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(Yahoo)   After Freedom Industries' chemicals made half the state's water completely unusable, WV regulators decide it's probably good idea to do a few inspections at ALL their facilties, and shockingly, find tons of other chemical storage violations   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 124
    More: Obvious, Freedom Industries, chemical accident, storage violation, West Virginia, nitrous oxide, Tom Aluise, chemicals  
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5062 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Jan 2014 at 12:28 PM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



124 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-01-16 03:11:55 PM  
I refuse to believe that in a bootstrappy, lightly regulated, Job Creator paradise like West Virginia, companies are not responsible in their handling of harmful chemicals.

That is simply not possible.

I'm sure the West Virginians are congratulating themselves on how they're doin' it right while enjoying their bottled water. Bottled water, like God intended.
 
2014-01-16 03:14:13 PM  
Still relevant

"The business of the American people is business."

Because we are too stupid to learn from our mistakes.
 
2014-01-16 03:15:18 PM  

Syrrh: I'm totally outraged at this affront to the 'Merican economy. How are we supposed to compete with the likes of China if we hogtie ourselves with arbitrary environmental restrictions?

Christ, there's still an article on the main page about how much progress they've made on enriching the air in Beijing. They're peaking at 671 micrograms per cubic meter and we can't even come -close- to that anymore. They're getting so thoroughly saturated in natural resources they're going to be able to mine the atmosphere soon, then we'll really start falling behind!


"mining the atmosphere"  LOL

/a little worried that now that you've given some asshole the idea, he's going to run with it
 
2014-01-16 03:15:32 PM  

neversubmit: Still relevant

"The business of the American people is business."

Because we are too stupid to learn from our mistakes.


Totalfark still doesn't give you a sad button. :(
 
2014-01-16 03:17:16 PM  

neversubmit: Still relevant

"The business of the American people is business."

Because we are too stupid to learn from our mistakes.


From your link:

"Of course, the accumulation of wealth cannot be justified as the chief end of existence,"
 
2014-01-16 03:28:34 PM  

tlars699: neversubmit: Still relevant

"The business of the American people is business."

Because we are too stupid to learn from our mistakes.

From your link:

"Of course, the accumulation of wealth cannot be justified as the chief end of existence,"


That would be the learning part.
 
2014-01-16 03:31:43 PM  

exPFCWintergreen: the money is in the banana stand: With a company dealing with chemicals, shouldn't there be routine inspections so this sort of thing could be either mitigated or stopped from occurring at all? How the fark did it get this far? Back when we had a full-time shop, we had OSHA inspections all the time to make sure that our emissions, fans, storage, and disposal/recycling was being done correctly. We aren't a very large company, and the "chemicals" that we were dealing with were mostly lacquers for refinishing, epoxies, spray booths, and paints. How the fark does a large company like that who deals specifically with hazardous chemicals NOT have routine inspections?

Had some of the same questions myself, the systemic amount of overlap in compliance failure related to several different state and federal regulatory agencies for an incident like this to happen is rather surprising. Part of it may be that the company itself is just a middleman, only being a waypoint between the chemical manufacturers and coal refiners. Ideally, a company like this shouldn't exist today, having been outmodded by digital-era logistics and the realization that storing huge amounts of potentially hazardous chemicals in any one place is a bad idea (as this and many other similar incidents have painfully demonstrated). Although if a particular chemical has only limited applications and is only manufactured in batches by one or two companies (which this may be), storage of some sort may be unavoidable (but there are many better alternatives than using one big tank). A company only dealing with the transfer of chemicals could likely operate normally without any employee having any specific chemical-related expertise or experience (and may be able to operate more easily in a regulatory gray-area). In such a case, basic steps like OSHA chemical safety training and EPA waste disposal and containment compliance which should come second nature to anyone who has worked with chemicals weren't there (a cul ...


I'd suggest that this is by design to limit the liability of the other entities.  If those tanks belonged to one of the big player ... either the manufacturer or the coal company, they'd have to maintain it to limit the risk of a spill and thus their liability.  That's expensive.  Better to create a small company for the sole purpose of owning this facility with no other resources.  If something happens, that little company is screwed, but there's nothing important there. "Freedom Industries" is corporate tongue-in-cheek for freedom from liability.
 
