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(Huffington Post)   Update: Chris Christie throws his aides under the bridge, er, bus   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 383
    More: Followup, Chris Christie, New Jersey, GWB, David Wildstein, Port Authority  
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8599 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Jan 2014 at 8:14 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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gja [TotalFark]
2014-01-08 10:08:08 PM  

Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!


I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.
 
2014-01-08 10:08:24 PM  
img845.imageshack.us
 
2014-01-08 10:09:13 PM  

thurstonxhowell: farkstorm: thurstonxhowell: HKW: The same hate that would force vets of an open mall 'because its closed'.

Your lose grasp of the English language makes it very difficult to figure out what you might be trying to say.

"off", study it out.

OK, now we're getting somewhere. Vets were forced off an open mall. Which vets? When? What mall? This is the sort of information it is customary to provide for the people with whom you are trying to communicate.

If he's talking about the shutdown, he's wrong about both the idea that it was open and that vets were forced off. That's only my best guess as to what he might be referencing, though.


Veterinarians were forced off of an "open" shopping mall in Cherry Hill, NJ because it was "closed" to people that treat animals for a living. You should follow the news more closely.
 
2014-01-08 10:09:49 PM  

Dougie AXP: An ambulance was delayed because of the traffic in getting to a woman who had a medical emergency (took them 3 times as long) and that woman later died.


Whoops.


There should be AT LEAST an investigation whether the delay contributed to her death.  If so, manslaughter charges if appropriate.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2014-01-08 10:10:56 PM  

tinyarena: [img845.imageshack.us image 649x335]


He reminds me of what Chris Farley might have ended up looking like a bit older and gray.
But with the same degree of dain bramage
 
2014-01-08 10:18:12 PM  

LessO2: Witty_Retort: At least nobody died.

Except this woman.

When homicide charges are brought against one of these jokers, someone will roll on Christie.

Calm down, even Dick Wolf or Jack McCoy couldn't make homicide charges stick.  Way too much to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" for homicide.

Take a deep breath and see how things play out.


If I learned anything in my travels in the Internet, it's this:

"Homicide" is not a charge.  It's just legalese for "unnatural death".  So a suicide would a form of homicide.

The charges would be voluntary/involuntary manslaughter or murder .. which comes down to "intent" and malice.

IANAL, but my guess, if appropriate would be involuntary manslaughter.
 
2014-01-08 10:18:22 PM  

gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.


Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.
 
2014-01-08 10:21:04 PM  

Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.


I can get behind that.. well.. except for the corporate welfare part if it's what I'm thinking ...
 
2014-01-08 10:25:01 PM  

Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.


Sounds good. Can we just have Angela Merkell, instead?
 
2014-01-08 10:25:17 PM  
So no one has evidence that he had this done, yet?
 
2014-01-08 10:26:22 PM  

Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.


I think you really under estimate the military-industrial complex.
 
2014-01-08 10:26:31 PM  

My shocked face


p.twimg.com


Let me show you it.

 
2014-01-08 10:32:43 PM  
Can I get more information about this shocking mistreatment of our nations veterinarians by the staff of the Paramus Park Mall?
 
2014-01-08 10:32:47 PM  

s2s2s2: So no one has evidence that he had this done, yet?


No, just evidence that his aides planned the whole thing out of spite.
 
2014-01-08 10:34:11 PM  

s2s2s2: So no one has evidence that he had this done, yet?


There wasn't any evidence on Nixon at first either.

What's your point, or do you have one?
 
2014-01-08 10:37:32 PM  

RepoManTSM: Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.

I think you really under estimate the military-industrial complex.


I was around during the post-Viet Nam draw down, and it wasn't pretty. When Congress gets it in their minds to reduce spending there is only one non-entitlement area that scale of money can come from, and it's the military. They've had a great 20+ year boom, but all good things must come to an end and now it's their turn.
 
2014-01-08 10:39:56 PM  
 
2014-01-08 10:42:00 PM  

Stone Meadow: RepoManTSM: Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.

I think you really under estimate the military-industrial complex.

I was around during the post-Viet Nam draw down, and it wasn't pretty. When Congress gets it in their minds to reduce spending there is only one non-entitlement area that scale of money can come from, and it's the military. They've had a great 20+ year boom, but all good things must come to an end and now it's their turn.


Agreed.

When you outspend the next ten nations in combined military spending, you might need to cut back a bit and focus on stuff like education and infrastructure to advance our interests. It's long overdue.
 
2014-01-08 10:43:27 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Dam is open.

Christie administration may have violated public records law


This is so disappointing. It's like busting Capone on tax fraud.

Sure, you get the guy, but it's just so mundane.
 
2014-01-08 10:43:56 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Dam is open.

