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(South China Morning Post)   China: The Desolation of Smog   (scmp.com ) divider line
    More: Sad, Shaanxi Province, Hebei, Henan  
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6833 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Dec 2013 at 1:14 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-23 01:16:20 PM  
I wonder how Beijing compares to 1960's L.A. ?
 
2013-12-23 01:17:09 PM  

Nick Nostril: I wonder how Beijing compares to 1960's L.A. ?


Maybe, but without the killing off of every species for the sake of imaginary health benefits.
 
2013-12-23 01:18:38 PM  
Republican logic: it should be that way here too
 
2013-12-23 01:18:51 PM  
Funny Title Sad reality.
 
2013-12-23 01:19:43 PM  
Having been in Beijing, a good day there was equivalent to a Stage 1 Smog alert in 80's LA.  Not sure how much worse it was in the 60's and 70's for L.A.

Also funny how this is what small government political types want the U.S. to be like.
 
2013-12-23 01:20:16 PM  
When I clicked the link, all I got was a blank, white screen.  Took me a second to realize it wasn't intentionally made to look like smog, but my browser just prevented the page from loading.
 
2013-12-23 01:22:19 PM  
how sad. How long before everyone over there just starts falling over dead?
Will they try to fix their problem then?
 
2013-12-23 01:22:32 PM  
i39.tinypic.com
Pictures like this are proof why some regulations are good.
It also shows who are the main culprits of adding crap to the atmosphere.
 
2013-12-23 01:23:12 PM  

mitEj: Funny Title Sad reality.


Sad why?  They chose this.

This is what happens when you let your world be controlled by people who value profitability and not quality of life, environment, etc.  When people vote against the ignorance and arrogance of corporate controlled politicians, remember that photo and you understand why.
 
2013-12-23 01:23:46 PM  
So... Is there any one specific reason that's causing this? It says they reduced coal output or whatever, but the pollution is still off the charts.
 
2013-12-23 01:24:27 PM  

frankmanhog: Having been in Beijing, a good day there was equivalent to a Stage 1 Smog alert in 80's LA.  Not sure how much worse it was in the 60's and 70's for L.A.

Also funny how this is what small government political types want the U.S. to be like.


Beijing isn't small government. The biggest polluters over there are State Owned Enterprises, as in the government.
 
2013-12-23 01:25:36 PM  
Yeah but there is the positive side,

"According to Yahoo News, China's state broadcaster CCTV attempted to shine some absurd light on the smog situation by listing five reasons as to why this air pollution is beneficial. The list is as follows:

1.It unifies the Chinese people.
2.It makes China more equal.
3.It raises citizen awareness of the cost of China's economic development.
4.It makes people funnier.
5.It makes people more knowledgeable (of things like meteorology and the English word 'haze'). "
 
2013-12-23 01:29:49 PM  
When you can taste the air you have a problem.
 
2013-12-23 01:30:02 PM  

Begoggle: Republican logic: it should be that way here too


Bah.  We still (despite libs best efforts) enjoy far more freedoms than the Chinese and yet don't have that sort of pollution.  They are actually banning barbeques there and taking other totally insane steps like that.  More regulation will not solve the issue, just as it will not make anything better here.  The difference between the two countries is that folks here have some sense of responsibility and common sense.  Whereas most Americans upon seeing air that dirty would think "I don't think I will light my fireplace today, even if I have can should continue to have that right" whereas the average Chinaman will say "fark the government and the rest of you I am going to be sneaky and keep burning stuff."
 
2013-12-23 01:31:00 PM  

MaliFinn: mitEj: Funny Title Sad reality.

Sad why?  They chose this.

This is what happens when you let your world be controlled by people who value profitability and not quality of life, environment, etc.  When people vote against the ignorance and arrogance of corporate controlled politicians, remember that photo and you understand why.


Yes, I believe the Chinese people specifically voted in this political system...
 
2013-12-23 01:31:37 PM  
The UK went through a lot of these 'killer smogs' in the 1950s and early 60s, thanks to the majority of homeowners heating their houses and generating electricity with low-grade coal. Not to forget most motor vehicles were spewing out their share of crap, too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Smog
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/december/19/newsid_ 32 80000/3280473.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/witness/january/29/newsid_2706000 /2 706901.stm
China seems to be at that point right now.
 
