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(Network World)   Not only has Windows 8 sold at half the speed of Windows 7 over the same time period, Windows 8 sales are trailing off while Windows 7 sales continue to grow   (networkworld.com) divider line 53
    More: Fail, Windows, web application  
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1891 clicks; posted to Geek » on 13 Dec 2013 at 9:16 AM (32 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-13 06:18:32 AM
9 votes:
And anyone who didn't waste their time learning how to forget people are people in a post-grad marketing course could tell Balmer WHY Windows 8 is failing.

1. Nobody likes change.
That's why cars have had roughly the same dashboard for nearly a century. The great Gatsby could drive a Lexus no problem. Meanwhile, what with all the power steering and antilock breaks and stuff, you could really have a fly by wire car with a cockpit in the rear of the vehicle using a video game controller and cameras in place of mirrors and it would still work just fine, maybe even better. But you'll never see that, outside of concept cars anyway, because laws were passed to make everything stay the same as long as possible.

2. One size fits all is really one size fits none.
You don't want to drive screws with a hammer, even if the claw fits in the groove. A leatherman can do many things and fits on your belt, but no one chooses the leatherman over the dedicated tool when they have access to the whole toolbox. Making your toolbox INTO a giant leatherman gets everything exactly wrong. Their tablet OS should NOT have been integrated into their PC OS on the user end. Under the hood? GO CRAZY with compatibility. Make every program work on tablets and the PC by using the same OS. Fine. But keep it secret with two different GUI philosophies.

3. People are combative.
Doctors, teachers, salesmen, and police understand this. If you say jump, the average person will sit down and stay glued to their chair just be belligerent; even if what you're telling them to do is something they'd want to do if they were given a chance and no commands. By forcing you to give up the start button, they've killed the OS even if 99% would, if given the chance, turn the start button off themselves and never miss it. It's like how dysfunctional families might have huge fights with each other, but will join together into a seamless whole against any outsiders.

4. People buy the sizzle, not the sausage.
It doesn't matter what kind of product you've got if you're projecting a horrible image. Windows 8 was just marketed wrong. It might be really good under the hood. Using it might be wonderful for me. I'll never know because they touted it in exactly the wrong ways. I am not alone, as these stats are showing. Many, many people are not digging in to try it. Just like Vista. Apple, meanwhile, just has to change the color of their damned product and it's lines around the block. And their products have always sucked as bad or worse than 8 in user interface. The difference? Image. Apple tells you your free so well you forget they are damned dirty liars right up until AFTER you buy their crap on a two years contract again.


tl;dr METRO
2013-12-13 09:28:22 AM
6 votes:
I've warmed up to Windows 8. I think it's pretty damn good.

I think the mistake that Microsoft made is because they themselves are surrounded by smart, tech-savvy people, they assumed their customers were also smart, tech-savvy people, instead of the drooling moronic luddites that they so obviously are.
2013-12-13 10:26:18 AM
4 votes:
doglover:
1. Nobody likes NEEDLESS change.

Agreed on all your points, however I feel the added word is necessary.

That's why people get upset when Facebook changes, or YouTube changes to put titles UNDER the videos (for some f'n reason). And we get the same round of "hilarious" jokes about how no one is forcing you to use the product. That's not the point. Change for the sake of change is the driving force in tech right now. Look at the absolute convoluted clustermess of Gmail. They change things every week. And all it does is shuffle things around. "oh now all your 'apps' are under this button of dots!!'. Great, so the menu on the top of the screen was cumbersome before?

"oh now instead of a desktop, you get all these tiles"
"can I still use multi-wind-"
"heh heh, no, no you cannot"

Change for the sake of change. Needless. It all boils down to that.
2013-12-13 09:40:36 AM
4 votes:
I haven't read the thread, but are the normal posters here to tell how you can do everything you need to do in Windows 8 just by memorizing the names of all of your programs, learning a bunch of keyboard shortcuts, and then installing a bunch of extra software and spending a few hours configuring the system to not be like Windows 8 anymore?

