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(FastCo Design)   You haters just don't get it. Windows 8 is perfect *sobs*   (fastcodesign.com) divider line 278
    More: Unlikely, Mac OS, Windows, Start Button, Microsoft, back closure, operating systems, Microsoft Surface, perfect  
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4053 clicks; posted to Geek » on 17 Dec 2013 at 8:47 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-17 08:55:36 AM  
I've written a dozen articles championing the design philosophy of Metro, but at the end of the day, I don't use Windows 8.

Idiot.
 
2013-12-17 08:56:31 AM  
Windows 8 looks kinda neat until you use it.

Then it sucks balls.
 
2013-12-17 09:05:00 AM  
The company's attempt to build iOS controls into Mac OS, through Launchpad, was an embarrassing failure. (What Mac user do you know who actively decides to leave their normal desktop to scroll through an iPhone interface shoehorned within OS X?) Meanwhile, Metro can perform equally well on a laptop, phone, tablet, or television, because Microsoft figured the design problem out.

Metro may fit more easily on a desktop than the iOS interface, but that alone does not cause Metro to be an optimal or even a desirable interface on a desktop.
 
2013-12-17 09:05:13 AM  
While Gnome 3 does a post-Start Menu desktop better, I'm glad to see that clunky ass UI element go away for good.

On the touch side I really like the UI Microsoft has put together on both their phone and tablet operating systems. I went a couple of weeks with a Windows Phone and the only reason I returned it for an Android phone is that the software selection is rather anemic.

I also have a Dell Venue 8 Pro, but I've kept it. There are still a few pure tablet/touch software gaps with iOS/Android and if it were an RT tablet, it probably would have suffered the same fate as my Window Phone experiment, but being able to do full desktop stuff that's well beyond iOS/Android mostly levels the playing field. Also, Civ V on a tablet is also the best thing ever.
 
2013-12-17 09:05:21 AM  
We don't want the same farking interface on our phones as we do our laptops or desktops.  Is it that difficult to comprehend Microsoft?

Sorry, but I'm not making any type of spreadsheets on my cell phone
 
2013-12-17 09:06:34 AM  
There has been more sales of Windows 7 in the last quarter than windows 8 and 8.1 combined.
 
2013-12-17 09:09:10 AM  
And while you're at it forcibly change the QWERTY keyboard to one of the dozen that are proven to be more ergonomic/efficient/productive and see what happens.

What's that? Nobody would buy our machines because there's 100+ years of consumer inertia of what people know and understand?

Same thing with Windows.

Sometimes being the biggest isn't the best.
 
2013-12-17 09:09:15 AM  
Oh, it's this thread again.
 
JW
2013-12-17 09:09:38 AM  
Any given box could contain a photo link to Xbox music, Xbox movies, or Xbox games, or downloadable content for Call of Duty, the latest episode of a particular TV show, a link to Netflix, a limited time coupon for 99-cent action movies, etc. It can be extremely disorienting to navigate to any particular preconceived destination. In this regard, Metro pushes exploration and discovery, but when you actually want to play a certain game or load a certain app? You'll really want to bypass Metro altogether and just tell the system where to go.

And that's a major problem I have with Metro.  The desktop mode lets me put a bunch of icons on the desktop so I can go directly where I want.  The start menu gives me a nice organized mode so that I can organize, but when I drill down, there's only the similar-icons present.  The apps menu in Metro full screen is crazy -- if I want something, I have to search among ALL programs.  And yes, I can type it out to find it, but what if I don't know the name?  (not of all Asus' programs are called "Asus <whatever>").

Add to that that I hate the take-over-my-full-screen nature of metro start screen -- it's too big and flashy of a change when I just want to start up a new program.  It's like having to go to a new room rather than just opening up my cabinet.
 
2013-12-17 09:10:30 AM  

wozzeck: Windows 8 looks kinda neat until you use it.

Then it sucks balls.


That

Windows 8 is only worth a damn once a 3rd party start menu is being used and all the Metro apps are replaced with regular programs....unless you happen to like Metro and typing commands to fully utilize a touch based interface.

Would it have been that difficult to include Classic, Aero, and Metro with Windows 8?
 
