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(Huffington Post)   NRA backs Florida's expansion of its Stand Your Ground law to include the ability to fire warning shots and not be prosecuted   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 255
    More: Hero, stand your ground, National Rifle Association, Health Insurance Portability, fire warning, Accountability Act, gun permits, George Zimmerman, gun safes  
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1433 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Jan 2014 at 7:20 AM (26 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-20 06:55:52 AM
How is this "heroic", other than in an ironic way?

Warning shots are an utterly stupid farking idea, period. If you are drawing your gun, your life should be in danger enough that it's either you or that person, and you should be doing so with the intention of dropping that person.
 
2014-01-20 06:59:17 AM
If I can't wildly spray my AR-15 into the air at will then the terrorists have won.
 
2014-01-20 07:05:51 AM
I've always thought the warning shot was a nice courtesy.
 
2014-01-20 07:11:45 AM

Nabb1: I've always thought the warning shot was a nice courtesy.


I certainly hope you're being sarcastic. For one, you're not in a warzone.

For two, that bullet's gotta go somewhere. Where are you going to shoot it?
 
2014-01-20 07:13:15 AM
And if the warning shot harms a bystander who had no part in your altercation and may not have even been aware that it was occurring until he or she got shot? Because that's pretty much the entire point of not allowing warning shots...
 
2014-01-20 07:20:11 AM
You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.
 
2014-01-20 07:22:27 AM
You only pull your gun if you intend to shoot.
You only shoot if you intend to kill.

/Lessons over.
 
2014-01-20 07:23:00 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.


I think that the CCW test should be simplified. If your goal is to look like an action movie extra or to carry a hand-cannon in the open at the grocery store, I think that your CCW application should be rejected.

If we got rid of all the Chuck Norris wannabes, the world would be a better place.
 
2014-01-20 07:24:50 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.


Which is ridiculous... they put the level marker for ice right on the side of the cup.
 
2014-01-20 07:24:58 AM
Poor grammar, the NRA, Florida, and a misused Hero tag. It's the perfect derp storm.
 
2014-01-20 07:26:16 AM
 
2014-01-20 07:28:02 AM
That stand your ground bullshiat should be repealed, not expanded. If you want to shoot anyone who looks at you funny, go be a cop. At least then we'll see you coming.
 
2014-01-20 07:28:08 AM
www.screamingpickle.com

Approves
 
2014-01-20 07:28:41 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.


That was a pretty cool scene... but no cops were wounded... remember his display at the end of the minigun sequence?

i44.tinypic.com
 
2014-01-20 07:29:30 AM

Katolu: Poor grammar, the NRA, Florida, and a misused Hero tag. It's the perfect derp storm.


Come for the ironic Hero tag. Stay to read adolescent gun-fetish comments justifying attempted murder.
 
2014-01-20 07:30:22 AM

Mugato: That stand your ground bullshiat should be repealed, not expanded. If you want to shoot anyone who looks at you funny, go be a cop. At least then we'll see you coming.


That is not the purpose of stand your ground, regarless of what you have been told. In Floriduh, it used to be that you had to retreat 3 times before it was legal to defend yourself with a gun in your own home/on your own property.... now THAT is dumb.
 
2014-01-20 07:31:27 AM

Katolu: Poor grammar, the NRA, Florida Floriduh, and a misused Hero tag. It's the perfect derp storm.


/FTFY
 
2014-01-20 07:35:09 AM

hardinparamedic: Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.

I think that the CCW test should be simplified. If your goal is to look like an action movie extra or to carry a hand-cannon in the open at the grocery store, I think that your CCW application should be rejected.

If we got rid of all the Chuck Norris wannabes, the world would be a better place.


I don't think you know what CCW means.
 
2014-01-20 07:35:48 AM

Bigdogdaddy: I don't think you know what CCW means.


In my state, open carry requires a CCW Permit.
 
2014-01-20 07:43:49 AM
As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.
 
2014-01-20 07:44:21 AM

hardinparamedic: Bigdogdaddy: I don't think you know what CCW means.

In my state, open carry requires a CCW Permit.


I'll be darned.  The more you know.  In my state you don't have to have a permit for open carry, even in town.
 
2014-01-20 07:45:13 AM
Gun threads kick off my random quote generator. I show you mine and you show me yours.


From Article 2 Section 2  "The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States"

And Article 1 section 8  "To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;"
 
2014-01-20 07:46:10 AM

Prophet of Loss: [www.screamingpickle.com image 420x444]

Approves


www.biography.com

Seconded
 
2014-01-20 07:46:22 AM

Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.


I'd rather not having neighbors shooting bullets into my house to warn someone.
 
Rat
2014-01-20 07:48:38 AM
I always thought the first warning shot should be center mass.

 
2014-01-20 07:49:25 AM

HindiDiscoMonster: Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.

