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(Jezebel)   Traditional American masculinity is on its way out, and men have no one to blame but themselves. Men are useless trifecta now in play   (jezebel.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, Americans, American masculinity, James Taranto  
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8281 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Jan 2014 at 11:47 AM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-12 03:58:59 PM  

Goimir: Valiente: StreetlightInTheGhetto: Valiente: rebelyell2006: DanZero:

Whenever I read "cisgender" my mind thinks "Cisalpine Gaul" and I wonder what Julius Caesar has to do with Feminism.

Same here. Too much "Gallic Wars" and Suetonius in my younger days and not enough poorly constructed gender political debates, I guess.

Having said that, I'm looking for a female welder, because all the male ones are busy. I really don't care whether my tradespeople sit down to pee or not, but I've sure noticed that there's a huge shortage of people who can actually do things.

Note that "scribbling for Jezebel" is not "doing things".

Honestly?  Up to you if you want to figure out international whatnot, but Washtenaw Community College in Michigan has historically produced many kickass female (and male) welders.  if it'd qualify as a skilled trade, Toronto's all of a 4ish hour drive away from here.  Been thinking of taking an intro class there just 'cause it'd be fun to learn.

http://www.wccnet.edu/news-events/articles/view/37/

I've bought a welder, a Lincoln MIG Pak 140 suitable for 1/4 inch steel and whatnot, which is more or less all I need (brackets and rebar frameups, etc.) It does gas-shielded and wire and can work off 20 amps, which I can wire up for the garage. I'm pretty sure I can experiment and read my way to a decent, strong bead. I've had to become pretty damn handy with an old house and an old boat.

But I do not have fabrication skills to make aluminum companionway doors and engine bay hatches. So really, I need a fabricator who can weld alu. White sailor problems.

Mig Al is easy. Push the bead, wrap your corners, and penetration doesn't exist. It's all about buildup with aluminum.

It's not as easy as welding bronze with pulsearc, but it's easier than steel mig.


img.fark.net
Moss: I'm a welder.
Wells: Acetylene? Mig? Tig?
Moss: Any of it. If it can be welded I can
weld it.
Wells:Cast iron?
Moss: Yes.
Wells: I don't mean braze.
Moss: I didn't mean braze.
Wells: Pot metal?
Moss: What did I say?
 
2014-01-12 04:00:44 PM  
How can this woman know so much about being a man? She needs to be quiet.

My husband is an over the road truck driver. He smokes, gambles, hunts, and loves sports (football, hockey, and NASCAR--I do not get that, but I am trying). He has taught me to hunt (primitive weapon and gun) and play poker (Texas Hold 'em). I do not smoke and love football. I am waiting for the San Diego/Denver game to come on. Go Chargers! Yea, I know.  Give me this. Anyway. . .he is 6^5 and about 300 lbs. All muscle from years working on oil rigs and with cattle. Truck driving was the only thing his doc would clear him for after his accident. He was thrown from the rig, ruined his spine and neck. I rub his feet, cook for him and his hunting buddies when they come back from the woods, clean for him, and do anything else he asks. I do not feel put down or less than. I feel I am doing what is required of a wife.To me, he is a man. Where this woman is getting her info from is beyond me. Not all men are the wimpy, let's talk all night over mojitos, I cry at weddings type.

Oh, I work. I am a college professor. I teach English. I have an MA in English. Yes, a professor married to a truck driver. Since he is gone a lot, I have learned how to kill bugs, get stuff off of high shelves, open stubborn jars, I explore those 2 a.m. noises, plumbing, fix my car, and other things. As soon as he gets back, he does those things. Not because I insist, but because he feels it's his duty to ensure my safety and happiness. When he gets back from a long road trip, I give him a home cooked meal, do his laundry, give him the remote, and a bj.
 
2014-01-12 04:21:05 PM  

Diego Dominguez: Goimir: Valiente: StreetlightInTheGhetto: Valiente: rebelyell2006: DanZero:

Whenever I read "cisgender" my mind thinks "Cisalpine Gaul" and I wonder what Julius Caesar has to do with Feminism.

Same here. Too much "Gallic Wars" and Suetonius in my younger days and not enough poorly constructed gender political debates, I guess.

