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(WMUR New Hampshire)   Police: He was belligerent, resisting. Suspect's Lawyer: That's what your report says, now let's go to the video. FBI, US Attorney: Yeah, let's go to that HOLY FARK. (w/ Video of "belligerence, resisting")   (wmur.com) divider line 254
    More: Obvious, United States Attorney, HOLY FARK, FBI, U.S., Attorney General's Office, dark cloud  
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22535 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Jan 2014 at 9:01 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-09 10:03:41 AM  

Fark It: OnlyM3: neongoats

Cops are civilians, just saying. They aren't some special pseudo military protected class. Any farking useless pig farker that tells you different... They absolutely are a protected class. They have dozens of protections from prosecution that Joe-6-pack would never have.

Why do you hate the unions and working class civil servants who

risk their lives every day to protect you!

According to the SCOTUS police DO NOT have a constitutional duty to protect you. So you might want to have a contingency plan. For some its exercising their 2nd Ammendment right for others its hiding. YMMV.
 
2014-01-09 10:03:51 AM  

cannibalparrot: internut scholar: cannibalparrot: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I totaled my car the othe day. It came to rest in the middle of the highway, at night, on icy roads, and the lights/electrical system were destroyed by the wreck. I would have felt better had a cop showed up right about then as I was waving oncoming traffic down with only the light of my phone.

And wouldn't you know it? Nobody showed up, even after calling 911.

/thankfully a wrecker just happened to come along about 15 minutes later


You are lucky no one showed up. If the cops had you would have got a citation for the wreck. At least in PA you would have.

Eh, it was just me. Hit a patch of black ice and tore up my car on the left barrier (which was absurdly close to the highway, otherwise I could have corrected the slide).

And they were running the snow plows without salt, so they were pushing the only bit of traction off the road, and leaving the bare ice behind. Had they ticketed me, I'd have been more than happy to send them a lawsuit for taking actions that contributed to the wreck...probably wouldn't have gone anywhere, but I'd have felt better that it would likely cost them more than what I paid on the ticket.

Because fark Tennessee, that's why.



And what you just explained to me would have gotten you a citation for driving in unsafe conditions. I wish I wasn't kidding.

A friend of mine is a Trooper. He told me that unless you are dead, you are getting a citation in any wreck. And he has no choice, it's mandated to him. Not sure if other troops in PA follow the same procedures but that's his.
 
2014-01-09 10:03:59 AM  

jakomo002: Bit'O'Gristle: Sighs....as a retired police officer who has taken many people to jail, i can say from seeing the video that this was completely unnecessary. Kid weighed about 130 soaking wet, and from what i saw, he was, at the most, just "maybe" talking shiat. There was no need, none, with 3 huge officers that clearly could have controlled him, to slam him into the wall like that. Prisoners talk shiat, that doesn't give you the right to injure them. There was no need at all to slam him like that, the officer who hurt him should be fired, and jailed for battery, and have to pay the kid damages out of pocket. The officer who maced him should be fired, as it was 1. not needed, and 2. he thought it was funny. This kind of horrible police work shames all good officers everywhere who try to do a good job and treat people with respect. Kid should get a nice fat pay off for this one. And officer brutal should go to prison. Shame on you officers, shame on you, for your lack of control, and brutal treatment of a human being

I agree with everything here except the jail time.  It should be far longer, since they abused their positions of authority AND they lied about it.

The fact that there's more than one means there was either a conspiracy to cover it up OR all involved actually approved of this conduct.

10 years and banned from any job of authority or one necessitating carrying any weapons.


/if he was convicted of battery, that is a felony, and he wouldn't be able to carry a weapon again, ever. Thats a good thing in this thugs case. He has no business being a officer.
 
2014-01-09 10:05:14 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: Sighs....as a retired police officer who has taken many people to jail, i can say from seeing the video that this was completely unnecessary. Kid weighed about 130 soaking wet, and from what i saw, he was, at the most, just "maybe" talking shiat. There was no need, none, with 3 huge officers that clearly could have controlled him, to slam him into the wall like that. Prisoners talk shiat, that doesn't give you the right to injure them. There was no need at all to slam him like that, the officer who hurt him should be fired, and jailed for battery, and have to pay the kid damages out of pocket. The officer who maced him should be fired, as it was 1. not needed, and 2. he thought it was funny. This kind of horrible police work shames all good officers everywhere who try to do a good job and treat people with respect. Kid should get a nice fat pay off for this one. And officer brutal should go to prison. Shame on you officers, shame on you, for your lack of control, and brutal treatment of a human being.


