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(New York Daily News)   Mayor of Hoboken, who accused Chris Christie of extorting her in order to get Hoboken Sandy aid funds, releases pages of her diary proving she isn't making this up. Most important takeaway? This mayor has the penmanship of a 4 year old   (nydailynews.com) divider line 199
    More: Fail, Hoboken Sandy, Chris Christie, Hurricane Sandy, hoboken, New Jersey, Secretary of Homeland Security, Homeland Security Janet Napolitano, Gov. Kim Guadagno  
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3374 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Jan 2014 at 3:15 AM (34 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-19 09:37:04 PM
That is pretty grim.
 
2014-01-19 09:40:56 PM
First off:

"Mayer?" Hoboken has it's own John Mayer?

Second: Firefox apparently thinks "Hoboken" isn't a word.

Finally: Diary entries...?
 
2014-01-19 09:48:52 PM
Dear Diary, 

Who still keeps a diary?
 
2014-01-19 09:56:03 PM
Hoboken? Ooooohhhhhh I'm dyyyin!
 
2014-01-19 10:25:50 PM
This mayor has the penmanship of a 4 year old


Oooooooooh.  That's a whole lot worse than being an extortionist.
 
2014-01-19 10:58:31 PM
When I write stuff down, the most important thing is that I write fast enough to get my thoughts out before they fall out my ears and onto the floor. I don't give a shiat about penmanship as long as I can read it.
 
2014-01-19 11:04:28 PM
That looks like something written by someone in week four of their winter stay at the Overlook Hotel.
 
2014-01-19 11:19:42 PM
fta "I'm coming forward. I'm sharing my story directly ... I'm sharing my journal. I'm offering to testify under oath. What are they doing? They're hiding behind spokespeople," Zimmer said on CNN.

Joke's on you, Mayor Zimmer. Everybody knows integrity is based on penmanship.
 
2014-01-19 11:50:01 PM
My leadership, everyone!

/didn't vote this election
//recently moved to Hoboken and wasn't registered on time
 
2014-01-19 11:51:16 PM
Of course it's sloppy.   She had to finish it before the press conference.   It's hard to be neat when you have a deadline.
 
2014-01-19 11:58:58 PM
A four year old, or a doctor?
 
2014-01-20 12:00:37 AM
I'll bet her blog sucks too.
 
2014-01-20 12:00:51 AM
Her handwriting is legible-ish.  The fact that she apparently wrote it while standing on a ladder using a comically oversized novelty pen is a different issue
 
2014-01-20 12:02:37 AM
Hoboken Mayor Dawn Zimmer expressed disappointment with Chris Christie, including one that read, 'I thought he was honest. I thought he was moral. I thought he was something different.'

Welcome to  Fark New Jersey politics.
 
2014-01-20 12:12:36 AM

JerseyTim: That looks like something written by someone in week four of their winter stay at the Overlook Hotel.


Overlook Hotel vs. Hoboken. Discuss.
 
2014-01-20 12:18:47 AM
"Zimmer said she met for hours this afternoon with staff from the U.S. Attorney's Office in Newark, providing a copy of her daily journal and other documents. Zimmer, who leveled the bombshell allegation on Saturday, said the meeting was requested by prosecutors." Link

She's also offered to take a lie detector test, and challenged the Lt. Gov and Commissioner to do the same.
 
2014-01-20 12:20:24 AM

Dusk-You-n-Me: "Zimmer said she met for hours this afternoon with staff from the U.S. Attorney's Office in Newark, providing a copy of her daily journal and other documents. Zimmer, who leveled the bombshell allegation on Saturday, said the meeting was requested by prosecutors." Link

She's also offered to take a lie detector test, and challenged the Lt. Gov and Commissioner to do the same.


Even if she's nuts, itll be entertaining as hell.
 
2014-01-20 12:34:46 AM
Because it's impossible to make up hand-written diary entries. I'm not suggesting that Mayor Zimmer is lying, but this evidence is not really convincing of anything.
 
2014-01-20 12:37:19 AM

quatchi: Hoboken Mayor Dawn Zimmer expressed disappointment with Chris Christie, including one that read, 'I thought he was honest. I thought he was moral. I thought he was something different.'

Welcome to  Fark New Jersey politics.


FTFY
 
2014-01-20 12:44:04 AM

nmrsnr: Because it's impossible to make up hand-written diary entries. I'm not suggesting that Mayor Zimmer is lying, but this evidence is not really convincing of anything.


No way man, one page is stained with a flavor of Kool-aid you TOTALLY can't get anymore.
 
2014-01-20 12:48:55 AM
The problem with releasing handwritten materials in your own writing is obviously authenticating their production during the claimed timeline. It would only be as credible as the person making the accusation. I'm not saying the mayor isn't credible--but rather taking these pages (barring some scientific testing I'm unaware of) as evidence of her credibility is at best putting the cart before the horse. The pages I've seen don't authenticate her in the way that trackable email records or even a secretly recorded conversation would, for instance. They don't add to her believability--they are dependent on it.
 
