If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(io9)   Ever wondered what that big hospital CT scanner would look like without the sleek outer casing? I'm not saying it's a prototype Stargate, but it's a prototype Stargate   (io9.com) divider line 57
    More: Cool, cat scan, Stargate, prototype Stargate, casing, sleek  
•       •       •

8587 clicks; posted to Geek » on 20 Jan 2014 at 9:43 AM (24 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



57 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-01-20 09:09:26 AM
Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?
 
2014-01-20 09:45:51 AM
The chevrons are locking!
 
2014-01-20 09:49:57 AM
Magnetic resonance images are coming out!
 
2014-01-20 09:50:27 AM
Indeed
 
2014-01-20 09:51:47 AM

Cybernetic: The chevrons are locking!


Is most pleased with this development.

 
2014-01-20 09:53:19 AM
www.troll.me
 
2014-01-20 09:55:12 AM
WTF. Let's try that again, shall we?

whosits_112: Cybernetic: The chevrons are locking!



static.comicvine.com


Is most pleased with this development.

 
2014-01-20 09:59:42 AM

p4p3rm4t3: Nuclear Magnetic resonance images are coming out!


FTFY
 
2014-01-20 10:00:42 AM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


A quick net-check and it looks like they'll go into the low 7 range - 1 to 3 mil.  But I'm guessing there's a wide variety of those things available, so probably an equally wide price range.
 
2014-01-20 10:02:25 AM
I watched a tech work on a focused beam radiation machine for cancer patients once. All the casing was off and every time the tech made things move I kept waiting for some kind of rapid fire laser cannon to begin shooting.
 
2014-01-20 10:07:06 AM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


$600k-1.5million depending on the options.

/medical physicist
 
2014-01-20 10:08:19 AM
Surprisingly compact when you consider what it's doing.  Always through they were much bigger.
 
2014-01-20 10:14:45 AM
Not sure how dangerous it would be (other than being dump and sticking an appendage all up in that, but I'd totally be scanned in that thing with the case off.
 
2014-01-20 10:19:33 AM
I fix these things for Philips.
The designation for the ganty is Stargate.
Also I am getting a kick out of these replies.
 
2014-01-20 10:43:42 AM
If people were already freaked out about going in that with the casing, no one would go in that if there was no casing.

Also, it seems like the precision needed to make that spinning part would need to be amazing. It looks like certain sections have more stuff on it than other and getting something like that perfectly balanced to spin properly would take a lot of work. Impressive. Well that, and the fact that it maps your farking brain.
 
2014-01-20 10:45:34 AM
Probably only gets 20FPS in Crysis 3
 
2014-01-20 11:05:44 AM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


I dunno but you can do it yourself on the cheap:

funnyfilez.funnypart.com
 
2014-01-20 11:12:28 AM
media.giphy.com
 
2014-01-20 11:22:08 AM

ActionJoe: If people were already freaked out about going in that with the casing, no one would go in that if there was no casing.

Also, it seems like the precision needed to make that spinning part would need to be amazing. It looks like certain sections have more stuff on it than other and getting something like that perfectly balanced to spin properly would take a lot of work. Impressive. Well that, and the fact that it maps your farking brain.


Also, you somehow need to get power in and signal out from all that rapidly rotating equipment. The fact that they can do that cleanly is impressive all by itself.
 
2014-01-20 11:24:43 AM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


Depending on what kind you get, anywhere from 1-4 mill for the actual instrument. However you also need a specialized room that will cost you something like another 500k.
 
2014-01-20 11:24:43 AM

SansNeural: p4p3rm4t3: X-ray Nuclear Magnetic resonance images are coming out!

FTFY


FTFY
 
2014-01-20 11:34:23 AM
Could you build a CT scanner so large that it could scan a CT scanner whilst it was scanning?
 
2014-01-20 11:43:52 AM
So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating
 
2014-01-20 11:54:46 AM
Orlan made one of those
 
2014-01-20 11:56:03 AM

Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating


You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.
 
