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(AZCentral)   1970s: Don't let your baby eat your cocaine. 1980s: Don't let your baby eat your crack. 1990s: Don't let your baby eat your heroin. 2000s: Don't let your baby eat your pot. 2010s: Don't let your baby eat your e-cigarette's liquid nicotine   (azcentral.com) divider line 30
    More: Obvious, poison control center, cigarettes, electronic cigarettes, cocaine  
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3243 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Jan 2014 at 6:35 AM (38 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2014-01-06 07:49:10 AM
3 votes:

Herr Morgenstern: Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?


Because they have to regulate every single farking thing associated with tobacco. Its the principle for them and they won't give up.
2014-01-06 07:01:20 AM
3 votes:
Ugh, another anti-vaping story for the news.... At least someone figured out where all this is coming from:

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/state-local-politics/194395-wh y- do-nanny-staters-hate-e-cigarettes

Looks like Big Pharma is behind it.
2014-01-06 06:37:01 AM
3 votes:
Save the world a ton of money and don't have children in the first place if you can't control yourself enough that you have to get the fix for your addiction around your children.

/Booze counts.
2014-01-06 10:38:40 AM
2 votes:
Is this the thread where people confuse nicotine with tar in cigarettes?

/goody
//Still standing over my simmering pot of tomatoes, btw.
///added peppers to up the nicotine levels.
2014-01-06 10:18:55 AM
2 votes:

Pangea: Psychopusher: Everyone else who decries them and isn't a NIMBY is doing so because they're in the pocket of one of the other two.

False. You left out people who quit smoking and know you can too. I used to smoke, but I'm not anti-smoking. My mom is allowed to smoke in my car and in my house. If someone wants to vape around me more power to them, and I'm not getting money from anyone.

I do however refuse to see e-cigarettes as anything other than shifting one bad habit for a less bad habit. Just because someone refuses to sign-off on your bullshiat isn't the same as trying to say you shouldn't be allowed to do it.


Point taken -- yes, the evangelical ex-smokers, I forgot about them.  "Just quit!  I did it, you can too!"  Yeah, no.  Not everyone is you -- thankfully.

And yes, to an extent E-cigs are shifting from a bad habit to a much less bad habit.  That's the point, though.  E-cigs aren't about quitting nicotine.  They're about harm reduction by quitting tobacco cigarettes.  Nobody is claiming otherwise.  (Or if they are, they've missed the point.)  Many of us have tried loads of other methods to quit and none of them worked.  Maybe we just don't have the willpower to quit.  Maybe we like nicotine but don't like smoking, yet couldn't unlink the two by any other means.  Whatever the case, vaping is an incredibly effective method of getting off of tobacco cigarettes.  It's also a significant threat to Big Pharma and the government's cash cows, and much of the controversy is manufactured.

Nicotine has been demonized for years in an effort to "denormalize" smoking by using nicotine as a convenient proxy for the stuff that's actually bad in cigarettes. (nicotine in and of itself isn't particularly bad -- no more so than caffeine -- but it's addictive and is what keeps people inhaling all the other bad crap in combusted tobacco, so it was a useful scapegoat.)  Now that we've been able to decouple nicotine in a manner that lets people maintain aspects of the habit, nicotine is still considered the big bad demon, but it's simply not true.
2014-01-06 09:55:11 AM
2 votes:

stoli n coke: Herr Morgenstern: Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?

Because it looks like your still smoking. And we can't have that. A lot of work has gone into publicly shaming smokers, and they can't figure out a way around that stigma that involves still enjoying themselves.


Nothing particularly.  It's the current bugaboo the NIMBY's like to fuss over, Big Pharma wants to scare you away from because they eat into the profits of their ineffective NRT products, and governments want to warn you away from because it eats into tobacco tax revenue.  Everyone else who decries them and isn't a NIMBY is doing so because they're in the pocket of one of the other two.

E-cig liquid contains nicotine, propylene glycol (which you already consume regularly as it's in many, many things), vegetable glycerine (which you've also consumed, often used as the base for liquid medications), and food-grade flavourings.  PG and VG vapor are about the same, and have been extensively studied since the 40s and are generally recognized as safe.  Nicotine unto itself isn't particularly harmful when inhaled in E-cigs, about on par in terms of addictiveness and effect on the body as caffeine. It's highly poisonous if you drink it though, so yeah... don't do that.  And if you're stupid enough to leave it around for your kid to get at, you shouldn't be a parent, same as if you leave bleach or cleaners or other crap within ankle-biter reach.  Any any every E-cigarette and liquid manufacturer will state that right on the label.
2014-01-06 09:39:00 AM
2 votes:
So require the use of child-proof caps on the bottles.

