If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(LA Times)   Western Medicine: "Ah, yous Chinese herbalists are a bunch of quacks" Science: Traditional herb is 3x more potent than modern painkillers and no side effects. Western Medicine: "Umm... about that"   (latimes.com) divider line 198
    More: Cool, Chinese, side effects, herbal remedies, Chinese Academy of Sciences, quacks, dopamine receptor, painkillers, Current Biology  
•       •       •

19079 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Jan 2014 at 1:11 AM (14 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



198 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-01-02 09:38:46 PM
The Corydalis plant is a member of the poppy family

4.bp.blogspot.com

the pharmaceutical-industrial complex always be stickin' it to the man.
 
2014-01-02 09:41:02 PM
I don't think anyone should ever claim that there's 0 good things in traditional medicines. It's just that its a crapshoot, since their's no real rigor. It's not a trustworthy process.
 
2014-01-02 09:47:34 PM
Article: "livier Civelli, a pharmacologist at UC Irvine"

Subby: "HERPADERP SCIENCE IS DUM"
 
2014-01-02 11:26:00 PM

the801: The Corydalis plant is a member of the poppy family

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 264x319]

the pharmaceutical-industrial complex always be stickin' it to the man.


Opiates kill pain. Damn now I know why that hip fracture patient I gave Dilaudid to a couple of weeks ago on the way to the hospital felt better,
 
2014-01-02 11:54:50 PM
I'm not sure Subby knows what medicine or science are.
 
2014-01-03 12:10:11 AM
So, basically, when your testing shows the efficacy of a treatment, even a traditional herbal one, it becomes medicine, eh? Funny how that works... It's almost like...

SCIENCE!
 
2014-01-03 12:14:05 AM
www.truthinaging.com

dealseekingmom.com
 
2014-01-03 01:04:25 AM

mamoru: So, basically, when your testing shows the efficacy of a treatment, even a traditional herbal one, it becomes medicine, eh? Funny how that works... It's almost like...

SCIENCE!


"'Oh herbal medicine's been around for thousands of years'. Indeed it has. And then we tested it all, and the stuff that worked became...medicine." - Dara O'Briain

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMvMb90hem8
 
2014-01-03 01:15:53 AM
i1111.photobucket.com
 
2014-01-03 01:18:08 AM
I'm just gonna count the ways in which subby fails:

1. The study was done by a pharmacologist at UC Irvine (Western Medicine and Science ftw.)
2. Many of our modern drugs come from derivatives of opiates similar to the plant in question (nobody calls it quackery)
3. There are definitely side effects to all derivatives of poppy-family plants, even if it is popping the dopamine receptors instead of the morphine ones, you can still deal with re-uptake issues.
4. The compound they worked with was synthesized in a lab (as noted in the article), not just a derivative of the main plant (again, western science ftw)

Basically, every part of this headline was just mind-bogglingly wrong... it's a good story, but ffs subby, did you actually read it?
 
2014-01-03 01:20:56 AM

firefly212: I'm just gonna count the ways in which subby fails:

1. The study was done by a pharmacologist at UC Irvine (Western Medicine and Science ftw.)
2. Many of our modern drugs come from derivatives of opiates similar to the plant in question (nobody calls it quackery)
3. There are definitely side effects to all derivatives of poppy-family plants, even if it is popping the dopamine receptors instead of the morphine ones, you can still deal with re-uptake issues.
4. The compound they worked with was synthesized in a lab (as noted in the article), not just a derivative of the main plant (again, western science ftw)

Basically, every part of this headline was just mind-bogglingly wrong... it's a good story, but ffs subby, did you actually read it?


Doctors hate this one weird headline.
 
2014-01-03 01:23:02 AM
Even a broken clock made of ivory, powdered rhino horn, and tiger penises is right twice a day.
 
2014-01-03 01:24:03 AM

BSABSVR: I'm not sure Subby knows what medicine or science are.


A quote by Dara O'Brain seems appropriate here:

"I'm sorry, 'herbal medicine', "Oh, herbal medicine's been around for thousands of years!" Indeed it has, and then we tested it all, and the stuff that worked became 'medicine'. And the rest of it is just a nice bowl of soup and some potpourri, so knock yourselves out."


This is something that's going from herbal medicine to actual medicine.


So yeah, agree.  Massive fail on the part of subby.
 
2014-01-03 01:24:45 AM
Great, so they got one right. I guess that justifies the eventual extinction of the Bengal tiger and the other 9,738 traditional herbal remedies that are complete BS.
 
