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(The Raw Story)   Dell's brand new computers now come preloaded with NSA spyware   (rawstory.com) divider line 172
    More: Scary, NSA, spyware, computers, interdiction, Tao, Der Spiegel  
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16706 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Dec 2013 at 7:09 PM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-29 06:24:58 PM  
www.rawstory.com

That logo isn't ominous at all.

And I'm typing this on a Dell I bought a little less than a year ago, so I wonder if
 
2013-12-29 06:56:14 PM  
So is this legal even if it's secretly being OK'd by a secret court?

/I think not
 
2013-12-29 07:03:57 PM  
God damn it this bullshiat is NOT getting greenlit.
 
2013-12-29 07:12:03 PM  
They're not even trying to pretend to not be creepily evil.
 
2013-12-29 07:13:32 PM  
Windows 8 already has backdoors installed for the NSA to look into. This is just the next logical step for them.

/nothing to see here citizen
 
2013-12-29 07:15:24 PM  

Ruiizu: Windows 8 already has backdoors installed for the NSA to look into. This is just the next logical step for them.

/nothing to see here citizen


what 4th Amendment?
 
2013-12-29 07:15:37 PM  
When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.
 
2013-12-29 07:16:01 PM  
Damn. I have a brand new Dell still in the box that just came yesterday.

I'm not supposed to care because I have nothing to hide, right?
 
2013-12-29 07:16:05 PM  
Once I discover which party is responsible, I will know whether or not to be outraged.
 
2013-12-29 07:16:15 PM  
Dude, you're getting spied on.
 
2013-12-29 07:17:47 PM  
Good.  I'm tired of paying extra for shiat that should be free!
 
2013-12-29 07:17:55 PM  
The only question is, are those businesses complicit like RSA is with the backdoor in its encryption?
 
2013-12-29 07:19:36 PM  

Snarfangel: Once I discover which party is responsible, I will know whether or not to be outraged.


One thing is for sure, the detractors are either Racists or Muslims.
 
2013-12-29 07:19:43 PM  
They should at least label the system with "NSA Inside!"
 
2013-12-29 07:20:29 PM  
The NSA is going to singlehandedly bankrupt the American technology sector. Thanks, Failbama.

/ and Failbush and Failclinton and Failbush and Failreagan and Failcarter...
 
2013-12-29 07:20:44 PM  
Isn't that octopus Logo/Patch a National Reconnaisance Office (NRO) one, not an NSA one?
 
2013-12-29 07:21:47 PM  
All this talk about backdoors makes me glad its shark week.
 
2013-12-29 07:21:48 PM  

HindiDiscoMonster: whidbey: God damn it this bullshiat is NOT getting greenlit.

I thought your govt. job was secure... why would you worry about a little article like this?


I don't know such stuff. I just do eyes.
 
2013-12-29 07:21:49 PM  
Meh
 
2013-12-29 07:21:59 PM  
Now you know why it took an extra day or two for shipping......
 
2013-12-29 07:22:44 PM  
shiat. Even Ubuntu has NSA inside. At least you can fark with the kernel in it.
 
2013-12-29 07:25:35 PM  

www.idealaunch.com

Dude, you got some real spy ware with your Dell

 
2013-12-29 07:26:15 PM  

p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.


Anything short of BIOS alterations could be handled just like you're doing. The BIOS would be a fairly easy implementation if you have the machine and you know precisely what needs to be done.

The safest way is to not order a computer. It's to either build it from literally off the shelf components or buy it randomly at a kiosk/store. Then never ever turn it on until you intend to use it at an anonymous location. Turning it on at your house? You risk it being identified to you if it connects through your network. Use it for any other purpose than clandestine activities? It will pick up info that can be traced back to you.

Treat it like a burner phone.

Or just don't ever be in a position where you'll risk becoming a target of your gov't.
 
2013-12-29 07:26:19 PM  
Yep. just checked, that's a NRO patch, not an NSA one.
 