I'd go ahead and say he most definitely was talking shiat; and I'm sure you would agree that he was probably talking shiat from the second he was pulled over until he fell asleep that night; and I'd stop at just "maybe" he has a prior relationship with legal trouble.  I'm guessing that officer probably gave the kid what he thought was a little arm twist like he probably had done 100 times before, but didn't account for how tiny that kid is.  And I agree 100% that they don't have the right to assault anyone; he should lose his job.

I'd be curious to know for how many of these pop up, how many incidents are there of talking as much as this kid and tempting the officer(s) into assaulting them, but the officer(s) just ignore it and move on.  It has to be somewhere around 99%
 
2014-01-09 10:05:37 AM  

Prey4reign: Come on people.  The police "violence" was no worse than what goes on at most fraternity hazings.  Looked like a group of older people introducing a younger person into the real world.


How many fraternities do you know of who bring along "throwdown" weapons for when they shoot unarmed suspects?

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.law-enforcement/v962yVOb jw s
 
2014-01-09 10:06:00 AM  

jakomo002: I agree with everything here except the jail time. It should be far longer, since they abused their positions of authority AND they lied about it.


I could not possibly agree more.  We have to have a system of trust between the public and the police.  When stuff like this happens, you get that trust eroding away.  What kind of society would we have if the public as a whole didn't trust the police?  So I think any crime a cop commits the penalty should either be automatically doubled, or have something extra tacked on like is done with hate crimes.  I think anytime a cop lies about anything that happened on the job, they should be immediately fired and they should never work in a position of governmental authority like that again.
 
2014-01-09 10:06:03 AM  

MindStalker: vudukungfu: Whoah
They slam his head into a wall, pick him up, throw him down, then pepper spray him?
Yeah.
I can see they will be getting a harsh punishment of paid leave and no jelly donuts.

A good explanation of the logic/legal reasoning behind paid leave http://www.reddit.com/r/ProtectAndServe/comments/1s01lr/most_common_m y th/cdslvma
Paid leave isn't the punishment, its taking them off the street while the investigation is happening. Also there is an issue of special Miranda issues dealing with police.
Read the link its eye opening.


Really informative link.  Enjoy your TF.
 
2014-01-09 10:07:07 AM  
why does USA need cops when everybody has guns?

Seems kinda redundant.
 
2014-01-09 10:07:49 AM  

bunner: Let me, if I may, state this plainly

[i.imgur.com image 627x370]

Period.

You either uphold the law or you don't.  Ask an honest judge.  This wild west v.2.0 sh*t has got a beard to it's balls and so do your excuses.


/ I was told by my FTO, never...ever..lie on the stand to get a conviction. If you lie once, and get caught, no judge will ever believe you again. And all the judges get together and chat. Your name will be blacklisted, and you will never win a case. Good advise, because i saw it happen to a cop who lied. He finally quit after losing multiple cases.
 
2014-01-09 10:09:56 AM  

fireclown: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I'll counter.  I found a dead man on the side of the road last year.  I hit 911, and within 20 min there were two cops, an ambulance and two off duty paramedics on site.


Is the dead man doing any better now?
 
2014-01-09 10:10:51 AM  
These particular cops were very threatened by this young man and feared for their safety. They put their lives on the line every day dealing with hardened, violent criminals like this. They have wives and children who depend on them. These men are True Americans. If you criticize them, you are scum and are committing treason.

i.imgur.com
 
2014-01-09 10:10:51 AM  

Nana's Vibrator: Bit'O'Gristle: Sighs....as a retired police officer who has taken many people to jail, i can say from seeing the video that this was completely unnecessary. Kid weighed about 130 soaking wet, and from what i saw, he was, at the most, just "maybe" talking shiat. There was no need, none, with 3 huge officers that clearly could have controlled him, to slam him into the wall like that. Prisoners talk shiat, that doesn't give you the right to injure them. There was no need at all to slam him like that, the officer who hurt him should be fired, and jailed for battery, and have to pay the kid damages out of pocket. The officer who maced him should be fired, as it was 1. not needed, and 2. he thought it was funny. This kind of horrible police work shames all good officers everywhere who try to do a good job and treat people with respect. Kid should get a nice fat pay off for this one. And officer brutal should go to prison. Shame on you officers, shame on you, for your lack of control, and brutal treatment of a human being.

