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(Slashdot)   In a heroic bid to save you from having to do actual work on your office PC, developers already trying to build emulators for the Xbox One and PS4   (slashdot.org) divider line 40
    More: Interesting, Xbox, graphics processing units, IBM Powerpc, Super Nintendo, pirate game, roots, PlayStation Portable, Super Mario World  
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1333 clicks; posted to Geek » on 09 Dec 2013 at 11:53 AM (19 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



40 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-12-09 12:01:32 PM
Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?
 
2013-12-09 12:06:15 PM
Would an office PC have the power to do this?
 
2013-12-09 12:06:32 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?


I think it's to show off our infinite master-race power.
 
2013-12-09 12:07:17 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?


How else are you going to play Metal Gear Ground Zeroes?
 
2013-12-09 12:08:37 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?


Because.
 
2013-12-09 12:18:33 PM

gnosis301: Would an office PC have the power to do this?


Depends what you do for a living, the majority of engineers and a lot of IS/IT people probably can.
 
2013-12-09 12:26:08 PM

farbekrieg: Depends what you do for a living, the majority of engineers and a lot of IS/IT people probably can.


Only if they routinely need to work on the Gibson...

willbradley.name

/ I use the same models of PC as regulars dildos ins company, just withs eyes5s insteads of eyes3s
 
2013-12-09 12:28:18 PM
This isn't a news story.  It's one Javascript jockey sharing his opinion that yeah, maybe emulation will be possible at some point.
 
2013-12-09 12:37:25 PM
If I wanted the same experience as a console I'd disable two video cards, under clock the third, underclock my CPU, disable most of the ram, disable most of the HDDs, disable two of the monitors, run something heavily restrictive like OSX and point an always on webcam at my crotch.

But seriously, both of the new consoles are getting pretty similar to real PC hardware, emulation should be pretty approachable.  Bonus if they can pull it off before Rockstar gets around to releasing a proper version of GTA5.
 
2013-12-09 12:56:52 PM

BumpInTheNight: But seriously, both of the new consoles are getting pretty similar to real PC hardware, emulation should be pretty approachable.


The Xbox 1 (which was the first Xbox; not to be confused with the Xbox One which is the third Xbox) was pretty close to stock x86 PC hardware, too, but a dozen years later the best freely available emulator (excluding the backwards compatibility system in the Xbox 360, which was the 360th Xbox) is maybe only 10% functional.  Good if your idea of fun is "look at the Halo 1 title screen".
 
2013-12-09 01:03:27 PM
I, for one, would love to see what the emulated version of a game I can just buy for PC plays like, which is most of them.
 
2013-12-09 01:04:16 PM

poot_rootbeer: BumpInTheNight: But seriously, both of the new consoles are getting pretty similar to real PC hardware, emulation should be pretty approachable.

The Xbox 1 (which was the first Xbox; not to be confused with the Xbox One which is the third Xbox) was pretty close to stock x86 PC hardware, too, but a dozen years later the best freely available emulator (excluding the backwards compatibility system in the Xbox 360, which was the 360th Xbox) is maybe only 10% functional.  Good if your idea of fun is "look at the Halo 1 title screen".


Yeah. I used to be heavy into emulation, and it takes a ton on horsepower to emulate newer systems. I recently got back into it, and I finally have a PC that can run ps2 games correctly (only tested with FFX). Dolphin, which is supposedly fairly awesome, still requires more than my machine can give. However, considering that the new generation of consoles lean more towards stock PC hardware, maybe emulators will become similar to what WINE is. I have no idea, I can't write code.
 
2013-12-09 01:06:46 PM
Have they got PS3 emulation working yet?
 
2013-12-09 01:09:10 PM
And it still won't save the Xbox One.
 
2013-12-09 01:11:14 PM

jchuffyman: Yeah. I used to be heavy into emulation, and it takes a ton on horsepower to emulate newer systems. I recently got back into it, and I finally have a PC that can run ps2 games correctly (only tested with FFX). Dolphin, which is supposedly fairly awesome, still requires more than my machine can give. However, considering that the new generation of consoles lean more towards stock PC hardware, maybe emulators will become similar to what WINE is. I have no idea, I can't write code.


My assumption is it'll be like Wine -- incorporating enough of the consoles' API to be ran native on PC's. I wouldn't be too surprised if the XBox 1 ran a modified Win8 and only needed a few executables and dlls ripped from it to be PC compatible. PS4 -- I dunno, hopefully the same assumption as Xbox 1 only with Linux.

Only time and good programmers will tell.
 
2013-12-09 01:24:34 PM

CPennypacker: I, for one, would love to see what the emulated version of a game I can just buy for PC plays like, which is most of them.

