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(Bill Moyers)   The good news: Political polarization and gridlock in Washington DC creates wealth and stability for Americans. The bad news: The top 1% of Americans   (billmoyers.com) divider line 114
    More: Interesting, Political Polarization, Washington DC, Americans, University of New York, wealths  
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605 clicks; posted to Politics » on 07 Jan 2014 at 6:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-07 07:56:35 PM  

The_Man_On_The_Phone: Tomahawk513: The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.

Sadly, this is only the second most ridiculous post I've seen today.  You really,  really, ought to look up historical tax rates.  HINT: They were a LOT higher!

This is easily addressed. There was no competition.  Now we have China and other markets where the stakes are much higher.


You can't be real. You really can't. No one can be this stupid.
 
2014-01-07 07:56:37 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:
If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?
Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.

Oh, look, it's the moronic argument that gambling on Wall Street is earningmoney, building things for people to buy, harvesting food and raw materials by the sweat of the brow, or providing services that have any impact on communities anywhere outside gated enclaves. They build nothing. They create nothing. They contribute nothing of any value to society. They pay lower tax rates. And they suck money out of the economy that could go toward building things, harvesting food and raw materials, or providing services that improve people's lives.

Come back when the Walton heirs do anything useful to anybody but the Walton heirs. (No farking tax dodges allowed.)


Vive La Revolution
theakumalian.com
 
2014-01-07 07:57:27 PM  

The_Man_On_The_Phone: This is simply not true. They very much are the architects of modern-day society. This is why you have an iPhone, an iPad, a personal computer, all the modern conveniences you enjoy. You seem to think that eliminating them through high taxes is simply going to replace them with something else, when it's far more likely they are going to cut corners to save money, including leaving areas where they employ hundreds if not thousands of people. You simply cannot "unplug" the 1% without heavy repercussions.


I like your theory that people change the world through elaborate plans bordering on manifest destiny. Truly, Mr Gates helped ripoff then refine a standardized GUI interface with an operating system because he knew he was a titan of industry, not because he wanted to make a buck off it by selling the idea to other people.
 
2014-01-07 07:58:30 PM  

zeroman987: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Tomahawk513: The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.

Sadly, this is only the second most ridiculous post I've seen today.  You really,  really, ought to look up historical tax rates.  HINT: They were a LOT higher!

This is easily addressed. There was no competition.  Now we have China and other markets where the stakes are much higher.

You can't be real. You really can't. No one can be this stupid.


That's not a bet I'd care to take.
 
2014-01-07 08:01:52 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:

If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?

Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.


They are excellent at getting money efficiently. That means that their return on investment is much higher than what they put in.
 
2014-01-07 08:03:04 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: demaL-demaL-yeH: Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:
If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?
Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.

Oh, look, it's the moronic argument that gambling on Wall Street is earningmoney, building things for people to buy, harvesting food and raw materials by the sweat of the brow, or providing services that have any impact on communities anywhere outside gated enclaves. They build nothing. They create nothing. They contribute nothing of any value to society. They pay lower tax rates. And they suck money out of the economy that could go toward building things, harvesting food and raw materials, or providing services that improve people's lives.

Come back when the Walton heirs do anything useful to anybody but the Walton heirs. (No farking tax dodges allowed.)

Vive La Revolution
[theakumalian.com image 440x330]


No revolution required. I just want a return to status quo ante in the War of Destruction of the Middle Class. They can keep their têtes.
Wall Street, on the other hand? Against the farking wall, metaphorically speaking: Strip the ill-gotten wealth with interest and make them work for a living.
 
2014-01-07 08:04:23 PM  

Isitoveryet: tinfoil-hat maggie: So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

o.k. the shiat hits the fan right now, the poors are storming the estate, what do you do, what do you do?

foreign mercs.

you have 2 choices, drug addled farmers who you can't communicate with & the Mexicans to the south.

check and mate


Russian Spetznaz, lot's of Brit's and others got training in Iraq and Afganistan. All kinds of choices.
 
2014-01-07 08:05:18 PM  

Bugerz: tinfoil-hat maggie: The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.

They always will be the 1% now if we taxed them the same as was done in the 40's and 50's they'd still have more money than you will ever have over you lifetime. Also how do we benefit? It's a global economy and free trade so Americans can compete for $2 a day making Nikes right because I bet you also think we don't need a minimum wage.