I'd go ahead and say he most definitely was talking shiat; and I'm sure you would agree that he was probably talking shiat from the second he was pulled over until he fell asleep that night; and I'd stop at just "maybe" he has a prior relationship with legal trouble.  I'm guessing that officer probably gave the kid what he thought was a little arm twist like he probably had done 100 times before, but didn't account for how tiny that kid is.  And I agree 100% that they don't have the right to assault anyone; he should lose his job.

I'd be curious to know for how many of these pop up, how many incidents are there of talking as much as this kid and tempting the officer(s) into assaulting them, but the officer(s) just ignore it and move on.  It has to be somewhere around 99%


/Man, if i had one dollar for every time some shiat heel mouthed off to me, i would be on a beach  in Jamaica earning 10 percent on my cash. You ignore it, and yes..its difficult, but i looked at it this way, he's going to jail, im going home. I win. Why rise to his trolling?
 
2014-01-09 10:11:36 AM  
We need to raise the education level needed to be a cop.  It won't eliminate the brutality but it might keep some of the troglodytes out.
 
2014-01-09 10:11:46 AM  

internut scholar: A friend of mine is a Trooper. He told me that unless you are dead, you are getting a citation in any wreck. And he has no choice, it's mandated to him. Not sure if other troops in PA follow the same procedures but that's his.


Gotta keep that revenue flowing...

My "bad" cop to good cop encounter ratio is something like 1:4.  One cop I knew was my landlord, and was a major dick.  Used his position to evict me because fark you, that's why (paid my rent on time, and everything else...he just wanted the house back so HE could live there).  The other one wrote me a ticket for something I didn't do, because fark you, that's why (got the ticket thrown out, though).  Granted, NONE of this amounts to what's in the video.  The other encounters with cops were either thoroughly professional (one legitimately caught me speeding, but brought the offense down...guess he was having a good day or something), or I know them personally and they're good people.  But still.  Out of every 5 cops I've known or encountered, 1 was a dick.  I don't have that kind of a ratio with people in any other profession.  Not even the military.

Something about having power just seems to screw with people's heads.  And/or, a position of power is a great attractor for the sociopaths and egotists.

Ghastly: ReverendJasen: Ghastly: This will protect the good cops from false accusations and prevent the bad cops from getting away with their abuse. In this day and age there is absolutely no reason this technology can not be made available and affordable.

The technology is available.  Police unions won't let it happen.  Hell, they fought tooth and nail just to keep GPS tracking out of the cars in at least one district.

Make it a federal law and they'll have no choice but to let it happen.


There are a few cities out there that are already doing badge cameras.  I think it's an awesome idea.  Protects *everybody*.
 
2014-01-09 10:13:47 AM  

Detinwolf: We need to raise the education level needed to be a cop.  It won't eliminate the brutality but it might keep some of the troglodytes out.


It won't.  I know plenty of troglodytes with PhDs.
 
2014-01-09 10:14:03 AM  

darlid01: Of course, now I get an e-mail saying that they aren't going to prosecute because it's not a felony.


Odd.  Speeding tickets aren't felonies either, but they seem willing to prosecute those.

Is there no sort of malfeasance for district attorneys who won't prosecute lawbreakers?
 
2014-01-09 10:14:04 AM  

WelldeadLink: fireclown: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I'll counter.  I found a dead man on the side of the road last year.  I hit 911, and within 20 min there were two cops, an ambulance and two off duty paramedics on site.

Is the dead man doing any better now?


Yes.  He thinks he'll go for a walk, and is not ready for the cart just yet.
 
2014-01-09 10:14:35 AM  

Onkel Buck: New Hampshire? Live free or die trying


Live free, die young, stay pretty.
 
2014-01-09 10:14:50 AM  
I don't think the kid has much of a case. He might get a settlement offer, but if it goes to court he'll get squat.

 I'm not a lawyer, but also not "IANAL" (stupidest acronym ever!)
 
2014-01-09 10:16:16 AM  

Nabb1: That's going to cost the department some money.


You mean the citizens who pay for the department out of their taxes.

Police abuse settlements should be paid for out of the police pension fund, to encourage self-"policing"
 
2014-01-09 10:17:52 AM  

xanadian: internut scholar: A friend of mine is a Trooper. He told me that unless you are dead, you are getting a citation in any wreck. And he has no choice, it's mandated to him. Not sure if other troops in PA follow the same procedures but that's his.

Gotta keep that revenue flowing...