Christie administration may have violated public records law


Hm.. Looks like they're hiding emails. Not good.
 
2014-01-08 10:45:18 PM  

AeAe: Dusk-You-n-Me: Dam is open.

Christie administration may have violated public records law

Hm.. Looks like they're hiding emails. Not good.


I just noticed that they tried to send these e-mails to their GMail and Yahoo accounts instead of official state e-mail accounts.

I'm sure that's a no-no as well.
 
2014-01-08 10:46:53 PM  

Phil McKraken: Sounds good. Can we just have Angela Merkell, instead?


She's under the weather right now, cracked her pelvis. Christie fell on her at a meeting. Or was it Rob Ford? Anyway, she's messed up.
 
2014-01-08 10:47:17 PM  

bronyaur1: I think that this is an unforgivable stunt, and that if he was involved, he is unfit for the office of governor, and should be booted.

That said, enough with the fat jokes already - they just damage a lot of good arguments about why he is a shiat.


You sound fat.
 
2014-01-08 10:51:28 PM  
It's always slightly surprising to me what pols get away with easily and what they have trouble with. Playing politics with public resources is the kind of thing I would expect a big city mayor to be doing pretty much ALL the time. This bridge thing seems kind of petty for a governor's office, but with no sex or money involved, I'd have thought a guy like Christie in a state like NJ might even get away with coming right out and samjacksoning it. "You're gotdamned right I did..."

Then again maybe I don't entirely understand the underlying shenanigans that they're trying to cover up.
 
2014-01-08 10:52:28 PM  
The problem with this kind of scandal is that people can't really know if the governor personally ordered the machine of state to pursue his personal vendetta. The drip, drip, drip of information leading in that direction encourages people to THINK he did.

It's like finding out a used car has a serious flaw the seller tried to keep from you. What else has he been hiding? Best to just cut ties to be safe.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2014-01-08 10:53:25 PM  

Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.


You will pardon me if I do not believe that she would be as you describe.
She is quite happy playing to special interest lobby groups.
And her leanings are such I cannot accept her.
She is no Angela Merkel.
 
2014-01-08 10:56:31 PM  

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: It's always slightly surprising to me what pols get away with easily and what they have trouble with. Playing politics with public resources is the kind of thing I would expect a big city mayor to be doing pretty much ALL the time. This bridge thing seems kind of petty for a governor's office, but with no sex or money involved, I'd have thought a guy like Christie in a state like NJ might even get away with coming right out and samjacksoning it. "You're gotdamned right I did..."

Then again maybe I don't entirely understand the underlying shenanigans that they're trying to cover up.


Since it is a federal criminal offense, that might not be a great idea.
 
2014-01-08 10:58:07 PM  

Cymbal: s2s2s2: So no one has evidence that he had this done, yet?

There wasn't any evidence on Nixon at first either.

What's your point, or do you have one?


Just wondering if this is a guessing game or a prosecution. I'm sure all fair minded people will just chalk it up to politicians being politicians, either way.
 
2014-01-08 10:58:48 PM  

AeAe: LessO2: Witty_Retort: At least nobody died.

Except this woman.

When homicide charges are brought against one of these jokers, someone will roll on Christie.

Calm down, even Dick Wolf or Jack McCoy couldn't make homicide charges stick.  Way too much to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" for homicide.

Take a deep breath and see how things play out.

If I learned anything in my travels in the Internet, it's this:

"Homicide" is not a charge.  It's just legalese for "unnatural death".  So a suicide would a form of homicide.

The charges would be voluntary/involuntary manslaughter or murder .. which comes down to "intent" and malice.

IANAL, but my guess, if appropriate would be involuntary manslaughter.


That would require proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the woman would have lived had the paramedics arrived that about four minutes earlier, as they estimated they would have were it not for the traffic.  Given there probably were no doctors at the scene to testify as to her medical condition four minutes prior to the paramedics arriving (let alone knowing what her vital signs were at the moment), I don't think you can prove, again, beyond a reasonable doubt, that the woman would have lived simply based on the four or so extra minutes.

I'm not saying she would or wouldn't have lived, but I am saying it seems to prove that in a court of law would be an extraordinary thing.

Not trying to find a way out for government slime balls, I just don't think the case can be legally made for homicide, manslaughter or whatever.  Too much reasonable doubt and likely not enough proof.
 
2014-01-08 10:59:36 PM  

Mrtraveler01: s2s2s2: So no one has evidence that he had this done, yet?

No, just evidence that his aides planned the whole thing out of spite.


So another typical day in politics.
 