Have those same people insulted our intelligence, and told us that we just don't want to "learn and grow" as a person because we use Windows 7?
2013-12-13 07:28:03 AM
4 votes:
I just can't get it through my head to use an OS that reminds me so much of the Leapfrog learning tablet my kids had about 6 or 7 years ago.

i44.tinypic.com
2013-12-13 06:04:16 PM
3 votes:
It's not just about Metro, they stripped out Aero also and left that flat pastel shiat in its place.

Damn Windows 8, you ugly!
2013-12-13 09:55:08 AM
3 votes:

vpb: slayer199: Of course this is anecdotal, but likely a typical experience.

A couple weeks ago I ordered a new gaming laptop (Gigabyte P27) for my son who is serving aboard the USS George Washington.  The laptop came with Windows 8 (not even 8.1).  I figured I'd poke around with Windows 8 and see how it was and save myself time from reloading the OS.  It was VERY slow in comparison to Windows 7.  I ended up reloading the OS to Windows 7.

It is faster for me.  On three machines.  It sounds like you have some sort of driver problem.


I've only tested across two machines (a high-end desktop gaming rig and a 7-year-old Dell office laptop) but in both cases Win8 ran slightly faster than Win7.  Not sufficient reason alone to make the move but was noticeable enough to mildly surprise me.

There is some good stuff under the hood but the Metro interface hides most of it under a crusty layer of annoyances.  Win9 will ease up on the bad, keep (and improve upon) the good, and will be more beloved that 7/XP ever were, just wait and see.
2013-12-13 09:36:55 AM
3 votes:

baconbeard: I've warmed up to Windows 8. I think it's pretty damn good.

I think the mistake that Microsoft made is because they themselves are surrounded by smart, tech-savvy people, they assumed their customers were also smart, tech-savvy people, instead of the drooling moronic luddites that they so obviously are.


Oh, and here's the perfect example of the kind of person who white knights Windows 8: a smug, self-satisfied asshole who somehow thinks that toughing his way through a badly-designed UI makes him superior to other people.
2013-12-13 09:22:02 AM
3 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: Take away the option to run 7 and most people will go with 8 by default, and realize that it's pretty much the same darn thing as 7 other than the start menu vs start screen from a usability perspective.


Know how I know you don't use 8? Because you say stupid shiat like the above. The farking charms crap, tiled desktop, and not a host of other shiat make me loathe and despise 8. If I wanted farking charms I'd would have bought a Mac.

I've tried, I've tried really hard to use 8, to make 8 a productive workstation, but I can't get used to it. I've been using 8 for almost a year now and I just can't get around the frustration of the changes. It is too many and there is too little benefit to them.
2013-12-13 08:00:22 AM
3 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: doglover:

1. Nobody likes change.


That's what is pretty much boils down to, plus a lot of people thinking that Windows 8 is all metro all the time due to all of the people biatching about it.

MS halted retail sales of Windows 7 in October, and the cutoff for OEMs to ship with it is set for the end of next year, though I think MS would be smart to move that date up.

MacOS or Linux are both much larger changes than moving from 7 to 8, and most people aren't going to be willing to pay the price for Apple hardware to run OSX anyway.

Take away the option to run 7 and most people will go with 8 by default, and realize that it's pretty much the same darn thing as 7 other than the start menu vs start screen from a usability perspective.


this is a crock of shiat.
2013-12-13 07:53:54 PM
2 votes:
If you don't like this:

files.conceptcarz.com

Better than this:

www.allfordmustangs.com

YOU HATE CHANGE!
2013-12-13 10:30:47 AM
2 votes:

baconbeard: I think the mistake that Microsoft made is because they themselves are surrounded by smart, tech-savvy people, they assumed their customers were also smart, tech-savvy people, instead of the drooling moronic luddites that they so obviously are.


