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(NBC News)   Obama when talking about the ACA "We're not repealing it as long as I'm president". GOP: Challenge accepted   (nbcpolitics.nbcnews.com) divider line 250
    More: Obvious, Affordable Care Act, ACA, Obama, challenge accepted  
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5946 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Dec 2013 at 12:34 PM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-12-04 01:31:03 PM  

Whatchoo Talkinbout: It sucked as a theory. It sucked as a rollout. It sucks as a product.

I'm sure it'll work out fine.


Seems to be doing just that.

Soon, Ronald Hudson walked in.
"Okay," Lively began. "What Hudsons are you kin to?"
"R.T., Uncle Lenny ..." said Hudson, a skinny 35-year-old who worked as an assistant director at the senior center and had just been released from the hospital after a blood-sugar spike.
He'd never had insurance before and said his hospital bills were up to $23,000 at this point.
"Good night," Lively said, tapping in his information.
Kids: five. Salary: about $14,000 before taxes.
"You're going to qualify for a medical card," she told Hudson.
"Well, thank God," Hudson said, laughing. "I believe I'm going to be a Democrat."


Source:  http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/in-rural-kentucky-health-care- d ebate-takes-back-seat-as-people-sign-up-for-insurance/2013/11/23/449dc 6e0-5465-11e3-9e2c-e1d01116fd98_print.html
 
2013-12-04 01:31:59 PM  

Sudlow: The Democrats have been very open about the ACA being a stepping stone to single payer. I suspect the goal is to screw up healthcare so badly that going to single payer will look like an improvement, albeit a short term improvement.


If that was the plan, they blew it.  The new public attitude after this screw up is that you, yes you personally, cannot afford to have the federal government involved in your personal health care.

General regulation of the industry, under the heading of the regulation of interstate commerce, fine.

But when it comes to your personal body and the medicine and services needed to keep it turning oxygen into carbon dioxide, if there is a government agent involved in that, you can expect any or all of the following:

- incompetence and its good buddy, sovereign immunity
- ideological interference
- political maneuvering
- bureaucracy
- cronyism
- spoils system patronage

None of this does a damned thing to get you the care you need, or to bring the cost down, but you don't have an option now, do you?  Politics is now part of your health care.  If trading off the CANCER voting bloc to secure the votes from the BIRTH CONTROL voting bloc, that's the calculation a politician will do.

And why the hell should they listen to you, now?  Stop bothering to call your representatives to leave your opinion on the issues.  The new policy will be to validate that you're a constituent before taking you message, and after that, well... hope you agree with the politician.  Otherwise, well, someone on his staff, not the representative himself, oh no, but someone deniable and expendable will pass a list to someone else, and suddenly you'll find you're at the bottom of the list to get the new multiple sclerosis drug, or your pain medication consumption will be audited.  Sit down, shut up, and do what you're told, because your quality of life is dependent on your party affiliation.
 
2013-12-04 01:33:04 PM  

Darth_Lukecash: [cdn.ucadia.net image 200x300]
Not conservative enough for the GOP


Torquemada - do not implore him for compassion
Torquemada - do not ask him for forgiveness.
Torquemada - do not beg him for mercy
Let's face it, you can't Torquemada anything!
 
2013-12-04 01:33:54 PM  

mjones73: Pinner: mjones73: Trid_Kicker: mjones73: meat0918: Yes, please proceed on running on the promise of taking away the guarantee of health insurance.

You mean health insurance you're forced to have or pay a fine over?

Like the car insurance I'm forced to have or lose my license over? Because you're a liability on the road

Like the homeowner's insurance I'm forced to pay or lose my house over? Because your mortgage company requires it

Like the liability insurance my doctor's forced to pay or lose his practice over? Because people are sue happy assholes

Well, I can see your point.  Having to buy insurance has ruined driving, housing, and pre-Obamacare medicine.  I'm convinced.

My well being is not going to impact anyone, nice try though.

You must be sterile.

So the fact I could get someone pregnant is your reasoning for forcing health care on me?


No, just saying that "your being" can in fact impact someone.
Maybe you're an insignificant citizen and no one relies on your responsibilities to keep anything going. If you have a heart attack right now, there are no people that are relying on you for meals or an education, stay in business so they can keep their jobs, contribute to the household income so that no one goes broke and loses their home.
 
2013-12-04 01:35:21 PM  

mjones73: hugram: mjones73: hugram: Trolls on this thread. "We hate Obamacare... That's why we voted for the guy who implemented Romneycare."