2014-01-08 11:01:28 PM  

Hollie Maea: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: It's always slightly surprising to me what pols get away with easily and what they have trouble with. Playing politics with public resources is the kind of thing I would expect a big city mayor to be doing pretty much ALL the time. This bridge thing seems kind of petty for a governor's office, but with no sex or money involved, I'd have thought a guy like Christie in a state like NJ might even get away with coming right out and samjacksoning it. "You're gotdamned right I did..."

Then again maybe I don't entirely understand the underlying shenanigans that they're trying to cover up.

Since it is a federal criminal offense, that might not be a great idea.


Okay, maybe I don't understand what it is they're accused of doing exactly.
 
2014-01-08 11:01:40 PM  

cryinoutloud: Phil McKraken: Sounds good. Can we just have Angela Merkell, instead?

She's under the weather right now, cracked her pelvis. Christie fell on her at a meeting. Or was it Rob Ford? Anyway, she's messed up.


Perhaps a back rub would help.
 
2014-01-08 11:04:00 PM  

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: It's always slightly surprising to me what pols get away with easily and what they have trouble with. Playing politics with public resources is the kind of thing I would expect a big city mayor to be doing pretty much ALL the time. This bridge thing seems kind of petty for a governor's office, but with no sex or money involved, I'd have thought a guy like Christie in a state like NJ might even get away with coming right out and samjacksoning it. "You're gotdamned right I did..."

Then again maybe I don't entirely understand the underlying shenanigans that they're trying to cover up.


a) It is now a conspiracy
b) Can you trust Christie to hire good people?
c) Is the this the tenor of his leadership?
d) What other political ratfarks do we not know about?
 
2014-01-08 11:04:26 PM  

gja: Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.

You will pardon me if I do not believe that she would be as you describe.
She is quite happy playing to special interest lobby groups.
And her leanings are such I cannot accept her.
She is no Angela Merkel.


Personally I would prefer Elizabeth Warren, but she is a n00b and far too common sense liberal to win.
 
2014-01-08 11:04:50 PM  

LessO2: AeAe: LessO2: Witty_Retort: At least nobody died.

Except this woman.

When homicide charges are brought against one of these jokers, someone will roll on Christie.

Calm down, even Dick Wolf or Jack McCoy couldn't make homicide charges stick.  Way too much to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" for homicide.

Take a deep breath and see how things play out.

If I learned anything in my travels in the Internet, it's this:

"Homicide" is not a charge.  It's just legalese for "unnatural death".  So a suicide would a form of homicide.

The charges would be voluntary/involuntary manslaughter or murder .. which comes down to "intent" and malice.

IANAL, but my guess, if appropriate would be involuntary manslaughter.

That would require proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the woman would have lived had the paramedics arrived that about four minutes earlier, as they estimated they would have were it not for the traffic.  Given there probably were no doctors at the scene to testify as to her medical condition four minutes prior to the paramedics arriving (let alone knowing what her vital signs were at the moment), I don't think you can prove, again, beyond a reasonable doubt, that the woman would have lived simply based on the four or so extra minutes.

I'm not saying she would or wouldn't have lived, but I am saying it seems to prove that in a court of law would be an extraordinary thing.

Not trying to find a way out for government slime balls, I just don't think the case can be legally made for homicide, manslaughter or whatever.  Too much reasonable doubt and likely not enough proof.


A wrongful death civil suit might be doable though. I'm not a lawyer though.
 
2014-01-08 11:08:02 PM  

gja: Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.

You will pardon me if I do not believe that she would be as you describe.
She is quite happy playing to special interest lobby groups.
And her leanings are such I cannot accept her.
She is no Angela Merkel.


Okay, but you'll have to fill me in, since all those scores are assigned to her by the several hundred organizations listed, not the other way around.

And please feel free to tell us whom you wish to vote for. No snark here. I'm genuinely curious if you feel she's not progressive enough to vote for -- in which case whom do you think COULD get elected. Or if you think she's too progressive, whom might you vote for among the still standing GOP hopefuls?
 
2014-01-08 11:08:34 PM  

gja: Stone Meadow: gja: Stone Meadow: After due consideration I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to Governor Christie for single-handedly ensuring the election of Hillary Clinton as the next President of the United States. Well done sir!

I wonder if she will have them stop mowing the lawn because....natural.

Hillary is no earth-mama...not with the makeup, hairdos and polyester pantsuits. Wanna know what kind of President she'll be? Look at Angela Merkel...careful centrist coalition-building corporatist. No wars, heaven forbid, and she will leave office having spent 8 years reducing unemployment, raising minimum wages to get the poor off public assistance -- a hidden corporate welfare program, fixing the potholes, etc., and paying for it all with about a 50% cut to the defense budget.

You will pardon me if I do not believe that she would be as you describe.
She is quite happy playing to special interest lobby groups.
And her leanings are such I cannot accept her.
She is no Angela Merkel.


But..  but..  she's Democrat!