Having said that, I'm looking for a female welder, because all the male ones are busy. I really don't care whether my tradespeople sit down to pee or not, but I've sure noticed that there's a huge shortage of people who can actually do things.

Note that "scribbling for Jezebel" is not "doing things".

Honestly?  Up to you if you want to figure out international whatnot, but Washtenaw Community College in Michigan has historically produced many kickass female (and male) welders.  if it'd qualify as a skilled trade, Toronto's all of a 4ish hour drive away from here.  Been thinking of taking an intro class there just 'cause it'd be fun to learn.

http://www.wccnet.edu/news-events/articles/view/37/

I've bought a welder, a Lincoln MIG Pak 140 suitable for 1/4 inch steel and whatnot, which is more or less all I need (brackets and rebar frameups, etc.) It does gas-shielded and wire and can work off 20 amps, which I can wire up for the garage. I'm pretty sure I can experiment and read my way to a decent, strong bead. I've had to become pretty damn handy with an old house and an old boat.

But I do not have fabrication skills to make aluminum companionway doors and engine bay hatches. So really, I need a fabricator who can weld alu. White sailor problems.

Mig Al is easy. Push the bead, wrap your corners, and penetration doesn't exist. It's all about buildup with aluminum.

It's not as easy as welding bronze with pulsearc, but it's easier than steel mig.


Moss: I'm a welder.
Wells: Acetylene? Mig? Tig?
Moss: Any of it. If it can be welded I can
weld it.
Wells:Cast iron?
Moss: Yes.
Wells: I don't mean braze.
Moss: I didn't mean braze.
Wells: Pot metal?
Moss: What did I say?


Yeah, fark. I haven't put a lid on for more that 10 minutes in almost a year.

Pot metal sucks, however, worse than brass. At least brass only catches fire. Pot metal is hot short and catches fire.
 
2014-01-12 04:22:39 PM  
As usual Jezebel is moronic shiate and so is its feminist author who posits that post globalism jobs value
"compromise, communication, networking, and other skills women and girls...... "

OTOH she suggests that men have controlled the entire world for 10,000 years... presumably without any of these attributes and presumably due only to their "upper body strength".  Yet another 3rd wave moron.
 
2014-01-12 04:25:23 PM  
How is this a thread claiming that manly men are going away without there being pictures of manly men?

/and no, what's his nuts from GI Joe doesn't count
 
2014-01-12 04:26:32 PM  

Underwater Bystander: Isn't the idea of modern life that everyone should be whatever they want? We ("applaud" is the wrong word, but) accept when people want to do things like decide to change their gender or decide to defy expectation not fall into traditional roles in more subtle ways.

I suspect the older incarnations of masculinity will never go away. Some men will always want to look like Arnold while others will proudly order froo-froo drinks at bars. Some will do both. Neither is wrong, so why should we care? Everybody just does their own thing.

/missing the point?
//maybe


I think we've just gotten horribly confused about the concept of "traditional masculinity." People now seem to equate it with cartoonish, hyper-macho bullshiat, when traditionally that would have been regarded as a failure of masculinity.

Historically (or at least, what I've read of the intellectual history), "masculinity" has tended to be defined with four overarching themes: 1) a stoic command of one's emotions, 2) equanimity toward adversity, 3) magnanimity, especially toward women and children, and 4) self-sacrifice to duty, honor, and excellence.

I'm a traditionally masculine guy, in those terms. I drink plenty of froo-froo drinks, and have never wanted to look like Arnold. (Or He-Man, or whatever else went wrong with the masculine self-image starting in the 1980s, when musculature somehow became equated with manhood).

And, I'll admit I don't have much patience for non-masculine/emasculated/macho men -- and I don't think society is better off for having them around.
 
2014-01-12 05:05:06 PM  
25.media.tumblr.com
 
2014-01-12 05:05:45 PM  

cryinoutloud: walktoanarcade: Some "men" today do look as though they've made it a point to get help to lift any object they ever needed to lift because they are scrawnier than many women.

What i hate now is that if I want to ask someone advice about my car, I have to go find an old guy. The young guys know nothing. Which is OK, since I'm an old gal, but why can't I have a scenario like this ever?

[www.betcheslovethis.com image 367x600]

"Well, ma'am, I think you need a tune-up. A little fine tuning. You gotta grab hold and tighten up a few things, move them around some. On your car, I mean. Your car--GET THE HELL AWAY FROM ME!"