This is the opposite of true. They assumed their customers are morons who can't handle more than one application at a time with big, giant colored buttons, when their customers really prefer using the desktop.
2013-12-13 09:48:27 AM
2 votes:

skeevy420: I'm getting a kick out of all the Windows 8 hate seeing as I'm a user who literally quit Windows (for Linux) because I thought XP really sucked compared to Win2kPro.  A week ago I installed my first copy of Windows in YEARS and instantly thought Metro was a crappier Gnome3 with tiles.....if someone like myself (anti-Microsoft, pro-Linux) can manage and deal with 8 then anyone can.

To all the "I have to install something for my system to be usable" folks -- I don't care what OS/Processor/Tablet/PC/Phone/whatever you have -- Can you honestly say that Stock ANYTHING is perfect?  First thing I do on a Linux install?  Remove the apps I don't like and add in the ones I do.  A Windows Install?  Media Player Classic, archive manager (zip, rar 7z), pdf reader, etc.  Android Phone?  All I know is I restore a crap ton of apps with Titanium when I update my rom.

At the end of the day the real question is "Do I like or dislike a tiled interface?".  If the answer is no then you'll have to install Classic Shell or something like that.  Big farking deal.

/Anyone else get a good chuckle when ya hear the "Honestly, I wanna see you be free" in the Microsoft ads?


See, that's the thing: Nobody's saying you can't use Win 8 if you try hard enough.  That's just what the fanboys (yes, MS has fanboys now, I'm as shocked as you are) tell themselves to justify their smug sense of superiority.  People are just saying the interface is badly-designed shiat that makes everything more complicated, because it is.
2013-12-13 09:44:37 AM
2 votes:
Windows 8 is fine.

It's just METRO that is the dumbest, most counter-intuitive UI in computing history.  Punch cards are easier to use and get in your way less stupidly.

Since various mods gave Win8 a better UI within like minutes of release, the fact that the OS is failing because of the UI that Microsoft intentionally selected just makes this a terrible marketing failure.  You don't take your completely legit, improved new product and show it to people wrapped in a used diaper full of AIDS, man, that's the opposite of good advertising.

// Above is for an actual computer with input peripherals and so on.  If you have a straight tablet I'm sure Metro's no more pants-on-head than any other tablet-OS interface, they're all pretty shiat at this point.
2013-12-13 09:23:14 AM
2 votes:

bsharitt: I don't know, I think Windows 7 would be pretty crappy on my tablet. I'll stick with Windows 8.


Why would you run a windows tablet when android and IOS exist?
kab
2013-12-14 12:46:41 PM
1 votes:

ex0du5: You run all of your OSes without any other programs installed. You're a purist. If the OS needs you to install a program, it clearly is insufficient.


There's a very clear difference between installing a program that carries out a task that the OS doesn't natively handle, and installing a program to make your OS not behave or display like a digital short bus.
2013-12-14 01:40:28 AM
1 votes:

Close2TheEdge: Windows 8.1 with Start8 on my desktop PC - Runs like a dream
Windows 8.1 native on my Surface Pro - Works great and makes a tablet actually a functional business device
Windows 8.1 native on my Dell Venue Pro 8 - Works great and is a nice tablet for "fun" stuff like Kindle, games, Netflix, etc.

Don't get what all the complaints are about.


Facepalm.......

Why aren't you running Win 8.1 native if it's such an awesome, issue-free OS?
2013-12-13 10:33:32 PM
1 votes:
Anyone figure that the slow growth also has to do with the fact that windows 8 still doesn't have a reliable crack for it?
2013-12-13 05:05:07 PM
1 votes:

Linux_Yes: i'm just being cheeky because when i see a thread that mentions another problem with windows, it amuses me that there is little mention of Linux in the thread.


That's because it's not a thread about Linux.

It's obvious by your Login that your personal identity is tied in with your choice of OS.
Perhaps tied a little too tightly. (The fact that you have a neckbeard is assumed).
Please note that my name is not Windows Fan.