2014-01-03 01:24:48 AM
Subby is an idiot, but he gets points on my book for making me think of Jon Stewart's "Douchey New York Guy" (aka Chinese Guy/ Jewish Guy/ Mexican Guy) voice.
 
2014-01-03 01:25:38 AM
Dear Author,

What are the negative side effects of eating dried tiger penis while I abstain from cold liquids? Does this affect the medicinal qualities of the bear gallbladder?

Much Appreciated.
 
2014-01-03 01:25:58 AM
There is a hell of a lot of difference between herbal therapy and five penis soup.  A lot of caution should be used with herbal remedies, but part of that comes with them sometimes being too effective (isolates of active compounds obviously vary in efficiency when dealing with raw materials as opposed to synthesized or processed medicines).
 
2014-01-03 01:26:23 AM
The city of Fuzhou is also famous for its pasta and bean soup, commonly regarded as Italian.
 
2014-01-03 01:28:05 AM
But Asia is to the west of us!?!!?
 
2014-01-03 01:28:35 AM
no side effects

img1.fark.net
 
2014-01-03 01:30:04 AM

firefly212: I'm just gonna count the ways in which subby fails:

1. The study was done by a pharmacologist at UC Irvine (Western Medicine and Science ftw.)
2. Many of our modern drugs come from derivatives of opiates similar to the plant in question (nobody calls it quackery)
3. There are definitely side effects to all derivatives of poppy-family plants, even if it is popping the dopamine receptors instead of the morphine ones, you can still deal with re-uptake issues.
4. The compound they worked with was synthesized in a lab (as noted in the article), not just a derivative of the main plant (again, western science ftw)

Basically, every part of this headline was just mind-bogglingly wrong... it's a good story, but ffs subby, did you actually read it?


He read it but likely half understood it.
 
2014-01-03 01:30:18 AM

DamnYankees: I don't think anyone should ever claim that there's 0 good things in traditional medicines. It's just that its a crapshoot, since their's no real rigor. It's not a trustworthy process.


And we're done here.
 
2014-01-03 01:31:14 AM

Lee Jackson Beauregard: no side effects

[img1.fark.net image 54x11]


No side effects in the mice.  At least so far.


It could still turn out to be highly addictive to humans.

And/or be the next Oxy for all the pill-heads.
 
2014-01-03 01:32:09 AM

the801: the pharmaceutical-industrial complex always be stickin' it to the man.


Anyone who doesnt realize this is a moron, its why they patent a shot then jack the price up to $3k when it used to be $25.

Its also why Im shocked pot is legal anywhere, I know it would work for a lot of medical issues involving stress, pain, and migraines which even large dose pain pills dont work and I have to use a muscle relaxer which makes me a zombie for 2 days or I can smoke a joint and be fine in an hour.
 
2014-01-03 01:32:57 AM
Hey Subby, you know what they call alternative medicine that's been proved to work? Medicine. AKA: western medicine.

Science: "Ah, yous Chinese herbalists are a bunch of quacks" Science: Traditional herb is 3x more potent than modern painkillers and no side effects. Western Medicine: "Umm... about that"

Your headline should be more like. Medical science: We don't believe you Chinese herbalist are credible until we have proof. Medical science: Huh, I guess some of you guys are credible after all. Now, if you would kindly stop endangering all the animals that you keep killing for "medical purposes" when you aren't busy eating them.
 
2014-01-03 01:34:42 AM
I wonder if that project is going to find the active (lol yeah right) incredient in rhino horns and tiger testies.
 
2014-01-03 01:36:05 AM

bbfreak: Hey Subby, you know what they call alternative medicine that's been proved to work? Medicine. AKA: western medicine.

Science: "Ah, yous Chinese herbalists are a bunch of quacks" Science: Traditional herb is 3x more potent than modern painkillers and no side effects. Western Medicine: "Umm... about that"

Your headline should be more like. Medical science: We don't believe you Chinese herbalist are credible until we have proof. Medical science: Huh, I guess some of you guys are credible after all. Now, if you would kindly stop endangering all the animals that you keep killing for "medical purposes" when you aren't busy eating them.



Yeah, but do you think the mods would have seriously greenlit that?  It's not sensationalist enough for them.
 