My dad's an old guy who worked motorpool during the Korean conflict, and ran his own garage in the old days... And if you ask him anything about today's automobiles, he doesn't have a clue, either. They don't make them the same way, and half the time you need a computer to analyze the microchips in modern cars to know what weird-ass thing is going wrong.

I was raised to work on cars, too... But I can't troubleshoot much on a modern car. Stick a 1970s vehicle in front of me and I'll probably figure it out (and I'm no mechanic), but have me look at your 2009 model, and I'll be lost aside from the basics.

So don't blame the younger generation for this one. Blame the engineers who changed the technology enough to make cars more difficult to repair in your garage at home.
 
2014-01-12 05:57:38 PM  

Ebbelwoi: As usual Jezebel is moronic shiate and so is its feminist author who posits that post globalism jobs value
"compromise, communication, networking, and other skills women and girls...... "

OTOH she suggests that men have controlled the entire world for 10,000 years... presumably without any of these attributes and presumably due only to their "upper body strength".  Yet another 3rd wave moron.


And hell, I'm a woman and I'm crap at all that social stuff. Just reading the phrase "networking" makes me cringe.

Reproductive function made it difficult for women to do the same stuff as men for thousands of years. Technology has made it easier.
 
2014-01-12 06:28:19 PM  

Bumblefark: I think we've just gotten horribly confused about the concept of "traditional masculinity." People now seem to equate it with cartoonish, hyper-macho bullshiat, when traditionally that would have been regarded as a failure of masculinity.

Historically (or at least, what I've read of the intellectual history), "masculinity" has tended to be defined with four overarching themes: 1) a stoic command of one's emotions, 2) equanimity toward adversity, 3) magnanimity, especially toward women and children, and 4) self-sacrifice to duty, honor, and excellence.

I'm a traditionally masculine guy, in those terms. I drink plenty of froo-froo drinks, and have never wanted to look like Arnold. (Or He-Man, or whatever else went wrong with the masculine self-image starting in the 1980s, when musculature somehow became equated with manhood).

And, I'll admit I don't have much patience for non-masculine/emasculated/macho men -- and I don't think society is better off for having them around.


Yes, but you still go off-script, and that's the real problem for the Jezebel set.

/they don't want Johnny Depp, they want Captain Jack Sparrow
//the fact that the closest they can get to Captain Jack Sparrow is Johnny Depp made up to look and act (for a short time, in a carefully staged environment) like Captain Jack Sparrow, is all the fault of the patriarchy that denies them what they want out of pure hate and fear of their strong female role models
 
2014-01-12 06:43:19 PM  

Gentoolive: The sissification of men started long ago. Do you notice in old black and white tv programs the father figure is a standup, respected leader of the household.

Nowadays the father figure is the brunt of any joke on television programs.


It was just as true back then, if you'll remember the Flintstones and the Jetsons. Authority figures are some of the easiest ways to get jokes.

I'll grant you it's an incredibly lazy one to pull nowadays, and I am likewise annoyed that you couldn't do the "dumb dad" act with a woman on a TV show without people crying misogyny.
 
2014-01-12 07:07:18 PM  

Death Whisper: [cdn-www.i-am-bored.com image 700x685]


"Come and die, it'll be great fun!" -- Rupert Brooke
 
2014-01-12 08:06:28 PM  

jennyz: And we wonder why more and more marriages are sexless and end in divorce....

Manly men are attractive, dammit.


That's because the women start saying NO as soon as they get that damn ring on their finger.

Wish we men could sue for entrapment in such cases. It's damn near criminal.
 
2014-01-12 08:10:11 PM  

Notabunny: Fubini: TL;DR, too much henpecking.

I'll bet Ms Ryan would have a happier, less bitter life if when Mr Ryan came home from work, she'd greet him at the door with a hoagie in one hand and a beer in the other.


And do so naked. Then maybe she'd quit her biatching.
 
2014-01-12 08:15:30 PM  

just_intonation: jennyz: And we wonder why more and more marriages are sexless and end in divorce....

Manly men are attractive, dammit.

That's because the women start saying NO as soon as they get that damn ring on their finger.

Wish we men could sue for entrapment in such cases. It's damn near criminal.