So really what do they do?

DEREGULATE, WHARGARBL! NO CHILD LABOR LAWS, WHARGARBL!, NO SAFETY NETS, BOOTSTRAPS WHARGARBL!!!


Exactly.
 
2014-01-07 08:07:11 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: UberDave: And by stability, he means, "not at the gate to our circular driveway with torches and pitchforks".

They'll just hire a private army if they haven't already if people ever do go that far.

Mags, I have to wonder how effective that approach will be when it's the guards' families who are carrying the torches and pitchforks. And just how long the guards will want to hold out when hungry people with modern arms offer the guards the opportunity to live if they open the gates.

So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

Yeah. No. They aren't getting in the country. And they'd be cut off and sitting ducks if they did, especially in your neck of the woods. It's not like we can't find somebody who speaks their lingo well enough to tell them that they get to live if they throw open the gates. (A few well-placed rounds of .308 Win does wonders for motivation and cooperation.)


Oh but who says we're gonna have any guns?
 
2014-01-07 08:08:15 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: zeroman987: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Tomahawk513: The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.

Sadly, this is only the second most ridiculous post I've seen today.  You really,  really, ought to look up historical tax rates.  HINT: They were a LOT higher!

This is easily addressed. There was no competition.  Now we have China and other markets where the stakes are much higher.

You can't be real. You really can't. No one can be this stupid.

That's not a bet I'd care to take.


I love that argument though, that rich folks will simply pick up and go somewhere else.  Where would they go?

Australia? Higher taxes.
Scandinavia? It's cold, and again, higher taxes.
Mexico? Private security costs money.
Mainland Europe? Say it with me now... Higher taxes.
Canada? See Scandinavia.
 
2014-01-07 08:10:48 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: Isitoveryet: tinfoil-hat maggie: So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

o.k. the shiat hits the fan right now, the poors are storming the estate, what do you do, what do you do?

foreign mercs.

you have 2 choices, drug addled farmers who you can't communicate with & the Mexicans to the south.

check and mate

Russian Spetznaz, lot's of Brit's and others got training in Iraq and Afganistan. All kinds of choices.


1. I speak Russian and I shoot straight.
2. Mercs are practical guys (even back in the time of Nick the Dick Machiavelli) who know when it's pointless to die for no reason.
 
2014-01-07 08:11:33 PM  

The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.


Nonsense. If capital gains and income tax were raised just to the rates in place in the mid-1990's, and if carried interest and other accounting fictions were to be banned, that alone would go a long way towards balancing the budget, reducing the deficit, and narrowing the inequality in our economy overall. Not a single new idea is needed; simply reinstate Glass Steagal, ban high speed trading, tax trades at .0001%, fully repeal the Bush tax cuts, and aggressively prosecute tax cheats and anyone parking money offshore.
 
2014-01-07 08:13:54 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: Russian Spetznaz, lot's of Brit's and others got training in Iraq and Afganistan. All kinds of choices.


i was under the impression there would be no planning ahead & the Richers would have to drum up their security support from whatever resources they have on hand.

if they have time to amass their forces then we're potentially screwed.
 
2014-01-07 08:14:00 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: UberDave: And by stability, he means, "not at the gate to our circular driveway with torches and pitchforks".

They'll just hire a private army if they haven't already if people ever do go that far.

Mags, I have to wonder how effective that approach will be when it's the guards' families who are carrying the torches and pitchforks. And just how long the guards will want to hold out when hungry people with modern arms offer the guards the opportunity to live if they open the gates.

So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

Yeah. No. They aren't getting in the country. And they'd be cut off and sitting ducks if they did, especially in your neck of the woods. It's not like we can't find somebody who speaks their lingo well enough to tell them that they get to live if they throw open the gates. (A few well-placed rounds of .308 Win does wonders for motivation and cooperation.)

Oh but who says we're gonna have any guns?


Wait a sec, please, Mags.
I need to catch my breath.
I almost coughed out my spleen laughing.
 
2014-01-07 08:18:29 PM  

Tomahawk513: The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.

Sadly, this is only the second most ridiculous post I've seen today.  You really,  really, ought to look up historical tax rates.  HINT: They were a LOT higher!


