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(The Consumerist)   Need additional proof of inflation? Your 15% "minimum suggested tip" is now 18%   (consumerist.com) divider line 107
    More: Asinine, TGI, inflation  
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1343 clicks; posted to Business » on 17 Dec 2013 at 9:10 AM (35 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-17 12:40:22 PM
I've acquiesced to the 20% that the servers I know think is right.  We don't go out much, though, to places where that'd be expected.  I think we'd eat out more if we weren't feeling the gouge. It's nice visiting countries where it's not expected. And when they start demanding 25% (there are certainly people suggesting it), I'll eat out even less.
 
2013-12-17 12:40:31 PM

lennavan: Right, so the price of the meal does actually change. It changes directly in response to how well you feel your waiter/waitress performed. If you pay all waiters/waitresses a flat wage with no tips built in, what incentive do they have to do a spectacular job rather than just a good enough to not get fired job?


Promotions? Raises? (And of course, not getting fired?) All the reasons that you see people do spectacular jobs all the time, while earning a salary? Why would wait staff be hardwired to not do a great job because they were paid a decent wage and didn't have to rely on tips and the fact that some people can be real dicks about leaving a decent/fair tip, regardless of service quality? (Never mind the people who are just against tipping, or the Jesus freaks who leave tracts, so on and so forth....)
 
2013-12-17 12:47:30 PM
COL goes up with inflation, but any Farker will tell you wages haven't kept pace with inflation, not for.. 30 years?  I'd imagine service wages like waiting are even worse.

But should customers be supporting the lack of wage increases?  No.  So when food workers demand an increase in minimum wage, we all support them right? no? wtf america.
 
2013-12-17 12:48:05 PM
I always tip 35% when I go to a restaurant by tipping 10% on the first $10 of the bill, then 15% on the amount of the bill between $10 and $15, then I tip 20% for the next $10, followed by a 25% tip on the $25-$40 part of the bill, then 30% tip from $40-$55, then 35% on everything above $55.

Then I complain that we should just tip a flat $5 since 35% is too much of a tip for a waiter who offers bottle service in a 5-star restaurant.
 
2013-12-17 12:49:03 PM

GoodyearPimp: The Stealth Hippopotamus: my favorite "get with the times" story is one of the ladies that works for me only tips on the pre tax amount.

Isn't that how it's supposed to work?  I don't mind being generous, but tipping on the tax is stupid.


what's the difference... 45 cents?
 
2013-12-17 12:56:40 PM
I tip 20% unless I am given reason to tip less.

He/she probably needs it and I am pretty fortunate.
 
2013-12-17 12:57:52 PM

robbiex0r: COL goes up with inflation, but any Farker will tell you wages haven't kept pace with inflation, not for.. 30 years?  I'd imagine service wages like waiting are even worse.

But should customers be supporting the lack of wage increases?  No.  So when food workers demand an increase in minimum wage, we all support them right? no? wtf america.


If wages haven't kept up with inflation, then where is the money coming from?
 
2013-12-17 01:04:34 PM

mcreadyblue: robbiex0r: COL goes up with inflation, but any Farker will tell you wages haven't kept pace with inflation, not for.. 30 years?  I'd imagine service wages like waiting are even worse.

But should customers be supporting the lack of wage increases?  No.  So when food workers demand an increase in minimum wage, we all support them right? no? wtf america.

If wages haven't kept up with inflation, then where is the money coming from?


Second/third job or welfare usually.
 
2013-12-17 01:20:01 PM

serpent_sky: stellarossa: Even the 'fark you' amount has inflated! Didn't people used to leave a penny to show dissatisfaction? If a server provides really crappy service, I don't tip them at all. Why would you provide anything for shiatty service when its discretionary?

Where do you all go that you get such terrible service? I honestly can't think of any time in my life that I had an unpleasant experience in a restaurant due to the wait staff.  The one thing that can be said in favor of tipping, at least from a customer's perspective, is it's good incentive to provide good service.


You'd be surprised where it happens. It's usually somewhere we frequent but the server is new, or pissed off at the world that day, or wanted a smoke more than she wanted to take my order. If the service is really shiatty, I give instant feedback to the manager on duty. I don't steam over it and mentally deduct tip money.