To be fair, a lot of guys stop trying to attract their wives like they did when they were dating. Some women do bate-and-switch, but a lot just slowly fall out of attraction for their spouses because they spend 7 hours a day on world of Warcraft and gain 30lbs, but expect their wives to be just as hot for the as when they were dating and he was looking hot and wooing her.
 
2014-01-12 08:31:56 PM  
FTFA: As Burger points out, jobs available to American workers now are more likely to place a premium on compromise, communication, networking, and other skills women and girls are socialized to value more than men and boys.

Though when men do work based on compromise, communication and networking it's called "an unfair old school tie network".
 
2014-01-12 08:53:06 PM  
FTFA: "And in the West's new creative economy..."

You keep using that word.

And Japan still has more herbivores. While America has lots of dinosaurs that don't yet realize they're extinct.
 
2014-01-12 08:53:21 PM  
I am so sick of the suggestion that I am some sort of effeminate loser simply because I am not a super-aggressive, testosterone-spurting gorilla.

Now if you'll excuse me I have to do some dusting. My sinuses!
 
2014-01-12 09:24:44 PM  
If you don't work in a factory, you're not a real man.  Well, except cowboys - they are real men.
And men need to stop blaming women for the transformation of the American economy from production to service oriented.  Men exported all the jobs and they are to blame!

/THANKS JEZEBEL!!!
 
2014-01-12 10:24:36 PM  

Fubini: You say that sitting on the couch playing video games makes you a grown-up kid, but it's increasingly evident that the kids who sat on a couch playing video games in the 90's are now the ones raking in money doing office jobs and technical work, while all of the manly men football players are unemployed or janitors.


Good lord, that's a false dichotomy if I ever heard one and just utterly false. The unemployed are the addicts, the emotionally damaged, the socioeconomically downtrodden, and sometimes, the plain ol' unfortunate (of any stripe). The type-A jocks are not unemployed or janitors.
 
2014-01-12 10:26:47 PM  
I guess I'm one of the few who finds the argument compelling. The shift of a majority of women from being homemakers to the workplace,combined with the decline of the manufacturing sector and adding unto that the rise of global competition would explain a lot as far as this so-called decline in masculinity goes. As the money goes, so goes the culture.
 
2014-01-12 11:06:18 PM  

ShonenBat: I guess I'm one of the few who finds the argument compelling. The shift of a majority of women from being homemakers to the workplace,combined with the decline of the manufacturing sector and adding unto that the rise of global competition would explain a lot as far as this so-called decline in masculinity goes. As the money goes, so goes the culture.


I think there's some merit to that, but only as a part of a larger story. (And I'm not much a fan of strong economic-determinist arguments, but setting that aside...)

For example: do you think women's lib would have been possible in a society that was not already, to great extent, "feminized"?
 
2014-01-12 11:06:43 PM  

ShonenBat: I guess I'm one of the few who finds the argument compelling. The shift of a majority of women from being homemakers to the workplace,combined with the decline of the manufacturing sector and adding unto that the rise of global competition would explain a lot as far as this so-called decline in masculinity goes. As the money goes, so goes the culture.


The curious part about the "argument" is that it's being made at all, honestly. The discussion sets up a veritable forest of gender-biased strawmen, and then proceeds to attack them to validate its own bias. The fun part here is that, honestly, the very same argument can be made for "traditional American femininity" - assuming, of course, that by that term, you mean the stereotype of the passive role allegedly played by the 1950's housewife. You can set up the same strawmen (strawwomen, in this case), and then proceed to attack them with the exact same methodology used in the article. However, if you can set aside the author's clear gender bias, she makes a solid point.

The article is right, in that this has nothing to do with gender. The winners keep rewriting history - the clear post-Cold War class struggle waged by the rich on everyone else keeps getting rewritten as a "racial struggle", or a "nationalistic struggle", or a "theological struggle", or, in this case, a "gender struggle." While we're left squabbling about this agitation, the class struggle continues apace. The wedges driven between us by race, nationalism, theology, gender, and so on have little to do with the real fight, and keep us, as a nation, divided and distracted while the thieves continue to plunder this country's future and line their own pockets with it.

And, yes, the economy has made it worse. It's amazing the faults that can be forgiven, overlooked, or outright ignored when things are going well. Now that we think that things are going badly, well, we're taking a closer look at perceived causes, and so we come back to the squabbling that we've been doing for at least half a century or so.