2013-12-17 09:11:41 AM  

wozzeck: Windows 8 looks kinda neat until you use it.

Then it sucks balls.


Windows 8 looks hideous.  Then it gets even worse.
 
2013-12-17 09:11:58 AM  
I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?
 
2013-12-17 09:12:37 AM  

BunkyBrewman: We don't want the same farking interface on our phones as we do our laptops or desktops.  Is it that difficult to comprehend Microsoft?

Sorry, but I'm not making any type of spreadsheets on my cell phone



There are already monitor-keyboard-mouse setups that you can dock your phone with and use it in lieu of a PC. While that doesn't make a whole lot of sense today, in the next couple of years, I can easily see the processing power for phones improving to the point where buying a tower simply isn't necessary anymore for most users. When that happens, where your phone is literally the storage and brains of your computer and everything else are peripheral docks for your phone, it'll make sense to have a consistent user experience rather than multiple operating systems loaded on a single device; yes?
 
2013-12-17 09:13:14 AM  

skeevy420: Would it have been that difficult to include Classic, Aero, and Metro with Windows 8?


Microsoft doesn't give a rat's ass about their existing base.  Ballmer and Co. only care about out-Appleing Apple.  Which is the biggest problem Microsoft has ever had.

Fortunately that lunatic is out the door soon.
 
2013-12-17 09:14:10 AM  

JW: The apps menu in Metro full screen is crazy -- if I want something, I have to search among ALL programs.


Oh you want to start a program? Here's every icon ever installed on this machine, ever with no way to organize them.  At some point back in the MSN days, MS bought into the let's cram everything onto a page school of design and never grew from there.
 
kab
2013-12-17 09:14:34 AM  
First and foremost, good design solves problems.

And this one is a solution to a nonexistent problem as far as desktop users go.

This move by MS is akin to GM saying "to ensure we're all on the same page, we're going to equip all our new vehicles with the same tires"
 
2013-12-17 09:14:47 AM  
That seems to be a rather schizophrenic article.  I almost suspect that it was written by two different people or perhaps by the same author at two different times.

The first half of the article gushes about how beautiful and functional Windows 8 is and how it's equally comfortable on any device.  The second half of the article seems to try to convince the reader that Windows 8 attempts to solve non-existent problems and is thus not very functional.

It's as if the author wrote the first half of the article upon Windows 8's release and was hoping to jump on the Windows-8-is-great bandwagon and the second half of the article was written some months later after it was clear that the public wasn't sold on Windows 8 and was hoping to jump on the Windows-8-ain't-so-great bandwagon.
 
2013-12-17 09:15:19 AM  
Two points in relation to another OS: 1. Launchpad: it's there for the geezers and the kids. Works great for those audiences. 2. The article is absolutely right on how terrible using multiple programs together is in 8, especially in Metro. Whereas Mavericks has finally fixed the problems with juggling full-screen programs, and is the best of both worlds, most especially on multiple monitors.
 
2013-12-17 09:15:46 AM  
Just installed windows 8.1 pro last night... was only on the metro tiles for the 2 seconds it took to figure out how to go to the desktop, then another minute to install classic shell. Easy peasy. I know people biatch about metro, but seriously... it takes a whopping 1 minute after install to never have to see it again.

Noticeably faster than windows 7 on my ~3 year old home-built rig (especially in gaming). Basically, it looks and feels like win7, just quicker. YMMV
 
2013-12-17 09:16:10 AM  

neaorin: Oh, it's this thread again.


I'll get my "you hate change" pictures ready. Maybe I'll start with Scrappy Doo today.
 
2013-12-17 09:16:48 AM  

neaorin: Oh, it's this thread again.


To be fair, we've never had a Windows 8 thread based on the user interface design opinions of a professional writer who doesn't use the OS he's critiquing.

/ why the fark would anybody green something this stupid?
// oh... right... because arguments = ad impressions
/// I'm sure this writer totally isn't getting paid by Microsoft to push a particular agenda...
 
2013-12-17 09:17:13 AM  
"First and foremost, it's just a beautiful interface..."

Welcome to the list of people whose taste is so awful anything else you could possibly say is ruined.
 
