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(CNN)   Maryland mom performs exorcism on her children, succeeds in releasing their trapped souls   (cnn.com) divider line 103
    More: Fail, woman charged, Montgomery County Police  
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12800 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Jan 2014 at 4:05 PM (44 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-19 04:19:35 PM  
13 votes:

Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.


Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.
2014-01-19 04:07:35 PM  
10 votes:
Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.
2014-01-19 04:18:59 PM  
8 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


The moon doesn't actively encourage this behavior.  Some religious sects do.
2014-01-19 04:36:53 PM  
7 votes:

Mister Peejay: skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?

While it is true that religion was the medium, it's even more true that there are billions of people who manage to avoid killing their children because of it.

So:  Yes, biatch be crazy.


That makes for a couple of kidnappings and these two murders over the last year because of exorcisms, I don't recall any because of the moon.

Yes biatches be crazy but religion encouraged the crazy rather than suggesting maybe some counseling and medication for it. My otherwise totally sane mother was worried about me "inviting evil spirits to take over [my] body" by using a Ouija board I bought in high school to use for laughs with my stoner buddies. She was intelligent and college educated, ran the family business and was the director of religious education program for a 2000 member catholic church.

Religion convinced her evil faries could control me. That's how stupid religion makes you.
2014-01-19 04:53:51 PM  
6 votes:
My mother was (and probably still is) a born again evangelical. She burned Beatles records and blessed my bedroom with holy water on a regular basis. She used to corner me when I got home and rub some holy water on my forehead in an effort to release the demons.

She got these ideas from the church she dragged me to and the radio programs she listened to. So don't tell me religion played no part in this. As soon as you start believing in things without proof it becomes so much easier to convince you to do anything based on those beliefs.

Idiots who believe in demons are on par if not worse than flat earthers.
2014-01-19 04:49:47 PM  
6 votes:
God tells you to sacrifice your child in 4000BC: You get your story in the Bible.
God tells you to sacrifice you child in 2014 AD: OMG, you are a criminal!

/Apparently, the only difference between a saint and a psychotic is a few millennia.
2014-01-19 06:36:24 PM  
5 votes:

i1089.photobucket.com

2014-01-19 05:36:55 PM  
5 votes:
Those of you in the thread insisting that religion had no part in this... well...

RELIGION HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THIS!

Seriously... just because you don't like that religion had everything to do with this, doesn't absolve religion from playing a major role in this. Atheist people don't attempt to excise demons from their children by stabbing them (and who knows what else those poor children had to endure). Religious people did that. Take the religion out of these people's lives and this event doesn't occur. Put the religion in and these two dipshiats kill some kids.


Try as you might, you'll never make this just a "crazy person" event. This is a RELIGIOUS crazy person event. Are all religious people completely nuts? No. Are they a little nuts for believing in religion? Probably a little.
2014-01-19 05:28:02 PM  
5 votes:

kwame: Magruda: kwame: I feel bad for your experience. I feel worse that it left you so incredibly small-minded.

Small minded does not mean "lends no credence to insanity".

Not sure what you think you're saying. Your mother was insane. If she didn't use religion as a catalyst, it would have been aliens or the government or fluoride in the water. Quit blaming something that was in no way the cause of your treatment.


I don't remember any local organization teaching the ways of aliens. There was a whole group of people willing to give her advice and tell her that her actions were correct. Just look at the defense you are offering to her delusions.
2014-01-19 05:20:58 PM  
5 votes:

wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.


The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.
2014-01-19 04:12:49 PM  
5 votes:
All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?
2014-01-19 05:49:09 PM  
4 votes:

MechaPyx: Religion didn't cause this any more than video games(or music or movies or books) make people into violent, depraved killers. Whatever these people were involved in merely gave them a framework for their actions but they were fundamentally broken in some way before they found an outlet for their crazy bullshiat.


I have yet to play a video game which actually told you to go out into the real world and perform any action other than buy the sequel. Religion on the other hand asks you to go do things.
2014-01-19 05:18:32 PM  
4 votes:

Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.


And there is no mental illness more untreated than the one called "religion".
2014-01-19 05:08:22 PM  
4 votes:

BorgiaGinz: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.


See also:  Natural disasters are caused by the actions of those that they disagree with.
2014-01-19 05:01:54 PM  
4 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


But religion does give crazies something to hide behind and not get the treatment they need. If a person says they are talking with the moon it would raise flags. Person says they talk with god every night, and we just say they are a good christian.
2014-01-19 04:28:20 PM  
4 votes:
And yet some people will say she was still a more fit mother than a same sex couple.

/let's throw some politics fuel onto this
//because why not?
2014-01-19 06:44:17 PM  
3 votes:

MechaPyx: So we should get rid of religion because it gives people ideas?


I'm not suggesting that we "get rid of religion". I don't want to take it away from people... I would prefer that people give up religion on their own. I would like people to come to grips with how toxic religion has been for society in the past and continues to be today.