My "bad" cop to good cop encounter ratio is something like 1:4.  One cop I knew was my landlord, and was a major dick.  Used his position to evict me because fark you, that's why (paid my rent on time, and everything else...he just wanted the house back so HE could live there).  The other one wrote me a ticket for something I didn't do, because fark you, that's why (got the ticket thrown out, though).  Granted, NONE of this amounts to what's in the video.  The other encounters with cops were either thoroughly professional (one legitimately caught me speeding, but brought the offense down...guess he was having a good day or something), or I know them personally and they're good people.  But still.  Out of every 5 cops I've known or encountered, 1 was a dick.  I don't have that kind of a ratio with people in any other profession.  Not even the military.

Something about having power just seems to screw with people's heads.  And/or, a position of power is a great attractor for the sociopaths and egotists.

Ghastly: ReverendJasen: Ghastly: This will protect the good cops from false accusations and prevent the bad cops from getting away with their abuse. In this day and age there is absolutely no reason this technology can not be made available and affordable.

The technology is available.  Police unions won't let it happen.  Hell, they fought tooth and nail just to keep GPS tracking out of the cars in at least one district.

Make it a federal law and they'll have no choice but to let it happen.

There are a few cities out there that are already doing badge cameras.  I think it's an awesome idea.  Protects *everybody*.


/you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help.  All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations.  You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive.  And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone.  Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.
 
2014-01-09 10:18:36 AM  

MmmmBacon: sammyk: I love how they always get put on PAID leave when this shiat happen. Not a one of them will spend a day in jail either.

/fark tha police

It's a catch-22, though. If they aren't put on paid administrative leave while under investigation, then every BS abuse report that gets filed - and yes, there are many false abuse claims made against cops - would drive good cops out of the profession. I feel bad cops should be held to account for their abuses, absolutely, but taking away paid administrative leave during these investigations won't solve the problem. Putting the bad cops in jail when they break the law would, though.


I totally get the importance of paid administrative leave to protect good cops against false accusations.  I just really think that the police under investigation should have to return the pay if it turns out that they were guilty of infractions.
 
2014-01-09 10:18:37 AM  

Pangea: Nabb1: That's going to cost the department some money.

You mean the citizens who pay for the department out of their taxes.

Police abuse settlements should be paid for out of the police pension fund, to encourage self-"policing"


And all cops should have to pay for their own malpractice/brutality insurance, rather than the cost of their malfeasance being shouldered by taxpayers.
 
2014-01-09 10:19:49 AM  

MyRandomName: sammyk: I love how they always get put on PAID leave when this shiat happen. Not a one of them will spend a day in jail either.

/fark tha police

Union rules.


Well fark tha police union too! Until they throw cops that do this kind of shiat under the bus they are part of the problem. Only a giant pussy that hides behind a gun and a badge does the kind of crap in the video. Only a POS defends it.
 
2014-01-09 10:20:21 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: Mikey1969: Wow... While slamming  him into the wall is bad, THIS part is bullshiat, too:

In the report, Dietenhofer said that Richardson "gained control of Bergeron," saying the teen was later pepper sprayed because he refused to stand up.

Really? "Because he didn't stand up?" Fark you assholes. And for the people here who are police, and who know police, it's people like this who drag that image through the mud. And it's not like this is an isolated incident, who the fark is supporting these pricks? The unions need to do some DEEP soul searching, and start setting up a code of conduct defining who they will and who they won't fight to protect.

/funny you mention that. I always told officers i worked with, or from nearby police departments, that if i was with them on a call, and they farked up a suspect with no valid cause, there is no way, none, that i would lie for them. I would tell anyone who asked that you farked him up for no reason, other than that you were pissed. I never beat a suspect who didn't fight, even if he was a scumbag who needed a good ass kicking.  And if i saw an officer do that to someone without cause, yes, i would report them. In writing. I wanted no part of slapping a suspect around with no legal justification.  THAT..is not our job. No, i wasn't popular, and thats fine. At the end of the day, i could look in the mirror and know i treated people with respect, even if they didn't do the same to me.


I think the problem is that less and less people are cops for the RIGHT reason anymore... They aren't there to help anymore, they're there because they are on a power trip. I'm always respectful to officers who pull me over, and I'm still not entirely sure that the only reason that i didn't get shot a few years ago isn't due to 100% luck. I was polite and cooperative to the officer who pulled me over, I let her know immediately about the knife I carried(100% legal), and I had done nothing more than make a sudden lane change because we remembered that we needed something from the store as we passed. This officer that pulled us over was so keyed up, that she wasn't even listening to her radio when they were calling back after running my info, it took another officer to pull up in his car and yell at her before she backed down. My wife learned an important lesson that day: no sudden moves in front of an agitated police officer. She almost hopped out of the car to talk to the officer when the woman thought I had a warrant out for an unpaid ticket(Which I didn't), and the officer turned to my wife and was about half a heartbeat away from pulling her gun.

