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(Patheos)   Seminary professor announces that he will "live like an atheist" for a year as an experiment. Step 1: Facing religious bigotry as your seminary fires you less than a week into the experiment   (patheos.com) divider line 102
    More: Asinine, religious bigotry, seminary, Adventist Church, Hemant Mehta, experiments  
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13641 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Jan 2014 at 2:08 PM (37 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-06 02:15:58 PM
17 votes:

EvilEgg: How does one "live like an atheist"?  Most Christians don't go to church, don't talk about Jesus much, and pretty much ignore Christ's teaching.


I thought about it, and I decided he could read the Bible, that's one thing many atheists do that Christians don't.
2014-01-06 02:13:09 PM
12 votes:
Not teaching at a seminary sounds like part of living like an atheist.
2014-01-06 02:26:33 PM
6 votes:

TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?


In the previous article, he notes he will stop attending church, cease praying, cease praising or otherwise referring to a deity as the cause of events, not read the Bible, read numerous texts from atheistic philosophies and atheist-specific philosophers, attend atheist gatherings, and attempt to speak with as many atheists as possible during this time. While there is an initial smattering of 'doing-it-wrong', he was questioning his beliefs before this process, and any attempt to live as something else as a trial means a lack of acceptance of the beliefs of this something else, or lack of beliefs in this circumstance. As far as anyone may be said to, this is as solid an attempt to live as an atheist as is possible, and he seems honest about his want to explore his own faith, especially the wavering aspect, and atheism.

This is what I remember doing in my early teens, once I found being an atheist was an option and my disenchantment with Christianity did not mean I had to replace with Islam, Buddhism, etc..
2014-01-06 02:36:15 PM
5 votes:
Next up, he can pretend to be gay... the same good Christians who fired him and turned him on to the street would happily beat the crap out of him on that same street... because that's how Jesus would want it.
2014-01-06 02:36:06 PM
5 votes:
For f*ck sake.  You want to live like an atheist?  Then continue what you are doing.  Plenty of worshipful people have come to the inner conclusion that god is not real, but change absolutely nothing.  I don't believe in God, but that doesn't stop me from cooking up a hell of a Seder dinner with my Mom and fasting on Yom Kippur.  I don't do it because I believe that God will have me die by fire, or drowning or wild beast.  But rather, I love my family, and the traditions and the food.  I think there is value in traditions that bind us to generations past.  Some are bad or dangerous and should be thrown away, but some are lovely.

The mark of a good religious experience is that you still find it enjoyable after you become an atheist.
2014-01-06 02:46:12 PM
4 votes:

drxym: What does "living like an atheist" even mean aside from having a lot more spare time and far less guilt?


Here's a good way to envision what it's like to live like an atheist.

Imagine living like a person that doesn't believe Zeus is real.
2014-01-06 02:40:01 PM
4 votes:
Ummm - this is crap....the guy's entire career is based around teaching and advising in religious matters.  Now he's spending a year 'as an atheist' - whatever that means.  To most people, that means he doesn't believe in God.  And that is contradictory to his career.

I'm a software developer.  If I decide to spend a year 'Not using Technology' I'd expect to be fired too.
2014-01-06 02:34:31 PM
4 votes:
I'm having a hard time sympathizing with this guy... seems like he's just an AW.

WTF does it even mean to "live like an atheist"? Is he really planning to attend our Tuesday Night Potluck and Abortion Dinners?

And the fact that he says that it's only for a year pretty much eliminates the possibility that he's going into his little experiment with anything resembling an open mind.
2014-01-06 02:31:43 PM
4 votes:
Ftfa: Just days after he made his announcement, they fired him until he rededicates himself to Jesus

I'm not seeing a problem here. He should just tell them that he dropped the experiment and keep going in secret. That way he'll get his job back, he gets to experience the need to keep his opinions secret for fear of persecution and he gets to examine if atheists really are untrustworthy scumbags who would lie because it is easier than telling the truth.
2014-01-06 02:23:17 PM
4 votes:

manbart: ftfa:

I don't think you can even pretend to be an atheist simply by reading books by atheist authors and attending atheist gatherings when your religious beliefs are still somewhere in the back of your mind - but I still applauded the fact that he was exploring atheism and wanted to learn more about it.

Who does this shiat?  Atheism is simply the non-belief in the supernatural, what is there to discuss? Sounds like a lame circle-jerk.

I think the experiment is a fail because these people are not representative of the vast majority of atheists.


"Live like an athiest straw man we can make fun of"

Really, this is worse than those "live like a homeless/poor person" articles. And that is setting the bar low.
2014-01-06 02:19:12 PM
4 votes:
ftfa:

I don't think you can even pretend to be an atheist simply by reading books by atheist authors and attending atheist gatherings when your religious beliefs are still somewhere in the back of your mind - but I still applauded the fact that he was exploring atheism and wanted to learn more about it.

Who does this shiat?  Atheism is simply the non-belief in the supernatural, what is there to discuss? Sounds like a lame circle-jerk.

I think the experiment is a fail because these people are not representative of the vast majority of atheists.
2014-01-06 02:14:39 PM
4 votes:
How does one "live like an atheist"?  Most Christians don't go to church, don't talk about Jesus much, and pretty much ignore Christ's teaching.
2014-01-06 03:32:26 PM
3 votes:

meanmutton: Christians believe that God gives individuals free will to choose between Heaven and Hell.


25.media.tumblr.com
2014-01-06 02:31:27 PM
3 votes:

Vangor: This is what I remember doing in my early teens, once I found being an atheist was an option and my disenchantment with Christianity did not mean I had to replace with Islam, Buddhism, etc..


you know what I did in my early twenties?  Nothing, I just kind of stopped thinking about religion entirely.  It just didn't really come up.  I stopped going to church after moving out of my parents house.  I just plain don't think about why I don't believe.  I don't have to be defensive enough about it to read on it or protest some church.

I'm more of the meh thinking on religion.
2014-01-06 02:29:16 PM
3 votes:

A Cave Geek: [global3.memecdn.com image 850x890]


media.tumblr.com

I bet that goes over great with all the wannabe psdeudo-intellectual libertarians sisterfarkers on your facebook wall doesn't it.

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it."

Neil deGrasse Tyson -
2014-01-06 02:28:08 PM
3 votes:
He's going to try talking to people nice even though they're not of his race, stop telling them what to think, let them decide for themselves. Wait....that reminds me of someone's teachings.
2014-01-06 02:14:15 PM
3 votes:
How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?
2014-01-06 02:12:04 PM
3 votes:
LOL

So very Christ-like.

Here's some trivia for you: Jesus hated anyone that wasn't a Christian.
2014-01-06 02:10:57 PM
3 votes:
I think he'll find it enlightening.
2014-01-06 05:04:35 PM
2 votes:

Finger51: BojanglesPaladin: A Cave Geek: Most of the people I'm referencing are college educated. Not nearly as many christians know as much about science as they think they do. the christian wing of the libertarian crowd is particularly annoying in that regard. Know nothing about science, think they know everything

That's cool. That's how most of us feel about atheists. It's fine if you don't believe in God, but it gets tiring listening to atheists trying to "poke holes" in the faith without a good grasp of adult theology. It's like a 6th grader telling a college grad that biology is dumb because sometimes brown-eyed parents have blue-eyed children.