I'm fully aware that people won't give it up... they're too entrenched in it. They like to believe that they're going to see their dead grandparents/mom/dad/sister/brother again in some perfect afterlife. They love their 'beautiful lies' too much to give them up. Heck, you, as an example, seem to love religion so much that you're unwilling to accept that it leads some people to do horrific things at all.

So in short, I don't want to take away your toys... I want you to grow beyond the need for them.
2014-01-19 06:22:53 PM  
3 votes:
god is a delusion

religion is a mental illness
2014-01-19 06:09:14 PM  
3 votes:

wademh: But the anti-religious camp also pretends they are champions of rationality and so are not just trapped by hypocritically  trapped.


It simply makes no sense to believe in something without empirical evidence to back it up.
2014-01-19 06:02:21 PM  
3 votes:

Lee451: Atheism was good enough for Karl Marx, Joe Stalin and Vlad Lenin it should be good enough for all of us!


Considering the number of horrible people who have ever existed in this world if you can only come up with three that were atheists and conversely the rest must be theists, then i don't think you are helping your point.
2014-01-19 05:52:09 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: kwame: Magruda: kwame: you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness

You seem to think that factual belief in religion is not a mental illness.

What I think is irrelevant. You're coming across as fanatical and single-minded as your mother at this point. Good luck, dude.

He has an excuse for it. You're just trying to stir sh*t up. Find someone else, kid.


Did you forget to switch logins?
2014-01-19 05:46:30 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: You're coming across as fanatical and single-minded as your mother at this point.



fa·nat·i·cal
fəˈnatikəl/
adjective
1filled with excessive and single-minded zeal.

Don't try to label me because you are having difficulty in expressing your ideals in a logical manner.
2014-01-19 05:43:38 PM  
3 votes:

wademh: Magruda: wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.

The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.

Which church? And which interpretation of scripture?
Logically, the rarity of such events tells us that this is not a major or common effect of religion. It's a longer argument, and I don't play it out here, but some people are organically mentally ill to begin with. They seek out rather non-conventional fellow travelors such as the cultish variants of born-again evangelicals you referred to. Making a blanket condemnation of religion in general based on specifics that are rare is illogical. Nothing this is not a defense of religion, nor an claim of virtue within religion. Interpreting my comments that way would be evidence of dichotomous thinking, black or white thinking, with me or against me thinking, which is a form of illogic that is sometimes fostered within some religions. But of course it is not common to all religions, some of which even encourage subtlety of thought.


Starting with what i was exposed to and then working my way back to sanity, i found that the only thing that makes sense is that the question of an infinite god is unknowable. Anyone who claims to know the will of god is either insane or a charlatan. I place belief in charlatans as a mental illness.
2014-01-19 05:37:40 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness


You seem to think that factual belief in religion is not a mental illness.
2014-01-19 05:30:44 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: Magruda: wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.

The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.

"The church?"

Bless your heart.


Yes, "The church" she attended, backed up by the 700 club. Quit defending lunacy.
2014-01-19 05:28:36 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: Magruda: kwame: I feel bad for your experience. I feel worse that it left you so incredibly small-minded.

Small minded does not mean "lends no credence to insanity".

Not sure what you think you're saying. Your mother was insane. If she didn't use religion as a catalyst, it would have been aliens or the government or fluoride in the water. Quit blaming something that was in no way the cause of your treatment.


Religion lends itself well to insanity, though, for some reason.

Maybe because belief in things that have no basis in reality is madness.
2014-01-19 05:18:10 PM  
3 votes:

kwame: I feel bad for your experience. I feel worse that it left you so incredibly small-minded.


Small minded does not mean "lends no credence to insanity".
2014-01-19 04:24:42 PM  
3 votes:
Twenty years ago, I would have asked myself, "what primitive, third-world country did THIS happen in?"
2014-01-19 09:42:03 PM  
2 votes:

PsiChick: BorgiaGinz: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.

No, that's a specific subset of Christian fundies. That is not representative of all or even most religious people even in the US, let alone the world. Get your facts right, please.


Oh? Let's see... Polls seem to say:
- 77% of American adults believe in angels
- 63% of Americans believe in demonic possession
- 79% of Americans believe in miracles
- tough to find polls on Glossalia, but this NYT piece says 18% of Americans spoke in tongues in 2012
- 77% of Americans believe in the power of prayer

Damn pesky facts making religion look crazy again. :-/
2014-01-19 07:33:56 PM  
2 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


Just about every single religion has some form of demon. Eastern, Western, you name it demons, evil spirits, possession, it's all in the realm of religion. Atheism has no demons. So suggesting that you can't blame religion for something that appears exclusively in religion shows your personal bias, not anyone else's.