What I like most about Windows is that all the latest games and apps run on it.
Hell, I can run 20 year old software in the latest version of Windows.
2013-12-13 04:04:51 PM
1 votes:
The quantities of hate, idiocy, and intentional misinformation demonstrated in this thread are truly baffling.

The operating system runs faster and is more stable than its predecessors. It is easy to use. People who claim otherwise have never used it, are lying, or are so stupid I wouldn't trust them to scrub a toilet.
2013-12-13 03:22:26 PM
1 votes:
Not drinking this?

img.timeinc.net
YOU HATE CHANGE.
2013-12-13 02:59:45 PM
1 votes:
Your preferred OS is WRONG!
2013-12-13 02:20:25 PM
1 votes:

degenerate-afro: jjwars1: Meh. I still prefer Windows 3.1.

Going from 3.1 to Windows 8 is an almost seamless transition.  Do you use Microsoft BOB overtop of 3.1 and AOL 3.0?  If so, you probably won't know what everyone is complaining about.
[betanews.com image 600x442]


toastytech.com
2013-12-13 12:52:39 PM
1 votes:

The Larch: I haven't read the thread, but are the normal posters here to tell how you can do everything you need to do in Windows 8 just by memorizing the names of all of your programs, learning a bunch of keyboard shortcuts, and then installing a bunch of extra software and spending a few hours configuring the system to not be like Windows 8 anymore?

Have those same people insulted our intelligence, and told us that we just don't want to "learn and grow" as a person because we use Windows 7?


Until now, I thought psychics were BS.
2013-12-13 12:50:24 PM
1 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: doglover:

1. Nobody likes change.


That's what is pretty much boils down to, plus a lot of people thinking that Windows 8 is all metro all the time due to all of the people biatching about it.

MS halted retail sales of Windows 7 in October, and the cutoff for OEMs to ship with it is set for the end of next year, though I think MS would be smart to move that date up.

MacOS or Linux are both much larger changes than moving from 7 to 8, and most people aren't going to be willing to pay the price for Apple hardware to run OSX anyway.

Take away the option to run 7 and most people will go with 8 by default, and realize that it's pretty much the same darn thing as 7 other than the start menu vs start screen from a usability perspective.


Almost everyone i know does the same thing as me which is buy every 2nd version of windows,  98, skip ME, xp, skip vista, win 7, skip 8.

It's not really about being afraid of change, it's more like they put out a good os every second version so why upgrade every time.  Unfortunately with this reasoning I've missed the great os's that  were ME, Vista and 8.....i know horrible right.
2013-12-13 12:26:30 PM
1 votes:
Windows 8 is the superior operating system by far, but I could probably cite a couple hundred similar examples where people prefer inferior products because people, in general, are idiots.
2013-12-13 12:23:59 PM
1 votes:

jjwars1: Meh. I still prefer Windows 3.1.


Going from 3.1 to Windows 8 is an almost seamless transition.  Do you use Microsoft BOB overtop of 3.1 and AOL 3.0?  If so, you probably won't know what everyone is complaining about.
betanews.com
2013-12-13 12:10:18 PM
1 votes:
I don't see much of a difference.  It is easier to organize and see all the stuff in the start menu in the new start screen, it just looks childish with the colors and stuff... and the Start menu got irritating on machines with many applications.  In reality, they've just traded problems: visual clutter over difficulty in finding the right menu item.

I don't use many of the Metro apps, though, because I don't have a touchscreen.  What little I've poked around in them, they seem highly functional and useful.  But I've got a desktop and the Internet so it's not as useful.

I don't hate it, but I really don't like it either.  It's Win 7 with some annoyances, but the major change to my workflow is 1) avoiding corners with the mouse when I need to get it out of the way and 2) use Win and Win + D instead of the Start Menu and the button on the right of the bottom bar.  That's it.