"Masculinity" is about as useful as "femininity" in such situations as a discussion point, cause, rallying cry, whatever - that is to say, it's not useful at all. The author has couched a great point in a bizarre deflective rant, railing against an opponent I can't really see here.
 
2014-01-12 11:19:06 PM  

Gentoolive: The sissification of men started long ago. Do you notice in old black and white tv programs the father figure is a standup, respected leader of the household.

Nowadays the father figure is the brunt of any joke on television programs.


The bumbling dad was a fixture of movies (especially kid-oriented family movies) going well back to the B&W era.   Death of a Salesman was written in '49, and Willy Loman is the archetypical putz.
 
2014-01-12 11:25:34 PM  

Bumblefark: Historically (or at least, what I've read of the intellectual history), "masculinity" has tended to be defined with four overarching themes: 1) a stoic command of one's emotions, 2) equanimity toward adversity, 3) magnanimity, especially toward women and children, and 4) self-sacrifice to duty, honor, and excellence.


I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

That pretty much describes my core values.   Although I'd probably put duty first.
 
2014-01-13 12:18:07 AM  

jennyz: just_intonation: jennyz: And we wonder why more and more marriages are sexless and end in divorce....

Manly men are attractive, dammit.

That's because the women start saying NO as soon as they get that damn ring on their finger.

Wish we men could sue for entrapment in such cases. It's damn near criminal.

To be fair, a lot of guys stop trying to attract their wives like they did when they were dating. Some women do bate-and-switch, but a lot just slowly fall out of attraction for their spouses because they spend 7 hours a day on world of Warcraft and gain 30lbs, but expect their wives to be just as hot for the as when they were dating and he was looking hot and wooing her.


Yeah, but around these here parts, bringing that up is considered misandry, so watch it.
 
2014-01-13 12:36:05 AM  

Ishidan: Go on, try to be a stereotypical "man"- loud, alpha-dominant, and burly--in an office environment.  See what you get.
/hint:  it's 'regularly called up to HR for disciplinary measures because somebody felt 'threatened'


We should be allowed to be racist and finger-bang our secretaries!

/$1 to Eugene Mirman
 
2014-01-13 12:41:35 AM  
I am, according to my wife, a real man.  I work long hours as a telecom lineman in northeastern Ohio.  I'm rugged.  I have a beard, I wear flannel, and i don't whine about hard work of any kind.  Everyone I know brings me anything that needs fixed.  I don't go in for macho garbage though.  Clothes are to be functional, problems are to be solved, and tools are an appropriate gift for any man on any holiday.  This article is nonsense.  The only reason I see that the concept of being a man is faltering in this country is that men are failing to instill these things in their sons.  They prefer to pay child support and hide from the true responsibilities of being a parent.  An entire generation of young men has been raised by single mothers with little to no male influence in their lives and they turned out to be a bunch of petunias.  Don't get me wrong, female influence is a necessity, but without both you get what we have now.  A bunch of 25 year old little boys calling for roadside assistance because they don't know how to change a tire and don't want to get their manicures dirty.  Our new hires are practically worthless and actually require training to use basic hand tools and constant goading to actually do anything when it's a "bad day" out.  Say what you want about the economy  and all the changes and whatever, but it will always take hard work to keep your lights on and your internet up, and your cellphones working for IT jobs to actually be necessary.  I saw someone comment the other day about how reliable their PBX systems and landlines were compared to all those other systems...A "real man" says You're Welcome!
 
2014-01-13 12:52:26 AM  
ZeroCorpse:
I was raised to work on cars, too... But I can't troubleshoot much on a modern car. Stick a 1970s vehicle in front of me and I'll probably figure it out (and I'm no mechanic), but have me look at your 2009 model, and I'll be lost aside from the basics.

So don't blame the younger generation for this one. Blame the engineers who changed the technology enough to make cars more difficult to repair in your garage at home.


Also, IMPOSSIBLE to work on at home.
Used to be, there was a lot of space in the old engine bay.  A general purpose set of tools, you could pretty much go to town on the thing.

Now, fuhgeddit.  Not an inch of extra space in there.
 
