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(Huffington Post)   Drug companies won't let you use their products to execute people anymore, do you C) mix up your own brew and hope it doesn't leave people gasping and choking for 15 minutes before they die   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 615
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9555 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Jan 2014 at 2:59 PM (32 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-17 04:33:35 PM

HighTechHick: TV's Vinnie: When was the last time a rich person was executed for their crimes in the US?

Think about that.

That's easy to explain:  Rich people just don't commit crimes that deserve capital punishment.


Didn't Madhoff get life?
 
2014-01-17 04:38:04 PM

PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: No, vengeance is not part of any justice system. Depending on the society,  punishment might be, but punishment is not and never has been vengeance. Vengeance is punishment without proof, without checks, and on the basis of emotion. Punishment without vengeance is what can be shown as demonstrably based on non-emotional criteria and is for society's supposed benefit.

Then, by your own definition, what this guy got was punishment.  There was no uncertainty, no lack of proof, no lack of checks.  It was proven he did it, someone said he admitted it, and apparently, the evidence points to him as the only suspect.  Staggering how people can feel more sorry for a murderer than the multiple victims he killed that we're no threat to him at all.  If this was drug dealers killing drug dealers, I bet you'd not be so critical.  This guy is worse than them.  By far, yet people still defend him.  Why?

Yes, what he got was punishment. However, there are different  types of punishment.  If the USA wants to introduce painful deaths instead of painless standardized deaths as part of the punishment,  then the USA must differentiate each type, class them according to crime, and otherwise fit them into our justice system (and find reasonable arguments that it should be that way). No one is defending this guy; they  are saying he was given  more punishment than he should have been by law. That's a problem. Why? Well, if you get pulled over for speeding, you don't want to end up in jail for two months, right? Yeah, that's why adding on punishments outside of the law is bad.

When someone speeds, there is no loss of life to discuss (usually).  And when that does happen, the penalties become much more severe and appropriately so.  Law enforcement does not want to crowd jails any more than they have to, especially give the current state of prison overcrowding.  However, moving violations are truthfully not for penalty, it's for financial gain f ...


Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.
 
2014-01-17 04:49:04 PM

Dr Jack Badofsky: Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.


Yes. That's why it's being reviewed--to figure out what is just within the existing laws. Weird situations happen, but they're rare and didn't apply to TFA.
 
2014-01-17 05:04:06 PM

PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.

Yes. That's why it's being reviewed--to figure out what is just within the existing laws. Weird situations happen, but they're rare and didn't apply to TFA.


I'm pretty sure that no punishment will make up for what this guy did, short of sending him to the Cenobytes. I'm not directly involved with the case, and I don't have kids, but i wouldn't lose a second of sleep if the guy suffered a little bit.  A stabbing death has to be as bad as burning at the steak, and I could not care less if this douche was scared of needles, felt a slight prick as he was injected, experienced some sort of seizure or whatever.  Like hardinparamedic said earlier, the drugs were probably so strong that this guy didn't know his own name when they hit his system.  Hours of agonizing, pain at the hands of a merciless POS vs a few seconds twitchiness?  That sounds completely fair to me, and I'd even say this guy got one HELL of a bargain.
 
2014-01-17 05:14:05 PM

Dr Jack Badofsky: PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.

Yes. That's why it's being reviewed--to figure out what is just within the existing laws. Weird situations happen, but they're rare and didn't apply to TFA.

I'm pretty sure that no punishment will make up for what this guy did, short of sending him to the Cenobytes. I'm not directly involved with the case, and I don't have kids, but i wouldn't lose a second of sleep if the guy suffered a little bit.  A stabbing death has to be as bad as burning at the steak, and I could not care less if this douche was scared of needles, felt a slight prick as he was injected, experienced some sort of seizure or whatever.  Like hardinparamedic said earlier, the drugs were probably so strong that this guy didn't know his own name when they hit his system.  Hours of agonizing, pain at the hands of a merciless POS vs a few seconds twitchiness?  That sounds completely fair to me, and I'd even say this guy got one HELL of a bargain.