I really gotta ask: if this is No. 2, what's No. 1?
 
2014-01-07 08:34:40 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: Isitoveryet: tinfoil-hat maggie: So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

o.k. the shiat hits the fan right now, the poors are storming the estate, what do you do, what do you do?

foreign mercs.

you have 2 choices, drug addled farmers who you can't communicate with & the Mexicans to the south.

check and mate

Russian Spetznaz, lot's of Brit's and others got training in Iraq and Afganistan. All kinds of choices.

1. I speak Russian and I shoot straight.
2. Mercs are practical guys (even back in the time of Nick the Dick Machiavelli) who know when it's pointless to die for no reason.


Really Grandparents? I used to wanna learn German but about 10 years ago I started getting into Russian films and really it is a prettier language just Crylic (sp) scares me almost as much as other Asian languages. Like Chinese or Japanese, etc..
 
2014-01-07 08:36:16 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Wait a sec, please, Mags.
I need to catch my breath.
I almost coughed out my spleen laughing.


I thought everyone would enjoy that ; )
 
2014-01-07 08:39:18 PM  
Get a bunker, you two.
 
2014-01-07 08:40:04 PM  

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: The_Man_On_The_Phone: This is simply not true. They very much are the architects of modern-day society. This is why you have an iPhone, an iPad, a personal computer, all the modern conveniences you enjoy. You seem to think that eliminating them through high taxes is simply going to replace them with something else, when it's far more likely they are going to cut corners to save money, including leaving areas where they employ hundreds if not thousands of people. You simply cannot "unplug" the 1% without heavy repercussions.

I like your theory that people change the world through elaborate plans bordering on manifest destiny. Truly, Mr Gates helped ripoff then refine a standardized graphical GUI interface with an operating system because he knew he was a titan of industry, not because he wanted to make a buck off it by selling the idea to other people.


Sorry, pet peeve.
 
2014-01-07 08:49:16 PM  

whidbey: Get a bunker, you two.


You can come join my bunker anytime, besides Dema has already said he's married and his wife wouldn't be into 3-somes so, nope. Not gonna happen; )
 
2014-01-07 08:50:47 PM  
It's nice to see a few people coming to terms with the reality that the legacy wealthy rentiers and wall-street usurers simply will not take them seriously until they demonstrate decisively that they're not to be trifled with.
 
2014-01-07 08:52:25 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: Isitoveryet: tinfoil-hat maggie: So you've never heard of foreign mercenaries before? Sure Machiavelli wasn't crazy about them but that was for defense of a nation-state/city-state and this would just be an estate.

o.k. the shiat hits the fan right now, the poors are storming the estate, what do you do, what do you do?

foreign mercs.

you have 2 choices, drug addled farmers who you can't communicate with & the Mexicans to the south.

check and mate

Russian Spetznaz, lot's of Brit's and others got training in Iraq and Afganistan. All kinds of choices.

1. I speak Russian and I shoot straight.
2. Mercs are practical guys (even back in the time of Nick the Dick Machiavelli) who know when it's pointless to die for no reason.

Really Grandparents? I used to wanna learn German but about 10 years ago I started getting into Russian films and really it is a prettier language just Crylic (sp) scares me almost as much as other Asian languages. Like Chinese or Japanese, etc..


Really, and my American roots go back before the Revolution, so no, no grandparents.

I was given this little half-day test, and after it was scored, my commander told me, "If you volunteer, we'll send you to California to learn Russian. If you don't volunteer, we'll still send you to California to learn Russian, but we'll hold it against you when it comes time to ship you somewhere to be useful." So I smiled and volunteered and learned Russian.

Cyrillic is just a different alphabet that borrows heavily from Greek. The spelling and pronunciation are about as phonetic as European langages get. Aren't Chinese and Japanese alphabets syllabic, with ideographs for formal use? At least you don't have to read Cyrillic "backwards" and remember what the vowels are, like you do with Hebrew.
 
2014-01-07 09:03:58 PM  
Remember like a year ago when we raised taxes on the top 1% and they all said it would be the end of the world but we did it anyways and then they had the most profitable year ever?
 
2014-01-07 09:06:21 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: whidbey: Get a bunker, you two.