2014-01-20 12:49:23 AM

nmrsnr: Because it's impossible to make up hand-written diary entries. I'm not suggesting that Mayor Zimmer is lying, but this evidence is not really convincing of anything.


It really depends on context. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real. On the other hand, if these pages are in a separate folder, and she doesn't keep a diary regularly, then yes, its more suspect.

That being said, she's openly said she'll take a lie detector test and testify about it under oath. So either this is real, or Ms. Zimmer is the craziest, and most brazenly lying, public official since this dude:

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2014-01-20 12:50:21 AM

Somacandra: The problem with releasing handwritten materials in your own writing is obviously authenticating their production during the claimed timeline. It would only be as credible as the person making the accusation. I'm not saying the mayor isn't credible--but rather taking these pages (barring some scientific testing I'm unaware of) as evidence of her credibility is at best putting the cart before the horse. The pages I've seen don't authenticate her in the way that trackable email records or even a secretly recorded conversation would, for instance. They don't add to her believability--they are dependent on it.


Like I said above, it seems pretty easy to determine legitimacy from context here. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real. On the other hand, if these pages are in a separate folder, and she doesn't keep a diary regularly, then yes, its more suspect.
 
2014-01-20 12:51:16 AM
 Christie's camp has noted that Zimmer publicly praised the governor in the past after the alleged threats were made.

this is supposed to cast doubt that a threat was made?
 
2014-01-20 12:54:43 AM
Well, Christie, where's her money? That'll clear this up right quick.

/we're waiting...
 
2014-01-20 12:55:44 AM

DamnYankees: It really depends on context. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real. On the other hand, if these pages are in a separate folder, and she doesn't keep a diary regularly, then yes, its more suspect.


Even in that case, it's not hard to take the real diary and copy it over, but with new entries, or to fabricate based on memory and email exchanges a diary that covers the desired dates. It's more work than I think someone would go through just to make Christie look bad, but it's absolutely within the realm of possibility, so it's just not credible evidence. I actually believe her, but this journal doesn't make me believe her any more or less than I did before.
 
2014-01-20 12:58:50 AM

nmrsnr: DamnYankees: It really depends on context. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real. On the other hand, if these pages are in a separate folder, and she doesn't keep a diary regularly, then yes, its more suspect.

Even in that case, it's not hard to take the real diary and copy it over, but with new entries, or to fabricate based on memory and email exchanges a diary that covers the desired dates. It's more work than I think someone would go through just to make Christie look bad, but it's absolutely within the realm of possibility, so it's just not credible evidence. I actually believe her, but this journal doesn't make me believe her any more or less than I did before.


Yeah, like I said. It's either real, or this woman is completely insane. Absent some evidence she's farking nuts, I'm not sure why we'd think she did what you're describing.
 
2014-01-20 01:07:47 AM
It's not so much that I'm concerned by the appearance of her diary entries... I'm entertained with the thought of her writing them. Almost like an SNL skit involving Cheri Oteri on crack portraying the mayer [sic] keeping a diary.
 
2014-01-20 01:09:32 AM

DamnYankees: nmrsnr: DamnYankees: It really depends on context. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real. On the other hand, if these pages are in a separate folder, and she doesn't keep a diary regularly, then yes, its more suspect.

Even in that case, it's not hard to take the real diary and copy it over, but with new entries, or to fabricate based on memory and email exchanges a diary that covers the desired dates. It's more work than I think someone would go through just to make Christie look bad, but it's absolutely within the realm of possibility, so it's just not credible evidence. I actually believe her, but this journal doesn't make me believe her any more or less than I did before.

Yeah, like I said. It's either real, or this woman is completely insane. Absent some evidence she's farking nuts, I'm not sure why we'd think she did what you're describing.


Speculation can be fun, but it's unbelievably unlikely.  If she were going to do something like copying over an entire diary, she might as well cut together snippets from Christie recordings and say it's him on a phone call.  That kind of crap only happens in fiction.  People don't go to that kind of trouble to manufacture evidence that isn't a slam dunk.
 
2014-01-20 01:10:05 AM
Well...that's pretty damning.

The allegations are pretty bad, too.
 
2014-01-20 01:33:03 AM

DamnYankees: it seems pretty easy to determine legitimacy from context here. Does Zimmer keep a diary every day, and these pages are in the place they are supposed to be and consistent with the rest of her diary? If so, it seems pretty farking likely its real.


I don't find this helpful actually. Lots of people keep diaries but that are event-driven, not time-driven. How long does a person need to keep a diary to be convincing--is it a sliding scale of believability depending on if she started before or after becoming mayor? The minutiae of assessment bogs down a determination of relative credibility. I just don't think its as cut and dried as you're suggesting. It would not be difficult to produce a large apparent volume of backdated writings in a short period of time given her writing style and choice of paper. This scandal business seems to have been going on for months in itself in terms of local coverage--plenty of time to create a cache of material. Maybe investigators have some quantitative way of determining authenticity. I hope so. Without some stronger tie-in or evidence that could not have been post-constructed, this just isn't a smoking gun. Of course the way things are going there may not need to be one of those at all.
 