2014-01-20 12:01:01 PM
stuhayes2010:
$600k-1.5million depending on the options.

...but never get the rustproof undercoating. That's a ripoff.
 
2014-01-20 12:05:32 PM

cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.


And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.
 
2014-01-20 12:10:22 PM

cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.


Thank you, I guess, but I thought it was pretty clear I was kidding about the printer.  :)

Guess not.

My point about the fans was that the effect of all that spinning force would, to my non-engineer eyes, swamp any small amount of cooling provided by the little fans -- in other words why not simply have channels that would use some of the rotational force to sweep and concentrate air through the necessary areas.

Do airplane jet engines have cooling fans?

Hmm, come to think of it, perhaps the value of the little fans comes into play only AFTER the scanner has stopped rotating, similar to many TV projectors.  That at least makes sense to me...
 
2014-01-20 12:16:45 PM

Phaeon: cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.

And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.



No, CT scans work completely differently than an MRI.  A CT machine is usually in the basement because that's one less 'wall' (the floor) that the hospital has to shield so that radiation doesn't get get *out*.  If it was on a floor with something under it, the floor would have to be shielded as well, increasing the cost of the room.  This is also why as a general rule in most hospitals, all standard radiation type thingamabobs and doodads are in the basement as well.
 
2014-01-20 12:31:53 PM
Off to design one that will be 10 to 25% cheaper,  it will be immobile and spin the patient,  I'm going to be rich!
 
2014-01-20 12:43:35 PM
It is not a Stargate, it is a Fargate!  From the makers of Findependence Day! We will give it a mohawk and wheelchair if you need help.
 
2014-01-20 12:46:57 PM

Phaeon: cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.

And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.


Not to mention the software it takes to make the images.  Anyway, CT is losing ground to Ultrasound and MRI, that's why ultrasound techs are one of the fastest-growing of all fields in the country.  A basic ultrasound machine is $250k and you can wheel it from room to room and plug it into standard wall outlets.  And the patient isn't exposed to radiation.

I think it's amusing when people complain about the cost of healthcare.  Yes, your CT costs $1,000.  The machine cost $2,000,000, the room cost $500k, the software runs many thousands of dollars per year, and the test is being conducted by a tech making $30 an hour, and interpreted by a rad who makes over $150 an hour.
 
2014-01-20 12:52:24 PM
Far Cough:
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating


Depends on the fans and how bonkers the engineering is, I mean their rotation could be being used to help balance the wheel; it does look lopsided as far as weight goes.  I'm also not sure how the airflow works with the casing on, obviously more restricted than off but the fans could be needed whilst its spinning and not just used to cool it when stationary.
 
2014-01-20 01:26:11 PM

Fark It: Phaeon: cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.

And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.

Not to mention the software it takes to make the images.  Anyway, CT is losing ground to Ultrasound and MRI, that's why ultrasound techs are one of the fastest-growing of all fields in the country.  A basic ultrasound machine is $250k and you can wheel it from room to room and plug it into standard wall outlets.  And the patient isn't exposed to radiation.

I think it's amusing when people complain about the cost of healthcare.  Yes, your CT costs $1,000.  The machine cost $2,000,000, the room cost $500k, the software runs many thousands of dollars per year, and the test is being conducted by a tech making $30 an hour, and interpreted by a rad who makes over $150 an hour.


Uh....

16 hour days for 50 weeks per year = 180 x 16 x 7 x 50 = 1,008,000 personnel costs

2 CTs per hour = 2 x (16 x 7 x 50) = 2 (5600), @1,000 each = 11,200,000 income from CTs

So you're telling me the hospital is netting $10 Million per year to absorb their $2.5 Million one-time investment, and that's your example of why we're NOT supposed to complain about health care gouging??

Come again?
 
2014-01-20 01:55:01 PM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


Used ones seem to be going for high five to low six, so I imagine new ones are in the 6 figures unless you get one with like 128 slices or something.
 
