If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(NBC News)   "With Windows 8.1, Microsoft has resurrected the Start button ... by placing it in the 'Pet Sematary'"   (nbcnews.com) divider line 57
    More: Amusing, Start Button, Microsoft, Action Center, SkyDrive, screen resolution  
•       •       •

7398 clicks; posted to Geek » on 08 Dec 2013 at 6:45 PM (45 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2013-12-08 05:06:40 PM  
8 votes:
Also, may I add:

THEY'RE NOT F*CKING APPS, THEY ARE PROGRAMS, AND AN OS SHOULD NOT JUST BE A WALLED GARDEN APP-DELIVERY SYSTEM.

/rant over
2013-12-08 06:56:23 PM  
4 votes:
Right click on the start button. I don't know why they don't promote that more.
blog.laptopmag.com
2013-12-08 05:15:48 PM  
4 votes:

Cubansaltyballs: I just hated that it opened it in full-screen mode. I know this sounds crazy, but sometimes I like to have two PDFs open at the same time and view them side-by-side.

For me, I'd have to spend so much time tweaking and hammering away at Windows 8 to make it usable for me, it's just not worth my time for a handful of minor upgrades.

But, if you think Windows 8 is stupid, just try dealing with Server 2012. It's basically the same as Windows 8, because you know... no one uses the start button and everyone has touch screens on their servers.


Right? I fundamentally don't understand the idea of essentially forcing people to operate in a world without a taskbar. I mean, right now I have Steam, Spotify, iTunes, Word, Notepad, Task Manager, Calculator, Chrome, and two instances of Explorer open on my screen. I can see  exactly what's going on, and I can select each one of them with an incredibly small flick of the mouse.

With the Metro UI, if I'm in an App, I have no idea what other apps I have open unless I go and check for them! That's way more inefficient. It's like on my smartphone, which is inefficient because it's on a tiny screen and therefore can't use the same space.

Steve Ballmer is  nuts if he thought this was a good direction for Microsoft. Metro is a pretty decent tablet OS and they should be commended for it, honestly. It made it so that you can have tablets that essentially act as traditional computers, in a way that iOS never allows for. But Windows 8 is clearly  not designed for laptops or desktops, and it sure as hell isn't designed for work environments. Which is why it's such a bad business move, because Microsoft has  always been a company that tried to cater to the Enterprise market and business markets in general. And it's like suddenly they threw up their hands and said "you know what? That one thing that we kick Apple's ass in and that helps fund all out other shiat? No one wants that anymore! fark it! Tablets and touch is the wave of the future! THROW ALL THE MONEY AT IT!"
2013-12-08 04:55:45 PM  
4 votes:
Ugh.  I just got a new laptop from a Black Friday deal on NewEgg, and it came with 8.

I almost shot myself dealing with frustrations. It treats me like I am a child, and hides all deep functionality from me. I've been using Windows since 3.1, so by this time I'm a goddamn power user. But suddenly I feel like a complete idiot. I spent almost two minutes searching for the goddamn Windows Update. I had to go online to figure out where the hell the Control Panel was stored.

8.1 is a slight improvement, and now that I've set it to boot to Desktop and reinstalled the  actual start button, things have gone from teeth-grinding frustration to mere occasional annoyance. But then I find out that the default PDF reader is an "app" and shunts me over into the entirely different Metro closed-garden system, and I get annoyed all over again.
2013-12-08 08:53:45 PM  
3 votes:

Some Bass Playing Guy: I really don't get all the hate. All people need to do is install a start menu replacement that Win8 works exactly like Win7, except with a bunch of under the hood improvements.


All people need to do is install Windows 7.
2013-12-09 02:57:01 AM  
2 votes:
TuteTibiImperes:
First of all, it's not very different from 7 in the desktop mode.  For business use where they'll be rolling out dozens or hundreds of machines all with identically imaged hard drives with the necessary office software already installed and the desktop set up for their business needs, it won't be an issue.

That's not actually how large scale businesses' IT deployments work. It's how they should work, and it's how a lot of them claim they work, but the reality is, it's not how they work. Things like constant driver updates, security updates, hardware changes, multiple configurations, etc etc prevent them from using a single drive image which they deploy en masse. The image needs to be updated and reconfigured so often, you end up maintaining terabytes of images, all with marginally differing images, contents and quality. At the end of the day, a lot of places just reinstall for each new order and trust Group Policy to handle the wrinkles.

As far as security goes, improvements to Windows Defender, Secure Boot, Smart Screen, and future versions of IE that will only run on 8 and above will win the day.  Windows 8 also comes with more tools to allow IT departments to access and manage individual machines remotely.

The biggest enemy of Security is the learning curve of the end user. It's hard to keep your environment hardened when everyone in the accounting department keeps their passwords on a yellow sticky next to their keyboard.

What 8 does is completely throw the user's existing experience out the window, and users need to install third party apps like ClassicShell just to find their way around. As an IT Admin, you have the choice of allowing a potentially risky third party app without a world class security organization behind it, or disallowing it and watching the productivity of your business go into the toilet while your users try to re-learn the new system.