That said, ya the major component here was the crazy.
2014-01-19 06:28:59 PM  
2 votes:
So... exactly which religion's exorcism procedure calls for multiple stabbings? Not that I'm any kind of expert, but that's a new one for me!
2014-01-19 06:00:59 PM  
2 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


She used religion as an excuse for her delusions, and religion was all too willing to help empower them.

So yeah, F*CK religion for empowering the crazies.

l3.yimg.com
2014-01-19 05:54:17 PM  
2 votes:

kwame: kwame: Magruda: kwame: you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness

You seem to think that factual belief in religion is not a mental illness.

What I think is irrelevant. You're coming across as fanatical and single-minded as your mother at this point. Good luck, dude.

He has an excuse for it. You're just trying to stir sh*t up. Find someone else, kid.


This would be another example of insanity.
2014-01-19 05:48:14 PM  
2 votes:

MechaPyx: Whatever these people were involved in Religionmerely gave them a framework for their actions but they were fundamentally broken in some way before they found an outlet for their crazy bullshiat.


You can stop pretending not to know what gave them their framework for their actions now...
2014-01-19 05:43:26 PM  
2 votes:

kwame: Magruda: kwame: you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness

You seem to think that factual belief in religion is not a mental illness.

What I think is irrelevant. You're coming across as fanatical and single-minded as your mother at this point. Good luck, dude.


No isn't. You, on the other hand... are. Maybe you ought to just accept that you've said stupid things in a fark thread and just stop saying more stupid things in a fark thread. You're only embarrassing yourself...
2014-01-19 05:27:45 PM  
2 votes:

IlGreven: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

And there is no mental illness more untreated than the one called "religion".


While quipy, and it fits on a bumper sticker, your comment is semantically unsound, and that's rather ironic in somebody trying to say something about mental illness.  A sane person is supposed to experience cognitive dissonance when they construct an irrational thought.
2014-01-19 05:12:57 PM  
2 votes:

Magruda: My mother was (and probably still is) a born again evangelical. She burned Beatles records and blessed my bedroom with holy water on a regular basis. She used to corner me when I got home and rub some holy water on my forehead in an effort to release the demons.

She got these ideas from the church she dragged me to and the radio programs she listened to. So don't tell me religion played no part in this. As soon as you start believing in things without proof it becomes so much easier to convince you to do anything based on those beliefs.

Idiots who believe in demons are on par if not worse than flat earthers.


Religion has almost nothing to do with this. Many followers of religions don't act like the psychotic idiot you portray your mother to be. However, psychotic idiots find excuses, and because religious leaders are so ubiquitous, psychotic people often find religious leaders to assist in their insanity. But religious beliefs are not the cause. What they are is an conduit for extremism based on pre-existing mental defects.
2014-01-19 05:06:56 PM  
2 votes:

kwame: Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?

Probably. But it's irrelevant to this story.


Actually no it isn't, if she weren't in whatever religion she is in this would never have come up, exorcism is a religious practice! Comment fail.
2014-01-19 04:44:09 PM  
2 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


images1.wikia.nocookie.net
2014-01-19 04:35:04 PM  
2 votes:

Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.



If you can fix that in the USA, then you can probably pass out AK-47's on every corner to everyone that walks by and the only related deaths will be cleaning accidents.

But fixing how we treat mental illness in this country will make fixing the healthcare industry seem like a nice relaxing sunday drive.
2014-01-19 04:29:10 PM  
2 votes:

kwame: Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?

Probably. But it's irrelevant to this story.


Not when she inevitably claims that the government has no right to prosecute her because she was exercising her religious beliefs.
2014-01-19 04:28:25 PM  
2 votes:

kwame: Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?

Probably. But it's irrelevant to this story.


Yeah. If a priest does it, he's a hero. If a mom does it, she's crazy.

It all comes down to the penis and collar.
2014-01-19 04:26:00 PM  
2 votes:

Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?


Probably. But it's irrelevant to this story.
2014-01-19 04:17:28 PM  
2 votes:
Children ARE evil.  I am surprised more parents do not follow this lead.

Hero tag should have been used.  Haters are going to blast me, but this lady, like Susan Smith before her were wise in how to handle worthless crotch spawn.

(No WIC, quieter restaurants and less crowding in our schools - it is a win all around)
2014-01-19 04:14:35 PM  
2 votes:
Weird, there's no mention of which religion these people believed themselves yo be practicing. I suspect if it had been - Zoroastrianism, or Satanism say - it would have been in the lede.
2014-01-19 04:13:31 PM  
2 votes:
wait, my comment from a redlit thread was reworded and submitted as a headline?

Unpossible!
2014-01-19 04:09:23 PM  
2 votes:
1.bp.blogspot.com

"Feel the burn."

i.ytimg.com

"Good, Dory."
2014-01-20 04:33:50 AM  
1 votes:

wademh: You're using phrases and terms from a rational discussion of epistemology but you're not quite getting them correct. This last example of you confusing what circular reasoning is is the grossest example. There's no requirement for a naturalistic mechanism to qualify as empirically valid. We don't even have a mechanism for gravity. Ponder that child. Maybe by the next thread you'll have upped your game.