/if I hear the "If god is all-knowing and all powerful, then why is there sin?" again, Imma gonna have to punch someone.

Preach it brother! You'll be happy to hear that goes both ways.

If I hear the "If we're descended from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?" question ... yeah. cockpunch.

so live and let live sez I. But please, stop legislating from your bible. It's great that you find peace etc. with your religion, but it'd be great if you just keep all that to yourself. kthxby.


I've been faced with that one, and rather than a cockpunch (difficult since it was a woman), it was much simpler to explain that similar to how she is related to her cousins through her grandparents, and looks similar to some cousins but different from others, we are related to chimpanzees through some very,very ancient great, great, great (repeat ad nauseum), grandparents.

Surprisingly, it was accepted with a "Why did no one ever explain it to me that way!" response rather than continued intractableness and unwillingness to learn.
2014-01-06 03:43:05 PM
2 votes:

InterruptingQuirk: Difference is the atheist doesn't have powerful groups that will run to their aid if they are offended by an off the cuff remark.


"Off-the-cuff"?

Ever been the object of aggressive proselytization?
I have. Many, many times.
My children have been aggressively proselytized.
I still have total strangers ring my doorbell and interrupt my meals to tell me all about Jebus.
On the Sabbath.

Having grown up in the overly-polished buckle of the Bible Belt, let me tell you a truth:
There is nothing "off-the-cuff" about this behavior. It is deliberate, demeaning, disgusting, and, in a place of business, absolutely unprofessional.
2014-01-06 03:31:27 PM
2 votes:
jigger:

The lake of eternal fire created by Jesus (God) for that purpose.

Nice soul you got there. Be a shame if anything happened to it. Maybe you love me and nothing bad happens to it. Maybe you get down on your knees and tell me how much you love and worship me and you want be in for a world of hurt.
2014-01-06 02:57:29 PM
2 votes:

Ant: Pants full of macaroni!!: You also have to loudly inform everyone within hearing range that you are an atheist

I've never done that. Usually it starts with a question from a believer like "What church do you go to?" or "has your son been baptized?"


How those conversations actually go down in my experience.

Religious:What church do you attend/denomination do you subscribe to/another religious question
Atheist: Oh sorry I'm an atheist, I don't believe in any of that.
Religious:OH AN ATHEIST, HEAR THAT EVERYBODY AN ATHEIST, OHHHH AN ATHEIST.
Atheist: Yeah, I don't believe in organized religions as they are all organized by man as ways to control the masses and ignorant.
Religious:OH AN ATHEIST, HEAR THAT EVERYBODY, ETC.....
Atheist: I'll just be leaving now.
2014-01-06 02:56:19 PM
2 votes:

Itstoearly: "A lot of atheists remain in the closet precisely because they're afraid of the ramifications of coming out."

Yes, and a lot of Christians hide their faith for the same reason.  Sorry if I am not surprised that humans across the board tend to be biased against people who are different than them.


ic.pics.livejournal.com
2014-01-06 02:51:33 PM
2 votes:

EvilEgg: EvilEgg: How does one "live like an atheist"?  Most Christians don't go to church, don't talk about Jesus much, and pretty much ignore Christ's teaching.

I thought about it, and I decided he could read the Bible, that's one thing many atheists do that Christians don't.


I've found that atheists are generally more willing to discuss theology logically than religious folks. Lots of religious folks get their panties in a twist when you ask uncomfortable questions. Very rarely do you find one that will discuss a touchy subject without condemning you.

The above is my experience. Not my intention to paint with a broad brush.

I had one girl condemn me to Hell in the beginning of a rather volatile conversation about televangelists and hypocrisy. By the end, she told me that "Jesus had forgiven me."

/shakes head
2014-01-06 02:42:35 PM
2 votes:
What does "living like an atheist" even mean aside from having a lot more spare time and far less guilt?
2014-01-06 02:40:53 PM
2 votes:
Just to be clear, you can (pretend to) be an atheist and be employed by a religious organization. That's not really a big deal.  What is a big deal is (pretending to) be an atheist and be employed by a religious organization to teach religion.

If you're in accounting or IT at a religious institution and someone says, "Do you believe in God?" your answer has no bearing on your ability to do your job.  If you're a religion teacher and a student asks what you think of the material you're teaching and you're answer is, "It's a nice story with lessons we can learn but a story none-the-less" then you've got some issues that arise.

That said, the school seems pretty but-hurt over this and they reasons they give are not religious in nature (they even praise it's merits). They're simply worried about funding. That's something they need to worry about for sure but it just seems wrong to do so.
2014-01-06 02:38:04 PM
2 votes:

ArgusRun: For f*ck sake.  You want to live like an atheist?  Then continue what you are doing.  Plenty of worshipful people have come to the inner conclusion that god is not real, but change absolutely nothing.  I don't believe in God, but that doesn't stop me from cooking up a hell of a Seder dinner with my Mom and fasting on Yom Kippur.  I don't do it because I believe that God will have me die by fire, or drowning or wild beast.  But rather, I love my family, and the traditions and the food.  I think there is value in traditions that bind us to generations past.  Some are bad or dangerous and should be thrown away, but some are lovely.

The mark of a good religious experience is that you still find it enjoyable after you become an atheist.


As a Catholic, the mark of a good religious experience is that you know you should be ashamed of yourself if you enjoyed it, as all enjoyable things are sinful.
2014-01-06 02:22:28 PM
2 votes:
You're either on the bus or your not. I got off on an early stop.
2014-01-06 02:18:46 PM
2 votes:

TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?


You also have to loudly inform everyone within hearing range that you are an atheist, and sue anyone who puts up any kind of religious display.

Or so I've been told.
2014-01-06 02:17:34 PM
2 votes:
Sky Cake!

"That sh&t [religion] was going on all over the planet. They would tell them about sky cookies, or sky pie, or sky baklava. And as each of these civilizations grew, they built ships; they'd go visit each other, and the one guy would walk off the boat and go,'Hey, did you hear the good news about the sky baklava?' and the first guy went,'It's CAKE, motherf%&ker! You're dead!"
 -God (Patton Oswalt)
2014-01-06 02:15:21 PM
2 votes:
global3.memecdn.com
2014-01-07 05:02:25 PM
1 votes:

ciberido: AgentPothead: Ant: Pants full of macaroni!!: You also have to loudly inform everyone within hearing range that you are an atheist

I've never done that. Usually it starts with a question from a believer like "What church do you go to?" or "has your son been baptized?"

How those conversations actually go down in my experience.

Religious:What church do you attend/denomination do you subscribe to/another religious question
Atheist: Oh sorry I'm an atheist, I don't believe in any of that.
Religious:OH AN ATHEIST, HEAR THAT EVERYBODY AN ATHEIST, OHHHH AN ATHEIST.
Atheist: Yeah, I don't believe in organized religions as they are all organized by man as ways to control the masses and ignorant.
Religious:OH AN ATHEIST, HEAR THAT EVERYBODY, ETC.....
Atheist: I'll just be leaving now.

Funny, based on your earlier post I would have imagined it went more like this:

Religious: What church do you attend?