If you disallow the risky third party apps, you're guaranteed to see people sneaking their files onto older (sometimes unsecured) machines just to get back to an environment they can be productive in. They'll find other, riskier shortcuts, too - when their review is tied to productivity, and productivity is down because they can't find the programs they need, users have no problem throwing security out the window and getting back into a familiar environment. They might pull that old XP machine off the junkheap, or use a cloud emulator, put it on a home machine out of the reach of IT, or email docs to a Google account to use Open Office. Users find a way to get to what they need, and if your security is in their way, say goodbye to your security.

You can argue this all you want, but ignoring human nature is like ignoring gravity; doesn't do you much good. When execs start to figure out that 8 = less productivity and less security, they will opt for iPads using OpenOffice instead. You can already see it happening.

It's all a moot point anyway. Ballmer's successor will shiatcan Metro on desktop. Bank on it.
2013-12-08 11:54:25 PM  
2 votes:

The Larch: TuteTibiImperes: When you're working in the desktop space everything works almost exactly like it did in Windows 7.

Unless you accidentally start a Metro app.  Then you're all borked again.

You see, everyone loves the different input modes in VI.  It's probably the best part of any editor ever invented.  So Microsoft thought it would be totally awesome if the whole desktop worked that way.  Because reasons!

Seriously, multi-mode desktop is one of the most insanely stupid things I think I've ever seen in a user interface.  The fact that Microsoft released their flagship product with such a stupid feature is evidence that they they have fundamental structural problems as a company.  It would be like Ford releasing a car where sometimes you stop by pressing the brake pedal, and sometimes you stop by pressing a button on the dash.

Of course, if Ford did that, I don't think every single computer bulletin board in the entire world would be filled with people telling us that it's an insanely great feature, and if you're stupid if you don't like it.


How do you accidentally start a metro app when you're in the middle of working on the desktop?  I suppose it's possible you could double click a file that's associated with a metro app, but then you change the association for that file type and never have to worry about it again.  Metro doesn't lurk in the shadows waiting to jump out and take over the computer.  Even if you do launch a metro app you just drag it down to close it or mouse over to the bottom left of your screen to return to desktop mode and everything is just as you left it.
2013-12-08 11:24:23 PM  
2 votes:
Lot of Microsoft shills in here.

When I set up a Windows 8 computer for a client I
1. ask if they want Classic Shell. If the answer is no then
2. I uninstall EVERY Metro app and delete the Windows Store links, then
3. I repopulate that pi$$a$$ start screen with USEFUL items from the All Apps menu, then
4. I create buttons for shutdown, restart, and All Apps and populate the task bar AND start screen.

I am NOT letting my clients waste more than a second with any of that Metro crap. And they thank me by giving my business card to everyone they know.
2013-12-08 07:38:21 PM  
2 votes:

gingerjet: Babwa Wawa: Really?  A full blown server-class hypervisor built in, boot times under 10 seconds (on an 18 month old install), FAR improved multi-monitor support, and it sucks?

With an SSD - Windows 7 boots in 7 seconds.  Windows 8 in 12 seconds.  You aren't very good at this are you?


How often are modern computers rebooted anyway? Sleep and hibernate are very reliable on 7 if you don't have problematic hardware. Saving 4 seconds once a month when I reboot for Windows updates is not a big deal compared to the productivity loss of having to relearn the UI.

The good news is that the rumors are that Microsoft is back tracking and is going to kill Win RT and replace it with what will basically be the Windows Phone version of "Ice Cream Sandwich" that is tweaked to work on both tablets and phones, with Atom-based Windows tablets taking over the RT segment. Hopefully that means that somewhere along the line, a "Win 7" mode will be added for companies that want 8 but don't want to spend money retraining all their employees on the Start Screen. There's some nice things about the Start Screen, but for a lot of users it kills their productivity because of the learning curve. Also, having to juggle two very different UIs doing work just screws with people's productivity. Win 8 is basically two different OSes glued together and it doesn't commit to either one.
2013-12-08 06:31:11 PM  
2 votes:

Rincewind53: I'm seriously considering downgrading. Yes, it'll cost me some money, but honestly I don't think that's such a big deal. I'm going to give Windows 8 about a month until I get used to it, and then I'll decide. Right now my anger has turned down to just a low simmer, so I see positive things in the future.


Don't downgrade.  I run 8.1 on my desktop, 7 in my work virtual machine.  I spend the majority of my time in Win7.  8 is better in almost every sense.  I've not bothered with a start menu replacement - I just took a couple minutes to arrange it in a way that makes sense for me.  It got a lot better when I realized you can just start typing while in the start menu to bring up any damned program you please.

xanadian: 8 sucks for power users and admins; seems OK for the technologically-impaired.