And perhaps you will have gotten past the childishly misanthropic idea that agnosticism is somehow a middle ground between belief and non-belief.  If you were more intelligent, we might have managed to get to the meat of your argument, but unfortunately you couldn't get past the enormous flaws in your premises.

I'll reiterate that if your hypothesis regarding your personal unfounded beliefs being an accurate predictor of reality is any indication of your scientific prowess, I genuinely hope that you're not researching anything important as a scientist.
2014-01-20 04:20:00 AM  
1 votes:

wademh: Consult a dictionary.


The tendency to favor information that confirms your hypothesis.  Do you not understand that I'm accusing you of doing this, or are you the one that needs to consult a dictionary?

wademh: Uh, you babble.


Got nothing, huh?  Your argument is ridiculous.  If I built two bridges, one based on the sound application of modern engineering principles, and the other based on my sincere desire for toothpicks to be as strong as steel, would you be equally skeptical about walking across both bridges?  Of course you wouldn't.  Science is a trusted tool because it's based upon a strong foundation of logic and because it's withstood the test of time and scrutiny.  Stop trying to make something out of this nonsense.

wademh: And your reading comprehension isn't very impressive. I could explain "the problem of evil" but I don't chose to do so.


I didn't ask you to explain the problem of evil.  I said that if you want to profess an unfounded belief in a deity, you would have to contend with it.  You might want to check your own comprehension before belittling mine there, Sparky.

wademh: That I can do so does not make me a theist.


If you were willing to mount the defense, I assumed you were professing belief.  So, you're an atheist, then?

wademh: but noting that empirical evidence includes tract records.


You're baldly asserting this nonsense.  You have yet to support the notion.  You're also getting sloppy ("tract records"?).

wademh: Further, what the hell has _should_ got to do with anything.


You're the one who used "should".  I was just using your phrasing for parallelism.  Why must unicorns be understandable to humans?  Perhaps because in order to ask the question, we have to have some idea of what a unicorn is in the first place?  To wit, does the sentence "why must hibbityflibbityboozlewoozles be understandable to humans" mean anything?

wademh: Disbelief and non-belief are not the same thing. You're not doing well here.


Ah HA!  Now we're getting somewhere! The fact that you're even talking about "disbelief" shows that you don't understand the position you're arguing against.  Belief (theism) vs. Non-belief (atheism) is the only relevant dichotomy in this discussion.

wademh: Again, science is accepted because it works, not because you or I can wrap it in some tidy mathematics.


You can make this claim as many times as you like.  It will still be patently false, and the rest of your argument falls to pieces without it.  Sorry.  There's no way you're going to get away with equating the axioms of logic, like basic truth tables, with all other forms of unsupported assumptions, large and small.  It's an idiotic position.  I'm not buying it.
2014-01-20 03:24:21 AM  
1 votes:

wademh: Think about why science is held up as a standard of excellence.


I'm well aware of why science is a highly-regarded investigative tool. It seems you are the one who should think a bit more about how it came about, and what it's founded upon. Your bald assertion that its track record is its only support is frankly silly.

wademh: Some seem to adopt a foundation epistemology that establishes naturalism axiomatically.


"Some seem to adopt", huh?  Does that kind of language fly with your publisher?

You're confusing the assumption of naturalism as an axiomatic truth with methodological naturalism, which is what science is governed by.  Science does not implicitly reject the existence of the supernatural.  It simply excludes it from its scope on the basis of falsifiability and that which is testable and repeatable.

The fact that "some seem" to reference the scientific method in place of empiricism when justifying their atheism doesn't limit their argument to that scope.  The idea that the burden of proof falls upon the positive claim does not spring from, nor is it limited to, the scientific process.

wademh: However, by the same principles that lead them to reject theism and adopt philosophical naturalism, the principle of following what is empirically successful, you would have to accept Tarot cards if they proved reliable.


This is circular reasoning.  IF Tarot cards proved reliable, the mechanism would either have an empirical explanation, in which case they would operate by some natural law, or not, in which case empiricism would have to be discarded as a reliable tool.  They do not prove reliable, so we are spared the implications of this hypothetical.

In light of this, you still haven't addressed the glaring issue with your earlier conclusion that your unfounded beliefs are somehow a reliable indicator of truth. I'm going to need to see some data.
2014-01-20 03:01:15 AM  
1 votes:

wademh: Few.


Confirmation bias.

wademh: Science is respected and trusted because of its track record, not for other reasons that are anything other than assertions.


Incorrect.  Science, and its methods, are based upon sound logical reasoning, which is in turn founded upon mathematics, which is founded upon some very few base assumptions, beginning with pvq <-> qvp.  Pretending that science came from an intellectual vacuum is disingenuous.  It has an extremely strong empirical foundation of credibility.

wademh: I can, someday I may entertain you with it. In some other thread.