I much prefer the Linux window managers.  They have all the features of the others, but are more configurable, and have MULTIPLE DESKTOPS.

/how is this not a built-in feature in Windows yet?
//*nix (including OS X) has had them for a while now (some longer than others...)
2013-12-13 11:59:47 AM
1 votes:

choder: MrSteve007: Also interesting, and not pointed out in the article:

- in a single month, XP usage plummeted by nearly 20% (from 31% to 25% of the market)

I wonder how much of that is from businesses ditching XP for 7 now that it is nearly out of support.


A quick and dirty graph, using the last 6 months of net applications data on XP, WIn 7 and Win 8 (combined 8 & 8.1)
scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net

A much more accurate headline should be:
"Windows 7 usage surges past 50% for the first time, users abandon 12-year old XP in mass, Windows 8 continues steady growth"

But I guess saying Windows 8 is a complete failure is a much more click-bait worthy headline.
2013-12-13 11:36:29 AM
1 votes:

ex0du5: This is why there are people who feel they need to come in to these threads and point out Win8 is hated by those who hate change. Because those who hate change project their inability to adapt into some belief about objective measures.

The truth is that the tiled start screen is actually faster to use than the old menu. For mice and keyboards, not just tablets. This is due to Fitt's Law, the same place all modern UI advancements have come. The same law Google uses in it's UIs. Google recently switched to tiled selection on it's web pages for apps too.

It's easy to memorize a few catch phrases to explain your dislike (it's good for tablets but not for mice and keyboards, every other OS sucks, etc.), but it's much harder to recognize when you are doing that only for psychological justification so you don't have to admit to yourself how hard a time you have with change.


I'm not even 40 yet and I'm already a curmudgeon. (I plan to go yell at some clouds later today.) And Windows 8 is forcing me to take an honest look at why I dislike it so much. I don't even have it, my machine still runs 7 and I'm not going to upgrade until I get a new one. But yet, I still dislike it because I resent being forced to change when what I've been doing now has worked for me. I resent it far more than I probably should, but there you have it. I don't even care that it's better "under the hood" and that the tiles interface might actually be more efficient for me. I am angry at the notion of being forced to change from my current status quo, no matter how much better the new version might be.

And this is where MS screwed up. They live in their own little word of computer techs and engineers, and they forget that not everyone outside their bubble is like them. To them, the change is needed and better, and they think that it's so self-evident that they don't need to bother to explain it to us peons and can't understand why we don't see it as mana from heaven. They lost touch with human nature, because we like our patterns and we instantly resist when people tell us "What you've been doing all this time is wrong, so you need to change and do things my way." It doesn't matter that your way will improve our lives by 1000% we aren't doing it you smug, out of touch, elitist. You can have my start button when you pry it from my cold, dead hands.

You can't just foist a huge change on consumers, you have to entice them with it. You have to make them want to change, and that means they needed to sell us on the concept of using this new system, whether it is tiles or the start menu. I'm much more likely to respond to someone telling me "want to see something cool?" and showing me the new interface, then being told "This is the new system, deal with it."

If sold the right way, I'll love Win8. It's a good system underneath, but I just can't get over the way it's being presented. It bothers me and gets my blood boiling. Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to put an onion on my belt and annoy younger people with a long, rambling story.
2013-12-13 11:09:36 AM
1 votes:

The Larch: I haven't read the thread, but are the normal posters here to tell how you can do everything you need to do in Windows 8 just by memorizing the names of all of your programs, learning a bunch of keyboard shortcuts, and then installing a bunch of extra software and spending a few hours configuring the system to not be like Windows 8 anymore?

Have those same people insulted our intelligence, and told us that we just don't want to "learn and grow" as a person because we use Windows 7?


well don't start doing anything different now.  Windows users don't like change.
2013-12-13 10:54:44 AM
1 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: That's what is pretty much boils down to, plus a lot of people thinking that Windows 8 is all metro all the time due to all of the people biatching about it.