Really?  A full blown server-class hypervisor built in, boot times under 10 seconds (on an 18 month old install), FAR improved multi-monitor support, and it sucks?
2013-12-08 05:27:55 PM  
2 votes:
Just got a new computer, it came with win 8. I was about to bite the bullet and pay to downgrade, but then someone in another thread mentioned Classic Shell. Restores you start menu, works on 8.1, and is completely free. It helps a whole hell of a lot. Give it a try before downgrading.
2013-12-08 05:11:13 PM  
2 votes:
I, too, am thankful that I have Win7.  We have some Win8 machines at work and I loathe them.
2013-12-08 05:09:12 PM  
2 votes:

Rincewind53: 8.1 is a slight improvement, and now that I've set it to boot to Desktop and reinstalled the actual start button, things have gone from teeth-grinding frustration to mere occasional annoyance. But then I find out that the default PDF reader is an "app" and shunts me over into the entirely different Metro closed-garden system, and I get annoyed all over again.


I just hated that it opened it in full-screen mode. I know this sounds crazy, but sometimes I like to have two PDFs open at the same time and view them side-by-side.

For me, I'd have to spend so much time tweaking and hammering away at Windows 8 to make it usable for me, it's just not worth my time for a handful of minor upgrades.

But, if you think Windows 8 is stupid, just try dealing with Server 2012. It's basically the same as Windows 8, because you know... no one uses the start button and everyone has touch screens on their servers.
2013-12-08 04:43:16 PM  
2 votes:
Sometimes, dead is better.
2013-12-08 04:18:52 PM  
2 votes:
img.photobucket.com
2013-12-09 08:12:54 PM  
1 votes:

uttertosh: umm.. if you simply open an explorer window


See, this is why I have no tolerance for you Windows 8 shills. You go on and on about how the only thing that's wrong with Windows 8 is that users don't want to learn it, then you get a perfect example of the problem thrown at you and suddenly it's "BUT IF YOU DO EXTRA STUFF TO AVOID THE ACTUAL WINDOWS 8 PART IT'S JUST AS GOOD AS WINDOWS 7!!!!!"

Right. That's the problem. Fark the extra steps. If I have to take extra steps every goddamn time I turn around to avoid some useless "Metro" nonsense then it's NOT just like Windows 7, now is it? Why the bloody hell wouldn't I just keep using Windows 7 if the best argument for 8 is that I can go out of my way to make it just as useful as 7 was by avoiding everything that makes it Windows 8?

Yes, there are a few things in Windows 8 I like. I like the improved file transfer modal, for example. But the few little bits here and there that don't suck are simply massively outweigh by the fact that Metro is a lumbering, obnoxious piece of shiat that constantly gets in the way when I want to do something productive. It's constantly popping in with some half-assed, gimped "app" version of a useful tool when the actual, useful tool is still there, it's just been moved aside and you have to go dig it out.

My computer is not a tablet, so there are no benefits to Metro on it. EVERYTHING Metro offers is a huge negative. That just seriously outweighs the small positives under the hood.
2013-12-09 02:15:14 PM  
1 votes:

SleepingEye: rewind2846: Two different devices with two different uses, require two different paradigms. The same OS and interface does not apply, and the microbrains at Microsoft failed to realize this. I don't need for the lines to "blur" any more than I want all my food to taste the same.

You do realize that the people at Microsoft HAVE realized this and as such, kept the DESKTOP lurking around?  You know, because it's the DESKTOP?  You just click the DESKTOP tile and you get the DESKTOP version back?

Yes, there are a few idiosyncrasies they have to iron out, but by-and-large, if you stay with desktop, you never really see the Metro UI and if you stay with Metro, you rarely see the desktop.



Windows 8.1: "If you like your start button, you can keep it"
2013-12-09 11:30:37 AM  
1 votes:
I swear some of you are like old people clinging to their VCRs when DVD was invented.

"But how do I rewind it? Now I can't use my rewinder!"
"The box are was bigger on the tapes! I liked that!"
"TOO MANY BUTTONS NOOOOO!"
"I CAN'T RECORD MY STORIES NOW!"
"Which way does this thing go in? I'M CONFUSED!"
"THERE IS NO CLOCK FLASHING 12:00 NOW! I MISS THAT!"
"Where's the record button?"
"THIS CHAPTER SKIP BUTTON SCARES ME AND IT'S UGLY!"
"I don't want this! I liked what I had!"
"This is a conspiracy! They're trying to make us buy new TVs!"
"But home video and computers are two different functions! WHY USE THE SAME FORMAT?"
"MAH REMOTE IS DIFFERENT. MAH BUTTONS ARE NOT LIKE BEFORE! THIS SUCKS!"
2013-12-09 10:29:37 AM  
1 votes:
It took me 2 hours to get used to 8 following years using 7. The frustrations occurring in this thread are a little hilarious. I'm not trying to be arrogant here, but the way I see it I need an image of jack sparrow that reads "The problem is not the problem, its the way you're acting about the problem".

For me, the metro/start area of Win 8 just feels like a combo app sandbox and a start menu, and you sometimes need a different program install to operate in either (definitely the case when Win8 was first released), but more and more programs operate in either the metro app sandbox or in classic windows form.

Other than that one major hiccup, Win 8 feels in every way like Win 7. I dont get what people are getting butthurt over except that theyre butthurt because something changed.
2013-12-09 10:16:35 AM  
1 votes:

jso2897: The good IT jobs don't go to the introverted neckbeards anymore.