2014-01-13 12:56:09 AM  

hitnrun74: I work long hours as a telecom lineman in northeastern Ohio


Man, that ain't no picnic.
 
2014-01-13 01:24:36 AM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-01-13 02:02:44 AM  

clyph: Bumblefark: Historically (or at least, what I've read of the intellectual history), "masculinity" has tended to be defined with four overarching themes: 1) a stoic command of one's emotions, 2) equanimity toward adversity, 3) magnanimity, especially toward women and children, and 4) self-sacrifice to duty, honor, and excellence.

I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

That pretty much describes my core values.   Although I'd probably put duty first.


Vol. 1, Issue 1:

25.media.tumblr.com

/ought to be required reading for young men...and used to be
//
"When you wake up in the morning, tell yourself: the people I deal with today will be meddling, ungrateful, arrogant, dishonest, jealous and surly. They are like this because they can't tell good from evil. But I have seen the beauty of good, and the ugliness of evil, and have recognized that the wrongdoer has a nature related to my own - not of the same blood and birth, but the same mind, and possessing a share of the divine. And so none of them can hurt me. No one can implicate me in ugliness. Nor can I feel angry at my relative, or hate him. We were born to work together like feet, hands and eyes, like the two rows of teeth, upper and lower. To obstruct each other is unnatural. To feel anger at someone, to turn your back on him: these are unnatural."
 
2014-01-13 02:30:15 AM  
Manliness is like any other art. It takes practice.

Here, a resource to help you practice:

img.podbean.com
 
2014-01-13 05:33:26 AM  
Here's an idea for men who aren't sure how to react to all of the dichotomous demands placed upon them.

When a woman starts going off about "men should to this and they should agree to that and be this and that and never this but only like that when we want them to be and..."

Smile, nod along until </screed>, state calmly "Absolutely".  Get up, smile, excuse yourself.  Walk off.  Get on with your life.

Ta da.  I man, lets face it, if the choice is "dance puppet dance" for somebody who doesn't love or respect you anyhoo, or lonely, lonely has less.. abrasive qualities.
 
2014-01-13 06:12:00 AM  

bunner: Here's an idea for men who aren't sure how to react to all of the dichotomous demands placed upon them.

When a woman starts going off about "men should to this and they should agree to that and be this and that and never this but only like that when we want them to be and..."

Smile, nod along until </screed>, state calmly "Absolutely".  Get up, smile, excuse yourself.  Walk off.  Get on with your life.

Ta da.  I man, lets face it, if the choice is "dance puppet dance" for somebody who doesn't love or respect you anyhoo, or lonely, lonely has less.. abrasive qualities.


Takes less effort, too, and costs less money. I can save up, invest in defenses for when the angry peasant mobs choose to make me the scapegoat for everything that's gone wrong (on the grounds that I didn't do the stupid things that left them all as peasants), and when the revolution comes, go out with guns blazing.

/not the life I would have chosen
//but you only get to live the life you have, not the life you wanted
 
2014-01-13 06:42:26 AM  

Tatterdemalian: Takes less effort, too, and costs less money. I can save up, invest in defenses for when the angry peasant mobs choose to make me the scapegoat for everything that's gone wrong (on the grounds that I didn't do the stupid things that left them all as peasants), and when the revolution comes, go out with guns blazing.


'k
 
2014-01-13 08:48:52 AM  
nerdreactor.com
THE FEMPUTER HAS SPOKEN!
 
2014-01-13 11:35:22 AM  

MechaPyx: If by that you mean men are gaining a greater freedom to express themselves then yes. They don't all have to be cookie cutter replicas of each other. There are still plenty of guys out there that are comfortable being traditionally masculine but not everyone is into that nor should they be forced to. Freedom of expression is a great thing and there's no reason why we can't all do our own thing.


Bingo. Too bad I didn't get to this thread back when it was new and people would actually read it. Always late to the party, it seems. Meh.

Anyway, I'm one of those that doesn't give a rat's ass about upholding "traditional" masculine appearances and behaviors. I certainly don't look like the traditional "manly" men but I do more "manly" things than your average guy.