2014-01-20 02:00:24 PM

Far Cough: Fark It: Phaeon: cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.

And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.

Not to mention the software it takes to make the images.  Anyway, CT is losing ground to Ultrasound and MRI, that's why ultrasound techs are one of the fastest-growing of all fields in the country.  A basic ultrasound machine is $250k and you can wheel it from room to room and plug it into standard wall outlets.  And the patient isn't exposed to radiation.

I think it's amusing when people complain about the cost of healthcare.  Yes, your CT costs $1,000.  The machine cost $2,000,000, the room cost $500k, the software runs many thousands of dollars per year, and the test is being conducted by a tech making $30 an hour, and interpreted by a rad who makes over $150 an hour.

Uh....

16 hour days for 50 weeks per year = 180 x 16 x 7 x 50 = 1,008,000 personnel costs

2 CTs per hour = 2 x (16 x 7 x 50) = 2 (5600), @1,000 each = 11,200,000 income from CTs

So you're telling me the hospital is netting $10 Million per year to absorb their $2. ...


You're assuming that CTs can be done twice in an hour, that they don't take longer, that patients don't miss their scheduled appointments, that there is no down-time, that none of the CTs are contrast (more expensive), and that CTs are a "one-time investment"  And that all patients pay their bills.  And that they don't get sued.  And that there isn't any facilities cost (mainly energy), support staff.  And my $30/150 is on the low-end, that's salary, it doesn't account for the costs of benefits, malpractice, health insurance, matching 401ks, training, continuing education.

Just because hospitals are "non-profit" doesn't mean that they can operate in the red.  They need to make money to hire better doctors, buy the best equipment, provide the best patient care, maintain their facilities, etc.
 
2014-01-20 02:02:30 PM

Far Cough: Fark It: Phaeon: cptjeff: Far Cough: So how long before these can be 3D-printed in a home workshop?  Can anyone speak to that?

/seriously that does look way cool
/WTF with the cooling fans
/how much could they accomplish when the whole thing is rotating

You will never be able to make one of these with a home 3D printer. An industrial one like the ones they use to make airplane parts could make pieces, but they would likely still require additional machining. They demand incredibly tight tolerances on the composition of the materials and machining, the x-ray tubes have to be perfectly aligned and their power has to be exactly equal, and they generate a shaitload of power and heat, which requires a really advanced vacuum cooling system. And you can run fans while the whole assembly is spinning, that's not hard.

Home 3D printers basically make cheap plastic dodads. Not stuff like this.

And doesn't the room have to be shielded from outside radiation, or is that just something they do for an MRI to block out the Earth's magnetic field.

Not to mention the software it takes to make the images.  Anyway, CT is losing ground to Ultrasound and MRI, that's why ultrasound techs are one of the fastest-growing of all fields in the country.  A basic ultrasound machine is $250k and you can wheel it from room to room and plug it into standard wall outlets.  And the patient isn't exposed to radiation.

I think it's amusing when people complain about the cost of healthcare.  Yes, your CT costs $1,000.  The machine cost $2,000,000, the room cost $500k, the software runs many thousands of dollars per year, and the test is being conducted by a tech making $30 an hour, and interpreted by a rad who makes over $150 an hour.

Uh....

16 hour days for 50 weeks per year = 180 x 16 x 7 x 50 = 1,008,000 personnel costs

2 CTs per hour = 2 x (16 x 7 x 50) = 2 (5600), @1,000 each = 11,200,000 income from CTs

So you're telling me the hospital is netting $10 Million per year to absorb their $2.5 Million one-time investment, and that's your example of why we're NOT supposed to complain about health care gouging??

Come again?


Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.
 
2014-01-20 02:29:19 PM

skeevy420: Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.


Well, according to Mr. or Ms. Fark It above, after your gas, tolls, and liability insurance, you'd still be losing money.  If you hire a helper, you're in the red already.  Overhead's a biatch, apparently.  :)
 
2014-01-20 02:54:25 PM

Far Cough: skeevy420: Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.