So you're saying you're a theist, in addition to being an agnostic?

wademh: Further, my understanding of science leaves little room for any gods that would be especially comprehensible to humans.


So, now that you've willingly used empirical evidence to eliminate the possibility of all gods except the totally incomprehensible ones, what difference is there between a reality in which a completely abstract god exists, and one in which that god doesn't?  I submit that there is none.

wademh: And lastly, why should any gods be understandable to humans?


In order to ask this question, you must first answer:  Why should any gods be, at all?

wademh: I'm am however not forcing myself into convenient dichotomies of certainty.


Again, you're confusing knowledge with belief.  The dichotomy of belief vs. non-belief is not merely convenient- it is required.  You are either a theist, or an atheist.  Taken in the broadest sense of the terms, there is no in-between.

wademh: The problem remains that while many beliefs are Wishful Thinking, that can be used to establish so about specific beliefs.


I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.  I stand by the assertion that belief in the existence of that which has exactly zero empirical evidence to support it must come down to some form of wishful thinking, and that there is no qualitative difference between believing in an abstract god and believing in say, Santa Claus.  Both can be dismissed on precisely equal terms.

wademh: Many men are lying dogs when it comes to women, and for reasons that can be scientifically rationalized, that is inadequate to conclude about specific men.


This is not an ontology, which is what we're discussing.  Again, I'm not sure what point you're trying to make with this example, but I suspect it's irrelevant to the existence of gods.  Feel free to rephrase it if you like.
2014-01-20 12:08:09 AM  
1 votes:

PsiChick: but if you're going to claim someone is mentally ill


Please point out exactly where I claimed someone is mentally ill. Go ahead, I'll wait.

PsiChick: please use real science for statistics and the actual definition of mental illness to determine the validity of your statement.


Please do the same. Post some data which shows that belief in angels, demons, miracles, prayer, and an interventionist God is not the majority belief among Americans. If you reject the reports on poll data that I linked, then feel free to provide data which refutes them.
2014-01-19 11:47:45 PM  
1 votes:

wademh: Objectively, this confirms the accuracy of my perceptions that occurred prior to objective evidence and, objectively denies the requirement for hard objective evidence to reveal truth.


BZZZT. Wrong.

This confirms nothing objectively.  It is, in fact, a perfect example of confirmation bias.  If you really are a scientist of some kind, I imagine that you're pretty bad at it.

As for the rest of your post, it's clear that you (like most people who stubbornly insist on identifying as "agnostic") do not understand the difference between ontology and epistemology.
2014-01-19 11:06:55 PM  
1 votes:

wademh: And that was the point, to counter the claim that it is irrational to believe in things without objective support. Instead, it is entirely rational to trust ones own feelings when one has personally validated the reliability of ones feelings.


You are free to believe however you chose. Please keep in mind however that this in no way resembles any type of scientific method and means nothing to anyone but you.
2014-01-19 09:34:16 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: Magruda: kwame: Magruda: kwame: Magruda: kwame: You Internet-argue too much.

Translation: I got nothing.

Turn the computer off and get some therapy man. You're projecting.

Translation: Wait, i still have character assassination

If you're going to share with the world that you were abused by your mother, don't get upset if someone suggests therapy. Calling that character assassination makes you look paranoid.

You appear to have no understanding of what the words: projecting, character assassination, abuse, and paranoid mean. Come back when you are capable of adult conversation.

OK, well you take care of yourself.


static2.fjcdn.com
2014-01-19 08:36:10 PM  
1 votes:

Standard Deviant: BorgiaGinz: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.

Oh shut up.


In less than 60 years religious belief will be classified as a neurological disorder. Until then we have to suck it up.
2014-01-19 08:26:24 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: don't get upset if someone suggests


Just stop... now you're not only looking like an ass, but a troll... Why do you have to be an asstroll?
2014-01-19 08:23:40 PM  
1 votes:

phrawgh: The Lord works in mysterious ways. He needed these children as His new angels in His Kingdom. We cannot question Him nor know His reasons. These children are truly blessed to be at His right hand. Praise the Lord! His will be done!


You could consider joining them  .  .  .
2014-01-19 08:02:44 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: Magruda: kwame: You Internet-argue too much.

Translation: I got nothing.

Turn the computer off and get some therapy man. You're projecting.


Translation: Wait, i still have character assassination.
2014-01-19 07:55:50 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: You Internet-argue too much.


Translation: I got nothing.
2014-01-19 07:50:59 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: iaazathot: kwame: Magruda: kwame: I feel bad for your experience. I feel worse that it left you so incredibly small-minded.

Small minded does not mean "lends no credence to insanity".

