better), and eventually after 30 years of research and Moore's Law, you too can solve the Chess problem.
2014-01-24 07:34:03 PM  
1 votes:

spawn73: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Afterwards, Gates purchased Norway and told Carlsen to GTFO.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Government_Pension_Fund_of_Norway

Norways loose cash would purchase Gates 10+ times.


upload.wikimedia.org
2014-01-24 06:46:33 PM  
1 votes:

nekom: lennavan:
I see that my castley dude can kill that guy or that guy.  Good chess players see the rook controlling lanes on the board.

Good chess players (I'm above average, but by no means great) indeed see lanes, but there a few key concepts beyond that that don't occur to the layman.  My father was a chess geek in school and taught me how to play.  What I learned going from n00b to somewhat decent:

1.  Do NOT bee too conservative.  If you just stand back playing defense, you are going to lose, period.  You need to plan and mount an attack right out of the gate.
2.  Overprotection.
3.  Control the center of the board.
4.  When all else fails, push a pawn.  But don't make that your first go to plan.
5.  Overprotection.  Worth mentioning twice.
6.  Don't be afraid to sacrifice a piece for a higher value piece of your opponent's.  If possible, sometimes even try to goat them into taking the exchange, this works best on n00bs.

Better chess players than me probably conceptualize it in entirely different ways.


I don't know how many people are afraid of sacrificing a piece for a higher value opponent piece.  The difficult part that I never got over was seeing the board the same way as the clearly better players did.  I would make that trade, I would take their better piece and sacrifice my crappy piece.  I would do that a few times and think I was winning.  I wasn't.  They were trading pieces for position and board control and it was only a few moments away before I started getting my ass kicked.

I don't know how important controlling the center is, I got beat many times because I couldn't do shiat with people controlling the sides.
2014-01-24 06:40:18 PM  
1 votes:
lennavan:
I see that my castley dude can kill that guy or that guy.  Good chess players see the rook controlling lanes on the board.

Good chess players (I'm above average, but by no means great) indeed see lanes, but there a few key concepts beyond that that don't occur to the layman.  My father was a chess geek in school and taught me how to play.  What I learned going from n00b to somewhat decent:

1.  Do NOT bee too conservative.  If you just stand back playing defense, you are going to lose, period.  You need to plan and mount an attack right out of the gate.
2.  Overprotection.
3.  Control the center of the board.
4.  When all else fails, push a pawn.  But don't make that your first go to plan.
5.  Overprotection.  Worth mentioning twice.
6.  Don't be afraid to sacrifice a piece for a higher value piece of your opponent's.  If possible, sometimes even try to goat them into taking the exchange, this works best on n00bs.

Better chess players than me probably conceptualize it in entirely different ways.
2014-01-24 06:17:13 PM  
1 votes:
I've always thought it odd how ability in chess is conflated with intelligence.

I've met some people who were smashing at chess, but more or less retarded at other things (like math).

And I've met the opposite. One of the most intelligent people I've known is rubbish at it, rubbish enough that I can beat him, and I'm pretty mediocre at chess.
2014-01-24 06:08:02 PM  
1 votes:
A casual gets his ass handed to him by a pro. Nothing to see here.
2014-01-24 05:58:33 PM  
1 votes:
I found it funny that Magnus had his queen in position for the mate before Bill even castled that way.  He knew he could put Bill on the defensive until he did it.
2014-01-24 05:57:54 PM  
1 votes:
...has won him the moniker, the "Justin Bieber of chess".

Someone needs to be kicked in the nuts for that, either him or the person that called him that, but someone...
2014-01-24 05:51:02 PM  
1 votes:

obenchainr: 4-move checkmate


If you ever really want to blow someone's mind:

1) Beat them with 4 move checkmate (Queen to H5 variant).
2) Show them the pawn counter (Pawn to G6) to 4-move checkmate
3) Play another game, and QxE5 when they do the counter.  Place them in check, and then go grab the rook with your queen.
4) Completely rip open their kings side.

/Got good enough to be able to crush my family unthinkingly.
//Was never good enough to get past "And then I do this cool thing 3 moves from now" to "And then I move this pawn that 10 moves from now could be part of a deeply laid plan because it controls X".
///And then my family stopped playing me.
2014-01-24 05:38:50 PM  
1 votes:
Bill Gates castled even though Magnus was positioning expecting the castle watch the board noobs
2014-01-24 05:38:31 PM  
1 votes:

i.imgur.com

RIP Robot Fighter

2014-01-24 05:34:49 PM  
1 votes:
Yes because Gates couldn't steal a victory, which is the only way he knows how to make a living
2014-01-24 05:34:42 PM  
1 votes:

relaxitsjustme: 9 moves?  Does Gates even know how to play Chess?  A 1300 player should be able to hold out longer than that as long as they don't walk into a trap.


Bill wasn't thinking about moves. He was panicking because Magnus was slapping that clock a quarter second after Bill made his move.

If there's one thing Magnus is good at (besides actual chess of course), it's getting into opponents heads very quickly and farking them up.
2014-01-24 05:30:15 PM  
1 votes:

ArcadianRefugee: uber humper: I thought Magnus Carlson was the World's Strongest Man.

That's Carl Magnussen.


I thought it was Marl Cagnus
2014-01-24 05:28:40 PM  
1 votes:
9 moves?  Does Gates even know how to play Chess?  A 1300 player should be able to hold out longer than that as long as they don't walk into a trap.
2014-01-24 05:28:17 PM  
1 votes:

uber humper: I thought Magnus Carlson was the World's Strongest Man.


That's Carl Magnussen.
2014-01-24 05:26:40 PM  
1 votes:
upload.wikimedia.org

To be fair, Bill was confused that none of the pieces took out an ax and violently chopped up the other pieces.
2014-01-24 05:26:13 PM  
1 votes:
I thought Magnus Carlson was the World's Strongest Man.
2014-01-24 05:01:17 PM  
1 votes:
www.planetsmeg.com

Prawn takes horsie.
2014-01-24 04:25:24 PM  
1 votes:
Afterwards, Gates purchased Norway and told Carlsen to GTFO.
 
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