Well, according to Mr. or Ms. Fark It above, after your gas, tolls, and liability insurance, you'd still be losing money.  If you hire a helper, you're in the red already.  Overhead's a biatch, apparently.  :)


Yes, because it's intellectually honest to compare chain-link fencing to the healthcare industry  *eyeroll

Labs and imaging are where hospitals make up the revenue losses from other areas, particularly emergency.  And how long do you have to go to school to become an installer of chain-link fencing (and an expert on the economics of healthcare, apparently)?  Is it 10 years?  What happens if you make a mistake?  Does anybody die?  What professional societies and registries are chain-link fence installers required to be in?

There is a happy medium to be struck with regards to service and cost in healthcare, and hopefully the ACA will reign in some costs (unless the poor people the ACA targeted opt to pay the fine because they still can't afford basic coverage), but there are way too many people who expect to have the best AND cheapest healthcare available.
 
2014-01-20 03:05:59 PM

Fark It: Yes, because it's intellectually honest to compare chain-link fencing to the healthcare industry *eyeroll

Labs and imaging are where hospitals make up the revenue losses from other areas, particularly emergency. And how long do you have to go to school to become an installer of chain-link fencing (and an expert on the economics of healthcare, apparently)? Is it 10 years? What happens if you make a mistake? Does anybody die? What professional societies and registries are chain-link fence installers required to be in?

There is a happy medium to be struck with regards to service and cost in healthcare, and hopefully the ACA will reign in some costs (unless the poor people the ACA targeted opt to pay the fine because they still can't afford basic coverage), but there are way too many people who expect to have the best AND cheapest healthcare available.


Are you kidding?  At the rates they have the nerve to charge for emergency visits you're telling me that's a LOSS and not a profit center?  Odd, then, that all the ones around here have been taken over by 3rd party companies that love to bill you separately and claim no responsibility for anything.

Of course medicine has huge overhead, but it also provides pretty lousy and ridiculously inefficient service, if my last few times in hospitals are any indication.  Lot of time sitting in $3,000/day beds for no reason at all waiting for doctors who bill you without ever actually seeing you, nurses ignore you, and you get the feeling that your very presence is a burden and you are anything BUT a paying customer.  (Not speaking for myself, these were others hospitalized.)

By the way, the only reason I even responded was that you provided particular dollar representations, purportedly to counter people "complaining about the cost of healthcare".  But your numbers indicated the opposite, that the costs were way too high by any measure.  If all the REAL numbers were elsewhere perhaps you should have included them, as this didn't make a very effective argument for your position, as I'm sure you can see.

/i made up $3K above, it may be higher?
 
2014-01-20 03:12:06 PM
Therac-25.
 
2014-01-20 03:13:21 PM

Far Cough: skeevy420: Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.

Well, according to Mr. or Ms. Fark It above, after your gas, tolls, and liability insurance, you'd still be losing money.  If you hire a helper, you're in the red already.  Overhead's a biatch, apparently.  :)


My prices included all that and 2 helpers @ 10/h priced for the average residential house without a lot of extra bs required. There's only 8 hours tops in 200ft of chain link over 2 days, unless it's in god awful ground that takes forever to dig, there's a lot of brush clearing, old fence removal, etc.

Point is, even with overhead, people can do a good job and manage not to gouge prices too much like the hospitals do.

Though the bigger problem with hospital costs isn't the hardware, it's things like tuition, malpractice insurance, people without insurance not covering their part, big pharmaceutical, not being allowed to use natural/herbal remedies in cases where they'd be better than modern medicine, and more. All things considered, the cost of hardware isn't what needs the most attention and the whole system, not just hospitals, needs a redo or an overhaul, which is hard to do with democracy and capitalism (nobody will agree with anybody and decisions are based on personal gain versus the good of the country).
 