Most

of them?  Hmmmm
 
2013-12-09 01:36:55 PM

animal900: CPennypacker: I, for one, would love to see what the emulated version of a game I can just buy for PC plays like, which is most of them.

Most of them?  Hmmmm


Well, most of the ones I would care about playing anyway
 
2013-12-09 02:51:14 PM

skeevy420: My assumption is it'll be like Wine -- incorporating enough of the consoles' API to be ran native on PC's. I wouldn't be too surprised if the XBox 1 ran a modified Win8 and only needed a few executables and dlls ripped from it to be PC compatible. PS4 -- I dunno, hopefully the same assumption as Xbox 1 only with Linux.


Yeah. The PS4 and Xbox One are both essentially standard x86 hardware (the PS4 uses DDR5, which isn't standard on desktop machines... yet). Since there aren't going to be many major architectural differences between the hardware platforms, the biggest issue will be replicating system calls with some native equivalent. That's substantially different from the completely different mode of operation that the PS3 uses due to its unique CPU.
Of course it wouldn't shock me to learn that the hardware does everything inside some ridiculous, encrypted virtual machine just to prevent this sort of hacking.

Anyway by the time this stuff gets to be fully functional, the kids will have moved on to the Xbox Seven and Playstation 10 because most people are perfectly happy to buy a new game box every five or six years even when that means completely abandoning the old one.
 
2013-12-09 03:06:12 PM

BumpInTheNight: If I wanted the same experience as a console I'd disable two video cards, under clock the third, underclock my CPU, disable most of the ram, disable most of the HDDs, disable two of the monitors, run something heavily restrictive like OSX and point an always on webcam at my crotch.


If I wanted the same experience as a PC I'd saw my 60 inch television in half, mount it on my desk, sit in a desk chair hunched over the controller, and every 2 years I'd drop a grand into a trash can and set it on fire for the hell of it.
 
2013-12-09 03:25:41 PM

Khellendros: BumpInTheNight: If I wanted the same experience as a console I'd disable two video cards, under clock the third, underclock my CPU, disable most of the ram, disable most of the HDDs, disable two of the monitors, run something heavily restrictive like OSX and point an always on webcam at my crotch.

If I wanted the same experience as a PC I'd saw my 60 inch television in half, mount it on my desk, sit in a desk chair hunched over the controller, and every 2 years I'd drop a grand into a trash can and set it on fire for the hell of it.


Haha I game from my PC on my 60" TV in my living room, kicked back in my recliner.  And I use a 360 controller when that is better than mouse/keyboard.  Which it rarely is.  I spent all of 300 on this computer. Looks amazing in 1080p.
 
2013-12-09 03:31:56 PM

Khellendros: BumpInTheNight: If I wanted the same experience as a console I'd disable two video cards, under clock the third, underclock my CPU, disable most of the ram, disable most of the HDDs, disable two of the monitors, run something heavily restrictive like OSX and point an always on webcam at my crotch.

If I wanted the same experience as a PC I'd saw my 60 inch television in half, mount it on my desk, sit in a desk chair hunched over the controller, and every 2 years I'd drop a grand into a trash can and set it on fire for the hell of it.


I do have a 360 and a PS3 though.  I don't discriminate.  Just games on my PC look like 20 times better.
 
2013-12-09 03:35:58 PM

Khellendros: BumpInTheNight: If I wanted the same experience as a console I'd disable two video cards, under clock the third, underclock my CPU, disable most of the ram, disable most of the HDDs, disable two of the monitors, run something heavily restrictive like OSX and point an always on webcam at my crotch.

If I wanted the same experience as a PC I'd saw my 60 inch television in half, mount it on my desk, sit in a desk chair hunched over the controller, and every 2 years I'd drop a grand into a trash can and set it on fire for the hell of it.


Huh.  My PC uses HDMI to plug into my TV and I use the same wireless controller as you (assuming you have an XBox or PS3) when I want to play on the TV.  I guess I could try your method, but it seems kind of wasteful.
 
2013-12-09 03:42:04 PM

NicktheSmoker: Haha I game from my PC on my 60" TV in my living room, kicked back in my recliner. And I use a 360 controller when that is better than mouse/keyboard. Which it rarely is. I spent all of 300 on this computer. Looks amazing in 1080p.


flak attack: Huh. My PC uses HDMI to plug into my TV and I use the same wireless controller as you (assuming you have an XBox or PS3) when I want to play on the TV. I guess I could try your method, but it seems kind of wasteful.