Atheist:  Pull your head out of your ass!  That way, you'll finally get a chance to see reality, instead of the walls of your anal cavity!  I'm an atheist!  That  means not being ignorant to the reality around me in the non existent chance a god will punish or reward me after I die.

Religious: Oh sorry, I didn't realize you were an obnoxious twatwaffle.  I'll just be going now.


I can't speak for Mr. Ant, but IME, it tends to go more like this:

Religious: What church do you attend?

Atheist: None. I'm an atheist.

Religious:  You need to come to my church right now!

Atheist:  Sorry, no.

Religious:  But your immortal soul is in danger!

Atheist:  Nope.

Religious:  Oh, I see.  Satan already has your soul!  SATANIST!

Atheist:  Still no.

Religious:  I can't believe a SATANIST lives in my town!  How dare you even show your face in public!  You are a servant of evil!  Good Christian folk shouldn't even have to look at you!

Atheist:  Please go the fark away and leave me alone!

Religious:  YOU ARROGANT BIGOT!  How dare you infringe my religious freedom!
2014-01-07 03:14:07 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: DeaH: I wouldn't want an engineer who thinks pixies in the computers perform calculations. I don't want a doctor who think the all life was created in six days, six thousand years ago.

Ever been to Notre Dame Cathedral? Everyone involved in it's construction firmly believed in these "fairy tales". Oddly, their belief in the unprovable existence of God and angels, and demons (and probably witches and fairies and ghosts) did not in the least impact their ability to build an incredibly sound and massive building.

Both the father of modern biology and the man behind the "big Bang" theory (the science, not the TV show) were devoutly religious and firmly believed in these "fairy tales". Oddly, their belief in the unprovable existence of God and angels, and demons  did not in the least impact their ability to fundamentally advance science.

I don't know how many ways we can make this clear to you. Absolute acceptance of evolutionary theory is not a requirement for a physician.

But since it is YOUR doctor, you can use whatever criteria you like, no matter how nonsensical.


Actually, the Catholic Church has no problem with evolution.

You also misread my example. I do not want a technician fixing my computer who thinks faeries are inside running things. I do not want a doctor who beleives the basis for biology is that all life was created in six days six thousand years ago. Those things directly affect how repairs (to a body or a machine) are done. If an architect believes that life was created in six days six thousand years ago, well, he's not working on a biological structure, is he? On the other hand, if he believes that faeries will buttress the arches, yeah, I'd screen him out, too.
2014-01-07 02:38:09 PM
1 votes:

EvilEgg: How does one "live like an atheist"?


By living a very moral and ethical life and having very good reasons for everything you do, being able to explain the reasoning behind your personal moral code and why you hold it, and by examining every part of your life on a regular basis to make sure you're not doing anything irrational or harmful to yourself or others. .
2014-01-07 12:24:54 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: Pitabred: Hehe. That's cute, you think you can distinguish between micro-evolution and macro-evolution using something as imperfect and fluid as "speciation". Species are just naming scientists use for shorthand... species have jumped entire taxonomic trees before, and it's far from a hard delineation like you seem to think it is. Microevolution and macroevolution are the exact same thing, only operating on different timescales. If you can't conceive of something larger than a few thousand years, then no wonder you think there's a difference between the two.


I think it's cute that you can't distinguish between the SCIENCE of verifiable, reproducible empirical evidence like genetic variation among species (micro evolution) and extrapolative, non-reproducible, hypothetical evidence like speciation (macro-evolution) where we don't have the ability to confirm results.

Yes, "speciation" is an imperfect and fluid concept, which is kind of the point. And to be clear, species have not "jumped entire taxonomic trees", rather, scientists have changed their understanding of which taxonomic groups they properly belong to, which is a whole other can of worms having to do with the assumptive and subjective practice of applying morphological characteristics in extrapolation of assumed (but often inprovable)  common descent. It is vitally important that one does not confuse the 'proven' genetic variation over generations which is demonstrable, verifiable and most importantly, reproducible (see dog breeding for instance) with non-reproducing, genetically incompatible divergence of species (Chihuahuas and great danes are still genetically compatible.)

This is NOT to say that epoch evolution (speciation, "macro-evolution") is wrong. Rather, I am pointing out that "believing in evolution" is not a binary condition, and that while one can and should accept that species change over time, there is a great deal still to be proven about speciation and common descent and therefore, even ...


Are you trying to CDP?
Because you're f(l)ailing.
Badly.

Evolution is a mechanism. A fact. Observed directly. And the evidence - all of it - supports evolution.
You can quibble about how it works, and real scientists do, but evolution is a cold stone fact.
2014-01-07 12:21:41 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: DeaH: It matters because modern medicines are based on evolutionary science.

Not really. I hate to flip your lid here, but biology predates evolution. Evolution is a sub-set of biology. Can show me how evolutionary science directly impacts diagnosis of, say, lung cancer? Even when it comes to genetics, evolutionary science, which spans millennia and huge generational drifts isn't really relevant.

Again, biology underpins evolution, but in practical terms, it's not the other way around. For instance, analysis of mitochondrial DNA provides support for evolutionary theory - biology (a much older filed) is used to support it. I would say you have an imperfect understanding of the theory of evolution and its role in science and biology if you believe this to be true. A medical physician has no real need to understand, much less accept evolutionary theory in order to competently diagnose and treat physical ailments.


No, just because other biological knowledge came before knowledge of evolution, that does not mean that evolution isn't the underlying factor in biology. You seem to have an imperfect grasp of the difference between epistemological and informational hierarchies. And evolution has a lot to do with modern medicine.

Like all biological systems, both disease-causing organisms and their victims evolve. Understanding evolution can make a big difference in how we treat disease. The evolution of disease-causing organisms may outpace our ability to invent new treatments, but studying the evolution of drug resistance can help us slow it. Learning about the evolutionary origins of diseases may provide clues about how to treat them. And considering the basic processes of evolution can help us understand the roots of genetic diseases.

At the very least, an understanding of evolution helps physicians stop over-prescribing antibiotics. And that is the least-most application. Hereditary disease is often treated differently (and certainly diagnosed differently) than diseases that are not heritable. Hell, the flu alone is an excellent example of evolution, and a physician needs a basic grasp of this just to understand effective treatment and prevention. I go to a doctor, in part, because the doctor is supposed to be a lot more knowledgeable than I am about biological issues. I want expertise. A belief that evolution is just something made up is not expertise.

While it's true that I do not need a physicist to fix my computer, I do not want a tech who thinks the fairies make the system work. A doctor need not be en epidemiologist, but he or she better not think that the foundation for all biology is that all life was created in six days about six thousand years ago.
2014-01-07 09:57:43 AM
1 votes:

DiffMavis: I was led to believe that a turntable was for playing records (e.g. because it has a round table that turns so the needle plays the music) but if turntable also means multi-cd changer I'm all for it.


You can have a multi-disc cd player that's not a turn table.

thumbs2.ebaystatic.com

vs.

seattlecontent.s3.amazonaws.com
2014-01-07 07:27:04 AM
1 votes:

A Cave Geek: [global3.memecdn.com image 850x890]


Damn it, we've been over this. Jesus was a LICH. He raised himself from the dead, he wasn't mindless, and he could raise others. It's all there in the monster manual.
2014-01-07 01:16:41 AM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: Ant: Many atheists know believe they know The Bible backward and forward.

