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(The Atlantic)   Let's say this Twinkie represents the number of lies the NSA has told us about tracking the location of our cell phones. Based on this article... that's a hell of a big Twinkie   (theatlantic.com) divider line 18
    More: Fail, NSA, Americans, cell phones, Deputy Attorney General, MetroPCS Communications Inc., Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, Justice Department  
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7671 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Dec 2013 at 5:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-15 05:59:03 PM  
4 votes:

aerojockey: Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.

We already knew the cell phone networks have to know your phone's location in order to communicate it, this is a technical fact.  We already knew that the government can quite easily subpoena this information.

So now the only difference is that my location is the government's own database instead of Verizon's, and not significantly more accessible that it would have been.  Whoopteedee.

Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know.


To be specific, we already knew what the Government was capable of. Snowden confirmed it was actually being done. Its the difference between circumstantial and concrete evidence.
2013-12-15 05:45:43 PM  
3 votes:

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.


I don't see that as a response from an apologist, but as from people who were derided as paranoid and conspiracy theorists not 2 years ago.
2013-12-15 07:03:07 PM  
2 votes:

aerojockey: Gaddiel: To be specific, we already knew what the Government was capable of. Snowden confirmed it was actually being done. Its the difference between circumstantial and concrete evidence.

No, it was publicly known that the government was able, and often did, subpoena records from cell phones before we ever even heard of Snowden (and I think police can get cell phone locations in emergency situations without a court order).

We knew the cell phone companies kept these records around, we knew government was able to access them easily. The government was openly spying on us, and we knew it, not circumstantially but directly and openly, before we ever heard of Snowden.


There's a huge distinction between the government having access to this data via subpoena and the government archiving and data mining it without one. Nobody ever doubted that the government had the technical capability to do such a thing, the question was whether they would flout the constitution and do so.
2013-12-15 06:37:41 PM  
2 votes:
Really, I'm having trouble mustering any concern over this, given that any fool with a teaspoon of gray matter could have--and did--see this coming three decades ago. Did you think that when cops were tracking murderers and kiddy diddlers by tracing their cellphone pings off of transmission towers that somehow did didn't affect YOU? Because I saw them doing that shiat on CourtTV in the mid-90s. Did you think that when police began locating stupid thieves who posted pics of their hauls on Facebook and YouTube that nobody else was keeping track of it? Corporations have been monitoring social media since at least the late 90's, when Disney used to catch shoplifters by looking for large garage sales selling "Lots of Disney stuff CHEEP!!"

Everyone freaking out about it now--you're twice idiots for first of all not thinking this would happen and second for somehow making a distinction between the data collection done by the NSA and the data collection done by Google and Target. It's all equally bad and equally subject to abuse. And just because the corporations aren't going to arrest you doesn't mean anything--they're also not subject to any laws, even after the fact.

If you're worried about loss of your 4th Amd. rights, you should be; but all this nonsense about "The NSA lied! Obama/Bush/Clinton etc. lied!" is pure whargarble. It is what it is, and the only way to cure it is to get yourself off the radar and minimize your signature. Don't expect the government to stop what they're doing because it inconveniences YOU.
2013-12-15 06:05:21 PM  
2 votes:

aerojockey: Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know.


The bit about getting cellphones to report locations even while powered off was kind of novel. Also, specific types of encryption the government has broken is a bit of an improvement over "well, we'd be pretty dumb to assume that the government isn't actively trying to break encryption". He's told us a lot of things we didn't know, even if you were already in the "The government is recording all my phone calls!" camp.

Mind you, the conspiracy nuts that were believing these things with no evidence whatsoever are still nuts. They just happened to be, in some cases, correct.
2013-12-15 07:49:50 PM  
1 votes:
i970.photobucket.com

51 posts in and I'm the first with a picture of the Twinkie from the scene in question.
2013-12-15 07:35:14 PM  
1 votes:

tetsoushima: BafflerMeal: tetsoushima: This doesn't mean all conspiracy theories are true, btw.

Nor does it mean the converse.

How could anyone imply or infer that "no conspiracy theories are true" given the context of this conversation?


They will try.  They always do.
2013-12-15 06:45:39 PM  
1 votes:

tetsoushima: This doesn't mean all conspiracy theories are true, btw.


Nor does it mean the converse.
2013-12-15 06:42:10 PM  
1 votes:
This doesn't mean all conspiracy theories are true, btw.
2013-12-15 06:36:11 PM  
1 votes:

Delta1212: Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.

Less "Snowden didn't tell us anything new" in this case and more "didn't Snowden tell us they were doing this quite a while ago?"

I swear I heard all this stuff about incidental overseas tracking of Americans already.



Not what this is about.
2013-12-15 06:18:59 PM  
1 votes:
The NSA collects data so it can be used to combat terror. Film at 11.
2013-12-15 06:17:57 PM  
1 votes:
They're lying... but it's for our own good. Thank them and go about your business citizen. Also, while you're moving along, can you pick up that aluminum can and toss it in the trash?
2013-12-15 06:15:35 PM  
1 votes:
A friend and I killed a twinkie one time. Crushed it to death, then buried it in an unmarked grave in eastern Colorado. We were high on peyote at the time.
2013-12-15 06:00:01 PM  
1 votes:

Yakk: Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.

They are still better then the "I believe what the CIA tells me" camp.


Anyone who belives anything the CIA says should try reading a book or two.

CIA is nothing more then international terrorists. Dont worry though, they have lots of domestic operations to.


/just watched some show about them. Still pissed off about it
2013-12-15 05:58:58 PM  
1 votes:
img.fark.net
2013-12-15 05:55:29 PM  
1 votes:

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.


We already knew the cell phone networks have to know your phone's location in order to communicate it, this is a technical fact.  We already knew that the government can quite easily subpoena this information.

So now the only difference is that my location is the government's own database instead of Verizon's, and not significantly more accessible that it would have been.  Whoopteedee.

Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know.
2013-12-15 05:48:55 PM  
1 votes:
I phone the NSA whenever I lose my car keys.

They always know right where they are and it's easier than me having to look around for them.
2013-12-15 05:11:20 PM  
1 votes:
I'll just wait for the "Snowden didn't tell us anything we didn't already know!" apologists.
 
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