It's why I like getting pulled over by older cops. My friend who was roommates with a police officer explained it one day: The rookies feel that they have something to prove, while the veterans are polite to you as long as you are courteous to them in return. After he pointed that out, I've noticed that it tends to follow that for the most part.
 
2014-01-09 10:21:46 AM  

xanadian: Out of every 5 cops I've known or encountered, 1 was a dick. I don't have that kind of a ratio with people in any other profession. Not even the military.


xanadian: Something about having power just seems to screw with people's heads. And/or, a position of power is a great attractor for the sociopaths and egotists.


It's probably selection bias.  The main times you encounter cops is when you're doing something against the law.  In the military, you're working together.  When you get pulled over, you're not working together.

xanadian: one legitimately caught me speeding, but brought the offense down...guess he was having a good day or something


This is just my own guess from my own anecdotes as well as a few others but I always thought the cops do that to make you happy so you don't fight the ticket in court.  It seems from your post you were happy to pay your fine, versus possibly contesting it in court which would require the officer to show up in court.
 
2014-01-09 10:22:30 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: /you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help. All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations. You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive. And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone. Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.


We should eliminate the unconscionable draft system the government uses to force people to become police officers.
 
2014-01-09 10:22:44 AM  

internut scholar: cannibalparrot: internut scholar: cannibalparrot: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I totaled my car the othe day. It came to rest in the middle of the highway, at night, on icy roads, and the lights/electrical system were destroyed by the wreck. I would have felt better had a cop showed up right about then as I was waving oncoming traffic down with only the light of my phone.

And wouldn't you know it? Nobody showed up, even after calling 911.

/thankfully a wrecker just happened to come along about 15 minutes later


You are lucky no one showed up. If the cops had you would have got a citation for the wreck. At least in PA you would have.

Eh, it was just me. Hit a patch of black ice and tore up my car on the left barrier (which was absurdly close to the highway, otherwise I could have corrected the slide).

And they were running the snow plows without salt, so they were pushing the only bit of traction off the road, and leaving the bare ice behind. Had they ticketed me, I'd have been more than happy to send them a lawsuit for taking actions that contributed to the wreck...probably wouldn't have gone anywhere, but I'd have felt better that it would likely cost them more than what I paid on the ticket.

Because fark Tennessee, that's why.


And what you just explained to me would have gotten you a citation for driving in unsafe conditions. I wish I wasn't kidding.

A friend of mine is a Trooper. He told me that unless you are dead, you are getting a citation in any wreck. And he has no choice, it's mandated to him. Not sure if other troops in PA follow the same procedures but that's his.


The lawsuit wouldnt be for the ticket, it would be against the city/county/whatever for taking actions making unsafe conditions much worse.

Unlikely to win? Sure. Crazy? Maybe. But so was every new legal theory...before it eventually won. It used to be you couldn't sue the state (and by extension any local government) no matter HOW negligent or willful their injurious conduct was, until some crazy lawyer (with a more sympathetic case than mine, sure) filed a suit, lost, appealed, and was lucky enough to get a panel of judges that said "hey, you know what? This guy's right...the state really SHOULDN'T be able to do , which got people killed"
 
2014-01-09 10:23:01 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: /you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help.  All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations.  You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive.  And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone.  Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.


I absolutely understand that.

I also understand that a lot of it is a constant stream of bullsh*t radio calls, 8 hours a day, that largely amount to prying people apart who live under the same roof and are supposed to care about each other - until the board is clear for 10 min and you can eat.

Know what else I understand?

Becoming part of the problem means being part of the problem.  Period.  The shoveling sh*t all day doesn't get a bye run for beating the sh*t out of the waiter because he asks him to sit on the patio.  If the burnout is that f*cking high, maybe we need term limits.  Nothing justifies joining the gang you're supposed to be dragging in to booking.
 
2014-01-09 10:24:21 AM  

puckrock2000: duffblue: This happened to a white boy in the pretty liberal state of New Hampshire, imagine what it's like for black kids somewhere like Bloomberg's New York.