Romney had to do something drastic in Massachusetts because their insurance market was so farked up, it wasn't an answer for the whole country...

Then why didn't he run on his record of implementing Romneycare?

No idea, you'd have to ask him.


I'm pretty sure you know why... but in the case you don't, I'm sure other farkers here will explain to you why he could not run on his MA healthcare record.
 
2013-12-04 01:36:06 PM  

Fluid: Someone must really like defeat.


That would be Rex Ryan.
 
2013-12-04 01:37:15 PM  

Kangaroo_Ralph: FTFPresident: "If I've got to fight another three years to make sure this law works, then that's what I'll do."

How stupid and stubborn is that statement? No matter how much time, money, and resources it takes, Obama is going to cram this down your throats whether you like it or not.


Stay the course!
 
2013-12-04 01:37:54 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: Ignored by somebody willfully ignorant.


Did I say that I was putting you on ignore?  I just said your "contributions" merit no further consideration.

See what I mean about your tenuous grip on reality?
 
2013-12-04 01:39:00 PM  

nmrsnr: This very much depends on what you think Obama meant by "works" if, as you seem to suggest, "works" means "gets implemented, regardless of how bad it is, or how widely reviled it is" yes, the statement is not a particularly good one. If however, you take "works" to mean "provide every American affordable health coverage, regardless of what changes need to be made" then it seems exactly like what politicians should do, work ceaselessly to make our lives better.


Ah, but it's "this law works".  The law itself is too flawed to work as written.
 
2013-12-04 01:39:04 PM  

Pinner: mjones73: Pinner: mjones73: Trid_Kicker: mjones73: meat0918: Yes, please proceed on running on the promise of taking away the guarantee of health insurance.

You mean health insurance you're forced to have or pay a fine over?

Like the car insurance I'm forced to have or lose my license over? Because you're a liability on the road

Like the homeowner's insurance I'm forced to pay or lose my house over? Because your mortgage company requires it

Like the liability insurance my doctor's forced to pay or lose his practice over? Because people are sue happy assholes

Well, I can see your point.  Having to buy insurance has ruined driving, housing, and pre-Obamacare medicine.  I'm convinced.

My well being is not going to impact anyone, nice try though.

You must be sterile.

So the fact I could get someone pregnant is your reasoning for forcing health care on me?

No, just saying that "your being" can in fact impact someone.
Maybe you're an insignificant citizen and no one relies on your responsibilities to keep anything going. If you have a heart attack right now, there are no people that are relying on you for meals or an education, stay in business so they can keep their jobs, contribute to the household income so that no one goes broke and loses their home.


Well if I were to drop dead now, my life insurance would cover those items, not health care. If I were to live, health care would cover my costs, it still wouldn't supplement anyone else. So what's your point again?
 
2013-12-04 01:39:59 PM  

Kangaroo_Ralph: How stupid and stubborn is that statement? No matter how much time, money, and resources it takes, Obama is going to cram this down your throats whether you like it or not.


Yeah, he should just stand and watch as other people expend as much time, money and resources as they can to repeal a law that has passed muster at every single checkpoint and is officially on the books, that makes total sense.
 
2013-12-04 01:40:52 PM  

DamnYankees: Sin_City_Superhero: Theaetetus: Why would the GOP want to repeal the ACA? It's free money for insurance companies,

That's the thing I don't get. Isn't this a huge boon for the big insurance companies? All those people that would be going without insurance because they are young and healthy, are now forced to buy coverage, or pay for the privilege of opting out.

Opposition to the ACA has long, long, long gone past the point where it was rooted in any sort of ideological consistency. The opposition has only the barest of rationalizations at this point - the ACA is more liberal than what came before, because it redistributes money from the more-fortunate to the less-fortunate. That's it. That's where the opposition comes from. Trying to find specific things the ACA does which they hate is pointless. It all goes back to that,


It takes money from old white people and gives it to young black welfare babies.
 
2013-12-04 01:41:02 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: meat0918: Smeggy Smurf: Theaetetus: Why would the GOP want to repeal the ACA? It's free money for insurance companies, as well as providing a boogeyman to help them get the vote out.

Because some of them know about this little thing called the T-4 program.  In the hands of a despot socialized medicine is a terrible weapon.

You know who else....