As another poster pointed out, it's not karma. It's justice. They are in fact different for solid reasons.
 
2014-01-17 05:40:54 PM

PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.

Yes. That's why it's being reviewed--to figure out what is just within the existing laws. Weird situations happen, but they're rare and didn't apply to TFA.

I'm pretty sure that no punishment will make up for what this guy did, short of sending him to the Cenobytes. I'm not directly involved with the case, and I don't have kids, but i wouldn't lose a second of sleep if the guy suffered a little bit.  A stabbing death has to be as bad as burning at the steak, and I could not care less if this douche was scared of needles, felt a slight prick as he was injected, experienced some sort of seizure or whatever.  Like hardinparamedic said earlier, the drugs were probably so strong that this guy didn't know his own name when they hit his system.  Hours of agonizing, pain at the hands of a merciless POS vs a few seconds twitchiness?  That sounds completely fair to me, and I'd even say this guy got one HELL of a bargain.

As another poster pointed out, it's not karma. It's justice. They are in fact different for solid reasons.


"Let the punishment fit the crime.". What this guy got was really better than justice, it was a mercy kill, really. There was no pain at all, he just went to sleep, permanently.  And, if it wasn't so unbelievably time/resource-consuming to get to the final stage, it would be craploads cheaper than sticking him in a closet for the rest of his life.  Consider that part of death penalty reform people mentioned.  In cases like this where the proof is overwhelming and there is no question who did what, there really should be an express lane to the chair.

I suppose, if there really were any sort of benefit to LWOP, it would be making them available for medical testing.  Not like WW2 German testing, but new medication testing, stuff the public is just getting to experiment with.  Stuff like that.  Open the test pool a bit.
 
2014-01-17 05:52:33 PM

Dr Jack Badofsky: PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: PsiChick: Dr Jack Badofsky: Ahh, got it.  Wasn't there a case recently where a kid (in his teens, I think) got one sentence, and now it's being reviewed because it was inappropriate?  The Affluenza kid that wiped out his classmates, I think.

Yes. That's why it's being reviewed--to figure out what is just within the existing laws. Weird situations happen, but they're rare and didn't apply to TFA.

I'm pretty sure that no punishment will make up for what this guy did, short of sending him to the Cenobytes. I'm not directly involved with the case, and I don't have kids, but i wouldn't lose a second of sleep if the guy suffered a little bit.  A stabbing death has to be as bad as burning at the steak, and I could not care less if this douche was scared of needles, felt a slight prick as he was injected, experienced some sort of seizure or whatever.  Like hardinparamedic said earlier, the drugs were probably so strong that this guy didn't know his own name when they hit his system.  Hours of agonizing, pain at the hands of a merciless POS vs a few seconds twitchiness?  That sounds completely fair to me, and I'd even say this guy got one HELL of a bargain.

As another poster pointed out, it's not karma. It's justice. They are in fact different for solid reasons.

"Let the punishment fit the crime.". What this guy got was really better than justice, it was a mercy kill, really. There was no pain at all, he just went to sleep, permanently.  And, if it wasn't so unbelievably time/resource-consuming to get to the final stage, it would be craploads cheaper than sticking him in a closet for the rest of his life.  Consider that part of death penalty reform people mentioned.  In cases like this where the proof is overwhelming and there is no question who did what, there really should be an express lane to the chair.

I suppose, if there really were any sort of benefit to LWOP, it would be making them available for medical testing.  Not like WW2 German ...


Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.
 
2014-01-17 09:49:50 PM

PsiChick: Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.


Your previous explanation included a ridiculous redefinition of vengeance that has no place in reality.  The entire concept of "justice" rests upon the human need for vengeance.  Revenge is not a dirty word.
Revenge is natural and it is good.
 
2014-01-17 09:51:58 PM

TheWhoppah: PsiChick: Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.

