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(io9)   So it turns out that organic food may be the cause of the recent rise in autism   (io9.com) divider line 114
    More: Obvious, organic products, autism, cognitive biases, Cory Doctorow, logical fallacy  
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19648 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Jan 2014 at 4:30 PM (33 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-01-05 05:39:44 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits


because anti-vaxxer nuisance suits were becoming a real problem.

the same reason you cannot get human lyme vaccine anymore.
 
2014-01-05 05:39:57 PM
Ad at the bottom of this thread:Asperger Treatment

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Full Spectrum of Care Autistic Spectrum Disorder
 
2014-01-05 05:41:15 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


Lawsuits from people who will get their kids vaccinated, then sue because the kid died in a car accident a month later, "but it had to have been the vaccine!!"

Also, double blind studies are generally considered unethical in cases where giving a placebo could result in death for the control group. As with vaccine trials.
 
2014-01-05 05:43:38 PM
This really makes me wish that the RSS feed showed the linked site, instead of just the tag. Anything Gawker-related could just be filtered out. (Thankfully Buzzfeed seems to be banned.)
 
2014-01-05 05:49:55 PM
Well, it has to be something, so, organic food it is.

/ Roundup actually cures autism
 
2014-01-05 05:53:57 PM

No Such Agency: untaken_name:
I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?

Yes it is suspicious isn't it.  Vaccine makers know their vaccines cause side effects, including sometimes FATAL side effects and brain damage.  They know it so much a system (VARES) has been set up to report adverse reactions.  But has anyone ever actually heard of vaccines being changed because someone reported a reaction?  Nope.  Not a single ingredient is changed.  The report databses simply allow the vaccine companies to monitor parents who don't support vaccination.  Suffice to say I don't think they are monitoring them for benevolent reasons.


Wow... Vaccines do cause side effects, but they are very, very rare (like 1 in 100000 or so). And the odds of getting polio or measles is a lot higher than that
 
2014-01-05 05:54:02 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: wickedragon: MaudlinMutantMollusk: The numbers don't lie

But people love to lie with numbers.

Truer words...


People can only lie with numbers if the people they are talking to don't understand math, statistics and logic. Unfortunately, that is most people.
 
2014-01-05 05:56:57 PM
Why do people keep making excuses for children that have obviously been raised inappropriately?

90's: ADD
00's: ADHD
10's: Autism
20's: DERRRRRRP!
 
2014-01-05 06:00:32 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


The sad thing is that you actually think this proves something.
 
2014-01-05 06:05:10 PM

NotARocketScientist: People can only lie with numbers if the people they are talking to don't understand math, statistics and logic. Unfortunately, that is most people.


This is also true

/perhaps "mislead" is a better word
 
2014-01-05 06:05:12 PM

dopekitty74: Kevin72: Aspartame in diet soda ingested during pregnancy causes autism. Thank you, Donald Rumsfeld.

I hate diet soda. Never drink it ever. Neither of my daughters is autistic, so it must be true!


Same here. I HATE diet soda and I don't have a single autistic child.


tuxq: Why do people keep making excuses for children that have obviously been raised inappropriately?


You'll probably get some bites.
 
2014-01-05 06:05:16 PM
You heard 'im boys. Eat more Mcdonalds....
 
2014-01-05 06:08:40 PM

tuxq: Why do people keep making excuses for children that have obviously been raised inappropriately?

90's: ADD
00's: ADHD
10's: Autism
20's: DERRRRRRP!


Because the kids are now fashion accessories. Part of the "Perfect Life" package, sold through The Consumption Complex.

/Ask me what I really think and I'll say "Sparta".
 
2014-01-05 06:17:13 PM

tuxq: Why do people keep making excuses for children that have obviously been raised inappropriately?

90's: ADD
00's: ADHD
10's: Autism
20's: DERRRRRRP!


10/10. You'll get some bites.
 
2014-01-05 06:19:43 PM

ArcadianRefugee: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

To be fair, it's io9 (a Gawker Media site); ALL Gawker Media sites seem to be "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found somewhere else!"

It's like vomiting to let people know how awesome that steak was, and then pointing to where on the menu you ordered it.


And you are favorited.... and farkied as "Awesome vomit"
 
2014-01-05 06:20:55 PM
The

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


Because even if 100 out of 100,000 people die from a vaccine can stop a plague with a near 100% mortality rate. That is acceptable. At some point I guess it comes down to some spooky W.H.O. M@M panel filled with statisticians and other non ethics minded people who make the hard but rational decisions about saving us from the "Every Life is Precious" crowd.
 