Not saying none do, but the percentage of Atheists I have debated who actually have any familiarity beyond basic Sunday School level is pretty much nil. Sure they can quote something they read in an atheist book or blog or whatever, but ask them something outside their pre-loaded bullet points? Blank.

To be fair, this is exactly the same situation when debating most Christians about their faith as well. Basic Sunday School level at best.


Oh, I'll freely admit that I don't have the silly thing memorized.  I've got better things to do with my time than memorize a book of fairy tales.

I've read it.  Once.  It's mostly deadly dull, with quite a bit of absurdity and plenty of violence.  I see no reason to read it again.

And there's no real point in debating any given point in it.  There is no god.  And once you understand that there is no god, any debate on a particular religion's views on gays or shrimp is absurdly irrelevant, other than as a bit of amusement.
2014-01-07 12:44:12 AM
1 votes:

Whodat: Given that theology is "is the systematic and study of the concepts of God and the nature of religious truths" and that atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of those concepts and beliefs, I can understand him being let go from a Theological Seminary. His stance is akin to going to basketball camp and rejecting the concept of all sports yet expecting to be able to still play the game and get paid to do it.



Do you expect an expert on the history of Nazi Germany to actually be a Nazi?

It's entirely possible to study something without believing or subscribing to it.    One could even argue it would make you BETTER at studying it objectively.
2014-01-07 12:42:41 AM
1 votes:
Which group of atheists did he live like though.

category 1: Most of the gamers in a video game/internet cafe at all hours.  Drinking alcohol and/or coffee. Yelling about shenanigans.  Occasionally having to run the store because the owner got drunk over a break-up and slept with his pants down around his ankles in the women's restroom of his own business.  (in case you're wondering why so specific. I was the random christian getting a little tipsy with that group.  And picking on the owner over it.)  Complete with an anarchist who believed in Jesus.  He wants anarchy.  Anyone who disagrees with him on it is an idiot according to him.  I got called that a few times.

category 2: atheists who love to read all kinds of fiction right along with the christian friends they somehow decided to get along with and were perfectly fine as long as you didn't insist that Cthulhu could be vaporized by Q.

I know there are other categories. Fark covers them plenty of times. I think I can leave it at that.
2014-01-06 11:59:56 PM
1 votes:

JusticeandIndependence: Vangor: This is what I remember doing in my early teens, once I found being an atheist was an option and my disenchantment with Christianity did not mean I had to replace with Islam, Buddhism, etc..

you know what I did in my early twenties?  Nothing, I just kind of stopped thinking about religion entirely.  It just didn't really come up.  I stopped going to church after moving out of my parents house.  I just plain don't think about why I don't believe.  I don't have to be defensive enough about it to read on it or protest some church.

I'm more of the meh thinking on religion.


Kind like me not spending much thought on not believing in astrology. Being an atheist isn't grueling.
2014-01-06 10:23:33 PM
1 votes:

MooseUpNorth: thisisarepeat: g4lt: So he's staying out of foxholes for the next year?  Sounds like a pretty sane thing to do.

I never got that whole "no atheist in fox holes" crap.  When I was being shot at, I didn't pause to beg baby jesus to make the bad men stop

I never got why they even try that argument. Yes, people grasp at straws when they're feeling sufficiently desperate, but it doesn't change the fact that people are grasping at straws out of desperation. This is not an argument that is complimentary towards religion. Quite the opposite.


I always wondered why Christians would want or need a foxhole.
2014-01-06 10:00:12 PM
1 votes:

thisisarepeat: g4lt: So he's staying out of foxholes for the next year?  Sounds like a pretty sane thing to do.

I never got that whole "no atheist in fox holes" crap.  When I was being shot at, I didn't pause to beg baby jesus to make the bad men stop


I never got why they even try that argument. Yes, people grasp at straws when they're feeling sufficiently desperate, but it doesn't change the fact that people are grasping at straws out of desperation. This is not an argument that is complimentary towards religion. Quite the opposite.
2014-01-06 09:37:11 PM
1 votes:

g4lt: So he's staying out of foxholes for the next year?  Sounds like a pretty sane thing to do.



I never got that whole "no atheist in fox holes" crap.  When I was being shot at, I didn't pause to beg baby jesus to make the bad men stop
2014-01-06 08:12:24 PM
1 votes:

DarkSoulNoHope: TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?

Stay home on sunday (or Saturday, since he's a Seventh Day guy), watch football, protest another public nativity scene


Atheists don't protest Nativity scenes, a handful of attention-seeking douches do, Atheist or not.

The guy is ironically off to a great start: he learned a big lesson right away. The whole "War on Christians/Christmas" thingy is sheer BS, and now he knows it.  I'm guessing that the guy thought he would do some Jebus version of "Black Like Me". I guess he never read about the aftermath of that book: The reporter received death threats and moved his family to Mexico for a while.
2014-01-06 07:29:18 PM
1 votes:
BojanglesPaladin: Finger51: Not really. One is a hammer (a.k.a. science. Belief via evidence) The other? Well you'll just need to have faith that it is a screwdriver (a.k.a. religion. Belief via faith)Not the same.

Unsurprising that you do not understand. Unsuprising that you feel the need to assert that your hammer and your hammer alone is the only valid tool.

when the two choices are between science and religion then yes, science is a much much much more valid tool.

 But I also have a screwdriver, and I find it serves me well for things that a hammer just can't help with, or just does it better. Having never used a screwdriver, or even seen the need for one, I can't expect you to grasp its utility.
If by 'Utility' you mean I have no need for deluding myself into belief without evidence (which is what your faithful screwdriver really boils down to) then you are correct. If you have need for your 'tool' (faith) then I hope it works out for you. And I really mean that, as I stated earlier- I'm happy that religion brings people peace/solace. Do I think that peace/solace is as you stated "perfectly valid" ? No. I don't.

But whereas I am perfectly happy for you in your hammer only life, I find it puzzling that you insist that my screwdriver is not really a tool.
Parsing here, but my intent was to posit that your tool relies on faith- your screwdriver is a tool certainly, but because it depends on faith it's validity is not "Perfect" as your comment stated. If I have a broken leg, morphine is going to make it feel better- but it won't heal it. I think your tool is like morphine. It's really good  at making you feel better but it's not going to 'cure' you of your broken leg.

One would think that *I* would know better than you (who have no screwdriver at all) whether the screwdriver works for me.
I never said or implied your screwdriver didn't work for you. In fact I am happy that you have a tool for your loose screws. I don't have any loose screws so I don't feel any particular need for that tool.

Even more curious that someone like you without a screwdriver would insist that the majority of his fellow man, who also have screwdrivers of various kinds, are somehow mistaken in their use of a tool that serves them well.
I find it curious that you think I said anything of the sort. The closest I can see that I said that one tool is evidence based and (implied) more valid, the other is faith based. How you claim that I've judged others as 'mistaken' is ... curious.