2014-01-03 01:37:00 AM
Final Score:

Western Medicine: 10,245

Traditional medicine: 24

>Traditional Medicine: gg
 
2014-01-03 01:37:42 AM
The pain-relieving compound is known as dehydrocorybulbine (DHCB). It was isolated by Chinese researchers as part of the herbalome project -- an ambitious endeavor launched in 2008 to catalog all the active ingredients in traditional Chinese medicines.

Now that part of the article is interesting, so in 5 years they have found ONE?

Still most medicine are just from plants found in nature, has nobody seen Medicine Man staring Sean Connery? "Ive found the cure but lost it!!!!"
 
2014-01-03 01:38:46 AM
www.dieselsc.com

 Pain Don't Hurt, you bunch of pussies.
 
2014-01-03 01:39:25 AM
What actually happened:

Western Medicine: "We can't just accept folk remedies and folk medicine at face value."
Science: "We did a few studies and some of them check out."
Western Medicine: "Okay then, sweet."
 
2014-01-03 01:40:28 AM

mithras_angel: Lee Jackson Beauregard: no side effects

[img1.fark.net image 54x11]

No side effects in the mice.  At least so far.


It could still turn out to be highly addictive to humans.

And/or be the next Oxy for all the pill-heads.


A doctor I read once said "There are no side effects. There are only desired effects and undesired effects." So I'm sure there are "side effects" to this stuff too, just until we try it in humans, we won't know what these undesired effects are (i.e. it kills pain, but gives you non-stop runs).

As to the addictive effects: That's on the doctor and the patient. You develop a tolerance to any painkiller over time; even aspirin is "addictive" if the individual becomes dependent upon it to manage not only physical but emotional pain. Morphine and even heroin are only issues because people use them for ALL pain management (equating pain of a broken leg with pain of a broken heart), and because our society believes that one should tough it out rather than have relief from chronic physical pain.
 
2014-01-03 01:42:16 AM
Langdon_777: I wonder if that project is going to find the active (lol yeah right) incredient in rhino horns and tiger testies.

i259.photobucket.com
 
2014-01-03 01:43:17 AM

FloridaWombat: There is a hell of a lot of difference between herbal therapy and five penis soup.  A lot of caution should be used with herbal remedies,


Whereas five-penis-soup is always a good idea and can be found at most Denny's, during the night shift
 
2014-01-03 01:44:15 AM
growingmarijuanatips.com
 
2014-01-03 01:44:20 AM

macross87: But Asia is to the west of us!?!!?


It's also to the east of us, due to the shape of Earth,
 
2014-01-03 01:44:38 AM
Yeah no, there's still a lot of superstitious BS in traditional medicine, subs.
 
2014-01-03 01:45:17 AM

Gyrfalcon: A doctor I read once said "There are no side effects. There are only desired effects and undesired effects." So I'm sure there are "side effects" to this stuff too, just until we try it in humans, we won't know what these undesired effects are (i.e. it kills pain, but gives you non-stop runs).

As to the addictive effects: That's on the doctor and the patient. You develop a tolerance to any painkiller over time; even aspirin is "addictive" if the individual becomes dependent upon it to manage not only physical but emotional pain. Morphine and even heroin are only issues because people use them for ALL pain management (equating pain of a broken leg with pain of a broken heart), and because our society believes that one should tough it out rather than have relief from chronic physical pain.


See your tolerance is why I think more studies need to be done in the genetics field since nobody in my immediate family develops tolerances to pain meds or other medication, cough syrup still farks me up like when I was a kid and any pain meds will make me loopy. I will say strong pain meds make me nauseous, not sure if thats part of the reason or not. There has to be a reason why it doesnt happen but Im not a scientist and have no beakers to do research.
 
2014-01-03 01:45:38 AM

47 is the new 42: macross87: But Asia is to the west of us!?!!?

It's also to the east of us, due to the shape of Earth,


i2.kym-cdn.com
 
2014-01-03 01:47:37 AM

Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: Great, so they got one right. I guess that justifies the eventual extinction of the Bengal tiger and the other 9,738 traditional herbal remedies that are complete BS.


Name an endangered animal, and some Chinese dude is convinced one of its body parts will give him a boner.
 
2014-01-03 01:48:43 AM

Brainsick: FloridaWombat: There is a hell of a lot of difference between herbal therapy and five penis soup.  A lot of caution should be used with herbal remedies,

Whereas five-penis-soup is always a good idea and can be found at most Denny's, during the night shift


No no, I don't know who you're thinking of, but Denny's has SIX-penis-soup. It laughs at your girly five-penis-soup.
 
2014-01-03 01:49:03 AM
Opiates relieve pain ... really?