2014-01-05 06:24:38 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


insufferable douchbags?
 
2014-01-05 06:24:41 PM

No Such Agency: untaken_name:
I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?

Yes it is suspicious isn't it.  Vaccine makers know their vaccines cause side effects, including sometimes FATAL side effects and brain damage.  They know it so much a system (VARES) has been set up to report adverse reactions.  But has anyone ever actually heard of vaccines being changed because someone reported a reaction?  Nope.  Not a single ingredient is changed.  The report databses simply allow the vaccine companies to monitor parents who don't support vaccination.  Suffice to say I don't think they are monitoring them for benevolent reasons.


It's cool you have all this secret insight and hidden knowledge. Must make you feel powerful and important.
 
2014-01-05 06:25:29 PM
So according to this everyone was autistic prior to the early 1900's.
 
2014-01-05 06:26:48 PM

farkingismybusiness: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

le sigh.


Every site is sourcing each other.. Everyone is guilty of it.  I've followed source chains 4 pages deep a few times.  I call it the Buzzfeed Affect..
 
2014-01-05 06:29:42 PM

camarugala: Theuntaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?

Because even if 100 out of 100,000 people die from a vaccine can stop a plague with a near 100% mortality rate. That is acceptable. At some point I guess it comes down to some spooky W.H.O. M@M panel filled with statisticians and other non ethics minded people who make the hard but rational decisions about saving us from the "Every Life is Precious" crowd.


So it's OK if your kids or other loved ones die from it; taking one for the team. What a good sport you are!
 
2014-01-05 06:40:19 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Well, people who eat organic food are usually insufferable assholes, so this seems legit to me...


I tend to eat organic cereal, but that's because I like the taste.
 
2014-01-05 06:47:08 PM

styckx: farkingismybusiness: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

le sigh.

Every site is sourcing each other.. Everyone is guilty of it.  I've followed source chains 4 pages deep a few times.  I call it the Buzzfeed Affect..


Yeah. Fark news aggregators!!!
 
2014-01-05 06:52:55 PM

JoieD'Zen: camarugala: Theuntaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?

Because even if 100 out of 100,000 people die from a vaccine can stop a plague with a near 100% mortality rate. That is acceptable. At some point I guess it comes down to some spooky W.H.O. M@M panel filled with statisticians and other non ethics minded people who make the hard but rational decisions about saving us from the "Every Life is Precious" crowd.

So it's OK if your kids or other loved ones die from it; taking one for the team. What a good sport you are!


Pretty much, yeah. It's a hard pill to swallow (not really a pun as most vaccines are injected) but reality is a biatch like that. I could never say that I would not be hurt, sad, furious about it. I would ultimately understand the reasoning though. You wouldn't? That's selfishness in it's purist form.
 
2014-01-05 06:56:18 PM

Gyrfalcon: Also, double blind studies are generally considered unethical in cases where giving a placebo could result in death for the control group. As with vaccine trials.


False.
 
2014-01-05 07:00:41 PM

meow said the dog: Gyrfalcon: Also, double blind studies are generally considered unethical in cases where giving a placebo could result in death for the control group. As with vaccine trials.

False.


Are you feeling alright? That's the shortest post I've ever seen from you.  By a factor of about 100.
 
2014-01-05 07:01:18 PM

TEA-PARTY-PATRIOT: No Such Agency: untaken_name:
I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?

Yes it is suspicious isn't it.  Vaccine makers know their vaccines cause side effects, including sometimes FATAL side effects and brain damage.  They know it so much a system (VARES) has been set up to report adverse reactions.  But has anyone ever actually heard of vaccines being changed because someone reported a reaction?  Nope.  Not a single ingredient is changed.  The report databses simply allow the vaccine companies to monitor parents who don't support vaccination.  Suffice to say I don't think they are monitoring them for benevolent reasons.


Wow... You are a nutter....
 
2014-01-05 07:01:45 PM

Fart_Machine: So according to this everyone was autistic prior to the early 1900's.



And they all purchased their boxer shorts at K-Mart.

It was a simpler time then.
 
2014-01-05 07:02:36 PM

fusillade762: Are you feeling alright? That's the shortest post I've ever seen from you.  By a factor of about 100.