I do industrial electrical maintenance and I specialize in locations that are particularly susceptible to explosive atmospheres. From, you know, things like sparks. I thought about going into engineering but I quite like turning wrenches. I also work outside all year so I get the worst of Midwest summers and winters while on the job. I can fix a great many mechanical things and I enjoy working on cars and motorcycles. I'm the family go-to mechanic for this reason. Gifts to myself often include new tools. I also do other stereotypical manly things like drive stick and ride motorcycles. I'm in the middle of restoring a classic 60s bike, for that matter. I'm also stronger than I look and actively try to get in regular exercise. I look forward to buying a house so I have something to tear apart and redo to my preferred style and wants.

On the other side of that coin I paint my finger nails and dye my hair unnatural colors. I have 4 earrings (each lobe and each helix) (black opal studs at the moment). My favorite colors are black, blue, and purple. I enjoy having a reason to dress up in a suit and I can tie both a necktie and bowtie. I'm better "domestically" than most women I know. Cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc. I enjoy a good emotional story (which excludes shiat like rom-coms). I'm a techno-geek who loves to tinker with tech toys, build computers, etc. I'm a life long video gamer. I enjoy pursuits of the mind and I've enjoyed adult level logic puzzles since I was 10. I have no interest in sports. At all. I greatly dislike beer. But I love liquor. I'll order "girly" drinks at a bar but I can also throw back shots of tequila, 151 rum, 190 proof everclear, etc without flinching.

I'm kinda both. I'm not afraid of some self decoration that many find to be un-manly but I can make most guys look useless in a comparison of skills. Some days is all steel toes and power tools. Other days it's nothing but pajamas and geekdom. Some mornings I'll walk through an automotive junkyard looking for parts for a new project. Others will be spent sitting on my ass watching cartoons.

And yeah, I walk into my traditionally macho work environments with said polish and dye. I don't give a shiat. Do what makes you happy and fark everyone else. Don't give in to pressure of how you're "supposed" to be. THAT is what takes balls.
 
2014-01-13 12:04:20 PM  
CtrlAltDestroy

How YOU doin'?

(someone had to say it)
(no, don't worry, I'm not single and way too old)
 
2014-01-13 12:50:23 PM  

Therion: CtrlAltDestroy

How YOU doin'?

(someone had to say it)
(no, don't worry, I'm not single and way too old)


Ha. Haven't  that in a while.

Cool armaments, friend. I would love to learn to be a weaponsmith. Maybe if I win the lottery I can retire and pick it up as a passion project. Oh well. I do enjoy being a spark monkey for now.

I forgot to add that while doing all that "unmanly" stuff I'm straight. It would be easy in this soceity for someone to think that I'm not by looking at me. Stereotypes like that need to die out. It's getting there but it's an uphill battle.
 
2014-01-13 01:20:34 PM  

unfarkingbelievable: A real hot guy pumping me hard and rough, all sweaty and naked, will never be obsolete or useless to me.


Eww! Way to be AW and gross!  Good job.
 
2014-01-13 02:32:16 PM  

walktoanarcade: Fubini: walktoanarcade: Some "men" today do look as though they've made it a point to get help to lift any object they ever needed to lift because they are scrawnier than many women.

Really, my muscles aren't huge. but I feel like Schwarzenegger (of the 80s) next to these "guys."

I'll give the article that much and it should serve as a warning to mankind.

It seriously makes me think that there's something in the food or water. I sit at a computer all day, and I have two to three times the natural strength of my wife, who is on her feet all day. I have one female friend who does maintenance work (real maintenance... plumbing, electrical, etc.) and I'm still twice as strong as her, yet we're the same height.

Maybe I lucked out in the genetic lottery? Maybe those guys never eat any kind of protein ever?

It could be the protein thing, sure. It sure seems lots of men today espouse protein-free diets, or shun the best proteins (meats).

Combination of both? Maybe after a generation or so humans mutate owing to a radically disparate microcosm of society, i.e., those pockets are breeding groups with much less sexual dimorphism because like attracts like, in the sense that the Alpha female will gravitate towards to the beta/gamma male and then reinforce their physicalities and personalities.

That's my theory on the spot. Actually, I think it's far more complicated, but maybe my two-bit theory has something to it.


I thought of this 2-bit theory myself.

I definitely married a "beta" male while I'm an "alpha" female, at least when it comes to career drive. It works out very well for us because he's fine with staying home with the kids and being their primary caregiver when they are younger. I would rather die than be a stay-at-home mommy.