I think the funniest part of your silly rant is that your entire lecture on people skills is predicated on your belief that a person you've never met meets your image of a stereotype that never really existed.

Very professional.
2013-12-09 09:00:08 AM  
1 votes:

Babwa Wawa: Similarly, Apple's suggestion that I carry a macbook, a tablet, and a phone in order to get a full range of computing functionality seems fairly antiquated to me.


They really are different things (for now). For one thing, if you buy an iPhone or iPad with cellular data you have to choose the carrier you're going to sign on to when you buy it. This is dumb and I doubt it's Apple pushing that situation, but we're stuck with it nonetheless. Now, would you like to have to choose the carrier you connect to when you buy a whole laptop? No one wants that, which is why the carriers offer dongles, cards, or battery operated Wifi repeaters. I'm not saying that's ideal, but what is Apple supposed to do?

The touch screen situation is slightly more complicated. Yes, they could put sensors in every screen, but do people really want that in a laptop? I've seen people trying to touch the screen, but only in confusion. I've never seen anyone enjoy it. Having a keyboard and trackpad at hand seems much simpler than keyboard+trackpad+touchscreen -- way simpler than "3/2 as simple" or however you want to metricize it -- I guess I could see myself arranging windows around but it's just weird to poke at the screen and it doesn't open any new functionalities. The OS has to be designed for it. Retrofitting OS X wouldn't work. It didn't even work for Windows 7, as everyone pointed out.

The design I might be able to persuade myself to use, for now, is the 13" laptop I have, but with the ability to grab the screen off for reading on the couch. But that's attractive because the screen looks so light and thin. It's about the area of two ipods, so assuming it weighs the same as two ipods (doubling the case+screen+battery seems like a good estimate) then that would be a three pound screen. Right now my whole laptop weighs three and a half pounds.

The other vector, of course, is to add a physical keyboard to the iPad. This probably makes much more sense as a product. I can see Apple releasing an iKeys -- so thin and light it only weighs as much as a stick of gum, etc marketing blabble -- but if they wanted to do this, why haven't they already? Surely they're not waiting on some kind of new technology. Patents on low power Bluetooth maybe. I don't know.

I would like to see the bendable OLED tech used to let me "crack the ipad in half" into a bent shape and use the bottom as a keyboard and trackpad. I don't know how far away that is, but if they could combine it with some kind of haptic feedback to help you feel the keys and create the illusion of key travel in the broken position only, that might work.
2013-12-09 08:56:45 AM  
1 votes:

jso2897: KRSESQ: Pokey.Clyde: KRSESQ: 99% of Windows users have the computer understanding of a child

And this right here shows you have no business working with other people.

Prove me wrong.

He didn't say you were "wrong" - he said you are unfit to work with other people, and you just proved that yourself.
Asperger's, ego, and emotional immaturity - the trifecta of IT drones everywhere.
And these people wonder why no one likes them, and why us marketing guys enjoy having them fired on a whim.


Spoken like a true marketing puke. Windows 8 has "marketing decision" written all over it. I have yet to see "marketing" make one good decision about end-user usability.
2013-12-09 07:42:07 AM  
1 votes:

Some Bass Playing Guy: I really don't get all the hate. All people need to do is install a start menu replacement that Win8 works exactly like Win7, except with a bunch of under the hood improvements.


I will bet that many corporate environments will balk at the idea of installing freeware on their computers because of security concerns.

I hate that MS moves things around or changes things for basically no good reason as I've better things to do than relearning what I already know how to do. Maybe the old way is clunky and not as efficient or elegant as possible but I know how to poke and prod it to do what I want. MS isn't making people more productive with their changes.
2013-12-09 07:26:38 AM  
1 votes:
I don't understand the hatred. I've been on windows since 3.1 and I haven't used the start menu for anything more than search since 7.  The start menu was a dinosaur that was long past its prime. Pin your most common programs to the task bar, use the search function. It's faster, easier, cleaner, and just plain better.
2013-12-09 04:06:36 AM  
1 votes:

syrynxx: Some Bass Playing Guy: I really don't get all the hate. All people need to do is install a start menu replacement that Win8 works exactly like Win7, except with a bunch of under the hood improvements.

Try playing a DVD. Microsoft took out the codec because they looked at some metrics that people use YouTube and Netflix a lot. So because you can watch Rebecca Black on YouTube, Microsoft assumes you've thrown out your entire DVD collection.

I seriously wonder if they did any market research or testing (that they listened to) outside of a Microsoft campus.


VLC. Done
2013-12-09 02:40:47 AM  
1 votes:
I just built a pc a couple days ago for my wife. I was apprehensive about purchasing Windows 8 because of all the negative flack it has received but then I remembered how whiny people are about the littlest things and a lot of the criticism I'm seeing stems from layout drama queens. Like OMG, they totally changed everything on me. So I dropped $100 to get a Windows 8 Pro OEM disc and upgraded the pc to 8.1. Having used Windows since 95 it was a little awkward to navigate at first but I'm growing quite fond of the start menu in windows 8 (I like how things can be arranged and I generally like to keep my desktop itself minimal). For those of you that want easier access to your control panel - open up the start menu -> click the down arrow -> move the side scroller all the way to the right and right click on Control panel -> pin to start menu. viola! Now you can just press the windows key and have your control panel button right there along with all the other things use like to readily use.