That was a pretty cool scene... but no cops were wounded... remember his display at the end of the minigun sequence?

[i44.tinypic.com image 637x265]


You do understand what the word "casualties" means right?
 
2014-01-20 07:49:38 AM

Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.


That's a situation that only exists in the middle of the countryside, when alone. Which is an odd place to need to fire a warning shot.
 
2014-01-20 07:49:43 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.


Actually, whipping it out would probably be an excellent way to defuse a potentially violent situation. Mugger wants your wallet? Whip your dick out. Kid in a hoodie makes you uncomfortable? Whip your dick out. It's a complete nonsequiter that changes the tone of the engagement  instantly.
 
2014-01-20 07:51:08 AM

Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.


Anyone got statistics on how many gun fatalities are from harmless shots in the air?
 
2014-01-20 07:54:31 AM

Polish Brainiac: but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it..


If you can fire a perfectly vertical shot, then yes, the bullet will go up, lose momentum, and tumble harmlessly to the Earth. If, however, the elevation is even just a few degrees from vertical, that bullet will return to Earth carrying most of the kinetic energy it had when you fired it (which is why celebrations involving firing guns into the air tend to result in casualties a mile or two away).

Firearms should only ever be discharged in the direction of things that can stop bullets. In the case of a self-defense situation, that should be the target which you are defending yourself from. Anything else is movie power-fantasy (well, the "good guy with a gun" is movie power-fantasy, but this is even more fantasy).
 
2014-01-20 07:55:18 AM

shamanwest: Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.

Anyone got statistics on how many gun fatalities are from harmless shots in the air?


If New Yorkers were allowed to conceal carry, 9/11 might have been prevented. Those rooftops are excellent AA positions.
 
2014-01-20 07:55:24 AM

Bungles: Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.

That's a situation that only exists in the middle of the countryside, when alone. Which is an odd place to need to fire a warning shot.


Farking sign looked at me funny, so I done took a warning shot at it. Then had to stand mah ground agin it.

www.horizonsunlimited.com
 
2014-01-20 07:55:38 AM
If you are already pulling out your gun aren't you the one threatening the other person thus causing THEM to Stand Their Ground?
 
2014-01-20 07:56:33 AM

Bigdogdaddy: hardinparamedic: Bigdogdaddy: I don't think you know what CCW means.

In my state, open carry requires a CCW Permit.

I'll be darned.  The more you know.  In my state you don't have to have a permit for open carry, even in town.


Varies from state to state.  For example in Virgina, you need a permit to carry concealed, but no permit to carry openly AND you can carry openly in a bar/place that serves alcohol.  But you can't carry concealed in a place that serves alcohol.

shamanwest: Anyone got statistics on how many gun fatalities are from harmless shots in the air?


If there's a fatality, it's hardly harmless now is it?

Gotta ask; are you seriously trying to imply that no one ever dies from errant shots?  Do you also want to repeal any prohibition on firing a weapon inside a city?
 
2014-01-20 07:58:07 AM

hardinparamedic: Bigdogdaddy: I don't think you know what CCW means.

In my state, open carry requires a CCW Permit.


I don't think your legeslators know what CCW means.

Concealed Carry permit to carry open...

howdoyousaytacoinspanish.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-01-20 07:59:01 AM

Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.


you do know that things that go up do come down right?
 
2014-01-20 07:59:05 AM

shamanwest: Polish Brainiac: As someone who thinks SYG is an absolute abomination, I have no problem with warning shots. In fact, a warning shot is a PERFECT display that you are the proverbial "Good Guy with a Gun."
It's the idea that you can fire your weapon AT somebody when you think you might possibly feel threatened is what made SYG a failure imho, but if you're firing into the air harmlessly just to display you're capable of it...go ahead, but don't wake too many neighbors, one of whom might feel threatened enough to not take a warning shot at you, which SYG still tragically allows.

Anyone got statistics on how many gun fatalities are from harmless shots in the air?


There are statistics from celebratory gunfire, which I imagine is not a radically different "chance of injury" statistic..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celebratory_gunfire

It appears that the US injuries and deaths from celebratory "harmless" gunfire alone is greater than the total firearm deaths in most European countries (Puerto Rico alone is 27 a year, LA had 118 injuries and and 38 fatalities in a 7 year period)
 
2014-01-20 07:59:52 AM
... given that brandishing (aka "waving your gun around", though it can actually include just revealing a holstered weapon intentionally) is considered assault in 50 of 50 states and also the feds (for what federal input is worth)... I'm thinking that actually discharging your firearm like a dumb-shiat isn't going to be making it into the "legal" category anytime soon.