2013-12-29 07:26:27 PM  

tiiger: Isn't that octopus Logo/Patch a National Reconnaisance Office (NRO) one, not an NSA one?


It is indeed. It seems only tangentially related to this story.
 
2013-12-29 07:26:52 PM  

Snarfangel: Once I discover which party is responsible, I will know whether or not to be outraged.


Sarcasm aside, if statements from various US Reps and Senators are true (big if, I know), then neither party is responsible.  For the most part, they haven't authorized this stuff and don't even know it's going on.  Even the few that are on intelligence oversight committees generally claim to be shocked any time these stories come out.  (Again, if true) Essentially the NSA is interpreting existing general authorizations to mean that it can do all this stuff, and not telling ANYONE.  A rogue intelligence agency with no oversight and no accountability.

But hey, apparently it's OK because 9/11.
 
2013-12-29 07:28:09 PM  

The Madd Mann: Dude, you're getting spied on.


high-larious.


/no sarcasm
 
2013-12-29 07:28:45 PM  

p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.


From what I've been able to gather, they sometimes pop in different chips.  One in particular that controls your Universal Serial Bus.   They also have an altered motherboard for the disk controller, which your protocol should handle.   They are also altering the BIOS.

They have also been having Windows 8 send your crash reports and other error diagnostics to them as well as Microsoft.   That tells them what machines are vulnerable to various external attacks.

There is more collaboration between TAO and the FBI apparently.  Jobs that require physical access to sites.  Corporations mostly.
 
2013-12-29 07:29:30 PM  
... or you could read the linked article within which doesn't mention Dell or any other company and is less ambiguous about the fact that such interdictions are only performed on targeted parties and not random citizens.

Why get upset over actual crimes committed by the state when we can just make shiat up?
 
2013-12-29 07:30:59 PM  
img.gawkerassets.com
 
2013-12-29 07:31:12 PM  

dbaggins: p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.

From what I've been able to gather, they sometimes pop in different chips.  One in particular that controls your Universal Serial Bus.   They also have an altered motherboard for the disk controller, which your protocol should handle.   They are also altering the BIOS.


It's called EUFI. shhhhhh
 
2013-12-29 07:31:41 PM  
I'm all up for outrage, but this seems kinda over the top. Physical access to apparently random shipments? I suppose if you wanted to make them well-hidden zombie machines, but still. Lotsa room for failure there. Nabbing machines intended for people/organizations on a "suspect" list and working them over, yeah. The risk would be worth it then.
 
2013-12-29 07:32:32 PM  
Its worse than this. I left a shop (which may or may not be in that article) where source code access was given to the .gov *after* check in, but *before* signing. It was an open secret. And this was going on almost ten years ago.
 
2013-12-29 07:33:18 PM  

Hey y'all! Check out my new Dell 55 inch monitor!


www.stylebubble.co.uk

 
2013-12-29 07:33:55 PM  
How is it all this data that they're supposed to be collecting isn't causing their system to collapse under all that weight? And how could they possibly have the ability to sift through it all? It'd take years...
 
2013-12-29 07:34:10 PM  

p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.


They are doing just that, so...yeah.  Read the 3 part Der Spiegel story linked in TFA, it's not good.
 
2013-12-29 07:36:11 PM  

Your Hind Brain: dbaggins: p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.

From what I've been able to gather, they sometimes pop in different chips.  One in particular that controls your Universal Serial Bus.   They also have an altered motherboard for the disk controller, which your protocol should handle.   They are also altering the BIOS.

It's called EUFI. shhhhhh


UEFI actually.
 
2013-12-29 07:37:13 PM  

Your Hind Brain: dbaggins: p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.

From what I've been able to gather, they sometimes pop in different chips.  One in particular that controls your Universal Serial Bus.   They also have an altered motherboard for the disk controller, which your protocol should handle.   They are also altering the BIOS.

It's called EUFI. shhhhhh


Do you mean UEFIA, the Unsolicited Extensible Finger In Anus?
 
2013-12-29 07:37:23 PM  

Ruiizu: Windows 8 already has backdoors installed for the NSA to look into. This is just the next logical step for them.