You can come join my bunker anytime, besides Dema has already said he's married and his wife wouldn't be into 3-somes so, nope. Not gonna happen; )


Don't forget that I have children to raise, and I want to see then through graduate college, start careers, go under the chuppah, and maybe, if I'm really lucky, show me my grandchildren.

/Should I ever get a get, though, you go on my list, Mags.
//Not that I'm actively seeking one, though. I hope you understand.
 
2014-01-07 09:08:17 PM  

capn' fun: If capital gains and income tax were raised just to the rates in place in the mid-1990's


Ding ding ding.

"The Gini coefficient of after-tax income increased by 15 percent (0.071 points) between 1991 and 2006. By far, the largest contributor to this increase was changes in income from capital gains and dividends. Changes in wages had an equalizing effect over this period as did changes in taxes. Most of the equalizing effect of taxes took place after the 1993 tax hike; most of the equalizing effect, however, was reversed after the 2001 and 2003 Bush-era tax cuts."

www.motherjones.com

Link

Fark no like: http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2207372
 
2014-01-07 09:08:44 PM  
Account created: 2002-05-14 17

Dammit, where do these goddamn sleeper trolls come from??
 
2014-01-07 09:15:43 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Really, and my American roots go back before the Revolution, so no, no grandparents.

I was given this little half-day test, and after it was scored, my commander told me, "If you volunteer, we'll send you to California to learn Russian. If you don't volunteer, we'll still send you to California to learn Russian, but we'll hold it against you when it comes time to ship you somewhere to be useful." So I smiled and volunteered and learned Russian.

Cyrillic is just a different alphabet that borrows heavily from Greek. The spelling and pronunciation are about as phonetic as European langages get. Aren't Chinese and Japanese alphabets syllabic, with ideographs for formal use? At least you don't have to read Cyrillic "backwards" and remember what the vowels are, like you do with Hebrew.


Cool I was just wondering. Languages are a bit difficult for me plus I don't give enough time and practice on French and Spanich I've been told I'm really good at pronunciation but the writing not so good. Hell Sometimes I can't even write decent grammar in English.
/Actually most of the time ; )
//Wait what where we talking about oh yea the Russ.
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2014-01-07 09:19:47 PM  
Has anyone looked at the really lousy new crop of trolls and figured Drew's hiring rates have gone down?
 
2014-01-07 09:19:47 PM  
I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!
 
2014-01-07 09:22:16 PM  

The_Man_On_The_Phone: This is simply not true. They very much are the architects of modern-day society. This is why you have an iPhone, an iPad, a personal computer, all the modern conveniences you enjoy. You seem to think that eliminating them through high taxes is simply going to replace them with something else, when it's far more likely they are going to cut corners to save money, including leaving areas where they employ hundreds if not thousands of people. You simply cannot "unplug" the 1% without heavy repercussions.


You don't even understand what I've said.
No one is even talking elimination. Even with higher tax rates, the rich will still exist, and will still be rich. They'll still get their money in the end. There will just be other hands able to touch the money first, rather than the speculative hoarding we have now. In the long run, it will make the rich even richer, as demand will no longer be stagnant, giving their investments something besides speculation to build upon.
 
2014-01-07 09:23:29 PM  

Sergeant Grumbles: The_Man_On_The_Phone: This is simply not true. They very much are the architects of modern-day society. This is why you have an iPhone, an iPad, a personal computer, all the modern conveniences you enjoy. You seem to think that eliminating them through high taxes is simply going to replace them with something else, when it's far more likely they are going to cut corners to save money, including leaving areas where they employ hundreds if not thousands of people. You simply cannot "unplug" the 1% without heavy repercussions.

You don't even understand what I've said.
No one is even talking elimination. Even with higher tax rates, the rich will still exist, and will still be rich. They'll still get their money in the end. There will just be other hands able to touch the money first, rather than the speculative hoarding we have now. In the long run, it will make the rich even richer, as demand will no longer be stagnant, giving their investments something besides speculation to build upon.


You don't understand, everything's a zero-sum game to teatards.  Increase taxes on those making over 1m by 2%? GLOBAL DERPRESSION!!
 
2014-01-07 09:40:28 PM  

Bugerz: I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!