You are the one who brought up the validity of these tools. "they are both perfectly valid tools" And I disagree. The definition of valid is (of an argument or point) having a sound basis in logic or fact; reasonable or cogent. And I do not believe your tool meets that requirement. It may be a tool which has worked for you, but these two tools are not comparable as one of them does not meet the requirements to be 'valid'. Religion's basis on logic or fact is NOT sound, reasonable or cogent.

But keep on using your screwdriver if it helps you. You might want to ease up on the condescending tone, you sound like one of those rabid atheists.
2014-01-06 06:56:15 PM
1 votes:

ampoliros: Just to be clear, you can (pretend to) be an atheist and be employed by a religious organization. That's not really a big deal.  What is a big deal is (pretending to) be an atheist and be employed by a religious organization to teach religion.

If you're in accounting or IT at a religious institution and someone says, "Do you believe in God?" your answer has no bearing on your ability to do your job.  If you're a religion teacher and a student asks what you think of the material you're teaching and you're answer is, "It's a nice story with lessons we can learn but a story none-the-less" then you've got some issues that arise.

That said, the school seems pretty but-hurt over this and they reasons they give are not religious in nature (they even praise it's merits). They're simply worried about funding. That's something they need to worry about for sure but it just seems wrong to do so.


My good ampoliros, there is nothing more Christian than worrying about funding.
2014-01-06 06:55:52 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: There isnothing inherent to atheism which is analogous to "not using technology."

I would say that "Not believing in God" in a field predicated on teaching "How to believe and worship God" is one.


If faith is truly a private matter, it cannot be taught. And I don't believe in gods or supernatural beings, but being raised Catholic, I certainly explain its rites, cultures, and the desired thought patterns, and can (have) appeared quite observant to strangers when the need arises. I don't believe in Vulcans either, but I know enough about Trek lore I could educate the interested on them as well. I aerospace engineers who don't believe in the moon landing hoax, but understand how the evidence can be interpreted to support such conclusions.
2014-01-06 06:24:44 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: A Cave Geek: A competent physician would understand and 'believe' in the science that proves that organisms change and adapt to their environment. Someone who denies evolution IS a poor physician.

I would say you have an imperfect understanding of the theory of evolution and its role in science and biology if you believe this to be true. A medical physician has no real need to understand, much less accept evolutionary theory in order to competently diagnose and treat physical ailments. It is also worth noting that one can fully embrace and accept micro-evolution (the changing of species over time) without accepting macro-evolution (speciation or evolutionary divergence of species).

But either way, it's like saying your pediatrician must accept Freudian psychoanalysis.

But hey. It's your doctor. If you choose your physician based on whether they  share your political affiliation or religion, it's your call.


Evolution is neither politics nor religion. It is the underlying basis for all biology. Doctors who are bad biologists are bad doctors. The fact that you think evolution falls under politics or religion is quite telling.
2014-01-06 06:19:50 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: DeaH: I had an engineer say that evolution couldn't be real because there was no way it could account for the diversity of life on the planet. I never thought I would have to screen my physicians for a basic understanding of evolution, but I do now when insurance forced me to change doctors.

Why would that matter?

I have no idea whatsoever if my doctor 'believes' in evolution. It's never even occurred to me to ask. I care if he is a competent physician, but since neither he or I will be personally evolving during the time we work together, I can't imagine it matters in the least. Anymore than it matters if he is an atheist or a budhist or whether he believes in werewolves.


It matters because modern medicines are based on evolutionary science. If a doctor thinks that's hooey, I do not want that doctor prescribing me drugs. On some level, a physician ought to be a scientist. One is a very bad scientist, indeed, if one believes the Genesis section of the Bible takes precedence over biological science.
2014-01-06 05:59:20 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: Finger51: Not really. One is a hammer (a.k.a. science. Belief via evidence) The other? Well you'll just need to have faith that it is a screwdriver (a.k.a. religion. Belief via faith)Not the same.

Unsurprising that you do not understand. Unsuprising that you feel the need to assert that your hammer and your hammer alone is the only valid tool.

But by all means, feel free to live a hammer only life. I have a hammer too, and I like it just fine. It does everything I would expect a hammer to do. We both have fine hammers, and with them we can easily tackle all hammer related tasks.

But I also have a screwdriver, and I find it serves me well for things that a hammer just can't help with, or just does it better. Having never used a screwdriver, or even seen the need for one, I can't expect you to grasp its utility.

But whereas I am perfectly happy for you in your hammer only life, I find it puzzling that you insist that my screwdriver is not really a tool. One would think that *I* would know better than you (who have no screwdriver at all) whether the screwdriver works for me. Even more curious that someone like you without a screwdriver would insist that the majority of his fellow man, who also have screwdrivers of various kinds, are somehow mistaken in their use of a tool that serves them well.

LoneWolf343: Personally, I don't know how my old Bible professor kept his job at my college since he would say openly "Alcohol ain't going to send you to hell."

I'll give you a hint: If someone studied the bible, what would they find was Jesus' FIRST miracle?


What we non believers tend to worry about is huge numbers of people who believe in things they have no cause to believe in. That in itself may not seem scary but many of these beliefs have to do with harming or bothering people who don't believe. Kind of like really annoying salesman who might just gang up and kill you for not buying their stuff. Then, of course, there are the constant wars over whose god is right. Also, most religious people are determined that their beliefs be turned into laws that are inflicted on everyone, even those who don't believe. They don't seem to realize that by doing so they pretty much negate the whole 'faith' thing but hypocrisy is one of the trademarks of religion.

Of course YOU may be an enlightened believer (or at least think you are) in which case no one is really interested in bothering you.
2014-01-06 05:38:54 PM
1 votes:

Finger51: BojanglesPaladin: They are different frameworks by which to grasp the cosmos. If you try to use a hammer as a screwdriver, you will have poor results, but they are both perfectly valid tools. When you are building, you will have better results with both tools than only one.

Not really. One is a hammer (a.k.a. science. Belief via evidence) The other? Well you'll just need to have faith that it is a screwdriver (a.k.a. religion. Belief via faith)

Not the same.


Science is the only tool for understanding the physical world. As for human emotions, science is not all that great yet so religion is about on par. However, science always advances while religion usually tries to hold people back.
2014-01-06 05:22:18 PM
1 votes:
Well, we were all born Atheists.
2014-01-06 04:59:02 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: Why would that matter?

I have no idea whatsoever if my doctor 'believes' in evolution. It's never even occurred to me to ask. I care if he is a competent physician, but since neither he or I will be personally evolving during the time we work together, I can't imagine it matters in the least. Anymore than it matters if he is an atheist or a budhist or whether he believes in werewolves.


A competent physician would understand and 'believe' in the science that proves that organisms change and adapt to their environment.  Someone who denies evolution IS a poor physician.
2014-01-06 04:48:34 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: A Cave Geek: Most of the people I'm referencing are college educated. Not nearly as many christians know as much about science as they think they do. the christian wing of the libertarian crowd is particularly annoying in that regard. Know nothing about science, think they know everything

That's cool. That's how most of us feel about atheists. It's fine if you don't believe in God, but it gets tiring listening to atheists trying to "poke holes" in the faith without a good grasp of adult theology. It's like a 6th grader telling a college grad that biology is dumb because sometimes brown-eyed parents have blue-eyed children.