Not sure what you think you're saying. Your mother was insane. If she didn't use religion as a catalyst, it would have been aliens or the government or fluoride in the water. Quit blaming something that was in no way the cause of your treatment.

If it was involved in the scenario, then it was an extant variable in his situation.  Do you have zero idea how reality and causality works?

You Internet-argue too much.


Look at the blow-up doll addict performing e-slap!

/you are forever "that guy" to me kwame
2014-01-19 07:50:47 PM  
1 votes:

Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?


All religious people are exactly like this lady. All of them.

/ I have no idea how we aren't stacking the dead up in Mount Everest size piles.
2014-01-19 07:28:12 PM  
1 votes:
Know how many atheists hold exorcisms? farking zero.
2014-01-19 07:01:00 PM  
1 votes:
If only those kids would've had guns...
2014-01-19 06:53:51 PM  
1 votes:

Nacc: There are plenty of people this crazy without religion. Religion is not a requirement to be crazy, just as it is not a requirement to treat people decently, and with compassion.


Yes, but often religion can mask or shield the crazy from discovery and preventative care.
2014-01-19 06:49:24 PM  
1 votes:
Religion is merely an outlet and sometimes misguided enabler of and for such behavior.

There are plenty of people this crazy without religion. Religion is not a requirement to be crazy, just as it is not a requirement to treat people decently, and with compassion.

To blame religion and say it is the cause or source of this is just as trashy as blaming anything else. There is a scourge of mental illness being heavily untreated. I suffer from poorly treated mental illness myself. I served my country. You can blame my experiences in uniform, I know some of my situations exacerbated the problem, but it was not because of my time in uniform.

Trusting people who regardless of their upbringing, religion, and political affiliation can commit many unspeakable acts is the truly difficult thing. There is no guarantee of a person being safe from these kinds of things, no promises you can make to reassure anyone.

In fact, it's usually only the crazy people who can honestly tell you they are probably not good to be around. The sane people, so to speak, are the liars and manipulators.
2014-01-19 06:48:25 PM  
1 votes:

wademh: Look dude, I'm a militant agnostic, meaning I don't know and neither does anyone else.


Are you "agnostic" about the existence of Santa Claus?
2014-01-19 06:41:09 PM  
1 votes:
anyworld.files.wordpress.com

LOLOLOLOL

FAIL TAG USED CORRECTLY


IT'S FUNNY, BECAUSE A MOTHER MURDERED HER CHILDREN

LOLOLOL
2014-01-19 06:36:06 PM  
1 votes:

BATMANATEE: Which religion uses a knife as part of an exorcism? The Abrahamic ones don't, so voodoo or some kind of tribal stuff maybe?


I'm....I'm pretty sure the point is exorcism shouldn't be a thing.
2014-01-19 06:15:54 PM  
1 votes:

MechaPyx: JohnnyC: MechaPyx: Whatever these people were involved in Religionmerely gave them a framework for their actions but they were fundamentally broken in some way before they found an outlet for their crazy bullshiat.

You can stop pretending not to know what gave them their framework for their actions now...

So do you think violent video games turn people into killers? Does rap music turn people into street thugs? Would wearing feminine clothing turn John Wayne into a woman?

No. And that logic is farked up.

If we removed all religious influence from those two people would they suddenly turn into sane, well adjusted individuals? No. They'd still be batshiat insane.


I don't deny that they were crazy people, but I'm also not denying that it was religion that gave them exorcism which they then performed on those kids. You seem to be selective in your observation as to how they got from point A (not killing her kids) to B (killing and maiming her kids).

Which tells me one thing... Your REALLY don't want religion to be responsible in any way for this. Probably because admitting that religion had something to do with this would make you slightly uncomfortable with your own beliefs... but that's just a guess.
2014-01-19 06:12:46 PM  
1 votes:

MechaPyx: Magruda: MechaPyx: Religion didn't cause this any more than video games(or music or movies or books) make people into violent, depraved killers. Whatever these people were involved in merely gave them a framework for their actions but they were fundamentally broken in some way before they found an outlet for their crazy bullshiat.

I have yet to play a video game which actually told you to go out into the real world and perform any action other than buy the sequel. Religion on the other hand asks you to go do things.

Do you always do everything someone else tells you? Just because someone tells you do something doesn't mean you should just blindly go do it.


You obviously missed the point.
2014-01-19 06:12:44 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?

Probably. But it's irrelevant to this story.


i42.tinypic.com
2014-01-19 06:02:29 PM  
1 votes:

Magruda: wademh: Magruda: wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.

The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.

Which church? And which interpretation of scripture?
Logically, the rarity of such events tells us that this is not a major or common effect of religion. It's a longer argument, and I don't play it out here, but some people are organically mentally ill to begin with. They seek out rather non-conventional fellow travelors such as the cultish variants of born-again evangelicals you referred to. Making a blanket condemnation of religion in general based on specifics that are rare is illogical. Nothing this is not a defense of religion, nor an claim of virtue within religion. Interpreting my comments that way would be evidence of dichotomous thinking, black or white thinking, with me or against me thinking, which is a form of illogic that is sometimes fostered within some religions. But of course it is not common to all religions, some of which even encourage subtlety of thought.