Do it you'll feel better ; )

/For SPQR
encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com
 
2014-01-07 09:50:21 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: Bugerz: I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!

Do it you'll feel better ; )

/For SPQR
[encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com image 293x172]


COPY/PASTA WHARGARBL ENGAGE!

1 - Staggering Increase in the Cost of Elections, with Dubious Campaign Funding Sources: Our 2012 election reportedly cost $3 billion. All of it was raised from private sources - often creating the appearance, or the reality, that our leaders are beholden to special interest groups. During the late Roman Republic, elections became staggeringly expensive, with equally deplorable results.

2 - Politics as the Road to Personal Wealth: During the late Roman Republic period, one of the main roads to wealth was holding public office, and exploiting such positions to accumulate personal wealth. As Lessig notes: Congressman, Senators and their staffs leverage their government service to move to private sector positions - that pay three to ten times their government compensation. Given this financial arrangement, "Their focus is therefore not so much on the people who sent them to Washington. Their focus is instead on those who will make them rich." (Republic Lost)

3 - Continuous War: A national state of security arises, distracting attention from domestic challenges with foreign wars. Similar to the late Roman Republic, the US - for the past 100 years - has either been fighting a war, recovering from a war, or preparing for a new war: WW I (1917-18), WW II (1941-1945), Cold War (1947-1991), Korean War (1950-1953), Vietnam (1953-1975), Gulf War (1990-1991), Afghanistan (2001-ongoing), and Iraq (2003-2011). And, this list is far from complete.

4 - Foreign Powers Lavish Money/Attention on the Republic's Leaders: Foreign wars lead to growing influence, by foreign powers and interests, on the Republic's political leaders - true for Rome and true for us. In the past century, foreign embassies, agents and lobbyists have proliferated in our nation's capital. As one specific example: A foreign businessman donated $100 million to Bill Clinton's various activities. Clinton "opened doors" for him, and sometimes acted in ways contrary to stated American interests and foreign policy.

5 - Profits Made Overseas Shape the Republic's Internal Policies: As the fortunes of Rome's aristocracy increasingly derived from foreign lands, Roman policy was shaped to facilitate these fortunes. American billionaires and corporations increasingly influence our elections. In many cases, they are only nominally American - with interests not aligned with those of the American public. For example, Fox News is part of international media group News Corp., with over $30 billion in revenues worldwide. Is Fox News' jingoism a product of News Corp.'s non-U.S. interests?

6 - Collapse of the Middle Class: In the period just before the Roman Republic's fall, the Roman middle class was crushed - destroyed by cheap overseas slave labor. In our own day, we've witnessed rising

7 - Gerrymandering: Rome's late Republic used various methods to reduce the power of common citizens. The GOP has so effectively gerrymandered Congressional districts that, even though House Republican candidates received only about 48 percent of the popular vote in the 2012 election - they ended up with the majority (53 percent) of the seats.

8 - Loss of the Spirit of Compromise: The Roman Republic, like ours, relied on a system of checks and balances. Compromise is needed for this type of system to function. In the end, the Roman Republic lost that spirit of compromise, with politics increasingly polarized between
 
2014-01-07 10:06:51 PM  
The article never really gets to the heart of the issue. That the people benefitting from the chaos are the ones orchestrating it. These people own the government, the legislative machinery, and the judiciary, bought and paid for.
 
2014-01-07 10:23:27 PM  

Bugerz: COPY/PASTA WHARGARBL ENGAGE!


readanddigest.com

And the crowd goes wild.
 
2014-01-07 10:25:18 PM  
needs more see-saws.
 
2014-01-07 10:26:29 PM  

Bugerz: tinfoil-hat maggie: Bugerz: I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!

Do it you'll feel better ; )

/For SPQR
[encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com image 293x172]

COPY/PASTA WHARGARBL ENGAGE!

1 - Staggering Increase in the Cost of Elections, with Dubious Campaign Funding Sources: Our 2012 election reportedly cost $3 billion. All of it was raised from private sources - often creating the appearance, or the reality, that our leaders are beholden to special interest groups. During the late Roman Republic, elections became staggeringly expensive, with equally deplorable results.