/if I hear the "If god is all-knowing and all powerful, then why is there sin?" again, Imma gonna have to punch someone.


Preach it brother! You'll be happy to hear that goes both ways.

If I hear the "If we're descended from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?" question ... yeah. cockpunch.

so live and let live sez I. But please, stop legislating from your bible. It's great that you find peace etc. with your religion, but it'd be great if you just keep all that to yourself. kthxby.
2014-01-06 04:39:17 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: A Cave Geek: Most of the people I'm referencing are college educated. Not nearly as many christians know as much about science as they think they do. the christian wing of the libertarian crowd is particularly annoying in that regard. Know nothing about science, think they know everything

That's cool. That's how most of us feel about atheists. It's fine if you don't believe in God, but it gets tiring listening to atheists trying to "poke holes" in the faith without a good grasp of adult theology. It's like a 6th grader telling a college grad that biology is dumb because sometimes brown-eyed parents have blue-eyed children.

/if I hear the "If god is all-knowing and all powerful, then why is there sin?" again, Imma gonna have to punch someone.


I respect religion, so long as it's not treated as 'on par' with science for explaining how the world works.  Religion is great for some areas of life, for SOME people.  But it's not for everyone.  The more people know about how the world works, the less they tend to believe in religion.

Personally I don't need to poke holes in Christianity.  It's not my belief system, so as long as you're not trying to cram it down my throat, or pass laws that I have to follow based on your faith, I don't personally care how many holes the belief system has.
2014-01-06 04:25:39 PM
1 votes:

BojanglesPaladin: A Cave Geek: Most Christians I've debated know about as much about science as an elementary school kid. They think the bible tells them all they need to know. They quote buzzwords without knowing what any of them actually mean.

I think the problem there is that your peers are just morons. Their religion is a secondary characteristic. Most people in this country are Christian, regardless of intellect, income level, or education. Of you WANT to talk to intelligent educated Christians, go find some intelligent, educated PEOPLE.

You might as well say that most brown-haired people you talk to know about as much about science as an elementary school kid.


Most of the people I'm referencing are college educated.  Not nearly as many christians know as much about science as they think they do.  the christian wing of the libertarian crowd is particularly annoying in that regard.  Know nothing about science, think they know everything.
2014-01-06 04:22:31 PM
1 votes:

A Cave Geek: Most Christians I've debated know about as much about science as an elementary school kid. They think the bible tells them all they need to know. They quote buzzwords without knowing what any of them actually mean.


I think the problem there is that your peers are just morons. Their religion is a secondary characteristic. Most people in this country are Christian, regardless of intellect, income level, or education. Of you WANT to talk to intelligent educated Christians, go find some intelligent, educated PEOPLE.

You might as well say that most brown-haired people you talk to know about as much about science as an elementary school kid.
2014-01-06 03:55:40 PM
1 votes:

demaL-demaL-yeH: Ever been the object of aggressive proselytization?
I have. Many, many times.
My children have been aggressively proselytized.
I still have total strangers ring my doorbell and interrupt my meals to tell me all about Jebus.
On the Sabbath.

Having grown up in the overly-polished buckle of the Bible Belt, let me tell you a truth:
There is nothing "off-the-cuff" about this behavior. It is deliberate, demeaning, disgusting, and, in a place of business, absolutely unprofessional.


Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. I am a person that lives in this world too.

And who has the groups, which no one challenges for fear of committing social suicide, to back them up, you or atheists? The ACLU might be your first thought, but they are not dedicated to one group. They even defend Christians from time to time.
2014-01-06 03:53:02 PM
1 votes:

Pangea: DeaH: I have no argument that the school has the right to fire him. They could do it even if he weren't doing this "experiment." Where I disagree is the statement that an atheist can not teach from the Bible.

I'm not honestly saying an atheist can't teach from the Bible, notice how I said it would "presumably preclude him from teaching the Bible as gospel truth"

The Bible quickly falls apart when taken as the living word of God, as many Christians treat it. If taken as parables and allegory it's very powerful. Jesus even talked about that. I can't quote the passage, but it was something along the lines of having to teach from simplified examples because people couldn't understand the true teachings.

The problem is that you can't force people to do exactly what you say under fear of eternal damnation if you give on the "direct word of God" angle.


I have never been to seminary school, but I do know ministers and priests who have been to seminary school. While there are religious services, they are separate from classes. I was under the impression that the Bible is not taught as the gospel truth in class. Well, of course it isn't taught that way in Catholic seminaries because the Bible isn't treated like that in Catholic doctrine, but I know a Presbyterian minister who said her seminary had a far more scholarly approach to the Bible.
2014-01-06 03:51:21 PM
1 votes:

demaL-demaL-yeH: InterruptingQuirk: Difference is the atheist doesn't have powerful groups that will run to their aid if they are offended by an off the cuff remark.

"Off-the-cuff"?

Ever been the object of aggressive proselytization?
I have. Many, many times.
My children have been aggressively proselytized.
I still have total strangers ring my doorbell and interrupt my meals to tell me all about Jebus.
On the Sabbath.

Having grown up in the overly-polished buckle of the Bible Belt, let me tell you a truth:
There is nothing "off-the-cuff" about this behavior. It is deliberate, demeaning, disgusting, and, in a place of business, absolutely unprofessional.


To be fair, they don't do it because you are an atheist, they do it because you are not a member of the congregation they are.

I have been very religious and very not religious in my life. During all of those times I was an object of aggressive proselytization for some group or another.
2014-01-06 03:47:24 PM
1 votes:

Pangea: Let me summarize what I read.

He was an adjunct professor, operating under a contract at a SEMINARY SCHOOL, presumably to teach people religious doctrine. Living as "an atheist" would presumably preclude him from teaching the Bible as gospel truth, because it must be taught from a position of faith unless you're just treating it as a scientific text to be taken apart point-by-point.

He is clearly an attention whore and couldn't be teaching in the capacity under which he was hired. They HAD to fire his stupid ass.

No outrage available.


And I would still disagree with the school.  I wouldn't trust someone who grew up in a church and never once questioned anything in the church.  Most people I know in the church I attend, have either converted or had a period in their lives that they took time away from church and questioned things before choosing to return.  If you are going to believe, take the time to search and study what you are saying you believe in.  Understand what it is you are saying you are standing for.  I was in my late 20's before I joined a church, and I stand behind my decision.  My dad is still pissed about the church I joined.  Funny thing is, we agree on all topics faith related.  He just doesn't trust the RLDS.  Example, we agree on not baptizing babies, yet he'll attend a church that baptizes babies and still doesn't like my choice of a church that does not baptize babies.

His ability to teach would not have been hampered by his experiment.  If anything, it would've gotten better.  I stopped trusting seminary schools a long time ago.  They are not ran by sane people.
2014-01-06 03:47:02 PM
1 votes:

meanmutton: jigger: HotWingConspiracy: LOL

So very Christ-like.

Here's some trivia for you: Jesus hated anyone that wasn't a Christian.

He doesn't hate them. He loves them. Just because he sends them into a lake of fire for eternity doesn't mean he hates them.

Technically, Christians believe that Jesus tries to get people to go to heaven but they choose the lake of eternal fire.