2014-01-20 03:15:59 PM

Far Cough: /i made up $3K above, it may be higher?


It depends.  Most hospitals are going to have rates for common procedures, beds, and professional services listed somewhere.  $3k sounds about right for a basic room at a nice hospital (out-of-pocket).  And you aren't speaking for yourself, you're speaking for others.  Healthcare is like any other job.  The customers are idiots.  It sucks some people you talked to had a lousy patient experience.  That is not something you should use to indict the entire system.  And have you ever seen an emergency room?  Do you know what the ratio of staff to patients is?  Do you have any idea how many people come into the emergency room with no intention or means of paying for their healthcare, and how that cost then has to be made up elsewhere?

I used to be like you guys, and then I spent a ton of time on the other side of the coin, working/volunteering with providers in the trenches.  We're a democracy, we choose the kind of healthcare system we want every time we punch a ballot.  And we also choose to be unhealthy and stupid when it comes to our health.  I would estimate that about half of the money we spend as a nation each year on healthcare is lifestyle-related.  We choose to be fat and have heart problems, diabetes, lung cancer from smoking, etc.

Yeah, we get that you don't have the mark-up when you install chain-link fencing.  Do you have to install chain-link fencing for people who you know will never pay you?  Are you morally and legally obligated to?
 
2014-01-20 03:20:04 PM

skeevy420: Far Cough: skeevy420: Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.

Well, according to Mr. or Ms. Fark It above, after your gas, tolls, and liability insurance, you'd still be losing money.  If you hire a helper, you're in the red already.  Overhead's a biatch, apparently.  :)

My prices included all that and 2 helpers @ 10/h priced for the average residential house without a lot of extra bs required. There's only 8 hours tops in 200ft of chain link over 2 days, unless it's in god awful ground that takes forever to dig, there's a lot of brush clearing, old fence removal, etc.

Point is, even with overhead, people can do a good job and manage not to gouge prices too much like the hospitals do.


Because of how much you charge for installing fencing?

Though the bigger problem with hospital costs isn't the hardware, it's things like tuition, malpractice insurance, people without insurance not covering their part, big pharmaceutical, not being allowed to use natural/herbal remedies in cases where they'd be better than modern medicine, and more. All things considered, the cost of hardware isn't what needs the most attention and the whole system, not just hospitals, needs a redo or an overhaul, which is hard to do with democracy and capitalism (nobody will agree with anybody and decisions are based on personal gain versus the good of the country).

i.stack.imgur.com
 
2014-01-20 03:40:09 PM

Fark It: Far Cough: /i made up $3K above, it may be higher?

It depends.  Most hospitals are going to have rates for common procedures, beds, and professional services listed somewhere.  $3k sounds about right for a basic room at a nice hospital (out-of-pocket).  And you aren't speaking for yourself, you're speaking for others.  Healthcare is like any other job.  The customers are idiots.  It sucks some people you talked to had a lousy patient experience.  That is not something you should use to indict the entire system.  And have you ever seen an emergency room?  Do you know what the ratio of staff to patients is?  Do you have any idea how many people come into the emergency room with no intention or means of paying for their healthcare, and how that cost then has to be made up elsewhere?



Yeah, no.  I am being discreet, but I was there the whole time and while I wasn't the patient, I am speaking from personal experience.  The staff ignored the patient as much as it is humanly possible to ignore a patient.  The doctors did not come while the $3,000 meter burned away each day.  I can not interpret this as anything but intentional and baked into the system.  It felt like lazy ducks who were very accustomed to massive overfeeding, and who would never quite get around to swimming by but who would present their bill in the end anyway.

Of course I've seen emergency rooms, too many of them.  And the signature motif of every one of them was people waiting hours just to see the first nurse, whether there were 3 people in the waiting room or 30, and whether they were bleeding or barely conscious.  Not a single one even had someone act like a maitre d'  and greet people in the waiting room to try to establish triage.  As much as I support single payer and ACA, I do wonder just how much more lazy and customer-inattentive hospital staff can possibly get.