LAUGHTER OL this is because I was recently provided the vaccination which has caused to me the autism and the shortness of replies.
 
2014-01-05 07:04:39 PM
Wow, "more blessings" for the world! lol!
 
2014-01-05 07:13:16 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


You magnificent bastard. You placed your hook so very delicately. You know how to troll! 11/10
 
2014-01-05 07:19:45 PM

farkingismybusiness: styckx: farkingismybusiness: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

le sigh.

Every site is sourcing each other.. Everyone is guilty of it.  I've followed source chains 4 pages deep a few times.  I call it the Buzzfeed Affect..

Yeah. Fark news aggregators!!!


How many times have you seen on CNN or Fox or MSNBC them credit a Fark thread? But Reddit, it happens more than I am comfortable with.
 
2014-01-05 07:23:20 PM

ArcadianRefugee: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

To be fair, it's io9 (a Gawker Media site); ALL Gawker Media sites seem to be "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found somewhere else!"

It's like vomiting to let people know how awesome that steak was, and then pointing to where on the menu you ordered it.


Still better than buzz feed, which will publish someone else's picture of the steak and then give credit for the photo to Nikon.
 
2014-01-05 07:26:44 PM

desertfool: How many times have you seen on CNN or Fox or MSNBC them credit a Fark thread? But Reddit, it happens more than I am comfortable with.


It's worth it when they quote the comments though.

"Jizzonmynuts said such and such."
 
2014-01-05 07:36:44 PM
Here is the reason for the increase in autism....ahem:

Mom is lazy and doesn't want to work. Mom doesn't have to work if she stays home and home schools her special needs child.

It is easier for mom to stay home and spend 15 seconds asking Jayden the capitals of various states than getting out there and working an actual shift.

Your kid doesn't have autism. YOU are lazy.
 
2014-01-05 07:47:59 PM
I hate all this shiat but I will volunteer to fark the crazy out of Ms. McCarthy any day of the week.
 
2014-01-05 07:49:26 PM

wickedragon: untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death?
I dunno much about the american system for liability, but I do know statistics. For quite a few vaccines there is a risk of something going wrong, it's just that NOT taking a vaccine also includes a risk of something going wrong. For society (and by all probability the one taking the vaccine) it is better if people vaccinate against dangerous contagious diseases like measles and polio (yes, measles kill people) but for a few select individuals the world is worse off. I'm guessing the U.S rules are set up as they are to not scare the makers of vaccines from making vaccines. We as a society are utterly dependent on them after all

Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines?
It isn't?
"Haemophilus influenzae Type b Capsular Polysaccharide Vaccine in Children: A Double-Blind Field Study of 100,000 Vaccinees 3 Months to 5 Years of Age in Finland" by H Peltola et. al. from Pediatrics Vol. 60 No. 5  (1977)
&
"Safety and immunogenicity of 2009 pandemic influenza A H1N1 vaccines in China: a multicentre, double-blind, randomised, placebo-controlled trial" by X-F Liang et. al from The Lancet Volume 375 Issue 9708 (2010)
 &
"Efficacy assessment of a cell-mediated immunity HIV-1 vaccine (the Step Study): a double-blind, randomised, placebo-controlled, test-of-concept trial" by S P Buchbinder et. al. from The Lancet Volume 372 Issue 9653 (2008)
&
"Efficacy of 23-valent pneumococcal vaccine in preventing pneumonia and improving survival in nursing home residents: double blind, randomised and placebo controlled trial" by T Maruyama et. al. from the British Medical Journal Volume 340 (2010)
 &
"Efficacy of human rotavirus vaccine against severe gastroenteritis in Malawian children in the first two years of life: A randomized, double-blind, placebo controlled trial" by N A Cunliffe et. al from Vaccine Volume 30 Supplement 1 (2012)

That was to name a small sample of the massive amount of double blind studies done on vaccines. Almost all of them include a study about possible ill effects to the subjects, both mental and physical. So no, it isn't heresy to request a double-blind study. But in science it IS heresy to not check first to see if one has been done already.


We actually have been asked by our pediatrician to participate in a new vaccine trial. It's a MMR vaccine that has been used in Europe for years. Some kids will be give the new vaccine some will
get the old one. Nobody - not even the doctor will know who is who. We have to keep a diary, record body temps every day, they give us the thermoter and anything else we might need. Checkups goe on for years.
All this for a vaccine simply made by a different manufacturer that has been in use in Europe extensively, but not here.