2013-12-23 01:32:26 PM  

Mietsko: Yeah but there is the positive side,

"According to Yahoo News, China's state broadcaster CCTV attempted to shine some absurd light on the smog situation by listing five reasons as to why this air pollution is beneficial. The list is as follows:

1.It unifies the Chinese people.
2.It makes China more equal.
3.It raises citizen awareness of the cost of China's economic development.
4.It makes people funnier.
5.It makes people more knowledgeable (of things like meteorology and the English word 'haze'). "


I've also read "it will make it difficult for any other country to invade China, since they won't be able to see anything".
 
2013-12-23 01:39:05 PM  
Free from job-killing regulations!
 
2013-12-23 01:39:37 PM  

Mietsko: Yeah but there is the positive side,

"According to Yahoo News, China's state broadcaster CCTV attempted to shine some absurd light on the smog situation by listing five reasons as to why this air pollution is beneficial. The list is as follows:

1.It unifies the Chinese people.
2.It makes China more equal.
3.It raises citizen awareness of the cost of China's economic development.
4.It makes people funnier.
5.It makes people more knowledgeable (of things like meteorology and the English word 'haze'). "



6. It allows Fark submitters and media outlets around the world to come across as witty and original when they replace 'Smaug' - from the new Lord of the Rings film, The Desolation of Smaug - with the word 'smog'.
 
2013-12-23 01:42:02 PM  
I can't find a single fark to give. You idiots did this to yourselves, now live with it. Enjoy your cancer.
 
2013-12-23 01:43:20 PM  
Looks like a lot of respiritory problems in Chinas future.
 
2013-12-23 01:46:32 PM  

frankmanhog: Having been in Beijing, a good day there was equivalent to a Stage 1 Smog alert in 80's LA.  Not sure how much worse it was in the 60's and 70's for L.A.

Also funny how this is what small government political types want the U.S. to be like.


I tend to think libertarian sometimes, but I realize there's a lot of trouble living that way.  I grew up in the northwest corner of the LA valley in the 70's/80s where smog collected and grew thick, unable to rise over the mountains.  It was one of the worst areas in the US.  Most of the natural trees in the hills had all died.  As kids we broke sticks off them all the time to make forts, cannons, spears, etc.  Summertime often looked like the picture above.  There were many days where we couldn't play outdoors because our eyes would burn and get a "smog cough" if we took a deep breath.  (Inhale quickly and deeply and there would be burning sensation in your lungs causing you to burst out coughing).  You couldn't see more than 3 houses down the street.

Although it's only been 35 years, things have changed significantly.  I find it amazing that I grew up in a time where you couldn't breathe outdoors.  I'm somewhat fiscally conservative & socially liberal (probably like Alan Simpson or a blue dog democrat) and from a republican family.  My dad still thinks the EPA killed all the jobs in America (which is 50% true).  However, I'd rather have clean air to breathe and US corporations having to deal with costly waste problems than abundant jobs for everyone until they die at 49 of lung cancer.  Streams, rivers and air shouldn't be free dumping grounds so that companies can pad their pockets with extra cash.  We have to live here.
 
2013-12-23 01:46:45 PM  
Thank you, I knew someone had to use this pun for this story eventually.

/probably already has, but I didn't go searching for it
 
2013-12-23 01:48:25 PM  
DRTFA yet, but is there actual Desolation in the article? Or are they just going to hint at it, and get around to the actual desolation during the follow up?

/stop trolling me, Mr. Jackson!
 
2013-12-23 01:49:22 PM  
But government mandated catalytic converters will destroy the American car market!!! It'll raise the cost of a car by a hundred dollars. Free market! Job creators! Job killing regulations!
 
2013-12-23 01:49:30 PM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: Pictures like this are proof why some regulations are good.


Which is funny, because here is China, an actual Socialist Nation, who does not have the regulations that the US has, yet Republicans keep saying Obama is a Socialist who therefore wants to make the US into China, which, for things like this, sounds exactly like what Republicans want.
 
2013-12-23 01:50:53 PM  
LIBERTARIAN
PARADISE
 
2013-12-23 01:57:45 PM  
Good. I hope they all choke to death.
 
2013-12-23 01:59:32 PM  
This is why Republicans hate China, they're stealing all the good ideas.
 
2013-12-23 02:03:33 PM  
Nice one, subs!

Sad for the people who have to breathe this crap, though.
 
2013-12-23 02:05:22 PM  
With the amount of money we owe China, you would think that they would want to buy some clean air technologies from us.

China does need to come up with a plan to tackle the pollution.  Three Gorges Dam, and some nuclear power plants are a start, but mandating certain car features more strict than California, and changing a few other things would be good to do as well.
 