On a more practical note, ask basically anyone that actually does  anything with a gun, hunting, target shooting, whatever, about "warning shots".  You'll immediately be told that you're a farking moron, and the gun should not be pointed anywhere but the ground unless you actually intend to shoot something, and then it should only be pointed at  waht you intend to shoot.  Even a handgun bullet fired in a random direction can go for  miles before hitting something that stops it, and that something's as likely to be some innocent bystander as anything else.  And penetration depths for even handgun bullets are most easily expressed in  feet, so "there was a wall in the way" is not a backstop, a bullet can go through a lot of masonry before it'll stop moving.

So unless you're firing your "warning shots" directly down between your own feet, your'e a direct danger to everyone around you.  And even then, firing a shot in a potential fire-fight is more properly known as "starting a fire-fight" because once your dumb ass pulls that trigger they pretty much  have to shoot back.

// Stand your ground is usually much more limited, there has to be an actual crime in progress that you're preventing for it to apply and if it's something kind of open-ended like assault the burden of proof is very much on the shooter... and even then, you're not allowed to shoot people once they disengage and so on.  I'm not sure what the fark Florida's problem is that SYG has become an actual source of grey area instead of resolving an existing grey area.
 
2014-01-20 08:00:18 AM

Princess Ryans Knickers: HindiDiscoMonster: Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

If you carry a gun because you want to wave it around at the guy ahead of you who's taking too long to get the ice-to-cup ratio correct at the Mountain Dew machine then the gun you carry should be loaded with nothing more dangerous than your impotent tears of rage.

If you've jerked off to the scene in T2 where Arnold uses a minigun to shoot to wound dozens of cops so many times your hand has a groove so deep Bootsy Collins couldn't play it, then your dong is all you should be allowed to pull in a crisis.

That was a pretty cool scene... but no cops were wounded... remember his display at the end of the minigun sequence?

[i44.tinypic.com image 637x265]

You do understand what the word "casualties" means right?


someone who is casual? :P
 
2014-01-20 08:00:39 AM
You know, I just don't see myself ever vacationing in Florida again. It's not that I'm offended by their gun laws. Heck. I'm pro-2nd Amendment.

It's that I now know, thanks to the Zimmerman trial, that murder is actually legal there. According to Florida's SYG, it is now permissible to walk up to someone while carrying a loaded handgun, start a fistfight with him, then kill him when he fights back.
 
2014-01-20 08:00:59 AM

Princess Ryans Knickers: If you are already pulling out your gun aren't you the one threatening the other person thus causing THEM to Stand Their Ground?


Don't try to insert your liberal, commie thoughts into muh freedumz
 
2014-01-20 08:01:13 AM

Princess Ryans Knickers: If you are already pulling out your gun aren't you the one threatening the other person thus causing THEM to Stand Their Ground?


I suspect you're being sarcastic, but that's a criticism/problem of stand your ground laws.  The danger of just legalizing gun fights that no one is responsible for, especially for hotheads/wannabe tough guys starting trouble.
 
2014-01-20 08:02:24 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.


HindiDiscoMonster: You only pull your gun if you intend to shoot.
You only shoot if you intend to kill.

/Lessons over.


So you can't just shoot someone in the leg to put them out of commission?
 
2014-01-20 08:02:39 AM
Well, in those rare instances when my openly carried Sig Sauer P226 didn't instill fear and respect into someone at Starbucks unhappy with my inordinately long coffee order or the movies where I might be assaulted by popcorn, a warning shot would be necessary. I'll never know when I might be threatened on the streets.
 
2014-01-20 08:03:35 AM
www.aeterna.nl
 
2014-01-20 08:04:00 AM

Mugato: Mr. Coffee Nerves: You don't pull the gun unless you intend to aim it at someone who is directly threatening your life or the life of another. You don't aim it at that someone unless you intend to shoot. You don't shoot unless you intend to kill. Period.

HindiDiscoMonster: You only pull your gun if you intend to shoot.
You only shoot if you intend to kill.

/Lessons over.

So you can't just shoot someone in the leg to put them out of commission?


not unless you want to be sued in civil court for the hospital bill.... they will win btw.
 
2014-01-20 08:04:08 AM

shamanwest:
Anyone got statistics on how many gun fatalities are from harmless shots in the air?


I don't, but if you fire it straight up, you are extremely unlikely to kill anyone, even if you hit them in the head. The projectile is going to free fall with a terminal velocity below what is needed to crack a human skull.
 
2014-01-20 08:05:15 AM

hardinparamedic: Nabb1: I've always thought the warning shot was a nice courtesy.

I certainly hope you're being sarcastic. For one, you're not in a warzone.

For two, that bullet's gotta go somewhere. Where are you going to shoot it?


I guess you have to make a quick judgment call on that. You'd rather someone get killed if it could be avoided? I think if you can fire a shiat into the dirt, give it a try.
 
2014-01-20 08:06:00 AM
Well, it's about time we took out the ineffectual "responsible" from the label of "responsible gun owner" at this point, as that restricts my freedoms.
 
2014-01-20 08:06:01 AM
Shot, not shiat. LOL.
 
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