You guys seemed to miss the part where I was oversimplifying the position of the other person in mockery to show them how stupid the statement was.  Recalibrate your sarcasm meters appropriately to avoid this in the future.

Or bask in your master race's glow.  That works too.
 
2013-12-09 03:42:24 PM
the funny thing about x86 consoles is that there will be pc ports that still blow for no reason
 
2013-12-09 04:16:38 PM

Khellendros: NicktheSmoker: Haha I game from my PC on my 60" TV in my living room, kicked back in my recliner. And I use a 360 controller when that is better than mouse/keyboard. Which it rarely is. I spent all of 300 on this computer. Looks amazing in 1080p.

flak attack: Huh. My PC uses HDMI to plug into my TV and I use the same wireless controller as you (assuming you have an XBox or PS3) when I want to play on the TV. I guess I could try your method, but it seems kind of wasteful.

You guys seemed to miss the part where I was oversimplifying the position of the other person in mockery to show them how stupid the statement was.  Recalibrate your sarcasm meters appropriately to avoid this in the future.

Or bask in your master race's glow.  That works too.


I'll take basking in the master race's glow over a console's limited capabilities any day, or your jealous red hue, that's doing me just fine right now too.
 
2013-12-09 05:15:07 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?


because console specific only releases are bullshiat.
 
2013-12-09 06:32:14 PM

gnosis301: Would an office PC have the power to do this?


My understanding is that $2,000 gaming monster rigs would not have the power to do this. I'm not sure of the details of why, but emulation is not very efficient. Computers have only recently caught up to emulating the PS/2 without slowdowns.
 
2013-12-09 06:55:18 PM

LiberalWeenie: gnosis301: Would an office PC have the power to do this?

My understanding is that $2,000 gaming monster rigs would not have the power to do this. I'm not sure of the details of why, but emulation is not very efficient. Computers have only recently caught up to emulating the PS/2 without slowdowns.


As pointed out earlier, that's b/c they needed a lot of hardware emulation. PS4 is the first Playstation that's already x86, so you don't have to pretend to be a completely different kind of chip. There are still lots of sneaky ways to prevent software emulation, though.
 
2013-12-09 07:28:43 PM

LiberalWeenie: I'm not sure of the details of why, but emulation is not very efficient.


Check this out. It's been inefficient in the past because, as Trocadero points out, the computer has to basically create a software version of the entire machine in-memory in order to work properly. Since the SNES [and most game systems until now] used very different architectures this was an expensive calculation. However, the PS4 and XBox One are both x86 machines as far as I'm aware, which is the same architecture you run on your desktop, so emulation should, in theory, be easier in for those consoles.
 
2013-12-09 10:04:18 PM

stonelotus: drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?

because console specific only releases are bullshiat.


Exactly. I'm hoping the PS4 one works well so I can still play Everybody Has Gone To The Rapture when it's finally released. That said, a big 'fark you' to thechineseroom for selling out and abandoning your fan base.
 
2013-12-09 11:02:56 PM

stonelotus: drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?

because console specific only releases are bullshiat.


You sound poor and/or entitled.
 
2013-12-10 02:36:52 AM

Vash's Apprentice: stonelotus: drjekel_mrhyde: Why PC gamers want to emulate us poor console second class a-holes?

because console specific only releases are bullshiat.

You sound poor and/or entitled.


yeah, you got me.  most poor and/or entitled people don't see the value in dropping a few hundred bucks to be able to play one or two titles other than what they can play just fine on their PCs.  we're silly that way.

we're also not big on having to buy entire albums just to get the one single song we like, much less having to buy a completely separate sound system, independent of the one we already own, just to play that one song.
 
2013-12-10 07:11:39 AM
More games are released for my PC every month than I will play in a lifetime. If all those games are so unsatisfactory that I really need to play a game that is exclusive to some console, I'll buy the goddamn console.
Sheesh.
 
2013-12-10 09:19:22 AM

jso2897: More games are released for my PC every month than I will play in a lifetime. If all those games are so unsatisfactory that I really need to play a game that is exclusive to some console, I'll buy the goddamn console.
Sheesh


Over the years I've had a Jaguar, x2 NES, x2 SNES, x??? various Game Boys, a Game Gear, x2 Genesis, SMS, N64, x3 PSX, x2 PS2, x4 Xbox, x4 Xbox 360, a PS3.......tack on at least 10 games per console, controllers, accessories, etc and that's a lot of $$$ over the years. We'd like to play the games we still have, and paid good money for, without having a wall of consoles; a decent PC and emulators give us that option for a lot of our older games.