2013-12-23 02:06:39 PM  

ShonenBat: frankmanhog: Having been in Beijing, a good day there was equivalent to a Stage 1 Smog alert in 80's LA.  Not sure how much worse it was in the 60's and 70's for L.A.

Also funny how this is what small government political types want the U.S. to be like.

Beijing isn't small government. The biggest polluters over there are State Owned Enterprises, as in the government.


Read the rest of the post

Small government types or at least the ones screaming for small government like Rick Perry, Ron/Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, etc. The ones who want to get rid of that evil job destroying EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) you know the only thing really stopping what is happening in China now from happening all over America.

Beijing has the type of small government that the U.S. politicians I named want. Little to no regulations and if anyone complains the government can step in and put the workers down on site or move them to re education/work camps.
 
2013-12-23 02:07:05 PM  
The Free Market will sort this out. People who want clean air will just buy it.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-12-23 02:07:28 PM  
Don't worry, the Free Market will fix it.
 
2013-12-23 02:10:34 PM  

Ima4nic8or: Begoggle: Republican logic: it should be that way here too

Bah.  We still (despite libs best efforts) enjoy far more freedoms than the Chinese and yet don't have that sort of pollution.  They are actually banning barbeques there and taking other totally insane steps like that.  More regulation will not solve the issue, just as it will not make anything better here.  The difference between the two countries is that folks here have some sense of responsibility and common sense.  Whereas most Americans upon seeing air that dirty would think "I don't think I will light my fireplace today, even if I have can should continue to have that right" whereas the average Chinaman will say "fark the government and the rest of you I am going to be sneaky and keep burning stuff."


img.fark.net

What the fark are you talking about? The chinaman is not the issue here, Dude. I'm talking about drawing a line in the sand, Dude. Across this line, you DO NOT... Also, Dude, chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature. Asian-American, please.
 
2013-12-23 02:13:57 PM  

Ima4nic8or: Bah.  We still (despite libs best efforts) enjoy far more freedoms


Sort of relative... in reality, you are free to do a lot more things in China than you are in the US.  Lack of regulation/law = more freedom.

We have a better system of rights... but you shouldnt confuse that with freedom.
 
2013-12-23 02:14:23 PM  

So, that linked story is about 95% javascript, tracking cookies and other bull and won't even display if you have javascript turned off...

Here's the actual text:

Thick smog once again descended upon parts of northern China on Monday, with cities in Hebei, Henan and Shaanxi provinces posting off-the-charts air pollution readings.


The air quality indexes in Xingtai and Shijiazhuang in Hebei Province, Zhengzhou in Henan, and Xi'an in Shaanxi all exceeded the maximum of 500 as of 11am on Monday.


A thick blanket of dark grey air continued to loom over the city of Xi'an as it suffered a sixth straight day of serious smog.


"[We have] temporarily limited the production of seven major coal companies including Xingtai Iron & Steel and Zhongmei Xuyang [Coking Co]. Production [of each of these companies] was reduced 30 per cent on average," the official China National Radio quoted the deputy director of Xingtai's environmental protection bureau as saying on Sunday. The city had also endured almost a whole week of heavy smog.


Lhasa, the capital city of the Tibet autonomous region, traditionally known as the place with the cleanest air on the mainland, continued to suffer from serious pollution after being hit by a duststorm late last week.


Air quality readings surged on Thursday and Friday, with the larger PM10 particles - those up to 10 microns in diameter -- accounting for most of the pollution. The 24-hour average air quality index of the city bounced back to 348 this morning after the air quality improved to  "good" on Saturday.


The latest bout of prolonged air pollution plaguing many parts of the country is among the worst this winter.


According to statistics released by the Ministry of Environmental Protection, 74 cities on the ministry's watch list suffered from "slight" to "serious" air pollution on almost half of the days in November.


Of the 74, only three southern coastal cities - Fuzhou , Haikou  and Zhuhai -- reported pollution-free days throughout November. Nine cities, including Lhasa and Kunming, experienced air pollution during 20 per cent of the time in November.

 
2013-12-23 02:22:25 PM  

Begoggle: Republican logic: it should be that way here too


I was thinking along the lines of: "but they have jobs". I mean isn't that the logic behing their war on the EPA? Their pollution standards are job killers?
 
2013-12-23 02:24:21 PM  
that's not man-made, that's naturaly ocuring climate change.
Move on, hipies, nothing to see there!
 
2013-12-23 02:26:15 PM  
I think there is a market for cheep rebreathers/Air filters there.
We should work up a design and sell it to them.
 