/I'm pleased with the OS
//I still believe Win ME takes the cake as the worst in the series. That is the most rage inducing piece of shiat OS I've ever been subjected to.
2013-12-09 02:36:18 AM  
1 votes:

KRSESQ: Pokey.Clyde: KRSESQ: 99% of Windows users have the computer understanding of a child

And this right here shows you have no business working with other people.

Prove me wrong.


He didn't say you were "wrong" - he said you are unfit to work with other people, and you just proved that yourself.
Asperger's, ego, and emotional immaturity - the trifecta of IT drones everywhere.
And these people wonder why no one likes them, and why us marketing guys enjoy having them fired on a whim.
2013-12-09 12:42:11 AM  
1 votes:
You can fix all of these problems very easily.

Format, install Windows 7.
2013-12-09 12:33:06 AM  
1 votes:

KRSESQ: 99% of Windows users have the computer understanding of a child


And this right here shows you have no business working with other people.
2013-12-09 12:28:46 AM  
1 votes:

Some Bass Playing Guy: I really don't get all the hate. All people need to do is install a start menu replacement that Win8 works exactly like Win7, except with a bunch of under the hood improvements.


Try playing a DVD. Microsoft took out the codec because they looked at some metrics that people use YouTube and Netflix a lot. So because you can watch Rebecca Black on YouTube, Microsoft assumes you've thrown out your entire DVD collection.

I seriously wonder if they did any market research or testing (that they listened to) outside of a Microsoft campus.
2013-12-09 12:21:16 AM  
1 votes:
www.resourcesforlife.com
2013-12-09 12:11:20 AM  
1 votes:
I don't get all the frustration. I mainly work from the Desktop/ The icon on the lower left corner is for the Start Page, and if I want another program, I just click it. There's no need to scroll over. You can just begin typing the application or function you want, and a list will come up. In a lot of ways, it's much faster and easier than hunting through the old Start Menu and its submenus. You can also drag and drop program you use a lot so that they are the first things you see on the start page.

Yes, there is a bit of a learning curve, but it only took me 45 minutes to get comfortable. And I still hate the ribbon.
2013-12-08 11:38:40 PM  
1 votes:

rewind2846: TuteTibiImperes: The desktop isn't gone or neutered in any way, and it isn't going away. The biggest difference is that you have a full screen program launcher instead of a cascading menu. It's really not that big of a deal.

It is when you have 4 explorer windows, photoshop, illustrator, 3ds Max, Creo viewer, AutoCad, explorer browser, firefox, Zune software, MS Outlook and InDesign open across two screens. Cascading windows are good, and seeing all of them at once is even better (I have a beefy rig at work - 32 GB of ram).
Having everything mashed together or having to guess where something is because only 4 of them can be seen at a time? No thanks.

As I said before, there's play, and then there's work. Colored boxes floating around and searching for things isn't for work. Windows 7 pro 64 bit, TYVM.


You seem to be confusing the limitations for metro apps and desktop apps.   When you're working in the desktop space everything works almost exactly like it did in Windows 7.  You can have all of those open across two screens, with cascading windows, no problem, no limitation to the number of open applications or open windows.

As far as the start screen goes - either take the time to organize it to put your commonly used applications on the first page so they're easy to find every time, or just pin them to the task bar and launch them that way (which basically makes it functionally identical to OSX, which no one seems to have a problem with).
2013-12-08 11:34:22 PM  
1 votes:

KRSESQ: Lot of Microsoft shills in here.

When I set up a Windows 8 computer for a client I
1. ask if they want Classic Shell. If the answer is no then
2. I uninstall EVERY Metro app and delete the Windows Store links, then
3. I repopulate that pi$$a$$ start screen with USEFUL items from the All Apps menu, then
4. I create buttons for shutdown, restart, and All Apps and populate the task bar AND start screen.

I am NOT letting my clients waste more than a second with any of that Metro crap. And they thank me by giving my business card to everyone they know.


Because treating them like children and gimping their computers is obviously superior to taking fifteen minutes to show them around how things work in Windows 8...

Granted, it wouldn't be a bad idea to associate desktop apps with any file types that might launch a metro app by default, but IIRC once I installed Opera, Acrobat Reader, and Libre Office no other common file types wanted to load in metro anymore.

I don't understand the reasoning for removing all of the metro apps or the windows store.  I haven't really used the windows store, and while I played around with some of the metro apps after I first installed Windows 8, the only one I actually use is the Music app because that's the only way to interface with Xbox Music on a Windows 8 Phone, and it's not a bad setup.  At least letting people play around in metro to see what it's about and get comfortable with drag to close and switching between screens is a good idea in case they accidentally launch a metro app or want to use one in the future.

Why would you need buttons for shutdown and restart on the task bar and start screen?  Just CTRL-ALT-DELETE and click on the power button looking thingie.