MS halted retail sales of Windows 7 in October, and the cutoff for OEMs to ship with it is set for the end of next year, though I think MS would be smart to move that date up.


Or perhaps they should realize their new OS is shiat and go back to Windows 7.

/Windows 8 defenders perplex me - the market has spoken - they hate it
2013-12-13 10:22:34 AM
1 votes:

HeartBurnKid: taurusowner: The Larch: taurusowner: Interesting. The Asus Vivotab Smart weights 580g. The iPad 2 weighs between 601g and 613g depending on if you have 3G.

Tell me again which is heavy?

The IPad Air is 20% lighter than the Asus Vivotab,. has four times the screen resolution, has 50% longer battery life, and you don't need to add a heavy external keyboard to do anything useful with it.

And unfortunately it's also running iOS which makes all of those positive things meaningless. I DGAF if it's lighter and has a better battery if I'm using Playskool's "My First Tablet OS". If I can't run full MS Office 2010, full Adobe Acrobat, full Chrome browser, and full GIMP, I don't farking want it no matter how light it is.

You're running Acrobat and GIMP on an Atom?  Man, that must be slow as shiat.


Not as fast as a desktop, but slow is still better than impossible.
2013-12-13 10:21:32 AM
1 votes:
When I hear people complain that "the Start Button is gone" I have to chuckle. The "Start Button" is still there in Windows 8. But Microsoft, in its inscrutable wisdom, changed it from a visible, clickable button to an INvisible, clickable "hot-corner." When I show that to people the first words out of their mouth are invariably "that's stupid." And I have yet for anyone to explain how this is an "improvement."

Windows 8 is not a terrible OS (that distinction will be held by Windows ME for years to come). But MS totally screwed the pooch in 8's design and marketing.
2013-12-13 10:12:52 AM
1 votes:

taurusowner: Interesting. The Asus Vivotab Smart weights 580g. The iPad 2 weighs between 601g and 613g depending on if you have 3G.

Tell me again which is heavy?


The IPad Air is 20% lighter than the Asus Vivotab,. has four times the screen resolution, has 50% longer battery life, and you don't need to add a heavy external keyboard to do anything useful with it.
2013-12-13 10:11:23 AM
1 votes:

Jim_Callahan: Windows 8 is fine.

It's just METRO that is the dumbest, most counter-intuitive UI in computing history.  Punch cards are easier to use and get in your way less stupidly.


Yeah, pretty much how I feel about Metro. I upgraded my laptop to Windows 8.1 and the attempt to FORCE me to use the "cloud" was, well, annoying.

I admit I haven't looked around much, because I installed Classic Shell, but is there a fairly simple way to arrange the "All Apps" Metro screen to my liking? I might actually be able to get along with Metro if I could drag, drop, and rename groups on the All Apps screen.

I would just have to get used to scrolling up and down to move sideways. Grrrrr.

/You could rearrange punch cards if the compiler didn't like the order of your instruction set for some reason (had that experience in my first FORTRAN class, and even the help desk squad and the professor all said, "huh.")
//Get off my chad-covered lawn
2013-12-13 09:55:56 AM
1 votes:
The most amazing thing about Windows 8, in my mind, is how absolutely, insanely terrible Metro is under the hood.  I'm not talking about the API or technical underpinnings, which are fine.  I'm talking about Metro as a long term product strategy for Microsoft.

Suppose you've written a Metro app for Windows 8, and now you want to recompile it for Windows RT.  Can you do that?  No, you have to rewrite big chunks of it for Windows RT.

OK, now you have apps for Windows 8 and Windows RT.  Can you recompile it for Windows Phone 8?   Again, no... you have to rewrite big chunks of it again for Windows Phone.

Can you recompile the same application for the XBox one?   No, not yet. Microsoft has hinted at a possible migration path, but don't hold your breath.