What did all the haters think people were going to do when they made smoking practically impossible? Quit cold turkey overnight and just suffer because it's what they deserve?

I think this is about punishment for "poor choices", and the anti-smokers want smokers to suffer because they lost someone to smoking and it hurt their feelings. Or they had to smell smoke and it stinks and so smokers must pay. Something like that.
2014-01-06 07:38:24 AM
2 votes:

Herr Morgenstern: Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?


Because it looks like your still smoking. And we can't have that. A lot of work has gone into publicly shaming smokers, and they can't figure out a way around that stigma that involves still enjoying themselves.
2014-01-06 07:28:28 AM
2 votes:
Incidentally, you also shouldn't let your kids take big ol' swigs of bleach, lighter fluid, drain cleaner, cough syrup, axle grease, lye, hair spray, Windex, diswashing soap, WD40, or silver polish.

Any of you parents need any other pointers?
2014-01-06 07:11:36 AM
2 votes:
If you're not smart enough to prevent your crotch-droppings from drinking liquid nicotine, the world has a way of pointing out to you that you really have no business being a parent.
2014-01-06 07:10:41 AM
2 votes:

desertfool: Ugh, another anti-vaping story for the news.... At least someone figured out where all this is coming from:

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/state-local-politics/194395-wh y- do-nanny-staters-hate-e-cigarettes

Looks like Big Pharma is behind it.


That's a totally unbiased article you linked to.

Or maybe you're just another e-cig ninny who likes to whine.
2014-01-06 02:03:19 PM
1 votes:

mccallcl: HeartBurnKid: mccallcl: HeartBurnKid: Growing your own tobacco.

...if a tobacco leaf was deadly on contact, maybe.

I'm not shiatting on e-digs conceptually, I'm a user myself, but the reality is we are playing a dangerous game right now and we're getting away with it because no one is really watching. It's not the use of these things that needs regulation, but the manufacture certainly does.

So how many people have died as a result of nicotine spills in the process of home brewing e-cig juice? If it's such a clear and present danger, then you must have some statistical evidence, right?

How many people have died falling out of hot air balloons? Do I have to prove to you that being way high up off the ground is dangerous before you agree that operators of hot-air balloons should be regulated and their use should be controlled?

There was a time before any astronauts died going into space, but we all knew it was dangerous. 40mg of nicotine is lethal for adults and as little as 1mg for children. You're arguing against the regulation of a toxic substance for producers, just so you know, not the storage or use by consumers. Stumping for business interests over consumer safety is an interesting choice.


I take it the answer is "no", then? Despite all the people home brewing the stuff, and it being "deadly to the touch", you can't give me anything?

I shouldn't be surprised, I suppose, since you seem to think my arguing for home brewers to have the ability to mix their own juice is somehow an argument in favor of Big Business. It's pretty clear you aren't bothering to read much on this topic, including anything I write.
2014-01-06 11:45:27 AM
1 votes:

mccallcl: HeartBurnKid: Growing your own tobacco.

...if a tobacco leaf was deadly on contact, maybe.

I'm not shiatting on e-digs conceptually, I'm a user myself, but the reality is we are playing a dangerous game right now and we're getting away with it because no one is really watching. It's not the use of these things that needs regulation, but the manufacture certainly does.


So how many people have died as a result of nicotine spills in the process of home brewing e-cig juice? If it's such a clear and present danger, then you must have some statistical evidence, right?
2014-01-06 11:43:12 AM
1 votes:
I got serious about quitting smoking 2 days ago. I went from 30 cigarettes a day to 8 in one day, with the help of vaping. I've smoked for the last 30 years. If I can cut back that drastically, that quickly, with something cheaper than cigarettes without as much tar and various poisons, I'd encourage anyone trying to quit to try it.

The patches and nasal stuff and gum and pills don't address a significant part of the habit, which is the rituals involved in smoking. This does.

In addition, the liquid you buy can be adjusted downward as you go. Meaning right now I'm using 12mg nicotine. But in a few weeks I can cut that to 6. And for the last month I can go to 0 to taper off and eventually quit even the ritual. So far so good.

Seriously, the overwrought fears of e-cigs and vaporizers is stupid. It's not regulated? Woopty shiat. Cigarettes are and they're filled with tar and dozens of chemicals and poisons. What exactly are THOSE regulations preventing....?
2014-01-06 10:38:08 AM
1 votes:

Psychopusher: Now that we've been able to decouple nicotine in a manner that lets people maintain aspects of the habit, nicotine is still considered the big bad demon, but it's simply not true.