/nothing to see here citizen


I think I'll fill my hard drive with nothing but pictures of my cock.
 
2013-12-29 07:38:58 PM  

EggSniper: linked article


They linked to the feature story, when they should have linked to the accompanying story: Shopping for Spy Gear: Catalog Advertises NSA Toolbox
 
2013-12-29 07:44:01 PM  

p51d007: Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios


I got some bad news for you.

It goes as far as your hard drives (especially those with an additional processor built-in that even when disabled the hard drive works just fine. Yes, your hard drive can likely run Linux.)

You guys should be reading the Reddit thread where details are getting revealed.
 
2013-12-29 07:44:58 PM  
Why would an intelligence target order a computer online and have it shipped to him?  Rather than pay cash for a machine off the shelf at Best Buy?
 
2013-12-29 07:45:40 PM  

shazbotuh: How is it all this data that they're supposed to be collecting isn't causing their system to collapse under all that weight? And how could they possibly have the ability to sift through it all? It'd take years...


Notsureifserious.jpg
 
2013-12-29 07:45:52 PM  
Darn.  That means Linux systems from now on.

(The word processors that came with Ubuntu Linux sucked.)
 
2013-12-29 07:46:52 PM  
I would imagine only high value targets get the full chip-swap treatment, but there is nothing hard about having a shop instal thousands of UEFI update before you get your machine.    Your home computer is unlikely a viable target, but any machine going to a company will have some worries.  A few root compromised machines inside a company DMZ with instructions to phone-home on an encrypted connection and most any company is subject to espionage.

which I suspect has been the NSAs target all along.  Or at least, the private contractors that the NSA subcontracts this highly-illegal stuff too.  Hence, Snowden.

for every one Snowden spilling the beans for fame and patriotism, there are probably dozens of quasi-private spooks running all sorts of games.
 
2013-12-29 07:47:06 PM  
THIS CITIZEN'S ELECTRONIC DEVICE IS OPERATING PROPERLY AND THIS IS NOT AN NSA EMPLOYEE LOOKING THROUGH HIS STASH OF shiatTING DICKNIPPLE GOAT PORN.  RESUME POSTING ILLEGAL ACTIVITES.

END TRANSMISSION.
 
2013-12-29 07:47:44 PM  

tripleseven: Your Hind Brain: dbaggins: p51d007: When I order a laptop or desktop for work, I have a simple procedure.  Leave it OFFLINE, do the minimal setup required when booting a new system, then, power down, PULL the hard drive, sticker it with the serial of the machine it came out of, along with the manufacturers warranty date expiration, install a NEW CLEAN hard drive, set it up how I want, and install it.  If it makes it through the warranty period, I just wipe the drive and put it on the shelf.  If something happens to the computer, under warranty, I pop out MY hard drive, install the hard drive it came with, ship it back.  When it comes back, pop out THEIR hard drive and put
mine back in.
Unless the NSA is installing something in the bios, that should keep the spyware off....I hope  LOL.

From what I've been able to gather, they sometimes pop in different chips.  One in particular that controls your Universal Serial Bus.   They also have an altered motherboard for the disk controller, which your protocol should handle.   They are also altering the BIOS.

It's called EUFI. shhhhhh

UEFI actually.


Typo. Hammered etc.
 
2013-12-29 07:48:27 PM  

theotherles: Darn.  That means Linux systems from now on.

(The word processors that came with Ubuntu Linux sucked.)


Nope. Won't matter, as they're apparently in almost every component firmware as well. Unless you built the hardware yourself, you're not safe, OS means nothing, encryption means nothing, they're at binary level.
 
2013-12-29 07:48:53 PM  

theotherles: Darn.  That means Linux systems from now on.

(The word processors that came with Ubuntu Linux sucked.)


Depends what year you're talking about.
 
2013-12-29 07:50:33 PM  

khyberkitsune: You guys should be reading the Reddit thread where details are getting revealed.


It would be helpful if you provided a link.
 
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