The last time I had crappy service was at our local Skyline Chili about a year ago. We had a server I was unfamiliar with. She was slamming shiat around the table and was generally rude and abrupt. Maybe she didn't like that I was with my 4 kids - they can be messy - but then my demographic is typical for the west side of Cincinnati. Skyline is used to that.

Anyway, I let the first incident pass, as it was abruptness rather than rudeness but after the second instance, I looked at my wife, she looked at me and I asked the server if she could get her manager. Manager was appalled. Gave us a bunch of gift cards that we didn't expect.

The next time we came in, as bad luck would have it, we got that server again. I assumed she'd pretend not to remember us or whatever or maybe be antagonistic towards me but the first thing she did was to apologize for her behavior that day, stating she'd had some problems at home. I suppose I could have been a d1ck about it but I thanked her for her apology. It was a lesson to my kids that people can fark up, get called for it, and can still make amends. Most things can be fixed, including the customer/ server relationship.

/they can't mess with your food in Skyline
 
2013-12-17 01:24:57 PM
Baloney! 10% is for service that is only adequate, 15% for good, 20% or more for really amazing. If you get bad service, it is a matter of debate whether leaving change or leaving nothing complains louder.

When I delivered pizza, I would get about a buck whether the bill was $10, or a party order of $100. No one did percentages.

I got paid more than minimum, but still, a pizza driver comes to your home. A waiter or waitress barely comes to your table any more. After taking your order, the food runners take over from there.
 
2013-12-17 01:26:40 PM

serpent_sky: Why would wait staff be hardwired to not do a great job


I would say less than half of the wait staff I have ever encountered did what I would consider a "great job."  I have no idea if it's hardwired or not.  Maybe you should ask them why that is.  I can't imagine wait staff would suddenly do a better job if you paid them more first.

serpent_sky: Promotions? Raises? (And of course, not getting fired?) All the reasons that you see people do spectacular jobs all the time, while earning a salary?


A larger tip is a raise.  A promotion means you get to work during the more busy days/hours.  More experience and good recommendations means you can work at nicer restaurants.  It's all there.
 
2013-12-17 01:43:58 PM

uncoveror: When I delivered pizza, I would get about a buck whether the bill was $10, or a party order of $100. No one did percentages.


A dollar? Seriously?  I never, ever tip a delivery guy less than $5. Minimum.  They use their own cars more often than not (wear and tear, gas, etc), they work crappy hours, and they have to be on the road (which can be dangerous). If I am so lazy that I'm asking someone to literally get in a car and bring hot food to my house and quickly, at that, that's the absolute least I can tip them.

And after writing that, I feel really cheap. $5 is nothing, realistically.
 
2013-12-17 01:51:41 PM

uncoveror: Baloney! 10% is for service that is only adequate, 15% for good, 20% or more for really amazing. If you get bad service, it is a matter of debate whether leaving change or leaving nothing complains louder.

When I delivered pizza, I would get about a buck whether the bill was $10, or a party order of $100. No one did percentages.

I got paid more than minimum, but still, a pizza driver comes to your home. A waiter or waitress barely comes to your table any more. After taking your order, the food runners take over from there.


pizza delivery is a bit of a different beast...some places allow partial wage for drivers too, but that is not the point I am getting at.

You can still give some variance of service even when just delivering a pizza.  Starters, are you presentable and pleasant (yes, sir; no sir)?  if there are young kids at the door, did you jokingly ask who ordered the peanut butter and fish pizza?  Did you park in the driveway blocking the spouse who was coming home after you arrived?  did you knock on the door like the damn police?  Do you have red pepper and Parmesan packets on you in case they ask?  Do you have the stereo blasting obscene music?  if you see a multitude of religious stuff on the wall and it is Sunday afternoon, did you say 'have a blessed day'?  Do you have a pen and a pad for CC orders?  there are quite a few ways you can try to increase your chances at a good tip delivering pizza.  The 'blessed day' one used to net me a $5 tip at a certain house that would then always order on Sundays (one day I mentally slipped and just said 'thank you' and the lady looked sad I didn't say 'have a blessed day')

now on the flip side of the coin...you should always tip the driver at least $1.  Why? We know where you frickin' live. Also, drivers and stores keep track of good tippers and bad.  If I know I have a good tipper and a bad tipper on my run, guess who gets their pizza first, even if I drive by the bad tipper on the way to the good tipper.
 