Starting with what i was exposed to and then working my way back to sanity, i found that the only thing that makes sense is that the question of an infinite god is unknowable. Anyone who claims to know the will of god is either insane or a charlatan. I place belief in charlatans as a mental illness.


Your personal experience in this is a warped example. You are judging religion in general from the specific warped example of your youth. Many people adopt a perspective of faith for more subtle reasons, including but not limited to an objective assessment that their own lives are enriched by the general culture of belief. I'm not one of them but I observe people who do so lead happy, successful and productive lives. Thus, a blanket condemnation of religion, which these people testify is vital to their lives, denies this reality.

Ironically, some religious people are guilty of being overly black and white in their thinking, as are those vehemently anti-religion. These two extremes feed off each other to further entrench themselves in their failed dogmatic thought process. But the anti-religious camp also pretends they are champions of rationality and so are not just trapped by hypocritically  trapped.
2014-01-19 06:02:17 PM  
1 votes:

Bslim: Isn't religion awesome?


What religion do you think involves stabbing children with knives?
2014-01-19 06:01:24 PM  
1 votes:

Cpl.D: skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?

The moon doesn't actively encourage this behavior.  Some religious sects do.


What religious sects encourage stabbing children?
2014-01-19 05:59:21 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: Arachnophobe: kwame: kwame: Magruda: kwame: you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness

You seem to think that factual belief in religion is not a mental illness.

What I think is irrelevant. You're coming across as fanatical and single-minded as your mother at this point. Good luck, dude.

He has an excuse for it. You're just trying to stir sh*t up. Find someone else, kid.

Did you forget to switch logins?

I don't do the alt thing. It looks like I quoted myself instead of the comment below.


Sure you don't...
2014-01-19 05:57:29 PM  
1 votes:
HAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA
2014-01-19 05:51:56 PM  
1 votes:
HA!
2014-01-19 05:51:55 PM  
1 votes:

wellreadneck: I've seen them laying on hands and anointing with bacon grease or whatever but I didn't realize any of them were cool with slinging around  that popish holy water. Guess they're evolving, huh?


This was a long time ago, maybe 20 years. From what I've learned they tend to recycle fads. It really just depends on which guest preacher they have invited that week to fill their heads with nonsense.
2014-01-19 05:40:29 PM  
1 votes:

wellreadneck: Your mother is an evangelical who blesses with holy water? That is crazy.


Yeah, one of those assemblies of god where they slay in the spirit, speak in tongues, and invite faith healers on a regular basis.
2014-01-19 05:37:57 PM  
1 votes:

Magruda: wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.

The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.


Which church? And which interpretation of scripture?
Logically, the rarity of such events tells us that this is not a major or common effect of religion. It's a longer argument, and I don't play it out here, but some people are organically mentally ill to begin with. They seek out rather non-conventional fellow travelors such as the cultish variants of born-again evangelicals you referred to. Making a blanket condemnation of religion in general based on specifics that are rare is illogical. Nothing this is not a defense of religion, nor an claim of virtue within religion. Interpreting my comments that way would be evidence of dichotomous thinking, black or white thinking, with me or against me thinking, which is a form of illogic that is sometimes fostered within some religions. But of course it is not common to all religions, some of which even encourage subtlety of thought.
2014-01-19 05:37:53 PM  
1 votes:

phrawgh: The Lord works in mysterious ways. He needed these children as His new angels in His Kingdom. We cannot question Him nor know His reasons. These children are truly blessed to be at His right hand. Praise the Lord! His will be done!


Holy Fark!!!

The sad thing is, I'm sure there are those who actually believe that.
2014-01-19 05:34:41 PM  
1 votes:

Magruda: kwame: Magruda: wademh: Religion has almost nothing to do with this.

The church teaches that demons are real and that exorcisms are a valid practice. The scripture backs up their delusions.

Religion Logic has almost nothing to do with this.

"The church?"

Bless your heart.

Yes, "The church" she attended, backed up by the 700 club. Quit defending lunacy.


I'm not defending anything. You were abused, and in a thread about someone with mental illness killing a child, you are ranting about religion instead of the need to better identify and treat mental illness. I simply feel sad for you and what you experienced and I hope you're getting help.
2014-01-19 05:33:45 PM  
1 votes:

Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.


Religion?
2014-01-19 05:29:26 PM  
1 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


How many people per year are killed on the Moon's whim?