I've been in relationships with other "alphas" and it felt like that we where always in competition with each-other so they never worked out. After these relationships I always wondered if competition between each-other is one of the reasons why high-profile celeb couples tend to divorce, while celeb and non-celeb marriages tend to last longer.

Granted, being a "beta" in a relationship doesn't mean you're a complete submissive, far from it! He has his areas where he is an alpha and I'm utterly clueless (Repair work, engineering, gardening/landscaping, kid crap, etc).
 
2014-01-13 02:48:08 PM  

CtrlAltDestroy: MechaPyx: If by that you mean men are gaining a greater freedom to express themselves then yes. They don't all have to be cookie cutter replicas of each other. There are still plenty of guys out there that are comfortable being traditionally masculine but not everyone is into that nor should they be forced to. Freedom of expression is a great thing and there's no reason why we can't all do our own thing.

Bingo. Too bad I didn't get to this thread back when it was new and people would actually read it. Always late to the party, it seems. Meh.

Anyway, I'm one of those that doesn't give a rat's ass about upholding "traditional" masculine appearances and behaviors. I certainly don't look like the traditional "manly" men but I do more "manly" things than your average guy.

I do industrial electrical maintenance and I specialize in locations that are particularly susceptible to explosive atmospheres. From, you know, things like sparks. I thought about going into engineering but I quite like turning wrenches. I also work outside all year so I get the worst of Midwest summers and winters while on the job. I can fix a great many mechanical things and I enjoy working on cars and motorcycles. I'm the family go-to mechanic for this reason. Gifts to myself often include new tools. I also do other stereotypical manly things like drive stick and ride motorcycles. I'm in the middle of restoring a classic 60s bike, for that matter. I'm also stronger than I look and actively try to get in regular exercise. I look forward to buying a house so I have something to tear apart and redo to my preferred style and wants.

On the other side of that coin I paint my finger nails and dye my hair unnatural colors. I have 4 earrings (each lobe and each helix) (black opal studs at the moment). My favorite colors are black, blue, and purple. I enjoy having a reason to dress up in a suit and I can tie both a necktie and bowtie. I'm better "domestically" than most women I know. Cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc. I enjoy a good emotional story (which excludes shiat like rom-coms). I'm a techno-geek who loves to tinker with tech toys, build computers, etc. I'm a life long video gamer. I enjoy pursuits of the mind and I've enjoyed adult level logic puzzles since I was 10. I have no interest in sports. At all. I greatly dislike beer. But I love liquor. I'll order "girly" drinks at a bar but I can also throw back shots of tequila, 151 rum, 190 proof everclear, etc without flinching.

I'm kinda both. I'm not afraid of some self decoration that many find to be un-manly but I can make most guys look useless in a comparison of skills. Some days is all steel toes and power tools. Other days it's nothing but pajamas and geekdom. Some mornings I'll walk through an automotive junkyard looking for parts for a new project. Others will be spent sitting on my ass watching cartoons.

And yeah, I walk into my traditionally macho work environments with said polish and dye. I don't give a shiat. Do what makes you happy and fark everyone else. Don't give in to pressure of how you're "supposed" to be. THAT is what takes balls.


Keep being awesome
 
2014-01-13 02:53:33 PM  
One reason I think that while my boomer parents made sure that I learned both traditionally masculine and feminine subjects and chores, they NEVER did the same with my 3 brothers.

I think this makes men dependent on women, hence the whiny clingyness modern women complain about.

We've been taught how to survive without a man, but men haven't been taught to survive without a woman.
 
2014-01-13 03:28:28 PM  
ok Men

I eat red meat, Drink whiskey and smoke dope
I knock out windows kick down doors
Fark good women and call them whores
We are no good sombiatches.

Can I get an AMEN
 
2014-01-13 03:50:44 PM  

gadian: Tatterdemalian: //sign me up for "lambda"

I've got you farkied as "Lambda Lambda Lambda"
/hope you're not too young for that one.


Nope, he's Booger Presley.
 
2014-01-13 03:54:22 PM  

Duke_leto_Atredes: ok Men

I eat red meat, Drink whiskey and smoke dope
I knock out windows kick down doors
Fark good women and call them whores
We are no good sombiatches.

Can I get an AMEN


...said Barnacle Bill the Sailor
 
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