2013-12-17 02:03:40 PM

Earguy: When I was a kid, tipping was 10%.  Yes, it's gone up.

My dad clung to 10% for far too long, and only increased his tipping when me, a teenager, started leaving my own money on the table in addition to his.


Why would the percentage need to go up at all? Prices increase due to inflation, ergo the same percentage increase the tip amount. Are servers performing more duties than they were at 10%?
 
2013-12-17 02:17:04 PM
If someone needed a short way to understand what first world problems are, I'd link them to the nearest tipping thread on Fark or Reddit.
 
2013-12-17 02:23:35 PM

Devo: How about we raise the minimum wage tip earners get by 2 dollars? In an hour of waiting tables, does that work out to 15 cents per patron?



I would be willing to bet that a large portion of people who work at tip based restaurants would rather keep the options of tips rather than getting minimum wage and no tips. I mean if they wanted to make minimum wage they would work at McDonalds or walmart or something. Sure getting no tips sometimes sucks, but on the other hand the chance for the big score is always there. I mean why do you think that the servers at a chain sit-down restaurant are generally more attractive than the people who ask you if you would like fries with that at Burger King or McDonalds?
 
2013-12-17 02:27:18 PM
Unless my service was absolutely abysmal I'll leave 20%, usually rounded up to the next dollar.  Come on, people.
 
2013-12-17 02:36:27 PM
Solution:
Don't eat at places that place tip suggestions on the bill.
 
2013-12-17 02:46:12 PM

Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: Unless my service was absolutely abysmal I'll leave 20%, usually rounded up to the next dollar.  Come on, people.


Can we stop there, then (I'm old enough to remember 10%), or will that seem unspeakably rude in 15 years?
 
2013-12-17 03:14:48 PM

serpent_sky: uncoveror: When I delivered pizza, I would get about a buck whether the bill was $10, or a party order of $100. No one did percentages.

A dollar? Seriously?  I never, ever tip a delivery guy less than $5. Minimum.  They use their own cars more often than not (wear and tear, gas, etc), they work crappy hours, and they have to be on the road (which can be dangerous). If I am so lazy that I'm asking someone to literally get in a car and bring hot food to my house and quickly, at that, that's the absolute least I can tip them.

And after writing that, I feel really cheap. $5 is nothing, realistically.


They get paid for gas plus wear and tear. The amount waitress by pizza place but can go up to .50 per mile. Also, the amount is calculated on a per customer basis, so miles from store to customer, no taking into account if the driver is making one delivery or ten. Some drivers are really good at playing this system and take 3 or 4 deliveries that are all geographically close and end up making a nice profit on the individual mileage. If you want to help your driver out, split your large deliveries into multiple orders. They get reimbursed on the mileage twice.
 
2013-12-17 03:20:17 PM

Lusiphur: They get paid for gas plus wear and tear. The amount waitress by pizza place but can go up to .50 per mile. Also, the amount is calculated on a per customer basis, so miles from store to customer, no taking into account if the driver is making one delivery or ten. Some drivers are really good at playing this system and take 3 or 4 deliveries that are all geographically close and end up making a nice profit on the individual mileage. If you want to help your driver out, split your large deliveries into multiple orders. They get reimbursed on the mileage twice.


I did not know that - so they're at about the IRS rate, which is actually currently 56.5 cents per mile (that's how my company negotiates mileage reimbursement for independent contractors when mileage comes into play).  I always thought that it was a given that they just used their own cars. Now I feel less scummy about only tipping $5, but I'd never tip less than that because delivery guys are basically people paid to do you a HUGE favor when you're lazy.
 
2013-12-17 03:23:14 PM
I tip 15% regardless of how terrible the service is. I've tipped 300% on a meal before because of how good the server was.

But don't tell me how much I should be tipping. That's what I decide on my own.
 