Your previous explanation included a ridiculous redefinition of vengeance that has no place in reality.  The entire concept of "justice" rests upon the human need for vengeance.  Revenge is not a dirty word.
Revenge is natural and it is good.


Most major religions disagree with you on that.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2014-01-17 10:38:36 PM

PsiChick: TheWhoppah: PsiChick: Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.

Your previous explanation included a ridiculous redefinition of vengeance that has no place in reality.  The entire concept of "justice" rests upon the human need for vengeance.  Revenge is not a dirty word.
Revenge is natural and it is good.

Most major religions disagree with you on that.


You sure you wanna go with religion here on Fark? The place where all religion is hated and/or considered a mental disorder? You ARE brave.
 
2014-01-17 10:47:38 PM

gja: PsiChick: TheWhoppah: PsiChick: Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.

Your previous explanation included a ridiculous redefinition of vengeance that has no place in reality.  The entire concept of "justice" rests upon the human need for vengeance.  Revenge is not a dirty word.
Revenge is natural and it is good.

Most major religions disagree with you on that.

You sure you wanna go with religion here on Fark? The place where all religion is hated and/or considered a mental disorder? You ARE brave.


Fark may not like religion, but when almost every single supposed authority on morality agrees on something...that'd be a good time to listen.
 
2014-01-17 11:00:49 PM

PsiChick: gja: PsiChick: TheWhoppah: PsiChick: Unfortunately, vengeance has no place in our justice system, as I have previously explained.

Your previous explanation included a ridiculous redefinition of vengeance that has no place in reality.  The entire concept of "justice" rests upon the human need for vengeance.  Revenge is not a dirty word.
Revenge is natural and it is good.

Most major religions disagree with you on that.

You sure you wanna go with religion here on Fark? The place where all religion is hated and/or considered a mental disorder? You ARE brave.

Fark may not like religion, but when almost every single supposed authority on morality agrees on something...that'd be a good time to listen.


Where do you think the phrase "an eye for an eye" comes from?  Hint: Religion.

Before you go invoking the old everyone-agrees-with-me argument you might want to consider the views on this topic attributed to gods like Zeus, Osiris, Jehovah, Odin, Marduk, Brahma, Cronus, Isis, Uranus, Jupiter, Hadad, Shiva, Tezcatlipoca, Inti, Dagda, Ra, Shangdi, Yahweh, and Vishnu.  In other words, revenge is explicitly or implicitly approved of by pretty much every religious believer ever to live on this planet beside you and some new-age hippies and maybe JesusFyckingChrist but not most of his followers.
 
2014-01-17 11:39:14 PM

TheWhoppah: Fark may not like religion, but when almost every single supposed authority on morality agrees on something...that'd be a good time to listen.

Where do you think the phrase "an eye for an eye" comes from?  Hint: Religion.

Before you go invoking the old everyone-agrees-with-me argument you might want to consider the views on this topic attributed to gods like Zeus, Osiris, Jehovah, Odin, Marduk, Brahma, Cronus, Isis, Uranus, Jupiter, Hadad, Shiva, Tezcatlipoca, Inti, Dagda, Ra, Shangdi, Yahweh, and Vishnu.  In other words, revenge is explicitly or implicitly approved of by pretty much every religious believer ever to live on this planet beside you and some new-age hippies and maybe JesusFyckingChrist but not most of his followers.


Ironically, the entire point of "an eye for an eye" was that it was "an eye for an eye instead of starting a huge generations-long feud over a milling accident". In other words...justice instead of revenge. Which, anthropologists have found, is the point of almost all religious systems. Maybe we don't  agree with where they draw the line, but they all  do draw the line, and when you understand the system and environment they work with, not usually unreasonably.
 
2014-01-18 12:12:30 AM
Should have been 30.
 
2014-01-18 02:40:57 AM

TheWhoppah: Where do you think the phrase "an eye for an eye" comes from?  Hint: Religion.


The code of Hammurabi disagrees with you.
 
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