I'm also not pushing for vaping to be illegal. I'll readily admit the nicotine was calming to my nerves when I still smoked.

It's quite obviously a push for moral puritanism that is conveniently wrapped in the "think of the children" rhetoric. People also drink alcohol, much of which is available in very tasty flavors that appeal to kids. We saw how well prohibition worked there, and as far as I know there have been no driving related accidents because people consumed too much e-cig vapor.
2014-01-06 10:27:02 AM
1 votes:

Psychopusher: I suggest an MSRP of $6.99 for a 10ml bottle to those who sell my line, but it's up to them.


Ah, okay, now I think I see why you keep comparing nicotine and caffeine.
2014-01-06 10:17:40 AM
1 votes:

mccallcl: There's gonna have to be some regulation on this stuff, there's too much profit in making magic juice for $1.75 a bottle and selling it for $10. I imagine that eventually e-digs will have to be disposable and completely self-contained. There's no way the authorities are going to just let people DIY this stuff for much longer. For the record, I use e-cigs.


Most of it is convenience though. It's perfectly legal to grow tobacco in your own backyard. It's relatively trivial to dry and process it, which can be learned by a simple visit to a tobacco museum or watching a youtube video.
2014-01-06 10:11:50 AM
1 votes:

valkore: Yes, you have a right to smoke.  But it's one of those selfish, disgusting, and self destructive things you can do.


I feel the same way about driving a car, so I'm not empathetic when people and their families get killed doing something stupid like driving to get iced cream. My empathy is not important, though, because the practical matter of people driving to get iced cream doesn't involve my feelings at all. So I am more interested in making sure that driving to get iced cream (easily more dangerous, selfish and anti-social than smoking) is not unsafe, insofar as I am interested in the safety of other people I don't know, which is to say not very.

If you think smokers are "indignant" about smoking, try stopping someone from driving and see how that goes. Usually requires the police to step in.

Psychopusher: Already done.


There's gonna have to be some regulation on this stuff, there's too much profit in making magic juice for $1.75 a bottle and selling it for $10. I imagine that eventually e-digs will have to be disposable and completely self-contained. There's no way the authorities are going to just let people DIY this stuff for much longer. For the record, I use e-cigs.
2014-01-06 10:10:59 AM
1 votes:
stopped reading after "second Hand Vapor" ...


SERIOUSLY?

Non smokers are worried about water...


static1.wikia.nocookie.net
2014-01-06 09:59:39 AM
1 votes:

mccallcl: So require the use of child-proof caps on the bottles.


Already done.  99.9% of E-liquid bottles have childproof caps.  I never use anything but for my line of juices, and I also print clear warnings on all of the labels.  There are a few exceptions - many juice that come in glass bottles have non-childproof dropper caps. (Halo is one exception, they use childproof dropper caps.)  Some few small upstarts use non-childproof plastic caps, but they usually get called out for it in reviews, as well they should.
2014-01-06 09:44:19 AM
1 votes:

Elegy: Ah, this old chestnut. You are aware that since nicotine has been divorced from tobacco smoke as a delivery method, numerous medicinal uses of nicotine have been found? Everything from treating and preventing ulcerative colitis, Alzheimer's and OCD to the management of OCD.

Saying "nicotine is a poison" is almost nonsensical. EVERYTHING is a poison, taken in large enough quantities. Hundreds of children die every year of acute dihydrogen monoxide poisoning. It's proven to be more dangerous than nicotine. Where's the regulation to protect the children from this dangerous substance?


Dihydrogen monoxide is essential for life. An expensive habit that the body doesn't need isn't

I'm not even trying to convince people not to smoke, but the medical argument is tenuous at best. There are lots and lots of substances that are very useful medically, but that only makes them LESS appropriate for liberal application by someone addicted to the effects in an uncontrolled manner.
2014-01-06 09:25:31 AM
1 votes:

abrobi: Elegy: Public Savant: Elegy: Public Savant: Nicotine IS a poison. It restricts your bloodvessels, so a high concentration (such as in that E-cig fluid) will kill you or the ususpecting child if ingested.

Saying "nicotine is a poison" is almost nonsensical. EVERYTHING is a poison, taken in large enough quantities.

Go here: http://www.durham.gov.uk/pages/Service.aspx?ServiceId=380

Press Ctrl + F. Thin type 'nicotine'.

Oh, my - it's a poison!