You got it.  Now let's go really scary.  Imagine if the Rapeublicans were running your healthcare.  Picture abstinence only birth control mandated for the next 4 years.  Faith based antibiotics.  Mandatory quarterly drug screening for everybody.  That should scare the shiat out of anybody and yet it's not impossible to see it happening.  Yet you assholes are gleefully handing the possibility of that over to people that only see you as an open pocketbook and potential threat.


I suppose anything is possible, but the total sea change that would have to happen would rival the one that managed to get Prohibition into the Constitution.

And a lot of the health insurance plans I've seen already covers "Faith based medicine" in the form of naturopathic care, homeopathy (it's classified as medicine in America), and chiropractic care.
 
2013-12-04 01:42:25 PM  
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?
 
2013-12-04 01:44:06 PM  

cwheelie: You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?


That's exactly what I want. I want my IRS Auditor to be the one who gives me flu shots.
 
2013-12-04 01:44:29 PM  
I can't believe the Republicans are so mad that my mom no longer has to pay $850 a month for health insurance. I thought they wanted to strengthen the economy? Giving people affordable health care means they have more money to spend frivolously.
 
2013-12-04 01:46:30 PM  

Kangaroo_Ralph: nmrsnr: This very much depends on what you think Obama meant by "works" if, as you seem to suggest, "works" means "gets implemented, regardless of how bad it is, or how widely reviled it is" yes, the statement is not a particularly good one. If however, you take "works" to mean "provide every American affordable health coverage, regardless of what changes need to be made" then it seems exactly like what politicians should do, work ceaselessly to make our lives better.

Ah, but it's "this law works".  The law itself is too flawed to work as written.


It's a good thing the GOP worked tirelessly to come up with a bi-partisan solution to fix the various flaws in the ACA then instead of purposefully sabotaging the ACA and running on a platform of "No."

I mean that's what they did, right? Offer plausible, reality-based solutions and engaged in meaningful debate to make the legislation itself better, right? I mean if it's flawed, then obviously both parties in congress are responsible for the flaws, right? Not just one side trying to obstruct the other and trying to sabotage the legislation for political points?
 
2013-12-04 01:47:28 PM  

nmrsnr: Whatchoo Talkinbout: It sucked as a theory. It sucked as a rollout. It sucks as a product.

I'm sure it'll work out fine.

First of all, it's not a product. Second of all, which of these benefits would you like to take away from the American people:

1. No more preexisting condition exclusion
2. Kids can stay on until age 26
3. Closed Medicare "donut hole"
4. 85-15 rule for insurance providers, some people have actually gotten checks from their insurer
5. No lifetime caps on insurance



You forgot doubling my healthcare costs, but hey some eggs blah, blah, blah. No sale.
 
2013-12-04 01:48:05 PM  

Heliovdrake: Heliovdrake: Whatchoo Talkinbout: It sucked as a theory. It sucked as a rollout. It sucks as a product.

I'm sure it'll work out fine.

Your tiny fists such sure must be getting workout.


Truth painful much?
 
2013-12-04 01:48:38 PM  

cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford


Really? You quote the ramblings of an alcoholic, crack smoking Canadian to bolster your argument?
 
2013-12-04 01:48:56 PM  

cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?


You mean a government that considered the Native Americans a nuisance at best and an vicious enemy at worst might not have had their best interests in mind?

Whodathunkit?
 
2013-12-04 01:50:26 PM  

cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?


Um.  The USA already has a huge government agency administering a huge healthcare plan.

And interestingly, it is
preferred over private insurance.No, we don't want the "IRS" or the "DMV" administering our healthcare, but perhaps a government agency designed to, well, administer healthcare might fit the bill.
 
2013-12-04 01:50:41 PM  

Deucednuisance: Whatchoo Talkinbout: It sucked as a theory. It sucked as a rollout. It sucks as a product.

I'm sure it'll work out fine.

Seems to be doing just that.

Soon, Ronald Hudson walked in.
"Okay," Lively began. "What Hudsons are you kin to?"
"R.T., Uncle Lenny ..." said Hudson, a skinny 35-year-old who worked as an assistant director at the senior center and had just been released from the hospital after a blood-sugar spike.
He'd never had insurance before and said his hospital bills were up to $23,000 at this point.
"Good night," Lively said, tapping in his information.
Kids: five. Salary: about $14,000 before taxes.
"You're going to qualify for a medical card," she told Hudson.
"Well, thank God," Hudson said, laughing. "I believe I'm going to be a Democrat."