Seriously folks, they're all asshats. Look before you leap.
 
2014-01-08 11:09:14 PM  
It's so weird that everyone's finding out where Fort Lee is.  That Fort Lee exists, lol.
 
2014-01-08 11:14:00 PM  

Phil McKraken: Perhaps a back rub would help.


You could massage her pelvis, I'm sure it would ease her pain. Then maybe she'd appoint you to her "cabinet," if you know what I mean.
 
2014-01-08 11:14:00 PM  

BigOle8point: I hope a bunch of heads roll over this. How in the heck could you have so much hate inside you to fark the general public like that? Including your own constituents?


Both sides do it!

Republicans delay ambulances so people die.

Democrats provide Obamacare so people die.

See? It's the same.
 
2014-01-08 11:14:30 PM  

Mrtraveler01: I just noticed that they tried to send these e-mails to their GMail and Yahoo accounts instead of official state e-mail accounts.

I'm sure that's a no-no as well.


The fact that they didn't use their actual work account is, literally, the smartest part of the entire story.
 
2014-01-08 11:15:48 PM  
Thing is, this defence isn't even plausible

You really want us to believe that your staffers decided they wanted to punish the other guy?

And not because the boss wanted it?

Smacks of desperation that this is the best defence they can come up with at short notice

It is going to be so widely disbelieved that even 'plausible deniability' won't fly in the marketplace

I'm picking a grovelling mea culpa half-assed apology in next few days, particularly if the redacted bits of the emails become public

(at least he hasn't tried the "during a drunken stupor" one)
 
2014-01-08 11:22:22 PM  

Harry_Seldon: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: It's always slightly surprising to me what pols get away with easily and what they have trouble with. Playing politics with public resources is the kind of thing I would expect a big city mayor to be doing pretty much ALL the time. This bridge thing seems kind of petty for a governor's office, but with no sex or money involved, I'd have thought a guy like Christie in a state like NJ might even get away with coming right out and samjacksoning it. "You're gotdamned right I did..."

Then again maybe I don't entirely understand the underlying shenanigans that they're trying to cover up.

a) It is now a conspiracy
b) Can you trust Christie to hire good people?
c) Is the this the tenor of his leadership?
d) What other political ratfarks do we not know about?



Well, I guess I'm surprised that this was apparently considered NOT the tenor of his leadership or that anyone did NOT already think there were a bazillion political ratfarks we didn't know about, but as I said I don't know much about him or the situation. Just, a spiteful traffic jam seems a odd thing to be taken down over.

/yeah, the cover-up is always a bigger problem
 
2014-01-08 11:22:39 PM  
Sick of all this bashing of the Governeator. He's twice the man any of you libs are. Maybe thrice.
 
2014-01-08 11:23:18 PM  
TDS went with "E-mail Chains, Lanes, and Automobiles". Not a bad headline, but I think some Farkers did better.  Darth Machohad a better not fat joke with "Jersey Turnspite". I think we can all agree that coeyagiwins for best fat joke with "Portly Authority". "The Bridges of Fattison County", from the same contributor, definitely deserves an honorable mention.

They brought up the "I was working the cones" quote that I mentioned, but Jon focused on the dickishness of the quote instead of making it about ice cream. He's a better man than I.
 
2014-01-08 11:25:47 PM  
blogs.villagevoice.com

Here's Christie's henchwoman. Wait, is that the right word? Farkers, help me here.
 
2014-01-08 11:27:26 PM  

thisisyourbrainonFark: [blogs.villagevoice.com image 560x420]

Here's Christie's henchwoman. Wait, is that the right word? Farkers, help me here.


"Steerleader"?
 
2014-01-08 11:27:36 PM  

thurstonxhowell: Mrtraveler01: I just noticed that they tried to send these e-mails to their GMail and Yahoo accounts instead of official state e-mail accounts.

I'm sure that's a no-no as well.

The fact that they didn't use their actual work account is, literally, the smartest part of the entire story.


I heard a rumor on twitter that there was an unusual increase in snapchat traffic in Trenton today during the period that there was silence from Christie's camp. I couldn't tell if it was a joke or not. Damn poe's law.
 
2014-01-08 11:29:36 PM  

s2s2s2: Sick of all this bashing of the Governeator. He's twice the man any of you libs are. Maybe thrice.


It's certainly true he's twice the man Obama is. Maybe thrice.

~www.davidduke.com
 
2014-01-08 11:30:55 PM  

robsul82: It's so weird that everyone's finding out where Fort Lee is.  That Fort Lee exists, lol.


Having grown up in the area, Hiram's Roadstand... Best hot dogs EVER... carry on

/sadly I believe they are not there any more

//just interjecting a wiener (actually a big one) into the thread
 
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