2 - Politics as the Road to Personal Wealth: During the late Roman Republic period, one of the main roads to wealth was holding public office, and exploiting such positions to accumulate personal wealth. As Lessig notes: Congressman, Senators and their staffs leverage their government service to move to private sector positions - that pay three to ten times their government compensation. Given this financial arrangement, "Their focus is therefore not so much on the people who sent them to Washington. Their focus is instead on those who will make them rich." (Republic Lost)

3 - Continuous War: A national state of security arises, distracting attention from domestic challenges with foreign wars. Similar to the late Roman Republic, the US - for the past 100 years - has either been fighting a war, recovering from a war, or preparing for a new war: WW I (1917-18), WW II (1941-1945), Cold War (1947-1991), Korean War (1950-1953), Vietnam (1953-1975), Gulf War (1990-1991), Afghanistan (2001-ongoing), and Iraq (2003-2011). And, this list is far from complete.

4 - Foreign Powers Lavish Money/Attention on the Republic's Leaders: Foreign wars lead to growing influence, by foreign powers and interests, on the Republic's political leaders - true for Rome and true for us. In the past century, foreign embassies, agents and lobbyists ...


Why do some of these points cut off mid-sentence?

Liberal cleansing in action??
 
2014-01-07 10:29:05 PM  

whidbey: Bugerz: tinfoil-hat maggie: Bugerz: I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!

Do it you'll feel better ; )

/For SPQR
[encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com image 293x172]

COPY/PASTA WHARGARBL ENGAGE!

1 - Staggering Increase in the Cost of Elections, with Dubious Campaign Funding Sources: Our 2012 election reportedly cost $3 billion. All of it was raised from private sources - often creating the appearance, or the reality, that our leaders are beholden to special interest groups. During the late Roman Republic, elections became staggeringly expensive, with equally deplorable results.

2 - Politics as the Road to Personal Wealth: During the late Roman Republic period, one of the main roads to wealth was holding public office, and exploiting such positions to accumulate personal wealth. As Lessig notes: Congressman, Senators and their staffs leverage their government service to move to private sector positions - that pay three to ten times their government compensation. Given this financial arrangement, "Their focus is therefore not so much on the people who sent them to Washington. Their focus is instead on those who will make them rich." (Republic Lost)

3 - Continuous War: A national state of security arises, distracting attention from domestic challenges with foreign wars. Similar to the late Roman Republic, the US - for the past 100 years - has either been fighting a war, recovering from a war, or preparing for a new war: WW I (1917-18), WW II (1941-1945), Cold War (1947-1991), Korean War (1950-1953), Vietnam (1953-1975), Gulf War (1990-1991), Afghanistan (2001-ongoing), and Iraq (2003-2011). And, this list is far from complete.

4 - Foreign Powers Lavish Money/Attention on the Republic's Leaders: Foreign wars lead to growing influence, by foreign powers and interests, on the Republic's political leaders - true for Rome and true for us. In the past century, foreign embassies, agents and l ...


In part because the copy/pasta tried to link a every statement to the original article but also because of LIBBY LIB LIB CLEANSING!
 
2014-01-07 10:34:27 PM  

Bugerz: whidbey: Bugerz: tinfoil-hat maggie: Bugerz: I feel like going off on some random tangential rant inaccurately comparing the end of Rome to the current affairs of 'MURKA!

Do it you'll feel better ; )

/For SPQR
[encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com image 293x172]

COPY/PASTA WHARGARBL ENGAGE!

1 - Staggering Increase in the Cost of Elections, with Dubious Campaign Funding Sources: Our 2012 election reportedly cost $3 billion. All of it was raised from private sources - often creating the appearance, or the reality, that our leaders are beholden to special interest groups. During the late Roman Republic, elections became staggeringly expensive, with equally deplorable results.

2 - Politics as the Road to Personal Wealth: During the late Roman Republic period, one of the main roads to wealth was holding public office, and exploiting such positions to accumulate personal wealth. As Lessig notes: Congressman, Senators and their staffs leverage their government service to move to private sector positions - that pay three to ten times their government compensation. Given this financial arrangement, "Their focus is therefore not so much on the people who sent them to Washington. Their focus is instead on those who will make them rich." (Republic Lost)

3 - Continuous War: A national state of security arises, distracting attention from domestic challenges with foreign wars. Similar to the late Roman Republic, the US - for the past 100 years - has either been fighting a war, recovering from a war, or preparing for a new war: WW I (1917-18), WW II (1941-1945), Cold War (1947-1991), Korean War (1950-1953), Vietnam (1953-1975), Gulf War (1990-1991), Afghanistan (2001-ongoing), and Iraq (2003-2011). And, this list is far from complete.