[bluwiki.com image 432x196]

/oh, and pull your damn pants up, Bergeron


Looks like the only thing the guy was really doing wrong. He was walking along, and talking to the cops, if that was "combative", I would assume that they would have even slammed Terry Schiavo's head into the wall. The pants bothered me, but not enough to slam his head into the wall.
 
2014-01-09 10:25:27 AM  

bunner: The guy shoveling

 
2014-01-09 10:26:21 AM  

bunner: Bit'O'Gristle: /you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help.  All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations.  You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive.  And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone.  Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.

I absolutely understand that.

I also understand that a lot of it is a constant stream of bullsh*t radio calls, 8 hours a day, that largely amount to prying people apart who live under the same roof and are supposed to care about each other - until the board is clear for 10 min and you can eat.

Know what else I understand?

Becoming part of the problem means being part of the problem.  Period.  The shoveling sh*t all day doesn't get a bye run for beating the sh*t out of the waiter because he asks him to sit on the patio.  If the burnout is that f*cking high, maybe we need term limits.  Nothing justifies joining the gang you're supposed to be dragging in to booking.


/i totally agree, and i wasn't trying to excuse, but explain why some cops are "hard". There are many many of them, that lived through it , without abusing anyone.
 
2014-01-09 10:27:18 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: but explain why some cops are "hard"


John Wayne was hard.  These pricks are just schoolyard bully mean.
 
2014-01-09 10:28:31 AM  

This text is now purple: Bit'O'Gristle: /you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help. All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations. You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive. And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone. Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.

We should eliminate the unconscionable draft system the government uses to force people to become police officers.


/wow, wasn't that just farking enlightening? You're welcome btw, for my 20+ years of service without blemish.
 
2014-01-09 10:28:57 AM  

darlid01: Finally, they went out and got the laptop. Now it's three months since it was stolen and I know the cops have the laptop. Of course, now I get an e-mail saying that they aren't going to prosecute because it's not a felony.

Yeah, the cops are just awesome...


They can't return it because they 1) slammed it against a wall for being uncooperative and the administrative investigation is not completed, 2) are still searching it for evidence of child pornography and pirated software/videos before it can be returned to you, or 3) gave it to their kids for Christmas.
 
2014-01-09 10:30:06 AM  

Fark It: Pangea: Nabb1: That's going to cost the department some money.

You mean the citizens who pay for the department out of their taxes.

Police abuse settlements should be paid for out of the police pension fund, to encourage self-"policing"

And all cops should have to pay for their own malpractice/brutality insurance, rather than the cost of their malfeasance being shouldered by taxpayers.


Agreed. Then the good cops will be ASKING for cameras.

I believe there are good cops out there. These simple suggestions could reduce this instances.
 
2014-01-09 10:30:38 AM  

Heliovdrake: Remeber folks, if you record a cop breaking the law in most states, you are the criminal for wire taping and putting the officers life in danger.


Yes, because if someone is recording the scene and you aren't, the people doing the recording can edit their recordings to make it look like literally anything they want is happening, and you don't have any proof it didn't happen that way.

/of course you know this
//naturally, when people do it to make the cops look bad, it's "perfectly fair" and "the cops are stupid for not taping everything 24/7"
///while when a cop does it, it's "OMG WIRETAPPING! THE NSA IS INVADING MAH PRIVACY TO STEAL MAH VITAL ESSENCES!"
 
2014-01-09 10:34:05 AM  

Bit'O'Gristle: Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.


Oh, I'm sure that doesn't help.  But there've been experiments where you put a bunch of people in a prisoner/guard scenario, and bad shiat develops.  It's probably, ultimately, a mix of these things.

Either way, badge cameras would help take care of a lot of that.  A citizen knows he's being watched, he's less likely to be a dick in front of the cop.  Also, the cop's less likely to pull some shenanigans if *he's* being watched.

lennavan: It's probably selection bias. The main times you encounter cops is when you're doing something against the law. In the military, you're working together. When you get pulled over, you're not working together.


That makes sense.

I've been pulled over (or, at least, on the side of the road when a cop comes by) 7 times.  Only once did the cop try to trump something up.  Then, of course, was the cop who was my landlord.  Utter dick.  And, apparently, he has a ...reputation.  Then, I have a friend who is the deputy chief of police for a town up here.  Great guy, but a bit grabby, and forward about his sexual exploits.

Guess it amounts to a CSB.

lennavan: This is just my own guess from my own anecdotes as well as a few others but I always thought the cops do that to make you happy so you don't fight the ticket in court. It seems from your post you were happy to pay your fine, versus possibly contesting it in court which would require the officer to show up in court.


why that sneaky....