2013-12-17 03:26:37 PM

Lawnchair: I've acquiesced to the 20% that the servers I know think is right.  We don't go out much, though, to places where that'd be expected.  I think we'd eat out more if we weren't feeling the gouge. It's nice visiting countries where it's not expected. And when they start demanding 25% (there are certainly people suggesting it), I'll eat out even less.


Restaurant prices keep going up, competition is flooding in with the step-above-fast-food options springing up everywhere, and now they're pushing toward 25% added on? 20% wasn't enough?
Small wonder the restaurant industry is suffering and chains like chipotle are thriving
 
2013-12-17 03:53:51 PM
Then there are places like Moe's, where they cut the top off a gas can, and print "Gas Money For The Crew". The farking place doesn't pay the help enough to drive to work? Shame on them!!
 
2013-12-17 03:54:03 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: INFLATION DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY!

BSABSVR: That's not inflation.


Yeah. That seems more like a symptom of increasing wage inequity, from the minimum base wage for tipped positions having been frozen since 1991 or so. (Though anchor effects suggest fixing that would not necessarily reverse the rise in tip percentage norms.)

As a secondary conjecture, I'd wonder if there's a larger fraction of the US population who have previously worked in such tipped positions than in previous generations. However, my subjective impression is that's not the case.
 
2013-12-17 03:58:01 PM

Carousel Beast: Why would the percentage need to go up at all? Prices increase due to inflation, ergo the same percentage increase the tip amount. Are servers performing more duties than they were at 10%?


A good third conjecture, but I think the main effect is from server wages not being increased to match inflation on other goods/services -- including restaurant food prices.
 
2013-12-17 03:59:35 PM
I don't give 'em the tip. I give 'em the shaft.

/shut yo mouth!
 
2013-12-17 04:01:21 PM

serpent_sky: Lusiphur: They get paid for gas plus wear and tear. The amount waitress by pizza place but can go up to .50 per mile. Also, the amount is calculated on a per customer basis, so miles from store to customer, no taking into account if the driver is making one delivery or ten. Some drivers are really good at playing this system and take 3 or 4 deliveries that are all geographically close and end up making a nice profit on the individual mileage. If you want to help your driver out, split your large deliveries into multiple orders. They get reimbursed on the mileage twice.

I did not know that - so they're at about the IRS rate, which is actually currently 56.5 cents per mile (that's how my company negotiates mileage reimbursement for independent contractors when mileage comes into play).  I always thought that it was a given that they just used their own cars. Now I feel less scummy about only tipping $5, but I'd never tip less than that because delivery guys are basically people paid to do you a HUGE favor when you're lazy.


I have worked for Pizza Hut, Dominos and a private pizza place...never heard of any that do gas reimbursements by the mile...it is a flat amount per delivery...regardless if it is 1 mile or 10 miles from the store.

again, not since the 80's have i heard of a store providing vehicles for delivery...supposedly the insurance was too high and since it was a company vehicle driven by someone paid minimum wage with low loyalty, they would rag the hell out of the vehicles.

$5 is a very nice tip, btw.  That helps offset stiffs.
 
2013-12-17 04:22:52 PM
Proper tipping is as follows: Get your friend to kneel down beside the cow. Then you push the cow over. Easy peasy.

mimg.ugo.com
 
2013-12-17 04:47:19 PM
Subby must be a cheap-ass, who pays a 15% tip?  Especially when waiters make $3/hr?

20% every time, unless there's major issues with service.  If there issues with the food, the manager hears about it.
 
2013-12-17 05:07:17 PM

TyrantII: Subby must be a cheap-ass, who pays a 15% tip?  Especially when waiters make $3/hr?

20% every time, unless there's major issues with service.  If there issues with the food, the manager hears about it.


Are you as awesome in person as you are on the inter web?
 
2013-12-17 05:10:04 PM
3% tops up to a dollar
 
2013-12-17 05:34:55 PM
20% is my starting point...it's easy - 2 bucks on every ten, 1 on every five. I round down for mediocre service. I'll go 25% easy if the service was over the top awesome. I feel a really good waitstaff adds a nice element to a meal out.
 
2013-12-17 05:47:23 PM
How hard is it to calculate 15% in your head, anyway?  Shift the decimal point one spot to the left and add half of that.
 