2013-12-17 09:17:39 AM  

wilson_83: Just installed windows 8.1 pro last night... was only on the metro tiles for the 2 seconds it took to figure out how to go to the desktop, then another minute to install classic shell. Easy peasy. I know people biatch about metro, but seriously... it takes a whopping 1 minute after install to never have to see it again.

Noticeably faster than windows 7 on my ~3 year old home-built rig (especially in gaming). Basically, it looks and feels like win7, just quicker. YMMV


Now try opening an Adobe PDF file.  Be sure to scream "METRO!!!" when you do it.
 
2013-12-17 09:18:13 AM  

Fizpez: I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?


I'm using 8.1 for gaming and couldn't be happier.  It's not as bad as people make it out to be and Classic Shell type programs make it pretty decent.  Metro -- either you like it or you don't.  It isn't hard to avoid it and not use it.  Most complaints for 8 are just people whining about doing the standard crap you do when you get a system, like installing programs to make the computer run how you want it to or replacing one app with another (native zip program to Winrar for example).
 
2013-12-17 09:21:19 AM  

skozlaw: /// I'm sure this writer totally isn't getting paid by Microsoft to push a particular agenda...


I would hope not. At the end of the article, he says he only uses Macs and thinks Metro was solving a problem that didn't exist and was therefore a stupid thing to do.
 
2013-12-17 09:23:08 AM  

skozlaw: neaorin: Oh, it's this thread again.

To be fair, we've never had a Windows 8 thread based on the user interface design opinions of a professional writer who doesn't use the OS he's critiquing.


Well, no. But if you're looking for opinions from people who don't actually use Windows 8, the thread always has you covered.

/ [stoplikingwhatidontlike.jpg]
 
2013-12-17 09:23:30 AM  
Windows 8 isn't the problem. It's a good, stable OS. The problem is the metro stuff.
 
2013-12-17 09:26:41 AM  

neaorin: Well, no. But if you're looking for opinions from people who don't actually use Windows 8, the thread always has you covered


Like the guy upthread who falsely claimed Metro throws in every icon for every app by default and doesn't give you any way to organize it?

Maybe he means he is upset he can't arrange the icons in the shape of a penis.
 
2013-12-17 09:30:06 AM  

skeevy420: Fizpez: I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?

I'm using 8.1 for gaming and couldn't be happier.  It's not as bad as people make it out to be and Classic Shell type programs make it pretty decent.  Metro -- either you like it or you don't.  It isn't hard to avoid it and not use it.  Most complaints for 8 are just people whining about doing the standard crap you do when you get a system, like installing programs to make the computer run how you want it to or replacing one app with another (native zip program to Winrar for example).


My complaint is why would I want to get a system with this for my office full of old women who barely know how to use the computers they have now.  Switching to 7 and updating Office has been a big enough of a headache.  You think I want to have to sit here and hold 15 peoples hands all day for 6 months while they figure out how to use this stupid crap?  I'll give you a hint, I REALLY funking do not.
 
2013-12-17 09:30:56 AM  

Feepit: BunkyBrewman: We don't want the same farking interface on our phones as we do our laptops or desktops.  Is it that difficult to comprehend Microsoft?

Sorry, but I'm not making any type of spreadsheets on my cell phone


There are already monitor-keyboard-mouse setups that you can dock your phone with and use it in lieu of a PC. While that doesn't make a whole lot of sense today, in the next couple of years, I can easily see the processing power for phones improving to the point where buying a tower simply isn't necessary anymore for most users. When that happens, where your phone is literally the storage and brains of your computer and everything else are peripheral docks for your phone, it'll make sense to have a consistent user experience rather than multiple operating systems loaded on a single device; yes?


No.
 
2013-12-17 09:31:23 AM  

wilson_83: Just installed windows 8.1 pro last night... was only on the metro tiles for the 2 seconds it took to figure out how to go to the desktop, then another minute to install classic shell. Easy peasy. I know people biatch about metro, but seriously... it takes a whopping 1 minute after install to never have to see it again.