Also, you should make sure that you don't ingest any dihydrogen monoxide for at least a week. It would solve a few problems, I'm sure of it.

Wow. You provided me with evidence that the city of Durham, United Kingdom, has regulated nicotine as a poison and requires for you to have a valid permit to sell nicotine inside city limits.

Truly, you have proven beyond a shadow of scientific doubt that nicotine has no therapeutic benefits.

That sure taught me not to tangle with one of the foremost giants of intellectual debate currently active on the Internet. Let this be a lesson to everyone! Don't tangle with Public Savant! He'll bury you under a blizzard of peer review citations and make you look like a fool!

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0446.html

It is a poison. An insecticide by the CDC's view of it.


And?

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh /npg/npgd0262.html
2014-01-06 08:49:47 AM
1 votes:

Public Savant: Elegy: Public Savant: Nicotine IS a poison. It restricts your bloodvessels, so a high concentration (such as in that E-cig fluid) will kill you or the ususpecting child if ingested.

Saying "nicotine is a poison" is almost nonsensical. EVERYTHING is a poison, taken in large enough quantities.

Go here: http://www.durham.gov.uk/pages/Service.aspx?ServiceId=380

Press Ctrl + F. Thin type 'nicotine'.

Oh, my - it's a poison!

Also, you should make sure that you don't ingest any dihydrogen monoxide for at least a week. It would solve a few problems, I'm sure of it.


Wow. You provided me with evidence that the city of Durham, United Kingdom, has regulated nicotine as a poison and requires for you to have a valid permit to sell nicotine inside city limits.

Truly, you have proven beyond a shadow of scientific doubt that nicotine has no therapeutic benefits.

That sure taught me not to tangle with one of the foremost giants of intellectual debate currently active on the Internet. Let this be a lesson to everyone! Don't tangle with Public Savant! He'll bury you under a blizzard of peer review citations and make you look like a fool!
2014-01-06 08:10:52 AM
1 votes:

Public Savant: Nicotine IS a poison. It restricts your bloodvessels, so a high concentration (such as in that E-cig fluid) will kill you or the ususpecting child if ingested.

BTW, if you wanna kill someone, then put a pack of cigarettes in water and let it sit for a few hours. Then filter the tobacco and paper from the water. Then somehow get them to drink that foul smelling water and BAM - they die from a mix of asphyxiation, heart attack and blood clots.

/RIP, you unsuspecting guppies from that high school project.


Ah, this old chestnut. You are aware that since nicotine has been divorced from tobacco smoke as a delivery method, numerous medicinal uses of nicotine have been found? Everything from treating and preventing ulcerative colitis, Alzheimer's and OCD to the management of OCD.

Saying "nicotine is a poison" is almost nonsensical. EVERYTHING is a poison, taken in large enough quantities. Hundreds of children die every year of acute dihydrogen monoxide poisoning. It's proven to be more dangerous than nicotine. Where's the regulation to protect the children from this dangerous substance?
2014-01-06 08:01:10 AM
1 votes:

Herr Morgenstern: Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?


They mostly arent.  Nicotine has a number of health issues related to it, but thats about it.  All the other dangers of smoking are essentially removed from the equation.
2014-01-06 07:51:45 AM
1 votes:
It doesn't stink, and that's the most important thing to me.

On the other hand, if you were stupid enough to start smoking, then you damn well ought to pay the piper when it comes to quitting cold turkey.

Herr Morgenstern: Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?


Nicotine IS a poison. It restricts your bloodvessels, so a high concentration (such as in that E-cig fluid) will kill you or the ususpecting child if ingested.

BTW, if you wanna kill someone, then put a pack of cigarettes in water and let it sit for a few hours. Then filter the tobacco and paper from the water. Then somehow get them to drink that foul smelling water and BAM - they die from a mix of asphyxiation, heart attack and blood clots.

/RIP, you unsuspecting guppies from that high school project.
2014-01-06 07:45:39 AM
1 votes:
So if the baby eats pot, it'll eat a lot of food, drool, and stare wishfully at simple things? Who the hell could tell?
2014-01-06 07:35:21 AM
1 votes:
Can someone explain to me like I'm three why ecigs are bad for you? Aside from the obvious chemical addiction, that is?
2014-01-06 07:07:09 AM
1 votes:
Gee, if only there was a warning letting people know they should keep things out of the reach of children. Oh, right. They're right on the side of the farking e-cig box.

Any child deaths from this, I'm chalking up to shiatty parenting and Darwin.
2014-01-06 06:32:07 AM
1 votes:
Don't forget about you needing to protect them from GMOs and vaccines.
 
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