/yeah, it was, like, $50.  big whoop.
 
2014-01-09 10:35:15 AM  

internut scholar: cannibalparrot: internut scholar: cannibalparrot: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I totaled my car the othe day. It came to rest in the middle of the highway, at night, on icy roads, and the lights/electrical system were destroyed by the wreck. I would have felt better had a cop showed up right about then as I was waving oncoming traffic down with only the light of my phone.

And wouldn't you know it? Nobody showed up, even after calling 911.

/thankfully a wrecker just happened to come along about 15 minutes later


You are lucky no one showed up. If the cops had you would have got a citation for the wreck. At least in PA you would have.

Eh, it was just me. Hit a patch of black ice and tore up my car on the left barrier (which was absurdly close to the highway, otherwise I could have corrected the slide).

And they were running the snow plows without salt, so they were pushing the only bit of traction off the road, and leaving the bare ice behind. Had they ticketed me, I'd have been more than happy to send them a lawsuit for taking actions that contributed to the wreck...probably wouldn't have gone anywhere, but I'd have felt better that it would likely cost them more than what I paid on the ticket.

Because fark Tennessee, that's why.


And what you just explained to me would have gotten you a citation for driving in unsafe conditions. I wish I wasn't kidding.

A friend of mine is a Trooper. He told me that unless you are dead, you are getting a citation in any wreck. And he has no choice, it's mandated to him. Not sure if other troops in PA follow the same procedures but that's his.


For the record, I understand that I probably would have gotten a citation (and I admit that I probably should have). I'm not disputing that part at all.

It still would've stuck in my craw, though.
 
2014-01-09 10:35:50 AM  

wambu: darlid01: Finally, they went out and got the laptop. Now it's three months since it was stolen and I know the cops have the laptop. Of course, now I get an e-mail saying that they aren't going to prosecute because it's not a felony.

Yeah, the cops are just awesome...

They can't return it because they 1) slammed it against a wall for being uncooperative and the administrative investigation is not completed, 2) are still searching it for evidence of child pornography and pirated software/videos before it can be returned to you, or 3) gave it to their kids for Christmas.


ha!
 
2014-01-09 10:37:31 AM  
 
2014-01-09 10:38:31 AM  

Weaver95: And this is why I don't trust the cops anymore....i'm sure there are good ones out there who do the job and aren't violent sociopaths but....yeah.  still ain't trusting the cops.


The momentary violence is brutal, but there are a number of scary parts to this discussion that, rightfully, back up your mistrust:

- It took over 4 years to get that video from the cops. That occurred in 2009.
- Other cops looked at that video, and decided that no charges should be filed against the asshole who decided that a cinder-block concussion and pepper spraying was the right action for being mouthy to a cop. In fact, other cops decided that nothing, absolutely nothing, should be done about it.
- It took over 4 years to put all three of those assholes on administrative leave, and only because the guy lawyered up.

Bad cops are going to happen - they're human. What should make you distrust cops is that not a single cop, good or bad, stepped up when this happened. As bunner's post put it, if you just allow this clearly illegal act to occur and you don't do anything about it, you, too, are a bad cop. If you can't hold yourself or other cops accountable, you have no business holding anyone else accountable, either.
 
2014-01-09 10:38:39 AM  

TripSixes: Pigs are friendly creatures much like dogs.


th07.deviantart.net

disagrees.
 
2014-01-09 10:39:44 AM  

Dharma Bumstead: MmmmBacon: It's a catch-22, though. If they aren't put on paid administrative leave while under investigation, then every BS abuse report that gets filed - and yes, there are many false abuse claims made against cops - would drive good cops out of the profession.

***What "good cops?" To some degree they are all bullies, thugs or morons. Even if they aren't beating the crap out of people or murdering unarmed civilians they protect the cops that do. These supposed "good cops" will twist themselves into pretzels to defend, justify and protect the bad ones. Here in Los Angeles, the police chief makes sure to protect the bad ones. And if you are protecting and defending and justifying bad behavior that isn't being a good person.


My nephew is a good cop.  He is 24, works in the projects in Boston and does the right thing.  He's always been a good kid and still is.  What he will be after 10 years on the job remains to be seen, but there are good cops.
 
2014-01-09 10:39:57 AM  

xanadian: WelldeadLink: fireclown: ModernPrimitive01: I've yet in my life to be in a situation where I felt better that a cop showed up, and I've seen some things

I'll counter.  I found a dead man on the side of the road last year.  I hit 911, and within 20 min there were two cops, an ambulance and two off duty paramedics on site.