Noticeably faster than windows 7 on my ~3 year old home-built rig (especially in gaming). Basically, it looks and feels like win7, just quicker. YMMV


I support over one-hundred Windows-based desktop computers. Installing third-party applications to correct Microsoft's poor design choices is not a viable option. Even if I add the third-party application to the base deployment image, I must keep track of product updates to address possible security flaws or incompatibilities introduced with Windows security updates.
 
2013-12-17 09:33:04 AM  
Meh it's nowhere near as bad as most people gripe, especially with 8.1. I love the idea of a single platform. I bought a Surface tablet and was going to get a Windows phone to match, but there were just no apps, so I returned it and will stick with the iPhone/iPad for this generation. Maybe next time.
 
2013-12-17 09:36:00 AM  

Fizpez: I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?


Win7 will still be supported for a couple of years, but the Xbox one SDK only runs on Windows 8, so PC games will be abandoning it sooner than later.
 
2013-12-17 09:37:23 AM  

Fizpez: I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?


I went from Vista to 8, and 8 is much better. It's faster, more stable, and looks better.

The guy in the article doesn't seem to know what he's talking about WRT multitasking. Windows 8 is great for multitasking, and it works pretty much the same way it does in 7.

Metro isn't great for multitasking, but Windows 8 != Metro. Metro is just a subset of Windows 8, and is almost completely avoidable if you don't like it.
 
2013-12-17 09:37:25 AM  
Even if I liked Windows 8, it wouldn't change my feelings about its appearance when compared to Win7; I think it's hideous when compared to 7. If it weren't so counter intuitive, and it offered a major advantage over Win 7, I'd get over my feelings about how it looks.
 
2013-12-17 09:37:58 AM  
I've been running 8 > 8.1 for a good 6 months now. I spend 99.9% of my time in the desktop "app" because that's where everything I need is. I have scarcely even bothered with Metro anything. The Facebook app is pointless, for example, when I can fire it up on the browser and get the full functionality.
 
2013-12-17 09:43:58 AM  

Livinglush: Meh it's nowhere near as bad as most people gripe, especially with 8.1. I love the idea of a single platform. I bought a Surface tablet and was going to get a Windows phone to match, but there were just no apps, so I returned it and will stick with the iPhone/iPad for this generation. Maybe next time.


You and I both know that by "no apps" you mean there wasn't a specific app that you felt was a dealbreaker.  I'm curious as to what that app is.
 
2013-12-17 09:44:06 AM  
"Groundbreaking interface..."

Yeah, and only 15 years late to the party.

obamapacman.com
 
2013-12-17 09:47:29 AM  
I've banished the metro screen and all of those stupid ass charms.  Never see them again... ever.

Decent how-to article: (many more out there)
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2027945/how-to-banish-metro-from-your- w indows-8-pc-forever.html
 
2013-12-17 09:49:11 AM  

physt: JW: The apps menu in Metro full screen is crazy -- if I want something, I have to search among ALL programs.

Oh you want to start a program? Here's every icon ever installed on this machine, ever with no way to organize them.  At some point back in the MSN days, MS bought into the let's cram everything onto a page school of design and never grew from there.


No way to organize the programs? That's news to me. You can organize the menu by "alphabetically, by category, or by date installed." With a couple setting changes, you can parse out shortcuts, and eliminate the metro apps, if you so want.
 
2013-12-17 09:50:37 AM  

neaorin: / [stoplikingwhatidontlike.jpg]


I don't care if anybody else likes it or doesn't, I don't and after more than a year I don't think that's changing at this point so I've resigned myself to learning to get around the problems it introduces for me because at the end of the say I have no choice.

What irritates me about this ongoing "debate" is that every time you point to things that you don't like or that are actually a measurable step backward there's this bizarre contingent that pops up and starts calling everyone else stupid and lazy for daring to critique software. It's weird.
 
2013-12-17 09:55:24 AM  

wozzeck: Windows 8 looks kinda neat until you use it.

Then it sucks balls.


Windows 8 was designed to look good in tablet ads and sell tablets and that's it. You know how every tablet ad has to have a woman's right hand "touching" something on the screen with one limply extended finger like that will actually get any work done because you are wow, touching it? Windows 8 was designed to look kickass in those ads.  You know, for morons.
 