No, Christians believe that if a person doesn't follow a certain lifestyle, practice their religion a certain way, that they will go to hell. A lot like saying if a women dresses a certain way, she's asking to get raped.
2014-01-06 03:46:43 PM
1 votes:

A Cave Geek: Marcus Aurelius: A Cave Geek: [global3.memecdn.com image 850x890]

You're half right.

Dude...snark....You can make any belief system sound ridiculous when you break it down far enough.


Except that "break down" of the big bang theory was complete and utter BS not even remotely resembling what the current scientific theories are.
2014-01-06 03:45:48 PM
1 votes:
When I was back there in seminary school
There was a person there
Who put forth the proposition
That you can petition the Lord with prayer
Petition the lord with prayer
Petition the lord with prayer
You cannot petition the lord with prayer!
2014-01-06 03:33:28 PM
1 votes:

Pangea: Let me summarize what I read.

He was an adjunct professor, operating under a contract at a SEMINARY SCHOOL, presumably to teach people religious doctrine. Living as "an atheist" would presumably preclude him from teaching the Bible as gospel truth, because it must be taught from a position of faith unless you're just treating it as a scientific text to be taken apart point-by-point.

He is clearly an attention whore and couldn't be teaching in the capacity under which he was hired. They HAD to fire his stupid ass.

No outrage available.


I have no argument that the school has the right to fire him. They could do it even if he weren't doing this "experiment." Where I disagree is the statement that an atheist can not teach from the Bible. Textual analysis and understanding parables is not just for Christians. Selected internet atheists aside, most atheist I know are very polite. They have no wish to "convert" believers into atheists. There would be nothing that would get in the way of teaching the Bible or even passing on the dogma of the particular faith. What he could not do as an atheist is preach or evangelize.

But again, the school has a right to fire him. Just the fact that he has been open about this is grounds for firing him, and private schools do not even need grounds for adjunct.
2014-01-06 03:31:50 PM
1 votes:
Is "living like an atheist" similar to those "gay agenda" posts I've seen?
2014-01-06 03:31:35 PM
1 votes:

TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?


That and complain a lot and take high doses of SSRIs.
2014-01-06 03:23:17 PM
1 votes:

meanmutton: The Southern Dandy: meanmutton: jigger: HotWingConspiracy: LOL

So very Christ-like.

Here's some trivia for you: Jesus hated anyone that wasn't a Christian.

He doesn't hate them. He loves them. Just because he sends them into a lake of fire for eternity doesn't mean he hates them.

Technically, Christians believe that Jesus tries to get people to go to heaven but they choose the lake of eternal fire.

So Jesus/God is impotent?  He has no power to stop a person from going to hell? Why pray to him if he's impotent?

Christians believe that God gives individuals free will to choose between Heaven and Hell.


"Worship me or I torture you for eternity!" doesn't seem much like "free will" to me, it sounds like a false choice. Something lots of abusers do.
2014-01-06 03:17:54 PM
1 votes:
See, the thing is, just being a atheist insults people of religiosity. You've called them idiots as soon as you tell them you're an atheist. Worse, you've called their mama an idiot too (because you generally don't get religious people without them having religious parents).

People hate being called idiots.
2014-01-06 03:01:07 PM
1 votes:
I happen to think that there are a lot more atheists out there than you would find on a survey though many would decline the label.

I was raised in a religious household and quite frankly my early life revolved around church. My father was ordained (though never preached often), I spent summers in camps (do not send your children to these, these places are rife with molestation, etc), completed in Bible competitions (yes, they are real), went to a private Baptist college, and everything else.

Then in college, things changed. Even in that highly conservative space there was a lot to open my eyes. Hell, one of my roommates in college was gay and did cross-dressing shows out of town a few times per year for fun. During and after college I slipped away from religion as I formed my own opinions about it. And now, I am an atheist though I might never call myself that.

I still go to service with my parents when I'm in town, I observe many of the traditions I grew up with and I'm unlikely to call myself anything other than "Christian". It would break my parents hearts if they knew and that's more important than a label.

My wife and I have even talked about joining a Unitarian Universalist church so that our children can grow up with traditions and have perspective on religion. Too often I've seen those unexposed to religion convert later in life and become zealots because it fills a need they never knew about or pursued and I don't want that to happen to my kids.
2014-01-06 02:59:11 PM
1 votes:
This is just like the guns n' ammo editor whose entire career was utterly destroyed just because he suggested that it might be reasonable for a state to require handgun training before issuing a concealed carry permit.

This is how right wing groups respond to critical thinking.
2014-01-06 02:58:49 PM
1 votes:

Itstoearly: "A lot of atheists remain in the closet precisely because they're afraid of the ramifications of coming out."

Yes, and a lot of Christians hide their faith for the same reason.  Sorry if I am not surprised that humans across the board tend to be biased against people who are different than them.


Where are these hiding Christians? I worked for an engineering firm for many years. They had a lunch break Bible study. The company I worked for before than had morning, afternoon, and evening prayer groups.  All these activities were voluntary and not run by the business owners, but no one was hiding.
2014-01-06 02:55:29 PM
1 votes:

EvilEgg: How does one "live like an atheist"?  Most Christians don't go to church, don't talk about Jesus much, and pretty much ignore Christ's teaching.


My experience has shown me atheists live a more Christian life (minus the praying and church attendance) than the most vocal fundamentalist Christians I know.
Ant
2014-01-06 02:53:55 PM
1 votes:

Pants full of macaroni!!: You also have to loudly inform everyone within hearing range that you are an atheist


I've never done that. Usually it starts with a question from a believer like "What church do you go to?" or "has your son been baptized?"
2014-01-06 02:52:37 PM
1 votes:

Ant: How the hell do you live like an atheist? Do you just sleep in on Sunday?

/atheist


I believe the general answer to your question is this:

The only objective difference between atheists and Christians is that atheists tend to be more ideologically independent, are better educated, slightly wealthier, have higher rates of charitable giving, and usually score higher on empathy tests.

So, I guess the answer is that he'd go to school, learn to reason better, get a better job, care more about the people around him, and give back to society.

Cool part was I didn't have to say anything about Church or religion in there.
2014-01-06 02:52:04 PM
1 votes:
I'll try to explain what "living like an atheist" means since nobody seems to get it. Imagine your head was literally inserted into your anus. This was the normal way a large majority of the planet lived. Then imagine one day, you pulled your head out of your anus and got a chance to see reality, instead of the walls of your anal cavity. That's what "living like an atheist" means, pulling your head out of your ass. It means not being ignorant to the reality around you in the non existent chance a god will punish or reward you after you die. It means having the self will to say, humans don't know everything and we never will,but I'm okay with that. And that doesn't mean we should stop learning just because we can't know everything. The opposite, we should always be chasing the elusive knowledge.
Or just, you know, you hairless apes can keep killing each other over imagined slights to imagined deities until you don't exist anymore and the universe can collectively breathe a sigh of relief.
2014-01-06 02:52:02 PM
1 votes:

DeaH: The problem with that is that his beliefs have not changed. He never said he no longer believes in God, just that he will try to "live like an atheist" for a year.