Source:  http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/in-rural-kentucky-health-care- d ebate-takes-back-seat-as-people-sign-up-for-insurance/2013/11/23/449dc 6e0-5465-11e3-9e2c-e1d01116fd98_print.html



I agree, one good story makes up for millions losing health care benefits.
 
2013-12-04 01:52:21 PM  

blugenes: The ACA was not meant to be permanent legislation in my opinion, but a transition to a single-payor system either under or very similar to HR 676.  The ACA is a nightmare for providers and patients, the "coverage" it gives to many people is more costly for sometimes fewer services and a lot of providers are now considering leaving the medical field or retiring early because of it.  The new laws that are coming into place on 01 January will make it hard to reverse the damage already done, if it is not repealed by 01 January 2015 I am not sure what could be done to prevent many millions more people from losing their coverage on that date.


I used to work in a medical center with over 80 doctors.  We were in the process of upgrading all the practices to an electronic medical records system, and all the doctors over 40 were biatching and moaning about how hard it was to use, and that they were all going to retire at the end of the year.

Yeah, they never did.   The same thing is happening here.  "Change is scary! I don't like change! I'm quitting the medical profession!"  ...until they realize how little retirement pays, then they're all, "Psych!"
 
2013-12-04 01:53:20 PM  

cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?


img.photobucket.com
 
2013-12-04 01:53:25 PM  

Carthax: blugenes: The ACA was not meant to be permanent legislation in my opinion, but a transition to a single-payor system either under or very similar to HR 676.  The ACA is a nightmare for providers and patients, the "coverage" it gives to many people is more costly for sometimes fewer services and a lot of providers are now considering leaving the medical field or retiring early because of it.  The new laws that are coming into place on 01 January will make it hard to reverse the damage already done, if it is not repealed by 01 January 2015 I am not sure what could be done to prevent many millions more people from losing their coverage on that date.

I used to work in a medical center with over 80 doctors.  We were in the process of upgrading all the practices to an electronic medical records system, and all the doctors over 40 were biatching and moaning about how hard it was to use, and that they were all going to retire at the end of the year.

Yeah, they never did.   The same thing is happening here.  "Change is scary! I don't like change! I'm quitting the medical profession!"  ...until they realize how little retirement pays, then they're all, "Psych!"


It's never "Psych!"

It's... "Meh, I'll give it one more year. What's more year going to hurt?", then it's the year after that... and the year after that.

/works in the medical field
 
2013-12-04 01:53:45 PM  

Lando Lincoln: Man, if only Romney had campaigned on repealing the ACA, then he would have won.


People were not aware of hoe much liberals were lying about the bill until recently.

It had been fun watching liberals claim the GOP isn't offering useful fixes despite the facts democrats have always voted down every fix offered: see Enzi's 2010 amendment to dull cancelations of policies.

Liberals have relied on voter ignorance of the bill. Now that people are being affected, the support for ACA is dropping like a rock.

You can't benefit 10% of the population by harming 50%. That is not politically a good idea. SS and Medicare never harmed one group more than others, ACA does. Latest estimates are 10% will have lowered payments at the expense of 40% of the population. That 40% is a tad more than the evil 1% liberals rely on railing against.
 
2013-12-04 01:53:51 PM  

DamnYankees: blugenes: a lot of providers are now considering leaving the medical field or retiring early because of it

LOL sure


My Father-in-Law busted out this exact same statement at Thanksgiving. It must be a Fox News talking point... I told him that I'd believe it when I saw it.
 
2013-12-04 01:55:34 PM  

meat0918: cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?

You mean a government

republican party that considered the Native Americansmiddle/ lower class a nuisance at best and a vicious enemy at worst might not have had their best interests in mind?

Whodathunkit?

Updated that for you.
 
2013-12-04 01:56:31 PM  

meat0918: Yes, please proceed on running on the promise of taking away the guarantee of health insurance.


It isn't a garauntee of anything. Subsidies for an individual making 32ka year is negligible. What is not negligible is the 60% premium increase for that 30 year old with a higher out of pocket deductible . Aca does nothing for that person.
 
2013-12-04 01:56:47 PM  

MyRandomName: That is not politically a good idea.


I guess we'll find out.
 
2013-12-04 01:57:42 PM  

The Martian Manhandler: DamnYankees: blugenes: a lot of providers are now considering leaving the medical field or retiring early because of it

LOL sure

My Father-in-Law busted out this exact same statement at Thanksgiving. It must be a Fox News talking point... I told him that I'd believe it when I saw it.