2013-12-17 09:57:02 AM  

make me some tea: I've been running 8 > 8.1 for a good 6 months now. I spend 99.9% of my time in the desktop "app" because that's where everything I need is. I have scarcely even bothered with Metro anything. The Facebook app is pointless, for example, when I can fire it up on the browser and get the full functionality.


The Facebook app is a good example of touch vs. mouse. On my laptop the browser based Facebook works much better, but on a tablet, the app is nicer to use. The swipe in from the left to alt-tab considers the desktop to be a single app context so if both Fark and Facebook are running in the desktop it's easy to switch contexts with a mouse but harder with touch.
 
2013-12-17 10:01:06 AM  

skozlaw: What irritates me about this ongoing "debate" is that every time you point to things that you don't like or that are actually a measurable step backward there's this bizarre contingent that pops up and starts calling everyone else stupid and lazy for daring to critique software. It's weird.


For common PC usage, I would call anyone who has difficulty and requires, as the claims have been in this and other threads, "months of training" stupid and lazy. That isn't just Windows. Every modern OS -- Mac, Linux, Windows -- are practically Fischer-Price levels of easy. Everything is plug-n-play. The Internet magically manifests itself with next to no configuration, just click the WiFi network. All one needs is the ability to recognize shapes on a screen and click on the shapes relevant to their interests. When that fails, go to the search and type in the name of the thing you want.

Now if you are trying to do something with the PC that requires special knowledge of how to configure a specific setting, that's different. But I have yet to see a legitimate approximation of that in any of these threads.

Instead, it is outright lies, like being "forced" to use Metro, or being unable to organize apps in Metro, or having to deal with a network of hundreds of PCs and having to configure each one individually (what a pathetic network administrator to make such a claim, as if there is no way to push out updates and PC images to multiple PCs on a network!) and other nonsense.
 
2013-12-17 10:01:29 AM  
No, it's not.  It blows monkey ass.  It's a tablet OS being pushed on desktop computers.  It provides no information and everything is retardedly hard to find.
 
2013-12-17 10:01:30 AM  

Some Bass Playing Guy: Windows 8 isn't the problem. It's a good, stable OS. The problem is the metro stuff.


Except that for the average consumer/user, the interface defines the OS.
 
2013-12-17 10:01:30 AM  

Livinglush: Fizpez: I'm finally going to update my gaming rig (don't judge me it's been an expensive 5+ years and cash for something frivoulous like a new computer has not been available.

So, uh, my last rig uses Vista, and honestly I've never had huge issues with Vista.  Should I just use Win 8 because the world is full of whiners and it's really not that bad or should I install Win 7 and fall off the "supported OS" cliff even sooner?

Win7 will still be supported for a couple of years, but the Xbox one SDK only runs on Windows 8, so PC games will be abandoning it sooner than later.


That's actually kind of compelling if true - basically means some games might not be Win 7 compatible (if the developer is REALLY lazy)
 
2013-12-17 10:02:13 AM  

make me some tea: I've been running 8 > 8.1 for a good 6 months now. I spend 99.9% of my time in the desktop "app" because that's where everything I need is. I have scarcely even bothered with Metro anything. The Facebook app is pointless, for example, when I can fire it up on the browser and get the full functionality.


Pretty much. Once I figured out how to disable the apps and use the regular programs instead, I haven't fired up a single app.
 
2013-12-17 10:05:41 AM  

ReverendJasen: "Groundbreaking interface..."

Yeah, and only 15 years late to the party.


Remember kids, hyperlinking is THEFT!!!
 
2013-12-17 10:05:49 AM  

wilson_83: Just installed windows 8.1 pro last night... was only on the metro tiles for the 2 seconds it took to figure out how to go to the desktop, then another minute to install classic shell. Easy peasy. I know people biatch about metro, but seriously... it takes a whopping 1 minute after install to never have to see it again.

Noticeably faster than windows 7 on my ~3 year old home-built rig (especially in gaming). Basically, it looks and feels like win7, just quicker. YMMV


I installed classic shell so I could have my start button back but how do I keep "metro" from ever popping up again? It pops up randomly when I don't want it to. Drives me freaking crazy.
 
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