Can you migrate your application  "to the cloud" and run in like an Office365 application?   No, not even close.  It's not even on the Microsoft radar.  Microsoft used to have a product called Silverlight that was part of the roadmap to allow developers to do something like that, but Microsoft killed it, and they haven't even hinted at a replacement.

The Windows 8 Metro subsystem is absolutely terrible technology, not because the UI is objectively terrible (it is), or because the underlying technology is bad (it isn't), but because there's no possible roadmap to the future that doesn't absolutely destroy entire divisions at Microsoft.
2013-12-13 09:53:14 AM
1 votes:
I will say that the only thing I don't like about Windows 8 is that I can't run Internet Explorer 7 or 8. Sounds odd, I know. But a lot of military and government websites were coded by monkeys and won't run on anything other than IE 7 or 8. Not Chrome, not Firefox, not IE 9 or above. On Win7 I kept IE 8 around just for certain government sites. Can't do that in Windows 8.

But other than that, Windows 8 is fantastic. And I think the live tiles on the Start Screen are awesome. I'm very used to using widgets on Android phones that give me certain information at a glace. Weather, News, Time in different time zones, prices of gold and silver, pending Google Tasks and calender events, etc. I like looking at my phone and having widgets display all those things in real time. I tried using the desktop gadgets in Windows 7 to do the same thing but that was beyond hokey. Win8 Start Menu lets me do all that and access common programs just like phone shortcuts. But I can still do everything I could on 7 like running full versions on programs, Steam, etc. Best of both worlds.
2013-12-13 09:51:52 AM
1 votes:

baconbeard: I think the mistake that Microsoft made is because they themselves are surrounded by smart, tech-savvy people, they assumed their customers were also smart, tech-savvy people, instead of the drooling moronic luddites that they so obviously are.


Dat troll tho.

How about asking smart tech-savvy people about Windows 2012 and the shiat house that is in a Datacenter environment.
2013-12-13 09:51:21 AM
1 votes:

doglover: Apple, meanwhile, just has to change the color of their damned product and it's lines around the block. And their products have always sucked as bad or worse than 8 in user interface.


Agree when it comes to iPhone, I much prefer my Android interface, but I vastly prefer the OS X interface to Windows. But you do have to get used to it because it is different.

Otherwise, totally agree with your post.
2013-12-13 09:48:27 AM
1 votes:

baconbeard: I've warmed up to Windows 8. I think it's pretty damn good.

I think the mistake that Microsoft made is because they themselves are surrounded by smart, tech-savvy people, they assumed their customers were also smart, tech-savvy people, instead of the drooling moronic luddites that they so obviously are.


LOL, are you lording over us your elite hacker skilz at being able to navigate a Windows OS? Are you a wizard?
2013-12-13 09:41:12 AM
1 votes:
It's almost as if everyone has a windows computer and doesn't really need to upgrade.
2013-12-13 09:36:38 AM
1 votes:
8 really looks like it's more suited to a tablet than a desk or laptop. 7 does everything I need.
2013-12-13 09:35:21 AM
1 votes:
Forget all that other crap it's because they didn't give people the choice on how the interface works.  No the start screen is not a replacement for the start menu.  Not everyone suddenly switched to tablets.

Windows 8 should have been called "Windows Touch®©™" and only come with tablets.

/The upgrades to compatibility should have been a free download for Win7.
2013-12-13 09:34:45 AM
1 votes:
I'm waiting for Win9... I have no compelling reasons to upgrade to Win8. Currently running Win7.
2013-12-13 09:33:50 AM
1 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: doglover:

1. Nobody likes change.


That's what is pretty much boils down to, plus a lot of people thinking that Windows 8 is all metro all the time due to all of the people biatching about it.

MS halted retail sales of Windows 7 in October, and the cutoff for OEMs to ship with it is set for the end of next year, though I think MS would be smart to move that date up.

MacOS or Linux are both much larger changes than moving from 7 to 8, and most people aren't going to be willing to pay the price for Apple hardware to run OSX anyway.