I swear, people are spending 10x the amount of effort trying to work around Windows 8 than they would just embracing it and learning how to use it as designed.
2013-12-08 11:31:21 PM  
1 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: The desktop isn't gone or neutered in any way, and it isn't going away. The biggest difference is that you have a full screen program launcher instead of a cascading menu. It's really not that big of a deal.


It is when you have 4 explorer windows, photoshop, illustrator, 3ds Max, Creo viewer, AutoCad, explorer browser, firefox, Zune software, MS Outlook and InDesign open across two screens. Cascading windows are good, and seeing all of them at once is even better (I have a beefy rig at work - 32 GB of ram).
Having everything mashed together or having to guess where something is because only 4 of them can be seen at a time? No thanks.

As I said before, there's play, and then there's work. Colored boxes floating around and searching for things isn't for work. Windows 7 pro 64 bit, TYVM.
2013-12-08 11:26:15 PM  
1 votes:

ZeroCorpse: Repo Man: ZeroCorpse: I really don't get all the people who are confounded by the shut down procedure on Win 8... Unless your computer is ten years old, ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS PRESS THE POWER BUTTON. Windows and PC hardware have been smart enough to interpret the quick press of the power button as a "shut down safely" command for many years now. You don't need to dig through software menus to shut down. Press the farking button, dumbass.

As has been said before, many computer towers (both in homes and offices) are tucked away where reaching the power button is inconvenient.


Then right click on 8.1 Start and select shut down.


Jeez.




Don't tell me. I'm sitting tight with Win 7 Pro. I've had to set up a couple of laptops with Win 8, and I found it to be annoying and ugly. My primary motive for moving from XP to Win7 a few years ago was that I wanted a 64 bit OS to get full use of the memory I had installed. I skipped Vista, and it looks to me as though I'll be skipping 8.
2013-12-08 11:15:21 PM  
1 votes:

ZeroCorpse: I really don't get all the people who are confounded by the shut down procedure on Win 8... Unless your computer is ten years old, ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS PRESS THE POWER BUTTON. Windows and PC hardware have been smart enough to interpret the quick press of the power button as a "shut down safely" command for many years now. You don't need to dig through software menus to shut down. Press the farking button, dumbass.




As has been said before, many computer towers (both in homes and offices) are tucked away where reaching the power button is inconvenient.
2013-12-08 09:23:23 PM  
1 votes:
kroonermanblack:
Are there any linux distros that aren't shiat, have drivers, and are as easy to use as Windows XP or 7 were?  I don't really enjoy using computers, so I don't want to deal with...anything.  I just want an OS that runs stable, relatively quick, and lets me browse and/or watch netflix (Note: this laptop is strictly for living room 'looking shiat up' use, with the rare travel use).

OSX.  And I say this as a guy that makes his living supporting windows systems.  Some people want to tweak their car to do better in the quarter mile- some just want to get in, fire it up, and go get bread from the store, with nothing more complicated than putting in gas and the occasional oil change.  You're in the latter category.
2013-12-08 09:21:07 PM  
1 votes:

LasersHurt: Right click the start button. Press start and start typing. There, now you can find everything.


OR... click the start button and all your programs are laid out in a list, no typing needed.
No "finding" anything, no keyboard necessary.
I don't need for my OS to hide things from me. Every second I have to look for something is a second I'm not doing what I need to do. Stay out of my way and let me work.
2013-12-08 08:52:43 PM  
1 votes:
I feel like that if Microsoft doesn't annoy me by hiding everything or moving it somewhere hard to find, they're really not doing their jobs.  Then they go out of their way to make it ugly too.
2013-12-08 08:25:12 PM  
1 votes:
Microsoft is reaaaallly trying to kill their cash cows recently, aren't they?
2013-12-08 07:58:57 PM  
1 votes:

Babwa Wawa: hardinparamedic: To be quite honest, if you have a windows genuine sticker on your laptop, you can download the ISO corresponding to that and, using that CD Key, be perfectly legal.

Interesting.  I've never tried that.  Does it activate OK using Microsoft's servers?


Not quite the case. A lot of times the installs used for OEM laptops are special OEM versions, so you would need a specific image to use the key on your laptop. This was a real pain when I was working the student help desk through college, because we'd have the college's Win XP disc, but the keys on the student laptops were specific to Dell , HP, Compaq, Gateway, etc, so we'd always have to ask the students to bring their discs for their computer if they had them.
2013-12-08 07:50:52 PM  
1 votes:

Babwa Wawa: Interesting.  I've never tried that.  Does it activate OK using Microsoft's servers?


It should, as long as you're using a legitimate, non-cracked CD key - such as one from a WGA sticker.

I know it worked for Windows 7.
2013-12-08 07:45:31 PM  
1 votes:

hardinparamedic: To be quite honest, if you have a windows genuine sticker on your laptop, you can download the ISO corresponding to that and, using that CD Key, be perfectly legal.


Interesting.  I've never tried that.  Does it activate OK using Microsoft's servers?
2013-12-08 07:41:06 PM  
1 votes:

Babwa Wawa: Bear in mind when you buy laptops now you DO NOT get a windows disc, so I've got no clue/method to install a new copy legally...