4 - Foreign Powers Lavish Money/Attention on the Republic's Leaders: Foreign wars lead to growing influence, by foreign powers and interests, on the Republic's political leaders - true for Rome and true for us. In the past century, foreign embassies, age ...


Anal bleaching and enemas is a very good thing... I think I heard that from Martha Stuart not sure though :/
 
2014-01-08 12:02:38 AM  
Your blog sucks, Moyers.
 
2014-01-08 12:07:05 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: private army


It's called Academi nowadays.
 
2014-01-08 12:07:53 AM  

Smirky the Wonder Chimp: tinfoil-hat maggie: private army

It's called Academi nowadays.


?
 
2014-01-08 12:09:12 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: Smirky the Wonder Chimp: tinfoil-hat maggie: private army

It's called Academi nowadays.

?


Used to be Xe, which used to be Blackwater.
 
2014-01-08 12:15:36 AM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: tinfoil-hat maggie: Smirky the Wonder Chimp: tinfoil-hat maggie: private army

It's called Academi nowadays.

?

Used to be Xe, which used to be Blackwater.


Oh, I just can't keep up anymore. I bet international courts cant either.
 
2014-01-08 12:50:21 AM  

coyo: Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:

If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?

Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.

They are excellent at getting money efficiently. That means that their return on investment is much higher than what they put in.


Feudalism STILL sucks, and say what you will, WE AREN'T RETURNING to it---
 
2014-01-08 01:59:51 AM  

Gway: coyo: Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:

If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?

Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.

They are excellent at getting money efficiently. That means that their return on investment is much higher than what they put in.

Feudalism STILL sucks, and say what you will, WE AREN'T RETURNING to it---


I am not advocating this. I am not saying that they are doing any useful work. I am just saying they are good at sucking the economy dry.
 
2014-01-08 03:16:40 AM  

edmo: It's all fun and games until everybody is poor and won't buy your shiat.


They can sell their shiat outside the US. Within the US? Unregulated tax-free haven where the rich can live in moated castles. Who cares if the peons can't afford their shiat. Let them eat cake. Or rat.
 
2014-01-08 03:32:27 AM  

The_Man_On_The_Phone: I see a lot of grumbling over the rich in here, but not really an answer to my question, so I'll just cut to the chase-- if the 1% were to be taxed like liberals want them to be, our economy would plummet from the drain on their resources.  We all benefit from them being on top.


I know!  Liberals just wreck everything.  I bet they even made you impotent by stealing the purity of your essence.  Stupid liberals.
 
2014-01-08 03:55:54 AM  

coyo: Gway: coyo: Debeo Summa Credo: coyo: The_Man_On_The_Phone: Serious question:

If the 1% gets taxed out of being the 1%, won't the economy take a dive?

Aren't they holding this place together, so to speak?

Serious answer : they take disproportionately more money out of the economy than they put in. So no, they are tearing the place apart.

How do they take "disproportionately" more money? They earn what they earn, like everyone else.

They are excellent at getting money efficiently. That means that their return on investment is much higher than what they put in.

Feudalism STILL sucks, and say what you will, WE AREN'T RETURNING to it---

I am not advocating this. I am not saying that they are doing any useful work. I am just saying they are good at sucking the economy dry.


Oh, OK, sorry...  But sorrowful it is, as social stratification is as ubiquitous as it is timeless.  And welcome to the NWO, aka globalism and the new and improved Feudal Order!
 
2014-01-08 04:18:32 AM  

fusillade762: Account created: 2002-05-14 17

Dammit, where do these goddamn sleeper trolls come from??


The admins take over long-dormant accounts and start posting.  Look for the 2+ year old accounts that you've never seen in the Politics tab before, suddenly posting 10+ times per thread as if they've been here all along.  That account then usually disappears again after a week or two.


Kinda insulting that they think we don't notice.


static.fjcdn.com
 
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