Take away the option to run 7 and most people will go with 8 by default, and realize that it's pretty much the same darn thing as 7 other than the start menu vs start screen from a usability perspective.


Speaking as somebody who's dual-booted Windows and Ubuntu... bull.  I spent a good couple of years all but Windows free in the Vista days, so I'm clearly not afraid of change, as long as the change is worthwhile.  Windows 8 is not worthwhile. And as long as you don't have a big software investment in Windows (which I don't; besides games, I mostly use FOSS on my home system), frankly, the transition to a modern Linux distro is easier than the transition to 8.

I think we're going to see something similar to what we saw in the Vista days; companies will sell 8, but try to upsell people to Pro since Pro comes with downgrade rights.  Either that, or they'll start bundling one of the Start Menu replacement apps with their systems (hell, Lenovo already is).
2013-12-13 09:32:45 AM
1 votes:
Heh. The start button issue is hilarious because I remember all the biatching when that thing was introduced with Windows 95... "what the fark, Micro$oft - I gotta hit 'Start' to shut it down?!?"

Heh, good times.
2013-12-13 09:31:02 AM
1 votes:

Slaves2Darkness: TuteTibiImperes: Take away the option to run 7 and most people will go with 8 by default, and realize that it's pretty much the same darn thing as 7 other than the start menu vs start screen from a usability perspective.

Know how I know you don't use 8? Because you say stupid shiat like the above. The farking charms crap, tiled desktop, and not a host of other shiat make me loathe and despise 8. If I wanted farking charms I'd would have bought a Mac.

I've tried, I've tried really hard to use 8, to make 8 a productive workstation, but I can't get used to it. I've been using 8 for almost a year now and I just can't get around the frustration of the changes. It is too many and there is too little benefit to them.


I am about to rebuild my workstation and it's stories like these that make me hold off on OS upgrade. It seems like WIn 8 was for MS not the user, and like every bad OS version I am waiting for the good one that follows it to fix it.
2013-12-13 09:26:56 AM
1 votes:
Microsoft can only release 1 decent product every 5-7 years and Windows 7 is it.  All the rest suck.
2013-12-13 09:26:43 AM
1 votes:
8 isn't just Metro. There is a lot of underlying changes that make thing incompatible and developers are slow to adopt. 8.1 also made it bloaty.. The skydrive integration was annoying at best and you had to use backasswards methods to turn it off and remove it. I used 8 since release and stuck with 8.1 until last week... I finally just went back to 7... Was so sick of running into an issue with an app of game just to find out "that's an 8 problem"
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-12-13 09:10:07 AM
1 votes:

slayer199: Of course this is anecdotal, but likely a typical experience.

A couple weeks ago I ordered a new gaming laptop (Gigabyte P27) for my son who is serving aboard the USS George Washington.  The laptop came with Windows 8 (not even 8.1).  I figured I'd poke around with Windows 8 and see how it was and save myself time from reloading the OS.  It was VERY slow in comparison to Windows 7.  I ended up reloading the OS to Windows 7.


It is faster for me.  On three machines.  It sounds like you have some sort of driver problem.

I will say that you should stay away from 8 if you use WMC.
2013-12-13 09:06:48 AM
1 votes:
Of course this is anecdotal, but likely a typical experience.

A couple weeks ago I ordered a new gaming laptop (Gigabyte P27) for my son who is serving aboard the USS George Washington.  The laptop came with Windows 8 (not even 8.1).  I figured I'd poke around with Windows 8 and see how it was and save myself time from reloading the OS.  It was VERY slow in comparison to Windows 7.  I ended up reloading the OS to Windows 7.

The issue is not just a lack of familiarity that users may face, it responds slowly in comparison to Windows 7 (even on a very good gaming laptop).  As for me, I won't upgrade until Windows 9.
2013-12-13 05:37:18 AM
1 votes:
Yep, I am still snapping up cheapo Win 7 discs
 
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