2013-12-23 02:28:10 PM  

MaliFinn: mitEj: Funny Title Sad reality.

Sad why?  They chose this.

This is what happens when you let your world be controlled by people who value profitability and not quality of life, environment, etc.  When people vote against the ignorance and arrogance of corporate controlled politicians, remember that photo and you understand why.


Yes, it's rampant capitalism that caused the smog.  In China.
 
2013-12-23 02:32:41 PM  
Man I wish the Z-Virus would hurry up and get here, this world needs about 7 billion less people.
 
2013-12-23 02:37:16 PM  

JNowe: MaliFinn: mitEj: Funny Title Sad reality.

Sad why?  They chose this.

This is what happens when you let your world be controlled by people who value profitability and not quality of life, environment, etc.  When people vote against the ignorance and arrogance of corporate controlled politicians, remember that photo and you understand why.

Yes, it's rampant capitalism that caused the smog.  In China.


Either China is a laissez faire capitalist utopia or else you must concede that communism/socialism is economically kicking our collective capitalist butts.  (Hint: it's not the latter)
 
2013-12-23 02:40:59 PM  

mitEj: I think there is a market for cheep rebreathers/Air filters there.
We should work up a design and sell it to them.


Wouldn't work since they'd be built in China, they can just buy from the factory and cut the middleman out.
 
2013-12-23 02:43:40 PM  

Persnickety: JNowe: MaliFinn: mitEj: Funny Title Sad reality.

Sad why?  They chose this.

This is what happens when you let your world be controlled by people who value profitability and not quality of life, environment, etc.  When people vote against the ignorance and arrogance of corporate controlled politicians, remember that photo and you understand why.

Yes, it's rampant capitalism that caused the smog.  In China.

Either China is a laissez faire capitalist utopia or else you must concede that communism/socialism is economically kicking our collective capitalist butts.  (Hint: it's not the latter)



I think the issue of smog is not black and white, but a shade of gray...


/Not fifty of them, though, because that's just sick.
 
2013-12-23 02:44:17 PM  

Normal: China does need to come up with a plan to tackle the pollution.  Three Gorges Dam, and some nuclear power plants are a start, but mandating certain car features more strict than California, and changing a few other things would be good to do as well.


Maybe they can build the biggest wind turbines in the world, stretching into space, which would not only provide energy for the country, but would blow all the pollution across the ocean.

Then they'd put the eye of Sauron on top of one of them, of course.
 
2013-12-23 02:46:10 PM  

VegasVinnie: There were many days where we couldn't play outdoors because our eyes would burn and get a "smog cough" if we took a deep breath.  (Inhale quickly and deeply and there would be burning sensation in your lungs causing you to burst out coughing).  You couldn't see more than 3 houses down the street.


I can confirm this.  We'd get stage 3 alerts every now & then back in the 70s, and the air was always bad in the summer.  Now, I can't remember the last time we even had a stage 1 alert.
 
2013-12-23 03:07:42 PM  

Mietsko: Yeah but there is the positive side,

"According to Yahoo News, China's state broadcaster CCTV attempted to shine some absurd light on the smog situation by listing five reasons as to why this air pollution is beneficial. The list is as follows:

1.It unifies the Chinese people.
2.It makes China more equal.
3.It raises citizen awareness of the cost of China's economic development.
4.It makes people funnier.
5.It makes people more knowledgeable (of things like meteorology and the English word 'haze'). "


6: It reduces the amount of people, meaning you might get to ride inside the bus instead of on the roof.
 
2013-12-23 03:11:34 PM  

Slaves2Darkness: Man I wish the Z-Virus would hurry up and get here, this world needs about 7 billion less people.


Including yourself with that 7 billion?
 
2013-12-23 03:13:08 PM  

cryinoutloud: Normal: China does need to come up with a plan to tackle the pollution.  Three Gorges Dam, and some nuclear power plants are a start, but mandating certain car features more strict than California, and changing a few other things would be good to do as well.

Maybe they can build the biggest wind turbines in the world, stretching into space, which would not only provide energy for the country, but would blow all the pollution across the ocean.

Then they'd put the eye of Sauron on top of one of them, of course.


I don't get how this from an engineering point of view.
What would definitvely work would be wind turbines working in reverse, to blow the smog away on windless day. The turbines woul have to be redesigned, especialy blade profile and electrics  (generator->motor) but a lot of existing conponent and exerience can be used. You will need to feed them energy, though, and and we all agree that the best here would be  coal-plants, high-sulfur coal of course.
 
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