To be quite honest, if you have a windows genuine sticker on your laptop, you can download the ISO corresponding to that and, using that CD Key, be perfectly legal.
2013-12-08 07:39:41 PM  
1 votes:

kroonermanblack: A) Does anyone know where I can get some sort of clean-install version of windows 8? Bear in mind when you buy laptops now you DO NOT get a windows disc, so I've got no clue/method to install a new copy legally...


You can generally call the vendor's support number and they will send you a Windows install disk.  At least this is what I did with Dellsbefore I got an MSDN subscription.
2013-12-08 07:39:14 PM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: THEY'RE NOT F*CKING APPS, THEY ARE PROGRAMS, AND AN OS SHOULD NOT JUST BE A WALLED GARDEN APP-DELIVERY SYSTEM.


Are you talking about Windows RT or 8.1? Sounds like the former.
2013-12-08 07:36:55 PM  
1 votes:

xanadian: On 8?


Yeah, you get full blown Hyper-V on Windows 8.  You can even do NPIV, which is nuts.  I always wanted to run Server on my laptop so I had a quickie mobile lab, but then I had to run without a virus scanner unless I wanted to crack open the installer with ORCA.

The TFA's point about the clickable start menu is inaccurate.  It's better because "hovering" doesn't work well in RDP clients, and the shortcut keys don't work in all clients either.  So bringing up the start menu in RDP sessions required contortions in Windows 8, and don't in Windows 8.1

gingerjet: With an SSD - Windows 7 boots in 7 seconds.  Windows 8 in 12 seconds.  You aren't very good at this are you?


Hunh?  Maybe on the initial install, but probably not after stuff's been installed on it, and certainly not after the things been under use for a while.   In my experience Windows 8 was every bit as fast the day I installed it 18 months previous.  And objectively Win8 and 8.1 is less resource intensive than Windows 7.  Win7 was barely usable on Atom processors, where Win8 runs pretty damned well on it.

I find the whole thing about start menus kind of fascinating.  I never had a whole lot of fondness of the old style.  I'd pin stuff that I use regularly to it, and while I rarely went beyond the first menu level, it was always a bit slow doing so.  I find navigation a lot quicker with the new menu.  Plus, the old menu is straight up nonsensical for touch interfaces.

Frankly, it reminds me of the people who griped over WYSIWYG word processing, the Office ribbon, and the automatic transmission.  With all three, expert users were somewhat slowed down by the new features, they generally got over it quickly.  Not to mention that all three are necessary in order to take full advantage of the available features in their respective platforms.
2013-12-08 07:35:54 PM  
1 votes:
That lock screen... I still find it mind-boggling that Window boots to a lock screen, even when you have no touch devices installed.
2013-12-08 07:21:41 PM  
1 votes:
Since this is a windows thread: bought a new laptop a while back, and I spent quite literally 4-5 hours uninstalling shiat to make it run less like frozen liquid shiat.

It still doesn't run worth a damn.  The hardware in it isn't -great- by any means, but I can't help but think that windows 8 and Lenovo bloatware just wreck it.

So my question is: A) Does anyone know where I can get some sort of clean-install version of windows 8? Bear in mind when you buy laptops now you DO NOT get a windows disc, so I've got no clue/method to install a new copy legally...

B) Are there any linux distros that aren't shiat, have drivers, and are as easy to use as Windows XP or 7 were?  I don't really enjoy using computers, so I don't want to deal with...anything.  I just want an OS that runs stable, relatively quick, and lets me browse and/or watch netflix (Note: this laptop is strictly for living room 'looking shiat up' use, with the rare travel use).

C) Anyone had good exp with a chromebook? Do they run any programs at all?  I've got a couple thin game clients I run regularly that I would miss.
2013-12-08 07:06:04 PM  
1 votes:

gingerjet: TuteTibiImperes: Businesses will get on board.  Windows 8 is better than 7 in terms of security, and that alone is a big bonus.  Eventually MS will stop offering the option to use 7 on new machines, and when that happens and businesses upgrade their computers, they'll use 8.  They aren't going to spend 2x as much on hardware to use Apple, and Linux won't win out from an enterprise software support or user-friendliness POV.

No way businesses will get on board.  Windows 8 is too radical of a change and offers zero security advantages over 7.  I'm just assuming right now that you are a paid shill from Microsoft.


First of all, it's not very different from 7 in the desktop mode.  For business use where they'll be rolling out dozens or hundreds of machines all with identically imaged hard drives with the necessary office software already installed and the desktop set up for their business needs, it won't be an issue.  The shortcuts to Office, IE, and whatever else will be preloaded on the taskbar, and in most cases business systems run software that prevents the user from messing with settings or have IT policies that prohibit individual users from changing thing around anyway.  When it boils down to it most business users will barely notice the change.