I know Fark is not in the habit of reading articles, least of all a reference to a previous article which is itself a reference to another article, but I wanted to note this is wrong; his beliefs have changed and are changing:

In short, I will do whatever I can to enter the world of atheism and live, for a year, as an atheist. It's important to make the distinction that I am not an atheist. At least not yet. I am not sure what I am. That's part of what this year is about.
2014-01-06 02:51:40 PM
1 votes:

DontMakeMeComeBackThere: Captain Darling: Not teaching at a seminary sounds like part of living like an atheist.

Ding Ding Ding

If he really wanted to "live as an atheist", and not just, you know, research it like a non-attention-whoring person would do then NOT being employed by a religious organization should be an expected part of that "living as" arrangement.  Are we supposed to feel sympathy for him?


Why would you have to be part of the organization's religion to be employed by a religious organization?  If you are teaching people about the Bible as a religious text, why would it be required that you think it is?  Not being snarky, but I would imagine lots of people who work in many faith-based organizations are not of that faith.  Aren't most hospitals faith based for the advantageous tax and zoning rules?
2014-01-06 02:51:32 PM
1 votes:

firefly212: Next up, he can pretend to be gay


He's a fundamentalist preacher, pretending to be straight is more likely to be part of his skill set.
2014-01-06 02:51:07 PM
1 votes:
The "live like an atheist" thing bugs me too.  I don't research atheism, I don't prosletyze and I don't go to meetings.  I *did* read the bible which, as someone pointed out upthread, a fair number Christians probably don't (other than the cherry-picked passages someone told them to read).
2014-01-06 02:51:04 PM
1 votes:

The Southern Dandy: drxym: What does "living like an atheist" even mean aside from having a lot more spare time and far less guilt?

Here's a good way to envision what it's like to live like an atheist.

Imagine living like a person that doesn't believe Zeus is real.


Thats an amazingly concise way of putting it.  You.... I like you.
2014-01-06 02:49:31 PM
1 votes:

HotWingConspiracy: LOL

So very Christ-like.

Here's some trivia for you: Jesus hated anyone that wasn't a Christian.


Is this a troll?  The number of practicing Christians while Jesus was alive varies between 0 and 12ish.
2014-01-06 02:43:27 PM
1 votes:

manbart: ftfa:

I don't think you can even pretend to be an atheist simply by reading books by atheist authors and attending atheist gatherings when your religious beliefs are still somewhere in the back of your mind - but I still applauded the fact that he was exploring atheism and wanted to learn more about it.

Who does this shiat?  Atheism is simply the non-belief in the supernatural, what is there to discuss? Sounds like a lame circle-jerk.

I think the experiment is a fail because these people are not representative of the vast majority of atheists.


This is why I've started using the term apatheist. Too many people hear atheist and think if the minority who are vocal about the non-existence of god. There's agnostic, but even then people try to pull you in to some kind of debate because you acknowledge there COULD be something given the right evidence.

Theism just has no relevance to my perspective on life, and I don't care enough to discuss the merits until it infringes on my life.

/care enough to bring up the distinctions though
2014-01-06 02:42:49 PM
1 votes:

JusticeandIndependence: Nothing, I just kind of stopped thinking about religion entirely.  It just didn't really come up.  I stopped going to church after moving out of my parents house.  I just plain don't think about why I don't believe.  I don't have to be defensive enough about it to read on it or protest some church.


Which is reasonable. As is having an interest in matters of religion for cultural circumstances or as belief in finding answers to major questions. As is having an interest in matters of philosophy and ethics, which is what tend to be 'atheist texts'. But when you do not know what atheism is or this is a choice, sometimes the more aggressive antitheistic texts and such are needed to frame.
2014-01-06 02:41:31 PM
1 votes:
"Hey guys, I need more media attention for my thingy. Could you fire me for a year? K THX BYE!"

I applaud their marketing acumen. His "reaffirmation" to God next year should pull big ratings!
2014-01-06 02:40:05 PM
1 votes:

Vangor: Satanic_Hamster: I don't go to atheist lectures or clubs, apparently I'm doing it wrong?

Be mindful, his world-view is one of having been a pastor and professor in what is a rather structured denomination of Protestantism. For one to live as a member of any faith would be to steep themselves in the ritual and practices and representations of belief. Without solid ritual and practices and belief, this is what he has chosen.


Every night, I put a few cd's into the turn table, open a beer, and play Counter Strike.  Does that count?
2014-01-06 02:39:47 PM
1 votes:
The internet has made me "hard", right now I think this guy is just being a troll.
2014-01-06 02:39:19 PM
1 votes:
Maybe he's doing this in reverse:

img.timeinc.net
2014-01-06 02:38:54 PM
1 votes:
Did anybody posit that the university may have 'fired' him as part of the experiment?
2014-01-06 02:35:37 PM
1 votes:

meanmutton: jigger: HotWingConspiracy: LOL

So very Christ-like.

Here's some trivia for you: Jesus hated anyone that wasn't a Christian.

He doesn't hate them. He loves them. Just because he sends them into a lake of fire for eternity doesn't mean he hates them.

Technically, Christians believe that Jesus tries to get people to go to heaven but they choose the lake of eternal fire.


So Jesus/God is impotent?  He has no power to stop a person from going to hell? Why pray to him if he's impotent?
2014-01-06 02:34:55 PM
1 votes:

A Cave Geek: [global3.memecdn.com image 850x890]


Reverse CDP does not work.
/Mainly because the creationist demotivational does not, in any way, resemble a parodic take on evolution, biology, or astrophysics.
//Science, martherfarker. It works.
2014-01-06 02:33:56 PM
1 votes:

Satanic_Hamster: I don't go to atheist lectures or clubs, apparently I'm doing it wrong?


Be mindful, his world-view is one of having been a pastor and professor in what is a rather structured denomination of Protestantism. For one to live as a member of any faith would be to steep themselves in the ritual and practices and representations of belief. Without solid ritual and practices and belief, this is what he has chosen.
2014-01-06 02:32:57 PM
1 votes:
So he's staying out of foxholes for the next year?  Sounds like a pretty sane thing to do.
2014-01-06 02:24:55 PM
1 votes:

Captain Darling: Not teaching at a seminary sounds like part of living like an atheist.


Ding Ding Ding

If he really wanted to "live as an atheist", and not just, you know, research it like a non-attention-whoring person would do then NOT being employed by a religious organization should be an expected part of that "living as" arrangement.  Are we supposed to feel sympathy for him?
2014-01-06 02:21:11 PM
1 votes:

TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?



Dear God I don't believe in...
*wink wink*
Please DON'T watch over me or my family...
*wink wink*
Amen

Just like a real atheist does!
2014-01-06 02:20:41 PM
1 votes:
elitemrp.net
2014-01-06 02:18:01 PM
1 votes:

TheOnion: How does one live like an atheist? Stop praying and going to church?


Stay home on sunday (or Saturday, since he's a Seventh Day guy), watch football, protest another public nativity scene when the Christians want to play "We're the best religion and we're going to prove it by displays like this."
2014-01-06 02:15:19 PM
1 votes:
Yes, not doing my job is...an EXPERIMENT...to prove how important my job is. That's it.  See you in 6 months.
2014-01-06 02:12:21 PM
1 votes:
It's not religious bigotry when a seminary fires you as a Pastor because of your religious beliefs.
 
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