/ it's not new, must be Fark
 
2014-01-03 01:49:17 AM
Well, obviously some herbal remedies will work.  Many key drugs are derived from or based on chemicals found in plants.

The difference with "western" medicine is that researchers isolate the active compounds, purify and standardize exact dosages, and conduct studies to determine the safety and efficacy of the product before selling to the general public.  "Herbal remedies" are imprecise doses of thousands of chemicals which (hopefully) do more good than harm, except we don't know, because there's no requirement to study the product before selling it.
 
2014-01-03 01:49:19 AM

firefly212: I'm just gonna count the ways in which subby fails:

1. The study was done by a pharmacologist at UC Irvine (Western Medicine and Science ftw.)
2. Many of our modern drugs come from derivatives of opiates similar to the plant in question (nobody calls it quackery)
3. There are definitely side effects to all derivatives of poppy-family plants, even if it is popping the dopamine receptors instead of the morphine ones, you can still deal with re-uptake issues.
4. The compound they worked with was synthesized in a lab (as noted in the article), not just a derivative of the main plant (again, western science ftw)

Basically, every part of this headline was just mind-bogglingly wrong... it's a good story, but ffs subby, did you actually read it?


Subby does even worse than that, which is sad. See, YES, we do use herbs to make medicines... Except we extract the part that works, concentrate it so we can monitor exact dosage, and isolate and remove compounds in the herb that cause more harm than good. That's the whole point of pharmaceutical development. And that Dosage thing gets important. For instance, the Foxglove plant? Highly toxic. Will blow your heart pretty fast. So much that it was used as a poison for ages(Digitalis). In moderated doses, however? Great for low blood pressure as one of the most commonly prescribed blood pressure medications on the market. Digoxin. 

The reason we don't stick with the raw herb is A: The contents cannot be properly verified, B: the dosage cannot be monitored, and C: the more toxic elements cannot be isolated easily. Two plants in the same soil, same grow conditions, same sunlight and same soil nutrients can grow in completely different ways(And thus, differing concentrations). Hell, two stalks on the same plant can have differing concentration levels.
 
2014-01-03 01:49:29 AM
Ancient Chinese secret: Five penis soup no work. Only make to get American mad. Mad American eat many Twinkie, become very fat. Then Chinese man take white women and "So sad, Chinese make penis soup. I not make penis soup. Only make science soup. Never pee in Coke either." She be very happy, make many babies.
 
2014-01-03 01:52:42 AM

Sum Dum Gai: Well, obviously some herbal remedies will work.  Many key drugs are derived from or based on chemicals found in plants.

The difference with "western" medicine is that researchers isolate the active compounds, purify and standardize exact dosages, and conduct studies to determine the safety and efficacy of the product before selling to the general public.  "Herbal remedies" are imprecise doses of thousands of chemicals which (hopefully) do more good than harm, except we don't know, because there's no requirement to study the product before selling it.


You forgot optimizing synthetic derivations of said compounds and patenting them, but pretty much.
 
2014-01-03 01:56:15 AM
TFA: The pain-relieving compound is known as dehydrocorybulbine (DHCB)

sounds scary enough...,

ASSIGNED ACRONYM ALERT

DHCB out of our water supplies! DHCB out of our oxygens! DHCB out of our herp! DHCB out of our organic asparagus! DHCB out of our aquifers! DHCB out of our vaginas! DHCB out of our preschools! DHCB out of our specula! DHCB out of our refrigerator door ice dispensers! DHCB out of our Macintoshes! DHCB out of our DHCB!

Wake up sheeple!
 
2014-01-03 02:00:21 AM
Maybe someone with more knowledge could explain this, but isn't there anti-depressants that work on dopamine receptors as well?
 
2014-01-03 02:02:05 AM

Pentaxian: Maybe someone with more knowledge could explain this, but isn't there anti-depressants that work on dopamine receptors as well?


Chocolate?
 
2014-01-03 02:02:14 AM

grumpfuff: Brainsick: FloridaWombat: There is a hell of a lot of difference between herbal therapy and five penis soup.  A lot of caution should be used with herbal remedies,

Whereas five-penis-soup is always a good idea and can be found at most Denny's, during the night shift

No no, I don't know who you're thinking of, but Denny's has SIX-penis-soup. It laughs at your girly five-penis-soup.


Five-penis soup or six-penis soup, I don't care.

I'm never going near a Denny's again.
 
Displayed 50 of 198 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report