It's true. People who devote themselves to healing other people and pay large sums of money in education costs would rather see their patients and future patients suffer and die over a political point than continue their career and get paid.
 
2013-12-04 01:57:54 PM  

MyRandomName: meat0918: Yes, please proceed on running on the promise of taking away the guarantee of health insurance.

It isn't a garauntee of anything. Subsidies for an individual making 32ka year is negligible. What is not negligible is the 60% premium increase for that 30 year old with a higher out of pocket deductible . Aca does nothing for that person.


Be careful using logic in here... :D
 
2013-12-04 01:59:40 PM  

Chinchillazilla: I can't believe the Republicans are so mad that my mom no longer has to pay $850 a month for health insurance. I thought they wanted to strengthen the economy? Giving people affordable health care means they have more money to spend frivolously.


Know how i know you dont have to buy ACA insurance?

/problem is eventualy you will run out of other peoples money
//this is the epitome of a pyramid scheme
 
2013-12-04 02:01:49 PM  

MyRandomName: Aca does nothing for that person.


That person doesn't exist at a single moment in time. That person will age, lose their job, get sick, etc. When that happens, the ACA will then help that person.

The ACA, like every single other policy in existence, does not benefit 100% of people 100% of the time.
 
2013-12-04 02:01:58 PM  

The Martian Manhandler: My Father-in-Law busted out this exact same statement at Thanksgiving. It must be a Fox News talking point... I told him that I'd believe it when I saw it.


So wait until it's done ALL of the damage Republicans have claimed it will make before repealing it.

I guess Republicans will get to say "I told you so" each time one of their prophecies about the destruction inherent in socialism comes to pass, at least.
 
2013-12-04 02:02:10 PM  
Sigh, Obamacare is the mother of all cashgrabs by the health insurance industry.  The Dems are either stupid or skipped a few of the bill's 10,000 pages.  Or maybe the lobbyists just did some good old-fashioned vote buying via campaign contributions.  I would love for Anonymous to start a permanent DOS attack to stall this travesty.

Healthcare in the US will always be a cashgrab clusterfark until it is nationalized.  Which will never happen, too much money to be sucked up from Boomers by parasitic insurance companies.  Yet another consequence of dependence on a FIRE economy, everything is now a profit center.
 
2013-12-04 02:03:07 PM  

Trid_Kicker: cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?

Um.  The USA already has a huge government agency administering a huge healthcare plan.

And interestingly, it is
preferred over private insurance.No, we don't want the "IRS" or the "DMV" administering our healthcare, but perhaps a government agency designed to, well, administer healthcare might fit the bill.


But considering their track record (IRS, NSA, etc) I am not hopeful of a well run, cost conscious beauracracy... and for the record Mr. Macaroni & The Patient, I am not a government hating republican. Just a realist.
 
2013-12-04 02:04:03 PM  

Trid_Kicker: cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?

Um.  The USA already has a huge government agency administering a huge healthcare plan.

And interestingly, it is
preferred over private insurance.No, we don't want the "IRS" or the "DMV" administering our healthcare, but perhaps a government agency designed to, well, administer healthcare might fit the bill.



The VA also rates higher than private insurance.
 
2013-12-04 02:06:22 PM  

Phinn: Unlike the people who are the reason for two-thirds of all medical expenses in the USA, which are the result of self-inflicted, voluntary bad lifestyle choices -- obesity, inactivity, smoking, alcohol and drug abuse.


[citation needed]
 
2013-12-04 02:08:29 PM  

Phinn: What Obama should have done, and which a future government will need to do, is sever the connection between employment and insurance, which will in turn mostly eliminate insurance as the primary means of paying for ordinary, routine care, which only increases the cost.


Funny, that's what a single payer system is meant to do.
 
2013-12-04 02:10:02 PM  

cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford


You're quoting Henry Ford for advice on government healthcare?  He died in 1947 for chrissakes.  And wasn't a doctor.  Or a statesman.  Or any kind of government employee.  And wouldn't know a PET scan from a CAT scan.  And his cars didn't even have variable valve timing, EGR, or antilock brakes.

And he's not on Angie's List either.
 
2013-12-04 02:10:04 PM  

Lee Jackson Beauregard: Phinn: What Obama should have done, and which a future government will need to do, is sever the connection between employment and insurance, which will in turn mostly eliminate insurance as the primary means of paying for ordinary, routine care, which only increases the cost.

Funny, that's what a single payer system is meant to do.