2014-01-16 03:40:25 PM  
So how bad would you say this spill is? What's the twinkie rating on this?

i.imgur.com
 
GBB
2014-01-16 03:52:48 PM  

MechaPyx: So how bad would you say this spill is? What's the twinkie rating on this?

[i.imgur.com image 300x168]


Imagine if this Twinkie represented a typical glass of water.  The creme filling would represent the amount of deadly chemicals in the water.
 
2014-01-16 04:00:41 PM  

PsiChick: FUND AND ENFORCE THE GODDAMN REGULATIONS ALREADY!


So much this!

I work for a state that has this exact problem because the stupid farking Democrat governor reallocates the funding that pays for the enforcement of regulations for his pet projects, then wonders how things get so out of control.

/1 of 9 officials in a county of 3 million people regulating 25,000 businesses
 
2014-01-16 04:05:01 PM  

Latinwolf: jaybeezey: So then really, what we have here is a failure of gov't to enforce the many rules and regulations on the book. Sounds about right.

So you saying that excuses the business that broke those rules?


Right winger believes corporation should have no social responsibility to community.
Right winger also believes government budgets should be very small.
Combining these beliefs creates a government with no budget to oversee a malevolent corporation.

This leads to a pretty crappy society, but I guess if toxic water is your dream...
 
2014-01-16 04:08:49 PM  

Cup Check: PsiChick: FUND AND ENFORCE THE GODDAMN REGULATIONS ALREADY!

So much this!

I work for a state that has this exact problem because the stupid farking Democrat governor reallocates the funding that pays for the enforcement of regulations for his pet projects, then wonders how things get so out of control.

/1 of 9 officials in a county of 3 million people regulating 25,000 businesses


Just think of the job security.
 
2014-01-16 04:11:04 PM  

Lamberts Ho Man: I'd suggest that this is by design to limit the liability of the other entities. If those tanks belonged to one of the big player ... either the manufacturer or the coal company, they'd have to maintain it to limit the risk of a spill and thus their liability. That's expensive. Better to create a small company for the sole purpose of owning this facility with no other resources. If something happens, that little company is screwed, but there's nothing important there. "Freedom Industries" is corporate tongue-in-cheek for freedom from liability.


Given the various complications related to the ownership of this particular company and its holdings (least of all the founder having felonies related to tax evasion and cocaine on record), a cynical interpretation of its existence as a ticking liability timebomb is probably justified.
 
2014-01-16 04:16:40 PM  

Zeb Hesselgresser: SpectroBoy: This is why ALL water should be privatized. The free market would prevent this. People would only buy from companies that provide the good stuff.

No, clearly the answer is RAISES FOR EVERYONE!

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x109]

They've got top people on this. TOP.  PEOPLE.


Not work safe audio

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3mw49mk_x0

Classic video :)
 
2014-01-16 04:22:57 PM  

WTFDYW: Cup Check: PsiChick: FUND AND ENFORCE THE GODDAMN REGULATIONS ALREADY!

So much this!

I work for a state that has this exact problem because the stupid farking Democrat governor reallocates the funding that pays for the enforcement of regulations for his pet projects, then wonders how things get so out of control.

/1 of 9 officials in a county of 3 million people regulating 25,000 businesses

Just think of the job security.


You would think, but when some beaurocrat comes along and spots holes in enforcement, the first thing the administrators do is point at the low guy on the totem pole responsible for that duty and cut his ass.

Because it doesn't matter when you get fewer inspections done because you're so busy getting the problems corrected. They'll side with the lazy ahole who rubber stamps all his inspections without even getting out of his truck, but claims 100% completion of his assigned duties.

/It was either this or be a cop
//Still glad a didn't become a cop
 
2014-01-16 04:47:52 PM  

exPFCWintergreen: Lamberts Ho Man: I'd suggest that this is by design to limit the liability of the other entities. If those tanks belonged to one of the big player ... either the manufacturer or the coal company, they'd have to maintain it to limit the risk of a spill and thus their liability. That's expensive. Better to create a small company for the sole purpose of owning this facility with no other resources. If something happens, that little company is screwed, but there's nothing important there. "Freedom Industries" is corporate tongue-in-cheek for freedom from liability.