/idk about all of this .. Still deciding. Basically only because we are crazy busy and I hate to fark it all up by forgetting to do the homework.
 
2014-01-05 07:50:26 PM

Jument: I hate all this shiat but I will volunteer to fark the crazy out of Ms. McCarthy any day of the week.



How does Tuesday sound?
 
2014-01-05 08:13:49 PM

Gyrfalcon: Lawsuits from people who will get their kids vaccinated, then sue because the kid died in a car accident a month later, "but it had to have been the vaccine!!"


If you sold that kid the car, or the liquor he was drinking, or owned the tree he ran into, you can be sued.  What makes vaccine makers so special that they should be immune from frivolous lawsuits?

It's because we have the best government money can buy.  It's not something to be proud of.
 
2014-01-05 08:26:24 PM

knobmaker: Gyrfalcon: Lawsuits from people who will get their kids vaccinated, then sue because the kid died in a car accident a month later, "but it had to have been the vaccine!!"

If you sold that kid the car, or the liquor he was drinking, or owned the tree he ran into, you can be sued.  What makes vaccine makers so special that they should be immune from frivolous lawsuits?

It's because we have the best government money can buy.  It's not something to be proud of.


Because the first two(I don't agree with the third) are actual factors in the accident. The vaccines everyone takes for a good reason, and are a part of an enormously large percentage of the populations lives. I think they should be immune as well, or else they wouldn't be made anymore.
 
2014-01-05 08:26:52 PM
maybe affluenza causes autism
 
2014-01-05 08:33:40 PM

Enemabag Jones: How about science, the increase in mental healthcare and more educated professionals in teaching.  Lets add the pharmaceutical industry possibly redefining some margins.


The pharmaceutical industry actually really can't do jack about autism, so they have no finger in the pie. Autism medicine would be really farking awesome, but we don't have it. The first three are correct, though.

/I'd probably never have been diagnosed if there weren't competent people in my area.
 
2014-01-05 08:40:44 PM
Before chemical fertilizers took over the agriculture industry in the mid-twentieth century, organic food was known by a different name: FOOD!
 
2014-01-05 08:52:42 PM
That is why all my food is silicon-based.
 
2014-01-05 08:53:50 PM
Maybe autism causes autism.
 
2014-01-05 09:37:35 PM

jaytkay: ZOMG please spread this to the mommy blogs.

/ So they get off the antivax bandwagon


I avoid mommy blogs. It's the only thing that keeps me from losing my mind as a parent.
 
2014-01-05 09:43:15 PM

untaken_name: I dunno, if vaccines are so great, how come the manufacturers are completely indemnified against any lawsuits, including for wrongful death? And why did they have to push that as a rider on an unrelated bill? Also, why is it heresy to request double-blind studies on vaccines? What are the people who know these vaccines best, the makers, scared of?


Because it's Congress, and that's pretty much how they pass everything these days?
 
2014-01-05 09:48:30 PM

desertfool: farkingismybusiness: styckx: farkingismybusiness: desertfool: Shostie: "Hey, guys! Check out this thing we found on Reddit!"

Seriously.... I'm seeing more and more stuff that started on Reddit in the "News". It least it saves me from ever having to visit that site, but it's getting disturbing.

le sigh.

Every site is sourcing each other.. Everyone is guilty of it.  I've followed source chains 4 pages deep a few times.  I call it the Buzzfeed Affect..

Yeah. Fark news aggregators!!!

How many times have you seen on CNN or Fox or MSNBC them credit a Fark thread? But Reddit, it happens more than I am comfortable with.


So journalists are paid to surf reddit all day?

 No wonder everyone was majoring in "communications" when I was in college.
 
2014-01-05 09:54:36 PM
PsiChick
Enemabag Jones: How about science, the increase in mental healthcare and more educated professionals in teaching. Lets add the pharmaceutical industry possibly redefining some margins.
The pharmaceutical industry actually really can't do jack about autism, so they have no finger in the pie. Autism medicine would be really farking awesome, but we don't have it. The first three are correct, though.
/I'd probably never have been diagnosed if there weren't competent people in my area.


It would have been nice to have that a long time ago, but I am a little older and things have changed regarding what is quirky and what is a medical condition. I am still very happy not to grow up after 9/11 and Columbine in the US.
 
2014-01-05 10:02:12 PM

ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha: What effect will global warming have on food eaten by autistic pirates?


Pretty much what I came here to say
 
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