Also, NOT an herbal/alternative/magnet/woo person here.  I recently had to tolerate someone talking endlessly about homeopathy; I don't think he actually knew what it was or why he was full of crap.
 
2014-01-20 04:17:53 PM

nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?


i am.   multi-detector ct's have come waaaay down i price.   six figures.   you can get a very good refurbed 64 for less than 500K.  the highest detectors are 320 or 256, but you can do very good cardiac cta on a 64.  on one does because of medicare reimbursements rates and turf issues, but you can do it.
 
2014-01-20 04:56:43 PM

stir22: nekom: Anyone in the business know what one of those things cost?  6 figures or 7?

i am.   multi-detector ct's have come waaaay down i price.   six figures.   you can get a very good refurbed 64 for less than 500K.  the highest detectors are 320 or 256, but you can do very good cardiac cta on a 64.  on one does because of medicare reimbursements rates and turf issues, but you can do it.


Hah!  Now that's funny; kind of shoot's Fark It's math more deeply in the rectum.  So now that $10 Million yearly revenue stream only has to cover a $750K one-time investment.  It's hard out there for a pimp.
 
2014-01-20 05:41:01 PM

Fark It: skeevy420: Far Cough: skeevy420: Same reason it costs $1500 for anesthesia, a lancing, antibiotic packing, and 2 prescriptions. If I could get 1, 3, & 4 in a store I'd do 2 at home. Really sucks paying that much for maybe a hundred tops in actual materials.

I install fence for a living. If I marked up prices like that, 200ft of chain link would go from 2-2.5k to 20k. I'd love to mark up a custom iron fence like that.

Well, according to Mr. or Ms. Fark It above, after your gas, tolls, and liability insurance, you'd still be losing money.  If you hire a helper, you're in the red already.  Overhead's a biatch, apparently.  :)

My prices included all that and 2 helpers @ 10/h priced for the average residential house without a lot of extra bs required. There's only 8 hours tops in 200ft of chain link over 2 days, unless it's in god awful ground that takes forever to dig, there's a lot of brush clearing, old fence removal, etc.

Point is, even with overhead, people can do a good job and manage not to gouge prices too much like the hospitals do.

Because of how much you charge for installing fencing?

Though the bigger problem with hospital costs isn't the hardware, it's things like tuition, malpractice insurance, people without insurance not covering their part, big pharmaceutical, not being allowed to use natural/herbal remedies in cases where they'd be better than modern medicine, and more. All things considered, the cost of hardware isn't what needs the most attention and the whole system, not just hospitals, needs a redo or an overhaul, which is hard to do with democracy and capitalism (nobody will agree with anybody and decisions are based on personal gain versus the good of the country).


I'll bite...

Could have added "whether they do or not is a whole other argument about the merits of our societies' values, pure greed, or the downsides of profit driven capitalism" somewhere in the first part.

The second one. There's pot for insomnia, minor aches and pain, eating issues, and more. Murican honey has been shown to be effective against bad infections. Then you have Western and Chinese scientists studying various ancient teas, medecines, remedies, and the plants that make them up because they do heal and treat ailments. Lots of our current medicines come from realizing "this drink does that, let's figure which part does it, extract it, pill it, and (profit) heal people". I'm not all wholistic hippy about them, but I do recognize the values some have and believe doctors should use both in treating patients. Even if some are placebos, that placebo might just be the catalyst that gives the psychological edge to beat whatever.
 
2014-01-20 06:18:22 PM
Gordon, start the rotors, please
 
2014-01-20 08:58:04 PM

skeevy420: not being allowed to use natural/herbal remedies in cases where they'd be better than modern medicine,


And that's when I knew he was an idiot your honour. I'd prefer doctors to do something we, here in the UK, call medicine as opposed to what you're describing which is commonly known as bollocks.
 
Displayed 50 of 57 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report