Is the dead man doing any better now?

Yes.  He thinks he'll go for a walk, and is not ready for the cart just yet.


Of course he isn't.  But wasn't killed by the police.  Nor was he killed where I found him.  The point was that I called 911 and help showed up.
 
2014-01-09 10:42:57 AM  
I've known some good cops--some good, honest, actually fun-to-be-around cops--but there are bad cops in this world.

CSB: Back when I was an undergrad in college, I knew the majority of the campus police (who, incidentally, were technically members of the state police force and carried the state police badge despite identifying themselves as campus police). I was on a first-name basis with five or six of them, and on one memorable occasion they let me handcuff a friend of mine outside the student union just because it was a slow day. I even gave the standard Miranda warning. Those were good cops--the bad ones on campus were always seen drinking coffee in the back of the library while shenanigans were going on outside.

I have no idea why the cops said no when I asked to borrow a Taser.

/Same cops let me screw around in a marked cruiser
//Wanted to be a university cop for a while
 
Ant
2014-01-09 10:46:27 AM  

MmmmBacon: sammyk: I love how they always get put on PAID leave when this shiat happen. Not a one of them will spend a day in jail either.

/fark tha police

It's a catch-22, though. If they aren't put on paid administrative leave while under investigation, then every BS abuse report that gets filed - and yes, there are many false abuse claims made against cops - would drive good cops out of the profession. I feel bad cops should be held to account for their abuses, absolutely, but taking away paid administrative leave during these investigations won't solve the problem. Putting the bad cops in jail when they break the law would, though.


ragecams.com
Problem solved. Wearable police cameras will back up the cop's story when they're being falsely accused, and will have "technical difficulties" when they're up to no good.
 
2014-01-09 10:50:38 AM  
I would like to offer the only useful advice I have for thugs, billionaires, feds, cops, congresspersons, CEOs, judges, attorneys, mobsters, priests, pastors, business owners, gang bangers or anybody else who would deign to put on an authority hat on either side of the equation.

STOP DOING ILLEGAL, CHEAP, SLIMY SH*T.

A ghetto is the result of people cooperating to live like sh*tbags.  It's not a location.  It's a method of conduct.  Stop being a ghetto.

And, if you can, help uninstall the ones you see.  Cause that is, ultimately, a cop's job.  "It's not that simple!"  Bullsh*t.  It's.  Precisely.  That.  Simple.
 
2014-01-09 10:51:32 AM  
Bit'O'Gristle:

/you have to understand. Put yourself in an officers position. Nobody likes you, nobody wants to see you in the rear view mirror, unless you called them for help.  All you see, every day, is brutality by people to one another, drunks that want to fight, drug users that abuse their kids, spouses. Murders and rapes, child molestations.  You get the picture. Add to that, that everyone is watching you, and hoping that you do something wrong so they can sue. Courts, citizens, your other officers, and the brass. All have their eyes on what you're doing, and how your doing it. After so many years of this, one tends to become hard, jaded. You have to, just to survive.  And it is possible to be a good cop through all this, but...it is difficult. We are the product of our environment, and it shapes you after so many years. Everyone lies to you, and you can't trust anyone.  Think of all that, before you say its "power" that makes cops "bad". Its not that, its what they have to go through and see every day.

***And this is an argument that I have lost patience with.
If the job is so horrible, if it puts you into contact with bad people and life-threatening situations; if you are dealing on a daily basis with the scum of the earth who dare lie to you, here's a bit of advice - change careers. Otherwise man up, grow a pair, don't be a pu**y and don't whine like some 6-year-old girl about the brutality you see. It's the life you've chosen, deal with it or get out.
Nobody forces someone into law enforcement. No one puts a gun to someone's head and says, "Go be a cop." (If anything, it's the cop putting a gun to some poor civilian schmuck's head because that is what they do.)
But people get into law enforcement not because they want to "help" people (the lie they tell themselves and others) but because deep down they are bullies and thugs. A law enforcement job allows them to be paid to be a bully and thug; they get to carry a gun and wear a badge and are protected by other officers, their chief, and their union. They engage in bad behavior because they know they will get away with it.
 
Ant
2014-01-09 10:52:16 AM  

orclover: In other news: PUT ON A farkING BELT!

Which cop in charge of losing the video evidence is going to be fired?


Don't they take stuff like that away from you when you're arrested?
 
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