2014-01-20 01:35:34 AM
But Benghazi and like such as.
 
2014-01-20 01:37:48 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: People don't go to that kind of trouble to manufacture evidence that isn't a slam dunk.


i.imgur.com

upload.wikimedia.org

They do when it serves their purposes to do so. But this is all academic. I'm sure the investigators will do their job. They've probably seen tons of shiat we're not privy too. But seriously--people can and do make up elaborate shiat.
 
2014-01-20 01:44:15 AM
At first, I thought it was damning. But quite frankly, who keeps a journal in such a small notebook?

I thought it would be a classier bound book. Or at least a regular sized notebook- not one that you keep a shopping list.
 
2014-01-20 01:45:07 AM
If I'm trying to write something down while I'm driving that's pretty much how it looks.
 
2014-01-20 01:48:14 AM

Darth_Lukecash: At first, I thought it was damning. But quite frankly, who keeps a journal in such a small notebook? I thought it would be a classier bound book. Or at least a regular sized notebook- not one that you keep a shopping list.



i.imgur.com

/going to bed now before I get in any more trouble
 
2014-01-20 02:05:03 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: quatchi: Hoboken Mayor Dawn Zimmer expressed disappointment with Chris Christie, including one that read, 'I thought he was honest. I thought he was moral. I thought he was something different.'

Welcome to  Fark New Jersey politics.

FTFY


Fix cheerfully accepted.
 
2014-01-20 02:05:10 AM
encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com
 
2014-01-20 02:17:29 AM
Oh, no no. That's just sloppy, not childlike. The stuff my old boss used to write... it was in crooked-block form, like a kindergartener; the man was 55.  This woman's stuff is the likes of Button Gwinnett's signature, comparatively.
 
2014-01-20 02:56:46 AM
New Jersey, so entertaining. What would this country do without you, huh? HUH?

*head knuckle rub*
 
2014-01-20 03:21:29 AM
It's pretty clear what he means by "it will flow"

Please tell me I'm reading that correctly
 
2014-01-20 03:25:05 AM
What kind of proof is her own diary?
 
2014-01-20 03:27:59 AM

unamused: This mayor has the penmanship of a 4 year old


Oooooooooh.  That's a whole lot worse than being an extortionist.


Came to say something along these lines.


And yea, yea. Hate on NJ all you want. Your cries of displeasure amuse us.
 
2014-01-20 03:33:16 AM
I always keep handwritten notes of any meeting where anything that is discussed could result in some sort of dispute.

Of course, more formal and shared minutes are better, but I remember being advised that handwritten comtemporaneous  notes are always weighted more heavily in dispute resolution than any verbal account.  This has come in handy for me more than once.

I date my notes, and sometimes record who is there.

The requirement for 'verification' of the notes' authenticity is pretty low.  I would imagine in most cases swearing under oath is enough.  Don't believe what you see on CSI.
 
2014-01-20 03:52:12 AM

zamboni: It's not so much that I'm concerned by the appearance of her diary entries... I'm entertained with the thought of her writing them. Almost like an SNL skit involving Cheri Oteri on crack portraying the mayer [sic] keeping a diary.


www.thegridto.com
 
2014-01-20 03:56:13 AM
I would like to show some pages from my diary, which prove I was telling the truth when I said I was the real assassin of President Abraham Lincoln. Here is a scan of the relevant page of my diary:

aheckofa.com
 
2014-01-20 03:59:19 AM
[sarcasm]

Gee, isn't it amazing that she waited to present this damning evidence until AFTER the bridge scandal and Christie's office was already facing scrutiny? Gee, I wonder howcome she didn't actually tell anyone about this when it happened, or any time since then? The timing is truly remarkable!

[/end sarcasm]

If her fears really are that "nobody would believe her" it's pretty easy to prove without reliance on a poorly written diary: show the request for funds which Hoboken was entitled to, and the denial of said funds from Christie's office, with dates. That's all, because the money wasn't state money, it was Federal money, and Christie's office would have had to account for any holds or refusals to FEMA.

So all the Mayor needs is a sheet of paper that says: May 15, requested $1.7 Million; May 18 received $250K. May 20 asked where remainder was. May 25 told funds were "pending." Then let Christie explain what the "pending" was all about. Otherwise, she sounds like a woman who waited until her secret lover was involved in a messy public divorce before appearing with some random child suing for 15 years of "child support." Yeah, of COURSE nobody is going to believe you, honey.

And if anyone (including her) trots out her fears of being merely a woman, or Christie's bullying nature or whatever: She's Mayor. This is politics. She can't play in the big boys' arena, she needs to get out. Sorry.
 
2014-01-20 04:01:34 AM
She looks just like Bobby Jindal with a wig. Really she does.
 
2014-01-20 04:14:14 AM
i1.cpcache.com

You know who else also kept a diary?
 
2014-01-20 04:19:57 AM
eh, my grandma was a cpa and a notary for 60 years. wrote mostly in shorthand, and her regular penmanship looks a lot like this
 
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