Given the various complications related to the ownership of this particular company and its holdings (least of all the founder having felonies related to tax evasion and cocaine on record), a cynical interpretation of its existence as a ticking liability timebomb is probably justified.


I don't think it's cynical at all.  It's a relatively common occurrence.  As I understand it, unraveling these issues was one of the goals of the Superfund program.

Sometimes they get caught: http://money.cnn.com/2013/12/13/news/companies/anadarko-clean-up/
 
2014-01-16 04:52:23 PM  

CheatCommando: I am sure there is some sort of "industry disparagement" law that can be perverted to send at least one critic of the company to jail, at least overnight.


Anyone singing and dancing outside of the company HQ? They could be busted for rioting.
 
2014-01-16 04:59:59 PM  

Zeb Hesselgresser: No, clearly the answer is RAISES FOR EVERYONE!


That's a funny way of saying "DEFLECTOR SHIELDS TO FULL!"

Now that you've vented some team about unions, what do you think about clean water and environmental protection?
 
2014-01-16 05:45:24 PM  

SpectroBoy: cameroncrazy1984: Are you saying that regulation and enforcement is essential to safe drinking water? THE HELL YOU SAY

I have been assured by top Libertarians that the EPA and other governmental regulation of the environment are completely UNnecessary.

TOP LIBERTARIANS.

/ This is what they actually believe


FTFY
 
2014-01-16 06:08:26 PM  

GBB: MechaPyx: So how bad would you say this spill is? What's the twinkie rating on this?

[i.imgur.com image 300x168]

Imagine if this Twinkie represented a typical glass of water.  The creme filling would represent the amount of deadly chemicals in the water.


I'm sure you'd be willing to demonstrate how harmless that is with just a wee sip. No bigger than an eye droper full.
 
2014-01-16 06:49:08 PM  

busy chillin': [i.imgur.com image 358x317]


Thanks
 
2014-01-16 09:20:04 PM  

AgentKGB: Zeb Hesselgresser: SpectroBoy: This is why ALL water should be privatized. The free market would prevent this. People would only buy from companies that provide the good stuff.

No, clearly the answer is RAISES FOR EVERYONE!

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x109]

They've got top people on this. TOP.  PEOPLE.

Not work safe audio

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3mw49mk_x0

Classic video :)


Not as far off from reality as you would like. Dear Old Dad was an officer/goon of an AFSCME local for a bit in the '70s. He claimed that all the guys from the International he dealt with were corrupt scumbags. Pot, kettle, etc.

/Computers not being widely available at the time, which might have made things simpler, he used to bribe secretaries for copies of every memo that crossed their desk at contract negotiation time. He often employed cocaine instead of cash, as he could get the coke wholesale, paying with the cash from some slush fund, claim retail value when he gave it to the chicks, and pocket the difference.

//Still cleaner than the Teamsters of the same era, who used to just take payoffs and order their membership to ratify whatever shiatty contract. Don't vote the right way, you'll find out what happened to Hoffa. The AFSCME guys at least seemed like they were still trying to get the best deal they could for the rank and file. That's what unions are supposed to do. If they do it too well, that's because management are morons. There's always an imbalance of power favoring management, no matter what. You just have to understand how to exploit it.
 
2014-01-16 09:31:49 PM  

Zeb Hesselgresser: SpectroBoy: This is why ALL water should be privatized. The free market would prevent this. People would only buy from companies that provide the good stuff.

No, clearly the answer is RAISES FOR EVERYONE!

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x109]

They've got top people on this. TOP.  PEOPLE.


No, no, no.  Cut everyone's pay to the bone.   "Borrow" from the pension fund and file bankruptcy; it's not like those Union Thugs deserve to be paid back.  Then hand the loot out to the TOP.  PEOPLE.

/How does one go bankrupt selling junk food to Americans, anyway?
 
2014-01-16 11:59:20 PM  

jake_lex: There's no way that a company that calls itself "Freedom Industries" isn't sleazy as hell.


The punishment should be that they have to change their name to PollutingYourHouseholdWaterSupply Industries.
 
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