But that's socialism, and therefore bad.
 
2013-12-04 02:11:45 PM  

ManRay: "Sir, it was a valiant attempt, but it does not look like we have enough altitude to make it over the mountain."
"Throw out the parachutes and bolt the doors while I break off the throttle. We are riding this thing as far as it goes."
"Why not change course to go around the mountain? It might take longer be we will still get there."
"We have no choice. This is the only way. We have to crash this airplane before we can build a better one."


In your analogy, who is flying the plane? Is it the GOP that insists on opposing ANY legislation proposed by the sitting President of the United States of America?
 
2013-12-04 02:14:24 PM  

Sin_City_Superhero: ManRay: "Sir, it was a valiant attempt, but it does not look like we have enough altitude to make it over the mountain."
"Throw out the parachutes and bolt the doors while I break off the throttle. We are riding this thing as far as it goes."
"Why not change course to go around the mountain? It might take longer be we will still get there."
"We have no choice. This is the only way. We have to crash this airplane before we can build a better one."

In your analogy, who is flying the plane? Is it the GOP that insists on opposing ANY legislation proposed by the sitting President of the United States of America?


"Our number one priority is to make Obama a one-term president."

But they wouldn't sabotage the ACA legislation to make that dream come true, right?

... right?
 
2013-12-04 02:18:42 PM  

Whatchoo Talkinbout: nmrsnr: Whatchoo Talkinbout: It sucked as a theory. It sucked as a rollout. It sucks as a product.

I'm sure it'll work out fine.

First of all, it's not a product. Second of all, which of these benefits would you like to take away from the American people:

1. No more preexisting condition exclusion
2. Kids can stay on until age 26
3. Closed Medicare "donut hole"
4. 85-15 rule for insurance providers, some people have actually gotten checks from their insurer
5. No lifetime caps on insurance


You forgot doubling my healthcare costs, but hey some eggs blah, blah, blah. No sale.


Again, firstly, healthcare is not the same as health insurance, and healthcare costs are rising at their slowest rate in 50 years.

Secondly, I'm sorry if your health insurance premiums have gone up, but depending on your circumstance you either a) can get a subsidy to help with that, or b) can look for a cheaper plan. If neither of those are possible for you, then we come to:

Thirdly, you didn't address the question, which of the above benefits would you like to take away from the American people in order to pay less for health insurance?
 
2013-12-04 02:21:31 PM  

generallyso: Trid_Kicker: cwheelie: "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian."
  - Henry Ford

You really want the IRS (the federal equivalent of the DMV) administering your healthcare plan?

Um.  The USA already has a huge government agency administering a huge healthcare plan.

And interestingly, it is
preferred over private insurance.No, we don't want the "IRS" or the "DMV" administering our healthcare, but perhaps a government agency designed to, well, administer healthcare might fit the bill.


The VA also rates higher than private insurance.


I worked at a VA hospital for a few years many moons ago.  The VA gets a bad rap, it is actually a pretty efficient system compared to clusterfark private healthcare.  It's a proof of concept of what could be if Congress ever had the balls to create a nationalized system.

Word to the wise:  The VA is required to treat any patient that shows up, regardless of whether said patient was in the service or has health insurance.
 
2013-12-04 02:21:59 PM  

Weatherkiss: Lee Jackson Beauregard: Phinn: What Obama should have done, and which a future government will need to do, is sever the connection between employment and insurance, which will in turn mostly eliminate insurance as the primary means of paying for ordinary, routine care, which only increases the cost.

Funny, that's what a single payer system is meant to do.

But that's socialism, and therefore bad.


And this just in: Vermont.
 
2013-12-04 02:22:32 PM  
Joe Blowme:  /problem is eventualy you will run out of other peoples money

Have you seen the explosion of wealth in recent years for the top 1%?  We are not only decidedly not experienced this old tired meme, we are rapidly heading in the opposite direction.
 
2013-12-04 02:23:48 PM  

Trid_Kicker: Weatherkiss: Lee Jackson Beauregard: Phinn: What Obama should have done, and which a future government will need to do, is sever the connection between employment and insurance, which will in turn mostly eliminate insurance as the primary means of paying for ordinary, routine care, which only increases the cost.

Funny, that's what a single payer system is meant to do.

But that's socialism, and therefore bad.

And this just in: Vermont.


Wait... you mean "Single Payer is socialism, and therefore bad." is just rhetoric?

My mind. She is blown.
 
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