2013-12-17 06:05:37 PM
I usally tip 20%.  Unless I disagree with their skincolor, or lifestyle choice.  Then I just leave a comment in the tip line.  I also pay only in cash.  No shaming for me!
 
2013-12-17 06:30:54 PM
I tip 20-25% and then go back. I have a couple of resturaunts I go to regularly and order from the same pizza joint. Costs a bit more, but I get free drinks, free food, good service and I can't remember the last non snowy day my pizza took more then about 20 minutes.

Folks remember that shiat. Between the good service and the what I can only hope is a reduction of the amount of spit in my food, I figure I come out ahead.
 
2013-12-17 07:06:19 PM

Robo Beat: How hard is it to calculate 15% in your head, anyway? Shift the decimal point one spot to the left and add half of that.


That's a lot of math, right there. I was told there would be an 18% reduction in math.
 
2013-12-17 07:34:04 PM
Had a this chat with a co-worker you used to a waitress. She was most offended when I said if the food was shiat I would tip very little. Her point was that is the kitchens fault not the wait staff. I just don;t care for me I come for the food and that is the most important thing at a restaurant.
 
2013-12-17 07:45:24 PM

abb3w: Carousel Beast: Why would the percentage need to go up at all? Prices increase due to inflation, ergo the same percentage increase the tip amount. Are servers performing more duties than they were at 10%?

A good third conjecture, but I think the main effect is from server wages not being increased to match inflation on other goods/services -- including restaurant food prices.


You're missing the point. If I tip $1 per $10 and the price from the restaurant double, so does the tip. The tipping is completely disconnected from the restaurant's paying wage and goes up only according to the price of the goods. In that sense, it's fairly unique. Very few employers' prices directly impact an employee's compensation.
 
2013-12-17 07:53:52 PM

Carousel Beast: Very few employers' prices directly impact an employee's compensation.


Actually, sales people are frequently paid in commission, so the higher the prices of the product, the more they can make.

In that sense, you could look at waitstaff as the sales arm of a restaurant.
 
2013-12-17 08:53:27 PM

stellarossa: Kuroshin: Percentages: How do they work?!

Meal costs have gone up.  15% of $15 is already more than 15% of $10.  50% more, in fact.  Excluding the patrons who stiff their server, tips have already increased.

That's ignoring the fact that you don't get to demand any tip at all.  Tips are compensation for performance.  The 10%-15%-20% tip bases are informal guidelines.  You don't get to dictate how much any given patron tips.  Some people are generous, others are stingy, and you don't get to review your own performance in their eyes.

That being said, I like to at least tip enough for the server to buy a beer, no matter how small the ticket.  Unless they suck, in which case they get $1 flat.  Bad servers get the "fark you" dollar.  Typical tip is 15% plus the change it takes to round-off the total.  Good service gets 20% plus change.

That being said, I'm sick of tipping.  I'd rather they build the wages into the cost of the meal and pay their damn employees properly.  This hew and cry over "but then food would be too expensive" is bullshiat, because unless you stiff your servers, the price is still the goddamn same overall.  The price of the meal does not change.

Pay your damn servers, and get rid of tipping (exception: when someone gives exceptional service and the patron would like to give them a little something extra).

Even the 'fark you' amount has inflated! Didn't people used to leave a penny to show dissatisfaction? If a server provides really crappy service, I don't tip them at all. Why would you provide anything for shiatty service when its discretionary?

/incorrect answer would be 'to show them you hadn't merely forgotten about the tip'.


serpent_sky: stellarossa: Even the 'fark you' amount has inflated! Didn't people used to leave a penny to show dissatisfaction? If a server provides really crappy service, I don't tip them at all. Why would you provide anything for shiatty service when its discretionary?

Where do you all go that you get such terrible service? I honestly can't think of any time in my life that I had an unpleasant experience in a restaurant due to the wait staff.  The one thing that can be said in favor of tipping, at least from a customer's perspective, is it's good incentive to provide good service.