As far as security goes, improvements to Windows Defender, Secure Boot, Smart Screen, and future versions of IE that will only run on 8 and above will win the day.  Windows 8 also comes with more tools to allow IT departments to access and manage individual machines remotely.
2013-12-08 06:55:26 PM  
1 votes:

TuteTibiImperes: Businesses will get on board.  Windows 8 is better than 7 in terms of security, and that alone is a big bonus.  Eventually MS will stop offering the option to use 7 on new machines, and when that happens and businesses upgrade their computers, they'll use 8.  They aren't going to spend 2x as much on hardware to use Apple, and Linux won't win out from an enterprise software support or user-friendliness POV.


No way businesses will get on board.  Windows 8 is too radical of a change and offers zero security advantages over 7.  I'm just assuming right now that you are a paid shill from Microsoft.
2013-12-08 06:53:20 PM  
1 votes:

doyner: Rincewind53: I think they're going to see businesses refuse to update.

Good.


Businesses will get on board.  Windows 8 is better than 7 in terms of security, and that alone is a big bonus.  Eventually MS will stop offering the option to use 7 on new machines, and when that happens and businesses upgrade their computers, they'll use 8.  They aren't going to spend 2x as much on hardware to use Apple, and Linux won't win out from an enterprise software support or user-friendliness POV.

That being said, more businesses are moving towards thin clients these days anyway, which work fine for basic office work.
2013-12-08 06:28:36 PM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Cubansaltyballs: I just hated that it opened it in full-screen mode. I know this sounds crazy, but sometimes I like to have two PDFs open at the same time and view them side-by-side.

For me, I'd have to spend so much time tweaking and hammering away at Windows 8 to make it usable for me, it's just not worth my time for a handful of minor upgrades.

But, if you think Windows 8 is stupid, just try dealing with Server 2012. It's basically the same as Windows 8, because you know... no one uses the start button and everyone has touch screens on their servers.

Right? I fundamentally don't understand the idea of essentially forcing people to operate in a world without a taskbar. I mean, right now I have Steam, Spotify, iTunes, Word, Notepad, Task Manager, Calculator, Chrome, and two instances of Explorer open on my screen. I can see  exactly what's going on, and I can select each one of them with an incredibly small flick of the mouse.

With the Metro UI, if I'm in an App, I have no idea what other apps I have open unless I go and check for them! That's way more inefficient. It's like on my smartphone, which is inefficient because it's on a tiny screen and therefore can't use the same space.

Steve Ballmer is  nuts if he thought this was a good direction for Microsoft. Metro is a pretty decent tablet OS and they should be commended for it, honestly. It made it so that you can have tablets that essentially act as traditional computers, in a way that iOS never allows for. But Windows 8 is clearly  not designed for laptops or desktops, and it sure as hell isn't designed for work environments. Which is why it's such a bad business move, because Microsoft has  always been a company that tried to cater to the Enterprise market and business markets in general. And it's like suddenly they threw up their hands and said "you know what? That one thing that we kick Apple's ass in and that helps fund all out other shiat? No one wants that anymore! fark it! Tablets and touch is the wa ...


The Metro UI sections aren't designed for desktops or laptops, I agree.  Thankfully, you rarely run into them on a desktop or laptop once you've set things up how you like.  The only time I ever see Metro is when I need to launch a program that I haven't pinned to the taskbar, which is pretty rare.  Everything else I do entirely in desktop mode, and Win8 is fine with that.

There's a lot of hate for Metro when it's easy to avoid Metro.  The Start Screen vs Start Menu isn't a big deal to me, they're equally functional.  You don't ever have to use Metro apps on the desktop.
2013-12-08 06:16:21 PM  
1 votes:

xanadian: Rincewind53: THROW ALL THE MONEY AT IT!

I have, thankfully, only had limited exposure to 8.  I'll admit, the users take to it like a fish to water, in the limited cases where I've had to deal with 8.  I, however, am in the "grinding of teeth" category.  EVERYTHING is hidden, it seems.  8 sucks for power users and admins; seems OK for the technologically-impaired.

I understand WHY Microsoft did 8.  And I understand there are a lot of bennies with 8.  I just don't like it.  And, no, I'm not going to get over it.


7 has an "XP" mode. No such option (i.e., "7 mode") for 8?
2013-12-08 06:08:26 PM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: THROW ALL THE MONEY AT IT!


I have, thankfully, only had limited exposure to 8.  I'll admit, the users take to it like a fish to water, in the limited cases where I've had to deal with 8.  I, however, am in the "grinding of teeth" category.  EVERYTHING is hidden, it seems.  8 sucks for power users and admins; seems OK for the technologically-impaired.

I understand WHY Microsoft did 8.  And I understand there are a lot of bennies with 8.  I just don't like it.  And, no, I'm not going to get over it.
2013-12-08 05:11:48 PM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: I'm seriously considering downgrading. Yes, it'll cost me some money, but honestly I don't think that's such a big deal. I'm going to give Windows 8 about a month until I get used to it, and then I'll decide. Right now my anger has turned down to just a low simmer, so I see positive things in the future.


I dealt with it for about a week. The final straw for me was that you couldn't view/modify wireless profiles anymore.

The whole OS has been dumbed down too much.
 
Displayed 57 of 57 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report