No, really. Your contention is, it's no different from if she blamed the moon, so, why don't we see more people blaming the moon?
2014-01-19 05:27:21 PM  
1 votes:
The Lord works in mysterious ways. He needed these children as His new angels in His Kingdom. We cannot question Him nor know His reasons. These children are truly blessed to be at His right hand. Praise the Lord! His will be done!
2014-01-19 05:24:33 PM  
1 votes:

wademh: What they are is an conduit for extremism based on pre-existing mental defects


And that mental defect is a  belief in something for which there is no proof or logical reasoning for.
2014-01-19 05:22:53 PM  
1 votes:
Judging by the picture, it's just 2 fewer future convicts.
2014-01-19 05:16:09 PM  
1 votes:

BorgiaGinz: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.


No, that's a specific subset of Christian fundies. That is not representative of all or even most religious people even in the US, let alone the world. Get your facts right, please.
2014-01-19 05:14:57 PM  
1 votes:

wademh: Magruda: My mother was (and probably still is) a born again evangelical. She burned Beatles records and blessed my bedroom with holy water on a regular basis. She used to corner me when I got home and rub some holy water on my forehead in an effort to release the demons.

She got these ideas from the church she dragged me to and the radio programs she listened to. So don't tell me religion played no part in this. As soon as you start believing in things without proof it becomes so much easier to convince you to do anything based on those beliefs.

Idiots who believe in demons are on par if not worse than flat earthers.

Religion has almost nothing to do with this. Many followers of religions don't act like the psychotic idiot you portray your mother to be. However, psychotic idiots find excuses, and because religious leaders are so ubiquitous, psychotic people often find religious leaders to assist in their insanity. But religious beliefs are not the cause. What they are is an conduit for extremism based on pre-existing mental defects.


God talks to you: crazy.

You talk to God: sane?
2014-01-19 05:06:55 PM  
1 votes:

kwame: Magruda: My mother was (and probably still is) a born again evangelical. She burned Beatles records and blessed my bedroom with holy water on a regular basis. She used to corner me when I got home and rub some holy water on my forehead in an effort to release the demons.

She got these ideas from the church she dragged me to and the radio programs she listened to. So don't tell me religion played no part in this. As soon as you start believing in things without proof it becomes so much easier to convince you to do anything based on those beliefs.

Idiots who believe in demons are on par if not worse than flat earthers.

I feel bad for your experience. I feel worse that it left you so incredibly small-minded.


I agree. He should be more open minded to crazy, deluded people being crazy and deluded.
2014-01-19 05:01:27 PM  
1 votes:

miss diminutive: And yet some people will say she was still a more fit mother than a same sex couple.

/let's throw some politics fuel onto this
//because why not?


Well, more fit than someone who turns everything into gay politics pro or con.
2014-01-19 04:57:15 PM  
1 votes:

BorgiaGinz: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

Religion is a mental illness. Religious people believe in angels, demons, and  miracles. They believe that they can speak in unknown languages, that magical wishes (AKA prayer)  can affect their circumstances, that the smallest coincidences in their everyday lives are the deliberate acts of an invisible entity that governs every aspect of their lives.


I tip my fedora to you, sir.
2014-01-19 04:54:17 PM  
1 votes:

MrSplifferton: Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.

There were 2 of them, probably met in a NAMI group.


Um, the vast majority of people who need NAMI would never even come close to doing anything like this, but thanks for contributing to the negative image mental illness has so organizations like NAMI never have enough funding.
2014-01-19 04:53:41 PM  
1 votes:

balancing act: So no one else rtfa?  Mom did it ok, mental illness.  But this second psycho biatch helped!! And they tried to kill 4 kids ??? WtF?


Crazy people sometimes work together for a common goal.
2014-01-19 04:44:33 PM  
1 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


static3.wikia.nocookie.net

Guess what?  Ground-up moon rocks are pure poison.
2014-01-19 04:44:30 PM  
1 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


Of course not. The moon is only bad when it's in the third house of Capricorn.
2014-01-19 04:32:50 PM  
1 votes:
It's good that they show some interest in exercise.
imagizer.imageshack.us
Now who's crazy, eh?
v15
2014-01-19 04:30:40 PM  
1 votes:
Pffft black people problems.
2014-01-19 04:27:30 PM  
1 votes:
So no one else rtfa?  Mom did it ok, mental illness.  But this second psycho biatch helped!! And they tried to kill 4 kids ??? WtF?
2014-01-19 04:22:53 PM  
1 votes:
Isn't religion awesome?
2014-01-19 04:22:33 PM  
1 votes:

skantea: All comments about religion will reveal your personal bias.  The biatch was just plain crazy.  If has had said the moon made her do it, would we question whether the moon was bad for us?


While it is true that religion was the medium, it's even more true that there are billions of people who manage to avoid killing their children because of it.

So:  Yes, biatch be crazy.
2014-01-19 04:14:06 PM  
1 votes:

Apos: Undiagnosed/untreated mental illness is a scourge in this country.


There were 2 of them, probably met in a NAMI group.
 
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