Plus some of us are just tired of buying consoles, like myself. This generation I decided to just go PC only. If I'm gonna drop hundreds of $$$ I'd rather it go towards a PC than to a console that'll eventually be obsolete and replaced -- Obsolete PC's can be used as home file servers, gentoo compile boxes, media servers, etc; old consoles primarily get turned into a dust collector (for the most part, I know, mod chips and all, but not all consoles have them).

/all the 360's Red Ringed on me, the last one I returned the 3rd, got home with the 4th, installed Oblivion to the HDD, went to bed, woke up, and it red ringed
//Xboxes were a mixed bad of bad power supplies and backups to my chipped one
///All other multiple consoles were so we didn't have to share.
 
2013-12-10 09:21:59 AM
In regards to Dolphin... it'd just be cheaper to go buy a used Wii (a whole $50-70 at Gamestop last I checked for a "premium" refurb) and a nice external hard drive ($53 at Sams Club for a 1 TB USB3), mod the Wii, and run all my games from HD instead of buy all the bare metal hardware I'd need to get decent performance out of Dolphin on a PC.
 
2013-12-10 09:23:24 AM
//Xboxes were a mixed bag of bad......dammit
 
2013-12-10 09:35:43 AM

farbekrieg: gnosis301: Would an office PC have the power to do this?

Depends what you do for a living, the majority of engineers and a lot of IS/IT people probably can.


Nah. Why would they have high end gaming GPUs?
 
2013-12-10 11:00:44 AM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: farbekrieg: gnosis301: Would an office PC have the power to do this?

Depends what you do for a living, the majority of engineers and a lot of IS/IT people probably can.

Nah. Why would they have high end gaming GPUs?


Photoshop claims to use GPUs to help process things, autocad definitely does, CUDA is a good excuse too.  Sure its usually Quadros and PantsOnFires but then you say "Hey boss, you could spend $4K on one of those...or $300 on a gaming version that's got almost the same stats".

Win.
 
2013-12-10 11:12:54 AM

skeevy420: jso2897: More games are released for my PC every month than I will play in a lifetime. If all those games are so unsatisfactory that I really need to play a game that is exclusive to some console, I'll buy the goddamn console.
Sheesh

Over the years I've had a Jaguar, x2 NES, x2 SNES, x??? various Game Boys, a Game Gear, x2 Genesis, SMS, N64, x3 PSX, x2 PS2, x4 Xbox, x4 Xbox 360, a PS3.......tack on at least 10 games per console, controllers, accessories, etc and that's a lot of $$$ over the years. We'd like to play the games we still have, and paid good money for, without having a wall of consoles; a decent PC and emulators give us that option for a lot of our older games.

Plus some of us are just tired of buying consoles, like myself. This generation I decided to just go PC only. If I'm gonna drop hundreds of $$$ I'd rather it go towards a PC than to a console that'll eventually be obsolete and replaced -- Obsolete PC's can be used as home file servers, gentoo compile boxes, media servers, etc; old consoles primarily get turned into a dust collector (for the most part, I know, mod chips and all, but not all consoles have them).

/all the 360's Red Ringed on me, the last one I returned the 3rd, got home with the 4th, installed Oblivion to the HDD, went to bed, woke up, and it red ringed
//Xboxes were a mixed bad of bad power supplies and backups to my chipped one
///All other multiple consoles were so we didn't have to share.


I'm not the guy to argue the point with. The only console I ever owned was a PSX, and I didn't play with it much. I like gaming on the PC.
It satisfies me. But I'm just saying that if it didn't, I'd go buy the actual thing I craved.
 
2013-12-10 11:54:25 AM

jso2897: I'm not the guy to argue the point with. The only console I ever owned was a PSX, and I didn't play with it much. I like gaming on the PC.
It satisfies me. But I'm just saying that if it didn't, I'd go buy the actual thing I craved.


PSX is my favorite console ever. I can't tell you how many hours 14yo me lost with FFVII, Vagrant Story, Parasite Eve, Resident Evil, and much, much more.

I understand that, but eventually you get tired of replacing the hardware to play the old games --> plus in 10-20 years how many legacy consoles will have working models available for purchase? Emulators and roms are the only real long term solution unless they start making X-in-1 disk consoles like the do with the 3-in-1 NES, SNES, Genesis consoles available in the game stores, which is doubtful at best........though it would be cool to have a Saturn, Dreamcast, PSX, PS2, GameCube all in 1 system.

Or, we could just use our PC's and run everything from Atari to SNES with 99.9% of the games running flawlessly and almost everything else up to the PS2 generation with varying results.

/I really don't see the PS3 or 360 getting emulators anytime soon, if ever -- at least not until +8 core desktops and current gen graphics cards are the norm
 
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