I made it a point to pay with cash at Denny's once so I could leave the 18 cents change as a tip because the adjacent table with a different waitress was seated, ordered, ate, and left before we even got our drinks.  There is no way to say that I forgot to tip or I was being generous.  It sends a very clear message.
 
2013-12-17 09:42:42 PM
Jesus farking christ. Anyone with half a brain (that isn't also a self-righteous cheapskate) knows that one way or the other, you will tip. Abolish tipping, and your per-item cost is going to go up a lot more than the 10 cents some goober upthread suggested. It will likely (and I'm just spitballin here) go up somewhere between 15 and 20 percent. (Why does that number sound familiar?) The trouble is the fat skinflints with bottomless guts will always flock to the cheapest trough - and good riddance, I say.  If you can't afford to tip, you shouldn't be eating out or ordering your Irish carbombs ya farkin' yokels.
 
2013-12-17 10:17:32 PM
I'm a 15%er with very rare exceptions. Lower if it's a huge tab. Don't care if it's an upscale place--takes no more work to bring me a 30 dollar steak than a $4 hamburger. Spare me the 'extra service' argument. The waitress slinging hash at the diner is as attendant to my needs/wants as the waitress/waiter at the fancy-ass place.
 
2013-12-17 10:51:15 PM
We need to make waitstaff just be subject to the regular minimum wage... also, we need to raise the regular minimum wage... at this point, given the rest of the costs of getting to work and all, its ridiculous to work for any less than 10 an hour.
 
2013-12-17 11:02:24 PM
Assuming the service is good enough, I leave about 20% for two reasons: (1) The math is easy; and (2) It helps make up for all the dickheads out there who always seem to find a reason to leave a lousy tip, or no tip at all. When I waited tables long, long ago, my tips typically averaged about 15% because the more generous people helped pick up the slack for the cheapskates. They all got exactly the same level of service because of course I never had any idea what kind of tip I would receive*, so it was pretty amazing how much variance there was.

*Unless they ordered iced tea or prime rib. For some reason, people who consume those two things are hands down the cheapest people on the planet. No kidding. Every single person on the waitstaff noticed the same thing.
 
2013-12-18 01:32:50 AM
Here's a tip: Get a better job.
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-12-18 01:46:54 AM

SpaceBison: Here's a tip: Get a better job.
[4.bp.blogspot.com image 510x287]


You should mention that before you order.  I dare you.
 
2013-12-18 02:52:14 AM
America: Stop farking being jealous of poor people.

Seriously.

Yes I know there are some waiters cleaning up. That isn't the point.

My job collected a christmas gift for our janitors. They got 700 bucks (husband and wife duo). A coworker turned to me and said 'why are they getting a better xmas than me'?

I mean goddamn. This was a voluntary and anonymous donation, and he still took it and ran it into a rant about how great poor people have it. This is a group earning six figures with pensions. AND GOT MUTTERS OF SUPPORT!

Some of these are vocal about being "christians" and got upset at the charity of others.

Look, you want to be a tightwad at a restaurant, be my farking guest. But you have no place to complain if the rest of society calls you cheap as a result. It is one thing to whine about welfare, obamacare, whatever that you are forced into. But tipping, gifts, etc are still well within the free market (even if it is an added gratuity - don't fark the waiter, just don't go out to eat), so stfu.

"Omg I was at lunch and the bill had WORDS on it suggesting I tip x%. I am so upset I will pay the waiter less because I am so jealous of his awesome job that oddly enough most restaurants always seem to be hiring for... I think I will complain about those folks"

JFC, to those saying shiat like that I hope you seriously diaf for your greed.

It is a job most people want out of, and one we look down on when people past college age still do. Give them a farking break.

/rant off
 
2013-12-18 03:01:16 AM

The Dog Ate My Homework: *Unless they ordered iced tea or prime rib. For some reason, people who consume those two things are hands down the cheapest people on the planet. No kidding. Every single person on the waitstaff noticed the same thing.


Then there's the lemon and water folks who get upset if you charge them for the lemon they're making their table side lemonade with.  But I'm just drinking water!! No you're not, shut up you miserable, disgusting human being.
 
2013-12-18 07:56:28 AM
Now that tips are taxed, I tip less so the servers don't have to pay so much taxes.

/just doing my part
 
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